Is it the Americans or the British that are the reason why were

both

>>2561925
America is why Europe speaks it

Britain is why Australia, Canada, India and parts of Africa speak it.

>>2561927
This is the only sensible and so correct answer. /thread

>>2561930
so you mean america wouldn't speak english without britain

wow

>>2561925
A combination. It is likely it would have been a very significant language anyway, but U.S economic imperialism in the late 20th century has made its ascent to become the global lingua franca possible. It might have taken decades longer otherwise.

>>2561925
what if I told you americans are the english

it all started with the british, it is british after all gave birth to America, America is just a rebellious son who brags that they created everything, even if we are the one who gave it to them,

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>>2562009
You'd be wrong

>>2562247

that's a lot of bunk, our history, culture, law, and language issues forth from our shared lineage with the men of the UK

>>2562233
>we are the one who gave it to them

lol

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>>2561925
America, undoubtedly
English has only been the lingua franca since the beginning of the US hegemony after WW2

Before that, French was (although much less spread to the mass than English is nowdays as there was no such thing as a French hollywood or a French internet).
During the height of the British Empire, literally no one could speak English outside of the British Empire and America
That's why when German diplomats addressed British ones in 1914, they did in French ("chiffon de papier").

Still I guess we can give some credit to Britain as, while they're not the country that made English relevant, they're the country that created the country that made English relevant

>>2562266
posts like these are why people hate americans

>>2561925
Both, mate.
>>2562247
"Americans" are British. And Irish are Brits in denial.

>>2562280
Crushing British delusions by telling the truth is why you bongs hate us?
Lmao, whatever senpai

>>2562280

>so butt blasted that a single post makes you hate an entire people

wew lad

>>2562247

>self-reported identity
>most with british heritage don't care for it and don't identify it
>useful data

>>2562290
Brits are easily the most butthurt posters on /his/
When it's not about France, it's about Germany, and when it's not about Germany, it's about America.
They never rest

>>2562290
I don't hate americans, i'm just saying this is why others hate them.

>>2562287
Wrong. The UK spread English to Austrlia, Canada, India and Africa. The Us spread it to Europe. Pretending the US is the reason si American delusion.

>>2562301
Only because people are outwardly hostile to brits.

>>2562262

butthurt aren't we?

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>>2562315
>The UK spread English to Austrlia, Canada, India and Africa
Yeah, thank for spreading English to India, Zimbabwe and Nigeria
It sure helped to make it the global language

>The Us spread it to Europe
And Japan, China, South America, Russia...in short, the places that made it relevant

>>2562301
You're the faggots constantly shitposting about how terrible Britain is.
>inb4 butthurt Brit
I'm an American.
>>2562315
The only "Americans" who post anti-Brit sentiments are Kraut diaspora. Ignore them.

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>>2562329
>I'm an American.

Sure you are, Nigel

>>2562294
This map very much syncs up to historical migration patterns. Mexicans the the Southwest. Italians in parts of New York, New Jersey and lower New England. Germans in the Midwest. Americans in Appalachia. Blacks in the Deep South. British in New England and the West.

You'd have to be historically illiterate to not realize how accurate this data.

>>2562285
>Irish are Brits in denial.
Man, you are gonna be murdered by the Irish soon.

>>2562327
>And Japan, China, South America, Russia...in short, the places that made it relevant
Have you ever been to these countries?

Chinese, South Americans and Russians speak barely any English.

>>2562336
But "Americans" are Brits. That's what he means.
>>2562337
No micks in Indiana, just krauts.
>>2562331
America is my country. Lowland Scottish is my ethnicity.

>>2562327
>Yeah, thank for spreading English to India, Zimbabwe and Nigeria
It sure helped to make it the global language
It's not like India is the 2nd most populated country on earth, or that you ignored half my post.

>>2561925
Brittish. There's no businesses equality to London. And the reason people speak English is because it's the businesses language. American pop-culture piggyback on this fact.

Brits placed the seeds but America made the language an economic advantage to have

>>2562360
Even if you count Americans as Brits (they are protestant scotch-Irish) that still leaves a lot of Germans, Italians, Blacks, Mexicans, Irish, Scandinavians and French.

>>2562377
The Scots and Irish are British, idiot.

>>2562380
I know, but they aren't English like >>2562009
claims.

>>2562377
So? Brits would be the largest minority, not even counting Irish. But with Irish, they'd be well over 30%. A significant number, if you ask me. Also, our language, culture, common law, Etc. are all British derived.
Also, Scotch-Irish are Scottish, and Scottish are British.

>>2562377
>scotch

opinion discarded

>>2562387
>hurr durr
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Scotch-Irish_Americans

>>2562381
All British islanders who speak English are good enough to be counted as English, for me, though I'm an American. The actual English are, genetically, majority Celtic. So other Celts who speak English are practically the same.

>>2562266

There's no such thing as "the" lingua franca

>During the height of the British Empire, literally no one could speak English outside of the British Empire and America

That's not true, also in the early 20th century the British Empire and the USA made up not far off a third of the world's population.

>>2562390
>The term Scotch-Irish is used primarily in the United States,[5] with people in Great Britain or Ireland who are of a similar ancestry identifying as Ulster Scots people.

opinion remains discarded

>>2562402
>On an American website
>Gets buttblasted when Americans use American terms
Feel free to revel in your ignorance Willy.

>>2562371
>It's not like India is the 2nd most populated country on earth, or that you ignored half my post.

Do you unironically believe that quantity is what matters?
Why arent Hindi and Mandarin relevant languages then?
English is relevant because America spread it to the relevant places of this world, not because a billion street shitters speak it (and anyway I'm pretty sure that less than half of India's pop can actually speak English).

>>2562413
I see a .org. Not a .com.

>>2562415
Mandarin is an extremely relevant language.
If you want to communication with most of the world you need English and Mandarin.

Everyone but Americans/Brits and Chinese learn a second language.

>>2562428
What about Hindi (since India is sooooooo relevant)?

And Mandarin is less relevant than fucking Spanish

>>2562457

relevant indians speak english because of empire and it being useful so learning their language (not to mention all the other languages they have...) isn't that important

mandarin and spanish are 50/50, depends on where you live, areas you want to travel to or do business with

spanish is way easier to learn as a native english speaker (or almost any other language) though so there's that

this being said, so many educated people across the globe speak english to some degree that it means native english speakers can get by without learning a second language - as india and even parts of africa become more and more relevant then you have to give 'credit' to the brits

>>2561925
American spiritualism

>>2561925

Technically Brits are the reason for America, but we've both done our part. The world wars are shaky enough that you could realistically cut out any major tentpole Ally and see a different result

>>2562457
>What about Hindi (since India is sooooooo relevant)?
I never said that.

Hindi doesn't matter at all, all educated Indians speak English

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>>2561925
>>2561927
FPBP

>>2562393
"No."

>>2562668
No?
Celts who speak English are Celts who speak English.

>>2562692
Considering some of those Celts considered themselves culturally different enough to want to break away I'd be tempted to call you retarted.

>>2562698

That's funny, because it's very clear that you're the retarded one. I doubt Canada wants to unify with America, I guess that means neither of them speaks English, amirite? You dumb bastard.

>>2562710
The language you speak isn't your culture, you dumb bastard.

>>2562713

It IS the language you speak tho, you unbelievable cretin.

>>2562716
>culture=language
American "education".

Obviously America.

Throughout the height of British power, French was still the lingua franca. English only replaced French once Britain had become irrelevant and America had become a superpower.

>>2562698
Texas wants to break away, too, but would you really consider their culture that different from, say, Oklahoma culture?
Anyway, the cultural differences aren't even that big, anymore. Any they won't break away.
>>2562710
>now the guy I replied to will think I'm samefagging
Goddamnit, Anon.

>>2562745
Texas doesn't want to break away. Just because some rednecks shout "LONE STAR!" doesn't mean that there's a large succession movement like there was in Ireland. Do you also consider all Arabic speaking people the same?

>>2562757
Anyway, the context of my initial statement was saying that regarding British diaspora in America. The Irish in America have shed most of what few cultural differences there were between them and the English, so they should be counted as British. Same for American Scottish, Scotch-Irish, Welsh, Etc.
Also, I thought you meant Scotland.

>>2562804
Americans have their own cultural divides.

>>2561927
This.

>>2562822
They aren't very deep.
Have you been here?

>>2562829
Not him but I myself an an Ohioan and the cultural difference between here and the Bible Belt isn't that small. Heck even there's even a bit of difference from Cinci to Columbus

>>2562847
Any large nation is going to have areas where food is slightly different, clothes are slightly different, a few values are slightly different, Etc., but these are very minor differences. I could move from Indiana to anywhere in the country and fit in after 5 years, and so could you.

>>2562247
the one white county in Iowa is mostly Dutch

>>2562856
I think between North and South its more than that though. Sure Indiana isn't so different from Ohio but what about Maine and Georgia? People act a little different you can notice it when you visit.

>>2562864
I could fit in in Ohio in a year. In Maine in 3 years. In Texas in 5 years.
Yes, there are cultural differences. But they aren't that large. I could probably fit in in England in a decade, but I could never fit in in, say, Germany.
There are differences. But ours are much smaller compared to the typical differences between nation-states.

What so u telling me English is from England and shiet m8?
WE
WERE
ROYAL

>>2562723

Why is this board full of people that think there is such a thing as "the" lingua franca and that it was French?

Such foolishness.

>>2561925
>Is it the Americans or the British that are the reason why were all speaking English today?

Neither.

The English are the reason.

>>2562887
I suppose you also think English isn't the lingua franca today

>>2562913

There's no such thing as "the" lingua franca.

Nor would whatever case you want to put forward for the domination of English in the modern age of incredible communication technology make the use of French in past times automatically equivalent to that.

>>2562887
French was the lingua franca until English took over after WW2, that's a fact

>French replaced Latin as the most important language of diplomacy and international relations (lingua franca) in the 17th century. It retained this role until approximately the middle of the 20th century, when it was replaced by English as the United States became the dominant global power following the Second World War.[49][50]
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/French_language#History

Now, as >>2562266 pointed out, it wasn't as spread among commoners as English is right now (mostly because there were no international mass media)
Only the "elite" of each nation could speak it

>>2561925
Both, the british were responsible for its initial spread and popularity, making it one of the primary trading languages of most of the world and the language of the educated in their colonies and much of europe, the americans made its continued spread feasible when the british declined in power, sustaining and increasing the dominance of english.

>>2562943
>Now, as >>2562266 pointed out, it wasn't as spread among commoners as English is right now (mostly because there were no international mass media)
>Only the "elite" of each nation could speak it

You are very foolish to think the elites of every nation could speak French at any given time in the past.

Nor is there such as thing as "the" singular lingua franca whatever someone inserted into the Wiki article on the French language.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lingua_franca

>>2562428
>wanting to talk to chinks
The Chinese learn English and not the other way around, because Chinese is multiple orders of magnitude more difficult than English.

>>2562975
>You are very foolish to think the elites of every nation could speak French at any given time in the past.

Every relevant nation obviously
Of course the Zulus couldnt, otherwise Brits could have negociated with them lmao
But for exemple, during the Russo-Japanese War, Japanese and Russian diplomats used French to communicate

>>2562247
yeah thats quite a bit wrong with that chart, starting with the fact that it only shows the single largest ancestry in a given county.

meaning that a county that was say 35% italian 34% german and 31% irish would simply be shown as italian.

what this means is that the chart completely misses out the fact that over vast areas of the country british ancestry is a significant part of the racial mix (along with german, italian and irish)

the vast areas coloured cream for example are almost certainly largely british, and the british is probably the second moost common nationality in the blue and brown areas as well

>>2563011
>Every relevant nation obviously

I totally disagree and you have made no case for this other than making up a non-existent title and pretending that calling French by this non-existent title was a dominant in the past (even just among the elites) as English is currently dominant in international communication.

>>2562336
the problem with this data isnt that its innaccurate, it isnt, it does indeed pretty much look like you would expect it to.

the problem is that its incomplete, showing only the single largest ethnicity claimed.

>>2563006
>Chinese is multiple orders of magnitude more difficult than English.
I'm going to have to disagree. Chinese languages have an extremely sharp learning curve—pretty much a cliff. But it levels off, and then the learning curve declines fairly rapidly after you've mastered the basics. It's mostly learning how to study Chinese and apply what you've already learnt. It isn't a language that you can study casually, and requires a fair bit of brute memorization. However the problem CSL and CAL students face is that you can't even use the language until you have the principles and first five-hundred characters known by heart.

In English, on the other hand, it is easy to get by without mastery of the basics, or even the first principles. If you fuck up your plurals or your tenses you're still intelligible to a native English speaker, provided the person you're talking to isn't a total fuckwit. If you can grasp simple SVO word order, then you can communicate basic sentences in English. Because it's (more or less) phonetic, you require fewer resources to learn the basics.

However, mastery of English is intensely difficult for ESL/EAL students. The pronunciation, intonation, and emphasis of complicated polysyllabic words, especially technical words used in scientific or workplace settings; the appropriate use of count nouns and mass nouns; the correct use of subjects versus objects; the comprehension of contranyms by contextual use; and the conjugation of uncommon irregular verbs (e.g. "to smite") and irregular adverbs (e.g. "well") all fuck with ESL students. But if you screw these up it is a dead giveaway that you are one or more of: a high school dropout, a millennial who got totally fucked by "no wrong answers"-styled education, or you're not a native speaker.

American. You could put it to Britain's credit on account of indirect influence. You could also credit the Anglo Saxons tbqh.

The fact is Brit's speak American today. A century ago, Henry James' English was considered extremely foreign in England. Now it is the standard

>>2562247
This has been debunked a million times over.

>>2562315
>The Us spread it to Europe.
And the rest of the fucking world lel

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>>2563388
>The fact is Brit's speak American today

>>2563895
Did you play with a GameBoy Color or a GameBoy Colour as a kid?
Are British teenagers right now playing "For Honor", or "For Honour"?

>>2563895
>Henry James' English was considered foreign
>now it isn't
>durr duh books chynged matey, not us

>>2563911
Buying consumer goods with American spelling is entirely different to the spelling people use in everyday language both written and oral. No British school child is going to be told to spell either of those words with a 'u' and nor will they write it as such.

>>2562006
Yeah, us Americans probably would speak French or Spanish. Dutch maybe.

>>2563973
without*, how embarrassing

>>2563982
We wouldn't be Americans u dumbfuck

>>2564053
What would you be?

>>2564053
>We wouldn't be Americans u dumbfuck
We shouldn't be Americans with British ancestry. We should still be Americans. Just completely different. (Still white though)

>>2562009
Most of the USA's influential men have been Anglo, or at-least primarily British in Ancestry. Even Obama is Anglo on one side, and Colonial subject on the other.
>>2562266
Literally entirely because the English ruling class learnt multiple languages and appreciated tradition. But you're right, there is no better way to demonstrate superiority than to be openly averse to high culture and make frequent exhibitions of low intellect.
>During the height of the British Empire, literally no one could speak English outside of the British Empire and America
Ridiculous thing to say but saying "literally no one" APART from those living in the greatest empire in human history and those in the USA is hilarious.

English isn't even that widely spoken now, but it has been, since the mid 18th century, THE language of power, industry, knowledge and wealth. That the British wrapped the world up in telecommunication lines, railways, and maritime routes meant the main arteries of humanity would be profoundly English enterprises and the proliferation of the language would be inevitable.

>>2562327
>>The UK spread English to Austrlia, Canada, India and Africa
...also the USA
>Japan, China, South America, Russia
Four regions of the earth where most people wouldn't have a working knowledge of English...
What did he mean by this?