i'm curious about the use of grenadiers in 18th and 19th

>>2970018
Initially grenadiers did actually throw grenades, and they chose big guys (4 u) for the job.

When that proved to be dangerous in a field battle (i.e. your grenadier boy gets shot while throwing a grenade, blowing yourselves up), grenadiers became the crack assault force tasked with breaking niggas' formations up using aggressive tactics. They were also people you would not like to engage in melee with since they train to be better than it than everyone else in the infantry.

>>2970484
How heavy were those grenades estimated to be? I imagine that if they had to hand pick the guys who would throw them they must've been heafty.

>>2970526
Its not because they're heavy, it's just that they want big guys to throw them far.

File: Early-grenade.jpg (143KB, 600x613px) Image search: [Google]

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>>2970526
It's hard to tell exactly how heavy they were but the grandes were usually the size of a baseball ball.
Pic related is what they looked like.

File: Grenadier of the Preobrazhensky Regiment in 1712, End 1830s. Found in the collection of the A. Suvorov State Memorial Museum, St. Petersburg..jpg (649KB, 773x1024px) Image search: [Google]

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I think they were initially specialists integrated into the ranks of Muskeeters. Full units of Grenadiers appeared once their Elite status was made obvious.

The maximum throwing range for a modern grenade is stated to be 40 meters, I suppose it was the same.

I'm more curious about their use outside of open fields, such as Sieges and Naval actions. Surely, they must have been more effective in these settings.

File: YOU WANT MILLION TAELS- HERE BOMB, FUCK YOU-27.jpg (553KB, 1200x1614px) Image search: [Google]

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>>2972802
>I'm more curious about their use outside of open fields, such as Sieges and Naval actions. Surely, they must have been more effective in these settings.
They were predominantly used in sieges and naval battles actually. One thrown in breaches, up ramparts, or as an opener for boarders had tremendous effect in such close quarters.

Hell, you had the same development in medieval China: the grenadier soldiers were also not trusted to be safe, so they used them in places such as sieges and naval battles, with the most common bomb being the sling-launched clay-cased/paper-cased grenade.

>>2972802
>>2972811
Oh and might I add: sappers and engineer troops tend to use them in sieges more than grenadiers themselves.

>>2970018
When I was reading about Ney's repeated ineffective charges at Waterloo to Wellington's center, a question of (other than why didn't he spike the guns) would a group of mounted grenadiers be effective in order to form gaps to exploit in the ranks? Seems like it may be easier from horseback to carry larger explosives for breaching lines.

Have there been cases of horse grenadiers in line warfare? One problem I could see that grenadiers were formed from the strongest enlisted men, and cavalry was a gentleman's corps. Also, I'm not so sure they would want to be riding with or alongside a mounted powder keg.

>>2974748

Well like you said yourself, that would be a fairly dangerous tactic for the explosives alone, also big guys carrying big explosives (and I assume also muskets) would need big horses, making them both expensive to train and equip, and a prime target on the battlefield. I can easily imagine such an unit being created, and then transforming into a regular heavy cavalry unit in a few years or so.

As a side note, Horse Grenadiers of the Imperial Guard (Grenadiers à Cheval de la Garde Impériale) actually existed and they were one of Napoleon's elite heavy cavalry units, but they were called "grenadiers" because of some regulation that was in place when the unit was first established, not because they were actual grenadiers on horseback.

>>2970018
Grenadiers throwing grenades on the battlefield were phased out before the end of the 18th century in a standardized sense, but there are accounts of grenades being used from fortifications in the Napoleonic wars. In the US Civil War they also had grenades and they were detonated with percussion caps called Ketchum Grenades

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>>2974748
>grenadier cavalry goes for a bombing run on a trench
>grenadier lights up a grenade
>his horse falls with him spilling grenades all over
>grenadier frantically looks for the lit grenade before all hell breaks loose
>allied soldier sitting at the back see a small nuke go off in the distance

Would make for some great historical action movie scenes.

File: grenado.jpg (28KB, 400x300px) Image search: [Google]

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>>2970018
In the 18thC they were heavy shock troops. Over 6 foot tall, with a bear skin hat and a bag of grenades, they typically never bothered to load their muskets or remove their bayonets in battle. Their job was to be a hammer: Hurling grenades into the enemy before charging in with bayonet and sword.

>>2970526
>>2972579
>>2972590
No need to estimate. The extant ones we have at Colonial Williamsburg are about 9-10 oz, and about 3 inches in diameter. Modern repros tend to be too big, too thick, and sand is heavier than black powder.

>>2972802
>>2972811
>>2972821
Its actually rather amusing that flatly speaking, it would come to a point in the 18thC where non grenadiers would be more likely to use grenades than grenadiers.