Why aren't the Mormons widely considered to be a different

Many evangelical denominations do view them as non-Christian, but they have a strong base and like any religion they market relentlessly and collect directionless, depressed people who see their strong community and outwardly cheery disposition and feel like by drinking the Kool-Aid they can get some of that.

>>1723571

>Why aren't the Mormons widely considered to be a different religion than Christianity?

Mormons aren't widespread. They are concentrated into 1 state in the USA. And even within that state, they are a minority of the population. So knowledge of their beliefs is not widespread either.

>>1723571
They were considered non-Christian for most of their history, but then again it used to be that Protestants and Catholics called each other non-Christians as well.

Since western Christians in general are being exposed so much to outside culture, they're more willing to identify their "other" as Muslims and atheists instead and be more forgiving of other Christian denominations.

I live in Utah and my two cents are that Mormons are resolutely Christian but with a bunch of fanfic shit tacked on. You could argue that makes them non-Christians but then again you could say the same thing about the Apocrypha.

I am not sure if Europeans are aware Mormons are christians

>>1723637
Utah is 60% Mormon
They have tons of churches in pretty much every major city in the US and at least one church in every western nation.

>>1723571
>Why aren't the Mormons widely considered to be a different religion than Christianity?

They are, look at the main Christian lobbying groups and interdenominational meetings and you wont see any mormons or mormon ideas

>>1723571
>Why aren't the Mormons widely considered to be a different religion than Christianity?

They are.

We liken them to muslims.

IIRC they dont follow the Nicean creed

>>1723713
>Mormons don't lobby with other Christians
They make up a large portion of the Christian right in the South West of the US. They also have large numbers in both GOP party positions as well as local government.

>>1723780
They're also the main reason for a lot of "Christian" legal policies in those states, too. For example, Mormon lobbying was the reason Prop 8 passed on California. They also basically control the Boy Scouts of America and are behind many of its controversial policies.

They might not be as visible, because most live in states that aren't known for Christian lobbying, but Mormons wield a pretty large amount of political power in the US.

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>>1723637

>>1723571
They can't be considered Protestant because of their rejection of the 5 Solas

>>1723689
Mormons aren't Christian, mate.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QTYEtttwU18

>>1723571
You're making things up again Arnold!
You're wrecklessly warping the words of Jesus!

>>1724019
Mormons are Christian

Are Oneness Pentecostals Christian?

>>1724085
Mormons are as Christians as Muslims or Rastafarians.

>>1724103
This, their theology is so off base, they wouldn't even be considered heretics.

>>1724103
>"Anyone who calls on the name of the Lord will be saved"

>>1723571
They believe in Jesus Christ so they are "Christian"

>not true Christians though according to [dogma nitpick]!!!

>>1724164
Muslims also believe in Jesus Christ though, I hardly hear people saying they are Christian.

>>1724170
I wonder if Allah and JHVH are the same god.
Really makes ya think.

>>1723637
LDS is the largest intact organization on the planet.

>>1724181
What about the FLDS and other splinter groups?

>>1723968
>japan
>phillipines
>latin america in general

why

>>1724181
Nuh uhh

>>1724231
Superstitious savages?

>>1723975
they don't even accept the trinity
>>1724086

Just give the movement another hundred of years

are seventh day adventists christian?

>>1723571
>Why aren't the Mormons widely considered to be a different religion than Christianity?
They are, though. Mormon's are not Christian by definition for similar reasons as Islam is not - non-Trinitarian. Further, They are polytheist and marry the dead.

>>1724299
To be fair though christianity is a polytheistic religion since it worships a man as g.d.

Conan Doyle wrote about Mormon Death Squads and them being generally opressive cunts in Study in Scarlet?
How much of that was true in 19th century?

>>1724307
>
There is only one God. He revealed Himself throughout the ages through revelation, Grace, the Holy Spirit, the Logos (Christ), time eternal. How he has shown Himself to man is through the Trinity. One God, three persons - the Father, Son, and Holy Spirit. Trying to "rationalize" God is a fruitless struggle, as it is irrational to try to comprehend God fully with our limited abilities.
Think of a stream.. the source being God, who begot the Son and Holy Spirit, the stream being the Son and the current the Holy Spirit. One, three persons, inseparable yet distinct at once. The ice cube analogy is incorrect in that it describes a heresy, Modialism.

>>1724136
Their version of Jesus and the traditional biblical view of Jesus have very little in common. I could call Captain Kirk "Jesus", but that wouldn't save me.

>>1724630
Nothing is wrong with how they view Christ. It is still essentially the same view, very similar.

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>>1723571

I think it's because the first 75% of Mormon beliefs are on-par with mainstream Christianity, the remaining 25% being the significant outlier

>>1724231
>Japan
I get it with Latin America with their catholic population but why japan why

>>1723968

>Antarctica remains yet untouched by sullied LDS hands

wew

>>1724330
Blood atonement was a thing in Mormonism in the Utah territory. Also there was the mountain meadows massacre. And Smith himself was arrested after having his followers try and violently destroy a local paper because they wrote that he he multiple wives. Which was true but hidden from most of the church at the time.

>>1724656
>>1724231
Keep in mind that the church does inflate its numbers through a variety of methods. First is they have missionaries aggressively push for baptism. My own uncle was pressured to baptize homeless drunkards who could barely even find their way into the water. One of my cousins also baptized kids without parental permission offering them snacks in exchange. The bishops were fully aware of and encouraged this behavior.

The church also keeps your name on the roles even if you only show up once and leave. Even if you join another church. The only ways you get taken off is if you either formally request to be removed, are excommunicated, or die at a very old age. For example even though my father died two years ago he is still listed on the membership role as active despite him being a corpse who stopped attending decades before he died. This is done purposefully because around half of all children born in LDS families end up leaving the faith.

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>>1723571
Christianism = Belief that Jesus Christ is God.

Therefore, mormons are christians.

Whether they are Protestant or not is an entirely other question.

>>1724772
Some Hindus believe that Jesus is but an aspect of Brahma or Vishnu, it doesn't make them Christian in the least.

>>1725000
Of course it does. Many go even farther beyond to tell you it is the feet of brahmins He washed, and that He is a yogi, giving the same message of consciousness that the eternal teachings do. Christ is Krsna, to be a Christian is also to be devoted to Krsna. Gaudiya Vaisnavas and Christianity teaches that God is the Highest Being and that everyone and everything is a part and parcel of God. In Christianity we all come from God. Christ teaches us how to be one with the Father, and the Way is through the Messiah, which is the Christ.

It is all so linked together, because Brahmanism and Judaism do very well come into the same aspects.

>>1723571
Cosmology.

>>1723968
>100-1000 mormons in Kazakhstan
how? why?

>>1724252
Unfortunately yes.
t. Former Adventist

>>1725118
what's so bad about them anon?

>>1724177
Jahlaweh. Muslims and Christians are just a subgroup of Rastafarians.

>>1725075
I'm curious about how potentially 10,000 mormons got to Mongolia

>>1723571

They're Christians, but many would say they aren't due to their non-trinitarian views on the godhead.

They aren't christian:

1ºDifferent Jesus, Mormon Jesus traveled to Murrica. Traditional Jesus didn't.

2ºDifferent Sacred Books: They think Mormon Books are more important than the Bible.

3ºNot Abrahamic at all: Polytheism avant la lettre. God has a physical body, wives...

Mormonism is to Christianity the same that Christianity to the Judaism.

>Christianism = Belief that Jesus Christ is God

In fact, they believe Jesus is (a) God.

>>1723968
>Mormons in the Philippines
Those steeple building child-molesters make for a compelling argument for the return of Inquisitions.

>>1724231
American influenced places.

>>1726667
They are Christian

1 we have no idea where traditional "Jesus" was, for 30 years, is recorded by other sources to have been travelling, which is why His last 3 years are recorded. There is no pure pinpoint where "traditional Jesus" is, all "Jesus" is traditional "Jesus"

2 they still use the Bible and also say that many practices of early Christianity is lost (this is a fact) and that the Bible when read in true translation has its proper meaning

3 Christ is Abrahamic in lineage. It does not say "there are no other divinities" and recognizes that there are other divinities.

>>1724062
Damn, being a mormon god seems to be awesome. Where do I sign up?

>>1724136
And the name of the Lord is not Joseph Smith.

They need to get a certificate signed by Joseph Smith to get into heaven.

Not even kidding.

READ THE CES LETTER

>>1724307
To be fair, you're full of shit and cannot even apprehend the trinity.

There is only one God.

>>1724772
they don't believe Jesus is the Creator; they believe that God created Jesus and Lucifer, and asked them for plans to save mankind.

Different Jesus, different gospel, told to a man by an angel, and therefore accursed.

>>1726694
Mormons are cultists.

We know that Jesus' neighbors in Nazareth grew up with Jesus, and knew the family, and rejected Him. All evidence of Jesus from 12 to 32ish is extra-biblical. None of it is true.

They have their own book that supersedes the bible; the Book of Mormon. So no, they do not have the same bible.

God said there are none like Him. He even said He looked.

I'm gonna believe God over you.

>>1724136
>Not following the Nicaean Creed
>Christian
pick one and only one

>>1723571
>Why aren't the Mormons widely considered to be a different religion than Christianity?

Because they believe Jesus Christ is God.

>>1727104
Why is the Nicaean Creed so important to follow?
Legitimate question from someone who knows little about christian history.

>>1727114
It basically defines God as a trinity and affirms that Jesus is the son of God, died on the cross and was resurrected. it's basically the foundation of modern Christianity ever since the fourth century AD, and both Catholicism and Protestantism follow it.

https://www.crcna.org/welcome/beliefs/creeds/nicene-creed

>>1727124
What about the different churches before the creed? I doubt they all followed the creed. Were they not christians?

>>1727132
They were heretical sects like the Arians

>>1727132
It's not about following creeds; it's about establishing a relationship with God on His terms.

>>1723830
So /pol/ was right but they had the wrong guys?

>>1727147
Everything pol thinks is a Jewish conspiracy is a Jesuit conspiracy, for the most part.

>>1727146
t. Unitarian

>>1727049

It's still fucking christian retard.

>>1727174
If you do not know that Jesus is God, the Creator, you do not know the real Jesus.

You can call your gardener Jesus and follow him, but you're not a Christian by doing so.

>>1724181
That's the Catholic Church

>>1724307
One ousia.

>>1727132
>What about the different churches before the creed?
All accounted for, munched by muslim invaders(but those were niceean) or went out of Christendom and became extinct.
>I doubt they all followed the creed.
No, they didn't.
But the creed was a compilation of the most mainstream view at the time, and even the Arians believed in similar stuff.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6d2lOQpuqd4

>>1727054
Actually no one knows where "Jesus" was, not even the churches release the truth about where He was. I'm also going to believe God over you.

>>1727146
This is good.

>>1727142
Arians are also Christian

>>1723571
>Why aren't the Mormons widely considered to be a different religion than Christianity?

They aren't.

End thread.

>>1727434
fuckk you. shit awnser

>>1727441

That's what you get if you ask a stupid question based on a factually incorrect statement, kiddo.

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>>1723571
Because they're proddies.

They are Christian, identify as Christian, follow Christ's teachings, and only have minor differences.

>>1727515
>follow Christ's teachings
>only have minor differences
my sides

>>1727392

Jesus is God.

>>1727515
They follow Joseph Smith's teachings, not Jesus'.

>>1723571
>Why aren't the Mormons widely considered to be a different religion than Christianity?

Christians widely consdier them so. They are seen as a cult by moany Christians.

Mormons would prefer to be considered "just another denomination of Christians" so as not to get persecuted again.

>>1726667
>Christianism = Belief that Jesus Christ is God.
No.

>>1727688
They follow the teachings of Christ and Joseph Smith. Christ always comes first in the word Christian, so a person associating with Christ in the essence He teaches. When it comes to the beliefs of denomination, that is strictly denominational association.

>>1727507
I wouldn't want to have to answer for the slander of saints, papist.

>>1728305
>They follow the teachings of Christ and Joseph Smith.
error

>>1728385
No error. Every Christian follow the teaching of Christ and then they also follow someone else's teachings about Christ. Orthodox, Luther, Catholics, all do the same thing. You read what Christ says and then someone else's revelations.

>>1728421
>Orthodox
>Catholics
>Mormons
>follow the teaching of Christ
wew
Their teachings are contrary to Christ's teachings

>>1728494
How? The denomination is different but the Christ is the same. Each person only associates with the denomination but each has an individual relationship to God. So, stereotyping is dangerous in religious associations because to say "they are not Christian" is not for you to say, because you need to develop your own personal relationship to God, each person relating to Him on their own.

Interesting history incident about early Mormism
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Beaver_Island_(Lake_Michigan)#The_Mormon_kingdom_on_Beaver_Island

Also, here's an unrelated anecdote with an encounter I had with two qt Mormon missionaries a few months ago
>live in a redneck dirt-road neighborhood in a small town
>walking my dog one day
>see two young qts going door to door dressed in formal attire (despite it being 80+ degrees) while on one of the roads I normally walk down everyday, and think they're probably some teens apart of a fundraising or political shit apart of their school or college
>they start to walk towards me, and panic, because I got the spergs and my dog can sense my anxiety and gets defensive of me against other people when I start to quickly walk away and try to avoid people, so I often stay put and wait for them to talk to me and move on, so that he doesn't be a dick and bark at them and make me look like a jackass.
>they start talking to me if I believe in God and Jesus and shit, and I just want to desperately leave, so I austistically memble yes so I can get on my way.
>"oh that's cool! What do you like most about Jesus?"
>say "uh, erh... that he was so selfless, I-I guess?", like what the fuck am I supposed to say to that question.
>one of them says "Wow, you're so awesome" in a cheerful voice, which, I assume, she probably had the same sperg level as I did, or that they're really selling something else.
>they go on and ask me what I know about Joseph Smith and the Mormon church, and say that I was a little bit familiar with them.
>they give me the location of their church and ask me if I would go, and being the autist that I am, I said yes (even though I didn't), and they leave
>go on with the rest of my walk and kick myself in the foot like the Underground man for being such an autist

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>>1728679
also meant to post this autistic pepe to fit with the greentext story

>>1728689
If you go to their Whack Job meeting you can probably get a QT's number.

On the other hand, there is that greentext of the anon becoming a Jehovah's witness for his oneitis and getting cucked, so be careful my dude.

Joseph Smith is a prophet to them. To everyone else here he was a crazy who was killed and his followers run out of Illinois

>>1728494
I hear tell the Mormons are a Jesuit controlled faction at the top since US was founded primarily on Protestant dogma so they couldn't really just walk into the new world especially out west and be welcomed as Catholics. Once the Jesuits started getting a good foothold they finagled the whole state of Utah for a base. If true sort of a moot faction now as the Catholic church is accepted and actually controls much of the US today like the supreme court and foreign relations from Georgetown etc.

>>1728728
Lel no

>>1728421
>[...] Luther, [...] all do the same thing. You read what Christ says and then someone else's revelations.
Lutheranism at its core is just a back-to-basics denomination, which is the exact opposite of what you said.

Lutheran churches may subscribe to a specific school of belief, but believing the same things is not actually a fundamental or required part of the denomination, it's a rejection of all the accumulated theological stuff that has no real biblical basis, literal or contextual.

>>1728597
No, Christ is not the same. They are Polytheists, Islam is closer to Christianity than Mormonism is.

>>1728679
Kek Mormon girls in Salt Lake City are the horniest bitches on earth

>>1728750
Christianity only changes upon secondary beliefs. Point out any denomination, it will be slandered by the opposite. Christ and God should come before your label and denomination. The denomination depends on different condition but God is without all of these attributes "Catholic, Lutheran etc" while it is okay to associate with your denomination, it is not at the same time, because there is division among Christians because of it, without realizing it is Christ they are supposed to be following and it becomes a war between denomination. Value Christ over the labels of religion and watch the relationship grow.

>>1728758
But that is just assumed belief. It is like when two different people look at you. You are the same person, even though your boss does not like you but those you are a manager for, they like you. You are you, even though two different people have different perceptions and ideas about you.

>>1728679
Stop beating yourself mane its ok

>>1728782
Mormonism directly contradicts a lot of the Bible though.
They also believe the standard works are on par with the Bible if not more reliable.
They believe the president of the LDS is literally being given revelations from God

>>1728758
How are they polytheists?

I'm honestly asking here, I don't know much about Mormonism [spoiler]despite being from Utah and having Mormon parents. Haven't been to church since I was like 10 and didn't pay attention when I did go.[/spoiler]

>>1728776
Yeah, sure. Except what you're asserting is wrong.

We only differentiate denominations in the context of other denominations. We don't talk about "Hindus, Muslims, CoE, & Pentacostals" and Hindus don't talk about "Lutheran Europe" or Muslims, the "Baptist American South"

So Christian denominations already are Christian first, denomination second.

>>1728785
What do you believe? I mean rhetorical or literal if you want to answer.

Like, someone could go "I believe Christ teaches" and another could say "I believe this branch of Christianity is wrong because my branch says"

Christ says :
>"Yes, I am the vine; you are the branches. Those who remain in me, and I in them, will produce much fruit. For apart from me you can do nothing.

>>1728795
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Adam%E2%80%93God_doctrine

>>1728795
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/King_Follett_discourse

>>1728801
The denominations seperate Christians.

>“Do you suppose that I came to grant peace on earth? I tell you, no, but rather division; for from now on five members in one household will be divided, three against two and two against three. “They will be divided, father against son and son against father, mother against daughter and daughter against mother, mother-in-law against daughter-in-law and daughter-in-law against mother-in-law.”

How can a house divided against itself stand if it's members are seperate?

>>1728820
>How can a house divided against itself stand if it's members are seperate?
Drywall and timber framing, nigga.

Works great for dividing houses, and it's still the same house at the end.

>>1728844
In that case, these denominations are necessary to compliment eachother. Why Christians don't bring Christ together is a mystery in itself, because they focus more on the denomination than the Christ. Those who follow Christ first, understand the denomination is secondary.

>>1728860
>[...] because they focus more on the denomination than the Christ.
uwot? No they don't, you're just making stuff up now. 90% of pretty much every Christian service I've ever seen has been almost entirely derived from biblical verse, and could wholesale be exchanged between denominations.

>>1728881
Again, Christ should come first and Christians are not denominations they are people with different perspectives and it is natural for two different people to have different opinions even though their denomination says "this is what we have for a consensus"

Christ is the same person, and the Word is the same in the Gospel, but the people who understand the Word have different understandings. This is natural, yet they all follow the same person.

If you care to much about what kind of Christian you are, you miss out on the Christ who transcends all labels of denomination,let while holding all of them together at the same time, even as they seperate from eachother, without realizing Christ holds them together.

>>1728893
Again, the way you think things should be is already how things are. What you're complaining about isn't reality.

>>1728913
Actually, the way things are is your own reality, and the way you think affects your reality. No one is complaining, the idea here is to focus on your own belief instead of calling out someone else's denomination as "not Christian" because to them, they live in that Christian lifestyle and to you, you also live in your own. All have a relationship to God, and Christians try to strip this from themselves and others.