>Apply for a job (they needed a few characters designed, i

anon we're here to get cucked. people who make it are hand picked by the gods.

give up. hobbyists have no shame.

>>2838846
>>2838865
and if you don't like the word hobbyist. you can always change that to independent artist.

Man having a real career and just doing art as a hobby and maybe for some pocket change once in a while is so much better than getting cucked on a regular basis.

>>2838907
>muh safe dead end career

>>2838908
>muh unstable dead end "career"

>>2838908
>implying art is not dead end

>>2838846
Mind saying which company it was so we can know who to avoid?

freelance is dead. i can't tell you how many frauds try to do business with me. don't get cucked.

you want the jobs start making phone calls or get cucked.

>>2838925
Phone calls to who

>>2838846
>why are we here? just to suffer?
More or less.

www.youtube.com/watch?v=3ht-ZyJOV2k

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>>2838846
>Hey, we represent a film company and we're producing an independent movie for [film festival]
>We saw your work on Artstation and your blog and love it, we want to know if you do storyboarding
>Sure do, rate is [local currency units] 120 a day, what you're asking for should take one working week to complete

It's been three years and they still haven't got back to me.

>>2838846
why did you not get paid upfront

>>2839201
If you're not an established professional yet, it doesn't hurt to test out the waters first and instead of giving them your rate, ask them how much they had in mind for compensating you. That way you usually at least get an answer quickly instead of waiting for weeks for an email that will never come.

>>2838846

Supply and demand.

Either you work for peanuts or don't work at all.

Nobody needs fucking artists that much 2bh and the world is flooding with wannabe illustrators and 3rd worlders more talented and less demanding than you.

if you want to live off as artist, you either ask daddy to land you a job at Blizzard, charge $10 for your work, draw furry gay neon dicks, or become Sakimichan and open up a Patreon.

The good old days where you could charge $500 for an illustration are long gone.

Anyways, if you're good enough and announce your price list publicly, there will always be ONE person willing to pay.

>>2839253
Right. Being exclusively an artist nowadays is not a worthwhile pursuit unless you're already very well established or can stick out of the crowd with amazing works.

The world is overpopulated, there are too many people trampling on each other. It's also why everyone is turning gay or trans.

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>>2839253

>if you want to live off as artist, you either ask daddy to land you a job at Blizzard, charge $10 for your work, draw furry gay neon dicks, or become Sakimichan and open up a Patreon.

>tfw

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>>2839253
Im fine with drawing furry gay neon dicks

>>2839253
>Nobody needs fucking artists that much

So who is going to produce all that entertainment you genius?

>>2838846
You deserve it actually. But I don't belive your story.

>>2838920
This

>>2839319
Bollywood actors at $5/hour and chink animator farms at $2/hour.

>>2838846
I understand why you keep the details private, but you could at least tell us how much money you wanted for your work.

>>2839393
This. Also post work.

>>2839253

This kills the /ic/

this thread has made me curious about how pricing should actually be done.
What are your thoughts d/ic/ks?

post examples pls.

>>2839847
https://youtu.be/CdC99JRSpG8

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>>2839253
There's so much truth to this it's fucking disgusting.

>>2839847

The clue is to don't talk about money until the very last moment when they are basically sold on you and understand that your artwork is crucial to the success of their company, knowing/predicting accurately the revenue and wealth of clients is crucial. It's important to get into your clients shoes and see things from their side of things.

If you are going to work with bunch of wannabes with video game/film start up, you need to know that they are only a bunch of guys on very tight budget, so if you give price, you need to convince them that proper art delivered in professional way with proper workflow is CRUCIAL to their success and will determine be or not to be of their project.

If you can get a meeting with them or suggest switching to phone, lots of bullshit can be stopped early if you break the impersonal mail barrier.

A bit opposite is with a firm that has some money - then what is important for them is minimizing the risk of investment and you can ask for a lot IF they will know you are professional that WILL deliver what they want.

In every case remember - they are your clients and you are selling your brand and luxurious product. If they contacted you first, you have already won. You just need to know/guess accurately who they are and what they crave. Often client thinks he know what he wants, but you still can do "Hey, we can do it like this and that, but I am now offering this new thing with my clients to additionally help with marketing strategy/visual communication inside video games, if you have 30 min we can sit down and I can offer you this free(tm) consultation and brainstorm what will work to increase your revenue".

You need to convince the fuckers that you really want to help them and you are best thing that could happen to their project. Then you will get monies and maybe even sometime in the future a holy grail that is % from their profit/sales.

You need to branch out a bit into this business side of things.

>>2840122

Also be flexible - as an artist that deals with illustration and friendly client will offer you to make good character designs - why not if you can manage it? OR if you can't, but MONEY CHECKS, you get portion of money and offer it to fuckers that WILL make it for you. Can't into good designs? Get money, find character designer that is new, promising, preferably young and from third world country and pay him to make design sketches FAST and then you just pick/modify idea, use your awesome illustration skills and deliver to your client for much bigger money.

This is how it works.

As a former employer turned artist I can give you a few tips:
1. Get on phone/skype as fast as possible. There is one major advantage you have to third world artists who barely speak English or have to run through translation software, communication. If you are just as difficult or slow to communicate with you WILL lose the job every time, period. I'm not going to pay more for someone who gives me no advantages because those guys can undercut you severely on price.

2. Be flexible with pricing and payment structures. You should never put yourself at risk of being scammed or go into the poor house for a job but you should be willing to work with your clients budget. Unless of course you are some big name artists but then people would be coming to YOU with jobs, not the other way around. It's better to ask them what they think is a fair price than for you to give out some price list unless that list is your absolute rock bottom.

3. "You are great/best/etc" compliments are based in half truth and half blowing-smoke-up-ass to be polite. Employers don't want to shit on an artist who shows potential or may become great one day because it's unprofessional bridge burning for no reason. Also a lot of artists do not handle criticism well at all.

4. Sell yourself and your abilities (honestly of course), convince them you are passionate about the ideas, will get things done in a timely manner and will be available. If you are selling yourself as "it will get done when it gets done because this is a side job I don't care about and I don't even give a shit about your ideas" then an employer can sense that even if you don't say it. Your employer needs to become the sun and the moon and the god worshiped by you. Taking jobs you have no passion for is a dick move and it wastes everyone's time.

Most people paying for art do it as luxury, some for business but neither wants to work with an overpriced bad communicator who doesn't seem to care.

>>2838929

It's "phone calls to whom?", my uneducated friend.

>>2840739

do you even enjoy life?

>>2838846
There are a lot of assholes out there like that.
Don't ever get flattered. People will think they can pay you in flattery. Don't let them.

>>2840127
>use /ic/ like a sweatshop
>???
>profit

>>2840742

He asks on a 4chan art forum

>>2840139
This was really helpful, thanks!

>>2838907
I know that it's hard but living just with your art should be your goal if you're are passionate about it.

Why would I want to spend majority of my time on a shitty job when I can do art?
pursuing an art career also mean having some free time doing something else, with a full time job and some serious investment on art you won't have any time for something else. And trust me, it's important for an artist to dedicate himself to other things

>>2839253
>draw furry gay neon dicks
>open up a Patreon.

easy

>>2838846
Work cheaper faggot. Hitler did it, so can you.

>>2844400
>fail to get into art school
>take over country

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>>2844401
Shit happens, I read he still painted while he was the Führer. Bummer he had to invade Poland, wouldn't have been too bad besides the whole War thing. He was a beta male though (like a lot of artsy people) and he wouldn't have started WWII if he had read my blog.

i have a few questions!

So there's this one guy whose commissioning me for a drawing except he has a pretty vague idea of what he wants. Thats not the problem tho. He's just not very communicative.

I even have him on skype and he responds after like 1-2 days. I dont wanna nag him either cuz everyone has their shit.
So how do i deal with that?

Also should i ask him to pay 100% up front cuz i told him 50% before and after work is how i operate (havent paid yet cuz work hasnt even started thanks to him being unresponsive and late) but now im starting to get worried i'll be swindled.

Thanks

>>2838920
>Mind saying which company it was so we can know who to avoid?

With this you can pretty much throw a rock on a job board and hit one.

>>2840122
This guy gets it.

This has been my experience, except for consulting on branding.

Pricing for an illustration--5k for a large piece and 5k for licensing.

I have a buddy who sold 10 small paintings for 2k each plus 3k for licensing to a beverage co.

You have to take into consideration the usage. One company wanted a page that could be printed from their website as a kind of coloring book. That's a lot of iterations and will cost them ducats.

But you have to be talented, *and* have people skills. Luck is important, but if you stay at it long enough, everyone gets a shot. You gotta maximize that one opportunity.

I never did work for vidya companies or MTG or comic book, though. Can't speak to those industries.

>>2839847

I made some free comissions to strangers and then asked how much would they pay for my art
Everyone answered between 20 to 30 bucks so I have been charging 25 for a sketch since then
Im a third world subhuman so everything comes in handy

>>2838846
So did you already draw them stuff or just apply?

Literally nothing to be upset about if it's just an application. You should be applying to more than one person at a time if you want work.