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>Researchers use Macbook Pros(not Airs you fucking sperg,

This is a blue board which means that it's for everybody (Safe For Work content only). If you see any adult content, please report it.

Thread replies: 162
Thread images: 32

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>Researchers use Macbook Pros(not Airs you fucking sperg, stop posting that photo) for their incredible displays
>Software Developers use Macbook Pros for their portability and Unix-like operating system + build quality + display. If you create software all day, might as well do it on a high quality machine. Also, you're guaranteed to get back to work after sleep, no forced updates + the battery life is great. If you need Windows badly, there's always Bootcamp.
>Rich people use Macbooks because they just work
>Designers use the Apple ecosystem because it syncs perfectly across all devices + you get a consistent design philosophy.
>Poor people complain on /g/ because they cannot afford one, so they create their own fantasies about how Macbooks are bad, based on some screenshots they've SEEN somewhere...
>>
install gentoo
>>
>>61907043
Kys applefaggot
>>
>Poor people complain on /g/ because they cannot afford one, so they create their own fantasies about how Macbooks are bad, based on some screenshots they've SEEN somewhere...

Here's the thing: non-autists on /g/ *don't* make this argument against Macbooks. My argument against Macbooks is not that their pieces of shit, but primarily that they aren't nearly as customizable as Linux. Another (less significant) problem is that they're very overpriced.
>>
>>61907043
what a unique post

Why do you feel the need to endlessly try to justify your purchase? Literally nobody cares, faggot.

totally not saging this
>>
>>61907043
Kys applefaggot

>>61907043
Op is a fag
>>
Most people use Apple computers because they don't care and it's easy for managers to put no thought into issue beyond buying some Macbooks in bulk for employees. Software developers will use whatever the hell they feel like as long as it works with whatever the company uses, and I can guarantee you that if you use OS X because it's Unix-like, there's no reason someone running a Loonux distro can't collaborate with you easily.

>>Poor people complain on /g/ because they cannot afford one
If I want a good laptop at a premium, I'll buy an actual mobile workstation, not a glorified consumer laptop with a shiny chassis.
>>
kys Itoddler
>>
>>61907164
>Another (less significant) problem is that they're very overpriced

Find me another laptop with a 16:10 display running UNIX
>>
>>61907043
you forgot
>iFaggots routinely use iDildos up their asses
>>
>>61907359
macbooks aren't running unix, dumbass.

Also, any fucking laptop that normally runs windows can have gnu/linux or a BSD derivative installed.
>>
why is this nonstop apple viral ""marketing"" even allowed?
it's the same every day, all day
>>
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>>61907451
>macbooks aren't running unix
https://www.opengroup.org/openbrand/register/brand3627.htm

macOS is certified UNIX.
>>
>>61907478
>why is this nonstop apple viral ""marketing"" even allowed?
Along with AMD, Intel, Nvidia, Google, Microsoft and Lenovo ThinkPads.
>>
>>61907490
and you are a certified faggot
>>61907451
stop responding to this moronic shit thread seriously. dont you realise you are part of the problem here?
>>
>>61907529
>and you are a certified faggot
lel someone's a little assblasted for being called for being a fucking retard
>>
>>61907490
OS X under the hood is just FreeBSD with a little GNU sprinkled in.

All the certification means is that they paid to use the brand.
>>
>>61907564
it was my first post in your shitty shill thread. and you are still a faggot
>>
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>>61907596
so why are you still replying to me then?
>>
Fuck off with your blatant advertisement.
Sage, report and hide.
>>
I don't care what other people use. I don't base my OS decisions on others. If you do, I'm not at all surprised you use macOS.
>>
>advertisement
>shill
>thinking 800 billion dollar Apple seriously sends a bunch of people to an obscure forum to shill to the most unlikely demography to buy their products

Apple shills in Hollywood, not fucking /g/. Don't flatter yourselves.
>>
>>61909293
>totally not a shill
>the fact that we have the same threads over and over is a total coincidence
>>
>>61907043
lmao that keyboard
>>
>>61909323
>people talking about controversial tech on a tech board is very unusual activity to me, must be marketing to the 20-50 people on this forum at any one time from an $800bn company
>people only talk about something once ever

You are this fucking dumb.
>>
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>>61909492
>people only talk about something once ever
I never said anything even close to this. I think you should learn how to read.
>>
>>61909293
>>61909492
But why are you denying the very real possibility that it's shilling THIS hard? Could it be because you're actually one?
>>
>>61907043
Okay dell, we got it, hate apple, buy your laptops.
Now get the fuck out.
>>
here's why every apple user is a fucking retard:
>sees apple ads in TV about how user friendly macs are ("computers for the rest of us", aka for idiots)
>friends recommend apple products because they are apple uses themselves
>"minimalistic" design appeals to the retard, he can't predict that the materials used are designed to be so flimsy to break, also ignores how other products are more ergonomic to use since those aren't just slabs of aluminium
>compares $2000 applel product to the only other laptops he's ever used: $300 walmart trash and is amazed how ""premium"" apple is
>begins to use mac OS and since it's a bit more user friendly he believes it's the greatest thing ever
>now stuck in the apple ecosystem, has to buy a new model every 3 years because some of the hardware broke (planned obsolescence)
>likely a dumb poorfag so he has to take a loan just to buy the fucking computers
>even recommends apple to friends and tries to justify his position with unrealistic claims ("muh special functions only apple has", "I have a higher status in society if people see my computer", "it just werks", "muh special application NEEDS mac OS")

>worst of all, he doesn't even notice how much he has been cucked


tl;dr macfags are fucking retarded
>>
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>>61909614
cant hear you over this greatness
>>
>>61909614
>this level of projection
>>
>>61909505

FFS
>>
>>61909734

holy shit some macfag was triggered enough to make this
>>
>>61909756
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fVrQdz_x9hs

(You)
>>
>>61909769
holy shit some macfag was triggered enough to make this
>>
>>61907043
I thought summer was over in America. What season is it in India?
>>
>>61907506
Except those companies belong here because they're not for total tech illiterates
>>
>>61911362
>I thought summer was over in America

couple more weeks
>>
>>61907451
macOS literally is unix
>>
>>61911527

its literally not even fully posix compliant
>>
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>>61911527
macos literally is shit and will never be unix except on paper
>>
>>61907451

Shut the fuck up!

https://www.opengroup.org/openbrand/register/brand3555.htm
>>
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>>61911574
Shut the fuck up!

https://opensource.apple.com/source/bsdmake/bsdmake-16/mk/sys.mk.auto.html
>>
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>>61911602
MACTODDLERS BTFO
>>
>>61909667

I'd agree that they look nice, and have a nice looking screen...


But I seriously can't justify spending 1500 bucks on a laptop that I'll NEVER BE ABLE TO UPGRADE...

My work laptop is using about 1.1tb of data on my SSD and HDD (running a 2.5 SSD and 2.5 HDD). I could probably upgrade my cpu if i need it, I put in 16gb of RAM (for running virtual machines primarily and a little gaming). As it stands on my desk at work. I use two HDD docks, the SD card reader when I need it, 2 of the 3.5mm jacks for audio, the DVD burner for cd images if a flash drive won't cut it / im giving the image away, the HDMI plug for running a 24 in. monitor, an ethernet cable so I get faster network speeds, one USB for my mouse, power cord (obviously) and I still have 2 usbs free to plug in flash drives / whatever i may need.

Why am I mentioning all this? Because the laptop has all of these magical plugs BUILT RIGHT IN!!! I don't need any adapters, or dongles, or converters to use all of my existing equipment.

If I owned a macbook.. I'd need

>a USB C to A adapters / USB hub

>A thunderbolt 3 to HDMI adapter

>An external DVD drive (possibly using its own adapter or the USB hub

>A USB to ethernet adapter

> A USB to 3.5mm adapter for my stereo system

And with only a total of 4 Thunderbolt ports, i'd be

1. spending a fuckton of money on adapters
2. might as well use a desktop for my tasks
3. fuck that shit
>>
>>61907164
Macbooks can run linux so your argument is not good here.
>>
>>61907164

> customizable

Muh "customization"!

The fuck with your costumization, you need to "costumize" because

1. you have no life
2. it comes badly configured

And in the end, it will never beat macOS pure harmony.
>>
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>>61911672
>fagOS
>>
>>61911602

TF?

You are such a delusional losers!
>>
>>61911689

So you did that fake post, and you want what now?
>>
>>61911602
How will mactoddlers EVER recover?
>>
>>61911632
lmao. barely

unless you like poorly made, nonfree braodcom bullshit and funny dmesg's because the storage control decides to autism and do unexpected things because apple.
>>
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>the most popular free unix clone today is cobbled together communist trash
>>
>>61907490
>certified unix(tm)
>meaning anything
>not evne a complete pthread
>not even abortion standards like AIO
>half assed weird ioctl stupid that's incompatible with everything

fuck off moron.
>>
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>>61907490
>passes posix certification
>doesnt meet posix standards

rly maeks u think...
>>
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>>61907043
/g/ knows this and sort of supports it. When other people are paying you get the Macbook. When you are paying, you get a Thinkpad - NEETs get used ones. Your OS depends on how much you suck Gabe's cock.

...this post post is precisely why there was sage. I miss it deeply.
>>
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>>61911736
"barely"

Even at losing, you suck!
>>
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>>61911631
well I can't justify spending $900 on a computer and not on a phone that I can take with me anywhere I go vs the computer that is useless unless I sit in front of a desk your argument is odd
>>
>>61911758
Why did they break it again wtf
>>
>>61911767
ya ok kid. lets see your macbook running loonigs.

protip I'm actually doing that right now and it's fucking shit and this is just an 11,1, not the newer abortions which are even worse.

did i forget to mention the whole wireless radio arbitrarily deciding not to function after resume from suspend?
>>
>>61911758

buthurth loonix fag

that text is FAKE
>>
>>61911775
because they don't give a shit about POSIX, they want you to give them money to use their nonfree devel studios to build money making app store cancer using their nonfree toolkits that use nonfree bullshit frameworks that abstract away their broken ass, half ass, """SUS/POSIX""" certified shitheap OS.
>>
>>61911803

tf, GTFO, troll.

You had your chance.
>>
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>>61911819

you're fucking disgusting
>>
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>>61907043
>you do not know how good a McDbook is, because you never used one!
That's where you're wrong.
>>
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>>61911822
ya ok kid.

lets see yours
>>
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>>61911822
Fuck he rekt you good.

I work Apple tech support, no lie, I've seen some shit. Came here to agree with
>>61911859
that apple sucks, Macs sucks, it all sucks.

Also I wanted to compliment his table, it's nice. (Needs to use coasters though.)
>>
>>61911922
it's just glass. I can wipe it down and be dome with it.

please.
>>
>>61907043
Airs are the only relatively normal MacBooks left. You don't need a separate adapter to plug a fucking USB accessory, for one.
>>
>>61911974

BECAUSE YOU ARE FUCKING IDIOT THAT DOESN'T WANT TO UNDERSTAND USB-C
>>
>>61912004
>y-you just don't understand it
Fine faggot, go speak in your own language that no one else knows and then complain people aren't choosing it over English.
>>
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>>61912004
>The design is fine
>You are holding it wrong
>>
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first world problems, the thread
>>
Macs were made for ease of use.
>>
>>61912038

That picture is exactly why you are so brain washed.

You read the mainstream media, and defend what they say, without critical thinking.

The iPhone case is the right thing to do, small on the outside, battery for another day.

The Magic Mouse 2, I have one, it's okay, it lasts for months, charges fast, and asks for charge a long time before.

The Pencil is just retarded from the verge and the MKBHD gang they control, it comes with a piece to charge the thing with the lightning cable. No need for that, and rarely needs recharging.

Surely beats buying AAAA batteries like the Surface (no rechargeable batteries at that size), but nobody says that, because Microsoft pays them to FUD Apple.
>>
>>61907451
It's Unix moron
>>
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>>61912407
MacshitOS will never be unix, deal with it mactoddler.
>>
>>61907724
lol triggered hard
>>
>so insecure and mad about purchasing a 1500 dollar paperweight he has to brag about it to a bunch of autists on a thai ladyboy forum
DING-DONG DIDDLY KEK
>>
>>61911839
How does it feel to masturbate with a pinky ring?
>>
>>61912411

go cry to a corner.

It's UNIX, it's certified.
>>
>>61912349
>>>61912038
>That picture is exactly why you are so brain washed.
>You read the mainstream media, and defend what they say, without critical thinking.
LMAO apple products are the most media shilled normie products. Fuck off back to le Donald you fucking ape
>>
>>61912478
go cry to a corner.

fagOS will never be unix.
>>
>>61912855

Because a random idiot on 4chan says so?
>>
>>61912349
>I defend Apple
>But you are the one who is a brainwashed shill
How interesting.
>>
>>61912916

You detract Apple, which has the highest costumer satisfaction and loyalty, rated as the best in innovation, the most admired company on Earth, and most valuable 100% publicly traded company.

I don’t care what you say, nobody is buying your shit.
>>
>>61912946
>rated as the best in innovation
Tell me more about how you are an enlightened and independent thinker, and I am a brainwashed shill.
>>
>>61907043
Only Mac fanboys are miserable people could just be proud about buy a Mac.
>>
>>61912895
Because Apple says so: >>61911602
>>
>>61913112

Shut up, you don’t even get the joke, it’s a joke, you dumb idiot.
>>
>>61907043
You're autistic because you imply you can't spend 3k on a P51. Why are macs exclusively used by raging entitled cunts. Nice installing windows on a mac meme nobody installs macOS on anything else because there is no reason to.
>>
>>61913173

What is hackintosh?

Not everyone has macOS installed on their PC because either they know it’s illegal, they can’t do it, or are too dum pb.
>>
>>61913265
What are irrelevant autists the only reason to do that would be if you were a finalcutfag.
>>
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>>61912965
I have to give him credits, his mental gymnastics are damn good.
>>
>>61913265
t. mactoddler
>>
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>>61907043
Why don't macs have any cooling. They add black paint to the heatpipes and heatsink so it's insulated and will overheat quicker and more.
>>
>>61907043
Sage and report shill threads.
>>
>>61913278

Yeah, tell yourself that.
>>
>>61913502
Name one thing a mac can do better than a PC besides facebook.
>>
>>61913537

Everything.

Like color management, file management, resource utilization, web browsing, PDF VIEWING, programming, command line, etc.
>>
>>61907043
the keyboard on the new one is ass though it gives me cancer just to look at it
>>
>>61913680
File management no .ds_store mac has always been shit at file management
Resource management not since OSX lion
web browsing facebook does not apply
programming macfags have to buy a decent keyboard now because of how shit there keys have become
>>
>go on physics fair
>go to motion department
>denomstrates us software that reads the motion of ball
>macfag
>slow and buggy as fuck

>go to space department
>about to show us some simulation about how curvature of space affects movement of the planets
>macfag
>crashes

>go to robotics department
>robots use Linux kernel
>just werk
>he gave us presentation on mac
>fucking crashes

Why would anyone sane use this meme?
Just use fucking Windows or GNU/Linux, don't be a hipster faggot who uses retarded offspring of those two.
>>
>>61913386
>black paint
Black paint only absorbs extra heat from light energy. Since black is the absence of color, that means that it has to just absorb that light energy (it then converts it into heat energy).
The job of the heat sink is to deal with heat energy.
>>
>>61913782
Paint is an insulating layer. That meme is why people paint intercoolers black and it doesn't work it only makes it hotter.
>>
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>macbook pro maximum operating altitude 10,000ft
>inb4 macfags are flat earthers
>>
>>61907043
I want to test the applefags

if you're given to choose between a macbook and another laptop with

>same price (no poorfag argument valid)
>same cancerous display
>better specs
>no OS argument valid, you could flash it

will you apple fags still choose the macbook?
>>
>>61913873
You forgot actual cooling so the processor doesn't have to constantly be underclocked.
>>
>>61911631
i doubt you do all that shit everyday
>>
>>61913896
and this
>>
>>61913822

What does that even mean?

There’s a man there, meaning there’s AC and it’s sealed from outer space.

What the fuck are you trying to prove?
>>
>>61913755

There is no DS Store if you’re using HFS+ or APFS, you idiot.

Only there for horrid sub par operating systems.
>>
>>61913755

Your defense is “no, no, no, this can’t be happening, I’m losing”

LMAO!
>>
>>61913968
Macbook operating altitude 3,048m
Thinkpad operating altitude 402,336m
ThinkPad is the only laptop certified for use on the International Space Station (ISS)
>>
>>61913992

Good for you, that swipes the floors and thinks he’s an astronaut because you’ve bought a second hand thinkpad.
>>
>>61913991
Nice meltdown. How long did it take you to type it on your butterfly switches?
>>
>>61914000
>wipes floors
>$4k on P51
Sperg more 10% of the market cuck.
>>
Macbook "pro"
2017 and can't get over 16gb of ram and no xeon model
macfags will defend this.
>>
osx is a just a garbage, today one diagnostic process "spindump" was eating 344% cpu and all 4cores was running on 100%... had nothing else opened and also base system without anything else uses 3-4gb ram.
>>
>>61911602
How about you find out what darwin is before you get excited over something you thought supported your shit opinion
>>
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>>61907043
I could buy 10 of them right now, but I literally don't need one
It's a waste of money considering I put a more capable computer together for just 800 bucks
>>
>>61907043
>researchers use a range of products, macbooks, imacs, dells, lenovos, etc
>sofware developers use a range of products, macbooks, imacs, dells, lenovos, etc
>rich people use macbooks because they are literally given them
>designers use whatever they want
That's nice.
>>
>>61909667
>none of the professionals i know use one of the 2016/2017 macbook pros because of the lack of useful ports
Really makes you think.
>>
>>61907164
>that they aren't nearly as customizable as Linux
That's correct and solid point.

>Another (less significant) problem is that they're very overpriced.
That's complete bullshit. They are cheaper than alternatives with comparable screen. The only part where they really bite in your shekels is the extra USB C stuff if you're not having the newest hardware already.

>>61911632
The Linux support is horrible, specially on the new ones.
>>
>>61907043
This is actually what macfags think...
>>
>>61915573

Ahaha! bs! As if professionals can’t go out and buy the necessary cables!
>>
>>61909667
this shitty keyboard tho
>>
>>61911672
>pure harmony
>>
>>61916091

It’s not shitty, only retards say that.
>>
>>61916054
They could, but why would they for a machine that gives no performance improvements and only makes their lives harder?
>>
XPS 13 or XPS 15 with antergos is better imo
>>
>>61916162
>only [insult] dislike my toys!
Enjoy your 0.5mm of travel, kid.

>>61916307
Fedora works flawlessly on my XPS 13.
>>
>>61916188
>ignoring that better UI and OS let's you perform most tasks faster
>>
>>61916322

Enjoy your FUCKING OUTDATED key mechanism.

Stupid comparing key travels with different mechanisms.

You never have utilised a butterfly mechanism, you idiot!
>>
>>61916405
Alright, prove the UI is objectively faster than Gnome. I use both, dumb shit like spotlight and exposed being separate makes macOS look cheap.
>>
>>61916322

WTF this idiot has a Dell XPS and is shitting on Apple?

Enjoy your anemic 15W CPU! You fool!
>>
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>>61916437
>being this mad that someone dislikes your piece of shit keyboard
I did use it. I know it's easier to think everyone who disagrees with you is lying. Again, enjoy your 0.5mm of travel.

>>61916452
>anemic
Well look at that, it's almost twice as fast.
>>
>>61916439
> prove the UI is objectively faster than Gnome.
That'd require some pretty complex studies.

From a more casual outlook, how long did it take you to even begin using Gnome and learning how to operate Loonix compared to FagOS? How much extra software do you need for one (Say to get stuff like gestures)? Besides, if you're not using all the Continuity features as part of your workflow, it's pointless to compare.

The average person can literally, buy a Macbook, open the box and start using it. The learning curve is almost non existent, UI is consistent through every piece of software you might use and things are pretty intuitive, so there is less thinking about "how do I do X" and more doing X.

Though again, talking in general. If you're used to a certain think and can't be assed to relearn and/or need certain functionality of Linux, it's all different again.
>>
>>61916578
>I can't prove my claim that it lets people work faster, but here's a bunch of opinions
Every single time, the same myth that macOS is magically faster than everything else from people who've never used anything else.
>>
>>61916405
Most software runs better on Windows now anyway, sorry if you don't believe me.

Apple threw away the advantage they had with PowerPC allowing developers to focus on x86 optimization instead, the byproduct being improvements in Windows deployment.

The UI has literally no advantages over Windows.
>>
>>61916620
>the UI has literally no advantages over windows
I mean, I personally strongly dislike macOS, but it definitely has a better UI than Windows. Especially since Windows has like 3 or 4 UIs. there's the classic one you see in stuff like Administrative Tools, the full-on Metro you see in the new windows update (which coexists next to the old windows update, so you have 2 versions of the same shit program), the slightly metro from file explorer, the dark metro vertical menu from the start menu which is different from the vertical menu you get from right-clicking anywhere else.
>>
>>61916619
You realize that most people didn't have MacOS as their first OS, right? Many people who used it cite it as one of the big sources for switching, and customer satisfaction indicates that it's great too. If it weren't, surely people would look into other stuff, as many Windows users are forced to do eventually.

>>61916620
>Most software runs better on Windows now anyway
That's true.

>The UI has literally no advantages over Windows.
Nigga, what? Have you seen the abomination that W10 is now? The start menu and explorer alone have like 4-5 different UI's frankensteined together. At best they are better at multi monitor handling.
>>
>>61907043
Who are you quoting?
>>
>>61916697
I don't give 2 shits about what you read in some pamphlet in Cupertino. You claimed it was faster to do tasks, prove it or recede.
Also, there is no correlation between popularity and quality. Windows is FAR more popular than macOS and Linux on the desktop, yet here you are trying to show how it's worse.
>>
>>61916734
> there is no correlation between popularity and quality.
Customer satisfaction goes well beyond popularity, and Windows customer satisfaction is lower.
>>
>>61916775
Again, I'm not seeing any sort of proof of your statements, you just keep bringing subjective drivel as damage control. Take care.
>muh Windows
I don't even use Windows. I never mentioned it.
>>
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>>61907043
>Software Developers use Macbook Pros
not for long, the keyboard on the new macbooks is atrocious if you want to type anything more than a few facebook posts
>>
>>61907043
>poor people
i have a macbook pro and 3 iphones but i still prefer thinkpads
>>
>>61916842
I doubt we can ever see hard data on this, but I think it's starting to happen. If you type for 8 hours a day, you want a decent keyboard. No current laptop has a good keyboard, those died with the T420, but we didn't have to stoop this low.
>>
>>61916801
First one I found:: https://betanews.com/2015/04/07/microsoft-vs-apple-which-has-the-most-loyal-and-satisfied-customers/

Given how much Linux is a niche even compared to Apple, surely the quality of the software played a part too beyond muh monopoly?
>>
>>61911809
>filename
S O P A
O
P
A
>>
>>61916901
Are you pretending to be stupid or something? I asked for evidence of your claim that you accomplish tasks faster in macOS.
Faster.
That's a measure of time.
I believe your happiness charts or whatever, but it doesn't contribute much to this matter. And again, I don't care about Windows.

>surely
I can tell the level of arguments I'm up against just from this.
>>
>>61916970
>I asked for evidence of your claim that you accomplish tasks faster in macOS.
I said that there isn't any hard evidence already. The popularity among professionals and customer satisfaction are still decent indicators that it might be the case.
>>
>>61917024
Or that it might be something else. Maybe they're convincing themselves it's better because they just paid 1k for a laptop. Maybe they like the looks more even if it's slower. It could be anything.

In any case I don't care because I do believe macOS is better than Windows, not that that's a high standard to beat.
>>
>>61916875
I've been a mac user for quite some time, and by now it's actually cheaper for me to buy a new MBP every 3 or 4 years than to buy a new set of software for Windows.
Macbook keyboards have never been the best of the best (Much worse than the previous Powerbook keyboards, at least), but they were pretty OK for a laptop. But this has changed.
I got a new MBP this year and I just can't stand that awful keyboard. It's OK to type a few words, but not when you mash the buttons several hours per day. This will just end in an injury very fast.
2 weeks after buying it, I also ordered a small external keyboard and carry it around with me. So because they were so obsessed with thinnes that the sacrificed the keyboard just so the laptop could be 1mm thinner, I must now carry a lot more stuff that actually takes up much more space.
Tim Cook was a mistake.
>>
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>>61911809
delicia
>>
>>61917126
I feel you brother. I carry a mechanical tenkeyless keyboard and a Logitech G400 mouse to work on Monday and bring it back on Friday. I refuse to type for 8 hours a day on a glorified touchscreen.
>>
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>>61907043
Let poor people be poor, why do you even care about them?

iPhone 7 + iPad Pro 2017 + Macbook Pro 15 + Touchbar masterrace here
>>
>>61909323
It's called trolling. What, are you 12?
>>
>>61917126

You probably bought the last year's model because the keyboard on the 2017 one is perfect. Got changed to provide more feedback
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