How comes everyone imagines the late medieval as feudal society

>>2621796
>How comes everyone imagines the late medieval as feudal society and forgets about the Republics and City states of Europe?
Doesn't fit the anti-Western "le Dark Ages" meme.

>>2621796
Would city states be really different for the common man?

>>2621802
More likely people are just to stupid to point out Milan or Nuremberg on a map.

>>2621820
Yes, you had a lot of personal and political rights that was not available to common people in feudal societies.
you could vote, be voted into office, serve in the militia, and proudly bear arms. Also, personal freedom and economical freedom, like working a trade and so on.

>>2621802
Sadly this. Even Monty Pythons Holy Grail (A largely anti-medieval film that's played for laughs) references one of the many diverse forms of governance in medieval Europe.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=t2c-X8HiBng

The problem is that we have several groups of people to varying degrees all vested in making the Middle Ages seem like a dark age. Neopagans who hate Christendom, Jews who hate the supposed anti-semitism of the era, Muslims who try to tout their supposed superiority during this time, feminist who hate a society with gender roles, Atheist who are against a religious society, Liberals who hate traditionalism, a collection of homosexuals and other deviants who are opposed to Christian morality. I could go on and on.

>>2621802
>>2621864
/pol/ please fuck off, you wouldn't know the last thing about late medival history or city states. You contribute jackshit to this thread safe for spouting the list of your political bogeymans.

>>2621892
>anyone who doesn't buy the dark ages meme is /pol/.
kys my thing.

>>2621796
Because it still was a predominantly feudal society; exceptions are called exceptions for a reason.

Besides, aristocracies still exist within republics, e.g. Roman Republic.

Feudalism just means a hereditary aristocracy owns nearly all the land, rents it out to vassals, who use peasants that are tied to the land to work it for them in exchange for most

>>2621820
>Stadtluft macht frei[1] ("urban air makes you free"), or Stadtluft macht frei nach Jahr und Tag ("city air makes you free after a year and a day"), is a German saying describing a principle of law in the Middle Ages. The period of a year and a day was a conventional period widely employed in Europe to represent a significant amount of time.

>From the 11th century onwards, liberated serfs and other members of the Third Estate founded settlements alongside the old Roman or Germanic. It was customary law that a city resident was free after one year and one day. After this he could no longer be reclaimed by his employer and thus became bound to the city.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stadtluft_macht_frei

File: CollageMonumentiVenezia.jpg (186KB, 1000x721px) Image search: [Google]

186KB, 1000x721px

Republic of Venice >>> Erryone 2bh

>>2621892
>making assumptions about anons without proof

Truly a /his/torian. History has so many genuine holes that its impossible not make some shit up. I guess that applies to pseudo-intellectual posters

>>2622203
>Feudalism just means a hereditary aristocracy owns nearly all the land, rents it out to vassals, who use peasants that are tied to the land to work it for them in exchange for most
Yes, and this simply wasn't the case for large parts of Europe. Northern Italian states, the Swiss Cantons, German Free towns, they all had citizenship, rights, to some part democracy, citizens militias, armed and trained free men.
Thats not comparable to the French or English feudalism and absolute monarchies.

>>2621864
>>>/pol/

>>2621892
this

It's a good thing /pol/acks are leaving this board in droves. I remember a while ago I saw a post in their containment facility complaining about how they get abused on this board.

>>2621864
You forgot protties trying to shit on cathocucks for their predominance during this era.

>>2621892
>>2622356
>>>/s4s/

File: Historische_Karte_CH_1536.png (762KB, 3000x1884px) Image search: [Google]

762KB, 3000x1884px

Switzerland had several republics and no Kings or high nobility, they btfo'd dukes, kings and emperors with their citizen armies.

File: Repubblica_di_Genova.png (458KB, 1575x962px) Image search: [Google]

458KB, 1575x962px

The Genoa Republic managed to hold large swaths of territory and create a merchant empire.

>>2622373
We are having a discussion about European late medieval city states. You on the other hand just spout unrelated bullshit. please leave this thread.

>>2622407
>everyone who disagrees with my aimless board redirection shitposting is the same person

Your head is so far up your ass I'm surprised yotsuba blue isn't yotsuba brown for you.

File: Repubblica_di_Venezia.png (118KB, 1000x635px) Image search: [Google]

118KB, 1000x635px

>>2622403
Why do Venetians get associated with Jews when Genoans were the actual happy merchants dominating everything through their banks?

>>2622419
You do not agree or disagree with anything in this thread, because you are fucking off topic.
Again, this is about city states not your personal problems with society.

>>2622434
t. off topic meta shitposter who wants to stand on a plinth and have virtue-signalers suck him off

>>2622428
Being in the HRE has its perks. Also, the Fourth Crusade.

>>2622428
The merchant of Venice might has added to that perception. But yeah, La Serenissima is one of my favorites, next to the City and Republic of Bern.

>>2622439
Venice was never part of the HRE.

File: EU19_24[1].jpg (1MB, 1832x2352px) Image search: [Google]

1MB, 1832x2352px

>>2622451
>Why do Venetians get associated with Jews when Genoans

>Genoans
>Genoa

Now, where is Genoa I wonder...

>>2622439
>>2622451
The rest of the Italian city-states were part of the HRE but not really. The wars of the Lombard league made them effectively independent from them.

Did City States or Republics exist outside of the old HRE's territory? Save for Venice ofc.

>>2622531
The Novgorod Republic?

>>2622304
>without proof
It's like a homless guy that shits in the street and then says that there is no proof the dark smelly material that came out of his ass is shit. Your post is proof enough.

>>2622531

India to some extent. Depending what you mean by "republic", then of course there is also ancient Greece.

>>2623162
So basically free republics only existed within the old boarder of the HRE, at least that is for Europe. Why was that the only place where people could live free?

>>2622531
Novgorod, Iceland, Poland by the end of the Middle Ages,

>>2621892
I mean hes partially correct about it being historical revisionism. But I personally think its more to do with how knights and kings are romanticized in modern culture. Which were lacking in the Italian city states. Not much to romanticize about mercenary armies and if youre discussing the artwork youre already refering to the renaissance.

File: 168a1af5f6d637b7c217e9da7eaf231f.jpg (98KB, 564x797px) Image search: [Google]

98KB, 564x797px

>>2623348
>Not much to romanticize about mercenary armies
debatable

>>2623348
What about the Swiss armies, kicked the shit out of knights, defied emperors and kings and lived free 400 years before the US of A came into existence.

>>2623348
>historical revisionism
You sound as if the hisstory of city republics is discriminated or something. Which it clearly isn't, it is just not as popular. The notion of revisionism is tinfoil hat level retarded.
I'd rather blame Hollywood, simple minds, and the romanticed image of the knight for it. Maybe Anglocentrism as well because

I'd rather imagine being a wealthy citizen or free farmer than a filthy peasant taking shit from a knight.

>>2621796
It doesn't suit the leftist "hurr durr Christian dark age" meme.

>>2623162
There's some debate as to how republican India was.

>>2624004
But the city states had their high time during the end of the medieval, so they have nothing at all to do with "dark age memes"

>>2624033
Yeah, but there are many people who unironically refer to everything from 500-1500 AD as "the dark ages".

>>2624038
Yes, but thats not part of this thread and no one mentioned it here.

Medieval city states were oligarchies with a very closed circle of patricians running things. Of course they emulated nobility in almost every way so it wasn't much different if you lived in a town except you maybe payed less taxes and were technically a free man. But it was like 5% of town population that ever could be elected into governing positions.

>>2621864
(You)

>>2624095
>Medieval city states were oligarchies with a very closed circle of patricians running things
Broad generalization, and only true for some.

>>2624095
>But it was like 5% of town population that ever could be elected into governing positions
Again, not true for many cities.

>>2622240
>La Serenisima
>one of the most important and richest states in Medieval/early Early Modern Period Europe
>the longest lasting contiguous republican regime in history
>second (if not equal to) only to Florence in Renaissance artistic achievement
>had an industrial level shipyard 400 years before the industrial revolution
>ridiculously advanced hydraulic engineering and water management systems
>no one fucking remembers it

I blame the romanticists and their "muh melancholic decay" bullshit