If there is a God, then what created God? Religious people always

>>2899006
The typical response is that God has always existed, he was never created.

heres my question
So when the "rapture" happens the world as we know it will end and all will be judged for their sins, and evil will be defeated etc

What was the point of this middle period? Why bother having thousands of years of human sin and evil if the whole thing ends with our world no longer existing? I'm probably not coming off as intelligent, but does anyone know what I'm trying to say here?

>>2899613
>looking for coherency in an incomplete system like Protestantism
Find a more sound metaphysical doctrine like Gnosticism then we'll talk.

God is infinite and by his nature incomprehensible to us.

>>2899666
Nice try Satan

>>2899006
God has revealed Himself to humanity as "I Am That I Am", or more properly in the future tense "I Will Be What I Will Be".

He is an eternal spirit being without beginning or end.

He is eternal. He has always existed, and will always exist.

Nothing and nobody created Him, because He is not a created being.

He Himself created everything that was created.

>>2899019

This is an impossible answer, since if God existed for an infinite period before creating the Universe, then he can't have created the Universe because an infinite time never ends.

>hwel then who creaetd the iuniverse huh?
>It was always there
>tAht's impossibl haha. Someone, hadto create it, hense god.
>Well who created god then?
>uH noone lol, he was alway s there hah.

>>2899613
Not quite. When the Rapture happens, the Restrainer (Holy Spirit) will take those of us who are saved to heaven.

On earth, all hell will break loose. There will be 7 years of what is called the Troubles of Jacob, or the Tribulation, ending in the Wrath of God being poured out onto the earth.

The reason there is a gap between Pentecost 32 AD and the Rapture in the very near future was to gather many, many people to be brothers and sisters to Christ Jesus.

The place we will be inhabiting, that you have heard snippets of, with its streets of gold and gates of pearl, is 2/3 the size of the moon. It is a satellite city that is too big to be on the earth. Instead, it will orbit the earth, and the light of God will illuminate the earth through this pyramidal city (the sun will already have gone dark by this time).

After that 7 year period is over, and the battle at Meggido is over, there will be a renewed/refreshed/new heaven and a new earth. The earth will be like the Garden of Eden was. The devil and his demons will be restrained. Jesus will rule over this earth for a thousand years.

After that thousand years is over, then the devil is let loose, the last battle Gog of Magog will ever know is fought, Jesus wins, and then the Great White Throne judgment happens. Everyone will be raised to stand before God and asked a simple question.

"Is your name in the Lamb's Book of Life?"

If the answer is "no", you will have your opportunity to prove that you are as God is, fail, and be cast into the lake of fire.

If the answer is "yes", you will find yourself a place on the new earth, and go with God back into eternity.

tl;dr the Father wanted Jesus to have hundreds of millions of siblings, not just a few thousand.

>>2899006
Nothing can't come from nothing in our reality; God is thought to be beyond our reality, inherently.

That difference, his being existing in a plane/state that is unbound by reason itself is why he would be considered god.

This sounds circular, but I'll frame it like this: imagine reason or existence as a system. Saying there is only the system (atheism) fails to be sufficient as in the system because "nothing can't come from nothing". Logically, nonexistence cannot birth existence (the system), since every event has a trigger, previous events.

However, saying that the system must be created by something beyond the system, is merely claiming human reason is insufficient. I would further state that inferring this thing "beyond the system" is anything other than a monotheistic god would be creating another system but I digress.

My apologies if this is unhelpful.

>>2899712
There is no time in eternity when only God exists; time is a measure of decay, and God does not decay. Time keeps everything from happening at once, and God has no problem with everything happening at once. He knows the end from the beginning. Time is a measure of change, and God does not change.

>>2899724
the difference between a material universe subject to entropy and a spiritual supernatural being who is not

God is a gestalt

>>2899735
It's a good point. Nothing contains within itself the genesis of its own existence.

>>2899738
If Go cant change then he can't do anything

>>2899742
"material" "spiritual" "supernatural"

>>2899738
man, Christians have perfected the verbose nonanswer haven't they? 2000 years of practice I guess

>>2899752
God can change, when He sets up the conditions for Himself to change.

Stop thinking you know what God can and cannot do. You haven't a clue.

>>2899738

If nothing can change before the Universe then you cant CREATE a Universe. What a typically stupid Christian non-answer.

>>2899762
The truth just keeps on being the truth. Only lies change when they're discovered.

>>2899803
You don't get it.

The universe you live in did not always exist.

It was created ex nihilo.

>>2899801

You literally just said before the Universe there was no change. Which is it? Make your mind up. Either there could be change before the Universe, in which case God can't have created the Universe because there would be an infinite time before he did so, or there wasn't change before the Universe, in which case God can't have created the Universe.

>>2899808

By?

>>2899811
More exists than this universe. The third heaven, where God and the angels live, is not a part of this universe. It is the eternal home of God.

Stop thinking you can know what God can and cannot do. You never met Him, and have no idea.

>>2899813
By the God of Abraham, Isaac and Jacob; YHWH. Yeshoshua, aka Yeshua, aka Jesus.

>>2899811
You can't even understand the first verse of the bible, and you're trying to figure out what God can and cannot do.

Here's the first verse.

"In the beginning, God created the heavens and the earth."

Once you understand that verse completely, it will answer your questions.

God pre-exists "the beginning". there was a "beginning" for this universe.

And there will be an end.

>>2899826
>>2899820

YOU'RE the one telling me you know the name of the man who created the Universe, shit-for-brains. I'm just pointing out the impossibility of him having done so, YOU'RE the one making completely unfounded claims of knowledge you can't possibly have.

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>>2899805
but "the truth" has been disputed since the beginning christcuck

Why are Christians so stupid? You speak to Jews and they're wrong but at least they're somewhat smart, every single Christian I've had the misfortune of talking to is a mental pygmy as well as a moral coward and an all round vile sack of shit.

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>>2899729
Doesn't this give a ludicrously unfair advantage to the people born after the Second Coming though?

>Be born in the 2000 years before the Second Coming.
>There are tons of other religious beliefs and reasons to doubt that Jesus was truly the son of God and the messiah.
>Be born after the second coming.
>Live during a millennium of peace and prosperity under the rule of literally Jesus Christ now proven to be the son of God and the messiah.
What makes those people so special that they get to live with no doubt in their hearts? I'm genuinely wondering what the reasoning for this is.

>>2899832
Yes, because He told His prophets, and then His Son. They wrote about it in the bible.

Perhaps you've heard of it.

>>2899837
No it has not. People's opinion about what the truth his is a source of constant disputes, not the actual, objective truth.

>>2899839
Because you're not equipped to understand the things of God, child of satan.

It's just the way things are.

>>2899839

4chan christians are in it for the aesthetics

>>2899856
Yes, but their rewards are similarly limited, as is their role in the Kingdom of God.

And if you noted, there will be an army too big to number after 1000 years of peace on the earth, with God ruling, the devil bound, and everyone's needs met.

Final proof of the broken nature of mankind.

>>2899868
Catholics.

If there's one thing I will choke this forum on, it's that Catholics are not Christians.

Catholics are into aesthetics, as are Orthodox.

Christians know this world to be fuel for the fire.

>>2899864

not an argument

>>2899666

t. Lucifer

>>2899882
Not a valid criticism.

why did the universe come out of nothing?
Why does things exist at all?
Why is existence real, and not an absent of anything at all?

>>2899913
>why did the universe come out of nothing?
God spoke it into existence.

>Why does things exist at all?
Because God spoke them into existence.

>Why is existence real, and not an absent of anything at all?
Because God exists, and is a Creator.

>>2899931
Kind of strange you know the truth about God, but aren't sure He exists.

>>2899911

Still not an argument

>>2899959
Still not a valid criticism.

Maybe you'll note that nobody ever argued with you that 2 + 2 = 4.

Because not everything is an argument.

>>2899867
not an argument

back to watching fox news and LARPing like you can communicate with the divine le 21st century profet

>>2900071
http://www.cs.yale.edu/homes/as2446/224.pdf

now you do it with God

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>>2899006
The demiurge or the one you call "God" was created by the Sophia aspect of Pleroma. Stop worshiping this envious and arrogant serpent.

>>2899746

The universe is beyond our comprehension. You gain nothing from any answers you might get here.

>>2899801
And you do?

>>2899006
Another question: If god is all powerful, then he can do whatever, right?
Can he then make a stone so heavy that not even he himself can lift it?
Can he lift that same stone?

>>2899738
>There is no time in eternity when only God exists; time is a measure of decay, and God does not decay.

One could just say the universe is eternal, or the eternal cause behind the universe isn't personalized and sapient as Christians assume. However, since this argument from both sides assumes causality - a concept with no explanatory or predictive value that always leads to infinite regress.

>>2899006
If there isn't a god, what created the first thing? This isn't a problem for religion specifically.

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> yfw you realise you are god

> yfw you realise you made up all this for teh lulz

>>2899729

So aliens will come and take us?

why did god do it?

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>>2899006
Abrahamic monotheism is evil as it was created by the jews. Praise Jupiter.

>time is a dimension
>god exists outside this dimension

Fedoras are literally too retarded to comprehend the very practice they worship.

>>2905500
How the fuck does he exist outside of this dimension? Can you prove this?
This is the problem I have with religion in general. It's not scientific and therefore not rational to believe in. It's philosophy. You cannot physically prove or disprove the existence of a god.

>>2905510
1000 years ago you couldn't physically prove or disprove the existence of a black hole, and up until a few decades ago you could only theorize about it because math allowed it.

Any scientist worth it's salt knows we humans don't know everything and will probably never know everything because somethings are simply impossible for us to know.

The whole idea that you need proof in order to believe something is to prevent a scenario where anything anyone proposes is seen as valid. Because yes, literally everything is possible, but we don't know what from what is possible is real.

>>2899729

>Be a Roman
>Die in the year 31 AD before the crucifixion
>Damned to hell because they didn't make it a few more days to the atonement

Great theology.

>>2899613
>rapture
You're not gonna get coherent and sound theology from dipshit proddies my dude

>>2899712
Infinity minus infinity does not necessarily equal zero. So your argument is invalid.

>>2905510
Science is based around coherence and reproductibility. Not truth.

You can't actually prove most of modern science, which is why theories, axioms, principles etc exist.

We live in a 3d universe. We wouldn't understand what it would be like to be with god because we will never experience anything more than 3d. A 2d person living in a 2d land wouldnt be able to see a 3d man looking down upon him.

>>2899613
>so when the "rapture" happens the world as we know it will end

Wrong. There will be a 1,000 year period and then the battle of Magedo.

>>2902242
The universe ISN'T eternal though, it has a verifiable beginning and a clearly hypothesized end.

>>2899006
He is the uncaused cause

>>2907260
>verifiable

I'm not expert, but if there's a significant amount of scientists who disagree with something then it surely must be still just a theory.

>>2899666
Literally this tho.
You cant expect to understand God as human, as an ant wont understand an airplane, for example

>>2899006
a man created a god that created a man that created a god that created a man that created a god that created a man that created a god that created a man that created a god that created a man that created a god that created a man that created a god that created a man that created a god that created a man that created a god that created a man that created a god that created a man that created a god that created a man that created a god that created a man that created a god that created a man that created a god that created a man that created a god that created a man that created a god that created a man that created a god that created a man that created a god

>>2899006
humans created god, of course

Physical nature is known to be endlessly mutable. The universe is the cosmic form of the Supreme Lord, and I am that Lord represented as the Supersoul, dwelling in the heart of every embodied being.

Look. Reality isn't supposed to work within our frameworks or justice or logic. God simply doesn't exist. Even if He does He obviously doesn't love me, otherwise I wouldn't have been born as a mentally retarded third worlder in debt and with no family or friends. We humans are born into this world only to suffer and then meaninglessly die. Go ahead and prove me wrong.

Yet in this body there is another, a transcendental enjoyer who is the Lord, the supreme proprietor, who exists as the overseer and permitter, and who is known as the Supersoul.

There is no God. And if there would be one, he must be the asshole of all. And by the way, the bible is a fairytail, they had no tv back then. Life sucks, exept your death, enjoy life as long as u can.

>>2908225
You, i like you.

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God hates u