How did women manage to get convinced that getting a career was

>>3335452
But getting a career is more fulfilling

>>3335452
They probably didn't. What probably happened is they got convinced that being financially independent is more fulfilling than depending financially on one particular male. Which is absolutely true.

>>3335452
The fact that she was able to pick the job she wanted, work it and acquire money that she could spend for herself or her family, and didn't need to be told to do everything and no longer had to be burdened with other things in her life.

If you don't like freedom go join the Amish.

>>3335458
>>3335460

>thus ended western society

>>3335462

>implying the average person of either sex "chooses" to have a job

>>3335452
The capitalist thought only using 50% of the adult population was inefficient.

>>3335464
I think it's more that the West has to compete with a whole world full of developed economies now, so the scientific/economic edge the white man used to have is gone. Women staying at home wouldn't change anything about this. Could Western men even afford to keep wives at home in the current global economic climate?

>>3335452

Why don´t you raise a family and shut up?

more like how did you manage to accept half of your population stop working, leech on a single income and do meme activities such as cooking in the 20th century

everywhere in the world, women worked and raised children unless they were nobility

what makes amerishart women think they are entitled to the privilege of the few?

>>3335473
>Could Western men even afford to keep wives at home in the current global economic climate?

No. People who unironically make these threads probably can't support women in the kitchen, not that they can get a woman since they don't even try. And then they compare them to Anime girls and then go bitch on /r9k/ about all women being whores. The type of people who wouldn't have had wives back in the day anyways.

Because back then, doing shit was sort of annoying. If it were today, they could just shitpost on facebook all day and be fine.

That whole "world war" thing, mostly.

>>3335495

90% of married white women did not work for any kind of pay in the 1890 census

>>3335503

t. Reddit historian

It's a cultural thing. Society decided that it was socially acceptable for women to start working and do we adjusted the economy accordingly. It would take time but with improvements in AI and automation it could be possible again. Notice how quickly we shunted women back into place right after the world wars?

>>3335495
Women worked more hours then men during the gilded age in the mills. This whole domestic servitude bliss thing is a product of post-war imaginations in basically utopia.

>>3335518
>did not work for any kind of pay
It's a good thing women didn't do any work on the family land in rural areas as well then isn't it

>>3335458
It is not

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>>3335524
This, poor women have basically worked throughout most of history, whether in the field, as maids, or at other miscellaneous trades like wet nurses or weavers.

>>3335460
They don't really care about being financially independent, since they still want to marry rich guys. Obviously not all women, but it is a trend. It's more about power or necessity.

If not, there'd be a lot more women in the skilled trades, yet no one is fighting for more women plumbers or garbage men. Women are either in educated fields or like retail

>>3335539
For a lot of women it is.

>>3335526

>implying working on your family's farm or mom and pop shop with your immediate family is the same as abandoning your kids/husband to go wagecuck for a multinational corporation downtown

>>3335458

There is something fundamentally wrong with a """"woman"""" who doesn't self actualize on marriage and motherhood

>>3335452
Capitalism is indifferent to what women want, they go to work or they starve to death.

>>3335524

It was very strong in the 1700/1800s amongst the middle/upper classes

>>3335551

All these proles ITT talking about their job giving them freedom or independence just shows capitalism will be around another 1000 years. The average prole is literally too stupid to not envision a life without wagecucking.

>>3335546
What is the image a reference to?

>>3335518
>90% of married white women did not work for any kind of pay in the 1890 census
Well yeah, but something like 80% of the population were farmers back then. The farming wife wouldn't be getting paid for her hard work, at least not in any way that would be counted as a job.

>>3335557
It gives them freedom from starving, and independence from living on the dole. It's not ideal, but it has its perks over living on welfare.

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>>3335552
Yeah, so? The rich men didn't work either. Work sucked in the 18th-19th century, nobody was ever going to do it willingly. You going to pluck chickens for a penny an hour with no workers' rights to feel empowered?

>>3335546
>They don't really care about being financially independent, since they still want to marry rich guys.
They want to marry rich guys, but they want to be financially independent enough while they look for a rich guy that finding a guy isn't a matter of financial survival for them. Makes sense to me.

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>>3335558
The Thot's Progress: A Series of Engravings by Sir William ShindoL

>>3335548
Most women get a career first and then, if they abandon anything at all, what they do is abandon the career for kids. I don't know where you're getting these ideas of women abandoning their kids for careers.
Seems like women just can't win in the eyes of some guys. If they pursue having kids, it's cause they're not smart enough to succeed at careers. If they pursue careers, it's cause they're abandoning kids. What the fuck.

>>3335566
>ShindoL

Yeah OK, I can do without.

>>3335562
Yeah, and that leads them to either glamor jobs or necessary jobs. Skilled trade is relatively rare, excepting the medical field where lower tier jobs like Phlebotomy or CNAs are dominated by women.

>>3335568

>I wish she was more career focused

Sorry sweetie, but no actual men say this. I know your feminist thought professor told you guys like independent women who try to out do men but it's not true.

>>3335573
Dude, I'm probably more experienced with women than you are. I love career-oriented women. They're usually smarter on average than women who aren't career-oriented. They're usually better in the sack too, cause career-oriented women tend to have strong sex drives and know what they want.

>>3335571
Sure, but what argument are you trying to make by that?

>>3335593
I'm not really making an argument, just an observation. If more women went into better paying skilled trades, the pay gap would shorten significantly. All the leave and general lack of ambition would probably leave it at like 9/10, though. Almost as good as Asian women

>>3335598
Ah, got it. Yeah, I think you're right.

>>3335602
Yeah, all those phleb and CNA jobs are still hourly. It's not much better than being an employee at Walmart.
They're good if you're in medschool, but it's a career for many women.

>>3335518
YOU DUMB RETARDED SHARTER WHY WOULD THEY RECIEVE PAY FOR WORKING ON THE FAMILY LAND? HEY? WHY?

BECAUSE YOU ARE A FUCKING RETARD THATS WHY UGLY VIRGIN FUCKFACE, DIE

>>3335573

Can you be any more 13?

>>3335452
They saw something men did that they weren't doing or horning in on. This is the motivation of all women for anything that isn't involved in competition with another woman, or inanimate object, or concept on general.

>>3335518
>Society decided

>>3335469
Get a job before your parents die and leave you homeless, NEETfag.

>>3335452
cultural marxism

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>>3335539
Ah yes, a /his/ browser dictating how every woman fulfils herself because muh tradition.

How about just settling with the fact that no two individuals are the same? It's great if a woman prefers to dedicate her time to her offspring, but some women, and men, are better at working. Some shouldn't even be parents.

>>3335452
Kids are shits. I'd way rather have a job.

>>3335613
>>3335590

t. Hamplanet

Women weren't made for careers; they were made to be wives and mothers. That's like judging your heavy duty pickup truck on its gas mileage.

Average girl doesn't want to be a mother nor does she really want to work either. She just wants to date a super wealthy chad, do yoga classes and go shopping 24/7.

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>tfw degenerate, wh*te society will gradually fall to socially conservative Muslims and the odd radical Christian group

Thank God I'm Muslim, it amazes me how proud you are of letting your women run everything. You deserve every 1.2 birth rate you get.

>>3337178

Agreed. We need to rebuild a culture of parenthood for both men and women in western society. One of the benefits of gender roles is the meaning it ascribes to both parties: women as honored wives and treasured mothers, men as respected heads of families. Today we're all just androgynous consumer units. Thanks globalism!

>>3335495
>cooking
>meme activity
wat. cooking isn't easy. it's time consuming and labor intensive

>>3335518
>90% of married white women did not work for any kind of pay in the 1890 census
absolutely awful imagination you have. women as others have mentioned labored on the family fields AND had to carry out a great amount of housework while raising children

>>3337207

What kind of work do you think we're talking about retard? Of course we want women raising kids full time. See the rest too.
>>3335548

The average his poster Christ.

>>3335590

>wanting a sexually experienced woman

You're supposed to get a virgin and train her.

>>3335452
Women are silly and easily convinced of anything.

>>3337218
Ya sound like a virgin, mate. Your pronouncements about sexuality reek of the keyboard

>>3337240

More like "conservative mindset".

>wanting a whore

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It was the secret front of the third estate (the burgeoise, people who make money) who conspired to create feminism as a means to make women enter the workforce, driving down the price of labor. Now they are doing the same thing again but with immigrants (import more workers to drive down the price of work). It's quite simple really.

>>3335462

>freedom to enrich a capitalist with your labor

By having careers and discovering that they were more fulfilling than raising a family

>>3337272

This unholy antinatalist civilization must be destroyed. Thank god Muslims are taking over. Keep being DINKs guys.

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>>3337240
>implying there is anything wrong with virginity

>>3337272
Yes, making spreadsheets or working in customer service which is what 90% of women are ever going to do is truly is so fulfilling, much more than doing what any biological being clearly should do.
That's why childless career women are so happy on average.

>>3335452
Guarantee that image was made by a man.

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>>3335452
>manage to get convinced
>get convinced
They didn't get convinced by anyone, it was their idea to start with. They're at the root of it.

>>3335452
Kids are gone and you have nothing.

>>3335452
Women have worked throughout history you ignorant /pol/tard.

>>3337293

Shh, don't disrupt the brainwashing.

>>3337256
This is not how the job market works you colossal fucking moron.

>>3335598
>If more women went into better paying skilled trades, the pay gap would shorten significantly.


No it wouldn't. Skilled trades only get good wages in America due to their efforts to gimp the flow of new people into the field.

>>3337285
There's nothing wrong with being a virgin. There's something wrong with being a virgin and then trying to tell me what I should prefer in a sex partner.

>>3337324
Your well-structured and articulated argument has convinced me, you are right and i was wrong.

>>3337329
>you need to be a degenerate to bash degeneracy

>>3335472

>doubling the labor force
>good for labor

>>3337312
Women don't have original ideas.

>>3337329

Pluralism is a meme, homogenous societies are GOAT.

>>3335452
begging you to have sex

>>3337334
No one cares about the labour, it's the capital that decides.

>>3335452
>people unironically think that the average woman was a housewife throughout most of history

>>3335568
>Most women get a career first and then, if they abandon anything at all, what they do is abandon the career for kids.

Most women _can't_ give up their outside job even after having kids, (though almost all want to) as a single income just isn't enough to support a family nowadays.

>>3337335
Women rule society.

Women having kids after 30 significantly increases the risk of the kid being autistic. Having a kid after 35 or 40 basically guarantees the kid will be some kind of a fuckup. "Career first, kids later" is brainlet tier logic.

>>3335460
Unfortunately, doubling the size of the labor pool devalued labor and make financial independence impossible for most people regardless of sex/gender/whatever.

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>>3335452
Don't worry habibi, we will fix this inchallah

>>3337391
Islam won't fix shit. It's people who make ideologies and not the other way around. Christianity also used to be patriarchal, traditional, anti-gay, etc. Then the people become cucks so they made Christianity into a cucked religion as well.
If all of Europe became muslim tomorrow you can bet it will be in the form of transgender gay imams preaching that Muhammad was an egalitarian who would vote for Angela Merkel.

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>>3337329
Why though? Does abscence of experience guarrante ignorance, all of the time? No. One can argue that Anon, even though a virgin, has experience in finding partners, but he just hasn't found one that fulfills him enought to have passionate love with. Maybe he is romantic. Who knows? But you shouldn't make assumptions about one not having experience.

>>3337406
*in finding a partner, just because he is a virgin

>>3337332
>>3337386
People create jobs, there aren't a finite amount of jobs that exist and can then be taken away from you, people create demand which creates jobs, people have salaries which they spend which creates more jobs as demand goes up. It's not a one for one system that's not how it works, saying otherwise is just ignorant, stop getting your understanding of the economy from /pol/.

>>3337413
Families didn't double in needs when women entered the labor pool en masse. The price of those needs just rose to meet the greater amount of money each family had available. Supply and demand, this is basic shit.

>>3337406
True. But he's an annoying retard who claimed that guys don't like independent women, and that I'm supposed to want to get a virgin and train her. I mean, if that's your thing, that's your thing. It's not mine, though. I've been with college students and I've been with career women. I've been with virgins and I've been with sexually experienced women. My own experience is that career women are more interesting and are better in bed, and that sexually experienced women are more fun to be with than inexperienced women. Doesn't mean I want a girl who's banged a hundred guys, but it does mean that I see no reason to prefer a virgin to a woman who's been around a few times.

>>3337421
They didn't enter en masses, for the hundredth fucking time women have worked for most of history, its a myth that they were all house wives you sperg.

>>3337425
Not him, but working and employment are two completely separate things.

>>3337402

Projection. Islam, no matter where it is, tolerates no deviation from its line. This is because it's brilliance is more as a political style than a mere religion.

>>3337349

This is a direct result of feminism.

>>3337425

>too stupid to understand families working together at home versus leaving home for the office

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>>3335452
Not even trying

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>>3337467
>Islam, no matter where it is, tolerates no deviation from its line.
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/femail/article-2729055/Lesbian-Muslim-couple-Iran-tie-knot-Stockholm-delighted-imam-gay-too.html

>>3337337
What?

>>3335495
>cooking
>meme activity
You do realise that microwave dinners are a recent developement don't you?
For most of history cooking dealt with raw ingredients, now you have to go to specialty stores to find any slab of mean that isn't pre marinated, chemically tenderised, and usually even has grain filler in it.
t. Celiac who's allergic to most marinates.

>>3335452
It was essential to defeat communism.

A system in which only men produce value will fail if it is pitted against one in which men and women both produce value. They are not as valuable or productive as men on average but they are half the population.

>>3335452
>93 replies and 11 images omitted. Click here to view.

jaysus croist

>>3337484

Literally one out millions. There was a woman imam in Germany and she closed due to death threats. That's like posting those Russians that fought for the nazis or the Japanese nanjing govt.

>>3337528

>our social system is superior
>but only if we mimic our opponents

>capitalism is a million times better than communism
>but we still need to send women out

>>3337545
>provide a real example
>IT DOESN'T COUNT
Ah fuck off Turkshit, ideologies tend to be the same as the people following them.

>>3337437
In pre-industrial age women brought food to the table alongside their husbands. Never it was the case that men did all the work and women just sat around raising kids. On the pre-industrial farm you need all available hands to increase output, why the fuck do you think pisspoor peasants had 5 or 6 kids? more children - more workforce. It was no different in the towns either where women often sold shit on markets or held small shops/inns if they were wealthier. Braudel pittoresquely describes an average Parisian market in 17th century. It's all women behind the stands yelling and arguing aggresively with customers and with each other.

Industrial era only furthered the female employment. Who do you think worked in those early cramped manufactories? Hell they even worked in mines, even children worked in mines until it was banned under pressure of growing worker's movement.

To conclude, never in history were families privileged to be able to support themselves from just a single family member working. Only aristocracy and wealthy people lazed out. But for the majority of people? Endless struggle for more jobs and more money.

Guess what, your 1950s wetdream is a boomer invention that barely lasted for 10 years and died out with the first major economic hardship. It will never make a return, especially not with neoliberalism doing a rampage across the planet.

>>3337557
I don't think you understand anon. A slave is technically working, but he's not an employee. So yes, he's correct that women entered the labor force, which only counts employees and not slaves or serfs.

>Guess what, your 1950s wetdream
Where did you get the idea that 1950s America is my wet dream?

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>>3337563
>one anecdote disprove a tendancy
I want brainlets to leave

>>3337549
To survive requires will.

If a matched opponent is willing to sacrifice more than you, you will lose.

>>3337581
As long as it's just Arabs following islam it will be conservative. If cucked Euros adopt it, it will become cucked too. They will ignore the conservative scriptures just like they ignored the conservative passages in the Bible. Not that hard to figure this out.

>>3337572
Were people not employed in 18th and 19th century manufactories, factories, and mines? Were people not employed by whoever could offer them work and money in exchange?
>Where did you get the idea that 1950s America is my wet dream
Because you poltards always idolyze 1950s and always post the same 1950s stove advertisements with women happily cooking, thinking it was the norm and that it's some idyllic utopia.

>>3335613
t. bitter woman that is insecure about her rapid aging

>>3337604
I'm not a /pol/ack and I think America was a total shithole at every period of their history. You're literally building some ridiculous strawman off of me correcting you about the difference between working and employment. Then agian you were probably schooled in America which explains why your level of arguing is so boorish and downright primitive.

>>3337616
You sound like a lefty /pol/ack.

>>3337621
You sound like an American faggot.

>>3337616
Nope, you're the one making strawmans. For one you're doing an equalization of pre-industrial farmers and burghers with slaves. Not even serfs depending on a lord were equal to slaves.

Keeping believing women entered workforce "en masse" in 20th century though. Must be some jewish conspiracy :^)

>>3335769
You didn't understand his post.

>>3337626
Nope, but if you think America has been shithole through it's entire history you are an idiot who's only frame of reference could be the socialist utopia you imagine should have existed.

>>3337633
Where are you getting this /pol/ and 1950s and jew shit from? Are you confusing me with somebody else or are you genuinely retarded?

>>3337642
>world didn't exist before 1776
Yeah we all know Jesus was riding a triceratops before tAmerica came into existence.

>>3337645
>Where are you getting this /pol/ and 1950s and jew shit from
From this very same thread.

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>>3337598
>implying both races are not going to merge

>>3337650
Point out where I said anything resembling that.

>>3335460
>What probably happened is they got convinced that being financially independent is more fulfilling than depending financially on one particular male.
This.
And given how much bullshit they had to deal with before, with way more violent drunkards for husbands than before, they jumped at it.
But also this

>>3335495
>>3335524
>>3335526
>>3335546
Women have always worked a lot.
My grandmothers are peasants, and they worked their ass off in the field.
But turning the market into a free-for-all has decreased some wages.
Ironically, it isn't that bad, since for all the feminist bullshit, the vast majority of women still go in the same domains they've biologically been doing for the past thousand years.
>educating kids-teacher;
>financial management-accounting and shit;
>healing-nurse;
>taking care of people and elderly;
>organizing stuff for men-secretary;
>>3337467
>Islam, no matter where it is, tolerates no deviation from its line.
Yeah, no.
Persians were butthurt about woman imams and other stuff 600 years ago(also string instruments with raunchy lyrics).
And boy-fucking and homosex is a time-honored tradition in the Middle East.

>>3337652
Not you maybe, but this thread is a school example of muh womyn, muh tradishun, muh jews.

>>3337653
A few backward tribes practice pederasty, that's still less than 1% of the islamic world. I would not call that a tradition of the middle east.

>>3337658
>you
>but not you actually
Fuck off then. I'm completely impartial to the topic of women working. Instead of saying "Yes my European master, thanks for correcting my mistake, excuse my hideously unattractive and stupid American self for ever making it", you decided to completely sperg out.

>>3337662
Oh, please.
Turks were legendary for that stuff, and also dipped into booze from time to time.

And the current leader of Oman being a faggot and a massive pedo, to the extent that no one dares leave their kids alone with him, is an open secret.

>>3337666
First of all, i'm not American. Second, you seem to believe employment of women didn't exist before modern times and this is why i corrected you. Then you proceeded to call pre-industrial workers slaves, again showing your lack of knowledge.

>>3337180
Pre-Christian European spirituality is the way for the European future. Christianity, islam, and Judaism are spiritual deserts and need to go back there. Yes, varg is right.

>>3337361
Only because men have been convinced by (((them))) to allow it.

>>3337702
That's a given, but Jews are the instrument of the female, they are their golems. In fact you could say they were the patient zero of the female disease, when they became rootless mongrel shits who had to change patrilineal lineages to matrilineal (literally pushing father as the head of the family aside). It's no wonder it's mostly kikes who push for feminism and assorted lunacies.

>>3335452
Look do you want your wife to fuck the tv repair man and milk man at the same time?

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>>3335569
Right I give you a day before you crack.

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>>3337688
>meme religions with abysmal participation rates, fractured into a billion groups, filled with new-age faggots and we wuzzing nazis are the future of Europe;

If you had some sort of unified Theodism with lots of followers, maybe we'd talk, but discount Hindu deities you scraped off descriptions made by monks centuries after the whole thing went extinct have about as much a future as eastern gothic.

>>3337676
>Turks were legendary for that stuff, and also dipped into booze from time to time.

And how was that any different than the shenanigans Europeans got to? I'm forgetting the name of the Pope who had naked boys painted gold to decorate his parties.

>>3335452
Be a stay at home dad then bro. OH WAIT.

>>3335518
>90% of married white women did not work for any kind of pay in the 1890 census
gonna need a source on that one

>>3335547
The position is that this feeling has been contrived for women for some reason. I'm not certain whether it is or isn't, but I am certain that it is the only question worth talking about in this thread. Because it's a difficult question, and you really can't start talking about the historical reasons for the transition without agreeing that keeping a home and raising a family is or isn't actually equally as fulfilling as a career.

>>3335452
>work as shit, doesn't get paid, barely owns her shit
>work as shit, gets paid, owns shit
gee what a headcracker OP

>>3335452
I still don't see how these two conflict each other.
In any case if you want some dumb cunt that doesn't have any aspirations, doesn't bring any money to the household, is not involved in any meaningful conversations and just freeloads off your hard earned shit, then you are free to look for one, I'm sure there would be many that would like to do so.

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>>3335452
Bourgeoisie trying to ensure that it paid the family unit less overall while getting double the amount of work.
>Tfw leftists are too stupid to realize this

>>3339456
>I still don't see how these two conflict each other.

You don't see how perusing a career conflicts with raising a family?

I hope you are pretty.

>>3339469
One does interfere with the other, due to time allocation and depending on the priority hierarchy, but I disagree with the sentiment of them existing in competition.

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>>3335452
this is a goodie text on it

>>3339494
If you pursue one properly then you cannot have the other. What more than that do they need to be "in conflict"?

Cost of living rose but wages didn't increase proportionally by the same amount. A basic factory worker in the 50s was making the equivalent of $50/hr by today's standards.

>>3335566
>William

You know his actual name is Larry, right? That's Where ShindoL comes from, Lawrence Shindo.

>>3337324
It is. Like any other market, the more you flood it, the cheaper the product (labor) becomes due to abundance.

capitalist society

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>>3335452

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is it okay for women to giggle at sex?

>>3335590
>I need a woman who knows what she wants in bed cause I dnt
>I want a strong independent woman cause I'm a weak ass cuck
>I attract women looking for a submsissive man
>I let my wife fuck black men in front of me (not that I have any choice in the matter)
Ahahahaha, get cancer you cuck.

>>3335613
Where have you heard a 13 year old complaining about career oriented women?

>>3337240
"Ya" sound like a fat hamplanet trying to imitate a dude bro.

Kill yourself.

>>3341225
a fascinating example of /pol/tard insecurity

Feminism is actually designed to humiliate women because it says that womanly traits are inferior to manly traits, and that women have to adopt manly traits or else they are inferior.

>>3341537
>insecurity
hi rebbit

one paycheck families are a bad deal for:
>the state b/c one taxpayer,
>the corporations because it drives wages up, shrinking both the labor pool , consumer base, and the cost of living. Supply and Demand 101

>>3335452
Our capitalist culture sees a strong career as the pinacle of achievement and even the defining trait of a person (if someone is asked 'what do you do?' 9 times out of 10 they answer with their job).
This means that feminism, which was mostly coopted by capitalism during the first wave (notice how all the celebrated suffragettes were reactionaries who sided with the state on WWI and conscription, while good feminists like Emma Goldman were swept under the rug), would assume that women would be liberated through working.
Still, it had some benefits. Offering women an easier escape from dependency on an abusive spouse is always a good thing.

>>3343010
women have the daddy welfare state, which they self-servingly voted in after suffrage, they want an institutional harem with a boyfriend career as well?

>>3335452
Americans are stupid and brainwashed so they will do anything that tv tolds them to do