A few years back /fit/ used to be adamant that it was impossible

it's possible if you have TOP genes

what about carb backloading, does that work? it's supposed to let you lose fat and gain muscle.

Noob gains have always been the exception

>>39446378
Higher testosterone makes gains more efficient and significant. Low test buddy bros will see no changes.

>>39446378
Yes your body composition can alter slowly over time, but that is more for comparatively advanced trainees. If a beginner lifts at a deficit, yes, they will lose body fat while making strength (i.e. neuromuscular) progress, but they will not build significant muscle.

>>39446402

I feel that's the least of it and an example that shows it is not strictly impossible. I also feel say being young (15-35) and male with mid range to high test would make it a lot more possible.

It's very normal and happens to everyone, specially the noobies.

If you know what youre doing you can get into some really efficient recomp cycles.

>>39446378
>Noobs can gain muscle on a deficit at a decent rate.
>People who are really overweight can gain muscle into the early intermediate stages on a deficit.
>People with good genetics can gain muscle on a deficit even beyond that point, but it's going to be quite slow.
>Anyone at any stage can gain muscle on a deficit as long as they stay over 10%BF, eat right, adjust their programme and the deficit doesn't exceed their max daily fat metabolization, it's just going to be really, really slow and not worth it.
>With enough roids the sky is the limit.

>>39446378
The reason people think this is because of the cals in vs out rule.

Calorie surplus = added body mass
Calorie deficit = reduced body mass

And we get to decide if the "added mass" includes a high percentage of muscle mass by causing trauma to the muscles and allowing them to whilst in the process of gaining mass.

Now these rules are broadly true... However protein synthesis plays a huge role. If protein synthesis is efficient enough then it is possible to gain muscle mass whilst reducing overall body mass.

Now, what increases protein synthesis?

Mainly high testosterone (i,e injecting or during puberty) and during the initial shock stages of training as your body adjusts to the new demands of life in order to survive (srs your body thinks you almost got killed each time you reach failure during noob gains period)


The answer is to either cut and bulk. Or to inject testosterone into your butt.