How native peoples were able to live in the perfect harmony with

>> Harmony

Not really. The h/g groups had complex understandings of "nature", but they weren't ecophilosophers or anything like that.

>he fell for the magic native meme

>>1815566
>Perfect harmony with nature
Top zozzle. Natives on the East Coast were considered the backwater in terms of all of the natives in the Americas. Natives had trade and war. A good example of this is The Mississippian Native culture. To imply the concept of the noble savage is not only undermining the intelligence of the natives, but also overselling their kindness. Their connection with nature derives from a religion that dealt with shamanistic customs.

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History is full of examples of population collapse due to native people's breaching the carrying capacity of their environs. The new world is especially rife with examples of collapsed proto-empires due to the inability of agriculture to straddle the line between providing enough to ensure social stability and being sustainable enough to weather climate shifts and freak events like floods or droughts. The idea of the noble savage is ridiculous. Just as now, the stability of a civilization is intimately linked to it's ability to navigate population densities and resource utilization.

Though I have seen a lot of conflicting historical data and postulates regarding it, a prime example is the collapse of the Polynesian culture on Easter Island. They managed to crash this plane with no survivors just fine with just stone tools being used to clear land.

>>1815566
> go to amazon jungle
> give the natives some chainsaws
> sit and watch

>>1815566
It's ironic that people act as though the lack of education on Natives is hiding their peace.

Look up moundbuilder(Mississippian) culture. Pretty much an offshoot of Aztecs that came and conquered.and killed and sacrificed into the US south.

Athabaskans from Pacific Northwest invaded the Colorado Plateau and surrounding areas not 600 years ago. Where they conquered and killed the Zumic and Hopi tribes previous to them.

We all know Mayans and Aztecs, and to a degree Inca.

Stfu with this 20th century humanitarian bullshit.

We are all human and we all kill.

My theory is that somewhere along the line the Eurocentric romantic process simply became very materialistic oriented thereby leading to a culture and society that accepted greed and douchbaggery as the norm.

>>1815919
>"Peaceful First Nations peoples"
>The scalps of slaughtered British soldiers left hanging from the trees and bushes as the French and their Indian allies retreated from the Battle of the Plains of Abraham

Some people just aren't content with acknowledging that the aboriginals were equally as capable of hardcore brutality

>>1818803
based, anglos btfo
>tfw ill never get to scalp a brit with my new indian bros

>>1815566
If you time travel to 12,000 B.C in Europe you would see us whiteys living in Harmony with European nature, news flash living in harmony with nature is a cute way to say your a primitive moron who hasnt advanced beyond a neolithic state of society.

Also ruining the earth is a meme this planet suffered a catacylsm that makes global warming look like a joke, the Siberian flats flood basalt eruption that caused the largest mass extinction in history.

>>1815566
They didfnt

>>1819266
holy shit actual people like this exist

>>1819424
Fuck off back to /co/ leftist shit.

>>1819441
umm no, that's rude btw..

>>1815566
No

anyone who believe civilization is a good thing haven't read enough Huxley and Terence Mckenna.

>>1819457
>literally going RUDE
What the fuck are you a teenage girl in America? Fuck off kid.

>>1819476
INSULTING ME DOES NOT MAKE YOU "COOL" YOU MEANIE

>>1819471

I've read Huxley. I also grew up in a New Mexico 'town' so poor that the water was not approved for drinking.

Huxley should have let Steinbeck show him around poverty in the rural southwest. Then he might have appreciated the good with the bad that industrialized civilation brings.

>>1819503
that's an exact result of industrialization in the framework of a capitalist society, while the bourgeois enjoy their parties and entertainment you have unclear water, this is what Huxley is talking about you only emphasized his point.

>>1819424
he's right you hippie

>>1819515

Please explain how the bourgeois back east ruined the water in that valley in New Mexico, when said water was never fit to drink to begin with.

It was a shit hole because industry never developed there beyond pistachios. No civil planning, no water treatment, no tax base. It had nothing to do with the distracted masses or exploitation.

Whether you intended or not, your post reads as if you expect every ill in our society was planned by a moustache twirling capatalist.

>>1819266
Except the Indians weren't living in harmony with nature, they transformed it to suit their society. The Amazon itself is believed to have been in a process of being terraformed before Eurasian diseases brought an end to those societies.

"Rather than domesticate animals for meat, Indians retooled ecosystems to encourage elk, deer, and bear. Constant burning of undergrowth increased the numbers of herbivores, the predators that fed upon them, and the people who ate them both. Rather than the thick, unbroken monumental snarl of trees imagined by Thoreau, the great eastern forest was an ecological kaleidoscope of garden plots, blackberry rambles, pine barrens, and spacious groves of chestnut, hickory, and oak... Incredible to imagine today, bison occurred from New York to Georgia. A creature of the prairie, Bison bison was imported to the East by Native Americans along a path of indigenous fire, as they changed enough forest into fallows for it to survive far outside its original range. When the Haudenosaunee hunted these animals, the historian William Cronon observed, they

'were harvesting a foodstuff which they had consciously been instrumental in creating. Few English observers could have realized this. People accustomed to keeping domesticated animals lacked the conceptual tools to recognize that the Indians were practicing a more distant kind of husbandry of their own.'

... Carrying their flints and torches, Native Americans were living in balance with Nature---but they had their thumbs on the scale. Shaped for their comfort and convenience, the American landscape had come to fit their lives like comfortable clothing. It was a highly successful and stable system, if "stable" is the appropriate word for a regime that involves routinely enshrouding miles of countryside in smoke and ash..." - Charles Mann, "1491: New Revelations of the Americas Before Columbus"

Why do we keep having these threads where the OP says some stupid shit that he obviously doesn't actually believe and everyone responds as if he's serious?

You obviously know it's bait, you've been browsing this board for more than five minutes.

>>1819699
Sounds Ike y'all just some low IQ motherfuckers

>>1819699
1/2
resources are limited, their distribution is being managed by the people who manufacture it, clean water isn't scarce in most geographical landscapes, in a society who works with a reasonable resource management system you would get your clean water from where it actually is, the people who "hold rights" to those water whether it is govermental or privately owned.
you're describing a settlement which depends on and requires civilization's surplus for geographical and technological reasons, and because civilization does not work as well as it should you are left with insufficient wealth.
now there are roughly two states in which a human society can exist:

1.society which is built upon a state framework
2.pre agricultural revolution society which is based on a community and a hunter-gatherer economy

if it is governed by a state (no matter if monarchist democratic republic etc) than, assuming we are discussing what is better, or in other words that which is the good, than of course the governing institution should provide its governed people the required resources it consumes and use, that being achieved by precise planing of resource distribution which distribute at least the minimal standard required for each citizen to exist in what we consider "sufficient wealth to live well",
if this process does not happen, which it never does since the beginning of civilization, classes are formed which divide the citizens,
1.those who live extremely wealthy life full of leisure
2.people who don't have as much leisure but enjoy sufficient wealth
3.people who live in a state of insufficient wealth
with 2 and 3 are usually fluctuating between themselves

>>1820202
your mentioned environmental situation emphasizes the flaws of a capitalist society which manufacture resources through industrialization but does not distribute them sufficiently to a reasonable standard,
as an intelligent citizen of said state you should of course blame those who are responsible for the managing of the environment you exist in which directly corresponds to your wealth, and they are of course capitalists who hold more wealth then they should and the government which enables them to exist and supports them, they do not care about the state in which you live, nor the state any sort environment decline to at the expense of their increasing wealth and power,

this is the climax civilization arrived at and with the bourgeoisie ever increasing control over populace and other environmental variables to a point in which today it seems to be almost completely impossible to overthrow the current socio-economic system, the negative implications of said system I only touched slightly in this post as they are varied and far reaching, now the point is not that we should now "devolve" back to pre-civilized society as it seems completely undoable, and also inappropriate for the modern homo sapien to exist in, but rather that current modern western civilization is not good enough, not for the environment,and definitely not for human beings.

>>1819673
you're a hippy you

>>1819812
Because it makes for an ebin screencap to make libtards/conservashits look bad.

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>>1815566
wasted dubs

>>1819735
Pretty smart but hunter gathering is inefficient compared to agriculture.

Were the Sioux a peaceful tribe before the Europeans came or is that just a meme? Genuinely curious and this seems like a good thread to ask.

>>1815965
>yfw they use them as weapons instead of tools
>>1815566
>le noble sabage

>>1819483
>(insert bait meme here)

>>1815566
Nice meme kid.

>>1821365
Any truly peaceful tribe would have been wiped out by fiercer neighbors, like those one Pacific Islanders when the Maori came to their island.

>>1821873
>>1821365

The Sioux were primitive hunter-gatherers up in the subarctic tundra. It was the horse that made them a power, and they used the horse to literally genocide the peaceful farmer indians of the plains.

>>1815932

i would like to postulate a new law of societal development

>as time passes, the probability that a social system will be coopted, undermined and eventually destroyed by retards will tend toward 1

never underestimate the capacity of huans to fuck things up. "to err is human" indeed.

>>1819873

I agree. That's why I moved away to where there was a more better access to resources.

You know, civilization.

>>1820206

> Blame those who are responsible for the managing of the environment you exist in

Or, just change my environment to one which is more efficient at supporting a higher standard of living. At a certain point, you have to realize that some places are just harder to inhabit than others.

> This is the climax civilization

We'll see.