Whats the validity of /ic/? When you post here people shit on

>>2660301
Woah, man. I'm only here for the book threads and shitposting.

>>2660301
>Whats the validity of /ic/?
None, the moment someone gets even a bit good they leave. though the general git good and study fundamentals is 100% valid advice.

>no one here has the guts to even post their own art when giving a critique
This meme again.

>>2660301
post in the draw thread and ignore the rest of /ic/

decide for yourself if any critiques make sense or not. If you agree, say thanks and post a revision maybe. If you don't agree, don't bother saying anything.

>>2660307
>be some shitkid that just read Fun With a Pencil
>go around posting "yout art is shit lol" without anything to back it up
99% of /ic/, that shit aint valid

People who aren't even artists go to galleries and judge people's work. Skill doesn't stop people from calling shit shit. At least here they have some backwards sarcastic advice hidden in ad hominem.

>>2660301
There should be an unwritten rule that states if you post your work in the draw thread you must accompany it with a critique of someone else's work.

That said, giving useful critique is not always easy to do in a concise form which is why so many people get shafted, because it would take paragraphs to describe how to fix the problems short of repainting the entire thing for them.

>>2660324
but then with any other art forum you can get advice and know what the person saying shit is coming from

only upsides to /ic/ is they aren't a hugbox and completely honest, but 99% of the time you wont get good critique because its "loomis loomis loomis".

That, and you can post your degenerate shit here and noone cares.

>>2660365
>99% of the time you wont get good critique because its shit

>>2660301
People literally draw over people's drawings as a form of critique here all the time. Are you new?

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>>2660368
good art critique
>yeah your anatomy on the jaw is a bit off, try to keep in mind that the area under the neck isnt flat, blah blah blah, digastric muscle, here's a redline, read some loomis you faggot

/ic/
>stop posting and don't come back until you're on the level of kim jung gi
>here's my art btw
>merc_wip

no denying your art is shit and the person is helping by calling out, but there's a difference between peers critiquing eachother and being shitheads.

Maybe im biased because ive been lurking since 2013 and I feel /ic/ was more of the former.

>>2660375

>go to forum
>Jake with pretentious cat avatar, 100,000 posts, 338585835 thanks crits your work
>says something exactly what /ic/ would say without the swearing, basically beating around the bush that you suck because not being "humble" and "friendly" will tarnish his good name
>you MIGHT MIGHT get a redline but this is very unlikely
>obnoxious signature at the end of his post boasting how much of an influence they are to the circle of friends community he and the few others have cornered and created
>you thank jake
>another one of his friends step in the convo to talk down to you to feel superior
>instead of jake replying back to you he replies to his friend
>other people reading the thread thank their posts, increasing their status of the alpha forum user
>you comment again in hopes they reply
>nothing
>your thread dies
sketchbook thread
>you post stuff
>"wow I really like your stuff soooooo much"
that's it

>>2660395
and yet those forums that you laugh at produced numerous top professionals while /ic/ has only produced a few people who are just struggling at the bottom tiers of professional art

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>>2660375
I'm here since 2011, and /ic/ was never shittier.

Thank /b/.
Thank Mikufag and his magical /pol/ friends.
Thank Malaysia.
Thank Nosefag.

Previously on Retarded Niggers: THE SPARK.

Now, in this episode: WHAT IS GESTURE?

>>2660400
While that may be true the majority of /ic/ is children or young adults below the age of 25 fresh in real world pampers. People like Bradley didn't really attempt art until they were 18, and with the help of mommies wallet, was able to go to art school for 5 years. He was an active member on CA.

http://www.conceptart.org/forums/showthread.php/130200-Noah-s-little-sketchbook-(03-29)

There is no need for a pat my ass forum. We didn't have all the resources we have today back in 08. Kids can get good so fast without artschool it is unreal.

>>2660301
No need at all to be an artist to criticize.

>>2660410
>While that may be true the majority of /ic/ is children or young adults below the age of 25 fresh in real world pampers.
That shouldn't really matter given how good some people have gotten in a matter of 3 or 4 years. You can start at 20 and become great by 25. /ic/ has been around years and yet almost no one has climbed out of beginner or mediocre skills.

Look at Sijun or CA and you see you got numerous people who got fucking good fucking fast. Yes, the userbases were larger, but I think if you controlled for that you would still get more success stories from the forums.

> We didn't have all the resources we have today back in 08. Kids can get good so fast without artschool it is unreal.
I agree with this. In another 10 years it will be scary what the kids of today will be able to do.

>>2660410
>While that may be true the majority of /ic/ is children or young adults
Kids these days don't draw pieces of shit. People in their early 30's like Lefty and Firez does.

Anyone can tell if art is good or not.
Art ability is the result of internalized skill, the amount of actual knowledge is fairly low.
A baddy can tell when something is out of perspective or is fucked up proportionally just fine.

I think feedback is always good, my mom cant draw shit and yet sometimes she can pin point anatomy errors because to her eyes feels weird.

But I also think that feedback from a professional you like and respect is by far the most important one, while most people focus on correcting details a professional can see and criticize major concepts that you misinterpreted or didnt fully understand

>>2660301
I'm sure you'll accept compliments from people who are shitty artists though right?

doesn't matter who gives the critique. You don't have to take their advice on how to improve, but you should take their critique into consideration and figure out yourself how to fix it.

>>2660530
hey dude, your arts fucking shit, fuck off.

-modern /ic/ "critique"

>>2660401
back then /ic/ was a bunch of d/ic/ks helping eachother git gud by being dicks and not a hugbox

now? a lot of it is just trolling and shitposting.

>>2660540
/ic/ has always been like this
ive been here for years and never has once it has ever changed.
same ol crab bucket /ic/, only newfags fall for the malaysia era meme

>>2660301
It was doomed from the start.
1. Art is subjective
2. One of the few objective aspects of art (arguably) are anatomy and perspective, and because everyone seems to suck balls at them, and because it's so easy to recognize when they're wrong, that's all everyone looks to critique.
3. Posting anonymously allows anyone to have a shit opinion and get away with it.
4. Dunning Kruger
5. People get too emotionally invested in their art, or get too offended by bad art and lack the artistic knowhow to properly dole out constructive criticism.
6. 4chan is full of autists and faggots.

>>2660568
Art it's not subjective, that's something the impressionists said to avoid criticism

>>2660679
fuck you

To be honest i just use this place to see if what i do is interesting, like, do i get replies when i post a drawing i plan to finish? do people like it? does no one reply to my studies because they're good enough that no one can actually critique something?
Despite all the people that'll just notice a pretty animu face in the draw threads I keep posting to see if what I do gets any reponse and try to build a following around people that like what i do.


There's also the rare case when I actually get a good crit, which is really not often, but I appreciate those, the key for me is just not being a little bitch and try to be as objective as posible when someone crits something you do, and try to disect any comment you get to see if you're not getting baited into some retarded mindless discussion and this person just wants to help but that's your call to make.

All in all, just take everything you read here with a grain of salt and don't be a judgemental faggot about everything that goes on in this shitty board, that's what drives any good artists away from this place, at the end of the day do you really want to get better? then lay off the fucking keyboard and start drawing.

>>2660324
just because someone has 0 technical skill doesn't mean he has 0 artistic knowledge / sensitivity. Lack of knowledge make people call good stuff shit and call shit good stuff because they don't have enough perspective, and that's specifically the problem with /ic/. They read a few threads, they see people spouting loomis left and right and they mimick it.

at least that's how it was a few years ago, I haven't been keeping up too much

>>2660301
>This thread again

even people who know little about art can give instruction. Its about human perception. Normies don't have to read the loomis started pack to know when something looks off with a face or most body parts. Because we, as humans, subconsciously know what the shape should look like

so if normies can give at least the smallest art advice, than on here anyone learning can give the basic look over + any information they have retained up to that point, going upwards from there. Obviously a master will be able to point out more issues than the beginner, but it will only be issues in addition to the ones the beginner saw. A beginner may just see a anatomical error while a master see that, composition issues and lighting issues

Its a lot more about delusion

the reality is that more artist here are not willing to admit to their shortcomings and will shrug off a useful crit in favor for praise

that being said, you know when someone is trolling, because others will call them out, or you can use your own discretion. Because you are an artist too, if you look at something they say and it doesn't match up, you should read into it more. Just don't have the common knee jerk reaction to any negative thing said about your work

but if your automatic reaction after a stinging criticism is "post your work", than you are an infant. You will never learn to proceed if you cant use all the information given to you, and you have to gatekeep to make sure everything said is up to your retarded standards

With your mentality, you will smother any spark you might have and live a miserable life of non improvement

>>2662055
Also, to everyone in here that thinks "its shit" is a useless and throw away critique, you are retarded. If your work is shit, it's filled with too many errors to fix and save, making it trash. The sooner you man up and stop believing you're the freshest shit and the king of the hill, the better off you will be. You are dirt. We are all dirt until we grow slowly out of it. until than we are stuck here with each other. Learn how to take crit, even if it doesn't sound like your mom correcting your 4th grade homework

>>2662063
Kinda agree, but I think it depends on how they present it. If they're being little shits with their "yeah I'm better than 90% of you" or they don't even bother taking a decent photo or whatever, then yeah, let em have it.

>>2660400
>trying to confirm your bias with an asspull
What percentage of deviant art users are dogshit vs the percentage of /ic/ users?

Pro artists going to a popular forum to show off their work doesnt mean the forum did jack shit.

>>2660401
thanks for helping the situation

Yeah this is something that worries me a bit in this site. Though there are artists here that are good in my opinion and I'd gladly hear their critique, it sucks to not know who exactly is commenting your art.

That being said, could you guys recommend some art communities where you can get reliable critique?

>>2660311
What's really frustrating about /ic/ is that while there's an illusion of traffic, actual drawthreads are semi-dead
It's nearly impossible to get any feedback in a beginner drawthread unless you've made some obvious mistake, and if you fix or point those out beforehand, you'll get zero replies
Also in questions thread a lot of posts go unanswered
This place is literally dead if you exclude all the shitposting

>>2660301
>Fell for the "You must be THIS good to criticize me" meme
>Can't delineate good advice from bad, afraid to try anything that might be wrong
>Can't figure things out on his own through trial and error

Why are you even here?

>>2662401
>Also in questions thread a lot of posts go unanswered
80% of the questions get answered there. The stupid ones like
>how do I hold a pencil
>paper or tablet
>is it too late for me to draw
don't deserve precious braincells
>It's nearly impossible to get any feedback in a beginner drawthread unless you've made some obvious mistake
You know this is not true.
>actual drawthreads are semi-dead
let me remind you the userbase of this board is ~130 with ~90 regulars ~800 lurkers

>>2662440
>board for critique
>there is no good critique
>"just figure it out yourself brah"

/ic/

>>2662672
>not understanding the implication of "critique"
>Completely missing that the point of critique is not to have someone tell you exactly what to do and how to do it, but rather to use their observations as a tool to see things that you might have completely overlooked. Sometimes critique is not entirely good or accurate, but it is still important to know what immediately stands out. Sometimes someone with absolutely no knowledge whatsoever can have a simple observation that will stop you dead in your tracks.
>You are always on your own no matter how good the critique, you are the one who delegates what information is useful and what information is not

Wew lad

I actually find /ic/ pretty good for critique occsionally.

I go to a draw thread, post something up, and ask "What looks off?" and most of the time people respond with "X looks like shit. Work on that."

Boom. Is all I need. I got an account on Deviant art, and joined like a million critique clubs, and post my artwork there for people to comment and critique but I still get nothing but ass patting "u dun good!" stuff that doesn't help me.

>>2660301
But where are the good places? I hear ConceptArt.org used to be good. But every art community seems like /ic/ where I look.

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>>2660301
Lurk more

>>2662401
/ic/ is great for beginners, since that's the level that will get legit feedback from people.

Beyond that, it's pretty shit. Most the skilled artists spend the majority of their time drawing rather than shitposting. So you won't really see them post any form of critique very often. They just post their work, see if it gets replies, and carry on drawing.

If you want better feedback at higher levels, you need to go to a place where people aren't hidden by anonymity, and they have to care for their reputation.

>>2664966
This comic is on point.

>>2664966
The artist sure was horny when he drew that

You don't need to be a good artist to tell someone if their drawing us good. But you do need to be a good artist to give advice.

A person who just read fun with a pencil is perfect valid telling DaVinci that his painting doesn't look right. But there's no point in telling Da Vinci what to work in order to improve his painting. There's no way you'd know, since you never had his level of foundation and experience.

A more recent example is NBA players who neglect freethrows. A bad shooting percentage is objective and can be pointed out by a baby, but you are a fool to try and coach them unless you're at the level of a professional trainer or assistant who can knock down free throws like breathing.

>>2665001
>But you do need to be a good artist to give advice.

Not a lot of good artists are also good teachers. That isn't to say that anyone here is, but since this is an anonymous message board I don't think you can be real picky about what critiques you receive.

There are people who legitimately behave as illustrated in this comic >>2664966 , but sometimes you'll come across something that rings true. A lot of the time you'll have to fish for it, but there are decent people here who will point something out that rings true. Other times you just have to take it on the nose and see if something can be gleaned from the chaos.

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>>2664966
ftfy

>>2665030
fucking KEK

>>2660312
Why are people like you even on here if 999999% of this place doesn't appeal to you? What do you get out of this?

>>2665095
Because people want it to become the place it should be.

t. other guy

>>2665111
Everyday the same arguments are done in here. None of them end up in either side turning their approach. Everything remains and has remained the same for years, nothing progresses no matter how hard you want them to.

pointless

>>2665181
So giving up will solve the problem? /ic/ already got better through the years, there were times where we didnt even had a sticky, that answers question that come up very often, now we got dedicated beginner, draw, alternative artstlye,... threads. Complainers and trolls will always try to do their thing, but that doesnt mean they have to be the norm or should be given the space to ruin this place.

>>2665111
I've got a proposal that I'm sure will appease everyone.

We create another thread. No Art, No Post.

Essentially, the concept is to rely on the gregarious nature of this board, and the old guilt of the CA days where you would get chastised if you didn't post something before chilling in the lounge.

Your art becomes your handle. You have to make it in the moment.

>>2665201
Thread will die soon or plastered with art that is acutally from someone else, it would only work if /ic/ was working already. We already got somewhat guides how to do art and threads where to post stuff depending on their topic, the Artwork department of Artwork/Critique is covered with this, what /ic/ is still lacking is something covering the Critique part. A guide how to make a correct and helpful critique could be placed in the sticky or a overall concept should be discussed, as it happened with the sticky we got now, who covers a lot of former often asked questions.

>>2665209

I've already calculated this and it is unfortunately true. The only way it would even function as intended is if it were enforced by the mods. Even then, who's to say someone wouldn't take the art of another person? Even if it were made in the moment.
Though the ideal is appealing. I was hoping to get a good bit of back and forth on this to see if there was a diamond in the rough.

Though I am not opposed to guidelines regarding critique etiquette.

/ic/'s userbase mostly consists of people from the absolute bottom of the barrel shit stain unholy trinity of awful literal garbage degenerate human beings in the world.

/pol/, /a/ and /v/.

I suggest lurking these boards for some time and you'll be able to spot these retards instantly when they say stupid shit.

>>2665209
>take an image
>flip it
>add a filter to maximize security
>suddenly it becomes my art
It won't work.

>>2665214
>>2665217
you all answering to the wrong post, fuckers

>>2665225

It's fine.

>>2665229
i would understand if one made it, but 2? looks awefully like samefagging

>>2665232

>>2665214
This is my post, one that I used to clarify that this was not a perfect idea. Read it a little closer and you will see that.

>>2665242
no, i will read half of the first sentence and answer like i nkow the rest

>>2662382
ConceptArt/Permanoobs/Red Daggers

>>2660301
I always expect to get ripped to shreds by /ic/ but they don't have bad things to say on average. People much better than me are always getting dissed here.