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So, roughly speaking: Shi'a = Catholic Sunni = Protestant

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So, roughly speaking:

Shi'a = Catholic
Sunni = Protestant
Ibadi = Orthodox

?

Why did Islam fall into schism so early, anyway? There's like a ton of sects and each sect has sects on sects. Did Muslims not have an equivalent to Ecumenical Councils?
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No.
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>>273226
What the fuck are those equivalences even based on.

But well, it fell into schism because Islam was both a religion and a country. A country with an awful (to not say non-existent) succession rules. The schism was politic over who should have been the first caliph, the one supported by the shia was super butthurt because he should've been the first but had to see how three guys ruled before him. His name was Ali Ibadis are from a group that was pro-Ali but became super butthurt when Ali decided to negotiate with his detractors, and killed him. But Ibadis are a moderate current that pretty much did their own thing and the main violent group does not exist anymore.

>Did Muslims not have an equivalent to Ecumenical Councils?

Muslims do not have priests. The mullahs are just "experts". In shia islam there's a hierarchy and in sunni not even that. They're closer to rabbis or even academy doctors than priests in those regards. So they can discuss and shit and there's several schools in sunni islam but no central figure to say what's right and what's wrong.
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>>273233
Why not? Who had authority to interpret the Quran and the Hadith? Anyone? Didn't Mohammed realize that could lead to extreme disparate interpretations?
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>>273256
Hadith didn't exist when Muhammad was alive. Diferent sects have different hadiths, because they're basically stories that about things done or said by Muhammad and the scholars are to decide if they believe it sounds legit or not.
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>>273254
>What the fuck are those equivalences even based on.
Shi'a thinks Mohammed chose a successor, Roman Catholics think Jesus Chose a successor.

Sunnis don't think Mohammed chose a successor and are the source of batshit insane Muslims like Wahabbis

Ibadi is the oldest Muslim sect extent and are extremely rigorous about their religion but are also very much against forcing religion on anyone.
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Shi'a=Catholic
Sunni=Orthodox
Ibadi=Full time Heretic
Quranist=Protestant
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The Shia were those who wanted Ali to be king of Islam. The Sunni wanted Abu (Or more so just opposed Ali). The Ibadi wanted Ali to be king of Islam at first, but then decided that Muslims can decide on their own kings until God chooses a king personally.

That's basically it. There is no schism, it was purely political. Now however there are some differences. Shiites venerate saints while Sunni do not. Shiites believe that female circumcision (The removal of a woman's clitoris and the sewing shut of her vagina) is meritorious while Sunni believe it is necessary for a woman to enter heaven. Ibadi are desert tribals who can't read and have been cutting clits since before Islam was even around (It's a pan Afro-Asiatic practice predating Islam done by the Egyptians, Ethiopians, and Pagan Arabians).

Shia are content to remain in their areas until God declares final judgement while Sunni demand global Jihad. Wahhabism (The majority of Sunni Muslims practice Wahhabism, a loose ideology that can be summed up as "durka durka muhammed jihad" if you want to go turbo pleb) is a strictly Sunni phenomenon.

If you really wanted to compare it to Christianity, Sunni are Catholics, Shiites are Anglicans, and Ibadi are the last remnants of Nestorianism.
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>>273270
Would Mohommed approve of the Hadith, then? Or would he be a Quranist?
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>>273272
Yeah, well, except because like 85% of the muslims are sunni of course.
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>>273277
Fuck me if I know. The first quran we have is from when Muhammad was already dead (though surprizingly way more old than the ones discovered until recently).
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>>273277
>>273288

But well, from the perspective of those who follow the hadiths, of course Muhammad would approve them. They believe they're legit real stories of their prophet acts, just not literal divine revelation like the quran.
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>>273293
How come there was never an Ecumenical Council of leaders tracing back to Mohammed which could decide on a definitive Hadith Canon? Seems it would have made more sense to get representatives from everyone together and vote on it, rather than everyone decide their own canon.
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https://www.yahoo.com/health/surgery-could-give-men-wombs-1302360099545142.html

from a philosophical standpoint, what does this do to gender roles, assuming it's available to anybody?
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>>273226

You're a special kind of retard. Holy fuck.
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>>273305
Islam doesn't have a hierarchy like Christianity does. Everyone (except the Caliph) is on equal footing before Yahweh. Mullahs/Muftis are people who are trained in Islam theology no different than Doctors are trained in medicine. Anyone can be a doctor just as anyone can be a Mufti. It's just that the knowledge of the subject is required to, y'know, not kill people or spew bullshit. Shiites have a ranking system of how smart a Mufti is but it doesn't diverge that much.

Because everyone is equal, no one can definitively say "This is true" without a lengthy debate. And, plus, why would the Muslim aristocrats ever support such an endeavor when a charismatic holy man can declare an individual aristocrat to be EXTRA worthy of being in charge?
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>>273275
>Shiites believe that female circumcision (The removal of a woman's clitoris and the sewing shut of her vagina) is meritorious while Sunni believe it is necessary for a woman to enter heaven.
Holy shit, what?
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hey OP, i found this hadith, it does not need any explanation. The people of the book have divided into 72 sect, and this nation will divide into 73, 72 are in hell, one in heaven and the surviving one is the jama'ah(people of the sunnah and jama'ah)
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>>273511
It's more nuanced than that

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Religious_views_on_female_genital_mutilation
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>>273272
>oldest Muslim sect
>>273275
>Abu
>king of Islam
>Shiites believe female circumcision is meritorious
>Sunni believe it is necessary for a woman to enter heaven
Goddamn this thread is a mess
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>>273272
dumb ass who does not know anything, mohammad chose abu bakr alsidiq, that's what sunnis believe. ibadis are not the oldest, they're the khawarij that rebelled against ali. shia believe ali is god like and gabriel mistook mohammed for ali, that is what shia believe.
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>>273275
Female circumcision is expressly prohibited in Ibadi Islam

The rest you're mostly right on, but some Sunni sects consider female circumcision to just be advisable.
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>>273270
you know hadith literally translates to speech, or spoken or talk ? if i say hadith'hom, i'm saying their talk, if i say hadith'i, im saying my talk, if i say hadith'na, im saying our talk. e.g: hadith'na ams=our talk yesterday
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>>273641
>It is on this day that Muslim boys should be circumcised. In Oman it is required that circumcision take place in a hospital. Female circumcision is prohibited by law.

http://www.mara.om/religion-in-oman/modern-day-in-oman/birth-rites-and-rituals/
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>>273658
Outside of Africans and some Arabians, its almost non existant
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>>273273
>Shi'a=Catholic
>Sunni=Orthodox
>Ibadi=Full time Heretic
>Quranist=Protestant


sufi=based
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>>274946
sufi is actually bunch of people with their own methods of spirituality.
the real one didn't even talk about politics
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>>273254
muslim here,but maybe different with standard muslim.
I reject islam as a state.
muhammad building semi state entity actually only to keep his faction survive,or to achieve peace in his region by uniting arab tribe.
it is plain realism.
meanwhile The essence of islam is not that form of realism.

why it seems there is non existent succession rules.because in the end the rules could be taken from another method of thinking or ideology.from this point democracy could be counted as a way.
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>>276547
but the problem is the holder of status quo most of time just take a shortcut.
by blocking all way of improvisation,and hogging quran and hadith to keep their power
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>>273226
Great bait mate
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>>273275
WTF???? I had no idea about this female circumcision shit. Seriously fuck that.
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>>273226
Because Islam doesn't have a church per se. It has clergy and followers but no organized church body.

Islam on the whole just is analogous to protestantism, with Apostolic brands of Christianity being very alien to Islam. And much like Islam protestantism exploded into a multitude of sects very shortly as well with the lack of any proper church hierarchy.
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>>273272
>Shi'a thinks Mohammed chose a successor, Roman Catholics think Jesus Chose a successor.
So what about the fact that 'Ali actually became caliph? what about Hossein and Karbala, one of the main things that define shi'ism today? What about the following of the Emams (most Shi'as follow to the eleventh, as the twelfth is in occultation, awaiting the time to return).
Shi'a has nothing to do with catholicism, and this divide can only lead to confusion.

Sunni:
Aren't ''hurr Qur'an everything'', they also heavily rely on the ''church fathers'', such as the Rashidun, Hadith collectors (Muslim and Bukhari being prominent ones), and the Ulema/fiqh jurists of the medieval era.
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>>273275
>Shiites venerate saints while Sunni do not. Shiites believe that female circumcision (The removal of a woman's clitoris and the sewing shut of her vagina) is meritorious while Sunni believe it is necessary for a woman to enter heaven. Ibadi are desert tribals who can't read and have been cutting clits since before Islam was even around (It's a pan Afro-Asiatic practice predating Islam done by the Egyptians, Ethiopians, and Pagan Arabians).
>Shia are content to remain in their areas until God declares final judgement while Sunni demand global Jihad. Wahhabism (The majority of Sunni Muslims practice Wahhabism, a loose ideology that can be summed up as "durka durka muhammed jihad" if you want to go turbo pleb) is a strictly Sunni phenomenon.

Have we moved from crusaderposting to shiiteposting?
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Christians in the Middle Ages who believed Islam to be nothing more than a heretical plagiarism of their own faith, and Muhammad a giant, jewel-encrusted idol

during the 8th century, Muslims began to conceive of the world as divided between the House of Islam and a Christian 'House of War', sinister in its disbelief, obdurate in its defiance of the message of the Holy Koran. Sayings became attributed to Muhammad which cast warfare in the cause of the Muslim God as a duty of the Faithful, such as: "I was ordered to fight all men until they say, There is no god but Allah."

In 997, in demonstration of this, a Muslim army sacked Santiago de Compostela, Spain's holiest Christian shrine.

Bells from the despoiled cathedral were suspended from the Great Mosque of Cordoba in the south, to serve the faithful as lamps, and prisoners of war set to labouring on a great extension to the mosque.

Others were publicly decapitated, and their severed heads paraded through the market place, before being hung from the main gates of the citadel.
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>>273226
>So, roughly speaking:

No. They are not equivalents at all and trying to find analogues is just completely wrong and warping the issue which in its own right is its own phenomena.

>Why did Islam fall into schism so early, anyway?

Because, like Alexander the Great, there was no clear successor. Not least one that everyone could agree on.
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>>273277
>Would Mohommed approve of the Hadith, then?

If I recall correctly, he said that the ultimate source of authority rests with the Qu'ran over what he said/did. In fact, didn't he authorize his companions to scrap and burn some collections of sayings/deeds he did? (This was a hadith as well)
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>>273275
>Shiites believe that female circumcision (The removal of a woman's clitoris and the sewing shut of her vagina) is meritorious while Sunni believe it is necessary for a woman to enter heaven.

Well, this is wrong for a start. The practice is outlawed in a great many muslim countries and the practice predates Islam. There is no mention of it in the Qu'ran or Hadiths. If anything this is a cultural practice that got syncretised into muslim countries not the erroneous belief that it is a requirement in Islam. The different schools of Islamic jurisprudence are literally outdated in their views as many modern scholars, imams, and muftis reject FGM.
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>>273226
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does Wahhabism = Mormonism
?
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>>276935
So the opposite of original sin then?
Literally religion for babies.
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>>276949
you are stupid, no ?
mormons say that fuckwad smith is a prophet.
wahhabi are basically students of mohammad bin abdelwahhab(wahhab=the giver,gifter, one of god's 99 names), never claimed to be a prophet, would actually kill you if you assume there's a prophet after muhammad THE prophet. what he did is clarify to everybody in the arabian peninsula when a muslim exits islam, there are 10 acts that drive a person outside of islam.
1: To make partners with god in any way
2: who makes between him and god a medium, such as a saint or a sheikh or a god fearing person(e.g. god i ask you for the love of your prophets) there is no lobbying with god.
3: who doesn't believe that polytheists are infidels or doubts their infidelity or who corrects their creed.
4:believing that there's a person who has better teachings or methods than that of the prophet.
5:who hates or rejects or denounces something the prophet said or did.
6: who ridicules anything related to the religion(scorning and mocking).
7: the act of majik(all majik)
8: aiding the non-muslims in their fight against any muslim.
9: who thinks that some people are able and allowed to be above sharia, just like khidr and moses.
10: rejecting the religion of god, by refusing to learn it or and refuses to work with it.
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>>273226
No Christian woman ever has to be forced to wear a veil.

All Muslim women have to be wearing veils. Some veils are more restrictive and unhuman looking than others.
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The problem is the ratios are all way off
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