Problem: Windows is the standard. Reason: Gamers use windows.

>>58250798
You can't. Unless Half Life 3 is Linux exclusive. And released 5 years ago.

>>58250798
You can act as a consumer and buy games that work on linux, I use linux exclusively and recently bought Cities Skylines which works flawlessly there, I think if more gamers actively buy on linux then it'll go in that direction.

>>58250798
or let linux run windows games

gamers are not the reason Windows is standard dipshit. Before you were even glistening at the tip of your dad's dick Microsoft cornered the PC market, which was only rich white people running business software

GTA 6 exclusively on Steamplay/Linux

So it basically never going to happen...

>>58250878
I mean the standard today.

>>58250798
Vulkan is making great strides towards building a strong crossplatform hardware api. Primarily you have valve to thenk for vulkan however it is receiving unanimous support from everyone expect Microsoft. The MS death will happen over the next few years as vulkan gains traction. I just wish they'd called it Romulan

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>>58250798
You misrepresent the reason but anyway.
> How do we do this?
Make developing software under GNU/Linux profitable:
1. Do NOT pirate Linux games unless you bought the legal copy.
2. Do NOT buy any game that isn't available for Linux natively (wine wrapper doesn't count).
3. Donate to Open source software that you find useful, at least 5% of your monthly fee.
4. Volunteer the FSF.
5. Install Gentoo, email Stallman and get the reply, grow the beard, code lisp, don't allow running nonfree javascript in your browser, shill Free software worldwide. (optional)

this >>58250878 but also this >>58250952

The best way forward to cross-platform gaming is through Wine.

Right now the GPU API landscape is divided between DX12 on Windows, Metal on macOS, and Vulkan on Linux. It makes no sense for developers to target anything but the most popular OS, which uses DX12.

Once CodeWeavers adapts Wine for Vulkan and Metal, we will have DX11 compatibility at minimum across the board. That should be good enough to run most Windows games at native speed on other platforms.

The real problem is what to do with publishers who insist on DRM using virtual device drivers.

>>58251432
how is that codeweavers thing going? My initial search said it'd be ready by end of 2015.

>>58250798
>How do we do this?
You literally don't. Your marketshare is worthless. You will never get any major developers to exclusively develop for you piddly, piece of shit platform.

You're already getting some multiplatform releases, and that's the best you'll ever get with the pitiful marketshare you have.

>>58251432
Wine already supports Vulkan.

Fuck Metal who uses that shit.

DX11 support is lacking though but I did manage to get *one* thing working on it (BeamNG.drive demo - full ver does not work).

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It's not just gamers that are the reason for it's userbase not exploding in size.
Pic related is a pretty damn huge reason for a ton of people not being able to jump on Linux.
Get the Adobe products working flawlessly on Linux and throw in a proper tablet driver support from Wacom and you'll open Linux to a massive amount of new users.

I love Linux and I use it on all of my computer's, but it really needs to become more user friendly. I know there's Ubuntu and all, but things like the software center being such a buggy piece of shit need to be fixed. The entire ecosystem needs to be more user friendly, most settings can't be changed through System Settings and need to use the command line. This is the only way people will consider switching to Linux.

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>Problem: Windows is the standard.
How is that a "problem"?

>Reason: Gamers use windows.
Windows is a standard because you can't do enterprise computing without it. Not because of games.

>Solution: Get game developers to develop for Linux almost exclusively.
If you want to make Linux more popular, you must make developing on it less of a pain.

Microsoft realized early on that a healthy software ecosystem would be essential to their success, and that's why they always pampered developers.

The day Linux has something that comes even close to Visual Studio or C++ Builder then you can start talking about getting developers to switch to it.

>>58251522
Do you really think development on Windows is easy because of Visual Studio? And also, your picture is due to stupid people who can't use Linux to run their servers and need a GUI to get Exchange running.

>>58251522
>If you want to make Linux more popular, you must make developing on it less of a pain.
I find developing on Linux much less painful than on Windows. Considering that Windows doesn't tend to have a package manager to help with the many times you're missing several development libraries, I'd say Linux is ahead in this field.

It's the *other* fields where Linux lags behind. Basically, >>58251488 and >>58251497 covered the actual problems.

>>58251484
>Fuck Metal who uses that shit.

iOS developers

iOS is Apple's Trojan horse for market acceptance of Metal. OpenGL is now deprecated so it's just a matter of time.

Honestly it's the Khronos Group's fault for coming in dead last with Vulkan, over a year after the first Windows 10 betas with DX12 and iOS developer betas with Metal, and nearly a year after macOS developer betas with Metal.

If they had actually moved to beat or come in just after Microsoft and Apple, Vulkan may have had a chance of of achieving a wider reach. Now it's just "the Linux graphics API."

>>58251543

>because of Visual Studio
Having the best IDEs is one of the reasons, but there are many more. Being the only operating system with a well-documented object-oriented API also helps. A lot.

>stupid people
So let me get this straight: if you choose to be able to accomplish something with a less steep learning curve, you are being "stupid"?

How is it smarter having to know more in order to accomplish less?

And you look surprised when studies show Linux has much higher TCO than Windows.

>>58251577

>missing several development libraries
What libraries?

Don't blame the operating system if your company can't do proper configuration management.

>Solution: Get game developers to develop for Linux almost exclusively.
First you gotta get some gpu drivers on Linux. Even the closed source ones are flawed.

>>58251660
Linux devs brought this hardware support hell upon themselves when they decided it was okay to sign NDAs with hardware vendors.

>>58251675
>NDAs with hardware vendors
Source?

>>58251646
Basically, all the includes and libs and shit required for compiling shit. Or pretty much any software.

If your company has their shit together you only need to scrape past malware sites to find the right download once per package to add to the company standard install base, but you still need to do it.

I hear Ninite is pretty decent, but I also get the feeling that it's not for grabbing development libraries.

>>58251690

I know what libraries are. I was asking what specific libraries you were talking about.

What kind of company do you work for that loses track of the requirements for compiling their software?

>If your company has their shit together you only need to scrape past malware sites to find the right download once per package to add to the company standard install base, but you still need to do it.
Really? THAT is your reference of a company that "has their shit together"?

Have you ever heard of software engineering?

I'm gonna say this again: don't blame the operating system if you can't do proper configuration management.

>>58250798
Windows is the standard for a few reasons.

First is yes games. You are completely correct here well done. This is slowly changing but is not enough by itself...which brings us to...

The second reason...terminal. Command line. Thing that looks like a DOS prompt. Call it what you will but Linux is too heavily reliant upon it. This alone is enough to make Linux unmanageable for normies...Which leads us to...

Windows is installed by default on everything. This gives it an unfairly huge market share. Hence it's simply more profitable to develop for it and thus we end up in a situation where...

There are no games and most other software is Windows exclusive...


This is a horrible cycle in case you can't tell and it works like this:
1.Nobody wants it because it's hard (yes even the easy distros). It doesn't just werk like Windows and osx...or Android.
2.because nobody wants it it is NEVER installed by default (and yes it's been tried but people bitched hard about it because they didn't understand it...Dell for example tried this shit several times)
3.since it has no user base it's not profitable to develop for...which brings us back to 1. There are no games or software.

So just adding games DOES NOT fix the major issue.

Here's a hint...windows, OSX, iOS, Android and Chrome OS are all retard simple...Linux isn't. Not even Ubuntu.

>>58251736
Also MOAR GAMES doesn't amount to shit if the people don't stay around to play them.

When someone finally makes 'Linux for retards' and you have MOAR GAMES...well then you've got something.

>>58250798
>Problem: Windows is the standard.
>Reason: Gamers use windows.
>Solution: Get game developers to develop for Linux almost exclusively.

Problem: Windows is the standard
Actual reason: It has the word win in it.
Actual solution: Slowly change the language. Or just stop caring about things you can't control.

>>58251776
>When someone finally makes 'Linux for retards'
Many Linux distros are easy as fuck, and your typical normie distro comes with better out-of-the-box functionality than Windows. Does Windows 10 even come with a PDF reader?

I mean, yes. It could be smoother. We don't need to make it simpler though - we just need to fix a lot of silly errors that shouldn't happen.

>>58252096
Windows 10 comes with Edge for PDFs, you have to manually set PDFs to open on your regular browser now.

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>>58250798
>How do we do this? Steam is looking to Steam OS and Steam Machines, but how do you get everybody else to switch? Three, maybe four points:

By telling first time developers to reuse the code already made in other open source games like these https://yuki.la/vg/136546312#p136612903
Developers must understand they can sell existent open source games, and by putting their artwork is most guaranteed they will be satisfied. They only have to think on open source games as they were "game engines".

Second, there is an excellent ecosystem of tools for developers that goes unmatched. And I do mean unmatched. First time developers and veterans alike can benefit, rookies can make easy projects not with the multiplicity of libraries, engines and documentation, and veterans can access advanced features they wouldn't be able in other platform.

Third, all this doesn't mean they will be tied to Linux only, as all this open source platform ensures the tools are cross-platform.

Now, what we need is go to the devs we have in 4chan and tell them day and night about this.

GO GO GO!

/agdg/ - Amateur Game Dev General
>>>/vg/agdg

/gdfg/ - Game Development Feedback General
>>>/vg/gdfg

/indie/ - Indie Games General
>>>/vg/indie

>>58250798
Linux will take over Windows as the Gaming OS, is just a matter of time.

And I said it with confidence because Linux as replaced Windows in different areas before.

For example, back in 2003 Windows Server was the norm, but then Linux started taking traction to the point of today, where basically all new server infrastructure is built on top of Linux.

Why did that happen? The key was basically performance, Linux ran better than Windows, because of that choosing Linux meant less server costs and companies liked that.

Gaming is very similar in the sense that Performance is also key, if you start telling people their games will run better on Linux, you will get some to switch.

So, when will games run better on Linux than on Windows? The funny thing is that in a lot sense they already do, for example online games with Linux support like Dota 2 or CS GO have better latencies in Linux (because the network stack on linux is better than the crap Windows uses).

The problem is mainly graphics because of shitty drivers, a that's why Vulkan is such a big deal (and why Valve is supporting it instead of DX12), which Vulkan you have a more powerful API that basically gives you a better abstraction of the GPU, which basically means that we will no longer rely on shitty drivers to make the GPUs perform.

It's just a matter of time

>>58251522
>>Problem: Windows is the standard.
>How is that a "problem"?
Because of the vendor lock of course, why does this even have to be spoonfed to you? How are you even here?

Vendor locks restrict your choise and that's a bad thing. Bad things are the ones that are not good, remember those?

>>58252411

What are you talking about? Multiple vendors support Windows! You are literally nitpicking.

>>58250798
Technology literacy is becoming more and more relevant and important these days with technology advancing faster than it used to, with things becoming technologically automated and the advent of IoT devices. If you guys ever want to see a rise in GNU/Linux usage and usage of various open-source software over their closed-source counterparts, you're going to have to manually advocate for it, encourage people you know and show people yourself instead of posting on /g/ fantasizing about you're Utopian GNU/Linux dream world.

You also have to play your part in the economic sense too. Don't pay for software (games on Steam could be an exception, but IDFK), use free software.

You could also advocate for the usage of open-source encrypted messaging and other encryption tools to combat government mass surveillance (yes I realize many people don't care about NSA spying, but some do and may not be aware of what really goes on) which can help the open-source software movement significantly.

One other thing is for both Vulkan and Wayland/Mir to become the standards as opposed to OpenGL and X11 to improve performance and simplify drivers.

>>58252096
Not good enough man...here's the deal when terminal usage is 'almost never' on Linux then it's ready.

Here's how you know it's not ready. Using your browser download a few programs and install them...not from a repository mins you just straight off the web. Then double click the icon and use it.

And do this EVERY time. Without EVER resorting to a command line...just click it and install. Mouse only.

Until that happens Linux is too damned hard to appeal to normies...

ps if every distro doesn't work like this it's still too damned hard.

Now Linux has a lot going for it but this is the last hurdle.

Use Linux for 6 months and do everything other operating systems can do without ever using built in software repository or command line. Install programs (all of them) from the web and use them in any way WITHOUT using the terminal.

If this is doable then Linux is normie ready.

>>58252650
>What are you talking about? Multiple vendors support Windows! You are literally nitpicking.
Ok, looks like I fell for the bait. You really put some effort into these.

>>58252406
>this will be the year of lintard desktop for real!

>>58251522
RED HAT SHILLS ON SUICIDE WATCH!!!

>Reason: Gamers use windows.
You do know games existed before windows, right ?


>Solution: Get game developers to develop for Linux almost exclusively.
Why do you faggot want to take away choice from people?
The correct answer is "make Linux more attractive for game developers"

>>58252922
Games existed before windows sure, but any person who regularly plays video games is going to use windows and only windows.

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>>58252741
>normies are too dumb to use pic related and find it easier to search in Google and download .exe's from random websites

Normie genocide when?

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>>58250798
>Gaben

Don't ever compare that kike to RMS again.

>>58253637
Ignoring the problem or mocking it does not make it go away.

As far as most people are concerned this makes linux a failure that is difficult to use.

>>58253944
So the best thing we can do is make a linux distro so easy to use people might actually think it's a good OS?

>>58250798
People need to actually buy games with SteamOS support. Nobody wants to spend time developing games on Linux if they can't recoup the cost of development.

>>58253664
But Stallman is an actual kike whereas Gaben wishes to be one.

>>58250798
>How do we do this?
You can't. There is no universal Linux platform. Until one exists you can't develop games for it.

>>58253637
Also not every program is in the repository.it cannot ever be all encompassing.

>>58250798
grow grey beards ofc

>>58253944
>As far as most people are concerned this makes linux a failure that is difficult to use.

Honestly, the Linux community doesn't want people who are too dumb to use GUI software managers in which you literally just click the apps you want and then install. It sure as fuck is simpler and faster than clicking next half a dozen times with 12 different install wizards.

>>58250798
How old are you?

>>58250878
it's the reason why it's the standard with technically knowledgeable people

>>58254065
can't you just statically link your libraries?

>>58250798
>Reason: Gamers use windows.
/g/ is really this deluded

>>58254138
This.

Common people, developing a game is more easy on Linux.

>>58251522
>Windows is a standard because you can't do enterprise computing without it.
kekt

>>58250798
>How do we do this?

Well, most reasonable solution would be push for cross platform standards, like OpenGL and Vulkan.

Linux gaming is either endlessly fucking around with wine and ending up with a barely playable buggy mess, or buying a port from a bunch of incompetent mac porters which runs about 50% slower than the windows version. No thanks.

>>58256184
Valve was established because Doom sold more copies than DOS.

Software is what pushes popularity of operating system not the other way around.

>>58250798
>Reason: Gamers use windows.

That aint the reason.
The reason Windows is the standard is it comes pre-installed on all new computers.

>>58256834
No, the reason is that Linux is shit. When Linux users and developers understand this and the need for radical improvement they might have a chance of at least surpass OS X marketshare at some point. Otherwise Linux will be forever a nerd OS for people with lots of free time.

I want to see Stallman and Gaben wrestle in a mud pit.

>>58253664
Stallman is literally a jew though doesn't act like one.

>>58250798
There is more to it than just games. Office and autocad software are bigger deals than vidya.

Despite what every neckbeard thinks, Windows is still the OS you use for productivity. I can use both because I'm not a retard and know how to use a computer on a basic level, but most people don't, and don't care for that matter.

Ensure a push for more industry software (Solidworks, video editing, libre office) and then we'll talk.

>inb4 openCAD

>>58250835
This...

>>58256870
I bet you are one of then idiots promoting single standards at all cost, fuck off

>>58256871
I second this

>/v/edditors still think that videogames is the only reason why computers exist

holy fuck please go back to your respective subreddits and stop polluting this board with the horseshit of yours

>>58256933
>implying that is what anons here say
Lear to read you stupid faggot troll

Start by making linux usable for the average person. Linux is a fucking mess that only neckbeard turbo nerds care about.

>>58250798
Android games make more money than PC games through IAPs alone.

>>58254122
>Honestly, the Linux community doesn't want people who are too dumb to use GUI software managers
kinda shitty if you consider that the majority is exactly that

I've been using SteamOS on an old Phenom II box as my sole gaming machine since the launch of Steam controller.

Valve is really building something great here. It requires no management besides selecting "I wish to update now" when you are ready to update and it doesn't force you to update. It's also very easy to install and launch games. No other usable features though.

The controller makes a huge catalog of mouse+keyboard only games accessible onto the couch and sharing your controller settings is easy. I think the controller is a true gift to gaming as it gives the user power over controls.

Only thing they need is building the catalog but it'll happen over time. They've been adding 600+ games each year since Steam on Linux was launched currently totaling around 3000 or 18% of the total catalog.

I can understand that gaming enthusiast might be put off since all the titles aren't available yet but I just play what's available and that is enough for me. I already have more games than I have time to play.

>>58251238
Wine wrapper is just fine. I don't care as long as it works. Proper ports are of course better but I do understand that it might be hard to port over something that was developed exclusively for Windows.

>>58251736
>>58252741
Distributions that don't require any use of terminal ever:
-Android
-ChromeOS
-SteamOS

Having a terminal in general purpose desktop OS is essential. Even Microsoft acknowledges this by adding Ubuntu Bash userland in recent update to W10.

>>58257529
Only for niche developer use ;^)

>>58251776
>When someone finally makes 'Linux for retards'
It really amazes me that people still say these things when we have Steam OS and Kodi. These operating systems pander to the lowest common denominators (gaymers and media consumers). So, technically, we have "Linux for Retards".

>>58251522
Business computing for business majors != Enterprise computing

Basically Windows is for people who can't be bothered to learn how an actual computer works and just want fancy graphs that other business majors can understand without having to interpret real data.

Also pampering developers is how you end up with software just throwing exception text into a window instead of actually handling the error.

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>>58257706
I'm trying to figure out how we can make it more retard proof than this.

People don't need MS Office or games at all. There are plenty of Apple users proving that. It's just that people are too lazy to move away. And their computer comes with Windows by default.

>>58257944
only give them one browser choice; the chrome botnet

>>58257396
That controller was so iffy at first I almost regretted buying it. Glad they updated the software side of things and it is now my favorite controller unless an FPS is involved

>>58251238
>5% of your monthly fee
you mean my wage? lolnope
they get 1-5 bucks at best, if it was really useful

>>58251522
whewee lad, do you even know what C++ is? Visual Studio is a piece of shit, developing on linux is best.