What frameworks are memes and what frameworks are useful? I am

>>62121397

It doesn't really matter.
Rails is fine for beginners, so is Node.
Or learn PHP or Python..
For each of those you'll find people you say it's great and others saying it's shit.

It doesn't really matter. You will learn more than one framework in your career.

Rails is an old meme.
Node is like the new version of that meme.

At least they're not PHP, which is the ultimate web dev meme. Never fall for that one.

Python + Flask is not a meme.

[spoiler]This post is a meme[/spoiler][spoiler]
or is it[/spoiler]

>>62121397

Node is terrible. Single thread, single core. Your 24-core web server is doing nothing on 23-cores.

>you just need to run 24 instances

Now you have 24 problems.

>>62121818
I need the other 23 to install Gentoo

>>62121646
this. it's mostly same shit. once you learn one framework you'll see the others usually follow the same concept, and all you have to do is master the language

>>62121818
it's 2003 and i own/rent/buy servers

>>62121818
Well, as long as a bitch ain't one, I'll be fine.

>>62121397
Sorry about off-topic, but could you please explain to me your use of "memes" here. What does it mean for a framework to be a meme?

I'm not trolling or anything, I've just seen the word memes used in this context a few times and it doesn't fit my understanding of the word.

>>62121992
well that copypasta is a meme

>>62121818

It's all python again.

hahahah

>>62121992
It's a joke. A meme is a joke. Unless you're Richard Dawkins or something.

>>62122015
My question is copypasta now, or you think it already was?

>>62122043
So in this context we're asking "Which frameworks are a joke and which are useful?" thanks. I do think of a meme as it's literally defined because even the internets popularization of "memes" are still just elements of culture spread through imitation but as memes are often funny or jokes I see how this has come about, cheers I'll stop derailing.

>>62122199

Bascially "memes" come from a female scientist called S. Blackmore. According to her earth has now three replicators:
-genes (the basis of life)
-memes (the basis of human culture)
-temes (the basis of technology)


But in 4chan most things are very meta. So the 4chan usage of "memes" is a cynical reception of the usage of "memes" in other social media sites like reddit. It's not easy to understand. Lurk more.

>>62121992
It's french and means granny. Meaning old shit.

>>62121397
Rails is the og framework which was largely responsible for pushing the typical web framework pattern you see today. It's also used by tons of startups today. Anyone that tells you it's a joke is a probably fucking retarded contrarian or someone who doesn't have a job

Node... idk. Haven't used it much besides express. Hated it though because I hate js, although the you can probably get just as much done in node frameworks as you can with rails. Just your preference

>>62123733
Ruby is gay

t.Python dev

>>62123793

Node dev here, we use python for e2e. Ruby is busted old shit.

God Tier
-React

Shit Tier
-Django
-VueJS

Obsolete Tier:
-Knockout
-Ruby on Rails
-Backbone
-Ember
-AngularJS
-anything jQuery

Meme Tier
-Angular 2, 4
-Polymer
-anything Google

File: Capture.png (544KB, 586x573px) Image search: [Google]

544KB, 586x573px

It doesn't matter. Just pick one and develop something with it, you will learn so much doing that rather then spending days figuring out the """"best"""" framework. FUCK YOU

node is in a state of everchanging exhaustive and overwhelming js framework changes. give it time to settle

>>62121397
Laravel is the comfiest framework desu

>>62123939
Fucking retard conflating frontend and backend technologies.

>what frameworks are memes
all of them

When you are learning, I think no framework is the best idea.

You mentioned node so let's go with that. If you learn the node standard library well, for instance, you will be able to better discern which js frameworks are well-written and which just became popular. I would even suggest trying to write a very small framework first for an easy project. You'll get a quick idea of which problems become a hassle to solve yourself and where the frameworks really distinguish themselves.

Perma-plebs continually learn frameworks, which quickly go out of date. Learning the standard library and gain a deep understanding of node yourself allows you to either write or contribute to existing frameworks in addition to having knowledge that will remain useful when the next meme framework comes out.

>>62121397
Rails is great, and opens the door to similar frameworks (Phoenix, Django). Ruby is a beautiful language to work in.

I haven't used Node but I get the impression that it's half-baked and fragile. I wouldn't use it unless I had a good reason to use Angular or something similar (which is supported in Rails now but isn't well-documented for newbies).

>>62121397
I do run a couple of websites for profit, and I tend to find that pre-built frameworks are a waste of time. They don't really do a whole lot anyway, so I built my own minimalistic one which, even after growing since then, still hasn't reached 2,000 lines of code. Using your own has the advantage that it's easy to adapt to whatever your needs are, that it fits your own mental model, and that you don't need to spend hours reading up on documentation and stuff to start using it.
As for the language, I use Python, but I'm not adamant about that. I've considered and am still considering everything from Racket or Julia to C++ or Java.

>>62128357
>>62129986


There are always two way of learning:
Either you start from the scratch (why not just using assembly, eh?) or you start high level and dig deeper.

I think it's important to write your own micro-framework at some point, but I would not recommend that for beginners. In the beginning there is so much to know, it's a good idea to have a bigger framework like Rails holding your hand here.

1) There are many attacking vectors a big framework protects you from. If a newbie makes his own framework, it will probably go down at the first traversal attack or SQL injection.

2) Backend always means using a database. While I do prefer pure SQL nowadays, it's a good idea for beginners to use an ORM that keeps the trouble away. Rails comes with batteries included and you can use SQLite without any configuration at all. (For other DB's it's only a minor configuration)

3) Before Rails everybody put everything "somwhere" and therefore most websites where a huge mess. Rails give you a good idea what stuff you can expect in your backend and where to put your stuff. It leads to good habits concerning the folder stucture. Of course there are many slightly different approaches, every mayor web framework will do things slightly different, but for newbies it's very good to get a rough idea before they make their own structure.

4) Whenever you work with more than one person you'll definitely benefit if you have "common ground". You get the highest productivity, if you already can assume some things. If I had to start in someone else's framework I would probably need a couple of days to get the do's, dont's and quirks of it. Even if you hate big frameworks, today there are so many good micro frameworks in any language (i.e. for Ruby: Sinatra, Cuba, Jekyll and many more). They all come with free support, updates and bug fixes.. I don't see why using your own in production would be an advantage here.

>>62121818
V8 isnt single threaded. But node is indeed pretty bad. Conventional frameworks like Spring can be made to also use non-blocking io and it'll be at least a few times faster than node

>>62130653
>why not just using assembly, eh?
Even if you aren't using assembly, it's a terribly good idea to know it. I write very little assembly (but some of it), but I read it far more often while debugging, and I constantly think in terms of it when writing C code. Basically the same argument is true for knowing raw HTTP when writing high-level website code.

>In the beginning there is so much to know, it's a good idea to have a bigger framework like Rails holding your hand here.
I would argue it's better to start with the basics. If you don't know HTTP itself you're never going to write good web code anyway. Arguably even PHP is a better way to start off since, for all its flaws, it's a rather minimal layer of abstraction on top of raw HTTP. Using frameworks with heavier abstraction you're just learning stuff that you may not even have any use for in the future without knowing it.

>If a newbie makes his own framework, it will probably go down at the first traversal attack or SQL injection.
Admittedly so, but then again the newbie's local experiment site probably isn't even public to anyone who might exploit that, and one would hope it's less than likely that a newbie would be writing a site where that really matters. If he gets attacked on his own local dev machine when showing off his booru to /g/, then that's probably just a good lesson.

>Backend always means using a database.
If "database" means RDBMS, then I don't use one, at least.

>If I had to start in someone else's framework I would probably need a couple of days to get the do's, dont's and quirks of it.
Surely so, but you probably would anyway just to learn whatever they're doing on top of a common framework anyway. Either way, not all of us have to deal with working with others.
>They all come with free support, updates and bug fixes.
And for that reason, you're bound to use the upstream repo, which makes it much harder to adapt it to your needs. Not impossible, of course, but more unwieldy.

>>62121818
> i dont know what clusters are