You have ten seconds to justify your consumption of meat without

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>>35211754

I like pissing off vegans.

I'm not a faggot

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My ancestors did it.

>>35211754
vegans are like gays, always pushing their shit in your face forcing you to accept their way of life and doing as they do.

i used to didnt mind going vegan, but every vegan i have talked to seems like an arrogant asshole and talk as if they are holier than those who eat meat.

I belong to an omnivore species.

Easier to bulk with meat.
Barbecue sauce.

meat eaters are like gays, always pushing their shit in your face forcing you to accept their way of life and doing as they do.

i used to didnt mind eating meat, but every meat eater i have talked to seems like an arrogant asshole and talk as if they are holier than those who don't.

I prefer to have a balanced diet with food coming from a variety of categories.

>>35211791
>vegans are like gays, always pushing their shit in your face forcing you to accept their way of life and doing as they do.
>i used to didnt mind vegans, but every vegan i have talked to seems like an arrogant asshole and talk as if they are holier than those who don't.

>>35211766
/thread

because nigga, if it was the other way around a Lion wouldn't give one shits about if he should have my juicy meat or that little dandelion on the floor for breakfast.

eating flesh is brutal

I want to give myself a cancer and ain't nobody going to stop me

vegetables are toxic

>>35211754
Don't have to justify shit since it's the norm

>>35211754
Because my stomach physically isn't big enough to hold the volume required to hit my macronutrients on a plant-only diet.

And I don't want green skin.

Really, I'd like to become vegan, because I hate how stock animals are treated and want to help the environment. Then I realize meat is just too good and easy.

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Gluten phucks with me. Vegan diet=wheat.

>>35211754
What's the real psychological reason people become vegan/vegetarian? Only a fraction will really be doing it because they care about animals

Is it a sense of superiority? Having guilt for other things in their lives?

Just sage and move on. The vegan trolls only exist because people respond to them.

Meat is a more efficient protein source per pound than vegan alternatives and is way easier to cook with.

I've considered going vegetarian in the past, but I could never go vegan. Eggs are way too awesome.

>>35211754

I eat apex predators. I ain't gotta explain shit.

>>35211754
I eat virtually all my meals at the dining hall at my university. It's hard enough for me to crack even 100g of protein a day there as a vegetarian since the nutritional content is such shit. Being a vegan would set my fitness goals back another five years. No thanks.

>>35211770
Your ancestors shat where they ate as well. Why don't you do the same?

veganism is more expensive, less varied, less tasty, requires supplements and planning
and is not good for us a species :
http://www.thehealthyhomeeconomist.com/baby-breastfed-by-vegan-mother-dies/

>>35211946
Like chicken, cows and pigs?

I buy biological meat.

/thread

>>35211971

Isn't all meat biological?

>>35211965

You know it, honkey. Chickens used to be dinosaurs. Ruled the Earth for millions of years. Now I eat them to consume their power.

I don't want cows and pigs to go extinct.
Chickens and Turkeys will probably be fine....they just taste good.

>>35211925

Eggs are shit

>>35211754
Why is it so hard for these autistic vegans to admit that it is far from optimal when it comes to micronutrients, essential fats and protein? In fact as a vegan you either have to eat tremendous amounts of the exact right foods or use a lot of supplement powders to get the same result as a simple omnivorous diet.

So fuck off with your faux-ethical vegan garbage. You aren't morally superior, you're just some city-dwelling sissy completely out of touch with nature except for the slaughterhouse videos you watch.

>>35211905
It's almost certainly a hormonal imbalance, and I'm not just trying to flame the OP. Generally a lack of testosterone in puberty will lead to more effeminate and emotional thinking, and therefore one will be less likely to care about meeting their own dietary needs due to some irrational empathy for farm animals that aren't even aware of their own existence. It's like people who cry when they step on a bug, they're just a hormonal mess.

Vegans proteins are NOT COMPLETE

I repeat, not all proteins are equal, just like 20g of carbs in a banana is not the same as 20g of carbs in a chocolate bars.

Incomplete proteins = less efficient muscle recovery after working out = less gains

VEGAN = LESS GAINS

source: I've been lifting for 5+ years and tried to go vegan for 3 months. Ate the same amount of proteins as I usually do on an omnivore diet. My recovery was shit so instead of training 5x a week, I could only train 3x

>>35211754
Because chicken.

>>35211993

u fockin wut m8

Less calorie dense way to hit my protein macro, and are complete proteins.
Easier way to get hit your micros without supplements.
More variety in diet, makes for happier little vegemites, less neurological hormones in a state of decline (you need your b12 folks).
Less hormonal deficiencies in general. Men need good sources of dietary cholesterol. Like eggs.

Be an omnivore.

>>35211982

Chickens ARE dinosaurs nigga. Aves (birds) are under the Theropod distinction of the Dinosauria clade.

>technicalities

It's interesting that this whole vegan/vegetarian movement is coinciding with record high meat prices globally.

Gee, it's almost like some 3rd party is trying to convince people they don't need to eat meat anymore to prevent them from potentially rioting due to high meat prices... hmm, what could that 3rd party organization be? The U.S. government? No, no way Jose.

>>35212018

>Men need good sources of dietary cholesterol. Like eggs.

Broscience

>>35212026
>what is testosterone
Dumb fucks can't tell broscience from basic endocrinology

Given that the new meaning of broscience seems to be "facts I don't like," good job mate, yes, you established an unanswerable question. Next ask us to answer a question without communicating; or traverse a graph using each edge only once, with more than two nodes and every vertex with an odd number of edges.

Holy shit just stop fucking responding you idiots. This is why the vegan fags are even here you dumb fucks.

>>35212059

>the more cholesterol you eat, the more testosterone you have

Broscience

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>>35212024

oh it's this guy

>>35211954

Take the best, leave the worst = progress = normal meat eating humans

Leave the best, sometimes dream of keeping the worst (pooping in the woods) = back-asswards humans obsessed with "natural" lifestyle = vegans

>>35211754
they really are pushing this vegan shit arent they? fucking retards will fall for it, not my problem tho

who wouldnt want to make easy money out of fools? well not be but anyway

>>35212077
WHY DO THEY ALWAYS HAVE LONG HAIR WHY

>>35212070
>implying you get adequate dietary cholesterol from your scoop of chickpeas and spinach

>>35212070
> cholesterol is a precursor to test
>somehow it still magically has no effect on test levels

Ok.

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>>35212077
>he trusts his government!

>>35211754
Iron. It's very difficult to find the same levels of iron as there is in red meats. Yes there is suppliements, but they don't get processed effectivly through your liver when you're on other medications that bind with blood albumin more effectively.

Being anemic and a female who has periods, iron is vital to both my mood, energy and ability to function (being cold, heart rate, dizziness or oxygen carrying capacity)

There are vegetables out there but they don't have the same levels for the amount i would have to eat.

>>35212110

http://www.nap.edu/read/10490/chapter/11

>Given the capability of all tissues to synthesize sufficient amounts of cholesterol for their metabolic and structural needs, there is no evidence for a biological requirement for dietary cholesterol. Therefore, neither an Adequate Intake nor a Recommended Daily Allowance is set for cholesterol.
>A Tolerable Upper Intake Level is not set for dietary cholesterol because any incremental increase in cholesterol intake increases CHD risk

>>35212115

The cholesterol in your blood is used to synthesize testosterone. This doesn't mean that the cholesterol you eat turns into testosterone. It doesn't even mean the amount of cholesterol in your blood determines how much test you produce.

Broscience.

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This guy follows a vegan diet. It's basically anti-aging. I'm thinking of trying it for a week.

>>35212136

Iron is actually one of the reaons to avoid red meats. That's the main thing associated with the increased risk of colon cancer.

Beans and lentils are great for iron and actually help prevent colon cancer.

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>>35211791

you leave us gays out of this
faggot

>>35212170
>Beans and lentils are great for iron and actually help prevent colon cancer
This is a load of shit. Beans an legumes are some of the worst shit you can eat for good health.

Source: Robb Wolf

>>35212170
>Iron is actually one of the reaons to avoid red meats

No it's not.

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>>35211754
I was a vegan for 3 years but I recently started eating fish because:
a) fish is objectively healthy
b) fish don't feel fear or pain like mammals

I'm open to hearing counterarguments though

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>>35212179

That's why you don't use retarded people as sources of information

>>35212181

'Fraid so, m'lady *tips hat*

http://www.aicr.org/press/health-features/health-talk/2015/04-april/recommendations-red-meat-saturated-fat-1.html

>Higher heme iron content may partly explain links between excess red meat and risk of colon cancer, since it seems to promote formation of compounds that can damage intestinal cells.

>>35212164
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/15741266?dopt=Abstract

http://www.endocrine-abstracts.org/ea/0013/ea0013p161.htm

http://www.endocrine-abstracts.org/ea/0014/ea0014p628.htm

http://jap.physiology.org/content/82/1/49

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/1998648

All these studies say you are full of shit vegan shill.

Testosterone is created from cholesterol and you better believe cholestrol from food increases the amount of test you can produce

>>35211979
Free range chickens yo. Decent treatment and it tastes better as well.

>>35212205
>muh meme science

Aren't you tired of posting the same troll thread every day? Can't you bother /ck/ instead?

>>35212210

Are you the same guy who posted these last time and I explained what they said to you because you didn't read them?

To give an example, look at your second link. You read "HDL levels are positively associated with testosterone" but somehow didn't notice that the study was about testosterone replacement therapy, meaning people were treated with testosterone, and the testosterone treatment increased HDL levels, not the other way around

>The results suggest that the dominant effect of testosterone in this group may be to increase HDL-C

>>35212231
Vegan fags really want us to kuck ourselves, don't they? Post your body.

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Am I Haram to vegans for eating Fish? I eat meat sometimes but I fucking love Fish..

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>>35212244

>lose scientific argument
>resorts to "REEEEEEEEEEE, let me see your dick"

Just say you fucked up, brother

>>35212295
I didn't fuck up, you're a moron vegan fag. Your meme science proves nothing like usual. Stop samefagging and posting the same fucking thread daily.

>>35212336

This isn't my thread actually. I've never made a thread on any board about anything related to veganism. Was just scrolling by, saw some broscience, and felt like calling it out like anyone should do. Why you gotta hate on me, bro?

>>35212220
>>35212336
>meme science
nice meme

>>35211754
The only way to end animal suffering is to end animal life. Even if we ended only the predator's lives, the result would be unchecked population growth for every other species and the death of us all, so no, they'd ALL have to go away for the suffering to stop.


You think a cow that lives in a nice farm getting fed and being protected for a few years until it dies to a single shot to the head is not happier than one that lives in the wild, possibly starving and on the run from predators 24/7 until it faces it unavoidable demise, dying in pure agony, one bite at a time?

Yes, companies that abuse animals should be (and probably already are) illegal, but they're not all of them - just the ones vegans focus on, for some reason. That's what you should focus on, vegan.

Also, you should probably start by attacking Jews and Muslims: their religions demand animals be slaughtered in terrible ways for them to be "acceptable". For instance, Jewish religion demands a cow dies by having it's throat slit and slowly bleeding out. That's cruel.

>>35212369
Riiiiight. Maybe it's the pedo vegan since there's only two of you here. Sure as hell ain't more though.

>>35212408

I think there's atleast 3 guys that regularly post in these threads on the vegan side. I'm not even a vegan though, I just eat one.

>>35212419

*eat like one

>>35212419

That's true, there's vegan fag, pedo vegan, and one vegan femanon who rarely posts. That still leaves just two of you responsible for the spamming and trolling. So for the sake of the board, fuck off.

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>>35212436

You really want me to go, bro? I mean I'll go, but like.. you really want me gone, bro? Like... permanent? Like forever? No takesies-backsies? Poof, bye-bye? I mean I can do it, I just... you're SURE you want this?

I just wanted to talk about vegetables and stuff....

>>35212472
Yes. Leave immediately you kuck. Killing yourself is optional. Fuck you and everything you represent.

>>35211754
because I don't know where to start, if only someone would post the nutrition values of some popular options or recipes that were easily accessible I would probably go vegan

>>35212336
>>35212336
You mad.

>>35211754
Because agriculture fucks up more animal lives than cattle breeding

>>35212488
heh

>>35211754
it's cheaper (than tasty vegan foods)

it's easier to find (than tasty vegan foods)

there's no vegan meals with 80% or more protein besides soy protein. (while there are meats like: tuna, shrimps, chicken breast etc.)

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>>35212487

>Leave immediately

Are you the guy in this video?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hxwyWCOtoqE

Now I kinda feel like staying. I'm thinking about settling down here, carving out a nice little cave on this board, fill it with all my nick-nacks and framed photos, open up a gumbo shop, whaddya think?

*yawn*

Yeah, I don't really FEEL like leaving now

Hey bro, get me a cherry coke, will ya? I'm talking on the rocks here.

>>35211783
>not going against nature to please retards on the Internet

Learn to not be a trigger m8

>>35211754
Le shit nigger

>>35212505
Do you have more statistics up your ass you want to share?

>>35211754
I do it for the economic benefit of my nation.

>also I'm a sexual predator, so might as well be a dietary one too!

>>35212497
So much samefag. Tbh it's probably just one vegan on here. >>35212505

>>35212545
Good try sherlock but nope.

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>>35211783
>implying

>>35211754
Too difficullt to get muh Brotein, vegan protein powder is more expensive and tastes like shit.

>>35211754
I don't have to micromanage my food intake like it's fucking Football Manager to easily hit the nutrients I need

because I don't want to have to eat 50 bananas a day just to meet my daily choline requirement

>>35211754
You have ten seconds to justify why you are breathing without resorting to the need of oxygen for living.

Pro tip: You can't.

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>>35211754
I don't look at the roided up faggots who suddenly turn a new leaf bc it's profitable to label oneself a vegan with a juiced up after eating enough meat to feed a small village for a decade

I look at this clown. A faggot who's never roided, never got strong and looks like some weird human-alien hybrid. He's a true vegan and my inspiration to NEVER be a vegan .

Let that sink in

I'd go vegan if there was anything that had decent protein that didn't have an ass load of carbs.

>>35212077

Ever since scooby died, Shaggy has never been the same.

Because my family owns livestock.

I like to assert my sexual dominance by eating animals.

>>35212512

(Different guy) Sorry your roleplaying just made me throw up in my mouth, most autistic thing ive read all day.

>>35211754
Because I like pigs and I don't want them to go extinct ;_;

>>35211754
I love meat

Creatine, it helps with the cognitive ability for kids. How are you going to get creatine from a vegan diet?

quality protein, only decent source i can eat in good quantities

too much dairy makes me look and feel like chit

Denser calories per volume of food with a higher ratio of protein to fat compared to the non meat alternative of nuts

DONE

Now fuck off

>>35213577
Vegans/vegetarians have an IQ of on average 10 points higher than non vegans. So that's bullshit. https://www.psychologytoday.com/blog/the-scientific-fundamentalist/201005/why-vegetarians-are-more-intelligent-meat-eaters

>>35211754
b12 is essential for health and only found in animal sources

>>35213652
Wrong, can be supplemented easily

its fucking tasty

>>35213664
by easily you mean the injections or the tablets with no proven synthesis?

>>35213652
False. Found in bacteria that sometimes get eaten by animals. Most people are b12 deficient. The supplements for b12 are vegan sourced.

>>35213691
>>35213697

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>>35211754
They told me to.

>>35213697
vegan sourced and injectable into your veins > eating animals?

>>35213652
It's supplemented in most products today, even if they aren't "vegan" products. It's really hard to not get enough B12, unless you're on some really weird diet.

also 1 (one) of the supplementary pills I got just in case is 10000% of daily recommended intake. Don't need to take them though.

>>35211754
dat. dere. creatine.

done.

>>35211754
>implying he got to be 300lbs of muscle eating vegan diet

only predators get big. you need a predator diet. an omnivorous diet. eat everything under the sun, in the sea, and from the trees. you need it.

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Because don't really want to end up looking like Moby.

>>35213715
Yes it fucking is, anyone with any morals whatsoever would choose a tablet over killing animals

>>35213715
I'm assuming yes because most atheletes get it this way. Even years ago Lance armstrong was injecting b12.

I went vegan for a year and it as pretty sweet for the first 6 month but then i started feeling terrible with no energy. Like i couldnt get out of bed. I finally figured out i was b12 deficient.

I am no longer vegan, but i will try again after finals week, I'm too afraid of injections X_X

>>35212205
>may partly explain
>may
>partly
Fuck you you stupid cunt. You can't into science.
What this means is that they found a nice explanation that could possibly be correct and that they did not find any evidence going against it in their study. It doesn't mean anything was proven. You can read this kind of statement in literally every theoretical paper in every field of science ever, and most of them are proven wrong afterwards.

It's the scientific equivalent of "I think that" you piece of shit.

>>35212005
best post ITT

>>35213724
Nice bro science.

>>35212179
>Scorce: Robb wolf

EW r u b8ing me dud?

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>>35211754
There's no reason not to.

>>35212559
Pic related cunt.

>>35213736
i said injections, not tablets. tablets have no proven synthesis

>>35213737
vegan for six months, had ZERO energy, got down to 47 kg, don't do it. Cut back on animal products, just don't cut them out entirely

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I love how some meat eaters get in their feelings whenever vegan diets come up (regardless of how it is presented).

I am sure that there are those that just ignore the threads and go along with there day like normal, adjusted human beans. The ones that turn into beat-faced, steaming 5 year olds whom are unable to discuss the subject without resorting to ad-hominems and circular logic make baiting the topic hilarious.

I guarantee someone is going to, or was about to before reading this sentence, claim how I keep "shilling veganism" even though I've never started a vegan thread or baited the topic, even though I find it hilarious.

:^)

>>35212519
underrated post

>>35211754
The faux meat selection is shit in the UK, the tasty stuff costs more than meat. I gonna attempt seitan soon, if I can get that tasting like beef then I may switch but it won't be fully rather flexitarian or whatever it's called.

>>35211754
why do we eat fucking anything if it isn't for taste...

if they (aliens) created a pill which:
-contains all nutrients required to build/maintain a /fit/ body without eating anything for the rest of your life
-is created to vegan standards
-tasted like nothing when put into your mouth/swallowed
-actually makes you full when consumed
If this pill was given to you, would you still eat food and why/why not?

>>35211754
The fact is, b12 is essential for human health and is only obtain via animal sources or an injection, which leads me to think that we were probably meant to eat meat. The modern Western diet of the past 100 years however, contains way more meat than is best for the body, planet or the animals themselves.

Before factory farming, meat was very expensive and therefore not consumed as often as today. I think a diet based on plenty of fresh fruits, grains and vegetables with the occasional serve of meat is natural, and best.

>>35213755
Appeal to nature fallacy

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>>35213814
Nah dipshit it comes from soil, feces, and dirty water - that's where you are meant to get it. In our sterile environment even animals need B12 supplements.

>>35213818
You're absolutely right, we should eat gravel.

Think about what you post next time you fucking parrot.

>>35213813
No, vegan food tastes good too.

>>35211754
Taste preferences.
Fuck you bitch nigga.

>>35211754
B-I-O-L-O-G-Y

>>35211754
It's easier to prepare and store meat and animal based meals in manageable portions. It takes up less space in my freezer. It's more available in my region, both at the grocery store, and in the wild, than significant sources of vegetable protein (I live in the subarctic).

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http://www.pcrm.org/nbBlog/the-protein-myth-terminator

More and more, bodybuilders and other athletes are proving that you don’t need meat to make muscle.

How are they doing it? A diet rich in various grains, legumes, and vegetables provides all of the protein our bodies need, without the large amounts of saturated fat and cholesterol found in animal foods. Just one cup of lentils contains 16 grams of protein, while a cup of quinoa contains about 11 grams. Even a cup of broccoli has more than 4 grams of protein.

While fad diets often lead people to believe that they’re not consuming enough protein, in reality, most Americans are at far greater risk of consuming too much. People who follow the standard American diet – filled with meat and dairy products – often consume about twice as much protein as they actually need. One recent study linked diets rich in animal protein to early death, while other studies show links to heart disease, cancer, osteoporosis, and other conditions.

>>35213894
>How are they doing it?
Steroids and supplements.

>>35213894
This. Even bread is 5% protein. Its in fucking everything (but lettuce)

>>35213767
It's hilarious and sad how butthurt and aggressive these people get when someone mentions how bad their diet is, in exactly the same way the fat people they make fun of do

>>35213891
Nigga,Storing grains, legumes and potatoes is almost effortless.

>u lazy fgt

>>35211993
Separate whites and yolks.
Scramble whites
Plate up
Put raw yolks on top
Mix

>changed my life

>>35211754
Taste + it's more convenient + it's better for your health

>>35211754
Threads like this are a waste of time. In 20 years we'll all be eating cloned meat and there will be literally no reason not to.

>>35213894
Someone who spent decades of their life growing and gaining the benefits from eating a mostly meat diet and steroids and other gear does not mean that a totally vegan diet is for athletes or even works.
There is no such thing as a successful clean vegan. Hell the geared up vegans and all meat eaters are still inferior ot the omnivores.
It's just common knowledge.

>>35213755
>Gaul bladder
Don't let the Romans near it

>>35213755
>mastication: unimportant
>survival without animal protein: impossible
>etc etc
What a fucking made up infographic filled with bullshits
The human body is the one with most evolutionary advantages
We can live with meat only and we can live without meat at all
We supposedly have a brain too, we supposedly can choose what to eat for our optimal health and it's universally recorded that this means something along the Mediterranean diet (very low in meat, very very low in red meat, some fish)
We are "naturally frugivore" at best, yet we can choose to voluntarily adjust our diet for further benefits and use our evolutionary advantages for rogue situations (i.e. greenland villagers have to eat meat, or meat)

Getting the same amount in macros and nutrients as a vegan is much more expensive.

I don't really care about the taste of what I eat. I just go for what is the best value for money.

this

>>35211754
shit quality bait
where does one get protein? no black beans where i'm at. soy is shit tier. otherwise, too much excess calories and, believe it or not, i don't love anyone enough to do 3 hours of cardio for them. this way, i consume turkey breast and tuna in brine daily, some fresh cottage cheese and fresh salads. i can control my macros easily. with vegan diet, i'd have to eat soy, which i really do not want to. white beans don't pack that much protein (only beans where i'm at).
bottom line: tell me how to get my protein without fats and carbs and i will turn vegan that very moment.
>protip: you can't.

But taste preference is the best reason for eating meat.

>>35214048
And it got to this point thanks to the consumption of red meat.


Fucking mouth breathers

I'm a vegetablekin and don't like the idea of eating my own kind.

But seriously, being vegan would mean eating food that I'd usually gag. I'm prepared to make my eating experience miserable in order to save a few animals.

>>35214156
not*

fuck

>>35214069
I'm mostly pescetarian, I get 45% carbs / 28% proteins (full spectrum of essential amino acids) / 27% fats even without my mackerel and my week expenditure on food is no more than 80 €.

>>35214102
I'm not interested in spoon-feeding you and I'm not interested in "converting" you, I'll report what I eat daily. Fava beans, chickpeas, lentils (giant/red/small), soy beans (not genetically modified and organic), tofu (same as above), other legumes (including multiple varieties of beans), broccoli.

>>35214136
>red meat
You mean: starch.

I'm vegetarian but shut up.

Is this vegan meme on /fit/ new? I don't remember it like 2 year ago when I was here last

It will sound edgy as fuck, but it makes me feel good that something has to suffer whenever I eat.
I really enjoy sitting down to eat and watching the steak and thinking about how the cow suffered and feared for its life.

>>35213644
>IQ

Hi /pol/.

>>35214170

Man, I went to bed and I wake up to find that you're STILL going. You must be getting paid for this.

>>35214156
>veggies make me gag :(

lol tendie eating fat man child detected

>>35214190
As a fellow meat eater, you need to see a therapist.

>>35214191
>Man, I went to bed and I wake up to find that you're STILL going. You must be getting paid for this.
That was my first post in this thread. Fix your autism.

>>35214195
I'm actually a skinny man child.

Grazing food just doesn't satisfy my appetite.

>>35214204
No it's not. We all know there's two main vegans on /fit/ because you two have distinct shitposting styles.

>>35214170
i can only get white beans, where i am at
no tofu
only soy chunks, white beans and broccoli.
broccoli aside (can't eat a kilo of it per day for 30g of protein), beans pack more than double the amount of protein in carbs (45g). for me, that is too much carbs. soy also has a lot of carbs and fats. i am an endomorph, with poor carb metabolism and i hate all kinds of cardio. the only cardio i do is in supersets and dropsets in the gym and with meat eating diet i am keeping my ass lean. with beans and soy i'd start packing loads of extra weight that i sure as shit do not need, just to get enough protein for muscle growth. not to mention the fact that i wouldn't be able to use creatine supplementation or whey protein when going vegan. soy boosts esterogen, which is in no way good.
also, eating fruits is murder as well as killing animals. the fact that plants don't scream when you destroy them doesn't mean that they weren't alive.
one more thing, unrelated, fuck all vegans who own dogs. worst kind of people.

>>35213818
No it isn't, nice try though.

You're just a self righteous bitch. You can cry all you want about animal suffering, i dont care i love it.

>>35211754
Meat is richer in protein than any plant based source. If I were to hit my daily proton quotas w beans and nuts id have to consume 2x the anount amount of food im consuming now. Thats why all my vegan/vegetarian friends are DYEL skinnyfats.

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Avoiding the brain and nerve damage caused by vegan diets due to lack of B12.

On top of not being one of absolute faggots that follow the fads of twitterellas.
>hurr meat is bad
>but let's ignore that the feed we give them is humanly inedible
>better to just throw away that 80% waste from our grain production, i'm sure that's environmentally friendly

>>35214225
>No it's not
>there are only two of you
Ok, kid.

>>35214240
>also, eating fruits is murder as well as killing animals. the fact that plants don't scream when you destroy them doesn't mean that they weren't alive.
I don't give a fuck about the ethical intricacies of being vegan and as I reported I'm mostly pescetarian. I just eat what it seems more healthy, yet I use leathers and so on. I would bathe in kid's blood if it granted benefits.
>endomorph
That was a theory purported by a psychologist, and disproved. Ectomorph, mesomorph and endomorph body types are memes.
>too much carbs
tofu is extremely low in calories. Honestly my caloric goal is 2700 kcal/day and ~310 kcal for 100 grams of legumes at ~25% proteins is good enough for me.

>>35214102
Processed gluten products like seitan are good. Basically the only way to be a bodybuilder and vegan is processed foods, raw veganism is retarded.

>>35214291
so the size of bones is all the same for all humans on earth? that is just horsefaggotry right there.
body types are a real thing. you can make your bones grow with roids, no other way.

>>35211754
Chickens deserve to die.

>>35213984
Potatoes? I eat them. They're one of the only affordable vegetables here. Meat is more affordable and always available than legumes. I don't think you understand what food availability is like in the subarctic. I eat well, through effort and desire, but it's simply not practical to rely on plant protein in a resource hinterland.

>>35213738
[ ] Not rekt
[X] Tyrannosaurus rekt

>>35211993
MODS MODS MODS

>>35214048
>We are "naturally frugivore" at best,

I hate it when vegans say this.
You look at chimpanzees, our closest relative, or even "primative" cultures like the Australian aborigine, and they are omnivorous.

You want to make claims about what diet were were on before becoming meat scavengers, then start eating grubs and insects like we're supposed to be doing.

>>35214048
>frugivore
Freelee pls

>>35214388
WHATEVER IT TAKES MEATER EATER

>>35214388
WHATEVER IT TAKES MEATER EATER

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>>35211754
https://nature.berkeley.edu/miltonlab/pdfs/meateating.pdf

http://journals.plos.org/plosone/article?id=10.1371/journal.pone.0046414

http://www.pnas.org/content/109/45/18571.full


Vegans are all quantifiable pussies and should all be eaten for those who actually want to make gains.

>>35214388
WHATEVER IT TAKES MEATER EATER

>>35214411
they eat meat and insects, etc but it always comprises a very small amount of their total calories

>>35214493
Chimps aren't bodybuilders or athletes though. People aren't asking vegans how to get enough protein to survive, but to be athletic/build lots of muscle. If you eat nothing but fruit you'll probably get like 10 fucking grams, that may keep you alive but you'll be able to do nothing else.

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>>35211766
That's a bigass moose

I eat meat because I'm not a fucking gigantic dyke faggot

>>35214523
>he says on /fit/

>>35214214
>grazing food
>lol
>not fat

Why u lyin

>>35214493
Depends, they seem to be more of a seasonal hunter.

Jane goodall remarked that during certain months chimps would eat around 65g of meat per day during the dry season.

>>35211754
Because I'm a grown ass man and I'll eat what I want.

heme iron

>>35214493
Still more than 0%
Even if it's a small amount in their diet, its existence justifies its consumption.

-The vegan diet has questionable health benefits.

-The argument of human's being herbivores is bullshit.

-It is a privilege of rich people in western civilization so its ecological impact is questionable when huge parts of the world will not or can not follow a vegan diet.

-The variety of foods required by vegan diets require long distance shipping of foods, potentially increasing your carbon footprint.

-Abandonment of livestock farming will see the elimination of entire species bred only in captivity. It is more immoral to commit genocide than murder.


Enjoy your fad diet, vegans, it has no point other than making you feel morally superior by eating fucking tofu without actually having to be morally superior

>>35214568
http://blogs.scientificamerican.com/guest-blog/how-to-eat-like-a-chimpanzee/

>On average, nine days a year are meat days for chimps.

http://www.janegoodall.ca/about-chimp-behaviour-diet.php

>Meat is a favoured food item among chimpanzees, but makes up less than two percent of their overall diet.

JUST BE A VEGAN BRO ITS 2015
I
T
S

2
0
1
5

>>35214170
>80 € a week for a single person
>not a lot

>>35212168
he looks pale and sick on the right pic

>>35214607
A large proportion of this amount is eaten in the dry season months of August and September. In fact, during the peak dry season months, the estimated per capita meat intake is about 65 grams of meat per day for each adult chimpanzee. This approaches the meat intake by the members of some human foraging societies in the lean months of the year. Chimpanzee dietary strategies may thus approximate those of human hunter-gatherers to a greater degree than we had imagined.

What you posted does not conflict in any way with what I said.
Less than 2% of their overall diet isn't really relevant when the food item at hand is primarily eaten only 1/6th of the year.

Besides that I don't really know what chimps have to do with humans. We aren't chimps and our digestion system is not the same.

>>35211766
Was the moose a wanted criminal?
Did it kill people?
I'm confused what makes them heroes.
I eat meat, just curious.

>>35211810
>there are any lions left
>they regularly encounter dandelions

>>35211848
Never gonna make it

>>35212202
There is no such thing as a sustainable food fishery.
The aquatic ecosystem forms the basis of all other ecosystems.

>>35212109
It's the sign of a disgusting unkept man who can't even be bothered to trim or cut his hair. Why are you surprised?

>>35214691
Explain how farm-raised catfish, tilapia, or salmon are unsustainable.

>>35214638
perhaps i'm misunderstanding you, as your previous post came off like they were hunting and consuming meat as a regular part of their diet

with gombe chimps that is the time of year where fruit is scarce so it is the hunting season indeed, i'm not understanding why you think this refutes their biological classification as primarily frugivorous though

>Besides that I don't really know what chimps have to do with humans. We aren't chimps
we are very homologous to them hence they are the ideal animal model, e.g. for cardiovascular research

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3243481/

>and our digestion system is not the same
most of the gi evolutionary divergences are seen for consumption of cooked food in humans, that's about it

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I like meat.
And i'm not a faggot.

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>>35214851
>you think this refutes their biological classification as primarily frugivorous
Show me where I said that. I only said that when you say meat makes up very little of the chimp diet, it is misleading. That statement totally discounts their seasonal dietary habits to make a blanket statement.

>most of the gi evolutionary divergences are seen for consumption of cooked food in humans

I'll grant you teeth and jaws, but the rest you are going to need to source

It also fails to explain humans lack of a cecum compared to other apes.

At some point in our evolutionary history plants would have needed to be inconsequential to our nutrition (or an overabundance of food, which is very very unlikely), to the point it was pointless in maintaining the ability to digest fiber. And I think you are underestimating how much different our guts are to apes.

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We are human. We are at the top of the food chain because our ancestors have been fighting and dying for animal kingdom supremacy for millions of years.

Throwing that away and living on salad and soybeans is quite possibly the lamest shit you could do.

>>35214722
I don't know too much about catfish, but salmon and tilapia farms are fucked. You literally can't breed enough salmon to be profitable in a closed system. In a semi-open system, the fish still develop fish lice (parasites in their flesh), though not as bad as they do in closed systems. In these semi-open systems they spread the lice to salmon that pass by them, negatively affecting the spawn and crippling the natural population for years hence. It happens on the east coast, it's happened in Norway, it's happened on the west coast of Canada (not sure about the west coast of the USA though). Tilapia has a similar issue but it's a less fragile fish, it will probably take approximately 15 years for the problems to be as severe. Catfish might be okay, not sure how different pure freshwater aquaculture might be. Those aren't fisheries though, they're aquaculture. There's a lot of interesting research out there on both coasts, and particularly the island universities in Canada (UVic and MUN's Marine Institute).

>>35215155
The oceans have been getting seriously fucked for a few hundred years now. The fish population has been cut in fucking HALF as a direct result of human overfishing and ocean pollution. And this rate of ocean depletion is still increasing with new advanced fishing techniques that result from increased difficulty in catching any damn fish, because there's not many left anymore.

Which is a bummer because fish are super tasty.

>>35215155
>>35215194

https://www.msc.org/track-a-fishery/fisheries-in-the-program/fisheries-by-species/

>>35215194
http://www.seafoodwatch.org/

They have a cell phone app, so you can quickly search for better fish choices.

>>35212559
>human digestion 12 to 18 hours
not on GOMAD it isn't

>>35215286
>>35215260
Thanks, I'll check that stuff out.

>>35211754

>without resorting to taste preferences
Kek
My main reason is the taste. Two other reasons;
>it's good for you in small amounts
>it rustles the jimmies of people like you

Honestly, if I didn't like the taste that much, I'd go vegetarian. Vegan is just being fucking retarded.
>hurr I won't eat cheese or drink milk because poor cow

>>35212168
What is surgery?

>>35214048

>humans
>hunters
>frugivore

Kek

>>35214170

>not genetically modified

Why does that matter? Are you one of those anti GMO nutters? If so your opinions are invalidated. If not, stop trying to make it look like a good thing.

>>35215078
>muh ancestors

lel

>>35212202
Just scrolling through and landed on your post.

Fish is not objectively healthy. However, I don't feel like fighting with you on that when you left such a juicy part b)

LMFAO M8 ARE YOU SERIOUS
EVEN IF FISH DIDN'T FEEL PAIN ARE YOU ASSERTING THAT IMMORAL ACTIONS ARE JUDGED SOLELY ON IF SOMETHING FEELS PAIN BECAUSE OF IT?
ARE YOU LITERALLY A 2 YEAR OLD CHILD?
Secondly fish may feel pain but have no way to express it in a way we can view.
Thirdly even if their nervous system was incapable of feeling pain, if they had consciousness they can still suffer without feeling physical pain.
BUT FUCKING REGARDLESS PAIN OR NO PAIN DOES NOT EFFECT THE MORALITY OF AN ACTION HOLY SHIT WAKE UP ANON.

philosophy nigga out

>>35211791

You have that backwards friend. Vegans are the ones constantly pushing their ideals on you. Just look at the OP of this thread.

>>35214631
Seriously, he looks way healthier in the left image.

>>35212168

>>35215078
Your ancestors are dead, they don't give a fuck what you do.

>>35215430
oh and one more thing, you shouldn't base your eating habits on morality. Just eat what's good for you anon.

you know unless eating that thing facilitates a system that destroys the sustainability of the world you live in. then don't. but if you don't know, and you don't, don't say stupid shit like what you said.

>>35215422
Retard posts only make your position look weak.

Would you disgrace your bloodline by castrating yourself? Same idea.

>>35215430
Calling that middle-school level shit philosophy is an insult to actual philosophers. I'm not one either but c'mon man.

And fish are totally a part of a healthy diet. Where else are you gonna get those omega acids that are essential to brain function and health?

>>35215417
Please educate yourself on GM soy before ever opening your mouth again.

>>35215449
No they don't, but while I'm alive I give a fuck.

We as humans are apex fucking predators. Our forefathers have built a world so prosperous and luxurious that their children are choosing to cripple themselves in the name of not being mean. What a fuckin shame.

>>35215470
>And fish are totally a part of a healthy diet. Where else are you gonna get those omega acids that are essential to brain function and health?
If you read my post I said I wasn't going to argue that because my sources aren't full proof enough. I don't know if you're right or not.

>>35215500
It's not like the value of fish oil is up for debate. There's plenty of info out there on this. Fatty fish like salmon also are very beneficial.

It won't kill you not to have it, but it will make you shittier. Eat fish.

>>35211754
Cheap, need to eat less, easier to prepare rather than mixing foods to create complete proteins.

>>35215487

I am pretty much known on GMOs, since I work with them. Not known with the specifics of GM soy, but I'm extremely skeptical about it being somehow bad BECAUSE it's been genetically modified.

I am fully aware of the GMO boogeyman in America though, hence my skepticism.

High protein for cheap.

>>35215487
>>35215539

Your comment got me interested about what is so bad about GM soy. Used our database to search for articles, but couldn't find a single one. Where did you get your info?

>>35215500
Not getting enough fish oil in your diet makes you more likely to suffer from Alzheimer's, dementia, and other shit like that as you get older.

>>35211754

1)

My taste matters more than your opinion

2)

I like meat

3)

I'm an omnivore

4)

I like meat

>>35215640

Didn't mean to reply to the second guy.

>>35214621
>willing to spend less than 10€/day for its nutrition
>making it

Sometimes I wonder which are your fucking priorities, than I remember I'm a Mongolian sheep shearing imageboard

I eat it because I like getting the protein and being able to reach maintenance every day. On a more personal note though, I like the taste of it, and I like knowing that a dead animal is being eaten by someone like me who won't waste it.

I have noticed that I have dark under eyes if I don't eat meat at least every now and then. Despite taking iron supplement. So eating meat makes me look better. It also gives me energy and makes me full. I don't even like the taste of it that much so I could go without meat if I had to, but I don't see any reason to do so.

I'm a female so I need iron especially much and meat is such a great source of it.

These threads are great. Eat red and cured meats in moderation. You don't have to go full vegan to save your colon.

>>35214598
>-The vegan diet has questionable health benefits.
The vegan diet is very healthful. Though I'm sure you've got some obscure study talking about how vegans are more likely to get into car accidents on Tuesdays or something to prove me wrong.
>-The argument of human's being herbivores is bullshit.
It doesn't matter what humans are 'supposed' to eat, and if you thought it did then you'd be eating a lot less meat
>-It is a privilege of rich people in western civilization so its ecological impact is questionable when huge parts of the world will not or can not follow a vegan diet.
Meat is the food of privilege. Only rich Western countries can afford to eat it in the amounts we do. The poor third worlders you act like you represent eat a mostly plant based diet.
>-The variety of foods required by vegan diets require long distance shipping of foods, potentially increasing your carbon footprint.
I haven't looked into this but I doubt this has more of an effect than that caused by raising livestock.
>-Abandonment of livestock farming will see the elimination of entire species bred only in captivity. It is more immoral to commit genocide than murder.
We have breeding programs for pandas and rhinos but you think cows will die out?
>Enjoy your fad diet, vegans, it has no point other than making you feel morally superior by eating fucking tofu without actually having to be morally superior
You seem very frustrated people care about things you don't. You also seem to be the one acting superior here.

I like meat, animals would eat us too for survival.

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Objective review of the vegan diet. Coming from a meat eater who is intrested in plant based eating, but doesnt want to instantly jump into a fad diet based on feelings.
>You can get adequate and complete protein on a vegan diet. All protein are "complete protein". Its just that some sources are lower in some amino acids. Same thing in meats.
>B-12 defiency is not an argument since meat eaters get their b-12 from supplements as well because the animals are given b-12 supplements.
>Natural b-12 source is basically dirt. Food we eat today doesnt contain much b-12 because its so sterile. B-12 is a really cheap supplement anyways.
>Vegan diet lacks in DHA and EPA which are mainly derived from fish. You can get algea based vegan omega-3 supplements though.
>You are susceptible to overdose on carbs on a vegan diet. Many people fall into idiotic fad diets like "30 bananas a day" and raw veganism.
>On a vegan diet you need to pay special attention in order to get enough fats and protein. Many people associate fat and protein with meat, so they think that fat and protein are the reasons for meat's adverse effects. Many vegans dont promote a high protein diet because they see high protein as high meat.

>>35215490

>appealing to pride
>still thinking in terms of predator and prey when we've developed so far past that shit

let me guess, you're the kind of person who frequents humanity fuck yeah threads.

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Because of this dude

I was vegan for over a year and dealt with the consequences personally. I followed some other militant vegans on youtube who went through various ailments and realized that a balanced diet is the best option.
By all means, go vegan but don't come crying to me when your teeth and hair starts falling out.
Gelatin and organ meats are necessary. I believe the problem with a meat-centred diet is that people are mostly eating lean meats, not getting any gelatin or marrow or eating organs.

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>>35216160
>overdose on carbs
You were doing so well before that

>>35216217

sounds like you didn't supplement properly.

>>35213992
what does this achieve?

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>>35216240
I supplemented with b-12, k2 and zinc. I ate quinoa, beans, fruits, vegetables, lentils, rice, seaweed, natto, sauerkraut. Main meals were kale, bananas, hemp protein shakes, beans+rice and tempeh.
What was I missing? Lost over 40lbs, mostly muscle mass, at first I had a lot of energy and thought it was great but as more time passed and more weight was lost I began to be sluggish, tired, poor mood, bad sleeps, weak etc etc.
If you want to see a funny progression of fanatic veganism to grave remorse follow the rawbrahs on youtube.
I don't recommend daily meat intake or just lean meats either. I recommend free-range, organic meat, if it's red meat-grass fed. Game is the best but I've found the most important things to be bone broth and grass-fed cow livers.
How long have you been vegan and what do you supplement?

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>>35216295
Also hemp is a great source of protein, along with insect-fed eggs and raw grassfed milk.
I lean towards a 75% vegetarian diet but try to source my meats from ethical and sustainable sources, knowing that for my body it is a necessity.
Also I worked at a raw vegan restaurant and it was hilarious listening to and seeing the people that worked there. They constantly talked about how unhealthy meat eaters were and how great it was to be raw vegan. They were the sickliest, weakest looking people I've met and their emotions were all out of control. Girls would cry at work, guys would rage, there was no trust or true love. Just vapid shells who spouted memes of living authentically but had no substance or virtues at all.

>>35216203
If you're not proud to be a human you're fucking trash.

I bet you're one of those who think dolphins are almost as smart as us.

>>35216240
Why would you choose a diet that requires strict and heavy supplementation JUST to be not sickly and weak?

>>35216160

>Vital Wheat Gluten (Seitan) has god-tier protein macros
>Soymilk contains 80% of your B12 needs per cup
>DHA and EPA are easy to get from Flaxseed and Safflower Oil
>High carbs isn't as much of an issue with high nut intake like peanut butter

Completely agree with all of your points; your last point of needing to pay special attention is spot on. I posted the things above as examples of how to properly mitigate the issues you
mentioned, but doing so requires that the person be significantly more mindful of their diet. I found out it's cheaper to hit daily recommended nutrition intake on macro and micronutrients if
going vegan, but the big catch is that you have to hand prepare Seitan and Tofu, and if you don't have Seitan in your diet, it's extremely difficult to hit 0.8+ g/lb. of bodyweight in protein
without vegan protein supplements which is just more cash spent. All in all, vegan is cheaper and can be done effectively but requires a shit-ton of effort to hit your nutrients without
supplements assuming you want it to be cheap since you'll have to shell out an hour a day cooking. Otherwise, it's way more expensive than simply eating meat.

Even if your diet uses supplements for hitting macro and micros, meat is often cheaper altogether unless time is put into cooking vegan dishes; chicken breast can be plopped in the oven for
20 minutes whereas you either have to spend two to three times per calorie for vegan alternatives or spend an hour preparing the food for a better price/calorie ratio. Having only been doing
it for two weeks now, can't say I feel different. Also, the only reason I switched is because I noticed it was cheaper. I'm not much of an animal activist, just wanted to save some money.

>>35216203
>we've developed past predator and prey

Confirmed for being a pampered city boy. Predator and prey has not and will never go away, until maybe when we upload our minds into machines. We are more animal than we are human, and pretending otherwise is unhealthy. Might is still right, in the end.

>>35211754
I have a nut allergy and I'm lactose intolerant. Meat is my only source of protein. Swallow my allergy-prone load, OP.

>>35214520

Quality kek

>>35214520
>That's a bitch ass move

>>35216398
>Soymilk
Hello Estrogen!
>Flaxseed and Safflower Oil
nothing wrong with inherently toxic pufas, right??
>Peanut butter
ahh nothing like the rancid pufa of peanutbutter

Sounds like you're on the road to poor health and obesity, friend. How are your Thyroid levels? Oh you've never had blood tests? That's okay, just remember you always have the option to lose your fanatacism.

>>35211754

I don't justifiably know how to pack the most protein in completely plant based meals that will be both filling and delicious along with the factor of being less expensive than purchasing any meat.

Having talked to militant vegans about wanting more protein and their knowledge only goes as far as meat is murder and does not provide anything that would allow me to follow in such a food trend I'd be willing to stop eating meat if it could meet the criteria of my life.

Easy prep. Tastes great. More protein than meat. Far less expensive then meat.

If these things could be met with complete ease on the week to week basis I would find no reason to consume any more meat besides taste.

>>35216280
All the convenience of scramble with a runny yolk.

Insanely delicious!

Also solves the issue of whites are best eaten cooked, yolks raw.

>>35216478
This is an enlightening topic written by ray peat:
>Concerning my background, I have a Ph.D. in Biology from the University of Oregon, with specialization in physiology. The schools I have taught at include: the University of Oregon, Urbana College, Montana State University, National College of Naturopathic Medicine, Universidad Veracruzana, the Universidad Autonoma del Estado de Mexico, and Blake College. I also conduct private nutritional counseling.

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here is some all natural vegan gmo-free OC

>>35216384
>Why would you choose a diet that requires strict and heavy supplementation JUST to be not sickly and weak?
Many people refuse to eat animals for ethical, environmental and health reasons.
Many foods eaten in an omnivore diet like milk and cereal are fortified with vitamins.
The animals you eat are often themselves injected with B12.
Many people on this forum undergo more supplementation than vegans.

>>35216369
>I bet you're one of those who think dolphins are almost as smart as us.
Almost as smart as you maybe

>>35216405
Obviously killing a defenseless animal with a rifle from a distance makes you a big tough real man unlike those pampered city boys
>We are more animal than we are human
Did you think before you wrote that sentence.

>>35216398
>Having only been doing it for two weeks now, can't say I feel different.
Good luck man, hope you can stick with it and stay healthy

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>>35216501
Forgot link:
http://raypeat.com/articles/articles/meat-physiology-stress.shtml

It's a bit laborious to read but being informed is worth any effort.

>>35211754
Eating meat has no direct moral significance.
Veganism is an argument against industrialised farming not the consumption of meat.

/thread

>>35216447
Stop shitposting on /fit/ and get back to painting Ray

>>35211754

I get to piss of vegans :3

>>35216519
Except that's not what these mentally ill nutters are screeching

>vegans don't even have the brain capacity to understand their own cause

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>>35216554
have you studied his research backed by many citations? It's interesting stuff and lends some clarity to the ridiculous amounts of obesity and ill health plaguing our nations today.
Easy to dismiss uncomfortable issues but if you were versed on the subject you'd realize the inherent danger in doing so.
Shouldn't you be releasing fake studies on the benefits of fish oil USDA shill?

>>35216512
>Many foods eaten in an omnivore diet like milk and cereal are fortified with vitamins
Way to dodge the question. A healthy balanced diet doesn't require any additional supplements. Your dumbfuck vegan diet does. Even vegetarian diets do.

>Obviously killing a defenseless animal with a rifle from a distance makes you a big tough real man unlike those pampered city boys
A bigger man than buying all your food at the supermarket.

>Did you think before you wrote that sentence
Are you denying it? Much more of our brain is animalistic than human. A couple thousand years of civilzation does not erase millions of years of survival instinct.

>>35216607

why do people think that supplements are inherently bad? you add salt and spices on your meat. that is the same as supplementing.

>>35216447

>Lose your fanatacism
>Also, the only reason I switched is because I noticed it was cheaper. I'm not much of an animal activist, just wanted to save some money.

>What is reading comprehension?

But really though, couldn't give less of a fuck about animals. I don't feel guilty eating meat nor do I plan going full vegan; I only eat a vegan style setup on regular days wherein I'm
following the same daily food intake because it saves $5/week, roughly $20+ a month and I'm hitting the same macros/micros. Basically eat the same thing every day with no variation
unless I go out to eat or am cooking something big. If I do either of those, I'm not eating vegan by any means.

>>35216512

I plan to stick with it so long as it's cheaper. My biggest concern is the lack of natural creatine sources since I'm too cheap to actually buy a $50 tub.

>>35216687
Having to take 3+ pills after every meal to be somewhat healthy means there's something wrong with your diet.

Nothing wrong with some extra supplementation on top of a healthy diet, but if you've gotta take extra shit because you'll be sickly and weak without it, you need to eat better foods.

And no, adding seasonings for flavor is not the same as requiring multiple supplements.

>>35216513
>http://raypeat.com/articles/articles/meat-physiology-stress.shtml

Actually this body of research: http://raypeat.com/articles/articles/gelatin.shtml
is much more relevant, but it's still good to know the dangers of eating mass produced meat - note the article does not say avoid meat, just look for fresh sources and if you do eat the heavily stressed and aged meat supplement magnesium, niacin, vitamin A, aspirin, and, in some circumstances, caffeine to protect against excessive polyamines.

>>35216706
I was incorrect in calling you a fanatic but you do seem to be ill-informed in the dangers of Polunsaturated Fatty Acids and Soy.

>>35216602
I've read some of it and it is interesting but I see no reason to believe him over the general scientific consensus, which is backed by many more good citations
I also find his promotion of high cholesterol and low fibre to be irresponsible
He does have some good ideas though, and I respect him a lot more than I do other people promoting alternative diets
>Shouldn't you be releasing fake studies on the benefits of fish oil USDA shill?
Do you really think I'd endorse fish oil?

>>35216607
>Way to dodge the question. A healthy balanced diet doesn't require any additional supplements. Your dumbfuck vegan diet does. Even vegetarian diets do.
I didn't dodge the question. Many people do not go vegan for health reasons even though it can be a healthful diet. If you can replace meat (which has many problems) with a supplement then why not?

>A bigger man than buying all your food at the supermarket.
You're pathetic. I respect the men killing animals in slaughterhouses more than you. At least they use their hands and have to look the animals in the eye before they kill them.

>Much more of our brain is animalistic than human.
You are really fucking dumb if you don't realize how dumb the point you're making is.

>>35216712
>Having to take 3+ pills after every meal to be somewhat healthy means there's something wrong with your diet.

but why? its the same as eating.

>>35211754
Ive eaten meat my whole life. Why should I change because vegans are elitist assholes?

>>35211754
>You have ten seconds to justify your consumption of meat
>b-b-but dont give real reasons!

>>35211754
Yes I can, Meat has complete protiens with all of the 9 amino acids required for human dietary needs unlike vegetables and other foods which only have some (and that's only if your counting protein). You can get all the protein you need by eating steak or some chicken breast, which is cheaper and more effiecient than buying a mixing all of the non-meat foods needed to get complete proteins. Protein also increases levels of test which increases protein synthesis(your bodies ability to utilize protein for its needs, also helping build muscle). Why would I limit my protein comsumption based off of bullshit you pulled out of your ass? I'm not going to get weaker just because you say I should.
And
>without resorting to taste preferences or broscience
Broscience is literally what your shilling

>>35216737
Sorry for misunderstanding you breh. Hard to know who someone is through such a short post. But you're right, painting would be a lot more productive than shitposting on /fit/ vegan threads. I like your approach though, keeping an open mind without subscribing to a specific doctrine, I don't religiously follow Ray Peat like some of his fanatic devotees but I definitely pop a Vitamin E after having my PUFAS. Also he got me on Haagen Dasz and for that I am forever grateful.

>>35214657
Where are they being congratulated as heroes? Its just an insane hunting trophy

>>35211754

>Steaks heal for 3
>Cabbages heal for 1
>My inventory holds 28 slots
>Not eating swordfish

watch for the gains goblins at the door

>>35211754
Meatless diets show drastic increases in prevalence of psychosomatic/psychological disorders in multiple accredited triple blind studies, along with suggested evidence in the hinderance of osteogenesis over a lifetime of meatless/dairy-less diets.

Even though there's many others I don't need any other reason.

>>35211954
Ancient people had toilets often with running water you retard

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>>35212559
Welp. I'm human which means I have a brain fueled by not giving a flying fuck what animals eat.

>>35216809
>Swordfish having lots of mercury

It's almost like you don't want them brain gains.

>>35211804
Topmost of keks

>>35216826
Some ancients did. Vast majority didn't. Same in the modern world too, sewerage is really taken for granted now.

>>35216737
>I didn't dodge the question
Your diet is unsustainable without outside support. You cannot live without other men making supplements for you.

>You're pathetic. I respect the men killing animals in slaughterhouses more than you.
I hunt, fish, garden, and forage. You rely on civilization to keep you alive because you're weak. You are unable to provide for yourself and your loved ones without the support of others.

>You are really fucking dumb if you don't realize how dumb the point you're making is.
If it's that dumb it shouldn't be too hard for you to explain how.

>>35216745
>its the same as eating
How is popping pills the same as eating? I'm of the opinion that if you can't grow or kill it, you shouldn't eat it. Again, if you can't live on your diet, it's not healthy.

>>35216832
> I am a human and I have a brain and hurrdy durrdy it means I can just not think when it hurts my feelings.

That said that chart is messed up and mostly bait.

>>35216867
>I hunt, fish, garden, and forage. You rely on civilization to keep you alive because you're weak. You are unable to provide for yourself and your loved ones without the support of others.
And yet it's the same for you. You aren't Amish, but then even those sorts need the support of society to survive and continue yet they are way more independent than you.

>>35216867
>Your diet is unsustainable without outside support. You cannot live without other men making supplements for you.
You really think I wouldn't eat meat in a survival situation?

>I hunt, fish, garden, and forage. You rely on civilization to keep you alive because you're weak. You are unable to provide for yourself and your loved ones without the support of others.
I hope you made your clothes, guns, fishing rods and gardening tools entirely by yourself :^)
Or did that not factor in to your apocalyptic innawoods fantasy?
Why are you so concerned with your loved ones? If you have to provide for them then they're obviously weak people who can't live without the support of others

>If it's that dumb it shouldn't be too hard for you to explain how.
How can you even define what a human brain is if you claim a human brain mostly isn't human brain?
By definition the human brain is entirely human.
It makes as much sense to say that the human hand is more animal hand than human hand.

This body of ours is not specialized to eat anything at all. Stop trying to push a meat based or vegetable based agenda. We can be what we want to be. You want to fill this self prophecy of what we "are" but that is no fine line. Those ancestors who struggled to survive during shitty years probably ate nearly anything. Bugs, plants, carrion, even rotten food. You can't justify what the human diet is just from our anatomy that story book was closed a long time ago once we started cooking food en masse.

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>>35216867
>How is popping pills the same as eating?

you are still consuming NUTRITION. its just in a pill form.
in a similiar way we able to isolate sugar from sugar cane and use it on various products.
we use tons of additives on foods and they help our lives tremendeously.

just because somethings is natural doesnt mean that its better. we as humans have worked our asses off to get away from the limitations of nature.

>>35216961
>And yet it's the same for you
Get real. You'd starve in a month if the supermarkets ran dry.

>>35216994
>You really think I wouldn't eat meat in a survival situation
If you don't eat meat for too long, it'll make you very sick when you do eat it.

>I hope you made your clothes, guns, fishing rods and gardening tools entirely by yourself
>other shit
Again you dodge the question. You're like a helpless baby sucking on your mom's tit. Without other men to provide for you and protect you, you'd be fucked.

>By definition the human brain is entirely human
Alright dumbass, dig this. You can tell what the "human" part of our brain is by comparing it with the brain of other animals. We have much more in common than is different. Generally speaking, the closer to the middle of the brain, the "older" that part is. The further out you go, the "newer" it is. In this way, the human part of our brain, small parts on the outside, are dwarfed by the ancient parts deeper in.

>>35217013
>just because somethings is natural doesnt mean that its better
For the most part. There are natural poisons, etc. There's nothing wrong with supplementation on top of a healthy diet. But if you can't have a healthy diet without that supplementation, there's something wrong.

>>35217004
This. We're really amazing animals when you take a minute to appreciate it. Anyone who has pets has likely had a brief foray into all the shit that can kill them (chocolate, citrus fruits, vegetarianism, lilies...). Imagine being like an intelligent were wolf like dog. Chocolate is a deadly poison to you, and yet here are these baldy freaks eating and drinking tonnes of it for fun. Diet wise we're a lot like rats and mice, we can eat most anything.

We're even able to be at home on a snowy mountain and have fun skiing and shit, or in a desert camping. Shit's cray man

>>35217057
Being able to eat almost anything and being able to survive on almost anything are two very different things.

>>35217042
>Get real. You'd starve in a month if the supermarkets ran dry.
Look at this Alexander Supertramp idiot. You don't know me. However I and some other anons can see your naivety.

>>35217100
Sort of sometimes. Like we're more fucked than cats when it comes to brackish and salty water, and obviously there are things like vitamin c. But we are very similar to rodents and they do well. And we obviously do well too.

>>35217042
>Again you dodge the question.
You're the one dodging the question. You rely on others just as much as I do. It's hilarious that you act like some noble savage living off the land when nearly everything you own has been constructed by other people and you post on a chinese cartoon website, fantasizing about how society will collapse and you finally get the chance to prove you're the big strong independent man you always knew you were. By the way, I hope you've got enough bullets to last the entire rest of your life and tools that never rust or break.

>You're like a helpless baby sucking on your mom's tit. Without other men to provide for you and protect you, you'd be fucked.
Don't pretend you're independent. Don't pretend your entire existence is thanks to a large network of people directly or indirectly providing for you your entire life. Most you own wasn't made by you. Most you know was taught to you by someone else. Even now, the fact that you life peacefully in a warm house shitposting here is thanks the the existence of millions of people. You are not the man you are in your childish /k/ fantasies.

>Alright dumbass, dig this. You can tell what the "human" part of our brain is by comparing it with the brain of other animals. We have much more in common than is different. Generally speaking, the closer to the middle of the brain, the "older" that part is. The further out you go, the "newer" it is. In this way, the human part of our brain, small parts on the outside, are dwarfed by the ancient parts deeper in.
They are still part of the human brain.

>>35217174
>You're the one dodging the question. You rely on others just as much as I do.
It's true I'm not completely independent or self-sufficient. But pretending you're equally capable of providing for yourself and others as I am is absurd. I do use tools others built, but I could make my own. About the only things I use regularly that I couldn't replicate myself are cars and the Internet.

>childish /k/ fantasies
It's much better to be like you then, and hope fervently you never have to defend yourself.

>They are still part of the human brain.
You get my point, stop being difficult. We are more animal than human. Stop being pedantic.

>>35217174
>They are still part of the human brain.
No but you see the brain is like an onion with the inner parts being older and the outer parts being more advanced and newer. That's why meningitis turns humans into chimps amd gorillas.

T. Lofty "neuro genius" Wiseman wannabe

>>35217216
> I'm a really independent man
> I can't fix my car or computer
Can you even call yourself a man?

>>35217224
>>35217235
To the lurkers in this thread, you'll see the similarities between these comments and others made by these posters. These boys who call themselves men ridicule what they cannot understand and pretend to look down on masculine virtues they do not possess, in the same way fat ugly women ridicule attractive men and say they don't want them anyway.

>>35211754
On a cold rainy night two African Americans break into your quaint split ranch. Being a socially conscious liberal vegan, you do not own firearms, so instead you grab your metal softball bat, from when you were in a rec league with the boys, to meet the threat head on.

Unfortunately for you Tyrone flavor blasts your right shoulder with his gat held at a 75 degree angle, commonly referred to as a "gangsta lean." You collapse into a pool of your own blood and can only lay there helplessly as you see Tyrone begin raiding your living room starting with you 50 inch flat screen. Jerome goes upstairs to corral your wife, daughter, and son. The tribesman forcefully shoves your family down the stairs. Your wife looks in horror as she sees the man she loves limp on the polished wood floor of the entryway.

Jerome remarks, “Dis hurr shawty got sum cake,” as he rips your wife’s silk pajama top off revealing her plump breasts. Your wife, Claire, looks at you in horror. Until she catches a glimpse of Jerome’s massive cock protruding from his sagging pants. Her eye’s are filled with lust and she begins salivating, and you can see a wet spot forming between her thighs. The two redguards begin spitroasting your wife in front of you and your kids. You can hear her moaning in pleasure, she's never had a dick that big you think to yourself. She screams in ecstasy as they pump her full of semen and switch places.

After they tire of using your wife as their cum dumpster they execute her, she was already on her knees how convenient, and turn their attention towards your daughter. They stuff her into a bag to be sold as a sex slave on the black market and cold cock your son. Which more than likely would cause brain damage leaving him a vegetable with no future.

Tyrone stands over you, the barrel of his Hi-Point 9mm pressed against your forehead. All you can muster to say is, "Damn n-niggers."

Eat meat, save your livelihood.

>>35217235
I can fix my car and my computer. My point was that I couldn't build my own from scratch, like I could build my own fishing rod, bow, or snares.

>>35217261
Then you're p much saying
> yeah sure I can fix my car unless it's something more complicated than changing the oil or battery or checking the fuel

This is by what I can work out you mean by "replicate". I doubt you could build a heat pump (I can and have btw) but you aren't bothered about replicating a freezer, you probs can't build a gun from scratch but you have the replacement parts and ammo for it to work and now maintenance.

>>35217308
Like I said, I couldn't build my own from scratch. That doesn't mean I'm only capable of basic maintenance, you're really stretching there.

Dunno what you mean by heat pump but no, I probably couldn't build one. If you're talking about heating a home, I can build a fire and a basic furnace. I couldn't build a freezer like you're talking about, but I live in a colder climate so I could bury my food to store it long-term. I could build a shitty gun arguably from scratch, but not from shit I could procure from nature. If I had to, I'd just make a bow.

I don't know what point you're trying to make. I've already said that I'm not completely self-sufficient.

>>35217216
What the fuck are even arguing?
First you veganism is bad because you rely on supplements.
But then you say eating meat from a supermarket is also bad because you rely on butchers.
But you yourself admit you're not that independent and rely on other people too
So what are you even arguing? You might last two months where I last one?
This isn't even an argument about veganism anymore, you're clearly very attached to this fantasy of you being a self sufficient woodsman that has nothing to do with the actual life you live
>Dude if like everyone but me disappeared I'd be this super sick woodsman like in fantasies

>>35217260
Do you often have these fantasies of big black men fucking white women? Kekold porn isn't really tolerated here, try /d/ or something

>>35217369
I only think about ghetto denizens beating up glorious white pussy when I'm not eating chicken tendies or masturbating to chinese cartoons

>>35217350
>That doesn't mean I'm only capable of basic maintenance, you're really stretching there.
No it p much does. There are people out there that have a specific car because it's mostly fixable with basic tools and spare parts, but to be able to fix the majority of issues you need to know how the parts all fit together. You don't.

You are also really very much un self sufficient. I compared you above to Alexander Supertramp. He killed a moose in the colds of Alaska and still died of starvation because the meat went bad. Do you use a freezer now?

>>35217476
>he doesn't know how cars work

with a well supplied garage you can fix just about everything short of a cracked block

also they make repair manuals just for that reason

>>35217476
Is English not your first language or something? I can fix just about anything wrong with my car, assuming I have access to the necessary tools. For the third damn time, what I said is that I could not build one from scratch.

>>35217369
You're right, we got a little sidetracked here. My point is that vegetarianism is unhealthy and unsustainable.

>>35217524

>My point is that vegetarianism is unhealthy and unsustainable.

yet world powers are pushing for a more vegetarian focused diet for the public for the sake of sustainability and public health

>>35213738

>proven

Well yeah, nothing is ever proven, but when you can experimentally induce pre-cancerous polyps by exposure to heme iron and observe clear mutagenic activity, it's reasonable to accept this as a reason for red meat's association with colon cancer. They also say

>Emerging research also suggests that bacteria in the gut may play a role. It may convert compounds in red meat to substances that promote atherosclerosis (“hardening of the arteries”) and/or cause less healthful types of bacteria in the intestinal tract to flourish.

Which is pretty interesting too. This video, just released today, talks about this

http://nutritionfacts.org/video/whats-your-gut-microbiome-enterotype/

>>35217508
If you have a replacement block you can fix a cracked block... but that's not even usually the kind of un fixable problem you'd expect to ever encounter. Outside of the Fast and the Furious or whatever racy movie you think you're in obv.

>>35217524
>I can fix just about anything wrong with my car
If your technical ability goes as far as whittling a bow, nah m8

>>35217805
You don't "fix a cracked block"

You replace the engine

>he thinks you can only throw a rod racing
laughinggirls.jpg

insufficient oil pressure can destroy an engine faster than putting nos in your eclipse, family

>>35217830
>You replace the engine
That's what I said. DYER?

As for the rest it's like a fanfiction or something. You're throwing shit and hoping it sticks.

>>35217961
What's it like being a roastie?

>>35218001
Is that a new robot term for normie?

>>35215435
yea, no one is raised eating meat without being previously educated about the two options and then having the choice in its hands

it's the vegan who push things on people, yea

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eattingnmeat isnt so bad. I think humans should have a plant based heavy diet . but occasional meat is fine. it takes the longest to digest so it rots in ur intestine but if u don't have it every meal its coo

>>35216730
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/11303585
>Soy milk at levels of 400ml show no difference in estrogen levels

I'm not a hungry skelly, so I don't GOMAD; I'm more than okay.

>High doses of DHA can result in blood thinning without proper amounts of EPA.
>Recommended dosage of Omega 3 is 1900 mg and Omega 6 is 17,000 mg which most people don't come anywhere near
>Would have to eat a literal cup of peanut butter or half a cup of Flaxseed to hit a dangerous point

Assuming you're not using supplements, actually hitting your daily DHA and EPA needs is difficult. I doubt some extra nuts in someone's diet is gonna come close to harming them.

>>35216745
Nothing inherently wrong with supplements. Something to keep in mind is that supplements often aren't absorbed as well as nutrients straight from food hence why many often give
really high doses; good example is Vitamin E supplements that often have 300%+ of your daily amounts due to some of it being lost during digestion. Aside from that, they still count.
The main issue is with price and diet: if you need to consume tons of supplements to hit your needs, there's a good chance your diet isn't well constructed which isn't necessarily
terrible if you take into account what you didn't get, but most people don't.

>>35216776
This and taste are two of the biggest reasons why I didn't switch over until recently. As stated, did it because of the price, not because of animal whatevers; it is actually cheaper to
go vegan if you're willing to do a shit-ton of cooking, otherwise it's outrageously expensive. You can buy a 5lb. bag of soy beans for $15 and that'll give you two weeks of milk and
Tofu, but you have to spend an hour preparing it. Seitan has arguably better macros than even the almighty chicken, bird of gains, and better price/calorie, but it takes way
more time to prepare and kinda tastes bland unless you put in a ton of effort. Vegan bodybuilding is for those that don't care for taste or have unlimited time.

>>35211875
bullshit.

I don't eat wheat, wheat flour and derivatives and there's plenty I can eat still.

eat only fruits, legumes, beans and grains and you'll still eat very well.

learn how to cook stuff yourself and you'll be saving money on top of that.

>>35217767
I'm not that anon, but there is data showing that simply by eating red meat with spinach or a chlorophyl supplement completely suppresses haem irons detrimental effect; albeit in rats.

>In both studies haem increased cytotoxicity of the colonic contents ~8-fold and proliferation of the colonocytes almost 2-fold. Spinach or an equimolar amount of chlorophyll supplement in the haem diet inhibited these haem effects completely http://carcin.oxfordjournals.org/content/26/2/387.full.pdf

>>35214520
You definitely havent been to the frozen wasteland of northern canada.

They have moose big enough to kick a polar bear to death

>>35218716
What's wrong with wholemeal wheat products?

I can understand white since all the good stuff is taken out.

>>35211754
Not that shit again, meat is good and we'll never stop eating it, period. Btw foie gras is the shit.

>>35212005
Do you think that's why the green goblin does full body workouts 3 times a week? He claims its the most effective but its actually because he cant recover? Kek