>most of marvel books are written by literally whos from tumblr

File: mistakes into miracles.jpg (42KB, 300x400px) Image search: [Google]

42KB, 300x400px

>big names cost money
>DCs market and dollar share are falling
>nobody wants to buy a $4 DC book even tho they'll shell out $5 for a Spider-Man book

>>94148755
Marvel comics only exist to get laughed at. The moment the MCU stops being popular, Disney is selling that shit again

>>94148755
Marvel outsells dc. It's just that marvel no longer needs top writers, the brand sells.

Didio however was talking about variant covers killing the industry. And that's true for stores.


Overstocking causes damage. And most stores don't sell on back issues but tpb and toys and new comics. My two stores dropped back issues.

>>94149107
>>big names cost money
They sure do. I wonder why Marvel doesn't get them when they have all that money, right?
>>DCs market and dollar share are falling
Could it have something to do with the number of books between the 2, of course not. Silly me.
>>nobody wants to buy a $4 DC book even tho they'll shell out $5 for a Spider-Man book
Spider-fags are autists. Tell us something we don't know.

>>94148755
>Marvel is massively successful outside of comics and still dominates market and dollar shares with "literally whos from tumblr"
>DC is desperately clinging to a medium they themselves admit is dying because that's the only area where they have some "success"

>>94149183
>Overstocking causes damage. And most stores don't sell on back issues but tpb and toys and new comics. My two stores dropped back issues.

To be fair to the publishers, they all do variants and the stores all over-order to get them. We heard this "variants are cancer" thing from Image a couple of years ago - they then released more Walking Dead variants than ever before. Publishers can't afford to find out that their real audience is half what they're actually selling to stores - stores can't keep pretending they'll make the money back getting the variants signed and selling them on for a few hundred apiece. I'm sure it works for some, but it's essentially the same bubble that struck in the 1990s.

File: 1500926772647.jpg (2MB, 3340x4448px) Image search: [Google]

2MB, 3340x4448px

>>94148755
Marvel wanted a new breed of writers that would appeal to a new demographic and its biting them in the ass. Brevoort honestly thinks a business policy of making people hate read things for a short term sales spike is more sustainable than a steady stream of income from am enjoyable book will eventually kill Marvel.

I've even talked to two LCS shop owners in Manhattan and they even said they even said they never had anyone put a Hellcat issue in their pull list. They even had trouble giving them away when they tossing most of their stock for free comic book day.

>Getting ready for a DC fantastic Four inspired team book with Plastic Man.
Life is good.

>>94149227
>>94149227
>They sure do. I wonder why Marvel doesn't get them when they have all that money, right?

Because they're already paying names that they have on-staff, like Bendis, Slott, etc. They get in other names on the regular, but they also try out new writers. That's smart - nothing like finding a hit writer for DC to poach for more money.

>Could it have something to do with the number of books between the 2, of course not. Silly me.

In June, for example, DC released about 84% of the number of titles Marvel released (and 150% of the titles Image released, 165% of IDW, and 380% of the titles of each of Dark Horse, BOOM!, and Dynamite.)

DC's top 300 share was 83% of Marvel's, 205% of Image, 373% of IDW, 631% of Dark Horse, 683% of Dynamite and 1,025% of BOOM!

The number of books released is immaterial; what matters is orders. Retailers aren't ordering DC titles - if every book sold like Batman, DC would be leading the market with a share 1025% of Marvel's, but their books don't sell that well, because retailers can't shift them even with price breaks for big orders and variants to encourage higher sales.

>Spider-fags are autists. Tell us something we don't know.

They're autists with lioncash. This apparently escaped you. Precious lioncash is the lifeblood of business. DC isn't running a charity for down-on-their-luck neckbeards.

>>94148755
>superstar creators
>Tynion and Orlando

>>94149615
>Snyder
>Lemire
>Reis
>Lee
>Romita
>Kubert
I don't know, maybe they hope that after Detective's success Tynion might be able to sell a bunch of comics. Also Orlando doesn't have anything in that imprint.

>>94149227
>They sure do. I wonder why Marvel doesn't get them when they have all that money, right?
Do you just not know anything about Ike Perlmutter? Marvel employees have to re-use staples and bring their own toilet paper from home because Perlmutter cuts costs anywhere he can. Why would he ever allow them to pay more for bigger name writers when they can just go the BOOM! route instead.

>>94149810
The state of big names is a mess.

>>94149252
Nothing else is causing damage. Sjw shit has little effect on sales and is mostly in books designed to be axed.

Piracy can cause damage. I seen ultimates get more the readers it gets online than buying the book. But it's not as massive as music piracy.

Lowering prices won't work for marvel, overhead costs. Ike would have to fire whatever old artists left. And use black and white paper.

He did fire most editors to cut causes.

>>94149875
There's literally one superstar in comics right now and he's too busy running a cinematic universe.

What's causing sales to drop are storytimes. Granted, some cannot buy singles but the alternative is worse. Comixology is too expensive.

They need to go back to newspaper stock.

>>94150747
Print media's declining. Once it's properly dead, then digital issues will have a better price.

>>94150747
Never gonna happen unless newsstands come back. But you can also blame the 90's for killing the newstands.

Most people read digitally now. Only other way is remove net neutrality or the net.

>>94149107
>they'll shell out $5 for a Spider-Man book
Heh marvel gave that book away in a collectors corp box. They bought their own book

>>94149810
>Reis
>Romita
>Kubert
Why these guys are considered to be a superstars?

>>94149454
>In June, for example, DC released about 84% of the number of titles Marvel released
And Marvel got what, 5% more of the market share? Selling Star Wars and Marvel titles? Not counting variant incentives, overshipping, loot crates and the usual shit. Those are closing shop numbers anon

>>94149183
Marvel only outsells DC because of scummy business practices like incentive variants and overshipping, plus line wide higher cover prices and oversaturating the market with a ton of books and #1s. DC has a much higher share of the TPB market and is only trailing behind Marvel by around 5% for monthlies, despite this.

The brand sells, but not their comics. Why else is Marvel using the same shitty business practices to boost short term sales that caused the market crash back in the 90s?

>>94148755
>Marvel depends on the direct market because scamming LCS with their bullshit is the only way to stay slightly ahead in the statistics
>DC does fine in the direct market but they need quality to keep their dominion of the trade market, which is basically a DC monopoly between the Big 2

>>94151470
This excuse again. You aware marvel always dominated over DC mostly?

Jim shooter era owned 70 percent of the market in the 80s. Forcing DC to change their characters to get sales post crisis. Which still didn't do much.

>>94151216
>Most people read cbr torrents now.

ftfy

>>94151550
We aren't in the 80's anymore though.

File: 1472174869733.png (277KB, 1389x683px) Image search: [Google]

277KB, 1389x683px

>>94149230
>>DC is desperately clinging to a medium they themselves admit is dying because that's the only area where they have some "success"
?

>>94151550
And now Marvel owns less than half that amount.
Their June market share was under 43%. They're keeping a lead over DC only because of Star Wars and their shit tactics, which are designed to fuck over the retailers and the industry just to falsely boost their own numbers for the illusion of gain.

You can call it an excuse all you like, but that doesn't make it any less true.

>>94149615
>Who are Miller, Ellis, Snyder, Lee, Capulo, Johns and Morrison
>Who is Chris Priest

>>94151272
Reis definitely moves the needle, the other two I don't think so

>>94149230
>>94151627
FUCK OFF /tv/

>>94151799
Just a reminder that no super star will work in continuity.

Who gives a fuck OP? Comics are worthless wastes of paper designed for mindless children. Wertham was fucking right.

>>94148755
And yet he failed to grab Donny Cates. DC fucked up there. Cates is now on Dr Strange

>>94153485
DC can do without some new flavor of the month.

>>94153506
>flavor of the month.
you haven't been reading Heavy Metal apparently.

File: BookScan 2016 Top Selling Authors.png (73KB, 782x1865px) Image search: [Google]

73KB, 782x1865px

>>94150677
But Scott Snyder sells better than Geoff Johns.

>>94151550
You should be aware that people on /co/ know shit about comics or their history?

Why do you people think DC did a face-lift to their universe in the 80s? It's because they wanted to catch up to Marvel. DC has always played second fiddle. Just because I'm a DCfag doesn't mean I can't admit that. People here on /co/ like DC more because they're hipsters, Marvel it's just more popular with normies and casuals. Why do you think the trash Marvel is publishing right now still sells? Because casuals eat that shit as long as it has the Marvel characters.

>>94153619
Holy shit, i didn't realise Walking Dead and Invicible sold so much.

>>94149230
I think you forgot that DC has better games and animation (even though the animation hasn't been so great lately).

>>94153619
Too bad Yang's book store success didn't make any difference at all to New Super-Man.

>>94148755
>>DC's going all out with big names
>Humphries
>Lobdell
>Jurgens
>Bennett
>Tynion
>Orlando
>Hitch
>big names
Don't know if that's sad or
> launches an entire imprint dedicated to superstar creators
the fact that this whole line that's just a stealth shot at Marvel for saying artists don't sell is. Or maybe it's the fact that DC(and apparently you) unironically believe Tony Daniel is a superstar artist.

>>94153638
punished Spider-Man fags and X-Men fags never learn the later includes me. We all want Marvel to be good again cause they have so many great characters. But now that Ultimates 2 is being cancelled I have no more Marvel books on my pull list I may put Astonishing X-men on cause I am said punished fan

>>94151794
Still beating DC.

>>94153718
>this whole line that's just a stealth shot at Marvel for saying artists don't sell
well, the fact that they stole a couple of Marvel's best artists for it means it worked.
>tfw no Rockafort on Ultimates
it still huts

>>94149107
>nobody wants to buy a $4 DC book even tho they'll shell out $5 for a Spider-Man book
? Spider-Man's sales are in the fucking shitter.

>>94153638
What is your rant about? Nonsense.

Most people don't know any history. Anywhere on any board. The amount of people i correct is staggering.

>>94149107
>nobody wants to buy a $4 DC book even tho they'll shell out $5 for a Spider-Man book

Except Spider-Mans sales are shit

>>94153718
Frank Miller and Neil Gaiman are both writing for it, don't be dense.

>>94149230

I love this b8 because some retards actually believe it

>>94153663
Invincible barely sells anything. Walking Dead makes the grand majority of that.

>>94153663

Kirkman is fucking loaded man. It's why he can afford to shit talk Marvel so much. He's worth more than all their writers combined.

>>94153619
I hate that Mark Millar is even on this list. Fucking trash

>>94151550
>Jim shooter era owned 70 percent of the market in the 80s.

And that was because the books looked like they were done by people who gave a shit about what they were doing. Even mediocre Shooter-era books are lightyears ahead of a lot of current Marvel.

>>94153742
>T-They've dropped but they're s-still beating DC guys!

Pathetic defense, Marvel intern

>>94153939
still not as loaded as the original image creators. Jim Lee, Leifeild, and Mcfarland are the biggest money makers in comics

>>94153952
That's mainly because of Civil War, Old Man Logan, and Superman: Red Son, but primarily Civil War because the movie was out last year and his book has been consistently one of Marvel's top sellers ever since it got collected in trade form.

>>94153663
Invincible didn't make it on Bookscan's list. The vast majority of the Kirkman comics that did were Walking Dead volumes, and I think only two were Outcast (which got a TV show).

>>94153746
>stole a couple of Marvel's best artists
What? Jim Lee, Tony Daniel and Rocafort are DC. I guess Rocafort had a small sting at Marvel but he's mostly a DC guy. Oh and I guess JRjr but they poached him a while now and let's not pretend like he's a top guy.

>>94153619
>But Scott Snyder sells better than Geoff Johns.

That's partly because all but one of the Snyder books on the list are Batman (the only non-Batman one is Wytches).

Johns' list is Flashpoint, Blackest Night, DC Rebirth, Batman Earth One, Aquaman: The Trench, Flash Rebirth (the 2009 one), and a bunch of New 52 Justice League volumes.

>>94153619
>Ennis with all the Preacher cash
>Gillen making that Wicked + Divine money
>Loeb making a million from Long Halloween/ Color series every year plus producing every Marvel show salary
nice

>>94154294
Wicked + Devine sells decently but not enough to make those numbers. Where else is he cashing in? He's a good writer so I'm glad he's making bank but I don't know where it's coming from

>>94154365
Star Wars.

>>94153619
You mean Batman sells more.

>>94154294
>>Gillen making that Wicked + Divine money

Wicked + Divine is only a small fraction of his stuff on the Bookscan list, the rest is TPBs for his Star Wars: Darth Vader series.

>>94154449
>>94154412
ah ok, that makes sense. I just don't care much about Star Wars anymore. Rogue One kinda made me give a shit again, but not enough to read a comic.

Still, glad he's doing well, his Journey into Mystery was great

>>94152059
>Being a continuitycuck
Neck yourself

>>94148755
>>DC's going all out with big names on their books
What Big names? Most of their bullpen is the likes of Lobdell, Abnett, Humphries, Tomasi, Jurgens etc.
>launches an entire imprint dedicated to superstar creators
Tynion, Venditti, Abnett are superstar creators now. Even the artists are house style artists, rather than actual superstar names like Quietly and Paul Pope.

DC and Marvel are equally shit and no big writer wants to write a monthly run for them anymore.

>>94154520
Read the fucking thread faggot
If Frank Miller, Neil Gaiman and Grant Morrison aren't big names to you, you're retarded

>>94154536
>Gaiman
What's he writing for DC?
>Morrison
Read my post again. No big name wants to write a monthly book for them.
>Miller
This is not the 80s.

>>94154412
>>94154449
oh nice, I like Gillen's JiM a lot

>>94154520
I thought DC's super starts were Snyder,Johns and Priest atm

I'd be so happy if Marvel was readable again. I don't care about favorites, I just want passable books. Not even good ones, just books that are somewhat well written. Marvel is so deep in the trench of some sort of "activist" writing that it's not clever and is now annoying. I'm tired of being patronized by their books because of who I am. Write a good story you FUCKS

>>94154675
Marvel has a dozen+ good books right now, the same as DC

>>94153638
History is fucking history. Bringing up Marvel's market share from 30+ years ago under Shooter as if it's relevant to their market share now under Alonso is being disingenuous.

That fact of the matter is that Marvel has lost a huge amount of their market share for reasons that have been discussed to death. Retailers and fans are pissed, with good reason, and Marvel's sales figures reflect this.

>>94154715
Which ones aren't all activist-y? I'm interested but I hate the idea that all of the heroes all have the exact same beliefs and all feel like a writer jerking their dick off over how superior they feel due to their politics.

>>94154715
Ultimates ^2 is cancelled. So no, they have zero good books now

>>94154618
While Priest is a good writer, he's not and never has been a great seller.

>>94154758
Samefagging here to add a point: Are any of the books you might suggest actually well written and not, y'know. -bendis funny- if you catch my drift?

>>94154764
Neither is King. But it doesn't matter, DC is playing the long game. They are banking on trade sales.

>>94150677
Johns isn't a superstar. He never wrote anything like kingdom come, red sun or arkham asylum. Not even talking about shit like miracle man or animal man.

>>94154816
King's Batman is a huge seller, somehow. Though I guess we'll see with Mr. Miracle if that kind of success will boost his other cape work.

>>94154886
Johns's biggest claim to fame is the revitalization of Green Lantern, turning it into a top ten title.

>>94154764
>>94154816
I don't care about sales, but quality wise, DC and Marvel are in a creative rut. Both of them combined are hardly producing a handful of good books.

>>94154919
Rebirth hasn't been terrible tho. I know Marvel boys hate it but I dig everything.

>>94154601
>hurr because Miller isn't as good anymore he's not popular or famous
Fuck off
And of course big names don't want to write monthlies, that's because the economics of comics have changed. Short of a FAT exclusive deal (like the one Bendis has) a big name makes much more money doing OGNs for the big 2 and minis for Image than they do grinding at the big 2. That big money exclusive deal means they'll have to write several books a month like Bendis does, which is pointless if they don't have that drive anymore.

File: 1499629257754.jpg (164KB, 1715x567px) Image search: [Google]

164KB, 1715x567px

>>94153638
>>94151550
Spouting history facts means nothing when your analysis skills are completely shithouse. What exactly is similar between the Shooter era and the Alonso era? Marvel and DC books were mostly the same cover price back in the 80's. Marvel's books on the whole in the 10's are $1-2 more than most of DC's. Marvel's monthlies back in the 80's relied on direct and newsstand. Marvel's monthlies in the 10's relies on the direct market, incentive variants, subscription boxes, and overshipping. "But Marvel is still beating DC again, guys!" Yeah, if you easily get fooled by the smoke and mirrors they're doing in the last 7 years. Sending 43 extra books to a retailer who only ordered 10, then trying to say "but we're still outselling DC on that Diamond preorder list!" isn't a sign of good business health. All it does is rely on the general public's ignorance on what the Diamond chart is.

>>94154715
Bullshit, they had at best 5 when DC had 10 and Ewings Ultimates just got cancelled

>>94154919
>Hanna Barrbara comics
>Looney Toons Crossovers
>Shade the Changing Girl
>your pick of decent to good Rebirth titles Green Arrow is mine cause I'm a sucker for that, but Green Lanterns is pretty damned good most of the time too
I haven't read Wildstorm but I hear that's good too. Stop sticking to DC's main universe, their outside universe stuff has always been better

>>94154965
>Hasn't been terrible
So DC are in a creativity rut too.

>>94155021
Capeshit's highest tier is "not terrible", brosephus

>>94155061
80s and 90s vertigo beg to differ

>>94154758
>>94154999
Uncanny Avengers
U.S.Avengers
Doctor Strange and the Sorcerers Supreme
Unbelievable Gwenpool
Iron Fist
Deadpool
Black Bolt
Royals
Silver Surfer
Astonishing X-Men
X-Men: Blue
Captain America
Secret Empire
I am Groot
Weapon X
Edge of Venomverse

>>94155112
Isn't Secret Empire just Spencer whining that trump won or something? I haven't touched it because it looked dumb.

>>94155061
And?
If we consider Watchmen or Swamp Thing in a "not terrible" tier, then rebirth must be "irredeemable" tier at best.

>>94155112
Uncanny, Royals and Astonishing are a yes. The rest are a no.

>X-men Blue
STOP SUPPORTING TERRIBLE BOOKS!

>>94155139
>not reading the first good event since Age of Apocalypse
why?

>>94155178
>First good event since AoA

How?

>>94149183
Yeah he said he wasn't going to do variants for the Metal event but that it was going to have a folding cover for the main comic series and that it was going to be priced $2.99.

>>94153672
>has better games
not for long

>>94155178

In what way is it good? I'm actually curious. I literally haven't touched Marvel since civil war 2. If it's just Spencer crying about Trump, then why bother, there's plenty of better writers doing more subtle stories about that in plenty of media.

>>94155178
Secret Wars? I read that

File: 1495637466255.jpg (1MB, 1988x3056px) Image search: [Google]

1MB, 1988x3056px

>>94155230
Spencer has no fucks left to give because everyone hates him already
it's beautiful

>>94155285

And that's a good thing? What I'm getting from this is that Spencer is just a left leaning Frank Miller.

File: 1467289154676.jpg (49KB, 406x381px) Image search: [Google]

49KB, 406x381px

>>94155251
Yea, Marvel vs Capcom Infinite is coming out soon

>>94155285
Sorry, let me rephrase:

How do you exist having shit taste? Best event since AoA? That's your benchmark and Secret Empire is better? Christ above.

File: 1498669317693.jpg (4MB, 3975x3056px) Image search: [Google]

4MB, 3975x3056px

>>94155264
Captain Keikaku is just messing with everyone so hard and most of the tie-ins have genuinely been great

>>94155245
Dark matter line, not metal.

>>94155312
and Spiderman and Lego Marvel Superheroes 2 and that Square Enix Avengers game

meanwhile after Injustice 2 DC has...

>>94155348

I'm just not seeing it.

>>94151627
>B-but China

>>94155285
Did the artist not bother to finish drawing the top of Steve's (I think it's Steve) button flap thing?

>>94153619
>Way that high
I AM UPSET ABOUT THIS.

>>94155178
What? The first good event since Age of Apocalypse was Onslaught Saga. If you meant the first good event since Onslaught Saga, then that'd be AXIS.

>>94155307
>implying Spencer isn't moderate right
>implying Miller isn't a liberal
wew. Just because one doesn't like Trump and the other doesn't like Muslims doesn't mean that one is a liberal and the other is a conservative.

>>94149107
Yet Kite Man beat Secret Empire and beat Spider-Man by a lot in Comixology.

>>94155461
He's considered Left in America, the country where people matter.

>>94155502
he was a republican politician before writing comics while Miller was an adamant Hilary supporter

>>94155003
>Shade the Changing Girl
Why does /co/ seem to like this so much? genuine question. What I read of it seemed pretty bad with teen cliches and stuff, and characterization seems like a big step down from Milligan's series. Doom Patrol seemed way better to me out of the Young Animal line.

>>94155917
>step down from Milligan's series
So? Milligan Shade is some of the best comics the medium has ever produced. Don't know what you mean about cliches but it's trippy and does teen stuff well. It's obviously a Young Audience title but it's well made, I can understand not liking what it's doing because it's not your cup of tea but it's doing it well. It's a good character driven comic that delves into issues of identity and alienation.

>>94154987
Both Big 2 companies back then also had annual subscriptions for monthly books that they would ship out, just like any other newsstand available magazine. That's completely unheard of today. The Direct Market changed a lot of things, firmly solidifying floppies as a speculation market. That's why Marvel's scum tactics like overshipping and variant incentives work to their short term advantage at retailer expense.

TPBs and GNs sold in book stores are a better gauge of actual direct to consumer sales, as is digital (if they'd ever bother to release their numbers).