/dpt/ - Daily Programming Thread

real thread >>57270889

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>>57270913
>made later
>advertised later

What's real about that thread?

le java POO IN LOO

haha, object oriented programming is GOOD FOR NOTHING. lawl code monkeys PAJEET

le HASKELL. and EMACS

>>57270930
Add a "webcucks can't average two ints in C" and we have a complete dpt going on.

>>57270923
this one doesn't have anime in the op

>>57270967
Have you ever seen two pictures of him at different angles?
No.

Because he's 2d.

important poll, which language should i use going through "cracking the coding interview"? http://www.strawpoll.me/11519740

>>57270930
emacs is the king my man

>>57270987
>shit language
>language only used out of necessity
>horrible language
>barely a language
>bash

nice selection

> Hence, the type for our insertion function is going to be something like a -> Tree a - > Tree a. It takes an element and a tree and returns a new tree that has that element inside. This might seem like it's inefficient but laziness takes care of that problem.

Can someone give me an idea of HOW laziness works internally, to deal with the apparent inefficiency.
Just handwaving the problem with 'laziness' seems... lazy.

>>57270903
No, it's because the side effects induced by IO are not (internally) observable due to the sequencing. How it's implemented is completely irrelevant.

Talking about IO in the way you are falls apart when you introduce unsafePerformIO.

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I have an idea.
Someone make a repo on github and we all pull request stupid shit.

>>57271031
enjoy your TOS violation

>>57271014
The old tree is never mutated.
So you can just keep pointers to it.

>>57271020
>unsafePerformIO
non-standard

>>57271035
why

>>57271014
It comes from the observation that you don't always need to evaluate an argument to pass it as a parameter. Laziness allows you to pass unevaluated terms around. Technically, applying arguments to the insertion function doesn't actually insert anything until you evaluate it enough.

>>57271020
>performing mental gymnastics in order to justify IO monads

Are all Haskellfags this delusional?

>>57271038
So under the hood, every Haskell program is just a lot of pointer spaghetti?

>>57271071
misogyny

>>57271084
>mom how do binary trees work?

>>57271062
Haskell is de facto GHC Haskell.

>>57271077
???

>>57271084
Simple answer: Yes.

>>57271093
lmao

>>57271101
>Haskell is de facto GHC Haskell.
{-# LANGUAGE Safe #-}

>>57271115
That's Safe Haskell.

>>57271014
things aren't evaluated until they have to be

>>57271125
Are you saying normal Haskell is unsafe?

What about type safety?

>>57271125
AKA Real Haskell

is abstraction hated here?

>>57271108
Good to know. Pointer indirection can really slow a program down if done a lot.

>>57271095
Go to bed, Pajeet.

Go and Node JS have the best package importing

>>57271146
Depends on the abstraction.

>>57271146
Abstraction is welcomed, unnecessary abstraction is shunned.

what's dpt's favorite design pattern?

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Why shouldn't I fall for the FRP hype train?

>>57271138
GHC provides non-standard unsafe functions

>>57271146
The OOP fans in this thread hate it because it reminds them how worthless their paradigm is
See how >>57271160 refers to "unnecessary abstraction" - he's probably going to follow that up with "just use xyz oop design pattern x500 lines"

>someone actually did
>>57271174
holy shit

>>57271156
please don't restart the go thing
no one learns anything

>>57271174
[spoiler]Math[/spoiler]

>>57270923
>>57270966
nah, its someone so pathetic that they wanted to create a new one just so it has a picture of some shit kids cartoon

>>57271189
So I take it you believe monads are unnecessary abstraction then.

Got it.

>>57271174
I like to wrap objects with dummy objects. It is possible to write wrappers four-levels deep that do absolutely nothing, and almost no one will notice.

>>57271138
Yes, actually. There's no guarantee of termination, so every type has an extra inhabitant:

bad :: a
bad = bad

Add in unsafePerformIO, and every type a has its expected values + an infinite loop + IO a. The programmer has to be trusted to keep these under wraps.

It's not practical to have a general-purpose programming language that is also 100% safe without programmer responsibility.

>>57271156
>import directly from github
>no versioning
>have to rename and copy everything into project repository
>best importing

>>57271209
No, they're not only necessary but they aren't good enough

Monad transformers and type classes are pretty good

Any second now some autist will bitch about linear type systems. Don't listen to him. Also don't listen to idrisfag, effect systems are a meme.

>>57271153
>Pointer indirection can really slow a program down if done a lot.
True, and heap management is one of the biggest factors slowing Haskell down, but this is why GHC has a lot of optimizations to avoid these scenarios when it can.

But obviously you don't want to use Haskell in an embedded system. If you're getting to the point where you have to use a lot of tricks to enhance performance, it better be localized to small part of your program or you shouldn't be using Haskell.

>>57271225
>It's not practical to have a general-purpose programming language that is also 100% safe without programmer responsibility.

But that sure doesn't stop Haskell from trying tho!

Which idiomatic strlen implementation is better?
The correct answer will be posted momentarily.

char *strrev(char *dest, const char *src)
{
    unsigned len = strlen(src);
    int i, idx = 0;
    for (i = len - 1; i >= 0; i--)
        dest[idx++] = src[i];
    dest[idx] = '\0';
    return dest;
}

char *strrev(char *dest, const char *src)
{
    unsigned len = strlen(src);
    src = src + len;
    while ((*dest++ = *--src))
        if (src == src - len)
            break;
    *dest = '\0';
    return dest - len;
}

>>57271225
this isn't generally a problem because the program can never do anything after calling bad, bad will block evaluation indefinitely

>>57271230
>abstractions are bad, oop is shit because abstractions
>but monads are good, but they good be even more abstract

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>>57271230
>Any second now some autist will bitch about linear type systems. Don't listen to him. Also don't listen to idrisfag, effect systems are a meme.

>>57271243
Haskell is seriously falling behind when it comes to safety.

>>57271249
I suppose it depends if you consider non-termination to be safe or unsafe. It's safe in the sense that it's not a vulnerability per se, but it can lead to denial of service.

>>57271264
that's not what he said at all

>>57271232
I just like to be aware of the real world limitations of the tools i use.

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>>57271279
A node in a binary tree consists of an element and two pointers to additional nodes

>>57271290
why does that book change lifes?
how can it be so strong

>>57271313
It's the second best book

>>57271120
MENTAL GYMNASTICS

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>>57271244
>tasty code
>mfw

I would prefer the former. As side note, the latter has a random unnecessary pair of parentheses.

>>57271279
Makes sense.

>>57271333
we get it, you don't understand him

>i am angry
>angry about controlling side effects

>>57271348
WHY CAN'T I PERFORM SIDE EFFECTS IN THE MIDDLE OF STRING LITERALS?!
FUCKING MATHEMATICIANS

>>57271290
>A node in a binary tree consists of an element and two pointers to additional nodes
Don't need pointers, mang. A binary tree can be represented in a linear array where a node at index N will have it's leftmost child at position 2*N and rightmost child at 2*N + 1

    root
   /      \
  A      B
 /  \     /  \
C D   E  F

| 0   | 1     | 2 | 3 | 4 | 5 | 6 | 7
| nil | root | A | B | C | D | E | F

>>57271374
thanks for the heap anon

>>57271374
Fuck

    root
   /   \
  A     B
 / \   / \
C   D E   F

>>57271392
>>57271374

--no-preserve-root

>>57271374
No, this setup can only represent complete binary trees.

>>57271290
>and two pointers
I was going to argue with you that this is not necessarily true, and there are other ways to implement a binary tree, but then i realized i'm wrong because all the other ways essentially are equivalent to pointers.
That doesn't mean we want our data structures fragmented all over the free store, causing cache misses on every operation, though.

>>57271386
Doesn't need to be a heap, you can represent a binary search tree or red black tree the same way. It just makes more sense for a binary heap, because of how you populate each tree depth.

>>57271410
False

>>57271430
Give me an array which would represent a non-complete binary tree.

>>57271410
See >>57271416

You can easily replace any of those indexes with NIL. I'll make an example, two secs.

>>57271374
And what is the computational difference between array indexing an pointer indirection?

Why do monads trigger codemonkeys so easily?

>>57271452
monads trigger codemonkeys because codemonkeys fear the unknown

>>57271452
Because we don't understand it, and for those of us who've studied a little philosophy there's also the additional trigger of Leibniz being bullshitty.

>>57271374
So if I add stuff down one branch for 100 levels I need to use 2^100 * node memory just to store one leaf and 99 nodes?

>>57271442
That's retarded. You would guarantee a Theta(2^h) memory cost for no reason, and nodes could be entered with NIL parents.

>>57271437
>>57271410
>>57271442

    root
   /   \
  A     B
 /     / \
C     E   F
     / \
    G   H

| 0 | 1 | 2 | 3 | 4 | 5 | 6 | 7 | 8 | 9 | 10| 11| 12| 13| ...
|NIL| r | A | B | C |NIL| E | F |NIL|NIL|NIL|NIL| G | H | ...

>>57271451
A memory lookup, which ***can*** lead to a cache miss in worse case.

But that's really not an argument, because any large tree represented as an array with size > page size will have the same issue.

>>57271437
[1, nil, 2]

>>57271486
Well, yes. But then you can use linked array lists (where each array is a node in the linked list of a fixed size), in order to avoid that.

>>57271510
>nil
Not a number.

>>57271437
[root, A, B, C, D, E]

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Sorry for being a total moran,

Could someone do me the favor of explaining what the 'new' keyword in Java actually does and when I should use it, or if I even have to use it?

In return a cute penguin.

>>57271495
>A memory lookup, which ***can*** lead to a cache miss in worse case.
So, exactly the same thing then.

>>57271533
never use new, use the factory design pattern instead

>>57271495
>>57271510
So you're making it an array of boxed types just to suit this retarded data structure?

In theory, I can represent a red black tree as a linked list too, as the breadth-first traversal accompanied by an integer how many NILs we passed by horizontally to reach the next element. But that's so retarded it's not even a factor of consideration when implementing a red black tree.

>>57271514
Oh fuck, he actually said it.
>>57271523
That doesn't even make sense. The first element is unused, not the root, since otherwise the parent math becomes more complicates.

>>57271533
It allocates and initialises a object instantiation of a specified class.

class Person {
    String name;
}

class MyProgram {
    public static void main(String[] args) {
        Person john = new Person();
        john.name = "John";

        Person alice = new Person();
        alice.name = "Alice";

        System.out.println(john.name);
        System.out.println(alice.name);
    }
}

>>57271533
In Java, you use 'new' to create instances, aka objects, of your classes.

>>57271563
complicated*

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>>57271560
>design pattern

>>57271560
Don't listen to this memester.

>>57271533
It's hard to explain "new" in a vacuum. Take a look at some guides like https://docs.oracle.com/javase/tutorial/java/javaOO/objectcreation.html

I've been teaching myself TemplateHaskell for improved shitposting capabilities in inane programming "challenge" threads.

I wrote code to generate functions that will uncurry lists. It's totally useless and there is no sane reason I know of to uncurry a function so it'll take a list, but I had fun doing it.

genCurries :: Int -> Q [Dec]
genCurries n = mapM mkCFun [1..n]
  where
    mkCFun n = do
        fun <- uncurryListN n
        let name = mkName $ "uncurryL" ++ (show n)
        return $ FunD name [Clause [] (NormalB fun) []]


uncurryListN n = do
    f <- newName "f"    --Function to apply
    xs <- newName "xs"  --List to apply it to
    body <- (buildChunk (VarE f) (VarE xs) (n-1))
    return $ LamE [VarP f, VarP xs] body
    where
        buildChunk f' ys n = do
            Just h <- lookupValueName "head"
            Just t <- lookupValueName "tail"
            let curr = AppE f' (AppE (VarE h) ys)
            if n == 0 then
                return curr
            else
                buildChunk curr (AppE (VarE t) ys) (n - 1)

>>57271573
>>57271579
Do I have to use it to create a new instance/object, or is it just good practice?

>>57271586
Thanks I'll look at this.

>>57271552
>So, exactly the same thing then.
Depends on your access pattern, tree size, node size etc.

>>57271563
>So you're making it an array of boxed types just to suit this retarded data structure?
You can call it "retarded" if you want, but it's not far from how B trees are implemented.

It's not far from how B trees are implemented desu.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/B-tree

I am trying to learn c++. but this program does not loop correctly

http://pastebin.com/QFJQM6MM

How does everyone feel about Java becoming a compiled language?

>>57271608
>Do I have to use it to create a new instance/object
In Java, yes. Or at least implicitly (which means that it is used at some point somewhere).

Some object instances require a lot of setting up, where you might use a factory pattern or a builder pattern. But even so, 'new' is still used to instantiate the object itself. Patterns are anyway way down the line, you should not focus on that until you get a good grasp on object-oriented programming.

>>57271609
First of all, you don't necessarily need boxed types to implement B trees, and second of all, I can name random data structures too.

>>57271622

//repeat asking
  std::cout<<"do you want to do it again ? Y/N ";

Pro tip: Avoid "useless" comments.

>>57271649
Java is already a compiled language.

>>57271654
You seem angry for some reason. I just pointed out to anon that there are multiple ways of representing a data structure, that doesn't require the programmer to declare a left and right pointer.

There's no need to get upset.

>>57271563
You might be right. I'm too tired to think that through now. The point is you can trivially drop the rightmost leaves from the array representation of a complete binary tree.

ok memes aside, which language should be my primary language for mastering for code interviews, java or C++?
http://www.strawpoll.me/11520053
i'm going to be a csci grad next year and i want to get started mastering a language

>>57271672
Real, ahead of time compilation

>>57271697
>Real, ahead of time compilation
It is already, anon.

>>57271690
Learn Scheme or OCaml instead.

Honestly, any entry-level job that expects mastery of all the "fiddly" bits of a language/memorization of the API is going to be a shit job anyway. Just get good at a language and understand the broad strokes.

>>57271727
>don't waste your time actually learning a language, you should just have an abstract concept so you can write fizzbuzz in an obscure language instead

>>57271714
Nope

>>57271727
that's the opposite of what i hear you should do for google. there was a seminar they held that i watched and they said any language you include on your resume they will expect you to be able to program in without an IDE and solve their challenges

>>57271750
It is.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/GNU_Compiler_for_Java
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Java_processor

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Java_bytecode

>>57271697
>>57271750
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/No_true_Scotsman

>>57271014
It assumes the hardware is created for these functions rather than creating portable functions.

>>57271763
Well, you were stupid enough to ask 4chan for help, it was worth a shot.

>>57271674
Well, I feel like being critical today. Sorry if I sound abrasive. The point is, there's an infinite number of ways you can represent anything, but the crazy schemes people are cooking up in this thread are just stupid.

Take this one, for example:
>Well, yes. But then you can use linked array lists (where each array is a node in the linked list of a fixed size), in order to avoid that.
If you do this, you've lost the advantages of every other possible data structure to represent this binary tree.

Finding your parent takes linear time. Finding your left child takes linear time. Finding your right child takes linear time. Performing tree rotations takes linear time. These are all (besides tree rotations in some cases) constant time operations under any sane representation.

>>57271770
http://openjdk.java.net/jeps/295

>>57271244
Those are both wrong.

void strrev(char *a)
{
  char *b = a + strlen(a) - 1;
  while (a < b) {
    char tmp = *b;
    *b-- = *a;
    *a++ = tmp;
  }
}

I'm in a visual basic class
I've made a simple price calculator but I need it to keep track of every number it outputs and print preview those numbers when I hit print
Of course google is completely fucking useless as always and my dumbass teacher won't answer my question
Please help

>>57271763
i think you can choose whatever mainstream language you want. they're not going to spin a wheel to pick it or anything

>>57271804
>learning VB
>current year

>>57271792
>Finding your parent takes linear time. Finding your left child takes linear time. Finding your right child takes linear time. Performing tree rotations takes linear time. These are all (besides tree rotations in some cases) constant time operations under any sane representation.
Well, it's very late so I may be wrong. But I think this is not entirely correct: You know the index of your parent (N/2), you know the index of your children (2*N,2*N+1), so the thing that takes linear time is finding the correct array, not the node itself.

>>57271850
It's a required class

>>57271796
Well, to be fair, that has a different method signature than the original.

>>57271857
The thing is, you know the index of your parent, but in a setup full of linked lists you no longer have the ability to access the index N/2 in constant time. You have to traverse the lists.

>>57271847
i think i'm going to go with c++ then even though you guys voted on java in the poll. i unironically don't like the fact java isn't compiled and you have to do a bunch of special snowflake shit for it and NEED an ide

>>57271792
>>57271857
For example, if I chain two arrays of 4096 elements each, then node lookup is O(m * log n) where m <<<< n (a lot less than)

It's not O(n * log n)

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>he didn't use an anime image for OP

I need to learn JavaScript and some big front-end framework.

Is there a list of tools for javascript development that gets close to what Visual Studio provides for C#? Chrome obviously, for debugging and stepping.

>>57271880
I assumed as much. The fact that it is does not speak well of your institution.

>>57271881
>The thing is, you know the index of your parent, but in a setup full of linked lists you no longer have the ability to access the index N/2 in constant time. You have to traverse the lists.
Yes, that's true.

>>57271888
Why did you have the poll at all?

Also
>i unironically don't like the fact java isn't compiled
It is compiled

>you have to do a bunch of special snowflake shit for it
Bundling the runtime with the executable is not special snowflake shit, that's what you do in C# as well

>NEED an ide
No you don't, you just need a text editor and javac

>>57271921
>It is compiled
it isn't compiled

>>57271892
Generally, in algorithm analysis, the best case isn't considered - the example you have is one of the best cases - the main focuses are average case and worst case. In our scenario, the worst case is linear, since the worst case is alternating NILs and numbers where valid, and the average case (I believe) is dominated by permutations of leaves and NILs for the last row of the BST, which is the same scenario as the worst case.

>>57271902
Aptana is the closest i'm aware of, just in case no one will provide a better reply.

>>57271946
It is, for fuck's sake. It is compiled to Java bytecode, which can be ran in a virtual machine or in an actual fucking machine (see Java processors). You can also use GCC and just compile it directly to native x86 if you fucking want.

>>57271946
Then what does javac do? Bake brownies?

>>57271951
Actually, it's definitely linear for the average case, since the less balanced the tree is, the taller it is, which results in more nodes.

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This man is a MONAD

He is your FRIEND

>>57271987
>>57271951
I agree with you, it's definitively suboptimal for a binary search tree.

However, thinking about linked arrays of elements is useful when it comes to being aware of data proximity and cache misses. It's a separate argument I agree, I'm just tired and not able to form good sentences right now.

>>57271981
javac reduces it into byte codes which are interpreted by the jvm. a compiled language has no interpreter, so java isn't a compiled language

>>57271946

Wrong

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>>57272043
>javac reduces it into byte codes
Also known as compiling. Did you know the c in javac stands for compile?

>>57272043
See >>57271968 and >>57271770


The JVM can be an actual physical machine.

Also
>interpreted
Are you saying that your x86 computer is not interpreting a sequence of 0s and 1s (also known as opcodes and operands) into doing logical arithmetics and memory loads and stores??

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>>57272062

>>57272040
Yeah, I know the feeling. It's the worst when you've stayed up late for an exam and feel that way. And a linked list of array "segments" is actually quite useful, (shrinks the O(n) traversal coefficient quite a bit) I just haven't seen it used for binary trees.

>>57272120
>I just haven't seen it used for binary trees.
Of course, it's ridiculous.

>>57272074
> Did you know the c in javac stands for compile?
Not an argument. Calling something something doesn't make it so.

It's correct in this case though. Javac is a compiler.

>>57272043
If you're just going to make up your own definitions of words...

>tfw pedantry turns into an interesting and civil discussion

>>57272145
We're (almost) all grownups here.

>>57272145
Literally where?

>>57272145
Welcome to adultery. Wait, i mean adulthood!

I'm making a shitty binding library for fun.

Does this look like it would be maintainable or would it turn into a clusterfuck?

// Wrap the "#info" element in a bindable container. The container
// has the same properties as the original element but those properties
// are now streams instead of raw values.
let wrappedInfo = Element.wrap(document.querySelector("#info"))

// Create some reactive streams.
let showInfo1 = Stream.from(document.querySelector("#info-checkbox"), "click")
                      .map(x => x.checked ? "block" : "none")
                      
let showInfo2 = Stream.from(document, "keyup")
                      .filter(x => x.keyCode == 13)
                      .scan(x, _ => x == "block" ? "none" : "block", "block")

// The CSS display value of "#info" will always be equal to
// the latest value of the showInfo1/showInfo2 streams.
wrappedInfo.style.display = Stream.merge(showInfo1, showInfo2);

The stream part is basically exactly the same as any other FRP library (I'll probably just use an existing one), it's more about the container.

>>57272097
>CNN

Heh

>>57272145
Kek, that won't happen on this shit hole. Someone's always looking to start arguments over a fucking typo.

>>57272163
Looks neat.

Programming is hard.

>>57271189
I think people hate abstraction here because it isn't labelled for them. Much like people dislike "unreadable" code.

If I see a swap, I know a swap occured because the variables were swapped. I don't need someone to call it a swap.

Just the same, if I see a function that acts like a monad, I'm going to call it a struct because it's a struct. I don't care if you labelled it "cool_foo::bar( nyah )".

>>57272401
small children do it

>>57272406
>if I see a function that acts like a monad, I'm going to call it a struct because it's a struct
wat

>>57272442
He thinks monads are objects.

Installing Haskell.

I added it to my ssd and regretted my decision halfways through, clicked cancel and am stuck waiting while it installs just so I can re-install it. I'm wondering if clicking accept will make it take longer this time..

>>57272177
Ruby loves doing that. That's why he's filtered.

>>57272412
Small children make me hard.

>>57272442
No, if a pointer is the main point of return for all functions in a program and each function handles all types of data ( like a template ) with only limited casting prior to handing it information, I'm going to call it a monad. And praise that programmer for having such a great and intuitive mind. For great good!

>>57272412
Well, i'm not a small child, am i.

>>57272490
Am I being curried?

>>57272454
Did mommy say `interfere`? No? back to javascript with you.

>>57272510
Angry imperative pleb detected.

>>57272462
This is bullshit. I happen to like Ruby because he's thoroughly objective. You guys turn this into a fight to protect the queen, e.v.e.r.y.t.i.m.e. Oh wait, I used a metaphor.

>>57272454
No, an object will access monads that apply proper behavior to it. It's just one level above abstraction. The difference between a good programmer and you, is that a good programmer knows that abstraction will then be applied after the fact of creating the object and not creating objects based on abstractions. That's bad science. That's almost...blergh...psychology.

>>57272509
No, you are being inducted into a markov chain over a binary tree that is pre-defined without an object in mind. You're being made a specialist or defaulting to an autist neet. Thank the mods over policy.

What framework can I use to program up a will to live?

>>57272535
Imperative? So you are female.

Remember, boys. You can't reason with them. Reason doesn't work with them.

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mom?

>>57272594
The analogy of the makov chain here is that a markov chain "hovers" over an independent body. When that body evaluates a fact, the markov chain manifests over it and denies it access to higher truths but still accepts its evaluation as a possible truth. It then passes that information to where its needed and the body subordinate to the markov chain is none the wiser. The subordinate here could plausibly be correct, else why refer to it, but then is treated like a singleton system from which the markov chain can derive a stance from an enumerated set.

It's basic AI. This is how you lock processes in a concurrent system. Also, how you avoid contaminating a database. Take from the string, not the binary. Javascript functions like this. Python too, I think.

If that sounds crazy to you, javascript is easy. HTML is even easier. I'm learning html right now.

>>57272603
Just breathe into someone's mouth, you disgusting ape.

>>57272704
This is one of the more confusing insults i've received in my life desu.

>>57272734
This thread is seriously confusing. It's like some angry anti-haskell nerd is false flagging by spouting a bunch of generic bullshit in random order to give haskell a bad name.

I mean, who would even do such a thing?

>>57272734
>disgusting ape
Seems pretty straightforward to me.

>>57272734
Why because she "loves" you?

I'm saying the will to live doesn't come from things. It's already inherent to you. If you need an estrogen boost or the satisfaction of having boosted someone just go do the mouth breather thing. Or have a drink, like your mom used to.

>>57272749
Stop false flagging haskell. That was me earlier and I'm installing haskell right now. Or is this just the botnet doing its thing again and trying to point all posts to the same "cAHWWse"?

>>57272778
take your meds, your mother is worried

>>57272163
>

                      .scan(x, _ => x == "block" ? "none" : "block", "block")

Doesn't this line parse as:

                      .scan(x, (_ => x == "block" ? "none" : "block"), "block")

?
If you want x and _ as parameters of the lambda shouldn't you say:

(x, _) => ...

?

Why does every captcha ask me to spell "Calle"?

>>57272821
hand me a tissue, I'm crying witchu

anyway, programming is for special people. Not some normie with access to the ip address table and some win10 hacks. You haven't even touched on the topic, you just keep repeating the same shit over and over in every thread.

I'm arguing with a bot, aren't I? Python is pretty much only good for this kind of thing.

Learning lisp was a mistake, but I've already bought three books
I'm in to deep, I can't just quit, or I will have wasted my time.

>>57272848
>(x, _) => ...
Yes, this is correct. The code wasn't run since I was just getting a rough idea what I wanted to make.

This thing is stuck installing the uninstaller. How funny.

why are there no decent tui libraries in haskell
a hello world with the brick library is 8mb.

>>57272883
Is that why you're making all these weird posts that are confusing and scaring me?

>>57272872
>three books
Is SICP one of them? If yes, just read that.

If no, shame on you and read SICP.

>>57272918
Is that how you tell the subordinates no so that they continue doing your work for you and you just shitpost with me while I wait for this installer and answer questions? Nothing about what I've said is scary. Everyone on here HAS TO BE 18 years or older. We're all adults and it makes sense that someone learn what mommy does in order for them to be able to keep her safe from would be aggravations in her senility.

I'm in the very beginning stages of learning how to use vim and I have a small problem. Constantly shifting my right hand between hjkl for cursor movement and jkl; for typing is getting kind of annoying. Is this something that I'll just get used to or would I be better off changing this behavior in vim (if that's possible)?

>>57272918
no
bought an AI with common lisp book
another one for advanced macro writing
and the first one was for beginners common lisp

>>57272975
thumb on space and move your fingers according to the slide.

>>57272981
Read SICP first.

AI in Lisp is a meme that died in the 70s and has been a laughing stock since.

>>57273091
>AI in Lisp is a meme that died in the 70s and has been a laughing stock since.
Yeah, I don't get where this keeps being perpetuated from.

>>57272975
I rarely need to hit h so I stay on jkl;

>>57273091
I thought lisp originated with intentions of working on AI

I'm so excited for haskell but it won't install. You guys think I should just do it without stack and download everything separate?

>>57272975
Why wouldn't you rest your middle/ring/pinky on K/L/; respectively and just move your pointer finger between J and H as you needed?

Were you never taught how to touch-type?

>>57273141
What platform are you on? Installing GHC shouldn't be difficult.

I'll be unavailable in a moment, so I'll reply in like 30 minutes.

>>57273140
It certainly caught on in the field of AI for a while, and then lost its luster when we gradually figured out what worked and what didn't, and that Lisp didn't really offer something special we needed (and came with performance costs).

>>57273198
Getting to installing isnt' difficult or troublesome. It's waiting on that progress bar as it refuses to move that's annoying. I've tried it with several hdds now and it still gets stuck in the same place. Should I go 32 bit? Dual boot a linux and work out of there? I really can't stand ubuntu configurations anymore. My computer sounds like an ape!

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When you finish your exams and start looking for job

>>57273336
that title...

>>57273240
What platform are you on? You have a lot of options, but if Windows is what's giving you trouble you can either dual boot Linux or (usually easier) run Linux in a virtual machine using VirtualBox or something. Then just install GHC on your Linux VM.

>>57273336
Are you sure that's real and not a ruse?

>>57273336
Kek, looks like they put junior developer instead of senior

>>57273336
this

but seriously on must "junior" titles it always says at least 2 years of experience

how is that possible? how do new grads get hired?

I also have never seen any job opening that requires less than 1 year work experience

>>57273431
I tried the haskell irc and no one was able to help in the short span of time I was there so I'm looking at slackware and centos downloads right now. I need something that works out of usb. I'm hoping to run some heavy numbers once I get it going to burn it in to my board. I'm so sick of the smell. :p

If I'm wanting to stay off the edge and avoid any possibility of shillery and/or drama based on the system, what would you guys recommend? Like, if my OS would have to come up the least in conversations around the web, which of these two do you think is most stable and less commercial for the task of development?

If I want to learn webdev what order should I learn the languages?

>>57273198
so what, use c++ or something?
but I'm reading for the ai concepts, surely they can translate to other languages

>>57273431
>Are you sure that's real and not a ruse?
Maybe

>>57273462
Well, they want you to be their slave for few months first, and if they like you, they will give you some shitty job.
My friend is one of best c/c++/c#/java programmer i know and when he was searching for job, he needed to work 2 months for fucking 200euros per month. That was his "testing" period. Now he has like 700 euros, that is still very low.
btw. this is in poor eastern europe

Not sure if anyone will be able to help me with this but here goes.
In C, I've got a variable

void *(*some_callback)(void);
// ...
dicks *op_likes(void);
// ...
// I can't assign op_likes to some_callback, because I can't cast function pointers to void * function pointers
// some_callback = op_likes;
// but I thought this would work
void *op_likes_wrapper(){
         return (void*) op_likes();
}
// but this gives an error, saying I'm trying to cast a function * to a void *
some_callback = op_likes_wrapper;

Anyone have any insight into what the correct way to do this is?

>>57272043
>a compiled language has no interpreter
Looks like C isn't a compiled language anymore then
https://root.cern.ch/cint

>>57273571
Shit, nvm, I figured it out, I was actually calling the function when I tried to assign, so I was casting a void * to a function pointer

>>57272043

>which are interpreted by the jvm
This is actually false.

>>57273502
>install XAMPP
>HTML (markup instead of programming, but will be useful)
>CSS
>PHP
>Less/Sass/other CSS preprocessors
>SQL
>JS
>move to Linux or BSD instead of Windows
>bourne shell
>move to Common Lisp instead of PHP
>???
>profit

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Employed Haskell programmer reporting in

>>57273617
>move to mito instead of raw sql
>move to parenscript instead of js
>move to commondoc instead of html
>set vim+slimv as user shell
>set stumpwm as window manager
>???
>achieve nirvana

>>57273638
Are you actually employed as a Haskell programmer or do you do something else and use Haskell as a hobby (like, unfortunately, everybody I know who uses it)?

>>57273638
What is the longest function possible to fit into a single haskell field? Kind of like how a company will prime their structures with a specific formula, what would you recommend for simply burning in a new "pattern" into my ram cards and mobo? Something noisy preferably. I'm kind of sick of javascript and python.
>>57273685

>>57273685
I'm actually unemployed

Post discord invite.

>>57273751
>discord
Proprietary

>>57273617
Damn I started in the middle.

>>57273675
>>set vim+slimv
"no"

>>57273764
As long as you only move forwards, that's perfectly fine, specially the "instead of" parts

>>57273781
Well, climacs is a graphical IDE after all. You can just use a raw sbcl as your terminal if you like, even less heretical.

>inb4 GNU/Emacs memery

>>57273497
ahhahaahahahahaahah
faggot
I have arch and I only did

sudo pacman -S xmonad

which pulled ghc as a dependency
and it didn't break, it was already pre compiled hhahaaha
you niggers meme that arch breaks but its your distros that break lmao

>>57273497
just install gentoo or arch in a usb
arch is easier though, and has more documentation

>>57273920
I have an arch too but I don't have any blank CDs. I'm currently downloading centOS and will look to putting arch on another usb too. Thanks for the support. I love you too.

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>tfw have the discord link to the secret chatroom full of lots of /dpt/ers
>tfw not sharing it

>>57274023
Dunno, congrats?

>>57273751
https://discord.gg/dj6Qs

>>57273975
nigga you're dumb
I remember once putting arch on a usb
and I remember there being a guide for it
NO EXCUSES

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Pleas fucking help me /dpt/
tell me what the fuck is wrong.
its supposed to calculate the difference between the highest and the lowest number

>>57274152
>if x > max, x = max
does that make sense to you?

>>57274152
if (y > min) needs to be if(y < min)

>>57274152
Why x and y? Also it's supposed to be "if y<min".

>>57274193
>>57274197
ye i know that i was just trying to see if something will change if i put it that way.

>>57274191
So how do i make max=x without typing it

>>57274152
What is this even doing?

>>57274222
you didn't type max = x

>>57274069
what the fuck are you talking about

I happen to be doing other things and other kinds of research while working on this install... I'm also eating. No one is making excuses and no one needs your kind of shit. How does running a command on terminal automatically put you leagues ahead of me? I actually just read the one line command to install centOS on usb.

dd if=centOS.iso of=/dev/sdb

like niggah, what is your problem?

When I installed arch last I had to use grub and I think I'd like to avoid that this time around as I'm almost certain there is a new win config blocking that sort of thing because somehow my bootmgr was deleted upon removing the hard drive and adding it again.

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>>57274265
>>57274257
it sets max to 49 and min to 0 no matter what i type.

>>57274274
>read
>not knowing by heart

anyways, you still have to set up the system
unles you install a 3 gig iso like apricity os

>niggah
can you stop being a nog

>installing arch is hard
lmao just copy 4 commands you

>>57274312
you've completely changed the specification of the program but okay, let's talk. at least you've narrowed it down. max = x is never happening. which means x > max is never true

think about this carefully. say you put in n=2 and then enter the number 0. now i=1 and x=0. we get to x < max. what is max, at this point?

>>57274371
typo: obviously the last < should be a >. it doesn't even matter for what the eventual lesson will be

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>>57274371
already did it myself thanks for the help =]
>>57274265
really big thanks to this guy cause i though max=x was the same as x=max
but now i know it sets the first int to the second int

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can anyone tell me why my shit doesn't work?
>pic

>>57274405
better. you should know that if max is not initialized and you start to use it then there are no guarantees about what will happen. there's no default value of 0 or anything

you should how to better ask questions but i'm too tired to say what i mean by this. glad you got it working

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can someone explain to me why the output here comes out 3?

shouldn't it be undefined since n was deleted?

>>57274462
It is. There is no guarantee that the output is 3. It just so happens that nothing is done to that area of memory between the deletion and the printing.

>>57274424
Paste it:
http://paste.lisp.org/

>>57274322
>know by heart
Sorry, I don't do things the nog way.

>can you stop being a nog
I would be opposed to it, being a nog, if it weren't illegal or made you a, deemably, psycho around these parts. I didn't have the privilege.

>I said installing arch was hard
I never said that. If you're going to play programmer at least don't abide a strict 2s complements syntax to your bots. It's kind of retarded.

Oh thing I dislike likes something.
>Thing is not good
>dislike dislikes likes...likes

>>57274462
The delete command just deletes it from the heap allocation table, it would be a waste to zero out the actual memory location.

>>57274462
In C/C++ there isn't an actual value called "undefined" like there is in Javascript. If "the value of X is undefined", that means the C standard doesn't define which value X has. X will still contain a value of the appropriate type (in this case, int) but there's no guarantee what value that will be.

>>57274479
>>57274472
that makes sense, thank you

>>57274312
If you want to slide the bigger elements to one end of the array you have to lift and hold to switch the smaller array elements in its way in order to do so.

>>57274497
To be "tidy", you shouhd do n=null after deleteing it, but then trying to read *n would not be pretty.

>>57274474
http://paste.lisp.org/display/329766

>>57274531
Reading, just a sec

>>57274475
stop shitting the thread with your shitposts

>>57274517
It MIGHT not be pretty. There is no guarantee that anything will go obviously wrong.

>>57274542
LEERRROOOYYY JENNKINSSSS

>>57274517

>but then trying to read *n would not be pretty
Which is the entire point of setting n to null.

>>57274539
btw
the half delay function I added since I needed it
here what I added to the source code in the initialization file of ch-charms

(defun half-delay (tenths)
  (check-status (charms/ll:halfdelay tenths)))

>>57274582
Charms seems to be dying on me, how curious

How is a human brain able to learn on the fly? and how would you model that in a neural network?
Correct me if I'm wrong, but I think NN's are static and require some external mechanism like a GA to tune it, but that happens over generations.

>>57274622
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Online_machine_learning

>>57274582
>>57274600
Debian seems to come with an old SBCL without os-cond. Fugg. Where exactly does your snek hurt, anon?

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>>57274600
>>57274662
like this?
and I have 1.3.6

CS undergrad nearing the end of my degree, should I be worried about learning other languages and APIs and building shit if I'm just going to graduate school anyways? I haven't really seen anything in undergrad that's grabbed my attention except for maybe optimization of certain mathematical procedures

>>57274702
Let's go step by step. Start a clean sbcl, and run each sexpr until you reach the error.

>>57274738
kinda hard when you have ncurses in the picture
would do for any other kind of program though

>>57274737
you're going to graduate school despite not really loving any aspects of cs?
people do this all the time but that doesn't make it wise

>>57274777
>despite not really loving any aspects of cs
I wouldn't say I don't love any aspects, I'm certainly comfortable with pretty much everything that's been presented to me. If anything, I'm going to grad school to get a deeper knowledge and find something to really pull me in

>>57274756
It looks like your sbcl already has asdf. Try not loading it.
Also please try pasting that output too.

>>57274825
Meanwhile, on my side, it looks like the current quicklisp version of charms is borken. Which charms are you using?

>>57274622
Yeah, so having a life's worth of specialization goes against the principle of learning. You have to add variety in order for the network to be able to abide the new data structure. If that is not available, a lesion of truths acts as substitute where the truths were burned in or hardcoded through agitation, but can only act as referential and not as anything more than hard data to be read and not manipulated.

Still, learning on the fly is not impossible. It just tends to go against certain principles that have guided the network up to the point in contention. Like, for instance, having to access the registry. Tuning itself. Wiping its own ass.

>>57274861
"hard" data being "truth" in this matter. How true? As true as commonly possible.

>>57274825
Yello?

(compiles fine)
(desu)
https://0x0.st/evo.txt

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>>57274825
>>57275032

>>57274825
>>57275069
welp, looks like charms is shit
any tui libraries actually worth a danm in common lisp?

>>57274622
>I think NN's are static and require some external mechanism like a GA to tune it
Guess it's a /g/ pulls statements out of their asses episode.

>>57274891
Still, this isn't a good neural network. Simply one that'll get you the grade and the receipt. It won't guarantee you a seat in any master's course by a long shot. And if it does, definitely won't get the doctorate without stealing the info for it. Using your neural network, of course.

>>57273462
Certainly you took advantage of internships, or your school's cooperative education programs, right? And on the side, you decided to create some stuff that ended up making you a little money, which therefore counts as work experience because, if people pay you to do it, that's work. You didn't just sit on your ass and pass courses like some kind of uninterested, passionless hack, did you?

Also, there are a lot of places that list new grad positions as being different from junior positions.

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https://groups.google.com/forum/#!topic/golang-nuts/MHoI64RyRdY

wtf i hate go now

>>57275570

Before I even click on links like this, I know they're going to be about some SJW bullshit.

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I stuck around in that discord room because Ruby and GTP was in it but now it's just /r9k/ high school shitters talking about killing themselves.

>>57275703

We can talk more about black women and pegging in there, if you'd like.

>>57275703
>he didn't join the /dpt/ one
ayyy

I was sick for a few days and now I have a ton of work piled up ): Who /working through weekend/?

Since when does /dpt/ have a discord channel?

I thought we all were on IRC, what the fuck happened?

Also someone pls post a valid invite

wtf the SJW authoritarianism for who is allowed to code is real?

>>57275855
What are you talking about, anon?

>>57275839
Don't bother, it's just people posting anime and wishing they were 2D.

>>57275839
Wait, where's the IRC? Where's the discord? Where has this been in my life?

>>57276038
>it's just people posting anime and wishing they were 2D.
I repeat, where has this been in my life?

>>57276082
>I repeat, where has this been in my life?

It's actually really depressing, there's one guy in here who is on the verge of crying because he cant have a 2d anime gril.
I always thought all the /r9k/ memes were just memes, but some people really do take them to heart and it tears them apart from the inside, the roasties, the chads, everything eats at them from the inside.

>>57275817
Your job sounds like hell.

I'm dropping this book about metaprogramming, the author can't teach for shit and the examples are either too niche or impractical for what I'm looking.

>>57276105
>some people really do take them to heart and it tears them apart from the inside
Oh yeah, I'm no stranger to those types. Never actually spoken to one though. It's pretty amazing in the literal, not-necessarily-positive sense. Gives you a sense of perspective.

So uh... What server has this DPT IRC channel, might I ask? I'm really interested in both, but especially IRC.

>>57275817
>Who /working through weekend/?
You didn't actually get any sick days, then. I would start the job hunt.

>>57271587
TH can be fun.
For extra fun, fire up some IO in TH (you really can) and do something crazy.
You can create types from a database schema or a csv file for example.

>>57276185
The TH quasi quoter typically makes TH Code more readable.

>>57275102
>Correct me if I'm wrong
I guess this is a /g/ fails at reading comprehension episode.

Once again, what do I put in ,h files and what do I put in .c files?

>>57276310
.h For method signatures and comments about the implementation, .c for the actual implementation where all the function's code resides.

>not a single reply to OP
is this a record?

>>57276323
No, fuck you.
>>57270878

>>57276157
>>57276173
):

>Still programming kernels in C in twenty fucking sixteen.
Why aren't we making them in python? it'd be 2000x more stable and secure.

>inb4 b-b-b-but you NEED C/assembly for the bootloader and interrupt handlers.
No. plain wrong.

Look at this code sample:

kernel = open("kernel.bin", "r")

assembly bootloaders and BIOS mumbo jumbo BTFO.
Not only is it ONE FUCKING LINE, but it is also WAY fucking smaller than any assembly/C bootloader.

>interrupt handlers

def pagefault(signum, frame):
    # PF handler code here

signal.signal(signal.SIGSEGV, pagefault)

There, easy.

There is LITERALLY no reason to use C or C++ in kernels anymore. Python is the future.
There is no reason why Python code can't go in the motherboard firmware either.

>>57276310
You put everything in header files and advertise your library as header-only-library and as such it's ieasier to install and integrate into larger programs.
No Linking required.
t. boost maintainer

@57276356
(You)

>>57276346
What I didn't add is that I share almost the exact same sentiments, but I try pretty hard to keep it out of my life and be a normal person. So don't feel too bad. Trust me, I used to be way more autismo about it.

>>57276356
Wow, why didn't anyone think of this sooner?

>>57276356
>it'd be 2000x more stable and secure
Because also it'd be 2000x slower

>>57276356
Come on, trolling attempts shouldn't bet THAT obvious.
Put in more effort next time.

>>57276357
It sounds like bullshit.

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>>57276356
>writing the Linux kernel in Python

>>57276396
Yes exactly. Linux would be a far better kernel if it was written in Python.

>>57276394
It's exactly what many boost libraries do.

>>57275855
why would someone joke about that? That's work!

>>57276394
Nah, it's a real thing. Sacrifices the power of linking for the sake of convenience. Some say it's evil.

Just to prove I'm not bullshitting: http://eigen.tuxfamily.org/index.php?title=Main_Page
> If you just want to use Eigen, you can use the header files right away. There is no binary library to link to, and no configured header file. Eigen is a pure template library defined in the headers.

NEW THREAD!

>>57276439

>>57270878
I took three courses last semester. I just got the final grade for the last one. I got an A in one, and two F's in the others. I can't believe this. I finished my last math course in the beginning of Spring. I thought I would just be able to coast to graduation from here, but I'm getting stomped. Now I have to finish 16 courses before next September to graduate on time. The courses I failed were operating systems and networking.