When was atheism hijacked and stopped being about science and

How dare you post a picture of prophet Dawkins (science be upon him) while criticizing his dogmas?

>>2399151
even he hates the modern atheist movement, because they are about gender and race issues and idiotic christian bashing

>I am non-religious
It's the same thing as the atheism dumbass.

it's because atheism by definition is a reactionary stance. it's sort of like identifying yourself as a unicorn-denier. why do such a thing in the first place? it just stems from a lack of philosophical terminology education, most people who say they are "atheist" have a more complex view of existence than that and don't necessarily realize it.

usually people who are atheists more accurately fall into the realm of moral relativists, absurdists, non-cognitivists, or phenomenologists.

>>2399147

>stopped being about science and philosophy

New Atheism was the first to introduce the science/religion false dichotomy

>>2399204
that dichotomy is neither new nor false

>>2399204
but religion by definition makes unfalsifiable claims, seeks absolute truths instead of consistencies, and derives claims outside of utilizing the scientific method.

>>2399186
No it isn't dumbass. Autism is a stance worldview, and non-religious is a practical stance. I may believe in God and the supernatural in general without practicing any religion. Many. People are like that.

>>2399333
>autism
i mean atheism. Freudian slip...

>stance world view
I mean philosophical stance, or worldview, as opposed to non-religious which just means you don't practice any form of religion.

new atheism has been a popsci cancer from the start

>>2399147
responsibly experiment with entheogens and meditation OP. You'll find your current worldview laughable

>>2399161
i thought he's the one who popularized christian bashing in the mid noughties

>>2399364
that applies to anyone who doesn't have a thorough philosophical and anthropological education that hasn't done psychedelics before.

>>2399373
He thought it was about atheism until he dared to criticize the diverse and peaceful religion of Islam. Then his libshit fans turned on him. It was all about bashing Christianity and forwarding the liberal agenda.

2012 when Freethought Blogs and Atheism+ was created. That marked the end of the old group atheist YouTubers making fun of creationists while using it as an excuse to teach science.

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>>2399382

Yep. Its painfully obvious atheism and "rationalism" in general were hijacked by post-modernists, SJWs and Liberals. You only have to read the first paragraph of the rationalwiki entry on Thunderf00t to know that. Its all about Muslims and diversity, none of them cared when he was Christbashing.

http://rationalwiki.org/wiki/Thunderf00t

>>2399393
>Tfw when I'm unironically a sjw, postmodernist and atheist.
I do feel like we get unfairly bashed all the time while alt right white nationalist deus vult people get a pass cause it's 'different' and cool to be contrarian. They've even adopted the dapper look to make it look more aesthetic and people fall for it.

>>2399485
Well mate, when you support Islam (despite being an athiest) its pretty hard not to mock you.

>>2399485

The alt-right are SJWs and Post-modernists, just right wing ones. They're certainly not modernists.

>>2399485
>I do feel like we get unfairly bashed all the time while alt right white nationalist deus vult people get a pass cause it's 'different' and cool to be contrarian.
if you think this it's because you get more exposure to 4chan than normie stuff. it's the opposite on the surface world, outside of our subterranean lair.

Honestly Russell is where atheism went all to shit. Before him people like Santayana were doing materialist philosophy that included things like aesthetics, religion, history, as well as science. Hell, Ingersoll was fiery but was still steeped in classical learning.
Russell was a good logician but a shit philosopher and he's the one influencing the new atheist movement the most it seems.

>>2399485
Well when the group you are part of makes statements like 'all white people are racists an all men are sexist. No matter how they act or behave.'
You are bound to get mocked and have shit thrown at you.

>>2399147
When the card-carrying fedoras cared more about the "status" it gave them instead of questioning existence, inherited morality, and other existential shit.

When people ask i just say i dont' care, because i literally don't care anymore. When people want to discuss philosophy or science my personal feelings on the subjects don't matter, on the position i'm arguing from. Which changes every day.

>>2399485
Omg SJW are being oppressed! SJW visibility now!

>>2399485
>>>/reddit/

>>2399147

Atheism can't really be "about" anything other than a lack of belief in god(s). It's just a description for someone that lacks belief.

I prefer non-religious to atheist as well. Although I don't mind being called an atheist and don't mind describing myself as one it's a word that doesn't really need to exist. We don't have special words for people that don't believe in dragons or astrology

>>2399488

>altright
>sjw

horseshit theory yet again.

Also, they're absolutely modernists.

>>2399147
>When was atheism hijacked and stopped being about science and philosophy?

Atheism has never been about science or philosophy.

It is merely the rejection of a claim "God exists" that hasn't been proven.

>>2399488
>Le x is y because my asshole says it is
Fuck off and join your SJW friend on >>>/reddit/

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>>2399549

>they're absolutely modernists.

Bollocks, modernists aren't nativist. The Alt-right are litrally the opposite side to the coin intersectionalists who believe society is built to keep minorities out of power because whites are the majority and own all the institutions and therefore the metanarrative. The Alt-right agree and want to keep things this way because if minorities have power, then they don't, hence why the term "cuck" exists: giving up your own power so minorities can lord over you with it.

>>2399555

>Fuck off and join your SJW friend on >>>/reddit/

After you faggot.

>>2399161
i bash pisslam

If you truly give a fuck about the differences among "atheism," "antitheism," "agnosticism," or any other various term for non-believers, you have the 'tism.

It's just labels that believers can use on non believers. Who gives a fuck?

>>2399310
The same can be said of philosophy and political ideology

>>2399562

>Bollocks, modernists aren't nativist.

Nationalism is literally a product of modernity, what the fuck are you talking about.

It's all tribalism and identity crisis to sell books. Just like religion and politics.
Only honest introspection and self-discipline can protect you from meme warfare.

>>2399719

Nationalism not nativism. Also, that was enlightenment, not modernity.

>>2399705

This.

>>2399487
Not him, but why is it "supporting Islam" to point out that American and Indonesian Muslims are way less violent than their Christian peers and that most of the problems afflicting the middle east are related to realpolitik, with religion acting as a recruiting mechanism for unscrupulous power players, and that supporting exclusionary tactics only increases the risk of radicalizing a native-born.

That's not "pro" Islam, it's "anti-mingling of church and state" regardless of the church, or the state.

Atheism has never been about science and philosophy, it's always been about autistic rebellion.
>>2399310
Why are any of those things good? Bad philosophy is bad philosophy, and science is just that.
>and derives claims outside of utilizing the scientific method.
So does science, such as: 'fallibility is good' 'consistency is good' 'there is an ordered universe' 'the universe can be known' 'the scientific method is valid' and so on.
>>2399386
>free thought\
>do NOT question le science!!!
>do NOT question le normative ethics!!!
>>2399541
>i dont matter because le empiricist me-me

>>2399861
is this bait

>>2399547
Back to ribbit, you belong there
>hurr dragons and astrology and god rnt reel because my ideology sais so
>>2399554
That's a philosophical stance, a horseshit one though.
>>2399705
You are a believer though, just a believer in humanist nonsense.
>>2399834
>"anti-mingling of church and state"
muh church and state is bad because ribbit said so and i believe what they say
>>2399866
>anything i dont like must be le 'bait' meme!

>>2399869
>muh church and state is bad because ribbit said so and i believe what they say
Try Thomas Jefferson, and he said that specifically because the United States was founded by refugees fleeing sectarian violence in England.

It holds true no matter which culture or people you talk about: when you mix politics and religion, the result is a quagmire like what Europe had in the early modern era or what we have right now in the middle east: repressive theocracies and unscrupulous power players whipping people up into a violent religious frenzy.

>>2399869

Jesus Christ, son.

You're barely literate.

>>2399883
>thomas jefferson said so so it must be true IM A FREE THINKER BUT I UNQUESTIONINGLY ACCEPT WHAT THIS PERSON SAID
>>2399884
Wow epic, people I DISLIKE must be ILLITERATE

>>2399883
>when you mix politics and religion, the result is a quagmire
That's what happens when you mix politics with anything.

>>2399889

No. People typing garbled Chinglish are barely literate.

>>2399898
This isn't Chinglish you dip. If you think that, you must be yourself illiterate.

oh no this FUCKING WHITE MALE is typing in a way that isn't le classy like the way us fedora-wearing dapper atheist lads type (despite you thinking 'no' alone is a fucking valid sentence).

Oh sure, I'm the illiterate one here. Don't you have some bad poetry to have critiqued? don't worry, you might improve at some point (meanwhile, I am at least published.)

>>2399924

>ching chong ching choo

>>2399889
>>thomas jefferson said so so it must be true IM A FREE THINKER BUT I UNQUESTIONINGLY ACCEPT WHAT THIS PERSON SAID
Yes, why should I question the lessons learned from one of the key founders of the world's oldest continuously existing regime. I should spend more time on /pol/ learning from true nation builders.

>>2399895
Works that way with secular ideology such as Communism, as well. As soon as you shackle a society to an ideal it tears itself to pieces trying to decide what that ideal actually is

>>2399889
>>2399869
>>2399861

I am smart and you are stupid.
Therefore things that I like must be good things, and things that you like must be bad things.
If you argue with me it just proves how irredeemably bad you are as a person.

>>2399869
Humanism is less nonsense than theism, considering I'm a human and am using humanism to try to come to a common understanding with other humans. It makes sense to place humanity as a core principle of this understanding, considering we share humanity in common, human reason and human agency.

I don't use humanism to try and come to an understanding with a dog or a cat I keep as a house pet or a t-rex trying to eat me.

>>2399931
he said so so he must be write haha im a free thinker but unquestioningly accept what people say after all i dont want to look stupid haha he founded it so he must clearly be the reason why it is still living (even though it barely is)

>As soon as you shackle a society to an ideal it tears itself to pieces trying to decide what that ideal actually is
Burgerland is attached to a few dozen ideals you fucking moron.
>>2399944
ANYTHING I DISLIKE MUST BE NONSENSE
HUMANISM IS GOOD BECAUSE *NON SEQUITUR*
HAHA HUMAN NATURE EXISTS BECAUSE I SAID IT DOES WERE ALL ONE RACE EXCEPT EVIL WHITE PEOPLE

>>2399944
Humanism is literally just the fumes of Christianity.

It'll soon be deconstructed, and you're seeing it already in the postmodernist/poststructuralist crowd. For them humanism is simply another construction of white male capitalistic society.

>>2399953
>he said so so he must be write haha im a free thinker but unquestioningly accept
You see, this shit right here is exactly what makes people think atheists are flaming faggots. You don't actually have an argument to come back with so you shitpost

>Burgerland is attached to a few dozen ideals you fucking moron.
Including the ideal which says that we shouldn't let ideals take over our government, eurotrash

>>2399966
>arguments are good
Nice freudian slip though.
>Including the ideal which says that we shouldn't let ideals take over our government, eurotrash
wow epin everybody i dislike must be EUROPEAN
EUROPE SUCKS, FUCKING.WHITE.MALES

American government is solely based upon meme ideals.

>>2399966
wait are you the same /pol/ guy or the other one
i can't tell who is who this thread is splintering

>>2399976
Again, like a slippery weasel you systematically shield your own beliefs from criticism while thinking that mocking and ridicule constitute convincing substance

>>arguments are good
Go back to /pol/ or reddit if you need a hugbox

>>2399976
that european powers copied shamelessly

>>2399981
I'm definitely not the /pol/ guy, just the guy arguing that atheists don't need to all be shit-flinging Islamophobes if they're willing to study to nuances of geopolitics in the middle east

>>2399985
>le arguments are good
>le substance is le good
Is a hugbox.
>>2399988
Moving goalposts.

>>2399998
>Is a hugbox
Post a counter-point or GTFO because all you're doing at this point is shitposting

>>2400006
Why? because not doing so triggers you? Go be 12 on /b/.

>>2399147
Atheism was never "about" anything you either believe in gods or don't

The fact that a bunch of people tried to gather together over their shared lack of commonality and establish rules to govern this absence was never anything other than a ridiculous farce.

>>2400017
Better than having to deal with /pol/ acting like a 12 year old on /his/ desu.

>>2400037
>The fact that a bunch of people tried to gather together over their shared lack of commonality and establish rules to govern this absence was never anything other than a ridiculous farce.

In fairness, Dawkins has never done anything along those lines.

>>2400017
>Why? because not doing so triggers you? Go be 12 on /b/.
No, because maybe I actually want to hear a counter-argument and subject my own beliefs to a stress test so that they might be strengthen or improved by the increased perspective, but in order for me to actually be convinced they have to be grounded in logic and factual evidence and not just personal attacks.

If all I wanted to do is shitpost all day, then /b/ is where I would go, and maybe where you should return to if you if this board is too challenging for you

>>2400048
I'm not from /pol/, you certainly are though.
>>2400055
>this is good because le annoying greek pedophile said so
>logic and fact exist and are good because i said so

>>2399545
Reddit is toxic it's full of too many mgtow and mra's.

>>2399333
>I believe in god and the supernatural but I ignore it
So you are even dumber than a the typical religious theist?

>>2400119
people i dont like are le stoopid lol

>>2400155
Dumb and stupid are two different things.

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>>2400155
>I believe god, hell and magic exists but I'm going to continue my mundane life : ^)
How do you function?

>>2400172
Compartmentalization, or more likely, he just SAYS he believes in whatever because of groupthink.

>>2400172
I'm not him you redditor.

>>2400183
People I dont like are ruddit lul

>>2400177
Atheists are the champions of group think though.

Atheism was never about science nor philosophy.
Science is about peeking.
Philosophy is about pondering.
Atheism is denying and throwing a tantrum.

>>2400192
The vast majority of atheists are not members of any group or organisation, I think you have a hard time telling reality from the internet.

>>2399147
>mfw I unironically fell for the Dawkins, Hitchens, and Harris meme
>mfw I got out of it by the skin of my teeth

>>2400216
>reality
Doesn't exist.
>The vast majority of atheists are not members of any group or organisation
Entirely false, I don't think you understand what 'group think' is either.

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>>2400259
>reality doesn't exist
I KNEW IT
It's all just a dream...

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>>2399364
>>2399377
>DUDE, these hallucinatory chemicals will make you see the world for what it truly is!

>>2400271
I never said that I existed either. Reality doesn't exist because it's an ideology attached onto existence.

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>>2399713
while what you say is true about political ideology, it is not necessarily true about philosophy. there are ways to objectify the universe within a first-person perspective.

>>2399861
I never said anything good or bad about religion or science, I just explained the difference between religion and science. that being said, you're fooling yourself if you think consistency is phenomenologically unobservable. basically what you're saying boils down to "I have the knowledge that knowledge is unobtainable", a stillborn stance.

>>2400275
the only thing hallucinogens do with consistency is alter your perception of reality. if you have never viewed reality through an alternative perspective, this will be an alarming and life-changing experience for you no matter what you are.

>>2400280

This.

How can mirrors be real if our eyes aren't real?

>>2399147
Atheism never was about science and philosophy for fucks sake. It was anti-clerical from it's beggining, peaking at Marxist revolutions in early 20th century and it stopped being an ideological stance by late 20th century.

>>2399834
Ah the old "its the fault of the US/Soviets/Brits that the middle east is a violent shithole"
The middle east has had arbitrary borders and massive imperial meddling since the founding of Islam and the Umayyad Caliphate.
In addition, Islam has never been reformed, and the adherents of each sect claim to practice Islam in its purest form and as it was practiced during the time of Mohammed. This leads to prevalent beliefs in the Middle East (that are codified as law in almost every country) of less rights for women, death for homosexuals and apostates, and torture for minor offences.
When you line up the codes that the stricter sects of Sunni Islam follow and those that ISIS follow, they are actually very similar.

>>2400259
>Entirely false
Prove it

>>2400295
Knowledge doesn't exist.

How can one objectify what isn't objective? Fuck off you epistemologically non-standing twat.