I see PPL routines recommended a lot more often than before lately.

>>42411983
I created my own PPL routine with an emphasis on 5x5 strong lifts for the first 1 or 2 exercises then various accessories based on what I feel was lacking for the week. Fucking great results, but I really know how to read my body.

A sound program incorporates considerations of volume, intensity, frequency and progression. If your program doesn't take any of these into account it is simply a bad program. Doing a random assortment of 'push', 'pull' and 'legs' exercises on specified days will not get you very far beyond the short term. You must first begin with a long term goal and then program backwards accordingly. What do you hope to achieve with a PPL routine? If it is to get a stronger bench or squat there are better ways to do that. If it is to achieve a certain level of hypertrophy there are better ways to do that. If it is to improve conditioning there are obviously better ways to do that too. A PPL routine is really no better than your average bodypart split routine.

PPL is very good for people with average genetics who weren't able to grow on a bro-split routine or grow on a full-body routine.

More days in the gym means more chances of getting enough decent quality volume compared to a full body, more frequency than a bro-split.

If the big lifts didn't automatically grow your traps, arms, calves, delts etc - then a PPL is for you.


If you get overall size everywhere from just doing full body, then just do full body, but you're one lucky son of a cunt if your traps actually grow from just deadlifts and ohp - they never grew a inch for me, not even when I'm OHPing 80kg and deadlifting 200kg. My traps only grew once I started doing stuff like Shrugs and Upright Rows on the PPL ONTOP of all those other compounds.

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>>42412011
This goes with your point, because I see PPL recommended as a sort of “jack of all trades, master of none“ routine, for people with highly unspecific goals (i.e. “I want to be a bit stronger and look a little better“)

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>>42412033
>PPL is very good for people with average genetics who weren't able to grow on a bro-split routine or grow on a full-body routine.

It's just a way of working out, dude. It has nothing to do with your genetics.

Brosplits are terrible for just about anyone who isn't enhanced and full body workouts have a tendency to be too low volume per muscle group and not enough isolation work, hence not the best for people training for aesthetics.

What's better for a grill who wants the hot sloot hard body? Strong shoulders/back/butt + biceps/triceps is my goal. Literally dont care about anything else. PPL, SS or something else?

>>42412166
Are you a beginner? Beginners start on SS, no question.
If you're an actual grill, focus on your power cleans. You'll eventually move on to full cleans and so on.

Once you stall out of SS, it will be up to you. Try a full body, if it's too much for you move on a split.

Meme routine that takes 6 days a week.

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>>42411983
AS LONG AS YOU ARE TRAINING EACH MUSCLE GROUP AT MINIMUM 2 TIMES A WEEK WITH ADEQUATE FATIGUE MANAGEMENT YOUR ROUTINE IS FINE

ROUTINES AREN'T FUCKING MAGIC, THE DIFFERENCES BETWEEN ROUTINES WILL BE NEAR NEGLIGIBLE IF YOU APPLY CONSISTENCY, REST AND GOOD DIET

stop arguing and fucking LIFT

>>42412503
Been saying this forever. People put too much emphasis on small details and "secrets" to gaining, while all you have to do is actually go and do it.

>>42412503
shit, you have my goal body. Stats?

>>42411983
all those people that started doing SS last summer is looking for another routine

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>>42412503
Im not arguing, I'm with you there. Thats why I'm asking whats with the recent spike in PPL thread?
I guess its what >>42412696 said, a lot of former beginners are ready for another routine at this point.

Brahs who do a PPL - do you do the same 6 workouts and repeat or do you change up exercises? How do you fit in cardio?

Thinking of starting up PPL as my new routine after summer but unsure whether its a meme or not

>>42412891
PPL is a good transition for the intermediate lifter looking to move on from SS.

Explore some of the routines, such as PHAT and PHUL. See what works best for your body. Again, it all comes down to your goals and what you're trying to accomplish.

Also most PPL routines call for 6 days a week at the gym, PHAT calls for 5 days, and PHUL calls for 4 days. So, it depends on how much time you're willing to dedicate to the gym and what will keep you motivated.

PPL is worthless.

whats about nsuns 5/3/1 routines ?

>>42413575
What makes you say that?

>>42414056
The FACT that PPL is worthless

>>42414082
Please elaborate

I do a regular brosplit. I know it takes more time but I think it is more effective at building a physique to your liking. Heavy compound lifting routines usually avoid hitting specific muscles which I think add to ones overall physique. Plus I dont think half of you guys get enough food or rest to be hitting each muscle group twice a week.

>>42411983
>>42412033

>le laundry list of accessory exercises
>good for anything but spinning your tires

Lmfao

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>>42412503
>>42415686

70% x 6

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>>42415851

>>42412503
traps of peace

>>42411983
I like PPL because it's very easy for me to manipulate and change out parts as I notice areas I'm lacking in.

You still need to know where you're going and what you want to add to your physique or numbers. Then fill out your program to meet your goals. Especially useful if you aren't evenly developed. For instance, you were on a strength routine that completely ignored biceps: you execute your rows/DL/lat pull on pull day and then fill in some additional bicep focus.

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>>42412503
Can anyone offer a reasonable counterargument to this? Why do we try to "trick" ourselves by overthinking routines and add unneeded complexity?

>>42412503
let me see and fuck your boipucci

>>42417691
because most of us get into fitness as nattys and look at a bunch of dudes on roids and then when we realize we don't look like them we think we're doing something wrong.
that post is perfectly fine

>>42411983
>>42412034


honestly this is the average sort of girl i wish i had been having one night stands with in college

nothing really noteworthy about her but it would be a good night of feeling like you're normal. i'd almost rather bang her than someone objectively prettier because at that point you're like "ok you're banging me but you're out of my league, what's your angle"

with this girl you're like "ok shes just horny like me, we're both average. cool"

anyway whats this thread about?

>>42413681
Big gains.
Accessories are the defining of them. You use them to work on your weakpoints, but you HAVE to add Rows, Chinups, and Dips or you'll be weak as fuck.

>>42412200

Beginners don't have to start on SS you fucking rippletit memelord

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>>42417835
Can you be more autistic

The only person I know who does PPL has a body I would turn gay for. That's why I do PPL

>>42412503
wow. someone speaking sense on /fit/. thank you and keep preaching.

>>42411983
personally I like PPL because it's so customizable and with little changes I can target whatever I feel like is lagging behind. it keeps things fresh which helps a lot with motivation. it also lets me try out more obscure exercises I see online without fucking up my entire program.

Everyone I know does PPL so I started doing it when I began lifting too.

Its also a lot more fun than autistic squat-focused beginner routines so I refuse to do anything else

>>42412034
gib gymrat gf

>>42411983
PPL is a good generic cop out routine that doesn't require that much thought/explanation.
Noobs will get slightly bigger/stronger on just about anything so while I don't think that PPL is anywhere near optimal (for one you should go legs, push, pull to give your core/low back a day to recover in between leg work and pulling work) it'll work well enough.
It also makes the average new lifter feel like they're doing something special, which might mean that some people stick with it.

If I do ppl to combat my overdeveloped legs, how long will it take for my upper body to catch up?

not OP but pls rate
might do this in the next month or two
Push A
squat 5x5
ohp 5x5
bench 4x8 60-70% 1rm
dips/skullcrushers 3-4x8-12

Pull A
lat pulldowns/pullups5x5
rdl 4x6-8
pndlay row 4x8
one arm row 4x8

Push B
bench 5x5
frontsquat 4x6-8
ohp 4x8 60-70% 1rm
dips/skullcrushers

Pull B
deadlift 5x5
pendlay row 5x5
pullup/pulldown 4x8
bb curl 4x8

>>42421355
I think this is not enough volume nd what would your scheme be?

>>42418757

what's the best starter program in your opinion?

>>42418778
can you be more of a newfriend

>>42421355

this isn't PPL this is PPPP lmao

Volume is good for fat loss. So is Frequency. Volume is also good for hypertrophy.

When you compare PPLPPLx to 3xFullbody, you can workout with more energy doing once day for 45 minutes than you can working out every other day for an hour and a half.

I will write a full ppl critique when I get a new computer but in shorts it's suboptimal for any lifter for a huge variety or reasons regarding programming

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skeltin here (6ft 150lbs lmaooooooooo)

how long on SS before switching to PHAT?

>>42412166
I like Upper/Lower splits for girls.

Upper day would be
>bench
>row
>press (or incline)
>lat pulldown (or chins if you can)

Lower day would be
>deadlift
>stepups (or cable pull through)
>standing calf raises
>weighted glute bridge

Second U-day is same as first.

Second L-day is
>squats or split squats
>romanian diddlies (or leg curl machine)
>seated calf raise
>cable kickback

Can either LUxLULx or ULxULxx or throw in cardio like LUCxLUx.

>>42421733
Push A, Pull A, rest/cardio, Push B, Pull B, rest/abs, rest

>>42417691
Because dyel faggots are making their own programs when they have no business doing so. If you just started lifting then use someone else's program.

>>42412503
>>42417691
Mostly truth, but I wouldn't say the differences between routines are negligible. It all depends on your goals, and different routines will have different effects. Obviously training for strength and/or powerlifting and training for size with hypertrophy/time under tension will give you different results. Ideally though, after a couple years of lifting you should know enough to program or reprogram routines to fit you exact specific needs.

When it comes down to it though, just go to the gym and lift. Low rep high weight compounds, moderate accessories, doing all this more than once every 5 days, and you're golden.

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So what I get from this thread is that PPL seems to be favourable for people who can identify their bodys weak points and program accordingly.
I still dont understand why people call it a meme routine, since no one actually cared to point out weak points of a PPL routine.

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PPL or pic related?

>>42423644

That's just a modified SS lmao.

>>42423087

The weekly volume is inferior to a full body program.
The frequency is inferior to a full body program.
The average intensity is inferior to a full body program.
There's no sort of sustainable progression, you're going to get fatigued very fast and stall very fast if you're anything beyond a beginner.
All it really is is a laundry list of accessory exercises.

>>42423644

PPL is a 6 day a week routine.
Push. Pull, Legs, Push, Pull, Legs, Rest.
If you want to workout 6 days a week then do PPL, if you only want to do 3 days a week then a full body of some sort is better.
A PPL has two benefits. Working out 6 days a week makes it easier for lifting to become a habit which then makes it easier to lift consistently. It also allows more recovery time which some natural lifters need. Most of /fit/ are younger guys with high test so they don't realise that when you get older you really do need more recovery time, even if you diet and sleep is good.
On the other hand >>42412503 has a point. Any routine which is done consistently will show results. A perfect routine might give you gains a little but quicker but the benefits will eventually level off. No one becomes stronger indefinitely you will eventually peak. A perfect routine will get you to your peak in 3 to 4 years and a shitty one will get you there in 4 to 5 years.
The most important thing is choosing a routine which you will actually follow constantly.

>>42415864
So are you saying whey isn't a meme?

>>42423732
Thanks anon. Apreciate it!

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>>42423668
Finally someone who is willing to put this into perspective in a civilized manner. Thank you.

this is my ppl rotine
Hétfő:(Pull A)
Deadlift 5 sets
Chinups 4 sets
Close grip chinups 4 sets
Barbell rows 4 sets
Hyperextension 4 sets
DB curl 5 sets

Kedd:(Push A)
Flat Barbell Bench Press 5 sets
OHP 4 sets
Dips 4 sets
Dumbbell lateral raise 5 sets
Skullcrush 5 sets

Szerda: Legs
Barbell Back Squat 5 sets
Leg curl 4 sets
Legs extension 4 sets
Calf raise 5 sets
Abs

Csütrötök:(Pull B)
Deadlift 5 sets
Chinups 4 sets
Barbell rows 4 sets
DB rows 4 sets
Hyperextension 4 sets
DB curl 5 sets

Péntek:(Push B)
OHP 5 sets
Incline Bench Press 4 sets
Close grip bench press 4 sets
Lateral raise 5 sets
Standing Tricep Pushdown 5 sets

is it good?

>>42423644
phraks greyskull is better, the '/fit/' version was made by some gay tripfagger on here that doesnt even lift

Full body routines neglect many parts of your body in favor of just getting stronger in the main 3 or 4 lifts.
Full body routines are shit if you don't care about those lifts.

>>42411983

The key is how many times a week do you want to go to the gym?

3 = full body
6 = PPL

>>42424585
>3 = full body

By "Full Body" do you mean strictly SS (i.e. the big major lifts accompanied by some accessory work), or any program that targets every muscle group well enough to cause damage and hypertrophy? Because I can't squat due to fucked up knees, and due to previously broken wrists I can't easily bench so I do substitute work (cable flys, split squats etc.).

>>42425013

The PPL is essentially a full body routine split over 3 days. It allows you to do more volume and a few more accessory exercises because you have more time. If you can't do a core exercise then try and find an alternative that works the same muscle groups, if there is no alternative then just skip it entirely.
You are overthinking this, just try both routines and do what ever seems best for you. A shitty routine you do today is better than the perfect routine you might start someday when you are ready.

>>42425275
Thanks, but
>split over 3 days
The talk here is about 6 days a week, and I can't make 6 days - 3 tops if at the gym, 4 if I buy some weights and work out at home. Is PPL even built for 3 days? I thought it wasn't.

>>42425445

PPL will work out your entire body over a 3 day period. You do it twice a week so you are getting two high volume full body work outs a week with plenty of rest in between.
If you try to do a fullbody work out everyday you will fuck yourself because you are not resting enough. If you only do a PPL over 3 days then it will be ineffective because you are not hitting enough volume.

3 days a week (which is the bare minimum you should do) = full body
6 days or more = PPL
4 or 5 days = some sort of brosplit.

Which is better? None of them are really better, you will get results on all of them and it is just a matter of preference. You should be spending the same amount of hours on them all, it is just a case of splitting those hours in the way which best suits you.

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>>42425812
Thanks for the clarification, Anon!
But then I'm back to my original question (>>42425013), will I still make progress without the major lifts (mostly accessory/machine work) on a full body routine? People here seem to treat the major lifts with fucking awe, like they put way more strain on the muscles than mere accessory work, and since I can't do those I'd have to compensate.

>>42417691

It's easier to tweak your routine than actually track your diet

>>42426075

Some people get jacked as fuck just doing a lap of all the recommended isolation machines in the gym. Other people don't respond well to this at all. Try it and find out which type you are.

>>42425812
If you have 4 or 5 days there are plenty of programs that work extremely well.
Layne norton PHAT ( although workouts take extremely long) .
GZCL ( seriously that program is underrated, how to pull powerlifter tier numbers but look very god) variations.
Any 5/3/1 variation ever, but be sure to eat a shitload on it cause wendler is for big guys naturally.

>>42421797
implying you can't have linear progression and periodization doing PPL.

name is probably what you look like.