Childhood is idolizing Catholic larpers. Adulthood is realizing

>>3018674
Wokehood: realizing that Calvinism is at once the best Protestant interpretation of the Christian cannon and a terrifying clusterfuck of moral luck.

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>>3018674
>makes More sense

Sure kid

>>3018787
Ascendence: Realizing that Mormonism is the truest Christianity

>>3018802
Really?

Granted, I have to give them props for the relatively modern invention of signed witnesses, but their false history is laughably bad. It's not convincing in the least bit if you've bothered to read it through. Also, you should consider the blatant plagiarism of the main Judeo Christian cannon. It would be fine if the text merely quoted Paul and Co, but the ridiculous attributions to fake ancient historical figures makes it.

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>>3018787

>calvinism
>mfw

>>3018793
simple, the ones he took out were fallible, the rest are infallible

>>3018674
maturity is realizing the futility of organized religion

you don't need an intermediary to know god

>>3018802
Mormonism has nothing to do with Christianity other than the figure of Jesus existing. It's literally just American version of Islam.

>>3018818
Not saying I'm a fan, but it does bite the bullet of several pertinent moral questions.

Predilection towards atheism is a heritable trait with the stats corrected for home environment. Does this mean that some people have minds and/or meatsuits inherently less suited to know God? Yes. Yes, it does.

A great many people, even in this modern era, will go their whole lives without having any meaningful contact with the specific religion you like. A great and significant proportion of this group will get nothing in particular out of any "gospel revealed by nature" apologists will rail on about. Because that's a weirdly specific conclusion for something as ugly as nature. Does this mean that being born in the wrong place in time means that you're morally culpable? If not, what the fuck is happening. Calvinists say yes!

>>3018936
Why does Calvinism make so much sense?
Is it because John was a lawyer?

>>3019404
That probably helped. Calvinism has a cold, systematic way of uncomfortably logical thought. If something terrifying is found in pre-existing doctrine, John shrugs into the abyss and bites enough bullets to make a damn salad.

Not a Calvinist at all, but I have to admire their crazy.

>be Czech
>try to reform church 100 years before Luther
>instead of joining you, Germans send multiple crusades against you
>feelsbadman.jpg

>>3018793
Dirty papist, send more gold to Rome, Christ wills it, I know because my local frier told me

>>3018787
>and a terrifying clusterfuck of moral luck.

Please elaborate.

>>3018818
Arminius was a nice guy, I'm sure. He did what any good Christian in their heart wants to do, protect their Lord from slanderous charges. That in itself is a noble thing. But he deviated from Scripture to do so. He basically invented a nice-guy God and ignored the intent and effects of the atonement completely. His followers were even worse.

>>3018842
>organized religion
>intermediary
>Protestantism

I don't think you know what you're talking about. God-ordained means of communing with God are not an intermediary. We have no pope or earthly vicar of Christ. But if God has ordained the means by which we learn of him and know his will, then we as worshippers are bound to his prescribed will.

>>3018842
Catholics:
>I have an issue that isn't of the most paramount importance, so I will ask the representative at the store who deals specifically with that issue for assistance, since they were granted a small amount of authority in that subject by the one in charge
Protestants:
>REEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE I WANT TO SPEAK TO THE MANAGER, EVERYONE ELSE GET OUT

>>3018674

Sorry, but religion is about larping.

>>3019404
>>3019432
Medieval Catholics had been too afraid to think through certain sections of Scripture and to connect dots back to the Old Testament. Not since Augustine had any Western thinker actually attempted to do so. Luther started to, but shirked back when he felt the message of Scripture began to besmirch what he felt to be God's reputation as a loving father. Calvin instead dove headlong into it and accepted God as both all-loving and all-powerful.

>>3019820
I posted about the moral issues presented by Christian cannon and how they're covered in Calvinism here >>3019368 and here >>3018936.

It's an interesting mess I can both respect and hate.

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>>3018936
>Does this mean that being born in the wrong place in time means that you're morally culpable?

Even the elect are morally culpable; no one deserves salvation. God chose the elect by His divine wisdom and not because they did anything to earn it.

>>3019831
All-loving? Truly?

Let's not get all warm-and-fuzzy here. We like John because he tells it like it is. Jehova only has hugs for the Elect, metaphorically speaking.

>>3018674
>>3018787

Revelation is realizing people read the Gospels through the lens of Paul instead of taking Jesus's words as the bedrock and reading Paul in light of them.

Jesus's teaching on the importance of Jewish tradition, and veneration of the OT and Jewish practice leads one to the true path: Massionic Judaism.

>the luckily already circumcised

>>3020625
Yes truly because God gives common grace to all His creations including the disobedient ones. Just as the Sun's warmth does not discriminate between men, God's love is all encompassing and allows even the unrepentant to experience good things in this life.

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>>3020635
t. judaizer

Protestantism is the result of the turning of the Kali Yuga. People no longer needed strict guidance or a priest to communicate with God. God was better understood and communicated with through personal means in the Dwapara Yuga.

>>3020623
I understand the emotional attachment you have to your doctrine, but are you willing to break this down with me?

For starters, you're honestly applying moral agency to God here. In this scenario, he chooses the elect. The elect do not choose themselves. The elect have the same basic abilities provided to the larger section of humanity that exists largely to be damned later. Any blink's worth of actions they preform on earth are made irrelevant by a LITERAL ETERNITY OF HELLFIRE. Anything they did will frankly pale in comparison and become pointless when scaled next to their professional ability to emulate charcoal.

But don't they deserve their charcoal-dom? For distance's sake in this issue, let's do one of my favorite things: use irreverent /lit/ metaphors.

Congratulations! You're Bucky Barnes. Awesome, kick-ass war hero by day, general stand-up guy even when you're not clocked in. Unfortunately, due to a rather long fall, a coma, and technology genuinely out of your control, you... don't really know that anymore.

Kinda sucks to be you.

Now, in real life, the Geneva convention would have Opinions about how you reached your current state of being. Certainly, any court provided the evidence of your escapades as an RC car of death wouldn't find you mentally stable enough to convict. It's not like you had any say in the matter, or any opportunity to do otherwise. Hell, even if you were set free, you'd have no idea how to even start being a normal person.

The fact that a series of cruel events instead of actual help followed this unfortunate character fueled a lot of sympathetic narrative conflict that made Stan Lee much money.

So.

Why in the ever living fuck would you expect a person divorced from the presence of what you have decided is the sole acceptable purveyor of moral system to be responsible for the inevitable shit they will pull? The system was rigged. If they can be righteous, you're wrong about everything. So why punish eternal?

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>>3020692
God's ways are not our ways (Isaiah 55:8-9).

God determines what is moral and people only delude themselves by thinking they are capable of judging the Almighty.

Many perish from intellectual arrogance.

>>3020732
Yes, sweetie, that was the point. People are inherently unable to reason in ways that will resemble your god's reasoning, so punishing them with eternal hell for not knowing the game's ineffable rules is dreadful.

Let's not fight, though! I like Calvinism the best because it acknowledges that there is no such thing as a Buddy Jesus god due to this fact. Embrace it.

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>>3020806
The Jews know the rules better than anyone and that does not save them. Only Jesus saves and His friends take Him at his word.

>>3018674
enlightenment is realizing all religion is simply a means of control and your better off living life on your own terms.

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>>3020872
i wonder who could be behind this post?

>>3020850
Are you still Calvinist anon? If so, I think you're breaking my streak of meeting smart Calvinists.

>>3020878
I am a Christian anon.

>>3020918
No, I meant, are you the person I have been talking to? Your lack of understanding is excused if you are new to the thread. If you're the same person, even your god can't help you navigate your way out of a paper bag.

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>>3020986
Yes I am the same person you've been talking to but please spare me your petty insults.

Eͬͯ̍̃̊ͣ̊ǹ̢̀l̸ͣ͊͒ͬ͐͑̋̊͟i͋ͧͤ͌̾̓̏gͭ̒̄̋͊͒͘h̑͛͛̀ͣ͐̿t͛ͯ̀ͨ͛ͯ̐ͭe̡̊̈ͭ̋̾̚͟n̵̛ͭ̋ͣmͩ͡e̷͐̀͡n͋̏̃̈͂tͬ͌ͧ̌̀ͩ̐͘ ̢̌́̄ͭ͐̊͝͝i̵̴̧ͦͤs̔̓̐ ̸̷͐̾͌ŗ͋͒̋e̸̊̾͟͝á̢̒͌̓̚̕l̸̵ͫ̔̓̊̐͛͡i̸̧̧͂̽̾̎̈ͣ̀ͣz̨̧ͫ̉ͨ̕į̌̒̇̓̐ͮ̉͜nͮ̔ǧ̆ͧ ͛̄́͝t̐̎̽h̶ͫ͆͒̄͠ä̡́͊̕͞t͗̐̊͊̆ ̛̈́͑̉T́͌ͮ̒͢͜͝h̸̓͂ę̸̐͌̾͂̚l͋̌̂̒ͯ͆͑͜e̽̀͝m̶ͩ͌ͦ̍̍̇͛ͤ̀a̸̋̾̿̓̇̇ͣ͢ ͯͨ̀i̸͊̆̉̂ͩ͠s̨͗̊ͫ͢ ͨ̈́͢͞t͗̈̈͑͑ͩh̸̷̍̑̄͑ͩ͐è̡̔͋̽ͯ̍̽̽ ̡ͩͦͩm̶̑̈̓̐ơ̴̛̈́ͩ͆̽̓ͮͪ̀ṡ̌̓͢͢t̑ͣ͂ͧ̊̔͑͞ ͋ͣ̾ͦ̉t̵̡͗̐̾̂̍̂rͭ̌͞u͆̇ͭ̎̿̾͑̿͠ë̶̊

Why it that in Europe, Christianity seems to be declining much more in Protestant countries than in Catholic and Orthodox countries?

>>3020625
>1 Timothy 2:4
>John 3:16

God restrains evil in the world. He gives gifts. He gives common grace to all. Just because all men are not elect, does not mean that God does not show His love for them in other, non-salvific ways. The very fact that God restrains His anger towards sinners is evidence of His love and patience.

>>3020635
Jesus made it crystal clear that the Jews were the most wretched of sinners because they rejected the light of God's revelation EVEN WITH the gift of the Law and the Prophets. GTFO Judaizer.

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>>3020876

>>3021058
Your key words here are "non-salvific". While I'm sure that it's nice to credit anything not horrible as god's providence, there still exists the "creating sapient beings to burn them forever" problem. This is, by proportion, the most significant issue. Because literally forever. All transient mortal actions exist within a limited frame of time, you know? At some point, you can claim that the meaningful ramifications of an act have finished happening. Unfortunately, you think it is normal to pair eternal burning with limited offenses. Most people have something more nuanced than a binary for that sort of thing.

I know, I know, it's such a strict binary because your god is so pure. ...This loops back to the problem of evil, though.

>>3018674
Adulthood is not believing in god or santa

>>3021194
>there still exists the "creating sapient beings to burn them forever" problem
>limited offenses

You say it is a "problem". Creation and all created things are God's to do with as He pleases. The fact that He redeems any at all is evidence of his surpassing love. No sinner is worthy of God's grace, yet sinful man argues that unless God saves all, he is being unfair. You even try to absolve man of his offense by calling them "limited". Any offense against a all-powerful creator is rebellion.

>Hath not the potter power over the clay?

This is not a new argument. It's a very, very old one that Scripture answers.

>>3018793
Every time

>>3018838
And Who decides which book are infallible?