http://screenrant.com/spider-man-ho mecoming-box-office-drop

Is it released in China already?

>>94019269
Sony needs to stop trying to make it's own Spider Man universe and Marvel, both in film and comics, needs to stop keeping Peter in high school. The problem with both is neither wants to move on and are beating a dead horse

When you've spent an entire decade overhyping Spider-Man, then make a film that brings the character back to 0...it's not an appealing offer.

Should've been Spider-Man 4, tbqh.

>>94019269
>3 origin movies in 15 years
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rKMMCPeiQoc

>>94019269
Thread hidden.

>>94019269
why would anyone want to go see a movie they've already seen twice?

it's not like people would expect a remake of Avengers 1 to be successful.

>>94019747
Pretty funny how Einstein's famous quote about insanity pretty much describes the scientific method accurately.
Or hell, throwing a dice.

Most overrated and overused quote I can think of.

Or maybe it just wasn't a good movie and didn't even try to be a Spider-Man movie. In fact, /none/ of the movies apart from the Raimi films tried to be a Spider-Man story. Guess which ones were successful?

>>94019331
Nope. Only later this year.

>>94019883
>/none/ of the movies apart from the Raimi films tried to be a Spider-Man story

Stop.

>>94019624
This. Sam Raimi seems to be the only person who respects the franchise. Not just in movies, but as a whole. Say what you want about how Spider-Man is more serious and made less jokes in the film, he got the heart of the franchise and clearly knew his shit about the history.

>>94019269
>One More Day
>Spectacular Spider-Man cancelled.
>Ten years of Dan Slott.
>Three different iterations of Spider-Man on the big screen in 15 years, the second two doing nothing unique. All of his supporting characters that matter besides Aunt May are at Sony.
>Writers and other staffers are Marvel constantly telling us what we want from Spider-Man and that we're wrong if we disagree.

>>94019883
I hate how people like you start creating in-fights. The Raimi movies already got enough undeserved hate over the years because "muh comic accuracy", now you even want to play the elitist card?

Homecoming is a good movie, admitting it doesn't take away the originals' greatness. And if you want to talk about accuracy i hope you see the irony here

>>94019967
Actually, this is probably good news for Slott. No risk of him being removed in favor of a high school reboot now.

>>94019939
>Stop.
No. Homecoming was a damn disgrace, which is why all the spider fags keep constantly shitting on it apart from two people who /love/ how they completely took a shit on If This Be My Destiny. ASM made Peter too cocky and too much of a smug little cunt

>inb4 B-B-But, Peter wasn't a nerd it Ditko.

Yes he was, re-read the book. Peter was a social outcast who had zero friends because he didn't fit in with anyone else. He definitely wasn't a smug cunt who laughed when he got someone kicked out of science exhibit for stealing his ID card.

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>It's another "Muh Raimi" wanking thread.

He's gone, accept it.

>>94020042
>inb4 B-B-But, Peter wasn't a nerd it Ditko.
Stop arguing with straw men, you collossal tool.

>>94020042
He was kind of a school shooter in the making

>>94020042
Sounds like something that Ditko's edgelord "Randian" Peter Parker that people love to jerk off about would do.

>>94020042
Peter wasn't an outcast for being a nerd. He was an outcast for being an arrogant tool.

>>94019269
This is guaranteed to make a shit ton of money once it releases in Asia. Nips and chinks love Spidey.

>>94019971
Who says I'm talking about accuracy? I'm saying Raimi told a Spider-Man story while the others didn't. Sam Raimi understood why Spider-Man was popular and resonated so well with other people. ASM was all over the place in tone and Homecoming was pants on head retarded and was only made to suit commercial needs.

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VINDICATED

I AM SELFISH I AM WRONG

>>94019971
Homecoming was still a very unSpider-man film, still. It was ok(people overrate it way too much), and many of the pros were from Michael Keaton who carried it.

>>94019269
it's like we were all saying

if this movie is failing it's not it's Sony's fault for rebooting so quickly

>>94019939
The cool about spiderman comics is that he was just a teenager playing hero and it got terrible consequences no matter what he did.
>uncle died because of him
>love interest died because he didn't know how to rescue her right
>wanting to stop being a hero but felling like he got a duty
>identity crisis caused by clones

He's simply not compatible with MCU formula of everything being funny ducky

>>94020175
>ASM was all over the place in tone

Not really. There was a noticeable tonal shift between movies, but as standalone pictures they're pretty consistent with themselves.

I enjoyed the 90's-esque grittier tone of ASM but the color design of ASM2 was amazing.

>>94020201
It's severely underperforming. I mean, it had yet another 50% drop and now it's trailing behind WW, which started with 15 million less.

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>>94020042
The people that shit on Homecoming have literally no argument other than crying about race changes and muh Iron Man. Hell, I'm 90% sure most of the haters didn't even see the movie since they keep bringing up stuff like "Michelle JONES" (the movie doesn't reveal her surname) or "too much Iron Man!", which is in for like 10 minutes

These "spider fags" most likely the same people that shit on the Raimi movies for the stuff you just mentioned, or Dunst's MJ and minor shit like that

/co/ is the last fucking place where you should ask wether a movie is good or not

>>94020175
>>94020195
I want to hear your reasonings. And i expect to hear something other than "he was a hero just to look cool"

>>94020020

My point, which I forgot to actually make before hitting submit, was that Spider-Man has been in such a sorry state for about ten years.
You can only be angry about your favorite hero being shit on so long before it turns into apathy.

>>94020249
Wonder Woman is the most leggy superhero movie of the last 20 years you know

>>94020132
No, Ditko Peter Parker only had hate for his classmates (Flash in particular) and Jameson. And he never acted on all his mischievous thoughts about them because he'd remember what happened last time he acted selfishly. He certainly wouldn't do something like that to a stranger.

>>94020142
Post an example. They literally would just shit on him for no reason. Even the random assholes who nearly ran him over started to make fun of him.

>>94020201
>b..but sony

Hey, why is the movie called "Homecoming" again? Why were Marvelfags crowing about Marvel getting Spider-man back for so long?

>>94019331
Nope. The release in China is probably not gonna do much for it because it got saddled with a August release. Piracy could put a huge dent in its numbers, not to mention that the hype for it would be completely dead by then.

>>94020263
>/co/ is the last fucking place where you should ask wether a movie is good or not
trust me, /tv/ is worse

>>94020237
>Not really. There was a noticeable tonal shift between movies, but as standalone pictures they're pretty consistent with themselves.

The first film was consistent, but the second was all over the place. You had some super dark imagery spliced in with some really goofy moments.

For example, right after the morbid death of Gwen, we get this really cringeworthy moment with Rhino. That created a ton of emotional whiplash for the audience.

>>94020311
Well, at this point there's no difference. Try check the board every now and then, whatever CBM related shitposting thread you'll find you can bet your ass that it'll pop on /co/ too shortly after

>>94020237
1 was certainly better than 2, but the ending ruined the movie for me. Namely the George Stacy deal.

>>94020195
Seems very Spidey for me, I'm just gonna list the pros and cons.

Pros
>Very different feeling from your typical MCU movie.
>Holland manage to get a perfect balance of Peter and Spidey, something that the last two failed at.
>Keaton Vulture was great, one of the best MCU villains in a long time. That car scene was well directed and acted.
>Great set-pieces and chill humor, very homely compared to the bombastic previous entries.
>A after-credits scene which hypes up Vaas Scorpion.
>The Tony/Pepper engagement scene.

Cons
>Michelle was a bitch who provided nothing for the movie expect spit venom (pun not intended maybe) at everyone.
>Unnecessary name changes, Ganke should have been Ganke not Ned Leeds, and Flash should had been a all-new character.
>Spidey has way too much tech and gadgets that he relies on, also the moral seems to be screwy as the Infinity Wars teasers proved.
>Throwaway Romance.

>>94020263
I enjoyed "Homecoming" but they didn't do a very good job with the pathos of Spider-Man. It felt like he doing it to prove himself to Iron Man first and foremost. As in that while he understands that the alien weapons are dangerous and the Vulture needs to be stopped, that's not his driving force until the third act.

Also, Spider-Man was grossly incompetent in the movie and the lenghts it went to portray the Vulture sympathetically only made it worse.

>>94019269
Serves 'em right for making Zendaya MJ.

>>94020263
>The people that shit on Homecoming have literally no argument other than crying about race changes and muh Iron Man.
Completely missed the point of Spider-Man, he didn't seem to be serious about his duty as a super hero at all, no version of Spider-Man /ever/ acted the way he did except in the Ultimate cartoon, they completely discrased some of the most emotional scenes in the comics, missed the point of Peter Parker's character, ect. ect.

>Hell, I'm 90% sure most of the haters didn't even see the movie since they keep bringing up stuff like "Michelle JONES" (the movie doesn't reveal her surname) or "too much Iron Man!", which is in for like 10 minutes
I sat through the damn movie retard.

>/co/ is the last fucking place where you should ask wether a movie is good or not
Unless you want to see what an actual fan of the franchise thinks of it.

>>94020329
Movies are allowed to explore different tones. Gwen's speech was a pretty efficient way to segue from the dark elements of the the battle against the Green Goblin and Peter's mourning to the triumphant return of Spider-Man.

>>94019269
>Has Marvel Lost Its Touch—
Marvel never had a touch. Just a gimmick.

>>94020380
>Great set-pieces

They were actually pretty disappointing. The best action scene was the Washington Monument.

>>94019945
With the exception of Venom.

>>94019747

>Vaas is in Homecoming as the Scorpion

Pottery

>>94019269
Spiderman fans dying out? Definitely. Spiderman was never good? What the fuck have you been snorting to have such shit taste?

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>>94019269
>put out nothing but shit comics the last 10 years
>no good cartoon in 10 years
>no good video games in 10 years
>no good movie since spider-man 2
gee i wonder why Spidey fans are dying out

>>94020400
Well, you said it, he learns he prefers to help the little guy instead of just trying too hard to be a fancy international superhero, so i don't see the problem. He has a character arc but you guys don't like that he doesn't start as a saint already

>>94020448
>Completely missed the point of bla bla bla
See above, i don't get the bitching about this. I agree that for example the May reveal could've been more serious, but the rubble scene was great for example

>Unless you want to see what an actual fan of the franchise thinks of it
Define what you mean by "actual". I grew up with Spider-Man, from cartoons to movies to comics. Most of my comics library is Spider-Man. What credentials make my opinion on Homecoming less valid than yours?

>>94020600
Homecoming was alright.

I agree with everything else you said though.

>>94020523
Raimi didnt care about Venom, and lets be honest his franchise was mostly based in the Silver Age Spidey stories, Venom apearing was never the plan to him, but of course the jews at sony care more about money than consistancy

>>94020600
We're still around. We're just... hibernating. We'll come out again when someone of merit is available.

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>Sony still won't just sell the rights back to Marvel
>Going forward with their retarded Spider-Man universe without Spider-Man

>>94020615
What I don't like is that after his supposed catharsis he didn't really mature or grow as a fighter. It didn't feel earned.

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>>94020263
I have a feeling you don't want my reasoning and immediately after this post you're just respond with "Not muh fag", but whatever, here it goes.

Spider-Man isn't some goofy kid who spergs out at everything he sees and acts like a moron constantly, throwing himself head over heels over a complete stranger. Teen Spider-Man is a kid who has no friends, and was prematurely thrusted into an adult world. He doesn't really trust or respect most of the other hero community unless they're outcasts like he is. He doesn't rely too heavily on tech because his intelligence shines through when he applies his knowledge of chemistry and physics to the enemies he's trying to defeat. He relentlessly makes fun of his enemies because of his pent up aggression towards his enemies. But most importantly, it's about a normal person who finds himself with amazing powers. Not someone who has amazing powers and has a billionaire supporting him, but someone who is dirt poor and doing the best with what he has. His entire motive is that he let his father figure die from his own actions and feels that if he doesn't become a hero something bad will happen again and we see him grow with actual character development and we see his personality radically shift with the more experience he gets, which is something unheard of in cape comics (Until some asshole decides he doesn't like it and makes Peter sign his marriage over to the fucking devil). I didn't feel like I was watching Spider-Man on the big screen. I felt like I was watching the flanderization of what some shitty Tumblr accounts impersonation. You know the ones, the kind that depicts him as the child of Tony Stark and Steve Rogers?

>>94020523
Studio decision. Should have been left out completely.

>>94020600
Blame One More Day, after that the fanbase sort of just left due to utter shittiness and Marvel still refuses to believe that it was worst idea in the history of Spider-Man.

>>94020697
if homecoming underpreforms then Sony has no hope of their Spider-manless universe to succeed
the only thing they can do is either sell the full rights back to Marvel while its still worth something or keep the franchise in hibernation for about 10 years to reboot again

>>94020754

Clone Saga was worse. OMD is easily #2 though.

>>94020263
>or "too much Iron Man!", which is in for like 10 minutes
Iron Man is present even when he's not physically on screen. Everything Peter has or does, revolves around Tony Stark. Spider-Man's suit exists because of Tony, along with all the bells and whistles. Pepper is there, Happy is there. Even Vulture exists as a result of the events of the Avengers, with a final battle won only thanks to Tony Stark.

The difference between me and you is, when I want to see a Spider-Man movie, I watch a Spider-Man movie. Not "A Celebration of Robert Downey Jr with special guest Spider-Man".

>>94020615
>but the rubble scene was great for example
Off yourself. It completely missed the point of If This Be My Destiny and wasted it on a fucking Tony Stark quote. It was /supposed/ to be an underlining for why Peter Parker is Spider-Man, which was to protect his loved ones and make the world a better place so something like the murder of his uncle doesn't happen again. Instead? "Man, Mr. Stark wont let me be his but buddy if I can't lift this!"

>>94020201
>it's Sony's fault

I love that in the first week everyone was sucking Marvel's dick and now, when it's underperforming people are starting to blame Sony.

How about, both companies fucked this movie and franchise up?

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>>94020758

>Another shitty Sony Spider-Man reboot

All we can hope for is for Sony to close down their film division before it's too late.

Why does Spidey's suit always look like CG? Even when it's probably the physical suit it still looks like CG. How does that even happen?

>>94020861
>How about, both companies fucked this movie and franchise up?
This is likely what happened. Especially with how Marvel views Peter Parker now. I blame Bendis and his Ultimate run.

>>94020774
It depends on which you hate more. If you hate stagnation, Clone Saga was worse since Parker completely stopped aging after that. If you hate regression, OMD takes it since it took him back to a status quo that hadn't existed since 1987.

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>>94020731
one thing id like to add is that no version of Spider-man would ever look up to Tony Stark of all people, Stark is the very thesis of a person Pete does not want to be, thats why he looks up most to Cap, a hero for the little man, a guy with little to no powers who just tries to do best he can, this shit movie already went south the moment they built Tony as some mentor figure

>>94020821
>Not "A Celebration of Robert Downey Jr with special guest Spider-Man
Hyperpole much? True, many things in the MCU are a result of Tony Stark, I guess in the same way the MCU franchise as a whole is a result of RDJ as Iron Man. But he's not the main character of the movie, just a mentor character.

>>94020731
I'm sorry, but yes, I'm going with not muh, I'd like to understand how you accept anything that isn't EXACTLY and ONLY the original comics, like USM or Spectacular

>>94020830
The Stark quote was just to make the audience understand what was going on in his head, he didn't lift the rubble to impress Tony, if anything he did it to impress himself, to prove himself he was already everything an hero should aspire to be instead of focusing on fancy gadgets ("I'm nobody without the suit!") and Avengers memberships. Why do you think he was screaming "come on Spiderman?"

>>94020380
>Pros
>Very different feeling from your typical MCU movie.
Horseshit. It usd the same damn formula as always.

>>94020934
>thats why he looks up most to Cap

Honestly? The film would have been better if they did. Especially considering how 616 Peter use to read Captain America comics as a kid, which had a clear effect on his morals, like how he gave them away to kids on the block when he was done with them so more people could enjoy it.

Kinda makes me upset they're using Miles for Secret Empire instead of Peter. The kid has no connections to 616 Cap apart from a flashback.

>>94020758
They may not see it that way. They may look at the MCU deal as a mistake and back out after homecoming's sequel.

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>>94020774
Clone Saga atleast gave us Ben Reilly and his short lived but good run as Spider-man
literally nothing good came out of OMD, all those psuedo GF's they gave pete to compensate for MJ where basicly marvel writers inserting their bland waifus

>>94019269
>Keep the character in stasis and get sales off of making the core fan base angry for a decade, leading to less positive cultural circulation from fans and no new stories to tell.
>Reboot twice in five years.
>Force stories to stay at the part everyone knows.
>"Why doesn't it sell, do people just not like Spider-Man?"

>>94019269
>So can we now admit that Spider-man fans are dying out and Spider-man was never good?
No, we can admit the movie was not very faithfull to the source material and that after 6 movies in 15 years people are bored

>>94020992
>USM
Wasn't an adaptation, it was an alternate reality. But I didn't like it regardless because of all the damn plot conveniences Bendis wrote in. Completely overrated.

>Spectacular.
They had a clear respect for the franchise they were working with and told a good Spider-Man story. Peter Parker acted like Peter Parker.

>>94020972
It's hyperbole meant to illustrate the fact that RDJ basically casts a shadow of himself over the entire franchise.

>>94020758
In Sony's eyes this cannot underperform, as it's making TASM money but without having spent a 250million dollars budget on it

>>94020697
>>94020758

Why would Sony sell the rights back? Homecoming proves Marvel can't make a Spider-man movie any better than Sony can

>>94021101
An adaptation is just another alternate reality

>>94020992
Dude IM4's Spiderman is literally the pole opposite of Spiderman, this is not about Muh, is about making Batman a drag queen pacifist who is stupid and dirty poor.

>>94020884
this video seems almost prophetic now
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lg6v1dgTcxw

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>>94020992
Bullshit. The entire movie he was sucking up to Tony Stark, which built to him trying to prove himself for Iron Man. Peter honestly doesn't give two fucks about his own strength, If This Be My Destiny showed that his strength didn't come from himself, but from those he cared about.

Well let's think about this for a second.

1. Spider-Man was already rebooted rather shortly after the first film series ended.

2. The last three Spider-Man movies weren't very good.

With both of these combined, it's not shocking that future Spidey films would run into some tough hurdles.

>>94020380
>Pros
>>Very different feeling from your typical MCU movie.
Not really. Felt alot like Antman.

>>Holland manage to get a perfect balance of Peter and Spidey, something that the last two failed at.
Too bad his character isn't written that well. For 90% of the film his main motivation is to join the cool team.

>>Keaton Vulture was great, one of the best MCU villains in a long time. That car scene was well directed and acted.
Well I did say he carried the film.

>>Great set-pieces and chill humor, very homely compared to the bombastic previous entries.
The humor was forced and no, the set pieces were bad. Easily the worst part of the film. Everything felt fake and weightless.

>>A after-credits scene which hypes up Vaas Scorpion.
Not relevant to the rest of the film.

>>The Tony/Pepper engagement scene.
The only engagement scene I care to see in a SPIDER-MAN movie is one involving Peter and MJ, but given their insistence on Spider-shota, that's a long ways off, or never happening.

>>94021047
Homecoming is still turning in a way bigger profit on a much smaller budget than the Amazing movies + it's been critically well-received, unlike Sony's own attempts.

>>94020600
Web of Shadows was good.

>>94021168
Is he a hero? Yes
Does he think that's the responsible thing to do due to his powers? Yes
Is he smart? Yes
Does he have social problems, sometimes due to his dual life? Yes

There, Spider-man

Oh, but let me guess, just like >>94021188 you'll argue his characterization was "actually" all about sucking Tony's cock, right?

>>94021225
>The humor was forced
So you don't think humor belongs in a Spider-Man movie?

>>94021277
You literally described every hero ever because you went for the most broad strokes on a superhero's story. Congrats.

>>94020992
>"Tell me how it wasn't like Spider-Man!"
>Anon tells you
>"Lol, stupid not muh fag"

But he literally answered your question....

>>94020992
>Post explains in detail what the core of the character's appeal is and isn't dismissive of alternative takes so long as they understand the basis of the character's charm.
>LOL NUH MUH SPOODERMAN
Shut the fuck up. You don't give a shit what anyone has to say.

>>94021295
>So you don't think humor belongs in a Spider-Man movie?

Not forced humor.

>>94021277
>Is he smart? Yes
Debatable.

>>94021277
Shit, I didn't know Bruce Wayne was Spider-Man.

>>94021340
Hey, he has to earn his money from Disney

>>94021277
>There, Spider-man
Notice how you didn't go into details about his personal beliefs, motives, and personality?

>you'll argue his characterization was "actually" all about sucking Tony's cock, right?

When the entire movie is about impressing the guy? Yes.

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people are getting fatigue of high school Spidey
this could all have been avoided if they did something fresh instead
>have early 20's Peter whos about to enter ESU (great window to have him interact with future heroes)
>have him be Spider-man for so long that he already has a existing rouges galary (Shocker, Rhino, Electro, Vulture, Kraven)
>have Peter deal with new money problems, having to move out of Aunt Mays house, and a building up a newfound relationship with the people who hated him in High School
>have Peter dumpster diving to get components for things like the webshooters or Spidertracers
>have the movie focus on a whole lot of Super villians but they all work under the wing of a bigger crime boss that has plans that run deeper than Spidey understands
>Only street level heroes can cameo or have passing refferences, Spider-man has no fucking business sucking off Iron man and the Avengers

My thesis is still that Spider-Man struggles to work as a film franchise and is much better geared toward a TV show that can properly give space to both his Peter Parker life and his superhero career.

>>94021402
Bruce? that was Barry Allen, right?

>>94021295
Not him, but only Spider-Man, Jonah Jameson, and sassy Aunt May who is open about her knowledge of Peter's identity are the funny people in the entire mythos....Well them and Frog-Man, but that's a long shot.

>>94021429
to see him always having problems and struggling with life works better in TV, yes

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>>94021367
Is it really?

>>94021447
>Only Spider-Man
Well, he is the titular character.

>>94021188
He was a street level hero who got to experience something outside of a guy stealing a ladies purse on the street in CW. He wanted to take on a bigger challenge in which he thought Tony was the gate way and he even said he felt like he could do more when speaking to happy. To the point where he was willing to drop everything to be Spider-Man full time but then realizes those mistakes when he rejected Stark's offer to become an Avenger.

>>94020523
Every fan has a character they dislike in their passion. I fucking hate the o5 and don't care for X-factor, but I'm still a massive X-fag.

Raimi was a real fan and every frame from the first 2 films and some of the 3rd oozed passion.

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>>94021429
>Spider-Man struggles to work as a film franchise
bullshit
Spidey can work as a movie, but have you noticed how the only good spidey movies are the ones with no studio interferance

>>94021244
good combat system trapped in a shitty game

>>94021513
But Spider-Man /is/ a street level hero who is content with doing what he can. Sure he'll try to take on larger threats, but not through anyone else, he just fucking does it since he doesn't need approval.

>To the point where he was willing to drop everything to be Spider-Man full time but then realizes those mistakes when he rejected Stark's offer to become an Avenger.
Only for him not to learn anything from the entire fucking thing and take the suit back. Not only that, but he's going to have the suit Stark showed off in Infinity War. He learned absolutely nothing from his experiences.

>>94020934
More specifically, he wouldn't look up to him atleast post the origin. Peter could have easily become someone like Stark if he didn't learn about power and responsibility.

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>>94021651
The cape does things, man.

>>94020600
There's been good SM comics, they just aren't ASM.

FlashVenom, Scarlet Spider, Superior Foes, Superior Team Up, etc.

>>94019269
Spiderman movies were never good. Raimi is a terrible hack, Kirsten Dunst is ugly as fuck. They should've done James Cameron's Spiderman back in the day. That would've been a good movie.

Black MJ and Pajeet Thompson don't exactly help either.

>>94021416
This is why I think they should have done Spider-Man Blue instead. A flashback story where you don't see Gwen die, but it's evident she did at one point and you are caught up to speed on the fact that Spider-Man has a long list of rogues.

>>94021646
Anon this isn't the same deal as the comics. He's a high-schooler who has been thrown into a world of something greater only to go back to every day high-school life and boring Queens. And Stark gives him the suit he doesn't take it back. IW is taking place in space so of course he's going to use the new suit rather than his jumpers.

I just hate the suit and cant stand having another AI in the mcu and if they wanted to do their own characters as his friends why not just give them separate names. It's not like average guy is gonna care.

For some reason, foreigners seem to love Homecoming more than the U.S.

>Marvel hates Peter for some weird reason even though he has carried the company before
>They make a movie about "Peter" but it's extremely unfaithful so the fans don't like it and it's just not that amazing on its own so normies don't like it either
>It underperforms because of these things
>Marvel has an excuse to say "Welp, looks like people are just tired of Peter!" and bury him some more

>>94021833
>Anon this isn't the same deal as the comics. He's a high-schooler who has been thrown into a world of something greater only to go back to every day high-school life and boring Queens.
How the fuck is that not like the comics? He met /aliens/. Why would him fighting a bunch of strangers in a parking lot be any different?

>And Stark gives him the suit he doesn't take it back.
And Peter accepts.

>IW is taking place in space so of course he's going to use the new suit rather than his jumpers.
Secret Wars took place in space and he was fine with his normal clothes then.

>>94019269
Maybe Marvel Studios/Sony shouldn't have made Mary Jane Watson black?

>>94021896
Is it weird that I believe this? I mean, it's completely ludicrous and asinine, but with all the Miles pushing they've been doing...

If they made MJ a cute asian nobody would care

>>94021901
well he was teleported before he had any chance to change attire

>>94019269
>So can we now admit that Spider-man fans are dying out
Yes
>and Spider-man was never good?
No faggot

>>94021901
This isn't the comics, it's the MCU. Did stark recruit Peter into his team within the first year of being Spider-Man? Or how about going to space within the same time frame? Peter was already well experienced when any of those examples you are point out happened. In the MCU he's a highschooler being thrown all this crazy stuff when just yesterday he was stopping a mugging or car jacking.

>>94021854
>For some reason, foreigners seem to love Homecoming more than the U.S.
>make most the cast brown
>foreigners love it
Woooooooow. What a shock!

>>94020448
>Completely missed the point of Spider-Man
You either didn't watch the movie or completely missed the point of it. The arc Peter goes through by the end of the movie teaches him how to be a better hero.

>>94020992
>The Stark quote was just to make the audience understand what was going on in his head, he didn't lift the rubble to impress Tony, if anything he did it to impress himself, to prove himself he was already everything an hero should aspire to be instead of focusing on fancy gadgets ("I'm nobody without the suit!") and Avengers memberships. Why do you think he was screaming "come on Spiderman?"

Oh, fuck you.

>>94021941
No, anon. It's obvious they want Miles as the main Spider-Man. After Peter is done they will kill him off and replace him with Miles. Sony will approve because they love Miles (which is why he's getting an animated movie).

>>94022123
It had the most successful opening weekend out of any Spider-Man film in South Korea, yet the movie had no Koreans in it. And let me tell you, Koreans don't give a shit about anyone who isn't also Korean.

>>94022085
>This isn't the comics, it's the MCU.
Who apparently learned nothing from the first movie.
>Did stark recruit Peter into his team within the first year of being Spider-Man?
His senior year he did, but Peter's an asshole to the Avengers. He'd probably act worse if it was his first year.
>Or how about going to space within the same time frame?
I'm pretty sure when you're abducted by aliens your first year and brush it off and a weird thing that happened that day you don't give a shit.
>Peter was already well experienced when any of those examples you are point out happened.
You are incorrect.
>In the MCU he's a highschooler being thrown all this crazy stuff when just yesterday he was stopping a mugging or car jacking.
He fought fucking /aliens/ in one of his first adventures. The only thing Peter went through in the MCU was a shitty fight in a hangar with people that he knew about.

>>94022164
Bull fucking shit it did. He learned nothing from his experience. And by that point he should have already known considering the last time he father figured /died/ because of him.

>>94022299
Did we watch the same movie? His over-reliance on his tech gimped him, he had to learn how to actually be Spider-Man without Stark or The Avenger's approval. It was the entire premise of the movie, anon.

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>dont want to talk about Uncle Ben or the influence he had on peter
>literally trying to remove the drama out of fucking SPIDER-MAN
this is a greater sin than anything in the ASM movies
fuck you Sony and Marvel

>>94022356
And then what happened at the end of the movie?

>>94020042
>>94019883
>spider-man has to stop a bad guy from stealing shit
>sacrifices larger social life to do it
seems like spider-man to me

>>94022371
This. I've always viewed Spider-Man as a soap opera with capes. A soap opera without drama is just boring.

>>94022389
I don't want to explain it again, so here. >>94020731
Try reading the thread next time.

>>94022385
He did exactly what Spider-Man's supposed to do, realized nobody was helping him and took responsibility for Vulture. He even went as far as trying to save him.
Then after he declined Tony's offer to join The Avengers and the Iron Spider suit.
I feel like you didn't watch the movie and you want me to explain what happens, anon. It wasn't a hard film to follow.

>>94021072
It's fucking depressing that we're at a point where we can say "at least Clone Saga wasn't a complete bomb".

>>94022449
You're either stupid or purposefully glossing over the fact that he takes the high tech suit back.

>>94019269
>So can we now admit that Spider-man fans are dying out and Spider-man was never good?- 142 posts and 15 image replies shown.
But you guys told me how Spiderman was more popular than Batman and Superman combined with those retarded sales charts from what, 2013? WTF?

>>94022441
The entire point of the film was for Peter to move away from the characterization you're upset about. He literally matured and learned to be a better street-level hero through the movie. Did you walk out half way through? Did you have some sort of episode during the last 30 minutes of the film?

>>94021609
good combat, other marvel heroes, 2nd best swinging
it's the best overall spider-man game for me

>>94021072
Jenny was cute.

>>94022485
But he didn't. If you're referring to Infinity War then it's because it's his Avengers suit and he's working with The Avengers.

>>94022505
No he fucking doesn't. Did you even read my post? It goes far beyond his characterization, this just isn't a Spider-Man story.

>>94022534
Yes he does, did you even see the movie? Tony gives him the suit back and Peter accepts, completely defeating the point of the lesson learned.

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>>94021854
From my experience, westerners prefer the pathos behind Spider-man, as well as his everyman nature.

Foreigners care more about Spider-man's powers, some of his villains, and just the overall fun factor.

>>94019403
The MCU follows 1:1 ytd ratio with reality. By the time Infinity War rolls around he will be in college.

>>94022515
the fetch quest, shitty graphics and terrible level design ruined it for me
that and the game reusing the same boss battles twice

>>94022580
No, Tony gives that suit back because he realizes Peter is not longer relying on the suit. It was taken away in the first place because Peter needed to learn a lesson, and when he did it was given back.

>>94022580
What are you talking about? There's no reason to decline the suit. In fact, you'd have to be a retard to do so. When you're working to save lives, you don't decline a free gift that'll help you do it just for "muh independence". If Tony's willing to give him back the suit, no questions asked, then why should Peter decline to use it? As long as he doesn't try to bite off more than he can chew, it can only be an asset. That's the entire point of the Training Wheels protocol.

>>94020774
Clone Saga didnt half Spidey's readership
Spidey used to be a regullar 100k seller before OMD

>>94020190
Wrong movie chum, that was played at the end of Spider-Man 2. Trust me, I watched it on UMD plenty of times on my PSP to know.

>>94022649
>>94022670
The entire lesson was that Peter was too reliant on someone else's help. He had to become a hero on his own merits. Him accepting the suit is him going back on that, since it offers things that are not of his own merits.

>>94022246
But it never happened in his first year right? Or hell first couple of months even. Bottom line, nothing like that happened to Peter in the MCU than it did in the comics which is why things are going to be different on how he acts. He mainly helped with petty crimes and accidents and now all of a sudden he was going to help apprehend Captain America. All this at the age of highschooler.

>Shitty fight

It was a battle royal with some of the most well known heroes (the Avengers) in that universe, the hell do you mean shitty fight?

>>94022725
No. The entire lesson was Tony's to Peter, and him giving back the suit was symbolic of Peter learning said lesson.
>"If you're nothing without that suit you shouldn't have it."
>Peter proceeds to prove he's Spider-Man even without the suit
>Gets the suit back to be used as a tool instead of a crutch
I really don't feel like Homecoming needed a "Ending Explained!" but apparently it was too complex for even /co/

I will take the entirety of the clone saga over OMD and everything that happened afterwards.

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>>94020286
>most leggy
You got that straight, jack. Homina homina. Chk-chk, AWOOOOOO!

>>94022725
Anon, there's a difference between standing on your own merits and refusing to accept help out of mere "principle". One is admirable, the other is stupid. If Peter's being an idiot for not refusing the suit, the Tony's also an idiot for using his dad's element as a replacement for Palladium in Iron Man 2, all the Avengers are idiots for teaming up at all. Doctors are idiots for using advancements others came up with for their medical practices, police officers are idiots for being part of a force, all humans are idiots for being members of a society.

Peter understands that the suit isn't what makes Spider-Man, it's Peter Parker than makes Spider-Man Spider-Man. As long as he understands that and doesn't lose sight of that lesson, there is absolutely no reason to refuse the helping hand of someone who is clearly capable of giving it. To refuse would be foolhardy.

It's all about balance. You can't be too reliant on someone else, but refusing to rely on them outright out of some misplaced arrogance is no better.

>>94022804
Peter talks about being his own man at the end of the film. By taking back the Stark suit he isn't building himself up, retard.

Also, he takes the upgraded suit that he refuses anyway in IW. He learned nothing.

>>94022725
>Stopped the Vulture without the suit and on his own merits
>Thinking taking back the suit is going to diminish that

Full damage control mode initiated.

>>94022602
>shitty graphics
So you don't like any Spider-Man game?

>>94022866
You can build yourself up while receiving help from others. If accepting Tony's goodwill is a sin, then he should move out of May's apartment immediately.

>>94022799
>But it never happened in his first year right? Or hell first couple of months even.
Yes it did you dense mother fucker. Did you even read the comics?
>nothing like that happened to Peter in the MCU than it did in the comics
You're right, 616 Peter went through much much worse.
> which is why things are going to be different on how he acts
No, it wouldn't change anything. Hell, he wouldn't even be in that situation to begin with if he acted a quarter of the way he was supposed to.
>He mainly helped with petty crimes and accidents and now all of a sudden he was going to help apprehend Captain America. All this at the age of highschooler.
Highschool Peter was abducted by aliens, beat up the Fantastic Four, met the X-Men, kicked the crap out of the Avengers, kicked the crap out of Hulk, met a giant lizard monster, attempted to be recruited by a known terrorist, /and/ was tricked into believing it was all an insane hallucination.

>>94022866
No, you're just mad he took back Tony's suits. He did learn the lesson and he was rewarded for doing so. Just because he was given a gift doesn't mean the lesson is forgotten.

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>>94022825
amber heard will dethrone her in Aquaman, but even loise lane had meater thighs than Gal "Walking Holocaust" Gadot

>>94022804
>Peter proceeds to prove he's Spider-Man even without the suit
>Gets the suit back to be used as a tool instead of a crutch

So he learned nothing and went back to the thing that caused the problem to begin with?

>>94020263
>or Dunst's MJ
- Fake redhead
- Not pretty enough
- "Sexy kiss" pushed by corporate as such

>>94023020
He learned the suit wasn't what was making him Spider-Man. When he learned the lesson he was given the suit back so he could use it as a tool instead of a crutch.

>>94023026
Honestly, the thing that bothered me the most about Dunst's MJ was none of that. It was her personality. I absolutely despised the character itself. These days, it's hard for me to rewatch any of Raimi's films because I really just hate Raimi's Mary Jane.

>>94022834
>If Peter's being an idiot for not refusing the suit
He is.
>the Tony's also an idiot for using his dad's element as a replacement for Palladium in Iron Man 2
Two completely different situations.
>all the Avengers are idiots for teaming up at all.
The Avengers aren't Spider-Man.
>Peter understands that the suit isn't what makes Spider-Man, it's Peter Parker than makes Spider-Man Spider-Man. As long as he understands that and doesn't lose sight of that lesson, there is absolutely no reason to refuse the helping hand of someone who is clearly capable of giving it. To refuse would be foolhardy.
No you moron. The point was that he was too reliant on tech instead of using his own talents and powers. He goes back to the tech, thus defeating the purpose of the suit to begin with.

>>94023101
>No you moron. The point was that he was too reliant on tech instead of using his own talents and powers. He goes back to the tech, thus defeating the purpose of the suit to begin with
That's an oversimplification.

>>94022933
Yes 616, not MCU Peter. That's your problem with this. The original fact was how he was sucking up to Tony Stark, when in fact he was giving updates to him so that he can move outside of being stuck in Queens. He didn't do any of that stuff you listed so of course things are going to be different for him. The apprehending of Captain America was the biggest experience in his life upon having the spider powers and Peter wanted to use his powers towards something greater than street level stuff which is why he was always asking for his next mission. After the events of homecoming is when he learned that he wants to stay grounded.

>>94023101
So what you're saying is that now that Peter's learned his lesson about self-worth, he should, on principle, never accept any help from Tony ever, is that it?

So when he's fighting an alien tyrant with a glove that effectively makes him a living god in the next film, he should just stick to his sweater and tube socks, is that it? Ignore Stark, ignore the Avengers, have nothing to do with him, and just charge in with nothing but a ski mask and a painted on spider. Even if the option to use better equipment exists, even if people are offering to help him deal with this colossal threat, Peter should just go "Pssh, I'm my own man now. I don't need your charity!"

Is that it?

>>94022962
>Tony: Did you learn your lesson, Pete?
>Peter: Yes mister Stark, sir!
>Tony" Good, now here's your suit.
>Peter:"Woof" "Woof" "panting"
>Tony: Good boy

>>94023258
No, my original complaint was that this is not a Spider-Man movie and is a disgrace to the character. The Stark sucking is part of that.

>>94023260
>So when he's fighting an alien tyrant with a glove that effectively makes him a living god in the next film, he should just stick to his sweater and tube socks, is that it? Ignore Stark, ignore the Avengers, have nothing to do with him, and just charge in with nothing but a ski mask and a painted on spider. Even if the option to use better equipment exists, even if people are offering to help him deal with this colossal threat, Peter should just go "Pssh, I'm my own man now. I don't need your charity!"

Peter shouldn't have that offer to begin with, he shouldn't be that close to Stark.

>>94023101
>He is.
Why? Not accepting the suit would be moronic He still created the web fluid himself. .

Your main gripe with MCU Peter seems to be that he idolizes Iron Man/The Avengers, but that makes a lot of damn sense in universe if you take your MUH glasses off.

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>>94022927
the last Spider-man games had the excuse of being on PS2 (and even then, Ultimate Spider-man aged pretty well with time) Web Of Shadows looked shit the day it release, it came out the same year as GTA IV , a year later Arkham Asylum comes out and looks way better

>>94022600
But that's wrong
> 8 years later

>>94023483
>Your main gripe with MCU Peter seems to be that he idolizes Iron Man/The Avengers, but that makes a lot of damn sense in universe if you take your MUH glasses off.

How, explain to me how it makes sense that this Spider-Man would idolize them while the other wouldn't.

>>94023328
So when these heroes all inevitably get together to fight this intergalactic threat, none of them should go "Hey, there's a kid in pajamas here. Maybe we should, I dunno, give him something a little better than a ski mask to work with?"

>>94023636
None of them should even know he's a kid. He should be actively trying to convince them he's an adult.

>>94023684
Not with that voice and physique.

>>94023564
Because he's grown up jerking off to them like everyone else his age in the MCU.

>>94023733
Because teenage Peter is well known for following trends and being interested in things his peers are interested in.

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>>94023328
Sure. Peter isn't one to accept money and tech handouts from Stark at all.

>>94023554
The events of the Avengers happened in 2009 in universe.

>>94023767
A bunch of superhero people stopping an alien invasion isn't a trend.

>>94023776
>Using post OMD Peter to prove a point

The character is dead as far as I'm concerned in that pic.

>>94019269
>So can we now admit that Spider-man fans are dying out and Spider-man was never good?
No, that's fucking stupid, though I can see someone reaching that conclusion on the same way "nobody remembers the X-Men".
Maybe it means MAYBE they should stop trying to reinvent the wheel and just give fans the characters they know and love.
And no, Marvel and/or Sony, I am NOT talking about any iteration of "Ultimate" Spider-Man.

>>94023776
And how did this end for him?

>>94023849
>Not muh

>>94023862
Badly, that's not the point.

>>94023797
Wanking off to them is.

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>>94023896
Get out normie. Wanking off to superheroes is an essential part of every-day life.

>>94023966
We're talking about a fictional character dumbass.

>>94020175
>Doc Ock is good guy gone insane who even sacrifices himself to save the city, not a downright criminal
>Norman Osborn still has a good side in him
>the population likes spiderman unlike what was canon from Ditko to Mackie

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>>94023276

>>94024222
You see, you right now are not muh fagging. That stuff doesn't matter, so long as it's still a Spider-Man story and has the essentials about the character.

>>94019945
>muh heart
It's a fucking superhero movie, it's a blockbuster designed to make money.

>>94020934

>this shit movie already went south the moment they built Tony as some mentor figure

It's about the suit, anon. The iron spider suit. There's no mentoring, just a suit with upgrades he doesn't even need.

>>94023548
>spider-man game has smaller budget than gta
Shocker.
Ultimate looks like shit.
Arkham Asylum isn't even open world so why bring it up?
Despite any of that, graphicsfags are the worst.

>>94019945

Jesus, stop this meme. Raimi's movies are a cringe party about an autistic man not knowing how to interact with people while dressing up in red and blue to be discount superman is weirdly filmed scenes.

>>94020748
>>94020652

>the studio's fault

It was Raimi's job to work under the conditions of the studio. The director just directs, and he failed.

Shifting the blame also doesn't make the movie good. It's another bad Raimi spider-man movie.

>>94024317
And it's nothing like Spider-Man.
>>94024459
And it was a good movie. Not only that, but it was a good Spider-Man movie.

Why are you guys getting mad about Spider-Man Homecoming?
It's a KIDS movie. Of course you don't like it, this movie is made for children under the age of 8. This is kiddie shit, and you all know it, so there's no point getting mad about it. You'd find more developed characters in fucking Dora the Explorer than this movie.

>>94023875
Ironic you say that because that shit is literally a result of
>not muh

>>94024516
The conditions of Sony were asinine.

I think the fact that this movie has literally nothing to do with Spider-Man mythos aside from the main character wearing a Spider-Man costume is why people aren't going to see it. It'd be like making a Superman movie, but never referencing that he's an alien from the planet Krypton and Lois is a fat Huffpo 'journalist', Jimmy is a Muslim and the Kents are played by Brad and Angelina. This movie was fucking stupid.

>>94024542
If we list the top five most popular Spider-Man stories you get.
>A suicide victim's last moments.
>The murder of a cop.
>A kid dying of cancer.
>A hero accidentally killing his girlfriend.
>Long term effect of that person mourning his girlfriend.

Maybe they should have focused on making a good movie instead of making it a strict target demographic.

>>94024542
>It's a KIDS movie. Of course you don't like it, this movie is made for children under the age of 8. This is kiddie shit
and even kids don't like it. This movie was solely made for getting mom and dad to buy the tickets too. They're losing out on the family market to a dour monkey movie with a guy pouting for 2 hours!

>>94024459
a classic 4chan user

>>94021854
Foreigners also love Transformers and F&F garbage.

>>94024636
This is the real problem. Marvel's taking too many liberties with it's IPs, both film and comic divisions. Too many big changes at once and the film doesn't have that focus anymore.

>>94024459
The people saying Homecoming Peter Parker is an autist sperg and too awkward, while praising the Raimi movies, has to be one some wild shit. Raimi Peter was so awkward he came off as a legit mentally and socially impaired person.

>>94024645
The thought process that Sony and Marvel has is that they can shit in a bag, call it Spider-Man and it'll make a million dollars.
>>94024662
Kids don't like being babied, and I'm not surprised seeing the "hero" be babied all time is turning them off the movie.

>>94024827
You don't know what a shit movie is.

>>94024746
Which is why their comics are failing hard and it's not getting any better. They took a shit on everything that made them popular in the first place - so why the fuck would anyone continue to buy their products? They're so lucky they got bought by Disney because they would have gone out of business a long time ago.

>>94021551

>no studio interferance

There's always studio interference. You just liked it on those movies. Heck, Avi fucking Arad produced all Spidey movies.

>>94024902
Of course we do. We're in a thread about one now.

>>94024558

So? He could've filmed a good movie.

>>94024902
Newsflash, there are maybe 5 comic book movies that are legitimately good movies. The rest are mediocre-to-trash.

>>94024902
I'm sure it's fine for the preschool crowd.

>>94024976
imagine you are making pasta, and somebody keeps throwing in shit you dont need like maiz or pees. and eventualy said they wanted a pizza instead, and you only have 15 minutes left in making it
that was Raimi working on Spider-man 3

>>94025174
To be fair, the relationshit whinefest dragged it down a lot (among a ton of other stuff), and wasn't that all Raimi?

>>94025303
Who can say? All I know for sure is that Peter was really fucking weird and Mary Jane was a selfish bitch. She was really gonna marry that guy. She didn't even love him, not really. She was still pining for someone else the whole time. But she was still gonna marry him. And then she leaves him standing at the altar without so much as an explanation.

>>94020992
>Anon explains exactly why the film does not work as a Spider-Man film at its core
>NOPE YOU'RE A "NOT MUH"

This is the most annoying aspect of "Homecoming" to me. The people who rabidly defend it refuse any and all criticism. They did the exact same thing for ASM1 and 2 when they came out too.

>>94019269
I'm a huge Spider-Man fan, have been for a lot a long time. My first experience was a Romita Sr. collection, and my first story was ASM #39 and 40. I have no interest in seeing Homeconing, just like I didn't watch ASM2.

It seems petty, but I just want a Spider-Man movie that feels like Spider-Man. Raimi's movies made a few changes, but it definitely had the feeling, tone, and spirit of a Spider-Man movie, which is why I love the first 2 so much. These movies just have a feeling of hollowness to them, like they don't even want to be about Spider-Man despite acting like they do. There is so much about Peter they can do, but they keep going back to things that completely miss the point.

>>94020600
>no good cartoon in 10 years
Hey man you are forgetting about Specta-oh...that was 9 years ago...fuck.

>>94024516
I do agree that a director does have to be able to work under whatever conditions he's given. However, if you look at 3 compared to the other 2, you can definitely tell something feels limited and plotted awfully, and you can't blame Raimi for that considering Sony aped the entire script. Raimi said himself that he was given a lot of freedom in the first two, and had almost none in 3, and it shows. The whole reason he quit 4 was because he hated the studio's decisions and they wouldn't stop forcing themselves on the movie.

>>94019269
as long as Sony is involved in any way Spidey can't move forward.

>>94027421
Freedom to turn Peter into an autistic manchild and Mary Jane into a bitch whore. JJ was his only positive achievement.

>>94020042
found the person who has never read a Spidey comic

>>94020600
One More Day came out 10 years ago, coincidence???

>>94027700
Is it you?

I think people are tired of Spider-man being rebooted every few movies. That or people are getting tired of superhero movies but the fact that WW came out just before it and did well makes me think that's not it.

>>94019841
>one is doing the same thing and expecting the same results or doing one thing different and expecting different results

>the other is doing the same thing and expecting different results

>Or hell, throwing a dice.

Unless you're Data, you're doing something different

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zbkizy-Y3qw

>>94019269
maybe Spider man is just not as popular as he used to be..

>>94027829
Spider.man is going to make the same, if not more than Wonder Woman. Which still isn't particularly amazing for MCU considering they have made billions with less popular characters, but it's no indication audiences are tired of cape movies either. .

> people are tired of Spider-man being rebooted every few movies
This-

>>94028055
Again, this board kept telling me how very popular he was with charts dating from 2014. Wtf?!

>>94020400
The pathos was the only thing they got right! All of the character dynamics were there, they just messed around with the names for some reason.

>>94028055
I'm not surprised. He'd been neutered and flanderized, to a manchild/spastic teen. Honestly, Spider-Man as they knew him is dead. They should move on to better characters, that aren't being fucked up.

>>94028795
How can a 15 year old be a manchild? And how is he spastic in any way?

>>94028903
I meant manchild/spastic teen as he's either portayed as a man child(comics) or a spastic teen (everything else).
As for how is he spastic in any way, well you saw Civil War and Homecoming. Kid's practically cumming all over himself anytime he's talking to the Avengers. He doesn't shut up and his personality stops at annoying teen.

It's not hard to understand why they took Peter in the direction they took him in. They wanted him to be distinct from the other characters they've introduced so far. They didn't want him to overlap too much with Stark, Quill or Scott. And since all the other characters are adults in their late-twenties to early-50s, I guess they took the opportunity to bring some youth into the project.

Spider-Man's also in a very precarious position. While Marvel is basically in charge of him an his movies, it's obvious that Sony have their own plans that they want to enact. There's no doubt that there's some spite and bitterness behind the scenes.

>>94029068
Part of the problem with Spiderman is Marvel/Disney turned all of their OTHER characters into Spiderman already.

Wise-ass, constantly quipping, rapid fire dialogue? They've done this with all the Marvel Heroes, barring Cap.

So one of the things that makes Peter unique is already old hat. Another problem is they keep retreading origin stories, and they're launching this film a scant few years after ASM. They've flooded the market with too much bad Spiderman. Frankly, the only thing they can do is sit on it for years now to let the stink fade.

>>94029068
>bring some youth onto the project
Oh come on anon, that's bullshit and you can't seriously believe that. I've never talked to anyone who said Quill, Stark, or Scott seemed old. He could have been youthful without it seeming forced, but he was written to be the most annoying squeaker kid that was endearing to no one. Even kids don't like him.
>Spider-Man's also in a very precarious position. While Marvel is basically in charge of him an his movies, it's obvious that Sony have their own plans that they want to enact. There's no doubt that there's some spite and bitterness behind the scenes.
That's probably the real reason, Marvel is shitting all over him because Sony owns him.

>>94029212
>the most annoying squeaker kid that was endearing to no one. Even kids don't like him
The majority of positive reviews from audiences is focused on Holland being likable as Peter. Clearly a bunch of people liked him.

>>94019839
But Age of Apocalypse was successful.

>>94029377
They like the movie, the way they like Boss Baby. For being a silly, turn your brain off kind of movie. Holland is an annoying kid and he's only there to deliver quips.

>>94021551
those were the bad ones, 3 was better and Amazing 1 and 2 were huge step ups.

this thread is retarded

>Sony makes two better movies and sets up an arc made for multiple movies to lead up to a Sinister Six movie
>Homecoming comes along to strip all that away
>now it underperforms

Gee it's almost as if Marc Webb's movies had a substantial amount of fans that wanted a third Amazing movie.

>>94029801
But those were sub-par, last one outright shit, and had a much smaller fanbase than Raimi Spider-Man or any semi-popular MCU property.

>>94029886
>Hated
But how did they PERFORM?

Did they restart again because it bombed, or because it didn't make ENOUGH money to suit them?

There's a big difference between a mediocre performance and a terrible one, unless you're an investor in which case you only see all the moneys you didn't make, not the ones you did

>>94029801
It already made more domestic than TASM2, don't kid yourself

>>94019747
But Homecoming is not an origin movie

The message Disney will take from this is Spider-Man is done, purge him from the movies and comics.

>>94029964
They made less money than the Raimi movies but since people at Sony are retarded they spent Avengers-tier budgets to get them made, $230millions for 1 and 250 for 2, so yeah, financially it wasn't benefiting them

>>94029964
The issue is Sony's insane expectations for the Spider-Man franchise.

Spider-Man (2002)
>Budget: $139m
>Box office: $821.7m (approx. 590%)

Spider-Man 2 (2004)
>Budget: $200m
>Box office: $783.8m (approx. 392%)

Spider-Man 3 (2007)
>Budget: $258m
>Box office: $890.9m (approx. 345%)

The Amazing Spider-Man (2012)
>Budget: $230m
>Box office: $757.9m (approx. 330%)

The Amazing Spider-Man 2 (2014)
>Budget: $293m
>Box office: $709m (approx. 241%)

Spider-Man: Homecoming (2017)
>Budget: $175m

Incidentally, Avengers had a budget of $220 million and Age of Ultron had a budget of $250 million. Sony threw more money at Amazing 2 than Marvel did at Ultron in the hopes that it would make literally billions. The reason Amazing 2 was disappointing for Sony wasn't because it did poorly in the box office; far from it. The reason it was disappointing is because Sony threw nearly $3 million and got less than 2.5x that back. There's also the lukewarm critical response it received.

>>94030052
>>94030078
Jesus. How come Lizard still looked like shit? These movies didn't even have RDJ to pay.

>>94029886
>last one outright shit
Amazing 2 was the best SM movie though.

>>94030141
I want what you're smoking.

>>94030163
I smoke nothing, I'm just from /m/ and I don't bow to critics like sheeple.

>>94030135
The money were spent on rewriting scripts and reshoots basically. I dunno much about 1, but 2 started filming without a complete script and that's why you have stuff like MJ completely disappearing from the production. Those movies were a mess, enough to prompt Garfield to try cut ties with Sony like he did

>>94030219
>enough to prompt Garfield to try cut ties with Sony like he did
I thought the poor guy was fired, h was easily best Spider Man

>with the first of the two widely-reviled Amazing movies.

Oh shut the fuck up Screenrant.

>>94030234
Nope, Sony had a party after TASM2 where, among other things, they wanted to talk about the future of the franchise to the investors and Garfield straight up didn't show up

>>94029777
>retarded movie gets retarded thread
Who'da thunk it?

>>94030078
So basically what i'm getting here is Sony isn't happy unless a film makes AT LEAST 350% of it's budget back

>>94030354
Pascal did say she wanted 2 bil on the ASM vs SM movie.

>>94030354
When you throw nearly 300 million smackers into a project, making less than 2.5x its budget is gonna be considered disappointing, especially when Marvel only spends 2/3rds that and managed to reap over a billion. The problem with Sony Pictures is that their expectations for the Spider-Man franchise are completely bonkers.

The corporate heads at Sony Japan caught wind of how retarded Sony was being and forced them to sign the deal with Marvel, which they were originally planning on rejecting.

>>94028255
What? No it isn't. It's not even close. It's projected to do at or around Amazing Spider-man numbers.

>>94020308
only 100 million

>>94030193
>/m/
>Not sheeple

You faggots suck Heisei Rider cock and shit on the Showa era. Of course you have shit taste.

>>94031237
Currently there's only a 10 million difference between the BO of WW and TASM

>>94019269
>Has Marvel Lost Its Touch—or Are Fans Just Tired of Spider-Man?

Actually we're just tired of you blackwashing redheaded characters with black and minority actors

Stop the erasure of redheaded characters

The action sucked. It was obvious it was going to be trash when they announced Spider-Man wouldn't punch anyone. The only way to fix this would be to skip ahead to more put-together Spidey that knows what he's doing and has some stronger villains he can throw around. They can't do that because of all of the universe overlap. It's fucked.

>>94019269
maybe we didnt want a 3rd fucking reboot

>>94031421
1. WW is still grossing, it'll be over 800 million soon enough.
2. WW wasn't supposed to single-handedly kickstart a cinematic universe.
3. WW cost $145 million to make, TASM 2 (what Homecoming is expected to match) was fucking $293 million.

>>94031689
Dude, i didn't try to downplay WW's success, just pointing out a fact

But i don't think it's gonna get to 800million, personally, i don't know much about BO autism but Mojo shows it's falling in the <1 million per day territory

>>94024459
>memes are opinions I'm a contrarian to
Jesus, stop breathing

>>94031777
It still hasn't opened in Japan.

>>94031493
Did you even watch it? He punches a bunch of times.

>>94031865
Sure, but it's not that big of a market, may get 10millions out of it

>>94031777
It still has Japan. Suicide Squad has shown inferior performance to WW across the board and it got $16 million there. That'll probably be the tipper.

>>94030006
and the problem is that it was not so explicit that it was not another spiderman origin movie

You show on trailers Iron man mentoring a new spiderman kid, just getting his uniform, being a kid in highschool....learning to be spiderman...what would normies think? IT`S ANOTHER SPIDERMAN ORIGIN MOVIE!!!!

It was pretty boring, Holland isn't Spider-Man but Iron Man's Robin and the CGI looked really, really bad. It's actually still doing better than it deserves, despite the severe, franchise stopping underperforming

>>94031995
Yeah, we knew he was Iron Lad months ago.At this point it doesn't matter anymore. He's just a sidekick, and we'll just learn to accept it.

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Reminder that it's ok to talk about Marvel's film profits but not the comics

>>94032034
I kind of like Spider-Man as a character and I'm sick of fucking Iron Man though. Looking at the numbers I'm not the only one

>>94032086
Every movie he's been in since Avengers has passed the billion. I think it has more to do with people being wary of Spider-Man reboots than anything.

He was in it for 10 minutes or something. And in CW it was already shown Peter got the suit from him.

>>94032086
That's hopeful thinking, but honestly it's going to sell just on name alone. Parents know Spider-Man and they'll take their kids to see it. And as long as it has jokes, that's all they need. And making money is good enough for Sony/Marvel. They're going to keep doing this until enough people get tired of this, and even then they might not. They could just reboot and start the cycle over again.

>>94031777
>but Mojo shows it's falling in the <1 million per day territory
It actually did something amazing, it's one of the movies who lasted more days grossing over a billion than a bunch of billion grossing flicks. Truly a wonder

>>94032170
>over a million*

>>94032159
>And making money is good enough for Sony/Marvel.
The movie has gotten overwhelmingly positive reviews and holds a 90% RT rating.

On that alone it's in a better position than any of the AMS movies.

>>94032251
I'm not denying it. People are fine with Tony's little helper. I'm just saying that we just have to accept that Tony's sidekick is all Spider-Man will ever be in the MCU.

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>>94032295
Stop being so fucking dramatic, not being the most expert hero on the planet doesn't make you a sidekick

And Spidey being mentored is nothing new

>>94031777
I think box office experts have already predicted it'll cross $800M guaranteed.

>>94032345
No, that's a false equivalence. Fury isn't giving him a costume with a bunch of special gadgets and AI that thinks for him. Fury was just guiding him along with wise words, and mostly let Peter figure things out on his own. Tony built everything Peter has, and at the end of the movie Peter takes all those gadgets back. He takes back the Karen suit, and no matter what he achieves, he becomes a product of Tony's work and mentor ship rather than his own.

>>94032345
>Ultimate Nick Fury
>mentor
Bad example. A couple of pep talks does not equal a mentor figure.

>>94032452
Peter did create the web fluid himself, that counts for something.

>>94032438
No need to be an expert, it's $383M just domestic making almost a million a midweek day, about the same overseas, and still has $20M in Japan waiting. $810-20M is the realistic expectation

>>94020992
God Homecoming fags are so obnoxious.

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>Make another incarnation of Spiderman that only stupid teenagers can relate to

>Surprised most audiences don't care about a Teen Super hero. Even more so when the movie didn't even have one of Spiderman's A List Villains, just a B lister AT best who is more a C Lister

I don't wanna watch some dumb kid juggle being a superhero with his high school life. I get enough of that shit in anime.

>>94032345
>not being the most expert hero on the planet doesn't make you a sidekick
There's an understatement. He gets his ass kicked the whole movie and only avoids trouble because of Tony. That seems pretty sidekick to me. Besides,why does Spider-Man have to have his hand held by Tony? The mentorship of Scott and Pym makes sense because Pym built the suit so he knows about it. What does Tony know about being a mutant spider guy?

>>94032452
Tony only added the budget and Karen (which wasn't intended to be ready for use btw), everything important to Peter - the general design, webshooters and special goggles - all come from Peter himself

>>94032555
>What does Tony know about being a mutant spider guy?
More accurate to ask 'What does Tony know about being a superhero and fighting technologically advanced villains?', compared to MCU Spider-Man, a whole lot.

>vulture doesn't suck the youth out of people
Not even Keaton could save this

>>94032497
>>94032592
I'll grant you that Peter starts the Spider-Man identity, but Stark is the one who evolves it. The growth isn't a result of Peter's efforts. It's about Tony's efforts in spending time on teaching Peter. It's not about Peter becoming independent, it's about Tony giving him new power-ups.

>>94032594
And yet Tony figured it out all on his own, as did every other hero in the MCU. All this does is turn Peter into a tag along sidekick. That's the end of the story, he's Burt Ward's Robin and that's all there is to it.
>>94032537
>I don't wanna watch some dumb kid juggle being a superhero with his high school life.
Well that's how it's going to be. They want these movies to be "relatable and quirky" for teens.

>>94032692
The difference is that Tony made a shitton of mistakes along the way. His goal is to make sure that Peter doesn't fuck up as badly as he did. He believes that Peter can be better than him.

Rumor has it that a bunch of the Phase 1 heroes are gonna leave the franchise. This is basically Peter's chance to have some one-on-one with Tony before he retires or bites the dust.

>>94032654
Other heroes helping Spider-Man with tech is also nothing new. Is Spider-Man less of an independent hero in comics because, say, he needed Mr. Fantastic to build him the sonic gun that helped him defeat Venom? The important part is the personal growth. It's like you don't understand that to that point the guy's shop exploding was more more important than damn gadgets

>>94032692
Not disputing MCU Tony doesn't have a huge influence on Peter. but your argument that Tony doesn't know what it's like to be a spider mutant boy is pretty moot when what he's mentoring Peter in is how to become an Avenger, not particularly how to deal with being a spider mutant.

>>94032710
Yet Tony defines everything about MCU Spider-Man. His shadow is now over Spider-Man forever, and everything will just be about living up to Tony's legacy. You can spin it any way you want but Tony made Spider-Man a somebody in the MCU, he didn't matter until Tony. That's why, he's a sidekick and will be from now on. They're not going to develop him beyond "dorky" because people find it hilarious and that means money.

>>94032777
What are you talking about? Even without the suit he has the potential to be one of the most powerful heroes in the world. I'm sure Steve will give him some important life lessons that he'll live by for the rest of his life too in Infinity War. Will you be mad then too?

He's a kid. It's only natural for kids to walk in the footsteps of adults. Adults exist to guide children, and children exist to eventually surpass those adults.

>>94020221

We could say the same for tony

>>94032747
>Is Spider-Man less of an independent hero in comics because, say, he needed Mr. Fantastic to build him the sonic gun that helped him defeat Venom?
Bad example. Peter had already been Spider-Man for close to 10 years time by that point in-universe. He wasn't some fledgling amateur who needed to impress Reed Richards.

>>94032777
> That's why, he's a sidekick and will be from now on. They're not going to develop him beyond "dorky" because people find it hilarious and that means money.

I can picture you half-sobbing while writing this, It's not the end of the world. And he was more than just dorky/autistic/spastic/whatever buzzword you want to use. He's a 15 year old surrounded by adults who have done this for much longer than him. A reoccurring theme of the movie is he wants to be Spider-Man, not just Spider-Boy pretending to be a man. He's going to grow.

>>94032821
>I'm sure Steve will give him some important life lessons that he'll live by for the rest of his life too in Infinity War.
He won't. Do you realize just how many characters will be in Infinity War? Imagine any given Fox X-Men movie, and the amount of development any one character had who wasn't Logan, Xavier or Magneto. That's what Infinity War will be.

But, really. You guys wanna know the REAL reason why Peter's getting all this shit from Tony? You wanna know why Tony's outfitting him with not one, but TWO suits?

Merchandising. It's the same reason Captain America and Iron Man have different outfits in every film. They need to sell toys. That's always what it's been about.

>>94032861
>He's going to grow.
That goes without saying. But in this film, today, he's a child sidekick with everything handed to him on a red and gold platter.

>>94032922
But he was forced to defeat the villain in his crappy (but gorgeous) suit

>>94032747
The difference is that in that example, it's just a one-time thing under specific circumstances. Odds are he's not going to be using that sonic gun forever. That's the difference here.
>>94032768
But what's PETER doing to improve Spider-Man? He's not coming up with clever ways to use his webs or sticking powers. Tony makes Spider-Man better, and Peter adds nothing. He's a sidekick in his own story.
>>94032821
I wouldn't mind Cap giving him some words. Some WORDS would be fine, not for him to invent Spider-Man's fighting style.
>>94032861
>he's going to grow
doubt it. they're probably gonna reboot him after high school.

>>94032893
They're going to cover the infinity gem storyline with two movies.

>>94032940
>Peter watches Captain America fight
>Burns it into his memory
>Incorporates it into his fighting style

And there you go. We now have the perfect successor to Iron Man and Captain America. :)

>>94032964
You see that's actually a good idea. That he takes something he sees and makes something new with it. That implies initiative on his part instead of just getting handouts.

>>94022724
>UMD
Oh my God, the memories of UMDs and the PSP.

When you really think about it, what did the suit give him? In Homecoming, it was just a more efficient and aerodynamic suit. It was still working under the Training Wheels protocol, so when he ran circles around Bucky and Falcon, that was all him. If anything, in Homecoming, Tony's suit hindered Peter more often than it helped him, and his ultimate victory was achieved purely via his own abilities.

Honestly, I'm pretty sure the main reason Peter has an A.I. in his suit at all is so that he has someone to talk to. Peter monologues a lot in the comics, but that's harder to portray in film without having him narrate constantly.

>>94033133
Basically, Peter was just severely overplaying how important the suit was, that's all. It's convenient to have, sure, but that's all it is. It's not as if it gives him his intelligence, his strength, his speed, his agility, or even his webs. He makes those webs. In class. The web shooters are just a more streamlined form of something he already made, only with a billionaire's budget. The A.I. was cool to have, but he proved that he didn't need it when he fought the Vulture in the climax.

Basically, people who say that the suit somehow defines Peter are making the same mistake he did. The suit was just a convenient tool, but the person inside it was doing everything himself from the start.

>>94033254
>It's not as if it gives him his intelligence, his strength, his speed, his agility, or even his webs.
It gives him his "spider sense" though.

>>94019269
>two widely-reviled Amazing movies.
>now faced with the less spectacular-sounding honor of having “only” staunched the bleeding from the studio-destabilizing crack up of the second Amazing feature

Fuck them, I loved the Amazing Spider-Man movies. Didn't care for the villain costumes in ASM2 but that's a small nitpick

>>94033277
It doesn't. According to Feige, Peter's Spider Sense is an actual power that he has. The suit has nothing to do with it.

>Marvel Studios president Kevin Feige revealed that the Marvel Cinematic Universe’s Spider-Man has his spider-sense, but that it’s portrayed differently than in previous films.

>“I think he has it. And I think he has it with or without that suit. I think how we explore it in a cinematic sense will change,” Feige explained. “I mean, that was sort of a big showy part of previous versions and we thought that we’d make it more of an internal, sort of second nature thing for him.”

>“But there are ways coming up that will slowly hint at that and also just make it part of his, you know, his natural abilities,” he added. “I think we’ll explore it further down the line.”

>Feige’s statement comes just days after Homecoming director Jon Watts revealed that the film doesn’t tap into this particular superpower. “I feel like we have seen a lot of Spider-Sense in the previous films,” he said in the earlier interview. “So we didn’t really lean into that as hard as they have in the previous films. But I do think it is a really interesting thing to explore.”

In Civil War, they were a lot more subtle about it, but there were clear hints that it was there. Watts, on the other hand, apparently didn't want to focus on it for Homecoming, so that's why it's less apparent there. They both seem interested in giving it focus in future films, but I guess Watts just didn't want to bother with it for Homecoming.

>>94033277
>making shit up

>>94033300
ASM2 is fucking schizo, man.

>>94023781
actually no, in civil war its menioned by black widow that tony has been iron man for the past 8 years. CW was released in 2016 so all the films follow the irl timeline as well, with avengers happening in 2012

>>94021710
ASM is the foundation still. The whole thing crumbles if it doesn't have a good one.

>>94020972
Iron Man is the main villain of the MCU

>>94029801
The Webb films are the reason Spidey is in this state.

>>94032861
>he's going to grow

They already planned out a trilogy with him in high school. He's remaining a kid.

>>94024222
>Norman Osborn still has a good side in him
Con-fucking-gratulations, that's exactly how Lee/Romita's Osborn was.
>but muh shitty cartoonishly evil psychopath
I fucking hate Gerry Conway and everything he's ever created for setting this garbage in motion.

>>94035077
People like to spew this as if it's some secret truth, but apart from Ultron Tony hasn't been directly responsible for any villains or horrible things happening in the MCU, and he was manipulated by Wanda and the mind stone in AOU.

>Stane
A fucking dick who was probably scheming to steal the company before Tony was even born.
>Whiplash
Mad because Tony's dad fucked him over.
>Killian
Butthurt because Tony stood him up one time over a decade ago
>Vulture
Mad because Iron Man and co are cleaning up the mess created by Loki and the aliens.

>He makes weapons so he's evil!
You blame rl weapon manufactures for every war crime committed around the world too?