Why is Hitler remember as the ultimate evil when Josef Stalin,

Fuck you

>>1764356
you seem upset

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>stalin killed 60 million people
>somehow this massive population shortage immediately made the soviet onion stronger which allowed it to engage in a cold war with the west long after stalin had died.

>>1764342
Nazi ideology and the threat Hitler posed were far more blatant than Stalinized Soviet communism. Today people like to downplay Hitler but that regime was freakishly genocidal in principle whereas early Soviet communism was more selective purging.

But anyone with a brain understands how evil and destructive the early Soviet and Chinese communists were.

Because if you say Stalin (and the communists as a whole) are bad, you automatically get called a nazi, a fascist and an anti-semite.

>but anon, how could stalin be bad if he fought hitler???

>>1764342
>innocent deaths

kulak detected

>>1764363
Got mad nostalgia from this image. I want to play paper mario now

>>1764342
You can criticize both, you know.

But the reason that Hitler gets much more attention is because in American culture he's pretty much the villain of WW2. Also the holocaust has been given a lot more attention and is more "memorable" than political purges and bad agricultural policies.

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>>1764342
I don't know anon. Why do YOU think?

Stalin didn't have a completely autistic ideology

>>1764342
Hitler was more isolationist. Merchant societies hate isolationism

>>1764342
>Why does the Holodomor genocide
>genocide
Genocide, as the term is mostly used, requires intentionality. The Soviets didn't want the Ukrainians to be exterminated, they didn't even want them to starve, and even if they did: It wouldn't be on the same level as the industrialized mass exterminations we had seen in the Holocaust.

>>1764342
>Why is Hitler remember as the ultimate evil when Josef Stalin, who existed in the same time period, was responsible for millions more innocent deaths

the answer lies in the question.

stalin murdering monsterous bastard that he was didnt kill as many as hitler and certainly not in such a relatively brief spree as Hitler.

also Stalins score was the total he had killed (and often includes death through incompetence as well as intent) and covers a period up until he died of natural causes.

Hitlers total is the total he managed before he was stopped and would have been significantly higher if he hadnt been defeated, Hitler killed more than stalin, in a shorter time and would have killed many more if outside interference hadnt prevented him from doing so

>>1764342
Hitler sperging out and causing the second world war is what led to Communism sweeping up eastern Europe

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>>1764342
>Why does mainstream media take the spotlight away from this Soviet murderer?
It doesn't.
Communist symbolism is even banned in some Eastern European countries along with the Swastika. Stalin is widely remembered in history as a mass murderer and the Holodomor is officially recognized as a genocide in over 20 countries.

I don't know what shithole backwater you live in but I was taught all about the unsavory aspects of his rule as part of my IGCSE education.

Take your retarded /pol/tard victimization back there.

>>1764342
They were both horrible, but Stalin was not "responsible for millions more innocent deaths". I don't know where people get this stuff. The most credible estimates for Stalin's death counts are about 20 million. Hitler killed more than that. It isn't just 6 million Jews, but
>an 11 million total for the Holocaust
>plus 3 million Soviet POWs deliberately starved
>plus however many millions of civilians deliberately killed by Germans in war crimes (thousands of villages of destroyed across the East, shooting 100 civilians for every German soldier killed by partisans in Yugoslavia)
>plus millions killed by famine in Eastern Europe, Greece, and the Netherlands because of German policies of pillaging the occupied areas for food to keep German living standards up
>plus you could probably count every death, military or civilian, in the European theatre of WWII given Hitler was pretty clearly at fault for that (inb4 /pol/ he dindu nuffin)
>and he would have killed many many more had won the war (see Generalplan Ost, which would have killed at least 20 million Slavs)

But beyond that, Hitler's crimes are more well-known because:
>they're better documented (this is why getting exact death totals for Stalin is harder)
>the intentions are clearer (big part of Stalin's count comes from famines which may or may not have been intentional)
>we generally see killing people for something they can't control (like ethnicity) as worse than killing them for something they can (like being a political dissident)
>for Stalin, killing was just a means to an end: industrializing, or maintaining his own power. For Hitler exterminating racial inferiors was an end in and of itself. If that is actual worse, depends on your moral perspective, but it does make it more shocking for people

>>1764342
Half of the world ganged up on Hitler and destroyed him, Which significantly reduced his ability to commit evil

>>1765624
your map is incorrect, for example Czech republic recognizes it as a crime, but not as genocide

>>1764342
Normies like WW2.

>>1764342
Listen classcuck. Pretty much all of Stalins killings were justified and porkies know this but they want him to make YOU think he genocided people so they fabricate shit like holodomor.

Anyone who doesn't support Stalin is pretty much a cuck bending over for the porkies. You sound like a huge fucking classcuck OP.

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>>1764544
>communism
>not autistic

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>>1765695

>>1765700
You actually gonna debate me fash?

>>1765697
holy shit what a fucking cuck you classcucks could never beat me in a debate

>>1765697
>All people should live in small communes and share property

It is pretty much anti-austist.

>>1764342
>Holodomor genocide
It's not recognized as a genocide.

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>>1765705
>not understanding that humans are never going to stop wanting more than the next guy
Only in an all male society would that work. Sounds pretty autistic to me.

>>1765555
>he was didnt kill as many as hitler and certainly not in such a relatively brief spree as Hitler
I'm not really sure about that. His shenanigans in Ukraine alone rival the 6 trillion jews and was within 1 or 2 years

>>1764342
>holodomor

>>>/x/

>>1765715
listen classcuck how about you actually fucking bring up some points instead of just saying fuck bullshit cuck shut the fuck up with this cuck shit and actually give me an argument porky cuckold fash

>>1765705
>gimme gimme gimme
it's autism

>>1764412
>be a successful farmer who wants to own land instead of e shitty collective
>get executed

>>1765727
they were STEALING from the people you fucking cuck how do you not get this

>>1765715
>Only in an all male society would that work.
What?

>Sounds pretty autistic to me.
What? Are you suggesting that altruism and cooperation are autistic?

>>1765723
>says the leftypol faggot who literally supports BLM

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>>1765730
>implying that the driving factor in needless competition for resources isn't driven by desire to acquire females
They are truly the root of all evil. It's why communism will never happen.

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>>1765730
Forced altruism and cooperation are indeed autistic.

>>1765737
there is nothing wrong with supporting BLM cuck its ok to support a nationalist group as long as they aren't white nationalist because whites are an imperialist race who have colonized and oppressed the shit out of places

of course being a classcuck you wouldn't get this

i know you're still here fash, debate me

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>>1765744
>being this obvious

>>1765729
what were they stealing?

fucking debate me cuck i know your still here fascist piec eof shit

>>1765748
not an argument fash how about you actually fucking debate me cuck

>>1765751
stealing grain from the people cuck

>>1765717
by his shenanigans in the ukraine i assume you mean the famine?

2-3.5 million, he killed another 3 million in the various purges and between 1.5-3 million in the gulags totaling 9.5 million at most, hitlers score is around 12 million.

Stalin was a bastard, but he murdered to keep power, Hitler sought power so as to murder

i know your still here classcuck, debate me

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>>1765752
>tfw you'll never round up Bolsheviks and purge them

>>1765755
Stalin killed 23 million people.

>>1765753
by not wanting to collectivize?

>>1765743
It is normal people who force autists to cooperate.

Not the other way.

>>1765760
Actually he killed even more, 34 Million.

>>1765755

People dying due to shit economic policies is morally superior to rounding people up and gassing them.

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>>1765767
>forced to cooperate
What if people don't want to cooperate?

>>1765759
not an argument fash

>>1765761
yes, fuck them and the classcucks who support them. Those cucks are slaves to the porkies who have fabricated shit to make it look like Stalin was a mass murderer.

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>>1765775
Then they are autistic

and need to obey the neurotypical

>>1765760
What is this estimate based on?

>>1765755
>Hitler sought power so as to murder
'no'. It's called the endlösung for a reason, the initial plan was to deport the jews to madagascar.

>>1764407
this has to be bait

>>1765769
>shit economic policies
That's quite a funny way of spelling planned starvations

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>>1765778
>need to obey
So you're just going to force them to cooperate? Sounds more like authoritarianism than some kind of peaceful commune.

>>1765785
It's true.

I've had retards tell me the USSR was good because they fought the Germans even though the end of the war was the Allies and USSR racing to occupy land.

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>>1765794
You need to understand autistic people are mentally ill and need to be treated as such.

But we have stranded from your initial claim that communism is autistic

>>1764342
Joseph Stalin killed far fewer people than Hitler when you consider that Hitler was responsible for the second world war. That number of 6 million Jews was only a small fraction of the total Nazi bodycount.

Stalin's own bodycount is now believed to have been about 3 million executions, assassinations, and deaths in imprisonment due to abuse, neglect, or natural causes. These numbers include non-political prisoners, such as German POWs and criminals. Importantly, this is over the course of nearly 30 years. Hitler's killings lasted just over 10 years.

If you include the Ukrainian famine, which was caused or exacerbated by USSR policy, Stalin's bodycount rises to between 9 million and 20 million.

>>1765804
the longer this thread goes on the lower that faggot's bodycount gets

Because he was an almost pure pragmatist who wouldn't waste resources on something as petty as killing people just for being Jews.

His motivation was survival. It was either him or Trotsky. It was either him or potential political enemies in the gulags, even if only 1/100 were an actual threat he was going to sweep up all 100 to make sure he got him. He either conducted the purge and orchestrated famine in the Ukraine or he would lose his grip on power, all his family would be killed, he would be killed and possibly tortured, etcetera...

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>>1765803
>communism is autistic
No, the belief that it can work is autistic.

>>1765810
stalin dindu nuffin he wuz a good boy he killed all those people for his survival

>>1765809
That's because anti-communist activists usually rely on exaggerated or falsified Cold War era numbers that even their originators (Richard Pipes, Robert Conquest) admitted to be untrue.

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>>1764342
>when Josef Stalin, who existed in the same time period, was responsible for millions more innocent deaths

sage

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>>1765814
That was not your initial claim.

>No, the belief that it can work is autistic.
Childish, naive? yes. Autistic? Hardly.

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>>1765821
>implying that was me

>>1765818
whats next some faggot gonna tell me stalin was god's right-hand angel

>>1765825
>stalin was god's right-hand angel

Close, left-hand angel

>>1765799
That's retarded, but I really doubt its representative. In the U.S., or at least based on my personal experience in it, Stalin is seen as one of the most evil and villainous figures you could possibly name behind only Hitler and Satan. His purges and totalitarianism are the main (and for many, the only) things that are really know and remembered about him. Maybe things differ in Europe or college campuses in the U.S., but I have a hard time imagining that pro-Stalin sentiment is common really anywhere in the West.

>>1765842
I heard it in high school from some dumb commie kids who wore Ushankas to school sometimes. I seriously hope they grew out of it and didn't grow up to be some fatass sitting on GETchan or Leftypol.

>>1765816
he was just on his way to Poland

>>1765868
Poles were oppresing ethnic Soviets

>>1765842
It's not common but it's not non-existant either
and yes, the extreme left is actually this retarded
>https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ludo_Martens#Another_View_of_Stalin

>>1765877
Did they also attack a Soviet radio station?

>>1765867
lol glad im not the only one that had an autistic commie clique at my school

those faggots were everywhere in the 00's

>>1765704
Please stop posting any time.>>1765702
>>1765695

>>1765825
>stalin was god's right-hand angel
Stalin was Prometheus that descended on earth to give slavs nukes and turn them into a super power.

>>1765723
You haven't brough up valid points. You just really love ad hominem.

Stalin's industrialization of Russia was one of the greatest disasters in hisory, abd Russia would have sank without commissions of trains by the U.S. during WW2. They had to conquer Eastern Europe to combat their staggering poverty, since Stalin had stripped Russia of its economic backbone. Their fall proved the fallibility of putting war before economy in a post-imperial Era.

>>1765695

Why do pol and leftypol both obsess over the word cuck so much?

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>>1764342

>It's a stormfags pretend that nobody hated Stalin episode.

>>1765784
Either the nazis had the most incredible foresight in recorded history to disguise their infernal plan to murder all jews as 'just' persecution and deportation (in the early stages at least, or much of the Holocaust narrative we know today is revisionist bullshit. They might've changed their minds by '42, and this would be much more believable story than what is taught today.
They could've been the ones to help found Israel.

>>1765825
Nigga you can recognize that bias exists without exonerating the person they were biased against

>>1765697
>communism
>not autistic
Worshiping someone that turned his country into the 3rd world shithole with 43% unemployment is 100% not autistic.

>>1764342
>Make a shitpost thread on /his/ yesterday
>come back today and read the replies
:^)

>>1764342
>Why is Hitler remember as the ultimate evil when Josef Stalin...

I don't know what you're talking about. Stalin's name is synonymous with "mass murderer" and "evil dictator", on the same league as Hitler.

>>1766537
name 3 TV shows where the metaphor for evil was Josef Stalin

You can actually kill however many people you want to if you don't invade other nations. Had Hitler not started to tear down the entirety of Europe no one would have minded the holocaust.

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>>1764342
>Why is Hitler remember as the ultimate evil when Josef Stalin, who existed in the same time period, was responsible for millions more innocent deaths?
Because Stalin was on the winning side

Even then, it's more so because the lesson people are taught about WWII is that Fascism is bad. Communism being bad is the lesson to take from the Cold War. There's no need to cram why both methods are bad into one war.

>>1764342
>Why does mainstream media take the spotlight away from this Soviet murderer?
They put plenty of spotlight on him. Animal Farm and 1984 which are required reading in many US schools are a big fuck you to Stalin. All my teachers no matter their politics all agreed that Stalin was a mass murdering tyrant.

One of the big differences between Stalin and Hitler is the latter is more interesting and memorable as a person. When it comes to the style and oratory Hitler edges out Stalin. Another factor that keeps Hitler in the public eye is neo nazi groups. It is extremely rare to meet Stalinists as the left (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anti-Stalinist_left) came down hard against them. Stalin is hated by most of the far left while Hitler is mostly embraced (or greeted with ambivalence) by the far right.

>>1764342
It's because of the Jews.

>>1764407
>Stalin
>Communist

>>1764547
>isolationist
>goes around invading other countries
nice meme

>>1765741
Competition is just human nature. If you remove females from the equation people will find something else to compete over.

>>1765784
>endlösung
was originally part of the phrase "die Endlösung der Judenfrage" meaning "The Final Solution to the Jewish Question". Final solution in this context means one intended to "resolve" the "Jewish Question" once and for all.

>>1765791
Stalin didn't intend for the Ukrainians to starve.

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>>1764462

>>1764342
Is this even true? I know that /pol/ neckbeards like to cry about it but I don't see anyone beyond some hopeless loser commie tryhards or Putin defending Stalin today. Just like Nazis' have their own fringe loser supporters.

Gulag has entered popular nomenclature of an oppressive/secretive prison facility. I've literally seen nobody outside of Russian nationalists or fringe commies defend Stalin.

And yet, we have to bare the crying of /pol/ each day about how supposedly there's so much revisionism regarding him.

>>1764342
Hitler was a bad goyim who killed the Chosen!
Oh Vey!

>>1764342
It's another one of these threads.

>>1764462
I've read several Russian history books written by Jews

Stalin: Court of the Red Tsar (Simon Montefiorre)

A People's Tragedy (Orlando Figes)

Bloodlands (Tim Snyder)

Russia Under the Bolsheviks (Richard Pipes)

All were viciously anti-Stalin. Not sure what you're on about.

Putin, king of /pol/ after (((Donald Trump))), has praised Stalin though.

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>>1764342

Because the third Reich was glorious and powerful and went out with a bang. A worthy opponent.

The rest is just boring stats from the 2nd world.

>>1767537
If anything, there are far more people who defend Hitler or minimize his atrocities than for Stalin. Way more Neo-Nazis and Wehraboos than tankies out there in my experience

>>1765819
>ah yes we can revision the Soviet numbers but le 6 gorillion jews number is sacrosanct

>>1767565
It's much easier to categorize the number of Holocaust vs Holodomor victims. Holocaust deaths were caused by direct means within concentrated facilities, Holodomor was more indirect and effected a wide range of phenomenon across an entire country.

Moreover, the Soviets did not keep as neat of records about the Holodomor as the Germans did with regards to the Holocaust. In fact Ukraine Party Chief Stanislav Kosior reduced the number of dead across the country in general in INTERNAL Central Committee reports in order to maintain the illusion that industrialization and collectivization was going smoothly. These revisions was later used as evidence that Koisor was a party traitor when he was executed by Stalin during the purges.

Famine and "natural"-means genocides general are much harder to contribute reliable numbers to than violent genocides. You get similar wildly different figures with the Great Leap Forward, Belgian Congo, and Bengal famine.

But of course let this logic be lost on you and cry about Jews/JIDF and a grand conspiracy.

>>1767592
To add, Tim Snyder's Bloodlands (which is both anti-nazi and anti-bolshevik) determines Holocaust deaths at around 5.3 and 6.8 million and Holodomor deaths as between 1.8 and 3.5 million.

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>>1767548
>went out with a bang
I C WHAT U DID THERE

>>1767548
>went out with a bang
>bombed and suicide'd into oblivion

I kek'd

>>1767547
Pipes is a dishonest hack, Montefiore writes non-academic popular entertainment.

The best Stalin writers are by Fitzpatrick and Khlevniuk. Check out "On Stalin's Team" and "New Biography of a Dictator" as soon as you can.

>>1764342
Really? Because Stalin is painted as much of villain where I live.

>>1766009
They have no wit, as if their political stance didn't give it away fast enough.