Was Boudica the worst military commander of all time? >lead

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Really makes you think.

>>1573634
Europe's doomed. Russia gonna rule the world.

>>1573616

Boudica and Joan of Arc are talked about way too fucking much when their military abilities weren't that great.

There are better women to choose from over these two to highlight women in the military. I have no idea (aside from propaganda value) why so much emphasis is placed on Boudica and Joan of Arc.

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>>1573616
>ywn apply tattoos to Boudica, starting on her ankles and working your way up, past her thighs to her sweet sweet virgin pussy, which is just dropping lubricating juice for your cock.

I was born too late.

>>1573616
>an army of 250 000 people
Yeah that never happened.

>>1574686
You wouldn't even be forgiven for bumping into her by accident without paying 70 cows and giving up your daughter as slave, and since you're a permavirgin NEET with no children or cattle they would just hang you and throw your corpse in a bog.

>>1574681
Boudicca was literally the one example of briton defiance to roman domination for british 19th century nationalism to cling to. It's just like Arminius and Vercingetorix, only much worse for lack of alternatives (well Caratacus, but he probably wasn't known at the ime).
Joan of Arc's whole shtick was being a propaganda product about how she was blessed by god to lead the soldiers of France to victory over the english.

>>1574687
>>1573616
Plus, any estimation of anywhere near that size is taking into account the people following that army, mostly the families of the soldiers, who would outnumber the soldiers several times over.

>>1574681
Joan of Arc never was claimed to have military abilities, at least not whenever I was learning about her. She was purely a propaganda tool to help re-moralise the French.

>>1574686
>virgin

She had daughters you know.

>>1574743
She did lead her troops into battle being wounded twice and did set up artillery along with other battle plans.

Fighting no, she herself said that she preferred her banner over her sword which was one of the key points in her trial and retrial.

>>1573616
>not realising you're ever going to leave the island

assimilation would have been a better option

>>1574739
You're aware that they attacked and killed the camp followers as well, right?

>>1574880
So they cut down a bunch of women and children fleeing for their lives, k

>>1574880
Yeah, but those camp followers weren't warriors.

>>1574681
Joan of Arc was involved in the planning of military operations, was respected by her peers, was preternaturally gifted in the use of artillery and was generally a good leader who knew how to direct and inspire her troops to victory. Her aggression and reliance on cannons served her well but it could (and eventually did) fuck her over when she didn't have the supplies she needed but was too headstrong to just turn back.

They get talked about a lot but there's no comparing the two. Boudicca is a joke while Joan was a legitimately good military commander.

>>1574886
C'est la guerre.

Read up on the sheer butchery carried out by Boudica's followers and the Roman response becomes perfectly natural.

>>1573616
>no education
>no military training
>low tech society

>raise an army for you jihad against the latins

>get rekt

Wew who woulda thunk huh?

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Battle_of_Watling_Street

>>1573616
>lead an army of 250 000 people
It wasn't an army, she didn't have any soldiers with her. It was just a mass of angry bongs, most of them probably weren't even men. It's a miracle that they killed any Romans at all.

>>1574662
>>1573634

>Oh no, wymym hold political office
>My autism says we are doomed!
>Doomed!

>>1575650
The vast majority of fighting forces in history did not have professional, full time soldiers in them.

That does not mean they are no longer armies. Unless, of course, there were NO armies at cannae, or any of romes battles before 107bc.

Or almost any battles of the persian empire, oh, and one entire side of the fucking peloponnesian war didn't ever have an army. Also, no greek army at marathon.

You know what? I'm not listing them all. You're stupid, fuck you.

>>1573616
Well she wasnt actually a military commander
So the answer is no.

>>1576006
Boudica led a people's revolt, not an invasion or defense force though. What a complete prole

>>1574662
Russia is an impoverished shithole.

>>1576006
>You know what? I'm not listing them all. You're stupid, fuck you.
Oh, give it a rest. You're being deliberately obtuse so you can yell at someone a bit.

Anyway, there's a difference between the early Republican Roman army and Boudicca's mob at Watling Street. Most scholars think now that most of the British men at Watling Street weren't even armed.

>>1575977
>be defence minister without any military experience

everything is fine guys, remember what the canadian pm said, if you fight, you lose!

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>>1575977

Men had:

>Alexander
>Ceaser
>Augustus
>Charlemagne
>Genghis Khan
>Hitler

Women had

>a fucking glorified cheerleader - Joan D'Ark

or

>women being born into positions of power


>SEE WOMEN CAN RULE JUST AS GOOD AS MEN! AND STOP TALKING ABOUT THE NUMBER OF WOMEN VS MEN! IT DOESN'T COUNT!
>WHY YOU ASK?
>CHECK YOUR PRIVILEGE! IT'S 2016 WE HAVE TO BE PROGRESSIVE! THAT'S WHY!

>>1576207
stop posting like a fucking retard

>>1576207
So, because women can't be warlords then they should not become the defense ministers of industrialized nations?

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>>1576207
Anon your pills

>>1576200
Russia don't have that either?

>>1576312
Stupid question mark, should be a dot

shit thread

If you wanted to discuss the differences between men and women properly we'd be looking at criminal gangs and things and talking about psychology and sociology, looking for real answers.

>>1576207
>d'ark

So... daughter of Noah?

>>1575977

None of them has any expertise in the field they are working. They were appointed solely for the reason of 'Womyn strong and white CIS men are war mongers'. A friend of mine worked for the SEK and had the honor to meet Von der Leyen. He said at least she tried, but her knowledge of military affairs and strategy is incomplete at the very best.

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>>1576530
>None of them has any expertise in the field they are working.
I don't think you understand how the Western political system works.

>>1573616

>women in leadership roles

Just cuck my land UP

>>1576705
>he didn't study president studies to run for office
>law and administration is not a highly correlating subject

>I don't think you understand how the Western political system works.
Neither do you. We have politicians with military backgrounds and the minister of finance more often than not has some economics background.

>>1573634
>woman no be stronk
>woman can not punchy punchy
>somethign something international marxist degeneracy, apocalypse

>>1576746

You really unmasked them hard, anon. Really made me think.

>>1576715
>We have politicians with military backgrounds
Well, see, it's funny. Carter had a career in international affairs but apparently little military experience (unless you count giving his physicist's appraisal of superweapon plans.) Chuck Hagel did two years in Vietnam (where he was very brave and heroic, sure) but otherwise was just a businessman/lobbyist and eventually a moderate neocon senator, certainly nothing seems to indicate he would have any competence as secretary of defense.

>the minister of finance more often than not has some economics background.
Well yeah, because economics actually matter.

>law and administration is not a highly correlating subject
Please, every politician goes to prestigious law schools because that's where you make connections, don't even try to pretend it's for another reason.


The French minister of defense is a career politician with no military experience and he's an old white catholic male, how did he land his his job?

>>1576766
Well isn't that the point?
The wast majority of defense ministers have no military experience, but if they're women it's somehow a problem.

>>1576767
>The French minister of defense is a career politician with no military experience and he's an old white catholic male,
So is the British secretary of defense actually. Well, except he's anglican.

>>1576777
>The wast majority of defense ministers have no military experience, but if they're women it's somehow a problem.

False. In my country they at the very least served, were professional soldiers for a limited time or even had a medium rank. You will say that doesn't qualify someone to get his head into these geo-strategical calculations. Well it qualifies a hell lot more than having a completely unrelated background, no prior interest in the military whatsoever and only being elected so that the EU can keep her 'civil face'.
Even minor things like knowing what the daily life of a soldier looks like and how servicemen mentally function could make huge differences when implementing policies.

>>1576791
>In my country
your 3rd world eastern european shithole isn't the whole world :^)

>>1576795
Still Germany. ;)

>>1576798
ah yes, the practise of having "qualified" defense ministers really shows in the german army.
I guess Jung knew the "daily life of a soldier" constituted a sausage or a dozen :^)

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2008/mar/06/germany.armedforces

>>1576787
When was the last time a British secretary of defense had a military background actually?

Hammond, Fox, Ainsworth, Browne, Reid... none of them had anything to do with the military or geopolitics before (except Reid who was already minister under Blair, but again for no clear reason) and they also served in totally different sectors. In fact, Britain seems to be one of the least technocratic when it comes to handing out cabinet positions.

>>1576806

I think you have a hard time to stay on topic, cuck. Not uncommon with your kind. ;)
Can't wait for when your holy cow, the virtuous women will prevent you from getting jobs that are already rare for your shitty humanities degree via quotas.
Probably going to blame the 'cis white male' establishment for that though, lol-

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>>1576832

>>1576832
That's big talk from a country getting flooded with refugees by Mama Merkel. Don't forget to vote for her again in 2017!

>>1576795
>women hate eastern Europe

Warms my heart, guess we're doing something right.

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>>1576879
You're just the laughingstock of Europe, sorry lad.

>>1576876

I might be, because I plan to emigrate within 3 years.

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>>1576881
>lets in millions of dune coons
>calls anyone a laughingstock

>>1576889
You're taking a rather wild guess about my nationality (and gender) and missing completely.

>>1576207
you forgot
>The queen of Jhansi
>Literally carried her baby boy to war where she fought and led forces.
>>1576207
>immigrant to canada serves in it's military for several years honorably before working in the political system and rising to the top.
>"MUH SANDNIGGERS R Taking over"

>>1576705
.engineers in charge of government
that explains the chinese pollution levels.

>>1576891
What are you then?

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>>1576908
It really does, no joke. But they have changed strategies recently, the next generation will be promoted based on how well they meet environmental quotas as well.

>>1576913
>needs to know identity on an anonymous imageboard

typical sjws...

>>1576917
so the chinks run their country as a giant game of Victoria 2 then?
neat.

>>1576919
>too ashamed to say

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>>1576903
>>immigrant to canada serves in it's military for several years honorably before working in the political system and rising to the top.
>>"MUH SANDNIGGERS R Taking over"

Yeah people are literally losing their shit over that badass Sikh guy on all conservartive forums and it is totally exemplatory and related to the biography of these muslim immigrants who came here only based on merit and dedication.

>>1576928
fuck off with your identitarianism stupidlad

>>1576942
Nah you fuck off shitskin.

>>1576942

Says the guy who tried to dismiss a post by the heritage of the poster. You can't make that liberal shit up anymore.

>>1576952
no, I'm not that guy

>>1576955
sure. You just linked into the conversation the same time he stopped replying.

>>1576960
sure, why not you silly billy

>>1576955
>call the other guy a 3rd worlder
>he wants to know where you're from
>w-why does my identity matter?
>get outed as a 3rd worlder yourself
>t-that wasn't me

This damage control damn

>>1576993
>muslim transgendered stormfronter

wew lad, seek help


:)D

>>1576999
I'm thinking a beaner but it's irrelevant, you're still in no position to call anyone else 3rd world.

Boudica wasn't really a military commander. She was just salty she got raped and decided to lead a ragtag army of disorganized celtic tribes against proffesional soldiers. The thing is, any clet would have lost, because they viewed war as a sport rather than a discipline. Hell, during the battle of watling street the families (including children) of the soldiers turned up to watch and were having a festival. The soldiers were getting drunk and doing rituals while the Romans were getting into the wedge formation.

>>1577657
They didn't view it as a sport, anon. There's literally no reason to think they did.

War has always been ritualized to varying extents.

>>1576777
Because 90% of women have never been in a fight in their life.
How can you have any power within the military without experiencing even the most basic combat.
They lack the instincts that men have when it comes to fighting an opponent
Women are not strong you fucking faggot

>work in customer service
>customer gets angry at male member of staff
>staff member stares him dead in the face and keeps his cool
>after its over he just goes back to his work

>customer gets angry at female member of staff
>she's gets flustered and panics
>after its over she bursts into tear
This happens all the time
You can't seriously live your life alongside women and consider them your equal, especially in something that involves confrontation

>>1576239
Yes, a defense minister must think like a warlord.
Defense is about prioritizing yourself over all else, only in offense can you consider the enemy with any humanity.
Defense ministers must literally be the cruelest people.

>>1578452
This.

Defense minister is just Administration. Wider strategical decisions are made by others and for the day to day grind there are experts telling out what to do. I guess you need the same skills there as in every other bureaucracy.

>>1576207
>Alexander
wouldn't amount to jack shit if not for Philip II
>Caesar
born into an ancient, distinguished patrician family
>Augustus
sole heir to Julius Caesar
>Charlemagne
inherited the Frankish realm from his father
>Genghis Khan

>born into positions of power

son and great-grandson of previous khans
>Hitler
deranged autist who knew fuckall about running a military and frequently ignored the advice of those who did

>>1579611
>Genghis Khan
It really didn't matter that he was descended from Khans. He and his family were exiled from their tribe once their father died and they lived a fucking shitty life until Genghis made smart political maneuvers to get himself back into power.

>>1574762
Probably had a few more after the Romans were done with her...

>>1575977
>allahu ackbar the infidels rely on women to protect their land
>cue mass rape epidemic
>cue mass murder sprees

>>1574880
You're aware that the majority of Boudica's "military" success was intentionally avoiding pitched battles with Roman legions or garrisons and specifically attacking outnumbered militas or going after civilian colonias too right?

>>1574681
Anglo shit, its Jeanne D'Arc not "Joan", and secondly wrong: unlike Boudica, Jeanne is repeatedly and specifically attested by both French and English sources as taking part in battles. She was wounded at a siege, took an arrow or crossbow bolt in the shoulder, lead cannonade and artillery units directly and taking part in strategy planning with commanders and generals of the King. She is the direct reason why the English got the boot out of France and specifically sundered from ever having ANY holdings on mainland Europe at the end of the 100 years war.

Boudica did jackshit.

And to compound it even more for Anglo butthurt, she's permanently canonized as a Saint even after that corrupt joke of a "heresy trial".

>>1576903
>Rani of Jhansi
>Convinced the British holding Jhansi that if they surrendered they will not be harmed
>Proceed to kill surrendered british
>Use superior british fire power to hold off other poo in the loos
>British forces shows up and promptly wreck them
>Carried her baby NOT to war or to lead forces but to run with her tail tucked between her legs
>Later joins rebels were they were killed by British forces
>ruled for 1 year

Ching Shih is the only female worthy to be named next to leaders like Alexander, Genghis Khan, Julius Ceasar, etc...

>>1576207
>woman born into positions of power
You mean like most kings?

>>1579611
>born into an ancient, distinguished patrician family
That was so broke they had to live among equestrians and plebs. Not to mention were mostly killed by Sulla.

>>1576207
> liberal cabinet

That's a Sikh though...aren't they all about wrecking people's shit ?

>>1583004
>Ching Shih
>Prostitute kidnap by career pirate
>Rise to leadership of the Red Flag Pirates by cunning and ruthlessness
>De facto ruler of the east/south china seas
>Defeated everyone who came against her
>Chinese Navy - Defeated
>Dutch Navy - Defeated
>British Navy - Defeated
>So unbeatable that she was offered amnesty and got to keep all her loot if she just quit wrecking shit
>Retired to be a madam and died of old age.

>>1579655
She committed suicide after the defeat. The Romans never got her.

>>1573634
Have any of these women served in combat? Is that why were trying to solve the syrian conflict with love while russia props up a dictator that helps him evade sanctions?

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>>1573616
Boudica is literally a meme created by Victorian romanticists during a time when all of Europe collectively went WE WUZ PAGANS N SHIT.

And by meme I don't mean that she didn't exist, rather than the fact she was fucking horrid as a leader and should really be laughed at instead of celebrated.

>>1582684
I wasn't aware that FUCKING NINTH LEGION was a "militia." Probably because it was a professional military formation.


Also, you're just flat out fucking wrong. Boudicca did not, at any point, take any action to avoid a roman force.

>>1583097
No, you retard. Not even a little bit.

>>1576330
Nah, didn't you know she was of african descent? Joanique d'ark, virgin of kangz.

>>1585423
They raped her before she revolted brah

>>1585616
His point was that she was a hack whose overrated by new wave feminists into thinking she's some kind of military genius, you dong.

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>>1573634
>born too late to prevent Europe's destiny towards total racial destruction
>born too early to genocide all non whites for revenge
>born just in time to rebuild Europe from the grown up into a National Socialist Empire.

>>1585678
Actively avoiding pitched battle would actually make her a better commander than she was, anon.

>>1585674
No. They raped her daughters.

>>1579611

Hitler was a war veteran who survived gas attacks and shi
He was actually extremely competent in aggressive manouvers, however he didn't understand logistics across theaters as large as he took on.

His generals were utter trash, the "he didn't listen to his generals" meme needs to die, he listened to them and they were always biased, competing and flat out wrong.

Fuck, his staff was full of autists who buddied up to him because they weren't intimidated by his personality because they were so autistic, and Hitler, a lonely autist himself, trusted them inconditionally.

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>>1573616

That's a funny way of spelling General Custer

>>1586765
Custer was certainly horrible but imagine if his loss was a slaughter of a far numerous force that led to the Injuns exterminating the white Americans, because that's pretty much what happened with Boudica.

>>1585678
Vercingetorix failed the same way, severely outnumbering the Romans. In fact, Romans fighting in the Western territories were always outnumbered, but won by superior discipline and tech.
She had also been a popular figure way before modern feminism: She was an important symbol in the Victorian Era.

>>1586760
Hitler was a foot soldier of the lowest ranks. He wasn't competent as a commander in any way. There's a deciding difference in just performing an aggressive manouvre and taking a calculated risk to perform an aggressive manouvre. Hitler did the former, which is why he had to fail eventually, much unlike someone like Bismarck, and it was out of sheer luck and incompetence on the French side that anything he tried worked in the first place. He was incompetent of the latter.

>>1578433
It's just like
Your shitty life experience, y'know

>>1574725

>who is Caratacus mommy?

>>1576207

>lists a bunch of men born into positions of power
>attempt to handwave away women born into positions of power

It's almost like you got all your history knowledge from dank maymays...

This entire thread:

>Health minister never been a doctor or nurse
> ...

>Education minister never been a teacher
> ...

>Foreign minister never been an ambassador or diplomat
> ...

> Agriculture minister never been a farmer
> ...

>Infrastructure minister never been a builder
> ...

>Defence minister never been a soldier
> OMG WHAT THE FUCK THIS IS SHIT WHY WOULD YOU EVEN WHAT THINKING OMG WE DOOMED WE DOOMED WE DOOMED

>>1585542

Protip: the Russian defence minister has never served in combat

>>1576891
>(and gender)
Nobody asked for your gender you fucking whore
I am a guy btw teehee

>>1576006
>The vast majority of fighting forces in history did not have professional, full time soldiers in them.
They will have always had some experienced veterans, if a nation didn't, then they hired foreign ones, they've done this since the dawn of war.

>>1586945
>>Education minister never been a teacher
>> ...
Well, apparently Swedish Minister of Higher Education lacks even Bachelor degree, and that's actually pretty good example of what a Minister of Higher Education should not be.

>>1573616
Newgaf explaining to hist who boudica was. Back to the hitlr chNnel with you newfriend

>>1582777
This.

>>1586945
Classic roastie argument: she assumes that people aren't complaining about unrelated things to the topic at hand it means they think it's ok

>>1579611
Caesars lineage was tapped out. He had creditors chasing him. Boudicca was from the royal family. Your scattered unfocused point makes you the academic rival of honey booboo

>>1585564
She didnt spe a k english newfag

>>1588458

How is litterally every other minister lacking direct experience working in their area of responsibility unrelated to people whining about a minister not having direct experience working in their area of responsibility?

>>1588487
Because the post wasn't about health ministers, or education ministers, it was about defence ministers.

If you want me to complain about health ministers, make a thread about health miniatera

>>1573616
Custer was.

Custer lost to a Boudicca when his forces were two eras up on the tech tree.

>>1588508

So you don't deem it at all relevant to the discussion of ministerial experience, that no other minister has first hand experience in their portfolio? Why should defence ministers be different to every other minister?

>>1576777
How will they defend a country if their natural instinct is to flee and take cover behind a man, and if they have no proven track record of any kind of combat?

>>1588515
Except the Native Americans had guns.

"Ignore the racket made by these savages. There are more women than men in their ranks. They are not soldiers—they're not even properly equipped. We've beaten them before and when they see our weapons and feel our spirit, they'll crack. Stick together. Throw the javelins, then push forward: knock them down with your shields and finish them off with your swords. Forget about plunder. Just win and you'll have everything."

Gaius Suetonius Paulinus

>>1573634
>defense minister

What makes you think politicians need to be qualified in anything other than talking and listening?

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>>1573634

>>1578433
Nice

>>1589369
If you want my opinion fine; yes, ministers should have experience in their field.

Is it ok now?

>>1576207
What's wrong with a sikh defense minister? Unlike the women in that position in Europe, he's an actual soldier. Also Sikhs are literally religiously mandated to carry a dagger and be prepared for war. They are the literal definition of a martial race.

>>1576200
Good. Women are less likely to declare war than men, and as a male, I'd rather not die. That's been the suckiest part of being male since the dawn of time. If having a woman in office means I won't get murdered for some spook then that's great.

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>>1589940
What the fuck Albania?!? I thought you were Islamic not liberal faggots

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>>1590356
>Good. Women are less likely to declare war than men
You actually think the Minister of Defense has any say in declaration of wars? I

>>1586826
>Vercingetorix
Actually won a victory in the field against and equal opponent and managed to unite one of the most divisive peoples of europe behind him.

It's not his fault Caesar was a fucking prodigy.

Boudishit faced Suetonius, who was absolutely unremarkable as a commander. There's literally no excuse for her failing so dismally.

>>1586923

>Genghis Khan
>born into a position of power

you done btfo yourself

>>1579611
>Augustus
>sole heir to Caesar

What about Caesarion?

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>>1576879
>women hate EE
that only enhances our rape potential

>>1573634
None of those countries have a military.

>>1590356
t. beta and proud
Also
>defense ministers declare wars

>>1576207
and all of those guys were manlets

makes u think...

>>1590561

>YesugeiBaghaturorYesükhei(Modern Mongolian: Ecүхэй бaaтap,Yesukhei baatar; died 1171), was a major chief of theKhamag Mongolconfederation and the father of Temüjin, later known asGenghis Khan.
>a major chief

>>1591548
t. spook cuck