How Aztecs was being able to predict that some white guy will

>>772926
No wonder the spanish bred with the local women

Bloodmagic

>>773437
White people are very exogamous compared to Asians
Even the miscegenation law couldn't prevent it

They predicted a man with a beard would appear as an avatar of their god. When a guy with a beard did appear and brought with him non-indigenous animals and advanced technologies they reasoned it really was their god.

My point is, if their faith was the true faith, they would have been able to predict Europeans would come over on boats and fuck their shit.

>>772926
>aztec gods are real
>foretell of the Spaniards' arrival
>fail to warn of what they're going to do

What a bunch of assholes.

>>773639
Aztec gods fucking love bloodshed and strife, I bet they were busting up when everyone got killed hella brutally.

>>773639
Have you not read about what the aztec gods want their followers to do? And you expect anything less?

>>772926
You will find that most religious predictions are vauge to the point they can be met by a huge variety of factors.

You might be too young to appreciate this but the Soviet Union collapsing by itself was a huge dissapointment to many christians who belived it to be associated with the Anti Christ, and hence a sign of the second comming

>>773648
>>773644
They weren't even the worst. The Mayans had Ixtab, the goddess of hanging yourself.

>>774054
Sounds like the god for me.

>>774056
>>774054
dont ever change, anon

>>774011
what was the exact prediction that the aztecs had?

>>772926
because the aztecs were literally gods in america and only a threat from across the sea could take them down.

>>773636
>>772926
>>774011
>>774114
It'd be nice to have a translation of the quote, along with citations, leading to the original prophecy. Otherwise it might as well have been Spanish propaganda.

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>>774054

>>774952
>Otherwise it might as well have been Spanish propaganda.
It's believed by many historians to have been exactly that. There is no "original quote" stating a prophecy from before the Spanish showed up. The common idea of this legend comes from the Florentine Codex, compiled in the 16th century by a Franciscan. Most early recorded versions of the legends seem to imply that Quetzalcoatl-Topiltzin died after leaving Tollan, rather than going away over the sea to later return.

>>774976
Yes, and Ragnarok clearly leads to the birth of Adam and Eve. What irks me is that people don't have an ear to detect obvious bull.

>>772926
Coincidence. Now stop being a retard.

>>772926
Predictors do not care much about religions. May be their do contact with more than 4 dimension subjects and because this get predictions. Religions born, life and die, but predictors always alive.

>>772926
>How Aztecs was being able to predict that some white guy will come from the sea to mess things up in America?!
Maybe clear body and Sálvia divinórum.

they probably saw white men before some thousand years ago, dont ask me how, but thats the only logical answer

>>775151
Rumors passed down by Indians over centuries from Northeastern North America about white men (Vikings/Leif Erikson) arriving from across the sea.

>>775168
>>775151
You people suck so bad its not even funny

>>775185
why are you underaged shitters here?
why do you pollute this board

>>775209
26.

I hate this thread because it keeps getting colder from the truth. At least in the 5th world continent, the people who know fuck-all about that place dug gradually into the heart of things.

Here you idiots keep spring boarding into muddled myths.

>>773503
>spanish
>white

>>775216
yet you type and think like a teenager
get off my board shitstain

>>772926
The Aztec gods were idolized demons. Satan told his servants about the coming of the Christians as a way to both warn and mock his followers, knowing what would happen.

>>775185
Way to argue the point, fucktard. How about explaining why that would be false?

>>774976
>Florentine Codex

Quotes please? Historia General is as far from propaganda as you can get.

>Turns out someone just needs to die in order for the sun to rise.
>Absolute world peace achieved
>sun goes out
>every one dies

>>778114
OK, found it.

>You have graciously come on earth, you have graciously approached your water, your high place of Mexico, you have come down to your mat, your throne, which I have briefly kept for you, I who used to keep it for you.
>You have graciously arrived, you have known pain, you have known weariness, now come on earth, take your rest, enter into your palace, rest your limbs; may our lords come on earth.

From Wikipedia:

>Subtleties in, and an imperfect scholarly understanding of, high Nahuatl rhetorical style make the exact intent of these comments tricky to ascertain, but Restall argues that Moctezuma's politely offering his throne to Cortés (if indeed he did ever give the speech as reported) may well have been meant as the exact opposite of what it was taken to mean: politeness in Aztec culture was a way to assert dominance and show superiority. This speech, which has been widely referred to, has been a factor in the widespread belief that Moctezuma was addressing Cortés as the returning god Quetzalcoatl.

>>773644
>Over 1 million Aztecs defeated by a couple thousand Spaniards
Yeah they were laughing their asses off.

>>778211
A couple thousand spaniards and a shitton of native tribes who were justifiably mad at the Aztecs for everything their gods told them to do. It was an absolute bloodbath, and far more entertaining than the alternative of smallpox.

>>775305
>catholics
>Christians

kek

>>775299
which is appropriate to criticize, and not contribute to, a shitty thread

>>777861
i'd rather make a better thread about this

>>772926
Either coincidence or some Aztec fishermen strayed off the coast and saw Spanish Conquistadors on the Caribbean islands banging some Taino qts. Or the Mayans, who traded with the Spanish before they discovered the Aztecs, told them that whitey was around. The prophecy was concieved after the higher Aztec class got the rumours that the Europeans had reached the coast, and before that Quetzalcoatl wasn't seen as a white man but as a bearded Aztec (there were bearded natives around before Columbus, like the Beothuk, the Comechingones and other).

>>778211
You mean a couple thousand Spaniards and the rest of Mexico who hated Moctezuma's guts.

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>>775294
Are Iberians not white?

>>778414
They are white.
And before you say "Muh Moor rapebabies", most people living in Muslim Iberia were native Iberians and Latins who had been converted to Islam. The Andalucians were a thing from before the Moors came in and kicked the Visigoths out.
And the Moors weren't non-white, either. Sure, they weren't the lightest folk around, but they definitively weren't black or Touareg. Most of them were Berbers with an Arabic ruling class (wich was kicked out), and both of those peoples were Caucasian. Semitic, yes, but still Caucasoid.

>>772926
they most likely met some chinese around 1420ish, who had a paler skin than the aztecs. Also, one of their myths is of a feathered snake, eg. a chinese dragon

>>778486
Holy shit that actually would make sense, and it would explain why the Incans had similar myths regarding pale skinned men coming on boats from the East.
Note also how they only reference pale skin, not round eyes or beards, two other things that made the Spaniards different from the natives, but that the Chinese didn't have.
It would also be something else to add to the "Colombus didn't really discovered anything" meme, together with the Siberians, the Polynesians and the Vikings.

>>778351
>i'd rather make a better thread about this
We're waiting.

>>778386
Interesting. Still puts it within fabrication.

>>778486
I'm Chinese. It never happened. But it should have. America's bureaucracy is going the same direction as the Qing's (NASA funding cut, leaving Mars for China, India, or Brazil). Which sucks.

>>778511
make me fag bag

>>778486
>>778506
China is located west of the American continent and the Quetzalcoatl myth comes from at least the 200 A.D with a temple consecrated to him in Teotihuacan.

>>778559
>West
Oops, I meant to write that, since I doubt the ancient Peruvians ever learnt about the Atlantic Ocean until the Spanish came.

>>773644
>hella
kys mm

>>778579
They knew of the Caribbean area, which they traded and gained information from on occasion. Had the Inca empire continued, I have no doubt that their conquests would have continued north, but due to the instability of empires, it would eventually have led to a northern empire to contend with the western Inca empire.

>>778651
which is actually how the spanish learned of the aztec in the first place

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>>778189
>You have graciously come on earth, you have graciously approached your water, your high place of Mexico, you have come down to your mat, your throne, which I have briefly kept for you, I who used to keep it for you.
This was part of the speech pronounced by the nobles of Tenochtitlan during a coronation. The Aztec culture was borrowed from the kingdom of Quetzalcoatl, who exiled himself entrusting his people to keep his throne in the same condition that he left it. Nevertheless, his kingdom fell and the next Mesoamerican cultures tried to rebuild it.
The expedition of Cortes arrived from the same direction and year that Quetzalcoatl said he would come and followed a considerable amount of omens, which are described in the Florentine Codex. Everyone was so hesitant that even the nobles and priests had to wait until the year was over to disobey Montezuma.
It's unclear if Montezuma believed that Cortes himself was Quetzalcoatl or just a representative, as he always clarified with Montezuma's ambassadors saying that he came in the name of his mighty king, Charles V.
>It also should be noted that there's not a single pre-Columbian reference that depicts Quetzalcoatl as a bearded or white man, being this only mentioned in the chronicle of Bernal Díaz.

>>778211
The myth contributed to that downfall. Albeit technologically superior, the expedition of Cortes could've been easily dispatched. But Montezuma never attacked and instead sent sorcerers to investigate what kind of God was coming.

>>773636
their prophets were lazy stoners, all day taking peyote and shit and didn´t bother to tell the people the whole thing

>>778999
A brief account the omens mentioned by the Florentine Codex:
http://www.mexicolore.co.uk/acrobats/307_1.pdf

>>778486
all civilizations have myths about dragons or serpents

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>>772926
>Yacatecuhtli was the patron god of commerce and travelers
>His name means "lord of the nose"
THEY KNEW

>>778351
>Looks like you don't want to make my own case, just denounce everyone else's based on nothing. Why the fuck should anyone take you seriously when you can't substantiate anything you say?

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>>774976
>Most early recorded versions of the legends seem to imply that Quetzalcoatl-Topiltzin died after leaving Tollan, rather than going away over the sea to later return.
His death is mentioned in the Chimalpopoca Codex and the Florentine Codex, the later seems to be the only record of his journey in the sea and it also specifies that he traveled in a raft made of snakes called "serpentmat" or "serpentbed" and arrived to the Primal Red Place.

>>780528
latter*

>>772926
That's still disputed whether they believed this was the Spaniards and if this played a role in the Conquest. Most scholars have dismissed this legend as an early colonial myth. See --> Mathew Restall "Seven Myths of the Spanish Conquest", James Lockhart "We People Here: Nahuatl Accounts of the Conquest of Mexico", and Camilla Townsend "Burying the White Gods:New perspectives on the Conquest of Mexico".

http://www.cynthiaclarke.com/anth115/115_readings/Burying_the_white_gods.pdf

>>778999
Quetzalcoatl is more of a title than the actual deity, so when Aztecs addressed Cortes as Quetzalcoatl they were addressing him as a noble or high ranking person. There are many Quetzalcoatl kings in Aztec history.

Source: Warlords of Ancient Mexico by Peter G. Tsouras

>>780759
Also Motecuhzuma II was a very religious person and there was actually a prophecy of Quetzalcoatl (the king, not the deity) returning in the same year Cortes arrived.

He actually proposed becoming a vassal to the Spanish crown until some of his soldiers betrayed the Spaniards at Veracruz which led to the Noche Triste events.

Probably some vikings or fishermen shipwrecked and convinced the natives that their land was far more powerful. The legend itself probably was a fluke, but the basis for the legend is apparent.

>>780759
Quetzalcoatl was a title for a priest, but the title for a "king" was Topiltzin.

>>780790
>there was actually a prophecy of Quetzalcoatl (the king, not the deity) returning in the same year Cortes arrived.
It's unclear if Quetzalcoatl Topiltzin, king of Tollan, was a just a historical figure or a deity since his biographical documents are basically metaphors in Nahuatl. He even exiled himself after committing a sin induced by his twin brother, the god Tezcatlipoca.
The Toltecs mentioned him as Fourth Quetzalcoatl, suggesting that he was an incarnation or a prophet. The number four could also be a metaphor alluding to its meaning "whole" in Nahuatl.

And Montezuma certainly was a religious person, being him the only Mexica king who previously served as a priest.
Nevertheless, he only accepted to become a vassal after he got taken hostage by Cortes, who managed to kidnap him alleging an apology for the Spanish killed in Veracruz.
La Noche Triste took place 6 months later, while Cortes was fighting the spanish who wanted to capture him, Pedro de Alvarado killed many unarmed Aztecs due to a pagan celebration.

>>780759
That's a great book.

Also there was a K'iche Maya King called 'Gucumatz', literally Plumed Serpent who was around in the 1450's. He was said to be able to transform into the Plumed Serpent. The Ki'ches were a kind of Toltec influenced Maya in the Guatemalan highlands. Even many of their words have Nahuatl origins. What's interesting is in their myths their were many plumed serpents, sometimes even envisioned as a Trinity during the creation of the world.