ITT: People who were right all along but nobody listened >In

>>2503818
Nah. An Italy that openly allies with the UK gets invaded by Hitler when the Western Allies are too weak to do anything about it.

Allies could've used Italy as a base for European operations rather than having to invade it or do D-Day. Italy could've stayed neutral until the allies were ready too, just in case the Germans were prepared to cross the alps.

shame he died in ein [[[unfall]]]

>>2503884
>gets invaded by Hitler
That is actually probably not something Hitler could have won quickly in 1939/40. Geographically speaking Italy is a mess to operate in and an aggressive unsympathetic foreign invader would have galvanized Italian military and civil resistance.

It would have turned into a quagmire with Italian and British Colonial troops frustrating every German attack with endless defensive lines. Essentially what the germs did to the allies but in reverse.


Would have actually liked to have seen that.

>>2503960
>That is actually probably not something Hitler could have won quickly in 1939/40. Geographically speaking Italy is a mess to operate in and an aggressive unsympathetic foreign invader would have galvanized Italian military and civil resistance.

I'm hardly sure of that. I mean, historically, when the British and Americans invaded, the Italian government collapsed before the Allies even got onto the mainland. And you have a far greater concentration of population and industry up north.

Obviously, I can't be certain, but I think the government folding after a short amount of pressure, especially if this is shortly afterwards the attack on France historically, is a reasonably likely outcome.

Now yes, a British force entrenched in would be difficult to dislodge, but in late 1940, the British only have about 30 active divisions, and you'd need about 20 of those to hold a line in Italy if the 1943 campaign was anything to go by, which leaves them awfully bare for well, everywhere else like the defense of the home island and such.

>>2503967

Yeah but what about Italian divisions in the alps, much harder for blitzkreig and gives time for British or even French/Polish armies in exile.

>>2504005

The Germans would still enjoy an overwhelming air advantage. And given the rather lackluster performance against Greece in late 1940, as well as the need to demobilize large segments of the army to bring in the harvest, I'm really not holding out a lot of hope for Italy even if they do show teeth. Yes, the mountains will be a significant barrier, but the Wehrmacht is hardly all mechanized, and that doesn't affect the low levels of discipline, training, or troop commitment to their own officer corps.

Plus, I'm still reasonably certain they'd knuckle under rather than fight to the last.

>>2503967
The difference is both the government and the people knew they weren't being conquered. Before an invasion of Italy you'd at least have Norway, Poland, Denmark, Luxembourg, Belgium, Netherlands and lets not forget the annexation of the whole of fucking Austria.

If the Wehrmacht rolled into northern Italy your average citizen and promotion seeking government official could be sure they had only Germany's interest and conquest in mind. This should completely silence any antiwar sentiment and put people firmly behind Mussolini. Maybe even serve to motivate the Italian officer corps to not suck quite so hard.

>>2503818
indeed he was killed by ff in Tobruch

File: Ferdinand_Foch_pre_1915.jpg (73KB, 435x625px) Image search: [Google]

73KB, 435x625px

If only they listened to him at Versailles...

>>2503818

imagine what could have been if he and Strasser took over

idiots, the time of cross ideology alliance or even allowing different ideologies to exist as governments ended in 1939 and was confirmed by the cold war.

>>2505790
>1939 and was confirmed by the cold war.

>the communisnt outright declare ideological war on anyone that isnt them

It was all their fault. Start shit,get hit.

>>2503967
>>2503960

The Brits hardly had the necessary ressources to fully commit in Italy. Also they would have probably lacked the political will.

Also the germans could have attacked through southern france and France made the same mistake of overestimating the defensive value of mountains.

Sure the alps are a different Story but Italy is even more of a mess than France. The army was underquipped to a drastic degree and i hardly doubt they would be able to stomach the losses of the germans attacking through the alps and southern france with overwhelming air superiority (possibly from yugoslavia too).

Italy industrial Centers are in the north so they are easily reached by the Luftwaffe and there is no real strategic depth to defend them.

Italian morale probably wouldn't have been much higher. There was a deep distrust towards the brits because Italy felt cheated because the territorial gains of WW1 were rather small. On the other hand there were ideological bounds with the germans. Italian fascism wasn't a monolithic ideology and a lot of factions would have supported the germans. I actually think the germans would have had a lot of highly motivated HiWis and collaborateurs in the event of a german italian war.

>>2503960
Also people tend to overestimate GB on this board.

Dunkirk saved a ton of troops but equipment etc. had to be replaced. GB simply was unable to stage a major intervention again in 1940.