What is your opinion on russian academic drawing? Is that approach

I personally know little to nothing about it but I had a friend who went to a Russian drawing course outside of our University's courses and she said it was where she learned best how to approach art fundamentally.

It's too mechanical. It tries to have some human accidents here and there, but they just make matters even worse by seeming both shallow and contrived. Very few who study it make anything worthwhile as well, even if they can become technically good.

Not that there are much extant programs that are better.

>>2773989
So can somebody tell me what does this aproach consist of?

>>2773989
well, considering that it's regarded as one the best schools of drawing, i would say it's a great basis for any kind of work.

>>2774160
How about guangjian huang? Jeff watts?

>>2774168
gjh did russian academic drawing?

>>2774160
>Very few who study it make anything worthwhile as well, even if they can become technically good.

Same with a lot of asian artists. They're technically really good but a lot of them are soulless. On the other hand, technical skills and creativity aren't mutually exclusive. Most people don't make anything worthwhile anyway, whether they draw good or not.

Learning fundamentals is important because it sets a foundation for whatever style/direction you go.

>>2773989
What is Russian Academic Drawing?

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tfw I look through all these regularly just wishing and never drawing

>>2774176
I'd love to look and wish too, could you zip those up and put them on mega?

>>2774205
This

>>2774171
I'm not against learning fundamentals at all. It is however apparent that more than the past centuries, artists who know fundamentals are satisfied with creating works that most visibly show their fundamentals techniques above all. They are also investing more time in their practices than ever before. These two means result in them passing these off as their finished works. It's considered a rarity if someone who are taught under these somewhat rigorous programs come out with anything worth painting, or even more than just a figure study in that familiar stage lighting.

Even such a lowly artist like Pinturicchio at least endeavored for more than these supremely technical artists who know so much more of anatomy or how light works.

>>2774170
Yep

Any books on learning this approach?

>>2773989
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vpxrY0O40Ic

>>2774221
thankfully your opinion on what is "worth painting" isn't the gospel in art, and the pursuit of just creativity without regard for anything else is what turned modern art into garbage.
The fact is a lot of shitty artists try to downplay the technical and fundamental side of art because they can't understand that the fundamentals themselves allow for endless creativity and exploration.
Instead of just trying to challenge their creativity with just the subject matter, these kinds of artists get to express themselves with their calligraphy and strokes, edge control, subtle idealization and playing with value,color and lighting to suit their message and purpose.
This is why these kinds of artists can turn even a boring still life of fruits into a piece with personality and emotion to people who have a developed eye.
the OP drawing is a fine example, it's just a portrait yet it has dynamism and personality, and still manages to keep enough structure to be somewhat realistic and fundamentally very sound

>>2773989
I like the fact that this was graded B+.
Wonder what an A looks like to that teacher.

Where can we get PDF of Russian academy ? Doesn't matter if they are in russian

thanks guys

>>2774496

It isn't B+ but 4+
The russian grading system goes from 2 ( fail ) to 5 ( excellent )

>>2774453
Tfw US-RUS relations are at a 20 year high because we elected a dorito. Always thought I'd have no chance of attending because of my citizenship, but things are looking up!

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>>2774176
I third the zip request if it's not too much work

>>2774540
Still the same, but okay.

>>2774540
So it's exactly the same as a B+? Okay then.

>>2774176
upload something from that please

One of the best academic school in the world (maybe the best), as I know. If you want to have good skills and you live in Russia, why not?

>>2774625
What if I dont live in Russia but still want to get to know that approach?

>>2774674
then move to Russia, why not? Moscow is pretty comfortable city, St.Petersburg and few others too. But language is difficult, as I know (I'm native russian speaker, so I can't judge), and other cities are not the best place to live. And you must learn to drink vodka. A lot of vodka...

>>2774703
What I meant is I cant move out. I just want to self-taught, I was asking about some resources, if you know any of course.

>>2774176
4thing the zip/mega request.

>>2774172

European drawing legacy before the 60s.

>>2774674
>>2774708
Buy books. http://4-art.org/

>>2774703
Florence is probably nicer though, and they teach in english. All the professors are russian too.

>>2774725
>Florence is probably nicer though
Just a quick look at it (at their facebook, since the official site has no pictures) and it's all contemporary art trash. Unless they have secret courses they are not advertising.

>>2774725
maybe, I'm not qualified to judge. I only know what many people around me praise russian academic drawing. But I live in Russia, so it's not surprising

>>2774731
What? I'm taking about http://artac.org/

>>2774733
No doubt getting it straight from the source would be better, but moving to Russia and learning the language is a pretty large barrier for most people. I hear it's not easy to get in either, I think most of the international students are chinese?

>>2774446
>>2774539
>https://gurneyjourney.blogspot.nl/2016/10/fundamentals-of-drawing-now-in-english.html

>https://mega.nz/#!Q8owyCbC!wyRA9e-txOCrNd25ANfbBr9P0dzqduBOq6b1eo1C4X8

>>2774752
>What? I'm taking about http://artac.org/
Oh I see, sorry. I thought you were talking about one of the other art universities in florence.

>>2774752
I'm not a stunend of Art Academy, so I don't know, but in general international students is chinese and south korean, many students from ex-USSR, Africa

>>2774758
>http://artac.org/

Thank you ser

>>2774758

Sorry if it's a stupid question, but how are you supposed to study them? I treated it like the Charles Bargue manual and I sight-sized it.

So how many of you are going this way? Is this really that rigorous or does it still retain some fun? Wasn't kr0n trained that way?

>>2775026
He was. Kr0n finished art school and art academy, besides his parents are artists too, as I heard. But he newer liked academic painting

>>2774944
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YVAtRojlCS8

Your approach is not wrong and it's useful practice, but check out this video, it will help.

>>2774176
I am the fifth requester of these files

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>>2774176

Russian tradition is the height of artistic training. We'd have the same kind of tradition here in the West if our artistic lineage back to the Renaissance hadn't been brutally severed by the modernists.

It's why there are so many fuckawesome Russian/Chinese painters. The CIA promoted modernism as an attack on Communism, while the commies kept their art traditions alive. The best we have left is the French atelier style with cast drawings and rigorous site-size copying, but it's not as good for creative work as the Russian approach.

I like the results from a technical standpoint, but it's too stiff and mechanical a method for me.

>>2774471
I'm not talking about pursuit of only creativity. I made that clear. The Russian method isn't the only or best way of practicing fundamentals, though as I mentioned, of the ones that are established with large followings, it may be the best.

Modern art came about more with the same degree of regard for technical show as you praise, although not in the show of rendering reality. It may not seem apparent since the lovers of academic art and the like are staunchly against modern art, but it's what separates modern art from much of old master art. When we think of Van Gogh, we think above all in terms of the technique. Of Seurat, the same. For the different styles, in the creation of modern art, it's essentially the technique which determines the nomenclature, all the way through much of the present time. This level of concern with technique in contemporary traditional schools stems from modern art even as it revolts against it, just as modern art stems from and revolts against the 19th century academics. We see hints of modernism in the meaningless dashes of charcoal. This is something even modern artists did not understand about themselves.

I'm offended with disregard for skill, yet there is little to praise for gaudy display of technique.

>>2774540
>The russian grading system goes from 2 ( fail ) to 5 ( excellent )
what happens at 1? decapitation for shamfur dispray?

>>2775846
Siberian gulag happens, motherfucker!

>>2775561
i understand what you mean but i don't agree with a single thing, the problem with modern art is exactly that it's focused on the technique, but the thing is, technique is nothing without fundamentals.
the russian fundamentals don't focus on "rendering" reality, that's the sight size school with the 200 hour + efforts, where you actually render everything as accurate as possible.
the russian method is more focused on understanding the fundamentals of what you see to it's core level, and become intuitive with them so you can be freed of them while still giving them the respect they deserve.

for example these "meaningless" dashes of charcoal you're talking about are not actually meaningless, they are placed with thought and regard for the overall picture, you can witness this easily by the fact that when you squint, you don't see the strokes, you see a really good illusion of reality and texture.
this is why the school is the complete opposite of a "gaudy display of technique", because technique is only secondary in this method, it's only the outer layer of expression that comes after the base

>>2774176
Can ya zip and upload this Anon?

>>2774758
do you have this on russian, accidentally?

>>2775026
I'm going to do it because it is the most neutral basis for construction and rendering I've found and doesn't push the stylistic flourishes of any one artist. Then I can do whatever from there. A lot of instructors like Vilppu or Reilly or Huston assume a familiarity with these fundamentals coming from their own backgrounds with instructors from the 19th century, but go straight into their extrapolations from and shorthand of them.

>>2775921
>the problem with modern art is exactly that it's focused on the technique
you are fucking retarded

>>2773989
It's boring af, just like all the other dated-ass, boring af "academic" art.

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I've always admired the way they draw people, but I didn't think it was it's own school of teaching art. What do they teach that is different?

>>2776434
Explain how it's not academic or explain those quotation marks you insufferable fucking cunt.

>>2777313
"Do shit properly or fuck off" if you narrow it down.
Russian institutes are easy on expulsion if you don't follow the program. It's good and bad in a way. Good if you like what they teach, bad if you don't.

>>2777342
>Do shit properly or fuck off
Why is /ic/ not all over this? How can we turn /beg/ into a siberian art gulag?

>>2776302
how bout you actually read the fucking conversation before getting anally devastated, i'm talking about the painters he mentioned which are Van Gogh and Seurat which marked the beginning of modern art

>>2777390
>Why is /ic/ not all over this?
But it is. Their drawings get posted all the time.

>>2777390
Expel all the weebs.

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>>2773989
Their instagram page is pretty good. https://www.instagram.com/academic_drawing/

>>2777413
>that one big eye lip girl with slight tumblr nose
WHY IS THAT THERE
REEEEEEEEEE

>>2777413
Am I the only one who thinks this drawing is ugly it looks like the drawing was drawn from multiple perspectives then flattened.

>>2777568

Nah, the rendering carries it.

anyone got the english download of fundamentals of painting

>>2777390
>Why is /ic/ not all over this?
Because it's only sound fun in your head. Reality is sad. A lot people in /ic/ are just delusional about glorious russian art education.
Do you like doing some free job not related to art just because teacher said? You will. Do you like suck some teacher's cocks and stimulate his ego? You will. Conflict with some institute staff? You fucked, boy. You don't like teacher "style"? You don't like cross hatching? You will cross hatching everything for years even in your fuckin dreams. It's gives little in painting but who cares? Cross-hatching is sacred. Of course I'm little exaggerating but you will face it. There is supposed to be lurking some anon from repki he can tell you some stories for sure. Sometimes it's funny how US/EU people bitching about their art education while you have top tier ateliers like Grand Central Atelier. But no, you fags are too lazy and will bitch about Slade memes for years

>>2779459
>not liking cross hatching
top tier pleb

>>2774176
Can you zip and upload, so that we too can just wish and never draw?

>>2774176
pls to be ubloading blin

>>2779459
>It's gives little in painting but who cares?
but this is wrong, not only it's an amazing tool for drawing, which is the foundation of everything visual you will do, it's also a great tool to help you internalize form, and being able to convey and follow form with your brushstrokes is an important aspect of efficient and thoughtful painting

>>2779459
You should seriously ask yourself. Given, that you are not willing/capable of being self-thought. What would be more reasonable choice for a person who wants to become a good artist first and foremost?

A teacher that will discipline you and force those fundamentals down your throat whether you like it or not.

Or a teacher that allows his students to draw fucking anime and costs you 200k on top of that.

>>2777322
Don't bother. It's a baitfag.

>>2777410
This to be serious.

>>2780320
Try using charcoal. It's gives you more.
>>2780348
>Or a teacher that allows his students to draw fucking anime and costs you 200k on top of that.
Are you telling me that people from top tier animation schools or Art Center who actually draw "anime" and stylization don't kow fundamentals?

>>2780359
>Are you telling me that people from top tier animation schools or Art Center who actually draw "anime" and stylization don't kow fundamentals?

Are you legally retarded?

Both teacher and students can draw fetal alcohol syndrome lolis with cocks in their spare time for what I care.

But there is no place for this garbage in the still life, portrait, landscape lessons etc.

>>2780359
Animation and drawing look for different goals.

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>>2777413
Most of them not even russian lmao. Picrelated is Ramon Hurtado.
>http://www.ramonhurtado.com
They just earesed his signature. This is scum instagram full of bullshit. Google "VK practicum" for not bullshit place. And more imortant looks like there is some little "scandal" about Imperial Academy of Arts. Some kind of conflict with teachers and some girl.

>>2780368
>But there is no place for this garbage in the still life, portrait, landscape lessons etc.
Thanks captain. But where did you see bitching about fundamentals here? >>2779459
Also from what academy are you graduated? Repka, Stroganovka? Or it's just your theorycrafting?

>>2780359
fuck this pleb tier branch of drawing that is anime, get real

>>2780439
matur art for matur people

Just how many places in the world nowadays actually help develop artists who want to be GOOD in the classical sense like rubens or van dyck.

I look at the alumni of a lot of graduating classes for various schools around where i live (california) and most of it is way too heavy on the modern garbage (expression before technique).

>>2780461
Tons of them. Googling is just hard

>>2779459
Apply that to /beg/ and we would have endless lulz.

>>2774176
holy fuck nigga just upload the files already stop being a cock tease

>>2774176
bro, it's christmas time.

Can anyone recommend me a school in california for a complete beginner with almost 0 experience?

>>2779459
>Do you like doing some free job not related to art just because teacher said?
Can you actually elaborate? Do you consider students rotating in helping with cleaning duties to be a "free job"? Or do your teachers force you guys to get them coffee and shit? I am genuinely curious.

>Do you like suck some teacher's cocks and stimulate his ego?
>Conflict with some institute staff?
>You don't like teacher "style"?
How the fuck is it different from any other university?

>You don't like cross hatching?
I really don't get this one. You can dislike oils or watercolors or whatever and it would be somewhat justified by the fact that those mediums are relatively useless these days.

But crosshatching is the most basic way of getting value on paper with minimum tools. It's crucial for sketching, it works perfectly with illustration, it translates seamlessly to digital. How the hell can an aspiring artist who strives for solid fundamentals justify "disliking" it?

>>2780514
There is something you can understand only being a russian. It's kinda complex thing. Basically russian education considering as joke. It's free or very cheap. The "teacher" here is low tier shit job like doctor. Students are not recognized as human beings and have no rights. Add still strong USSR legacy (because oldbags are still alive) mix and shake. It's just like russian roulette.

>>2780540
This guy gets it. Russian education, even best available, is very, let's say, "special". You have insanely strong soviet theory, basis, books, but teachers often fucked in the head, if bad luck you need to bribe, you can be expelled because someone doesn't like you. As russian student, you can either have best time in your life or visit hell on earth. It's fully depends on current staff and your luck.

>>2780512
Beginners with little to no experience are the reason why art teaching suck. The teacher has to lower the standard of the curriculum so your unskilled asses have some chance at passing.

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>>2780512
Why I am, guy who lives on different cold continent among the bears and balalaikas able too google "good art school for a complete beginner with almost 0 experience" in less than fuckin 1 minute? In California. Actually even one of best art school and wet dream of a lot of anons. WHY? Why you stupid fuck can't even do simple shit like this in your own country? Did you use GPS to find toilet in your own house?

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>>2783188
Yeah. During the russian winter I wish to live in California or just some warmer place

>>2780557
>The "teacher" here is low tier shit job like doctor
Many of teachers in university work for good reputation or just wants to raise next generations. For example, I study in law academy in Moscow and some of my teachers are famous lawyers and have a plenty of money, cool cars etc. So I think in art academies must be teachers like that too.

>>2779459
>Do you like doing some free job not related to art just because teacher said? You will. Do you like suck some teacher's cocks and stimulate his ego? You will. Conflict with some institute staff? You fucked, boy.
If you're 19, sure. That applies to any other higher education institution too though, so don't go discouraging other anons.

>>2774176
Faggot confirmed

>>2774176
autism

>>2774176
It's just a bunch of fucking folders, without any files you idiots

>>2783188
>>2783337
Same ;(