What are your thoughts on 'restoring' old tools? Im

I'm of the opinion that quality, design solutions and materials used is what makes an old tools fascinating - whereas chipped paint and rust signals poor maintenance and screams for a new, more caring owner and user.

I wouldn't say I'm terribly good, but I enjoy dabbling in restoring items to their former glory to the best of my ability.

>>1229715
>chipped paint and rust signals poor maintenance and screams for a new, more caring owner and user

its also an opportunity to ask for a lower price

i usually strip the rust & paint off and put on a clear coat

>>1229715
I get what your saying. But tools that were passed down from a grandfather etc are bound to have signs of heavy use.

I think old tools that were passed down look way better than new stuff you can buy at home depot.

>>1229705
I really like the idea of restoring old tools, usually they feel a lot more solid than their newer counterparts due to material choice

>>1229730
Yes!
Solid metal castings beat the feel of abs plastic any day!

>>1229732
exactly

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>>1229705
The Pratt and Whitney lathe from around 1939 I have is the best machine I own, that's 77 years old.

>>1229730
For one thing with practically everything made in America they didn't have to put it on a ship and sail it from China to US. I think because of that tools were heavier and more rigid/durable.

I would also like to add that even Chinese castings suck balls compared to old American iron.

Chipped paint is OK but rust needs to die.

>>1229754
>t even Chinese castings suck balls compared to old American iron.

Even including shipping across the pacific, if you paid the same amount of 2017 dollars adjusted for inflation that the 1939 american lathe cost I bet you would have one fantastic piece of machinery. I agree that a lot of chinese stuff is garbage, but again, pay the same for products made anywhere in the world, and in general the Harbor Freight tools are as good or better.

>>1229772
shipping across the pacific is also really fucking cheap. autists go "hurr my 12-page selfpublished cartoon cp cost $20 to get to me overnight, imagine what a 300-pound chunk of steel costs", but the truth is that it's around $1000 to send over a 20x10x10 cube of literally anything if you're willing to wait a couple weeks, and most of the costs are incurred getting it to and from the port - so it's quite easy for cheap china labor carry from factory to port, plus extremely cheap container shipping, plus expensive american labor carry from port to you to add up to less than expensive american labor from factory to far depot, moderate mass shipping from far depot to near depot, expensive american labor from near depot to you.

the difference is that things aren't built to last, which is bemoaned by every old man afraid of his own mortality until the second you sit him back down in front of a 30-year-old lathe and tell him that his job is to precision-machine by eye all day instead of pressing a button to confirm to the cnc mill that stock is loaded and it can recreate the autocad drawing now.

>>1229705
I usually find one or two old tools a year working on whatever. Reserve a jug of Evaporust just for that reason.

>>1229705
An old tool will last decades longer in the hands of a craftsman who uses and maintains it, then it ever will being a decorative rust ball.

Restore the fuckers. Use them. Be proud.

>>1229705

>What are your thoughts on 'restoring' old tools?

If by 'restoring' you mean getting it back into working order and putting it to use then yes that is good.

But if you mean getting your grandfather's $10 hammer and going through the arduous process of restoring it to brand new and having it sit on a shelf while you do nothing with it then it is fucking retarded.

>>1229854

>shipping across the pacific is also really fucking cheap.

This, somehow.

I can order an LED or something off aliexpress shipped to my door for less than the cost of a damn postage stamp. Not sure exactly what manner of fuckery is involved.

>>1229705
Depends on what it is
Just because a tool is old doesnt mean its good or practical

>>1229932
There is something to be said of nostalgic keepsakes.

Then again, that then becomes more an heirloom, less of a tool.

>>1229945
>less than the cost of a damn postage stamp
I've had a delivery with actual post stamps on the envelope. They totaled at more than twice of what I paid for it. Chink magic.

>>1229985
Actual stamps above and over is them hoping you're a small business who will want $1,000 in LEDs once at least 98/100 of their first shipment pass QC. The balls-cheap shit like my buck fifty for a carton of smokes in a week is just China Post selling "when we can find a hole that size" tier service to promote local manufacturing, like the US used to sell media mail before Congress decided PROFIT FOR THE PROFIT GOD.

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>>1229705
Rust is not a sign of a tool that was used. It is a sign of something that got left on a shelf and wasn't cared for properly. Your picture is of an abused vise. The jaws have been removed, it's rusty in places that would normally be moved a lot, and has been painted a puke green. That is not the condition of a tool that was cared for.

See picture related? This motherfucker is mint. The craftsman even put his name on it. This tool was well cared for. It is a North Bros. 'Yankee' 990 machinist vise. You know how I know it was well cared for? Because Stanley bought North Bros in 1946. It has some dings and scratches but it rust free and hasn't been drilled full of holes by a careless fuckwit.

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>>1230021
Here is a neglected example of a similar vise from the same manufacturer.

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>>1230021
And a careless fuckwit example.

>>1230021

That kind of rust no.

But in a tropical coastal environment where 75% relative humidity is considered low, you'd be hard pressed to keep any face of uncoated steel rust free for more than 24 hours.

I mean I pick a brand new drill bit out of a set, check its size compared to what I am trying to fit and stick it back in. One hour later I go to grab the same bit and I see a perfect replica of my finger print, in rust on the drill bit.

The only thing that keeps tools rust free is constant use. Then you can develop a nice patina but even then, leaver her alone for a week and she starts bubbling again.

>>1230029
I kinda prefer this A E S T H E T I C

That's a little far but if a tool doesn't have some dings and scratches on it, it's clearly not being used. Rust is a sign of disuse, but flaking paint and pock marks are marks of proper use and the tool itself being heavy duty enough to survive.

>>1230050

Jesus Christ

It looks like a vice out of a first year engineering class. To find that good looking that must be the only memory of a real vice that you have

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>>1230029
Maybe he did it once or twice and then just decided it was his sacrificial vise.

>>1230029
that would look kind of cool if you brazed it and milled/sanded the result

>>1230029
That's hate for vise and drill bits.

>>1229945

There's a postage agreement between the US and China, specifically the whole "ePacket" thing.

Long story short, shipping from China to your door sees a huge discount, effectively subsidized by the government. I don't remember the actual numbers, but it's something crazy like 90%.

A lot of US sellers aren't happy about this, as you can imagine. Depending on size/weight, it's not uncommon that US-to-US shipping alone costs more than the same item _and_ shipping from China.

>>1230038
do they sell oil where you live

>>1230069
>effectively subsidized by the government.
it's actually subsidized by the post office at the behest of the government

restoring old tools is cool. The best woodworker in the world- Ron Swanson tries to get as old of tools as he can because they used to be made with a lot of quality materials unlike today with harbor frieght and ryobi and shit

The old tools you see are quality because most of the old crap is long turned to dust and scrap. The exceptions are crap that somehow escaped this fate.

In the 60s and 70s there was a phrase: "Americrap." That was the precursor to today's chink shit, though americrap was produced for a long time before that.

AMT was one of the americrap brands, and AMT tools are pretty rare. Mail order garbage.

>Table saw for 20$ - supply your own motor though and good luck keeping it from wobbling!

Sears used to have some brands below their craftsman line - dunlap, companion, etc.

There's old made-in-japan and made-in-korea garbage that floats around ebay as well, from when they were not marks of quality.

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>>1230093
This is true. I collect and restore old tools as a hobby. Sometimes I find an odd brand I've never heard of. I have to dig deep into google to find people on forums talking about them. Often times they are house brands for Five and Dime stores or just low end. They don't hold up. Generally, the only stuff left is the stuff that stands the test of time. That way, you know it is good. Also, the price is always nice. I've never paid anywhere near even 50% of retail price for a similar product that was new, even when the thing I am buying is like new.

I posted the pictures above of the North Bros. vises. They also made the famous 'Yankee' screwdrivers. The name North Bros. was phased out by Stanley in the 1950s yet I find North Bros Yankee push drills and screwdrivers all over the place. Stanley Yankee screw drivers? Not so much, even though they are newer and Stanley still made millions of them. They started making them cheaper in the 1960s. Plastic handles, thinner metal, cheaper platings, etc. They don't hold up as well as old North Bros. tools.

Same deal with Craftsman vs Powr-Kraft. Everyone knows Craftsman used a number of vendors over the years for their tools but they always used high-quality ones for the Craftsman name. Powr-Kraft was Montgomery Wards' top brand of tools. They generally didn't use as good OEMs as Sears did and their tools weren't quite as nice. Old Craftsman tools? I find 15 for every one Powr-Kraft.

>>1230099
>tfw you find an obscure tool with a great gimmick in a shitty body or with proprietary consumable blades/other pieces from a defunct company

Was considering contacting local machineshops to see if they could copy parts for me. Is this viable or is it actually illegal and I'm SOL?

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>>1230105
The price can be prohibitively expensive. I paid $20 for a very nice Goodell miter box with a Disston backsaw. The miter box was missing two parts that were used to hold down the wood when working (picture related) and act as a measured stop (measure once, set the stop, then each piece will be cut to the same size), respectively. 100% not required but nice little features. I checked at several local machine shops and the cheapest said they could knock them out for me in an hour or two. The material price was like $8, labor was $60.

As for the legality, patents in the USA only last 20 years. If it is older than that then you are fine.

Out of curiosity, what is the tool? Maybe I have heard of it.

>>1230052
>It looks like a vice out of a first year engineering class.
Exactly; a vise (ITS SPELLED VISE YOU SHITPUMP) out of a group of people with genuine love and enthusiasm for what they're doing. The machine spirits would be pleased, if there were any.

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>>1230109
>As for the legality, patents in the USA only last 20 years. If it is older than that then you are fine.
Oh that's good.
>Out of curiosity, what is the tool? Maybe I have heard of it.
Mostly thinking of the future because I am primarily getting tools to use, not display. Currently it's some foreign stuff:
I have a Rotary Razor Plane from Japan (pic related) that has one packet of blades and the only supplier with more has a limited stock as the company is defunct.

A 1930s hand-cranked german drill press - the chuck works, but badly. Its on a nonstandard threaded rod and is keyless. I am unsure what parts are bungled but if it's more than a spring I will be fucked. Also paranoid about accidentally breaking a part and ruining an antique tool with a much more difficult ability to replace it without an intact original.

An adapter for a brace drill that has a 1/2-24 threading and only a 1/4" capacity keyless chuck. The shank is worse for wear and it slipped a few times already, so I want to get a spare made in 1/2-20 or 3/8-24.

A 3/8" socket to 1/4" hex adapter to use hex bits with a ratchet, speeder handle, etc. One came with a tool I bought and it's immensely handy, but I can't find additional ones anywhere in my searching (it only comes up with the reverse, that lets you use sockets with a driver) and the tool loses a primary function if I lose, break or wear out the adapter (it holds the bits with a friction-fit, not magnetic).

>>1230121
Addendum: first two are foreign, third I have no idea as it's unmarked except for some numbers. Last one is still in production.

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>>1230121

>I have a Rotary Razor Plane from Japan
Pardon me for saying, but it looks like shit. Why can't you use a standard Japanese style pull plane? Picture related. It just looks like a cheaper, shittier version of those.

>An adapter for a brace drill that has a 1/2-24 threading and only a 1/4" capacity keyless chuck.
A tool should really only be used as it was intended. Braces that use a two jaw chuck should really only be used with the old square shank bits, which you can still get. You have already found out why. Way too much torque for an adaptor, so thing get stripped. What you want is a breast drill. Yankee made the best. They came in two jaw and three jaw varieties. If you want to mount round and hex shank bits you will want a three jaw version. I have seen three jaw braces but they are much less common than two jaw varieties.

>A 3/8" socket to 1/4" hex adapter to use hex bits with a ratchet, speeder handle, etc.
Do a google search for "Irwin Tools 3558131C" Is that what you mean?

I really should take some pictures of the shop I work in for you guys sometime.
We have a Kearney and Trecker Milwaukeematic, a Cincinnati Hydrotel, and a dozen Bridgeports from the 40s-60s.
My boss and a couple other older guys have 60s Yankee breast drills they still use from back when the shop was just a handful of folks.

>>1230038
Actually it's humid as fuck where I live too, I coat my tools in oil.

The immediate rust replication of a fingerprint is from you sweating on it, sweat rusts tools 100%.

>>1230109
patent infringement only occurs if you try to sell the item, not sure how that matters to a machine shop copying it for you though.

you can make personal copies of patented items all you want.

>>1230128
>Pardon me for saying, but it looks like shit. Why can't you use a standard Japanese style pull plane? Picture related. It just looks like a cheaper, shittier version of those.

Never said I can't, just that I like this thing and don't want it to become useless.

>Braces that use a two jaw chuck should really only be used with the old square shank bits, which you can still get. You have already found out why. Way too much torque for an adaptor, so thing get stripped.

It's actually the square shank end of the adapter that has been slipping. Not the adapter's jaws, the part made for the brace. I'm not sure why exactly. The reason is that I have some 1/4" hex-shanked bits which are designed for a huge amount of torque (people reported them actually breaking cheaper drills when the motor wasn't engaged for them properly) and new auger bits (wood owl, etc) are in a larger hex size. Plus I keep finding old auger bits that some nonce in the past cut the end off to use in his power drill.

>What you want is a breast drill. Yankee made the best. They came in two jaw and three jaw varieties. If you want to mount round and hex shank bits you will want a three jaw version. I have seen three jaw braces but they are much less common than two jaw varieties.

Was considering it if I couldn't get the adapter sorted. I'd rather not deal with the weird size and shape of a breast drill if I can help it though. I have seen holdall-style braces (which don't have 3 jaws, interestingly) and some new, plastic-gripped braces have universal chucks.

>Do a google search for "Irwin Tools 3558131C" Is that what you mean?

Shit thanks! That's pretty much the exact thing I needed! I don't know why it never came up for me, all I kept finding were the reverse when I put in every keyword combination I could think of.

>>1230029
And yet I'm sure it still works.

I'd stay away from old vises.

>>1230239
It's not a machinist vice man, it's a garage vice to hold the bullshit you're fucking with at the moment.

And in that regard it has replaceable vice jaws, which is a nice feature. The casting isn't broken or busted anywhere or so it seems.

OP, get someone to machine you some brass flat jaws for it (flat so it doesn't leave a cross-hatch pattern on what you clamp into it). Then soak it in EvapoRust, scrape the old paint off, repaint it, oil it.

If there is excessive wear on it, it will require some machine tools to repair.

>>1230247
Nah im saying the "screw" (dont know what vise shits called) gets fucked after enough use.

>>1230252
>gets fucked after enough use.

it's called lubrication son look it up

>>1230260
nah, its something different. They go all loose on you, its like the metal shrinks over time or the groves get worn away over time.

>>1230262
>its like the metal shrinks over time or the groves get worn away over time.

oh. ok. lubrication is no good for that.

>>1230264
yea, but that depends if its been lubbed over the years. Think of it like a used gun, sometimes its fine, other times the action is well and truly fucked.

>>1230252
>>1230262
man those leadscrews will take years of abuse, and yes they get worn out.

It's probably a motion transmission screw like an acme thread or a square thread leadscrew, you can buy a threaded rod of good steel pretty cheap for an acme thread to make a new one.

Acme/Square threads are used where loads are higher so the extra material on the threads is important, they also transmit motion better than a standard 60 degree V thread. The V threads tend to tighten up under load and "stick".

My precision vises all have acme threaded lead-screws. Probably old vises do too.

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Found an old ax head in a burn pile we had, and it was rusted to shit. cleaned it up with some wire brushes and oil and this is how it looks now. This was actually my first serious DIY project, think I was 15 when I did this?

>>1230262
>>1230252
acme threads get worn down to a "V" shape, it's pretty obvious when they're worn the fuck out if you look at the screw, the area where it's used the most will be thinner on the tops than where it isn't used as much (usually the ends).

https://youtu.be/Tnl_tWMGN3E?t=68