I'm a Muslim, and know quite a bit about the religion and

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>>2529456
Why do they wear the mask?

>>2529456
Why are you muslim?

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>>2529456
What is your opinion of ISIS?

>>2529456
Why did the Crusaders lose everytime after the 1st Crusade?

>>2529481
3rd Crusade would've been an even bigger victory if Barbarossa didn't take a tumble into the river. Fucker got like 100,000 soldiers ready in the goddamn middle ages. Saladin was shitting himself when he heard about them. But yeah, it basically comes down to numbers and the fact that they're playing an away game and the field is tilted.

>>2529472
>getting that far with one focus as an uncivilized nation

Fake and gay.

>>2529466
Headcoverings for women is something mentioned in the Quran, as a show of humility in opposition to extravagance. The burqas and niqabs, the ones that cover the whole face and body, are believed primarily by Salafists and very conservative Sunnis to have been worn by the wives of the Prophet Muhammad (peace be upon him). It is the general consensus of all Muslims that we should follow the footsteps of the Prophet as closely as possible, thus those who belive the Prophet's wives wore the garmet believe that women must wear it to be in line with Shariah. This is not a view I personally share

>>2529469
I converted when I was 14, after feeling the Quran had spoken to me in a way a book not inspired by God ever could. I was shaky on following at first, but connecting with other Muslims through the internet helped me through

>>2529472
Their actions contradict the Quran in many waus, killing innocent bystanders and following a 'caliph' who encourages rape and murder. As far as I'm concerned, pledging allegiance to ISIS is the same as apostasy. Early in Islam's history, during our First Fitna (Islamic civil war), a faction not unlike ISIS today appeared, the Kharijites. They pillaged and murdered innocents, all while claim to follow true Islam. They were a horrible plague, but thankfully, they were wiped out over time. The same must be done to ISIS

Why should anyone believe Mohammed?

>>2529481
>everytime
From a purely religious perspective, it could be argued that God had forsaken the Fatamids, who ruled Jerusalem before the First Crusade, for their decadence, heretical nature, and harassment of innocent pilgrims- a belief commonly applied to the Umayyads after their failed assualt on France. After the Fatamids were defeated, perhaps God favored those Muslims who continued to fight for the holy lands, leading them to victory. Of course none of this is known, and the Quran warns against claiming to know God's intent for the people on earth.

>>2529456
How did the prohibition against alcohol work in regards to long sea voyages for things like Chinese trade?

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All you need to know about Islam:

>Detailed Documentary Exposing Islam (3 hours)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qk_VwZxN9bA

>Muhammad the World's Most Evil Man?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=efRRknDAuHc

>Evidence Muhammad was Demon Possessed
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FywOhaY-GEA

>Original Sources Koran Stole its Stories From
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZhaLDYo0Kl8

>Allah = Satan
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qTi1FZkoEsM
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=86PL9wueH-s
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TLoUq8vybzY

>Why We Are Afraid, A 1400 Year Secret
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=t_Qpy0mXg8Y

t. ex-Muslim

>>2529483
For as long as Israel exists, there will be conflict between Muslims and Jews. In the event of Israel's fall, either tensions would ease as local Jews would integrate back into Muslim countries, or they could get even worse, if a terrorist group like Al-Qaeda seized the territory. I fear that the latter may be true (except it being Al-Qaeda themselves taking it, they see not to quarrel with them much...), but wish for peace between our peoples

>>2529545
The Sunni are too pure for this.mpeg

>>2529456
Is Allah outside morality?

>>2529490
I won't disagree with that, the Muslims did have stratigic advantages later on

>>2529528
We believe that the Quran contains miracles, and that the Prophet it had been given to was granted the gift of prophacy. It is thus because of the Prophet's miracles in life, such as the victory over the Makkans, and the miracles in the Quran visable to believers, which says we must follow the example of the Prophet, that we embrace all that we can know of what he said and did as law

>>2529456
How do you see the future of Islam? Any new conquests you guys want to lead? Do you hope the Muslim countries will unite into one powerful caliphate?

>>2529544
To be honest, I don't know. I don't know much about post-Rashidun Arab history, when a lot of the trade took place, and I know little of the livelihoods of traders

>>2529580
Europe will accept Islam. The current Europeans don't like it. Their children will tolerate it. And their children will pray to Mecca 5 times a day and accept that there is one God, Allah and that Mohammed is His Prophet.

Nothing can stop this trend at this point. We are looking at the dusk of Christian life in Europe.

>>2529545
That's more than I can watch in a night (it's 3:00 am here), but I'll look at what you've provided when I am able

>>2529592
What about Eastern Europe and Russia itself? India, China, Southeast Asia in general? What about the Americas?

>>2529553
A lot of Sunnis are getting ridiculous with the exessive traditionalism in recent times- it's the Salafist influnces being spread by Saudi Arabia. I am a Zaidi Shiite

>>2529554
Well no, Allah is the creator of all things, and thus created the morality we are born with

>>2529580
At current, the future is bleak. It is prophesied that near the end times, all Muslim nations would be ruled by unjust men, and as no leader of any Muslim nation seems to be adhering to Shariah themselves, this time seems immenent, if not upon us already. Nonetheless, I believe Muslim armies will defeat Israel eventually, and perhaps India too. A united caliphate is a wonderous vision, but Muslims will likely not recieve a legitamate leader of all until the Mahdi, who will unite Muslims near the last day

>>2529592
The future is tumultuous and uncertain- a few leaders and cultural shifts could change that. If people desire to convert to Islam, I'm all for it, but I don't have any desire in particular to see Christian Europe fall

>>2529618
>the mahdi
>all of Islam is anxiously waiting for a black Ethiopian dwarf

It's so funny to me

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>>2529466
>>2529499

Don't listen to their lies, they wear them to protect their hair and skin from the Sun, the Israelites were a standing army in the desert who couldn't keep pigs there.

The Egyptians before them did the same thing, they don't drink wine as it dehydrates you, these cultures were different in the most ancient times as they climate of the Middle East was a lot more habitable than it is the last 2000 years.

Mecca is Disneyland for Muslims invented by Jews and Americans.

>>2529456

is it really acceptable to marry first cousins?

>>2529456
Exactly how common is marrying 9-12 year old girls in Islamic culture? Like is it more of a universal tenant, or just more of a cultural locality kind of thing?

https://wikiislam.net/wiki/Scientific_Errors_in_the_Quran

Care to explain?

>>2529636
That's why the wives would have worn them in the first place. Extreme traditionalists just interpret from that that it was also a show of submission to God. The Quran also says what is righteous is what is good for you, and hence what is unrighteous, like alcohol, is bad.

>>2529643
Yes, we see it as something permitted by God in opposition to other forms of incest

>>2529643

Shouldn't this be stopped? The prophet didn't do this did he? Seems like a no brainer? Is it just the perception of being considered "modern" that stops people speaking out about this? Seems like this practice would be clearly detrimental to the group...

>>2529644
It's unfortunately regular in the Middle-East. This is accepted by many because it's been taught for generations that Aisha, the Prophet's youngest wife, was around 9 when they married. This doesn't make historic sense, however, as she was reported to have fought in full battle regalia alongside the Prophet. It would be downright silly to imagine a 9-10 year old in armor (which they did not make for children) rallying troops with powerful speeches and attacking enemies on camel-back. She must have at least been in her teens at the time of marriage, thus making child marriages outside the fold of Islam.

>>2529693
So why do you suppose the idea pervades even today then? Gettin's just too good or something?

Apologises to those I haven't answered, but I'm actively falling asleep now. I will return tomorrow

>>2529669
Lying =/= good

You stupid Muslims come to the most rain soaked lands and demand that people dress desert style, you are above all others, the most backward people on the planet.

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>>2529553

>>2529456
I have two questions

First does the Qur'an or Allah promise wealth or greatness on this Earth/in the physical realm?(as in not just an after death paradise system) If so what explains the generally weaker social/geopolitical standing of Muslim countries today?

Second, is there any aspect of man/creation not created by Allah? If not then is Allah guilty of all sin having created both man's nature/mind and that which he reacts to?

Thank you

>>2529648
A lot of those are just assumptions based on what is written and excessive nitpicking. The Quran does draw on analogies that would be sensible to the people they were revealed to, like sunrise-sunset; we wouldn't likely call someone who mentions a sunset as scientifically illiterate just because we know the sun isn't actually 'setting'- the Quran was given to us to achieve salvation, not just to describe the nature of the universe

>>2529456
Do you believe Islam as a majority religion is compatible with a liberal democratic society? Im grappling with the question myself

>>2529684
I believe the Prophet may have, but I'm uncertain. It's never really been a problem- inbreeding tends to only be a big issue after multiple generations of it in terms of birth defects. It's never been a very relevant issue, it's just something that there's no rule against

>>2529698
Tradition rules in much of the Middle-East, and people tend to be very much against adjusting to new change there. Several major Sunni and Shiite scholars and imams have embraced the idea of Aisha having been in her teens at marriage, but the Salafists have been the most resistant, and their scholars and the government of Saudi Arabia still promote it as fact

>>2529708
That's 90% Salafist doings. Attempting to maintain tradition is honorable, but they take it to ridiculous levels on questionable grounds

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>>2529545
>people are still posting this horrendously incorrect image that compares like 30 different Arab campaigns to just the First Crusade

>>2529456
How does Islam view Animal Cruelty?

>>2530034
First, to an extent; the greatest promises for the righteous are in the afterlife, but God may grant boons to those who act justly during their time on earth. This could be anything from vast material wealth to simply a comfortable mind- God knows what gifts will be best used. As for the Middle-East, it is prophesied that Islamic lands will suffer terrible leaders and great poverty near the end time. The abandonment of Shariah by Islamic leaders can be attributed to this

Next, all things, including the human capacity to sin, were created by God. God does not desire puppets for followers, but wants mankind to prove its strength against the influence of Satan

>>2530775
I don't think so. Liberalism by its nature encourages people to act upon what their body feels, which is in contradiction to Islam's teaching of conservatism. It is better when Muslims keep to our own communities, under our own laws

>>2530834
Strongly against, with harsh punishments. We believe that animals too have souls, and must be treated righteously. The Prophet Muhammad (peace be upon him) is reported to have treated his cat with such respect that he would not disturb it from his robe when it slept, and always ensured his camel recieved lavish treatment. Nonetheless, hunting and the slaughter of farm animals is accepted as being a part of our position in the world, so long as it is done humanly

>I believe Muslim armies will defeat Israel eventually, and perhaps India too
>nd perhaps India too
you do t see anything hypocritical here and reason why religion of peace is written with quotation marks

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>>2529456
Do you hate niggers?
https://fds.duke.edu/db/attachment/1220

>>2531094
We are not a religion of peace, that's just what a lot of liberals have taken to calling us. We are a religion of justice, and will shy from no fight to achieve this; that is nothing to be ashamed of. And indeed, for as long as Israel and India attacks Muslims directly or inadvertently, we will fight

>>2531185
So when in your opinion justice will be completed and all muslims outside of arabian peninsula dead or expulsed?
It is something to be ashamed of, you pride yourself that you are powerful and willing to fight, but in truth only reason you exist is morality of powerful.

>>2531146
No- though some have promoted ideas of racial supremacy, they have no basis; ethnicity has no bearing in Islam

What do you think of the idea of developing robots until they become an everyday item then activating a piece of encrypted code causing them to kill every human in sight except those with a special electronic tag?

Muslims really are just the worst

>>2531211
Genocide is never just. The majority of Islamic expansion was done by the Umayyads, who were unjust leaders who ignored the Quran. Nonetheless, most of the people today who live in those regions are now Muslims, and are no less afforded the same protections as all people. Our fight is to prevent something like that from ever happening again; vengence against innocent inhabitants of land over an empire long past is pointless

The sunnah states that Muslims should try to leave non-Muslim lands and emigrate to Muslim lands because living under the rule of non-Muslims in a non-Muslim land is conductive to sin. Do you then support the reemigration of Muslim from the West to Muslim lands?

>>2531226
Well, I can't say I'd approve of that...

>>2530932
In that case...
Can a Muslim be Vegan?
Basically, decide to not consume any animal or any bi-product of animals like eggs or milk etc'...

Or, is that not allowed?

>>2531255
So if Umayyads were unjust when will you do justice and go back to arabian peninsula, or will you following your own logic to prevent something that happened do same thing that that they did.
>Vengence against innocent inhabitants
So do you support Hamas and palestinian terrorist attacks?

>>2531267
I think it's better for Muslims to remain in Muslim lands, as it's better functionally and reduces ethnic and religious tensions- I'm generally opposed to immigration unless it's absolutely nessecary as a whole. However, that still leaves the issue of converts, like myself; I think we should generally stick together and help influence each other positively, but still maintain the cultures we were born into

>>2531293
It's allowed, and very common among Sufis. It's just not particularly encouraged

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>>2529545

>>2531293
That would be awkward. Imagine being the only one not sharing the meat of the mutton slaughtered by your family for the Aid el Kebir.

>>2529609
The Quran says that Allah leads people astray from his religion
I forgot the exact sura, but it's in there. How is this moral?
This is why I say YHWH and Allah are different.

>>2531301
The locals are the ones who converted under the Umayyads; it's the same people who were living there before, just with a different religion. You can't kick them out of their own land with any justice- the Arabian Peninsula is foreign to them

And I do not support terrorist attacks against anyone, but one thing must be made clear; Israeli settlers in West Bank are foreign invaders under the guise of civilians. Palestinians, like anyone else, have a right to defend their homes

>>2531328
I'm not quite sure how they do it. It's commendable, I suppose, to so staunchly defend animals, but I think it's ultimately unnecessary

Mufti?

>>2531343
You are correct on the verse; it is they themselves who fall astray through sins, but as a grave punishment for those who have fully forsaken God, then God removes their sight to see divine truth, and redemption becomes almost impossible. With divine inspiration, they will lead difficult, tiring lives, making a clear example of what rebelliousness against God brings. Sometimes people need harsh punishments so that others may see and avoid that path- this is in line with what is spoken of God in the Bible. God is the most merciful, but when punishment is needed, there is no more effective ones than those from God

>>2531347
Fair enough case for West Bank, what I wanted to point more is why India, when first war was started by Pakistan, and Muslims as all other religions have equal rights in India as opposed to Pakistan where others are constitutionally discriminated, should muslims have more rights than people of other religion?
Also you surely support reintegration of parts of Turkey to Armenia.

>>2531365
If your asking what they are, they're sort of regional high priest for Sunnis- similar to bishops in Catholicism, I think

>>2529456
Muhammad was supposedly given a unique exception by God where he could have up to nine wives at the same time as opposed to the usual four, one of whom was nine years old. Awfully fortuitous, wouldn't you agree?

>>2529456
Do you think apostates should be executed according to the Hadith? If not why not

>>2529456
Why did God wait over 500 years to rectify the supposed distortion of His word and reveal himself to an illiterate desert merchant and proceed to change laws and add doctrines like the existence of jinns (desert devils)?

>>2529456
How do you justify the fact that there was a schism immediately after Muhammad's death before the Quran and Hadith were even written down? (Ali is clearly the successor to Muhammad btw)

>>2531395
No sir. The Christian God would never close your eyes to see him. It's counterproductive to his plan of bringing everyone to his religion you understand?
Allah effectively damning people to hell for eternity is immoral and downright evil I'd say.

>>2531396
I'm no great supporter of Pakistan, and agree they've acted unjustly throughout their history. My concern is for the Muslims of Jammu and Kashmir, who have been discriminated against and forced from their homes in many cases, as well as the people along the Bangladeshi border, who are suffering extreme poverty due to the poorly-made, heavily militarized border. I'd be happier if the Indians and Bangladeshis traded lands peacefully to allow Muslims and Hindus/Buddhists to freely move through to their respective countries, and for Jammu and Kashmir to become independent, but I fear that would simply be unachievable in the current political atmosphere. And, if the residents of certain Turkish areas had desire to join with Armenia, I'd support it so long as no regions preferring Turkish rule would be forced along

>>2531415
God has granted exceptions to prophets throughout time; I do not question these special exceptions. It is believed by many that all of the wives were accepted because they, like the companions of the Prophet Muhammad (peace be upon him), all presented opportunities for the Prophet to express the laws of God in their interactions with him

>>2531422
The Hadith calling for their execution is questionable, in my view, and wouldn't be in line with the Quran saying there is no compulsion in religion. The reasons for their apostacy or what they intended to do afterwards, especially in the early period of Islam, could invoke harsher punishments

>>2531430
God is aware of all things, and chose that time perhaps because it was the best time for Islam to achieve victory. The Arabs at that time were a pitiful group, constantly fighting tribal wars or serving foreign powers. God revealing the Quran to the Arabs first, in the Arabic language, was a means for the Arab ethnicity to redeem itself and stand with honor

>>2531430
And we do not believe he added anything, he simply provided what had been lost. The Jinn were fairly irrelevant to everyone else, so it's sensible that they only need be mentioned to the ones who already knew of them in their culture

>>2531439
I would agree- I am a Shiite. The Prophet Muhammad (peace be upon him) prophesied that Muslims would divide themselves into sects, and that those who encourage division are deviants. After the death of the Prophet, the companions of the Prophet, including Hazarat Imam Ali. However, they all convened while he was building the tomb of the Prophet, and elected Abu Bakr without Imam Ali's input. Imam Ali wanted unity, and though feeling disenfranchised, accepted Abu Bakr's rule. On his deathbed, Abu Bakr chose Umar to be the next caliph, not even considering Imam Ali, but again he accepted it. On Umar's deathbed, he set a number of candidates including Imam Ali, and asked them to cast their votes. Imam Ali was narrowly defeated in votes by Uthman, who only received his votes because some of the voters despised Imam Ali without just reason.

Imam Ali did not swear loyalty to Uthman, but did pledge to continue to defend the Caliphate which he still felt he deserved in the first place. Uthman was displeased, and upset Imam Ali was preaching against him from his mosque in Kufa, so he seized all of his property except the single mosque, and all of his money. From his home in Medinah, Uthman was beginning to grow worried about unrest due to his habit of drinking and committing adultry, and was convinced Imam Ali was the cause. Nonetheless, it got to be more than he could handle, and he called on Imam Ali to save him when a mob trapped him in his mosque. Imam Ali refused, and Uthman was stoned to death.

(1/2)

(2/2)

At this point, rumors that Imam Ali had been responsible for killing Uthman began circulating. The widow of the Prophet, Aisha, promoted them strongly; she'd always had an unusual disdain towards Imam Ali, something the Prophet Muhammad (peace be upon him) had warned her against. In his life, the Prophet said one of his wives would betray the Ummah, and would be given a clear sign through hearing a barking dog at a specific town in the desert. Aisha raised an army to march against Imam Ali, and as she marched through that specific town, she heard the dog. She knew she had heard it, but ignored it, making the other generals under her very worried. However, they would not turn against Aisha, and marched on.

Aisha would lose the battle despite her superior numbers, and kicked off the First Fitna, with Muwayiah taking her place to take the Caliphate from Imam Ali. The division still exists today; had she just heeded the warning of the Prophet, or had the council choosing the first caliph been fair to Imam Ali, we would not be divided- but perhaps it was fate. Of course, note Sunnis would tell a very different story- I only tell as I know. Sorry for the walltext

>>2531751
>>2531759
This is pretty neat. Real Islamic/Arabic lore/history. Don't really hear much about the Eastern side of the world since Western culture is so centralized around itself (not to say that that's a bad thing necessarily).

Interesting read.

>>2531810
That is the Shia version of events. Sunnis would describe it differently

>>2529456
I appreciate this thread and the civility of discussion. I myself have a question for you:

How do you deal with the various minor (and some major) details that the Qur'an gets wrong when retelling biblical tales? E.g. that Mary is a member of the Christian Trinity

Also, when looking at the prophets behavior historically, he committed acts that, although acceptable at the time, would be unacceptable today.

How do you reconcile this with Islam's claim to universal truth?

>>2529456
Why do you worship a demon?

Why is there still an issue between the shiites and sunnis even after 1400 years ago? Should that be fixed by now or is there no way to fix it?

>>2531459
The rules have been made clear, and we're given full oppertunity to follow them to the best of our abilities. The path of rebellion harms those around us as well; the deviant wishes to harm the believer's faith only to bring them down. The sight of the deviant is not taken until they would happily discard of it themselves. You must recall the result of the cities of Sodom and Gomorrah- there is a limit to the chances we get

>>2531459
How do you, as a Christian, reconcile the extremely different personalities of the God of the OT and the God of the NT?

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what does the arabic in this pic mean?

>>2531810
Thank you. This is, of course, very abbreviated and simplified, but I definitely agree Arab history is too often overlooked

>>2531875
From my understanding, and what I was taught, the OT God was acting under the covenant of Abel, which was enacted in blood and murder. He showed himself as a more wrathful God because that was what the people needed. They were dickheads worshipping idols and shit so they needed a firm hand.
The NT God was acting under a new Covenant, the covenant of JC, which redeemed humanity and brought them back to God.
It's hard to explain, but I tried.

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>>2531879

aka this

>>2531845
I'm personally amazed- most Islam threads on other sites are 75% hostility or just regulated to the point that hardly anything can be discussed.

Now, when talking about Quranic references to Christians and the Bible, recall the Hejaz area, especially Makkah, was a hot-bed for heretics and syncretics. The Prophet Muhammad (peace be upon him) declared the trinity to be a heretical concept, but in the region were more than one group who belived in a trinity- even the Prophet's family worshipped a god and two goddesses above the other local deities. One particular group, whom I forget the name of, did believe in a trinity with Hazarat Mariam among it, and a priestess of this group is reported to have spoken with the Prophet at one point. The message of not equating humans with God is universal nonetheless, even if that example was directed towards a group which never grew to any prominence

(1/2)

(2/2)

The morality of the modern word has been shifted and warped with political happenings, clearly illustrated by the divide between the old and young on issues like gay marriage and marijuana legalization. The actions of the Prophet which would be most likely seen as against modern morals would be execution of war prisoners, accepting religious conversion as a means of avoiding execution, and marrying a young teenager. On the first to, it should be kept in mind that Muslims were in a state of total war from the seizure of Makkah and Medinah until the Prophet's death. Prisoners released would almost certainly just reinforce the enemies again, causing more harm to Muslims whom they were attacking. Conversion was accepted as a surrender, as that would condemn them in the eyes of their former clans, and served as an effective pledge of allegiance. Finally, Aisha may have been around 13, which at that time would mean she'd have long-since begun puberty. The discrepancy over life-span from then until now would place a 13 year old as nearly a mature adult; the law may put the age of consent at various specific ages, but ultimately what's really important is mental and physical maturity when it comes to morality

>>2531526
Your view on this matter is not in the majority, sadly. Two questions:

1. Do you think Muslim parents should encourage their children to scrutinize the texts and come to their own conclusion?

2. Do you believe Islam is in need of a Reformation to rectify coercive practices by many Islamic authorities?

>>2531866
While the political divisions and differences in religious teachings still remained, Sunnis and Shiites have spent more time at peace than at war. The modern fighting is mostly taking place between Salafists (Sunni extremists) and Khomeinist Ja'faris (Shiite extremists), and is so prominent as Saudi Arabia and Iran, the strongholds of the ideologies, are promoting them to advance their proxy wars.

>>2531879
Cute girls

>>2531915
That is the Shadah- the declaration of faith. It says "There's no God but Allah, the Prophet Muhammad is his messenger"

>>2532118
That's a misunderstanding of the Trinity as Christians understand it. It is not three gods, but one God in three forms all of one substance. This is an imperfect analogy, but you can think of it as how h2o exists simultaneously in three forms on Earth: ice, water, and steam.

>>2529456
What role do you think violence should have in Islam? Would you consider insulting the prophet Muhammad or mockery of the faith to be worthy of violent retaliation?

>>2532141
Yes- one's faith comes from inside, and forcing a certain viewpoint can lead to confusion and rebellion. Sects are difficult things, and no one can claim 100% in a sect. Encouraging children to read into it themselves and make their own conclusions makes for intelligent and spiritually enlightened adults.

Yes, to an extent. Such a movement would need to be carefully performed, relying on strong information from the Quran and Hadith; the Salafist movement started out as a modernist reform group, but poisoned itself by relying on weak Hadith and taking their interpretations too literally, even when they contradicted the Quran

>>2532154
The Shia-Sunni "war for the last thousand years" is a meme. The modern tension between the two groups is a symptom of the geopolitical conflict between Iran and the Saudis.

>>2529456
Do you fuck goats?

>>2532191
I think I understand the Christian view of the trinity, I had just brought the polytheist example to note that three divine figures was a commonly held view in the area, and the Prophet Muhammad (peace be upon him) condemned them all

>>2532235
Under Sharia, sex with animals is punishable by either 100 lashes (if not married) or stoning (if married). The only countries in which bestiality is a capital offense are the Muslim ones.

>>2532202
We believe that all people have a right to defend themselves from unwarrented aggression with violence. As Muslims, we are told to unite with fellow Muslims facing oppression or attacks with Jihad, and to protect fellow monotheists from harm. We must not be afraid of war when it is to protect innocent people from undue harm

The response to insulting the Prophet is situational; under normal circumstances, no. However, spreading propaganda against the Prophet with the intent of spreading hatred and violence against Muslims is considered the same as an act of combat. Thus, the Charlie Hebdo attacks were illegitimate

How do you view other Abrahamic religions?

>>2532217
Exactly, and western media is making it worse by making it out like people from different sects can never be on the same side

>>2532235
Nah

>>2532297
I wish we worked to unify more and focus on our common ground. Christianity and Islam are sometimes treated as opposites, when in reality we're incredibly close in theology and moral outlook. We would do well to watch each other's backs in this modern era; there are much bigger threats in the world than each other

>>2532347
Juden?

>>2532355
Juden.

>>2531318
>Among Sufis
Yyyeah I imagine that depends on the Tariqa. And the Sheikh within it.


Sufis are by and large just Traditional Sunnis that hold to the Classical Islamic religious science and practice of Mysticism.

>>2532217
Normally the "Shi'a vs Sunni wars" are just between Religious Pluralists and Sectarians.

In The Syrian Confict the SAA was portrayed by Mainstream Media as "The Shi'a Side". When in reality they were a collection of Sunnis, Shi'a (Both Twelver and Ismaili), Christians, Alawites, Druze etc.
While the Rebels were pretty much just Fundamentalist Sunnis.

>>2532347
That's all very noble, but hard to think very possible when muslims are themselves the people who go hardest against 'heretics'.

>>2529592
>nothing can stop this trend
>"trend"
M8 nobody is converting to Islam. The growth is purely due to demographics, which are leveling off - Arabs now are almost at European levels of fertility, and certainly will be within 50 years.

If all continues along a moderate (non-genocidal on either side) path, Europe will peak at ~20% Muslim max, after which they'll either secularize like the Christians or sperg out and see a massive reaction against them, which will force secularization.

Religious life in Europe, period, is slowly going away. Your special snowflake religion too.

>>2532295
This brings me to my issue with the term 'islamophobia'; criticizing Islam and inciting violence against Muslims are fundamentally different, but often lumped into one broad category with this politicized term.

Take President Trump, for example, would you consider him to be engaging in an act of combat against Muslims with his rhetoric?

Why does Islam use the symbol of a half moon on flags and on top of mosques? A strange choice for staunch monotheists

>>2533163
Ottoman empire

>>2529456
Do you look down on white converts

>>2529456
Does Islam give you or other followers fulfillment in life?

A lot of Christians talk about how they were going through tough emotional/spiritual times until they fully embraced Christianity. Do similar things happen with Islam?

>>2530864
So if all things are created by Allah, then does he not also make people to sin?

This question may be more accurately answered if we determine his power. Is Allah Omnipotent AND Omniscient? If so then how can man be at any fault for his sin?

As a second question again, what is your opinion of sin/evil? Does it "exist" what is its origin? Did Allah create it or create the one that created it? Do you see it like hot/cold in that it does not "exist" so to say, but it does have actual effects.

Thank you again

>>2529456
does no Muslim take offense to Muhammad's pedophilia

>>2529481
You really can't call the Third Crusade war,
It was a military victory, and a favorable political settlement towards Christians

>>2529456
How much of the negative view of Islam is based on arab culture and not the faith itself?

Is your belief in Allah and the Koran based on you having a direct spiritual experience with him or logical arguments?

Why hasnt there been a Sunni Caliph since the fall of the Ottomans?

Which country would you say best represents and Islamic country?

What part of your faith do you struggle the most with? For me and Islam it was seeing disappointment in seeing rather human behavior and outcomes when I had my hopes built up (with respect to the Koran) and secondly was the treatment of the Hadith

>>2529545
That image is fake and gay

>>2534327

Most Muslims take the Calvinist approach. God does decide all that. Your free will (in general) is only within the confines of what Allah allows for you.

Not Muslim, but I know about it. They are big on everything being part of Allah's will and predestination. So, there is no free will argument to be made since you're only as free as Allah lets you be. If he wants you to go to heaven or hell it's happening. Same with sin.

>>2534560
Noy exactly allah puts trials on your path and how you deal with them is up to you.
There would be no point if everything you did was not out of free will.

>>2529576
But why should we believe in the miraculous accounts written in the Quran?

If people have historically found great life changing meaning in false scriptures and works of fiction, how can one trust that their reaction to Quranic teachings actually signifies divinity?

>>2529545
/thread

>>2534921
Why does anyone fail a trial?

If Allah is omnipotent, and omniscient then should he not know exactly what trials will cause one to fail and what will not? Isn't he then damning those who fail to hell, having essentially created them for that purpose?

What do you mean by "free will"? Is this some method of choice-making not made by Allah? Is it the mind, has not Allah made this in all its components and knowing it exactly? If it is not the mind then what is its origins?

Also what is the origin of "sin" or "evil", does anything exist outside of Allah's creation?

>>2534921

He also hardens the hearts of the unbelievers so that they won't find salvation and will instead be burned forever. There is no freewill in islam, just a psychopath playing with his toys.

>>2535312
Allah doesnt control your every step, you're the one doing it and he is the one punishing if you fuck up.

>>2535315
How isn't there a free will?
I can choose myself if I want to take in drugs or not for example.

>>2535365

I argue there is no free will because ultimately some scenarios are outside of your control

For instance you did not create your mind, spirit, soul, or whatever mechanism it is that you "choose" with.

Ultimately, unless you have no beginning and brought yourself into creation, your are using something Allah made to "choose" (it would be more accurate to say that what Allah made has "chosen")

Ask yourself why you make any choice you make, and why for that reason, and ask how you ultimately controlled the entire process. (like what is my favorite color, red, why, my father bought me a red train, why, etc)

>>2535365
>>>2535315
>How isn't there a free will?
>I can choose myself if I want to take in drugs or not for example.

No according to the Koran you don't. Everything that happens is the explicit will of Allah, including the rejection of Islam by the unbelievers whom Allah has MADE to reject Islam, in order that he can have the pleasure of burning them.

>>2535371
Opinions on that differ desu.

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>>2529545
Fixed

Why is the qu'ran any more believable than the bible?
I'm genuinely curious how a book can convince someone to believe in a God.

Do you really treat women as badly as the propaganda says you do? Honour killings and all that jazz? And is that culture or religion or religion justifying the culture?

You know, people always go "Islam is the religion of peace"

Funny thing is I don't recall any Muslim ever saying that. Almost like the whole "religion of peace" narrative is something that people can bash the religion for

>>2535392
not a single one in Hungary, where most of the christian-islamic land battles of the 16-18th century have been fought?

>>2535392
"Reconquest" is not "Conquest"

>>2535418
Modern day Hungary is tiny and only the westernmost part of the Ottoman-era Hungary

>>2535420
By your logic Muslims could now invade Iberia and it wouldn't really be conquest.

I classify any movement of borders as conquest.

>>2535413
Family honor is importantbut I think it has more to do with eastern culture in general than islam itself.
Also while honor killings do happen I think more likely women would be disowned if they slutted it up.

>>2534445
bump for this

why dont you integrate
why is religion so important in the 21th century

if i was a devout christian and moved to an islamic country id be prosecuted or harrassed or worse while you expect equal rights or even more rights than locals

thats not rights, thats fucked up
and it makes this religion a backwards one

Some reasons why some people dislike Islam:

They disagree with slavery.

They disagree that sex with slaves should be allowed, if slaves are allowed at all.

They disagree with the death penalty, maiming, amputation or stoning.They believe in freedom of religion.

They disagree that Muslim men can marry Muslim women, Christian women and Jewish women, but Muslim women can only marry Muslim men.

They disagree that there should be any punishment for leaving the folds of Islam.

They disagree that women should be entitled to less inheritance than men.

They disagree that there is an expectation on men to be the main provider for the family.

They think 7th century traditions are largely incompatible with those of the 21st century.

They see lots of terror attacks being committed in the name of Islam.

They see that women have less rights than men in countries ruled under Islamic law such as Iran and Saudi Arabia, and they disagree with this.

They think open homosexuality is okay.

They disagree with child brides.

They think it's unfair a man may marry up to four women but a woman may only marry one man.

They think it's silly for thousands to protest against cartoons of a historical figure.

They think it's sick that people are murdered over cartoons of said historical figure and that hundreds of thousands of followers of Islam sign petitions against the drawing of cartoons of said historical figure just weeks after their slaughter.

Could you address these reasons why people might dislike islam?

>>>/pol/117478944
holy shit I literally used this image >>2535392 for a thread on /pol/ and that was all I had to do for a large response
/pol/ is such a fucking meme holy shit

>>2529525
Why won't "regular" islam clean up the mess of the "radical" islam? We would start to take you seriously if you wouldn't give green light for that insanity.

>>2536769
Because the only difference between "moderate" muslims and ISIS is impatience. Once the Caliphate is established, with a Caliph, the "moderate" muslims will be the same as the true muslims, the ones imitating Mohammad the closest. ISIS.

Or they will die at the hands of ISIS.

>>2532295
From the context, did you mean to say the Charlie Hebdo attacks were legitimate?

>>2529545
>ex muslim
>believing in Crusader LARP bait

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>>2529456
would you agree that multiculturalism in Europe is not working and the existence of extensive Muslim
immigration and settlement contributes more to radicalism to anything else.
im in a weird position i consider Islam a naturally violent religion, esp in its position in the world right ow but as an American i don't feel uncomfortable with Muslims entering my country but I'm uncomfortable with Europe being "cucked" to shit because i feel that it is the predominate home of the spirit of the west and her culture and i feel as though shit will go to fuck if europe gets "invaded any further"
>inb4 i fell for the /pol/ memes

>>2532472
I've heard that a lot of Christians have ended up joining the FSA lately also hezbulas appearance in helping assassination regime has pushed people over to support rebels

>>2536769
But they do

>>2538833
I'm not a Catholic so no.

But compared to what Mudslimes have done, the Crusades were nothing.

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>>2529456
would you ever fuck a 9 year old like muhammad did?
would you ever enslave people like muhammad did?
would you ever rape your slaves like muhammad did?

>>2535392
You forgot the northern crusades waged by the Teutonic order against the pagan baltics

>>2540124
Pagans aren't human

>>2529456
How do you justify Muslim Autistic screeching at Sex before marriage, while your own false prophet had sex with a Woman who he wasn't married to?

Why do Muslims think Sexual slavery is better than passionate, consensual fornication?

inb4
>not legitimate questions

>>2529466
Lotta loyalty for a hired wife

>>2536795
ISIS aren't real muslims. They instate whatever rules they want, disguising it as "the will of the prophet". They are hypocritical in many ways, and do not fight the Jihad the way it's supposed to be fought. They're gangsters, hiding behind the name of Islam. You can think Islam isn't peaceful, we don't mean for it to be, but please, don't confuse real muslims with fucking ISIS.

Does anyone know something about Ibadis and why noone is trying to exterminate them in the current sectarian conflict?
I mean, they're their own denomination but seem to just chill in Oman and do desert stuff while Sunnis and Shias murder each other everywhere.

>>2540170
There are a few chill sects that just stick to their own and don't disturb anyone else. Some sects don't even preach their teachings and shit.

>>2529456
Stop using the Turkish flag.
If Erdogan wins the referendum feel free to use it.

>>2540167
That's not accurate. They don't follow all of the Quran, that's true, but they follow the surahs of the Medinan period in absolute detail.
The idea that newer surahs are more relevant than older surahs has been around for quite some time, the same thinking was applied when talking about which monotheistic religion is the best (Islam is newer therefore better).

>>2536769
List of people fighting isis:
Sunni muslims
Shia muslims
Normal muslims
Again muslims
Muslims
List of people that are mainly targeted by Isis:
Muslims
Muslims
Muslims
Muslims
Yazidis
Muslims
Christians
And the people who speak against Isis are muslims the reason you cant see or hear it because its in fuckin Arabic even al Qaeda sees isis too fuckin extreme

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>>2539873
Read history you twat .. get away from fuckin internet articles

>>2529456
How difficult would it be to sneak a live pig into that area around the Kaaba?
What about a dead pig?
What about a small cut of pig meat?

>>2540219
They go against fundamental Islamic ethical teachings. Is the Medinan period the one where they became militaristic? If so, there are many misconceptions about the period, and ISIS certainly don't follow it to the letter. There's much evidence to support this.

>>2540170
Well because the fight is political , its obvious. In Oman all sects live peacefully and pray under the same dome. They care more about the ethics of Islam rather than political Islam , very wise Sultan and grand mufti

>>2535587
Reading a couple wikipedia articles about slavery in ancient times and slavery in islam will clarify this , secondly every one is concerned about Aishas age but no one knows who she was or what she did or how she was as prophets wife , I dont care how old she was because in Quran it is forbidden to marry amature girls that didnt reach puberty, description of Aisha at the time of marriage that she looked like mature women and grew up very fast , for me thats enough.

Do you think the Muslim world needs an equevelant of the Reformation and further down the line an Enlighentment and secularisation.

In general, do you think the Muslim world should follow the footsteps of Europe in historical pragmatic way? Or do you think that there's an alternate path they should travel?

t. genuine asker of questions

>>2529456
Draw a picture of Mohammed

>>2534445
Not OP
1. More than fifty percent. But not only arab calture however medieval calture(christian jewish persian) + arab calture + middle asian calture , basicly any calture that was under muslim rule left a huge fingerprint. Other negative views are mainly because of few hadiths (50 to120 hadiths from thousands) all written 200 to 600 years after prophets death.
2) no Caliphate since ottomans? Read the history of middle east for the past 250 years that will give you and idea, basicly politics, fabricated nationalisim, wars, the fact the arabs didnt devolop for 600 years is more than enough.
3) both logical and spirtual, read about God of Islam this should give you an example.
4) I struggle with the the fake teachings imposed on muslims. I struggle with salafists and ibn taymiyas thoughts. I struggle with fuckin saudi arabia

>>2540355
Country that mostly represent Islam , I give the grand prize to Oman

>>2540322
Islamic tradition needs reformation. The thing about muslims is that ijtihad stopped(not jihad,ijtihad basicly there are no new schools of thought) all teachings are from medieval era where there were two superpowers fighting each other , and some sick caliphs that wanted thousands of Jawari(women slaves in thier palaces) how do you do that? Well have a fatwa and make it part of religion . This a simple example. Hope this helps , ps: not OP

>>2532124
i'm not sure you answered his question: how do you reconcile the differences in morality encouraged by Islam with current trends? you say that the execution of war prisoners made sense at the time, so do you mean that we shouldn't do it today because it doesn't make sense anymore, and in general we should adapt islam's teachings to our context?

for example sharia doesn't fit with the secularism and morality in general of europe and america, should we change (or disregard) it?

sorry for my bad english

>>2540355
Thanks for responding

>no Caliphate since ottomans? Read the history of middle east for the past 250 years that will give you and idea, basicly politics, fabricated nationalisim, wars, the fact the arabs didnt devolop for 600 years is more than enough.

How come some country like Saudi Arabia hasnt done so?

> I struggle with the the fake teachings imposed on muslims. I struggle with salafists and ibn taymiyas thoughts.

Given how Islam is currently fairly decentralised how do you go about determining what teachings are real or fake?
>>2540359
>I give the grand prize to Oman

Does that have much to do with them being that strange ibadi sect?

>>2540295
>Is the Medinan period the one where they became militaristic?
Yes.
>and ISIS certainly don't follow it to the letter. There's much evidence to support this.
Got anything I could read on this? Everything I read seems to indicate that they follow the scripture of that specific period fairly well.
>They go against fundamental Islamic ethical teachings.
Depends on interpretation. The point of Salafism is the rejection of any interpretation the Uamar have come up with over the centuries.

>>2540310
I get your point but the conflict is not entirely political, as shown by the vigilanteism everywhere. But I guess if the different sects in Oman don't have grievances, they don't radicalize.

>>2540320
Ignoring the borderline insane apologetics for pedophilia you made concerning Aisha you ignored like 90 percent of the post

>>2540393
You are welcome
1) If you mean by caliphate imposing sharia law and making the country strictly islamic , saudia and gulf countries already doing that, However if we are talking about a true Caliphate in which muslim countries are under one rule, well its impossible there are too many differencies in sects and political views, no body outside saudi wants to be ruled by the house of saud or the hanbali or wahabi sect, everyone has his own view of caliphate, muslims mostly await for the supposed mahdi in the end of times, also house of saud are not really best friends with islam all they care for is money and power, not to mention the rule of western superpowers.(thats why you should go back to history all will be clear)
2) half the problem is solved if we drop the concept of naskh(Copying a rule from the Quran against other rule. Vast subject to talk about here)
Secondly dropping the hollyness of hadiths written along time after the prophet, and worst making new rules from them against the Quran such as stoning to death and killing apostates (mostly driven from jewish tradition) which condridict the Quran , the prophet forbided writing his sayings in fear that they be mixed with the quran, second caliph umar burned all records for prophets sayings, in more than one time the prophet said I left the quran as the only guidance for you. I see hadiths should be used for tibyan(explination) meaning of giving historical context for verses...ect.. and not adding to quran stuff from anywhere.
3) No Oman represents Islam by containing all muslim sects peacfully. Freedom of religion and abolishing nonsense said about the prophet in Sunni and Shia books. Kindship between people, respects for others, care for education , high morals and ethics.

>>2529456
Why is pretty much every muslim majority country complete and utter shit?

>>2540278
Would you ever fuck your cousin like Muhammad did?

>>2540410
>she was very mature for her age lol

>>2540471
>2) half the problem is solved if we drop the concept of naskh(Copying a rule from the Quran against other rule. Vast subject to talk about here)
Secondly dropping the hollyness of hadiths written along time after the prophet, and worst making new rules from them against the Quran such as stoning to death and killing apostates (mostly driven from jewish tradition) which condridict the Quran , the prophet forbided writing his sayings in fear that they be mixed with the quran, second caliph umar burned all records for prophets sayings, in more than one time the prophet said I left the quran as the only guidance for you. I see hadiths should be used for tibyan(explination) meaning of giving historical context for verses...ect.. and not adding to quran stuff from anywhere.
3) No Oman represents Islam by containing all muslim sects peacfully. Freedom of religion and abolishing nonsense said about the prophet in Sunni and Shia books. Kindship between people, respects for others, care for education , high morals and ethics.

Is there much chance of a return to that kind of Islam?

Would you see things like praying 5 times instead of 3 as something that would have to be ditched?

>>2529504
Isn't this because the bopk is a conversation? It is not a story, somebody is "literally" speaking to you (to the "recipient of the data). Not a "personal revelatipn". BAKA TBQH SENPAI

>>2540410
Well I can adress everything you mentioned , but there is no benefit for that, you can go to legitimate sources and study the subject , and then come back and ask specific questions I cant answer very branched subjects. For women rights, it is clear you didnt bother to read about the subject, for example, inheritance, women get half as man, but men are compelled to support the family and pay everything for her and her kids and no body can touch her money, if she wants to help then its like shes giving charity, if the man doesnt pay he is punished, so they become equal, also a woman should not do anything against her will, before islam women had nothing. Also women get dweries from their husbands for their own mostly gold and this still today.

>>2529525
You can find just as much justifications for genocide, rape and slavery in the Qu'ran as in the Old Testament. The Old Testament just likes it so much that they incorporated it into their stories.

>>2529542
Does this mean that God gave up on the Muslims when they lost Jerusalem? Your logic implies that he did.

>>2529545
"Demon possessed" lost interest there, buddy

>>2529551
That land belongs to neither the Jews or the Muslims. The Jews came to the "promised" land and same for the Muslims.

>>2540538
Wat

It was called the promised land because it was promised to a certain people.

Any idea who that was?

>>2540488
Inbreeding, anti-education culture, conservatism, corruption, piss poor work culture that makes millenials looks like automation

>>2529618
But all Muslim leaders opposing Sharia is a good thing. Not a bleak future. Check your priorities.

>>2540509
After reading your post on Aisha I would conclude that muslims are fucking insane, so you'll first have to address that concern. Also that was just a list that I picked up somewhere not my own.
Most of what I listed there are NOT up for discussion, they are not arguments but reasons. You can't pick out one part to try and discredit the whole thing.

Especially muslim hysteria is a problem, case in point this shit
https://www(dat)quora(dit)com/What-was-the-most-shameful-episode-in-your-countrys-history/answer/Ahsan-Khan-6/

>>2540507
Hopefully there is a Huge chance, I see it in 50 years. As an Arab my self, I see debates are rising among muslim scholars and the public is slowly rejecting those traditions, how ever there is also a huge amount of ignorance amongst people who try to supress reformation but its slowly going away.
I urge you to see (dr. Adnan Ibrahim) hope all his lectures are translated to english this guy is a phenomena, and scholars like him are rising everywhere around the muslim world. As for the prayers am impressed that you know about that detail. For me I hope not, praying five times meaning more mention of God, the number 5 is Sunnah motawatera(presistent sunnah passed through thousands to tens of thousands to millions ...ect in each generation).

>>2540540

The Akimamalites.

>>2540551
>Hopefully there is a Huge chance, I see it in 50 years. As an Arab my self, I see debates are rising among muslim scholars and the public is slowly rejecting those traditions, how ever there is also a huge amount of ignorance amongst people who try to supress reformation but its slowly going away.

How serious would the political implications be of this? Also with ISIS on the run do you think any other Muslim country could see a big reversion to "fundamentalism" like Iran and Afghanistan saw
>I urge you to see (dr. Adnan Ibrahim) hope all his lectures are translated to english this guy is a phenomena, and scholars like him are rising everywhere around the muslim world. As for the prayers am impressed that you know about that detail. For me I hope not, praying five times meaning more mention of God, the number 5 is Sunnah motawatera(presistent sunnah passed through thousands to tens of thousands to millions ...ect in each generation).

What I was trying to see there is the difference between the kind of Islam you are proposing and the Islam of the small and modern Quranists

>>2540547
1. About Aisha , I am not saying she was nine I am saying 90 percent of the facts about her conclude that she was mature at the time of her marraige.
2. My point is still valid , I just gave you an example of how you should research before you copy paste.
3. Muslim countries are in a fucked up state from a very long time , tell us something we dont know

>>2540547
Yeah these apologetics are really annoying.
He talks about reforming Islam but seeing the disgusting shit within his religion as beyond questioning is not very helpful.

>>2540604
1 is literally wrong though, only recently have apologists popped up trying to bump up her age before then it was perfectly OK, pretty telling 2bh
2 let me lay it out for you: these aren't arguments, these are all reasons average joes don't like islam. They might not necessarily be completely informed but they still need to be addressed.
Also there is a mathematical mistake in the Quran concerning inheritance, just so you know.
3 acknowledging that there is a problem is the first step, however all other issues with the culture-religion are responded too with apologetics rather than acknowledgement that something might be wrong.

>>2540587
I was talking about it within communities not countries, muslim countries are corrupted and fragile in every sense. The muslim brotherhood tried to take advantage of that in egypt but the people stood up against them, Isis is like any other jihadi group it will declinde and other groups will take its place, but it served as a good wake up call for muslims to seek reformation. It is risky to drop conclusions on the political arena but we cross our fingers and hope for the best.

Iam not Quranist in a sense that I dont reject hadith science , I am a Quranist in a sense where I derive my conclusions from Quran about the goals of Islam and Jihad with the help of hadiths in some cases.

>>2529456

When did it all start to go wrong?

>>2540661
When Muhammad decided to fuck a child and his cousin and to become an unhinged prophet of a retarded religion.

>>2540648
Well I am not apoligist , do I care about Aishas age? No, but I dont take that she was nine forgranted and no body should , my grandmother was married when she was 14 and others at 12 , do I find it wrong just because you do? No , I have my reasons and your calture has its reasons.
2. I wouldnt take average joes and debate them , I dont care what they think, I am here because I know there are smart people to talk to and to share my point of view.
3. Well I encourage you to read and listen to debates happenning in the muslim world not the west , ps: since when explaining your religion makes you apologist. Basicly I dont care what you believe about my religion , but dont shove it down my throat like I dont know what it is. Funny how you want 1.8 billion people to be like isis despite their noses. I have been studying history and islam for years now , unless you know half the shit I know I suggest you to leave your comments in pol and youtube videos

>>2540729
Don't get defensive because I asked for acknowledgement that there is a problem, don't call me /pol/ either since it was you who brought up aisha not me. I don't know what the heck your stream of consciousness at the end was about but it sure as hell wasn't about me.
My personal main concern is the lasting hysteria in the muslim population, it doesn't seem to go away or be pacified, all the moral qualms are secondary.

>>2529456

Are muslims aware of the Kaaba's pagan origins?

>>2540775
Good to hear that , if you wanted
acknowledgment , yes there is a huge problem , but spreading hatred wont solve it , trust me when I say that the muslim community is going for a better future, all the crap going on will clean it self

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What's with the destruction of ancient artifacts? Literally no one believes in these gods anymore, so how is it idolatry?

>>2540804
I dont think extremists are quite the same as op.

>>2540801
You can practise your culture and law in your countries that's fine by me, but you will have to live with the consequences. But in the end what really needs to be eliminated are practises in muslim countries that limit literacy, allow autocratic regimes to come to power, decrease competitiveness and innovation. The root causes need to be found but it's just that people think that islam may be a contributor to these issues(especially concerning female education) or that islam is easily used by autocracies to create a nationalist or pro regime narrative that riles them up against the west.
All of this contributes to hysteria.

>>2540816

Your point being?

Another question, if you're American, how do you and your family feel about Trump's bans?

>>2540826
True no objection by me. Islam is used to supress and opress people and to use them as herds. But on the other hand islam can be used to trigger the civilization to imerge, people are working on that, just give it time

>>2529636
Bullshit
Anything Muslims do is mandated. Anything they don't is outlawed. I don't believe this shit for a second except maybe Mecca. It's Sharia mandated Disneyland

>>2531185
If you are a religion of justice then be just and keep it to yourselves. Do not tread on my life and I won't dare to do the same to you. But if muslims think they can continue to force their religion and way of life upon the rest of the world there will be continued bloodshed. And rightfully so