What the fuck does this train? Why is this one of the main

>Biceps AND triceps?

>>34905254
Also what can I replace this shit with? Just skip cleans altogether and go for more deadlifts?

it is in starting strength because rip thinks lifting for aesthetics is shitty and since the power clean is shit at building muscle it is safe for him to put it in and still feel like a real man.

>>34905254

It increases force production. It makes your hips explosive. And it will give you big give traps.

>>34905254
It trains and strengthens your dickbutt. Of you press the bar up at the end you can also make some serious jazz hand gains. Just remember to do this exercise as fast as you can until failure every time. Really whip your back and flex your neck.

ITT: Unatheltic pussies.

>>34905254

Power clean will point out all your mobility issues.

>>34905397
Eh I'm just doing SS to get the hang of everything then switching over to a more aesthetics based routine.

>>34905414
So it fucks my hips up and makes me look like a bat? Sounds great.

>>34905420
I'll bend my shit up and even breath like crazy throughout the whole thing

>>34905278
Kek

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>>34905439

YOu might get into oly lifting, and get a cute waifu, jk quit being a bitch about and just do rows.

>>34905439

If you can't do a power clean by yourself, you're pathetic. Watch some youtube videos and practice for a bit. Stop being a bitch.

>>34905487
I can do em but they just seem pointless senpai. I'd rather replace it with something better if it doesn't really train that much.

>>34905475
Dude's explosive as fuck at that weight.
Would like to see him throw some more on.

>>34905504
Here's the deal.

They're great for explosiveness and mobility, and do really well in a strength based routine. Not like, a powerlifting routine, but a general strength routine.

If you don't want to focus on strength, and you're more interested in just lookin joocy as fuark, then you can replace them with BB Rows until you say fuck SS and move on to a routine that fits your goals.

>>34905303
bent over barbell rows

>>34905529
not OP, but what is so great about explosiveness and mobility?

they seem like crossfit-tier shit desu

>barbell rows
>not superior dumbbell rows
Why do you guys hate your lower back?

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>>34905550

>>34905529
I'll take joocy dick over strength. I will definitely switch it up when I start to stall.

>>34905559
this

>>34905542
You're fucking stupid, right?

More explosiveness means a higher rate of force production. Higher rate of force production means greater bar speed. Greater bar speed means more weight on the bar and flying past sticking points.

>>34905545

Fucking bait.
They have literally been a major part of strength and athletic training for decades.

>>34905475
Rows are actually for pussies. PCs all day.

>>34905519
everyone is explosive as fuck with 80kg m8

>>34905759
good job, your using bar momentum to lift more weights.... but how does any explosive movement help me in general?

>>34905770
still look like the dumb shit you'd find in a crossfit routine that'll get you fucked up

R O W S
O
W
S

>>34905796
Spot the newfag.

>>34905798
im assuming your a DYEL who only uses machines and dumbells to curl right?

>>34905798

The power clean is an extremely well established Olympic lifting variant.

Crossfit appropriates certain Olympic lifts, but usually does so very poorly.

Olympic lifts and variants =/= crossfit faggotry.

You're an uneducated dyel. Fix that before you bother posting again.

>>34905796

>> so you can use bar momentum generated by explosiveness to lift more weight.
>> so how does explosiveness help me?

Do you see how stupid of a question that is?

Though the deadlift will see the most benefit, anything that requires rapid hip extension will see benefits as well.

It's fucking stupid, don't do it.

>>34905900
Ur fackin stoopid m8.

Power cleans are /fit/.
Rows are r/fitness.

>>34906114
Power cleans are for people who actually fucking lift

>>34907026
You must have a pretty good row then

literally half of your body: traps, erectors, glutes, hammies, even calves. but if you really don't want to do them, go ahead and do shrugs, back extensions, squats and calf raises instead. faggot.

>>34907144
This. Although most of these muscles are muscles that many beginners don't give a crap about because they mistakingly think they're free to just train their "favourite muscles" and don't realize the shitstorm of muscular imbalances this approach leads to.

Anyway, they're just a fucking exercise. If anybody's emotionally attached to an exercise they need to calm the fuck down. The fact is that bent-over rows and power cleans are both great. You can't really compare them though - that'd be like comparing apples to oranges.
If you want, nothing is keeping you from doing both. Simply doing 2-3 sets of PCs followed by 2-3 sets of BORs works well whether you're doing SS or SL or something similar (although BOR doesn't offer much that you aren't already getting through Chin-ups if you're doing those).

And no, PCs aren't hard to learn. If you can deadlift you basically just need to add a jump and get your shoulders forward. Yes, if you want to move really heavy weights it requires a bit more finesse than that, but so does every lift. Technical proficiency is not something you have from day 1. It's something you develop over time.
Conversely, BORs are actually a bit more complicated than most people think, and I dare say the vast majority of people are actually doing them very wrong (ever heard anybody complain about low back pain?), which makes them hard to learn because there's a big risk you'll be learning them from somebody who're doing them wrong.

This was a really good thread. And it's going to die.

>>34905542
You're fucking stupid, right?

More explosiveness means a higher chance that you will explode like a fucking bomb. Higher cance of explosion means more jobs in the film industry.

>>34905397
power cleans build traps like no other

>>34907211
>correct BOR form
Which is? I basically just grab it out of the rack and RDL it to my desired angle and go from there, trying to keep neutral chin and everything braced. I find it hard to get a nice even contraction though, I think one of my shoulders is a little more protracted than the other which warps my form

>>34907286
almost elicited a chuckle out of me

your spelling though

no one whos actually good at lifting does power cleans as an assistance. they might help novice lifters with their DL but hell, so will everything else.
and no, power cleans aren't that good for the traps. people who say that have just gotten the doms from power cleans and think they must thus be great for traps. there are way better movements for that purpose

the only reason to do them is "explosiveness" for general athleticism. however, if you're not interested in that, don't do them. Rip himself says that older people dont have to power clean cause older people dont usually need to be explosive. and the injury risk is a bit higher than in other exercises.

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Power cleans are one of the most common lifts in any athlete's routine so take from that what you will

If you're not conerned about strength, speed, power, or just generally being a competent and fit human being and just want big muscles then skip it and do accessory work.

>>34905254
>what the fuck does this train
Nothing deadlifts don't train muscle wise, but (I'm not English please forgive me) it trains "nerve recruitment" for the deadlifts BETTER than deadlifts themselves do.
However I don't like doing them on a separate day. I warm up to a max with single PCs and then do my DL set.

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>>34907286

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>>34905439
you're retarded

>>34907598
>and no, power cleans aren't that good for the traps.
Incorrect.
>and the injury risk is a bit higher than in other exercises.
Confirmed for dyel. Post discarded.

>>34907600
This person believes hamstrings provide knee extension. You should probably listen to him.

>>34907753
>it trains "nerve recruitment" for the deadlifts
no it doesnt
>>34905254
you get to train power cleans and it works as a recovery day for diddylifts

>>34907598
Post a pic of your physique.

>>34909000
Calling it now he won't post it. You heard it first here.

You could replace it with speed deadlifts if you're training for powerlifting - Justin Lascek writes about it in his Texas Method book.
Rows are a common replacement as well.
I'd recommend keeping them in your program - it's a fun lift and doesn't take *that* much out of you.

>>34909009
Yup. Probably his first month.

>>34908837
>Confirmed for dyel. Post discarded.
lol, i literally quoted rippetoe himself
>>34909000
excellent argument m8

if you dont have a coach to teach you the power clean dont do it, it isnt easy to get the form down

>>34905770
not bait, just new and stupid

>>34905848
oly lifts arent good for building strength

>>34907352
anything builds traps.
deads, rows,

only one concerned with traps is dyel fags that want some sort of visible muscle
laugh at all the fucks doing a million shrug variants at the gym

>>34905770
theyre in ss so they are a major part of strength training

>>34907415
* you're spelling though

130kg power clean reporting in

If you do rows instead you are literally a vagina

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>>34905254
these non weightlifting plebs s m h

>>34909531
Post your body.

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>>34909541

>mfw they don't want to do one of the most fun exercises one can do

>>34909541
Get out of here stalker

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>>34909569
>implying all these people "want" to skip powercleans
its not like they're rationalising not being able to learn or anything

>>34909580

>not being able to
More like being too big of pussies to try
You don't need a fucking weightlifting coach to learn a passable power clean

>>34905254
Can I do powercleans with a torn labrum?

>>34908837
It's kinda true though, the other day I was doing power cleans in a commercial gym (so no bumper pl8s) and I only rested like 2 minutes from my last set of 3, the 2nd rep of that set felt hard, but I went for a 3rd one anyway and it pushed me deep into a full front squat in a shitty position and I couldn't stand back up. I ended up having to drop it but I kind of tried to grab it with my hands like an idiot and lower it down with my arms. Fucking dumb, it pulled down my thumb and for a few days after it hurt to squeeze or push on anything. So idk man, if you're not careful and end up going to failiure, especially in a commercial gym you're asking for trouble.

still going to give up cleans though, they rock.

As for if you don't want to do cleans, I think the best replacement is light (or 'speed') deadlifts. Rip himself actually reccomends 3x5 weighted chins as a replacement for power cleans if you cant do them, but I think you should do both 3x5 chins and power cleans (along with 3x5 of some sort of row, IMO push/pull balance is important and shouldn't be brushed off as Rip likes to do.

So do this for a clean free version if you're a total fucking pussy.

A:
Squat 3x5
Bench 3x5
Deadlift 1x5
Any Type of Row 3x5 (I like cable rows, chest supported row machines rock too, ideally a medium overhand grip pulling to your sternum should be used as it is closest to the opposite movement of the bench press, it works a lot of rear delt and mid back, although a row pulling to the belly is great for lats, will involve more biceps depending on grip used, better for bodybuilding, not so great for 'balance')

B:
Squat 3x5
Press 3x5
Deadlift 3x3 (Use 80% of the weight you used for workout A, or maybe even less if you didn't get all 5 reps, be explosive and use very nice form)
Chins 3x5 (or underhand lat pulldowns, or pullups or w/e the fuck, it's all vertical pulling, although chins or underhand pulldowns you get more bicep involvement and I think is a better choice)

>>34909670

>got pinned by a power clean

Breh it's not that heavy
Do you not front squat either? Smh

>>34909729
I'm doing SS and back squatting 3x a week (recently switched from lowbar to high bar because of a tendon issue). But yeah, I should've been able to get it up, but I don't front squat (or even squat high bar which is more transferrable to front squat than low bar) so that's why. I'm considering alternating front squat and back squat each session, at least once I can move some decent weight on back squat. I think it's especially a wise idea since I want to do (Oly) weightlifting.

>>34909447
>>34909600
Incorrect.

Dumb question but the weight should return to the floor every rep of a power clean right?

>>34909405
>lol, i literally quoted rippetoe himself
are you implying rippetoe doesn't look DYEL?? he literally looks like 9/10 of obese american males.

>>34909892
yes, otherwise you are doing hang cleans.

but if you are doing the lower end of the movement quickly, you are going to want to lower the bar, at least 99% of the way down to use the explosivity of you standing up

>>34909940
He's got a messed up back.He could still outlift you.

>>34909827

You should drop low bar for good if you want to do WL, it's garbage for the motor patterns you want to reinforce
Alternate front and back squats too, you need to be able to front squat 90% of your back

>there are people in this thread that don't clean
P a t h e t i c

>>34909967
>implying
that nigger can't even powerclean 2pl8

>>34909963
Thanks man

>tfw clean and snatch form is garbage

I want to do them so badly, but I have no fucking clue what I'm doing

>>34910069
>Practice at home with a broom or something while watching videos
>??????????
>cardio

>>34905397
I see you read the book.

>>34909977
What? No you don't, that's dumb. Plenty of accomplished lifters don't meet that ratio

This is how I usually distinguish from casual dyels to people who actually lift. If they do power cleans they are serious, otherwise usually skelly dyels.

>>34910292
Name one. I'll wait.

>>34909977
I have dropped lowbar for good, I just really had no good excuse to switch to highbar, I just wanted to keep the momentum going. Now I have some intertia with highbar so I'm not switching back anytime soon. I also think I'll start alternating front and back once I can move some devent weight on back (as I said). I'm a weak DYEL that squatted only 145lbsx5 high bar ATG last workout (when I did lowbar I managed to double 185lbs), I'm thinking once I get to lmao1.5-2pl8 I'll start front squatting regularly, and it really shouldn't take too long to get there.

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>>34909977
>"Oh, what's that, you're doing lowbar "squats" with 405 lbs, or as we Olympic Weight-Lifting gentlesirs prefer to call them: Good-mornings with 180 kilograms?"
>"Itis quite the sight, now please observe as I work up to my one-rep max of a mindblowing sixty kilograms"
>"Oh no good sir, I am in no way "DYEL", for these are actual full squats"
>"Quite indeed good sir; I not only break parallell, but I also abhor the use of crutches like belts and knee sleeves"
>"By this virtue alone, I am stronger than you, for you see, no mindless cretin "power-lifter" can aspire to lift weight as cumbersome as this with equally flawless technique - You quite simply do not have the mental fortitude, as evidenced by you seeking the path of least resistance with your ridiculous "squats", which barely hit parallell"

>>34910611
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nLVJTBZtiuw

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>>34910765

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>>34910771

http://i.4cdn.org/fit/1447519112647.webm this is why I don't do them.

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>>34910803

>>34905798
>olympic lifting is crossfit

Kek, pls be a troll

unless you're into team sports as a hobby there is literally zero reason to power clean.

>>34910887
Incorrect. Stop parroting other people.

>>34909600
>You don't need a fucking weightlifting coach to learn a passable power clean

Seriously, they're not that hard to learn. And you're not trying to win medals, you're doing SS, just do the fucking power cleans.

>>34910906
i'm not parroting other people, there's no reason to train RFD if you're not competing in sports that require jumping, sprinting, change of direction, etc. training RFD does not transmute to maximal strength activities in the gym.

>>34909874
They can't both be incorrect m80

>>34910935
>>34910939
Incorrect.

>>34910939
Can we not take the middle ground?

>>34910316
Pretty much this.

>>34910803
So I suppose you don't lift anything at all, then? People have seriously injured themselves with pretty much every single exercise there is m8

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>>34910952

>>34910971
Correct.

>>34910977
Show me a video of someone getting injured while rowing.

>>34905430

>tfw you want to be atheltic
>tfw atheltics class coach laughed at you whilst you athelted

>>34911007
>tfw they're still athletics class coaches and you have a real career.

>>34911018

>atheltics

It was all a ruse, buddy.

>>34905254
Because heavy deadlifts every session is too much in the later stages of the program.

Read the book.

>>34905430
atheltic.

>>34911005
I developed some pretty obnoxious scapula tracking issues by getting sloppy on just dumbbell rows. And if you don't see how you could hurt yourself on a barbell row, try lifting sometime.

>>34910887
>I run the 100 m race
Literally zero reason to power clean

>I run a leg of the 4 x 100 m relay
Power cleans are good for you

Sound logic

>>34911066
Been lifting for 7 years kid. Nice projecting though.

>>34905798
There's nothing in CF that hasn't been around for years. It's how CF executes stuff that's generally batshit retarded.

>>34910935
I work in a facility that has me throwing the most fuckall awkward boxes on top of each other. You can bet your ass it takes explosive force to throw those clunky mother fuckers.

>>34910472
Why wait? Start now.

>>34911098
>kid

Fuck off. You've been lifting seven years but you can't imagine injuring yourself on rows? Okay.

>>34907286
kekd hard anon

>>34911205
i have only been lifting 1 year, and cannot imagine doing anything stupid enough to cause injury on rows.

>>34911205
>getting this mad
Fucking lol even if you're trolling you made my morning

>>34908805
>that dyel asian doing power cleans at your gym
HAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHA

>>34911219
>use too much weight
>cheat with you lower back
>herniate disc

There.

>>34911224
There's this asian dyel with a little dick I see sometimes in my gym's locker room. He's just so small it actually pisses me off. I watched him put his combination in his combo lock a few times and memorized it. What I'll do is I'll wait for him to go shower and I'll take all of his clothes and go put them in my car. Then I come in back and wait. Lol then he has to walk through the lobby and out to his car in a towel. Bonus points if he's late for work after a morning gym session. I just die laughing. I think he knows it's me because every time it happens I'm always sitting up front just laughing my ass off. But he hasn't said anything to me about it.

>>34911241
yea, i cannot imagine doing anything that stupid.
that is like saying bench press is dangerous,, because if you load up 9pl8, and unrack it, it will crush you to death.

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>>34911271
>bench press is dangerous.. because if you load up 9pl8, and unrack it, it will crush you to death.

>>34911241
cheat rows are fine tho, plenty of people do them

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>OP

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lol at this one dyel arguing with everyone who does power cleans

>>34911287
Cheat rows are fine, I actually think very strict barbell rows are kind of stupid. But you can hurt yourself doing them, just like you can any other exercise, which was the point raised initially. You are unlikely to hurt yourself doing machine curls compared to a max clean and jerk, but it could happen. I'd say barbell rows are about as 'dangerous' as deadlifts, which is to say not very dangerous.

>>34911258
You are a massive fag,my nigger.

>>34911324
oh okay i agree with you then

>>34911258
>this actually happened

>>34911287
Yeah, if you cheat with the hips, not with the lower back though.
>>34911191
I don't want to fuck around too much, I'm a DYEL thats lifted for like a year and have made like no gains because of fucking around too much. Idk man. Maybe I'll front squat when I'm in the gym tomorrow.

>>34911317
muh sides

>>34911324
>deadlifts can't kill your spine

hmmhmmmokay

>>34911335
>>34911344
Look it's okay if you're new, but at least lurk for a little bit before posting.

>>34911413
>not even trying

>>34911364
Front squats are far from 'fucking around.' The shit will help you develop back tightness for back squat, if you do it correctly.

>>34911420
I don't keep track of pastas, if that's what you're getting at.

Two different people you responded to btw.

>>34910202
read*

>>34911344
fuck off reddit

>>34911493
>le reddit

>>34911442
Okay m8, I'll start front squatting

By fucking around I meant changing what I do too often, idk man. I'll give it a go and I'll start light.

>>34911442
Okay m8, I'll start front squatting

By fucking around I meant changing what I do too often, idk man. I'll give it a go and I'll start light

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>>34911560

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>>34911614
>>

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>>34911645

>>34911673
>>

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>>34911317
christ

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>>34911716

>>34911767
That gif always makes me happy.

Good day, anon.

>>34911080
He wasn't trying to be logical, he was providing a "rule of thumb." By team sports he meant football, basketball, soccer, ultimate, baseball, softball, etc. You went out of your way to seemingly bolster you're intellectual image by putting someone else down. And on an ANONYMOUS Japanese anime board at that. Nice job bro. No one's impressed though.

>>34911317
Lel and /Thread

>>34910977
All exercises can injure you, true. However, only a select few such as the power clean can kill you if done incorrectly.

>>34913074
Please stop giving fitness advice.

>>34907211
>>34907144

>>34905439
you sound like a fucking chick

>>34910446
Klokov, you might've heard of him :^)

>>34915119
Show me a video of Klokov back squatting then front squatting < 90% of his back squat.