Why did the Spaniards use steel armors when fighting in tropical

>>1467853
They actually switched to a thick cloth "armor" that was effective against the Aztec stone weapons.

Because what's the point of conquering anything if you're not going to look cool as fuck while doing it?

90% of the work is aesthetics.

>>1467853
I imagine it scared the natives, who had probably never seen men covered in metal armour.

>>1467943
Yes, it was essentially a vest filled with rock salt.

Early on, those that continued to wear their breat plates could reach a temperature of 200 degrees.

Eventually, they had all their native allies carry their armor for them, strapping it on when they had the fortune of anticipating battle.

File: Territorial_Organization_of_the_Aztec_Empire_1519.png (3MB, 3613x2265px) Image search: [Google]

3MB, 3613x2265px

Mexico isn't as tropical as you think.

The region of the valley of mexico where the Aztecs lived was actually temperate in climate, and the core of the Aztec empire was situated around a region of lakes (now drained) where modern day mexico city is.

The majority of jungle was further south in maya territory.

>>1467943
>>1467976
I don't know about the spainish using it, but the Aztecs and other native nations used the same sort of cloth armor as well: It was cotton soaked in mineral rich brine that then had the minerals crystallize when it dried out, which made it resilient to punctures from arrowheads as well as cuts.

Not thread related but....what was the average height of the Spaniard conquerors and the Natives average height?

File: Mexican with predominantly native traits.jpg (316KB, 736x1118px) Image search: [Google]

316KB, 736x1118px

>>1468115
I don't consider myself informed enough to really say for sure, but i've heard in prior /his/ threads that the natives were actually pretty tall, like 6ft

That sounds like bullshit to me though

>>1467943
They didn't "switch"" anything. They replaced worn out gambesons they already had with local variants.

>effective against tone

Stone weapons will do jack shit to a breastplate.


>>1467853
Because it's better to be hot than dead, and steel armor is incredibly effective.

>>1467976
>Early on, those that continued to wear their breat plates could reach a temperature of 200 degrees.
Post a source.

>>1468115
About the same height. Spaniards were pretty short

Why use and armor when you have gun power and native cannon fodder?

>>1467853
The Spanish wore steel armor when looting and raping in order to make it harder for their victims to poke holes in them.

>>1468151
>THEY DIDNT SWITCH, THEY MERELY STARTED USING ONE AFTER DISCONTINUING THE USE OF ANOTHER
good catch there chief

>>1468278
It's almost like a textile that is meant to take the blows of sharp implements will wear out and need replacing.

If I travel to Russia, wear out my American made gloves doing work, and buy local gloves to avoid waiting for international shipping, I'm not "switching." to Russian gloves.

I'm replacing a work out garment.
On top of that, My post was in response to a retarded namefag implying they replaced breastplates. You'd have understood that if you weren't semi-illiterate.

>>1468151
>Post a source.
Conquistador: Hernan Cortes, King Montezuma, and the Last Stand of the Aztecs by Buddy Levy.

Is it such a stretch? Miserable humid mexican jungle combined with layers of clothing and armor plate.

>>1468288
>If I travel to Russia, wear out my American made gloves doing work, and buy local gloves to avoid waiting for international shipping, I'm not "switching." to Russian gloves.
yes you are

File: Fig4-5-color.jpg (77KB, 620x473px) Image search: [Google]

77KB, 620x473px

Mexican here.

Most of Mexico is dry as fuck and only humid during the rainy season.

File: 2000px-Ruta_de_Cort%C3%A9s.svg.png (459KB, 2000x861px) Image search: [Google]

459KB, 2000x861px

>>1468110
>>1468342
Cortez's invasion route

>>1468353
Cortés* my bad.

>>1468342
They landed in Vera Cruz, so they got some of the worst tropical climate mexico has to offer.
Not to mention it was 500 years ago.

>>1468370
Yeah, that was a pretty bad hand they drew.

What month did they land?

>>1468377
Late February I think.
Must have been wild for your average stinky illiterate conquistador who never left Spain. First jungle, then vast hilly plains, then goddamn volcanos.

Cortes actually ordered Diego de Ordaz and another to climb Popocatépetl. They got so close to the edge of the crater that their clothes began to catch on fire.

>>1468353
>Invasion route

I mean, it wasn't really a conquest until he got buttmad over the aztecs refusing to take down their idols at the temple.

At the absolute earliest, Cholula is when you can say hostilities started.

>>1468451
Oh, my bad. I have no idea why I wrote invasion.

>>1468313
source for there being a damn place in the damn world where the damn temperature reaches a damn 200 degrees anywhere outside some damn volcano

>>1468144
It is.
The average Dutchman is 6ft now. I highly doubt Mesoamericans could compare in height to the much better fed modern Dutchman

>>1468506
200 degrees within their armor, anon. They all become little ovens.

>>1468582
That's how they invented the chimichanga

>>1468144
I've heard the same; when you consider height as a result of factors beyond genetics, like hygiene and nutrition especially, it's believable. The Mexican diet was much healthier than that of the Europeans,and the population had until contact not been exposed to crippling diseases.

File: 1427602357641.jpg (29KB, 252x234px) Image search: [Google]

29KB, 252x234px

>>1467947
underrated post

>>1468288
literally retarded, get some fucking logic please

>>1467853
it helps not get shanked

>>1468641
Why are Mexicans so short nowadays?

Is it just nutrition? That wouldn't make sense because Mexicans state side are also short as well.

>>1469289
>USA

>>1469289
>Frankish Empire, Middle Kingdom Egypt
>"""low""" tier

>>1469396
New Kingdom, sorry.

>>1469289
>spamming this shit ranking in every thread

>>1468144
Some tribes were pretty tall, like the plains indians

But nah Mexica and other Mesoamerican indians were manlets

>>1469289
Ameritard detected

>>1468563
Aztec maize was actually a pretty great nutrition source; nothing like modern corn. That food was pretty much responsible for their success as a culture until the Europeans said "all of this--it's mine"

>>1468408
>never left Spain

Except they launched their invasion from Cuba retard

>>1469287
Diseases. They were wreaked by them. What left are literary a remnants of destroyed civilization.

>>1468110
>Mexico isn't as tropical as you think.
Llegaron en pinche Veracruz.

>>1468144

Chia seeds are one hell of a drug

>>1468353
Pretty much as soon as you cross into Puebla the weather is pleasant.

>>1469720
>hey were wreaked by them.
Interested in seeing proof of that.

>>1469748
Read 1491.
Well written and full of things you probably don't even know.
In short Americas native populations suffer 95-97% losses from diseases brought by Europeans. Whole civilizations fall before contact as plagues spread. Conquest of Inca and Mexico was only possible because their social hierarchy was weakened by first wave of diseases.
It is supported by Spaniards church chronicles and other evidence.

>>1469287
there are some reports of some really tall natives in the patagonia. When I say tall they were really really tall.

>>1469289
Spanish K-Kingdom?

>>1469289
you just rolled a dice for each of these, didn't you?

>>1469289
>Shitanni Kingdom on par with Carthage

Gotta be shitting me

>>1469289
>Nazi Germany
>shit tier
Subhuman detected.

>>1469924
Not him but how was it not shit tier?

>existed for only 12 years
>started a big war and got steamrolled
>partitioned and cucked forever

>>1469924
Shit at logistic.
Shit at strategy.
Shit at politics.
Shit at ethnic cleansing.
They try hard and failed terribly.
Germans tend to suck hard and always going into extreme and fuck things for everyone.

>>1468563
Northern tribes' indians were taller than spaniards. There are accounts by jesuit priests that say so. They even say that if the spaniard and inidan fought 1v1 on foot, the indian would always win, which is why spaniards kept using cavalry with lancers even against small groups.

>>1469857
Oh THAT disease. I thought you meant chronically like their civilizations constantly suffered from plagues or something.

>>1469965
>which is why spaniards kept using cavalry with lancers even against small groups.
Yeah because normally the thing to do is dismount and give your enemy a fair fight.

Amirite?

>>1469289
>USA
>that high
>Byzantine that high
>Mughal that low
>Visigoths on par with Carthage
>Ottomans not mid tier
>Venitian Republic

>>1469937
>>1469947
not that stormfront faggot, but isn't it pretty impressive how long they managed to last?

>>1469982>>1469982
>dismount and give your enemy a fair fight.
Or they could fell/get tossed/pulled from the horse's back, you know?
They used to think swordfighting would beat them since northern tribes were buttnaked and armed with atlatls. They didn't even had bow and arrow until after the contact with spaniards. Usually, spaniards would drive them to the hills and camp there, in hopes of starving them because they wouldn't be able to hunt, but indians were able tu survive for days, (some say weeks) on lechuguilla alone.

>>1469998
You're retarded

>>1469995
Kinda.
Its like a see a bully to beat some weaklings, have some lucky streak then jump into shit and be impressed how long they float.
That doesn't change that they are mostly a meme.

File: 1468967548352.jpg (67KB, 1280x853px) Image search: [Google]

67KB, 1280x853px

>>1468288
>im not "switching". to
>work out

>semi-illiterate

>>1470025
Great argument

>>1469965
>They even say that if the spaniard and inidan fought 1v1 on foot, the indian would always win

I doubt this. Spaniards were expert swordsmen and a lot of the soldiers were veterans of European wars, absolute best soldiers of Europe a the time. They also didn't have many horses and most of them fought on foot. Feels like some sort of revision to basically diminish Spanish history.

>>1471712
You completely missed the point you dumbass. This isn't an argument this is us playing catch and you retardedly waving your arms about, squatting over shitting in your hands and then punting the shit as you exclaim "touchdown!".

>>1469875
>yfw decide to leave germany to colonize the fiery land of 9 ft tall cyxlopsii.

>>1467853
Yeah, as other people have mentioned, a soldier would wear a padded gambeson underneath the plate armor. The plate would stop pretty much any projectile, and the gambeson would stop anything that managed to pierce it.

The Aztecs' blunt weapons would be effective against steel, but again, the padding would absorb much of the impact.

If you read Bernal Diaz's writings, he lists casualties in a lot of the battles that they fought.

In a lot of cases, its like "we killed 100 natives before they routed, also we lost one guy". The armor saved their lives in a lot of cases, including his life when he was stabbed through the chest-plate with a spear.

>>1468353

Anything between Mexico-tenochtitlan and Coatepec in that map is as temperate as England.
Source: i'm mexican.

>>1468563
>>1468641
>>1469287
>>1469534

People in that time were very short, including the spaniard. I have spaniard clothes in mexican museums, conquistador's armor, noblemen garments, ladies dresses... they were 1.65mts tall at the most. They had the same height as the indians.

The real question here is, Why did the europeans concealed their true genetic height all of history?

>>1473070

I have *seen* spaniard clothes...