How to solve the problem of shelf sag? I've had this on

>>1119074
That is the standard fix. Also, using real wood instead of particle board helps.

>Specifically with IKEA shelves and such, that you can't install this on.
Right, because they are shit. Particle board, MDF, whatever. Don't buy garbage if you don't want garbage.

>>1119079
Except it happens with real wood too.

So basically, you have to custom build a wall to wall oiled walnut book case from a master carpenter born in 1583 for $25000 or you're fucked? There has to be something better than that solution.

>>1119074
If the shelf is solid particle board, just screw that length of wood underneath it in the middle rather than to the edge, that way the screws won't just tear through the shelf as the middle sags.

If the shelf is that thick, hollow particle board crap Ikea likes to use for some of their shelves you can't even screw stuff to the bottom. For that case you can do one of two things:

1) Attach an L iron to the wall in the middle of the shelf.

2) Screw a length of wood to the wall underneath the shelf (just make it short enough that it fits between the self's two attachment points).

>>1119081
>There has to be something better than that solution.
Stop putting too much weight on your shelf maybe?
Just a guess.

>>1119091
The way I did it on one IKEA TV shelf is to just put vertical supports (same color particle board dividers cut to proper height and depth) right in the middle, but that would look like shit on a bookshelf.

Looks decent on a TV shelf since it divides the big empty space into two spaces for two consoles.

>If the shelf is that thick, hollow particle board crap Ikea likes to use for some of their shelves
I know exactly what you mean, I drilled cable holes in that shit and I couldn't believe it was all empty inside and had fucking cardboard in it, but this material is from what I've seen used mostly for the outer frame, not the actual shelves things are supposed to be placed on

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>>1119074

If you are putting them on a stone wall or against a solid wood backplate use pins along the entire length "floating" shelves, instead of just the side.

Otherwise just put a flat steel, or an angle iron at the back of the shelf. That won't sag soon.

>>1119099
>Otherwise just put a flat steel, or an angle iron at the back of the shelf. That won't sag soon.
Does that actually work on particle board? How thick does it have to be? Doesn't the back stay fixed and the front sag anyway?

Because that's really easy to implement, I could do that on every shelf I ever buy really, since it's just a matter of cutting that shit and screwing it in.

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does diy think my floating shelf design will work?
each one will be 4' long and wight about 5-10lbs.
gonna use 4" screws into the wall!

>>1119107
no it will sag

>>1119109
how do u know?

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>>1119102

>Doesn't the back stay fixed and the front sag anyway?

Very unlikely with an angle iron, it keeps the back of the shelf completely rigid. A flat steel might twist and allow the front to sag that way I guess. Only problem with an angle iron is that you will need a router to recess it into the wood and hide it.

I have a some dirt cheep cabinets made from 1mm sheet steel and I can stand on the shelves without sensing deflection.

>>1119110
What is a fulcrum,Alex.

>>1119112
Fulcrum? Hardly even knew 'em!

>>1119112
so you don't know?

>>1119074
Google Sagulator


You're fucking welcome.

Sag is a function material strength, construction, load, and attachment. You can fuck with those variables to get a result of acceptable sag

>>1119074
Just use good-looking brackets. Not everything has to be trendy.

>>1119074
And if in a bookshelf, a proper thickness of wood, even mdf, won't sag

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OP here btw, I'm specifically looking at best solutions for this one (the longer portions), didn't get it yet, but I fucking know it'll sag very soon.

>>1119116
1/32 in. per foot.
what are these old mystic runes?
what is it on about feet for its a bookshelf not a shoe rack!
why choose that particular outdated measure? why not say the eye can detectus sag as slight as CMLXXI / MMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMM pollex per MMMMMMMMCCDDXCVI / MMMMMMMMMM palmipes. just as practical and sensible.

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>>1119204
>1/32 in. per foot.

>>1119199
screws from the back along the shelves will do wonders, assuming the backing isn't just fancy cardboard.

>>1119251
>assuming the backing isn't just fancy cardboard.
It is.

>>1119261
So, you've learned not to buy shit furniture, right?

>>1119204
>why choose that particular outdated measure?
>Doesn't notice that it's a decade old article that was originally printed on dead trees.

Gee, wonder why its old...

>>1119074
1/2 to 3/4 plywood (plywood, not particle board or MDF).

Wood doesn't sag if you don't overload it. Also, keep it at a consistent low humidity level (no open windows near it, no humidifiers).

Periodically, flip it 180 degrees and place the bow upwards.

>>1119283
>Periodically, flip it 180 degrees and place the bow upwards.
See you'd think that IKEA shelves would be perfect to do this with.

But no, they fucking have grooves on only one side so you can't do it unless you put them on a completely different set of holders that you have to devise on your own.

>>1119074

Use thick wood. Use ample support beams under the shelf.

Novice wood worker here, but this seems like a pretty obvious solution.

Am I wrong?

Everything I build I use at least 3/4 wood, except for like the back piece to a bookcase, or any decorative trim.

>>1119204

Fuck off moron. Builders and craftsmen of all types still use imperial units. Stop being a bitch man-child.

didnt even need to read the rest to know your buying ikea shit. my 50 year old solid shelves still look heaps good and can hold a lot of heavy books where as my billy bookcase from ikea had noticeable sag within half a year from holding manga..

>>1119284
Stop fucking buying ikea shelves then holy shit

>>1119199
You're going to spend more time and money keeping fiberboard ikea shelves from sagging, then just buying a real wood bookshelf from the start. Or, better yet, making your own.

This Old House did a nice segment on making a bookshelf from stair treads that would be dozens of times stronger than any flatpack ikea garbage.

>>1119534
>then just buying a real wood bookshelf from the start.
I honestly haven't seen one in any of the stores in my country ever. Even the "high end" ones are particle board.

>>1119539
yep, everything is fucking particle board these days
real wood is getting impossible to find at non exorbitant prices

>>1119539

Remember -- see the old chart somebody posted above -- the critical elements are
- load
- material
- thickness
- span

If you have to accept particle board, go for shorter span, or thicker, or less load.

I got a reputable carpenter to build me some built-in bookshelves out of really nice oak. Said repeatedly to him: I am really going to put books on these. Really. He made them out of good material, looked truly great, but span too long for filling with books. ARRRRGH.