So now that the dust is finally settled and we all agree that

>>42798649
Phul

5/3/1 UL

the one you made yourself

every body is unique

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Lyle generic bulk

>>42798666
satanic trips of truth, I prefer having A and B
A chest, shoulders triceps
B back, legs, 'ceps

>>42798649
Candito 'the Natty Bandito's 6 Week program.

I'm doing 5/3/1 with joker sets and BBB (doing ohp after bench press, squats after deadlifts, etc.), my strength is increasing but I'm not sure if it's the best upper/lower split

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>>42798671
But it says generic! Im a special case you see, everything has to be tailored to my special needs. You just wouldnt understand honey.

awww poor widdle waybes cant handool a PPL

awww come gif mammy a kiss on the lips

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>>42798649
doing this atm

Lower Frontsq 5x5+, sldl 4x8+
upper1 bench 5x5+, row 5x5+
upper 2 press 5x5+, pullups 5x5+

6-7 times / week. assistance work varies

>>42798702
If you working out 6 times a week you ain't lifting heavy.

If you actually lifted shit you would not be able to lift 6 times a week. You fucking pussy

I can actually get more volume doing ppxlx repeat than ulxulxx. I've been doing upper/lower for my first 15 months of lifting and made the switch to ppl this week. I'm liking ppl more because your workouts are more focused than running upper/lower and you can hit each muscle better.

>>42798725
Shut the fuck you bitch punk pussy fuck.

You pussy ass pussies know nothing about intensity. If you lifted with real intensity instead of your baby curls you'd be fucking dead.

>>42798745
Implying more volume is better.

>>42798649
>Upper/Lower
-Train 4 times at the gym, which means extra time wasted, extra commute etc
-Hit every muscle only twice a week
-inferior to PPL in terms of aesthetics, you can't do nearly as heavy chinups if you're tired from bench in an upper body session
+Your sessions are a lot shorter than full body, which works well if you have a tight daily schedule
>Full body
-Longer sessions in general. Heavy days might take more than 2 hours.
+Hit every muscle three times a week
+More off days to enjoy other hobbies
+Adjustable and specific to goal oriented training like strongman, powerlifting, weightlifting, (((CrossFit))) and other sports who use lifting as a supplement and not the end goal

>>42798758
My routine has an optimal amount of volume in the middle-higher range, as I've done my research and balanced it properly. 60-120 reps per week per large muscle group and 30-60 reps per week per small muscle group.

>>42798782
>60-120 reps per week per large muscle group
I do that in a day :)

>>42798787
Nice. What's your routine?

>>42798782
How much is your total weekly volume?

How shit are your main lifts?

>>42798766
hook me up with some research that shows working a muscle 3 times a week gets more growth than 2

i'll wait

>>42798823
Don't wait around. He will never find it mate.

>>42798823
>Hook me up with some research that says training 2x week is better than a brosplit
>Hook me up with some research that says brosplits are better than an 8 hour workout per bodypart per month
Everyone and their mother knows that muscle protein synthesis lasts 36-48 hours at most. If you're training less frequently than that, you're literally leaving gains on the table
Doing a third session even if it's light helps greatly with greasing the groove and learning motor pattern recruitment better.
It also allows more room for variety. If you want to make one of the three full body session squats a front squat, you're still back squatting 2x week. If you do the same in an UL split you're only back squatting once a week
>But then why not train 6x week
Two reasons
One, as I said before, the main advantage of full body 3x week is training less days per week
Two, 3x week respects the MPS rule. Bulgarian style methods don't, so you need very precise fatigue management and monitoring from an experienced (pricey) coach.
Finally, I didn't say UL is bad. It's just that if you want to train for aesthetics, PPL is UL, except better.

personally found this routine to work best for me at the moment.

a)chest+bis+tris (push heavy)
b)back (pull heavy)
c)legs

rest 1 day in between.

I can't iso shoulders without all the snap, crackle and pop. I work them with compounds over A & B. (wide grip press, rows for lateral and rear delts)

>>42798941
also do light cardio and stretching on those off days.

>>42798941
I hope by "1 rest day between" you mean ABCx and not AxBxCxx

>>42798649
best routine is PPPPPPx

>>42798941
you should be using your bis to pull no?

>>42798649
Swoletide GVT by far.
Without all the accessories

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>>42799028

>>42799028
While you are clinically retarded and/or juiced to the gills, Fortitude Training (which STVT is loosely based on) is actually an interesting way of doing a periodized U/L. So you are unintentionally not trolling as hard as I first thought.

>>42798882
try find it for yourself, doesn't exist, what you will find is there is no benefit of 3 times a week over 2, only 2 over 1

>>42798649
U/L and PPL doesnt work well for me, I find the volume is just stall central.

Currently on the 4-day a week Texas Method, spacing out the volume means I can add accessories and isos...I love it.

>>42798715
Sounds like someone thinks everyone still gets beginner roms.

WS4SB anyone?

>>42798673
What about your abbadabba's?

>>42799670
as often as I can with one or two days rest a week

>>42798941
do you train shoulders?

Nobody mentions jacked and tan 2.0. What's wrong with you guys?

>>42799320
Yeah, I do it like this:
Monday Heavy upper
Tuesday heavy lower
Thursday 10x10 Bench, 10x10 Curls and assistance
Friday 10x10 Diddlies
Saturday 10x10 rows 10x10 MP
Mad Gainz

>>42799365
Link? Not that guy or being a dick, I would just be interested in reading it.

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>>42798649
1 Rest day between trainings, 3x one week 4x the other making frequency 1,75 muscle/week

Only downside is that DL and squat compete for each other on Lower days

Up side is that you can have relatively high intensity/volume because the next Upper or Lower training is in 4 days.

24-48h increased MPS doesn't mean you're always good to go and 100% recovered in 48h. Recovery =/= MPS.

What do you guys think of Lyle's Bulking Routine? I would add some shoulder work to avoid becoming a shoulderlet

>>42798683
Winrar
Run c6w, analyze results, modify optional/accessory exercises to meet your specific needs. Eat a moderate caloric surplus. You'll get big and strong with relatively little to no fat gain if you do it right.

>>42800140
lol this picture is gr8

Fullbody 3x a week. It's like Upper Lower 6x a week condensed together. Obviously the volume is less but frequency is the same a who the fuck wants to go to the gym 6x a week? Do you guys not do any other sports or something ?

>>42798715
You can lift 6 days a week and still lift heavy, you just can't lift heavy 6 days a week. Nothing wrong with hitting your big lifts 2-3 days a week and then spending 2-3 days doing lighter work focusing on form and mobility just to grease the wheels. 5-6 days is actually the ideal frequency for natty lifters because it's necessary in order to enter an anabolic window to stimulate growth. As opposed to enhanced lifters who are in anabolic mode constantly.

>>42799401
4 day TM is U/L or is there one that's different I haven't read ppst3 in a long time

>>42800231
for me the appeal of working out often is the mood boost you get from working out. My life is also pretty boring at the moment and lifting is also a social thing

>>42800058
That is still somewhat retarded but way better. Are you on gear or a natty with godsent recovery?

>>42800140
Is this achievable as a natty?

I prefer Arnold Split

Chest/back
Shoulders/arms
Lower + abs
Rest
Repeat

I'm juiced and for me it has given me the best results, especially for arm growth, but it should work as a natural, too, if you don't go too high on volume. It's a lot more fun than PPL.

>>42800140
>Only downside is that DL and squat compete for each other on Lower days
I thought the way this was dealt with was that on Lower day 1 you go heavy on deadlifts and do lighter squat vairation and on day 2 you do heavy squats and lighter deadlift variations. If you are lifting numbers beyond novice (130-140kilo+) then isn't that enough?

>>42800232
>5-6 days is actually the ideal frequency for natty lifters because it's necessary in order to enter an anabolic window to stimulate growth.
This is interesting. Do you have any links to more info on this?

>>42800245
I can understand that, however I would argue that instead you can spend those other 3 days doing cardio or some sport, which would offer similiar benefits mood-wise and would increase your work capacity, which would in turn make you more efficient in the gym, allowing you to cram whatever you're doing in 6 days now into 3 fullbody days.

On top of that, obviously getting better at cardio is beneficial for health, and it takes less time than gym. So it might save you some time(traveling to gym etc.)

As far as the social aspect goes, I can't say much. My gym is filled with annoying bros and teenagers. But any other sport or activity can be social thing.

Anyway, I'm not saying you're doing it wrong.

Just making some arguments as to why fullbody 3x a week might be better in terms of getting the same results and saving time, and utilizing that saved time on other things eg like cardio which many people forget about.

>>42800237
It's not u/l, it's basically "push", "pull and legs"
You'd do bench, OHP and dips or LTEs one day, squats, diddlies/cleans and chinups the other

>>42799965
I keep hearing about that one, why is it so great?

>>42799965
>jacked and tan 2.0

Program is solid, but why the motherfucking FUCK would someone name a program that

>>42800255
The volume isn't even that high. It works try it

>>42798649
>So now that the dust is finally settled and we all agree that the superior routine for the natty lifter is the Upper / Lower Split
Everybody knows that already and has for years, Rippletits says that in his 2nd book

>>42798649
Candito's 6 week UL program

>>42802024
Do you do 10 sets across or start heavier and lower load as needed?

>>42802028
which one does he recommend?

>>42802038

>strength training

No thanks

>>42798649

Upper and lower split would work if you're willing to spend 3 hours in the gym on a single day

Hey /fit/, is Candito's upper/lower split good for someone who has only been lifting a month or so?

We've already established that PPL is the best OP

>>42802448
Candito LP has you progressing on a weekly basis. You should be able to progress more often than that. Can't you?

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>all these niggas who aren't conditioned to do volume work on a Full Body split

>>42802358
enjoy not making any progress and being that guy that looks the exact same after years in the gym

>>42802495

>You have to squat and deadlift heavy to make gains

k

>>42802455
That is simply wrong. Especially for beginners and advanced beginners.

Why do people on /fit/ stress so much about routine

It doesn't fucking matter just eat right and lift

>>42802555
How much you squat and bench?

you gotta switch it up op

Squat 3.5 plate bench 2 plate 74kg

>>42802511
He's not wrong.

>>42799619
Yes. Specifically DeFranco's newest version, Strong Bastard 911.

>>42802900

Why do you?

You think you can't make quad gains with leg press, hack squats etc?

>>42802920
Inefficient way, sorry lad my time is too precious to do 5 different exercises.

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>>42798649
Full body

>>42798649
Gym Jones functional mass gain program

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>>42799365
>>42798823
We already went through this in the last thread, as long as total weekly volume is equated the higher the frequency the better the results.

>>42798683
>>42800194
In the later weeks he has 1 set per exercise. Says no accessories....

I need to do more, should I up cardio these weeks or just add more accessories?

>>42804629
>In the later weeks he has 1 set per exercise. Says no accessories....
Yes, it's a peak week
>I need to do more
You don't. If you don't like peaking, don't do c6w and pick a weekly lp instead
>should I up cardio these weeks or just add more accessories?
Neither. Do the program as written, or don't

>>42804669
Thanks for the advice

>>42799755
front delts are just trained naturally when doing chest. side delts I use a wide grip press (you know you're hitting side delts when your elbows naturally bend outward, too close together and they'll bend vertically). rowing for rear delts. like I said I can't isolate them, tried this twice, two years apart and fucked them for a week both times.

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Really in love with GZCL stuff.

Currently running the rippler cause im cutting, gon switch to J&T2.0 in november.

>>42798649
West side :^)

>>42802920
>You think you can't make quad gains with leg press, hack squats etc
Literally no exercise can match the barbell squat for overall leg development. Leg Press is practically only quads, and even then, it's on a fixed path. The machine is doing half the work for you. If you're not squatting, that's fine - there's really no issue with that. But don't walk around like your substitute for it is just as good, because it absolutely is not.

Also
>hack squats
Barbell hack squats or the machine version? If you're talking about the barbell lift, yeah it's a good exercise and it mimics a lot of a conventional deadlift. However, unless you're 5 fucking feet tall, your legs won't be able to get as deep as you would be able to get in a full ROM squat. Yeah it still works your quads, but no where near the same extent squats do.

but yeah man keep doing what you're doing. enjoy looking the same a year from now.

>>42798649
I'd split her lower body

>>42798649
I have pretty much only done 3x a day for over a year.
Pretty much used the 70s big LP as a model, now im thinking of switching it up.
I modeled this off of the TM with a volume-ish day, a hypertrophy day, and a generic strength day.
I want that rugby look fwiw.
r8 please

A (Volume)
Squat: 4 x 6-8
Incline Bench: 4 x 6-8
Chinup: 4 x 6-8
Preacher curl: 4 x 8-10
Farmer walks x 4
Leg raises: 4 x 15

B (Hypertrophy)
OHP: 4 x 12
Front squat: 4 x 12
Romanian deadlift: 4 x 8
Pullup: 4 x AMRAP
Concentration curl: 4 x 12
Skullcrusher: 4 x 12
Ab roller: 4 x 15
Rowing

C (Strength)
Clean Pulls: 4 x 3
Squat: 3 x 5 (ramping)
Flat Bench press: 3 x 5 (ramping)
Barbell Rows: 5 x 5
Hanging leg raises: 4 x 15
Rowing

>>42798649
>superior routine for the natty lifter is the upper/lower split

This is the most retarded broscience meme I've ever seen.

I'm starting out TBB Operator template.

You choose 3-4 exercises to do each workout. You do 6 week blocks with 3 to 5 sets of 5 at

wk1: 70%
wk2: 80%
wk3: 90%
wk4: 70%
wk5: 80%
wk6: 95%

and then retest and start over.

I always make good progress with stuff like Starting Strength and then hurt myself when the weight gets too heavy. I think it will be more sustainable progressing every week instead of every workout.

I'm also going to get more serious about conditioning to prevent injury and increase work capacity.

>>42800140

MPS doesn't even equate to muscle gains, you can't just look at short changes in muscle protein balance post workout or even post feeding and determine if gains are being achieved or not.

If that were the case then we all should lift twice a day everyday since muscle protein synthesis elevation post workout starts to shorten really fast in people with average genetics after training for a bit.

>5-6 days is actually the ideal frequency for natty lifters because it's necessary in order to enter an anabolic window to stimulate growth. As opposed to enhanced lifters who are in anabolic mode constantly.

Broscience to the extreme.
Muscle protein synthesis is not an indicator of muscle growth, it's an indicator muscle repair.
Guess who has the highest muscle protein synthesis post workout, people who have really high inflammatory response from training, and are also the people who make the least gains.

>>42798715
>>calling people who lift heavy 6 days a week pussies
Just because you cant deal with the soreness doesnt mean i cant
Pussy

>>42800312
not him, but google the norwegian frequency project

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>>42798649
this one:

https://diogn.es/156

great PPL routine that changes daily

>>42798649
Sauce?

>>42800603
>never seen my new haircut

>>42806809
Begin the week with the strength day

>>42806246
Rippler any good? Gimme the cliffs notes, literally fail to read up on it every time I hear of it (have done J&T before).

>>42808021
>great PPL routine
>page doesnt exist
this is meta as fuck

I was on SL for almost a year and progressed my way to 0.8/1.9/3/3 on my road to 1/2/3/4. Then I stopped going to the gym over the summer because I was away from uni and lost some of my gains. Should I just go back to SL or should I try doing another routine? This is my 2nd week back at lifting and I've just been doing a PPL routine to go 6 days a week.

>>42806246
can someone post an example layout of the jacked and tanned?

>>42809538
do starting strength until you hit your old numbers and keep going if you can still gain on LP