Why does Valiant Comics feel so visually dull and empty? At least,

>>93846329
>Rafer Roberts
Because they keep giving this faggot books.

I wish he would fuck off somewhere else

You mean art or character wise?

Character wise cause it is? I don't really mine that though.

Art wise because they're hiring people that couldn't work for the big 2

I dropped Valiant like a year ago.
Divinity and that book about the mystical jap were great, but the rest feels dull as fuck.

If you mean art wise they've had some real knock out hits. KANO did a wonderful job with Quantum and Woody, Raul Allen's Eternal Warrior was great, Clayton Crain's Rai is arguably his best work, Juan Jose Ryp has been great on all of his stuff, etc.,

They do have a lot of 'house style' artists i will give you that but even they're generally quite solid.

>>93847424
I mean character and design wise.

>>93846329
That the way 90s Valiant felt. They're just continuing the brand legacy.

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>>93846329
>visually dull and empty?
>Raul Allen
>Tomas Giorello
>Lewis LaRosa
>Clayton Henry
>Darick Robertson
>Juan Jose Ryp
>Pere Perez
>Mico Suayan
>CAFU
>Trevor Hairsine
>Doug Braithwaite
>Roberto De La Torre
>Clayton Crain
>Tom Fowler
>KANO
>Cary Nord

You are literally fucking retarded, aren't you? Just go back to Marvel where literally 50% of the art is garbage and DC where everything looks the same.

I am a valiant fan and i will admit tgat tge art isnt stellar most of the time but sometimes i really like it. I know it only had 16 issues and i personally didnt like the last arc but shaddowman had a look i really liked especially the deadside. I also thought some choices here and tgere were fun like how animalia looks like a cartoon when she transforms because she is still a kid. Same with the dreamscape in gen zero.

>>93847548
>Valiant doesn't have characters and designs as immediately iconic and recognizable as Marvel and DC's greats.
>Therefore Valiant's characters and designs are visually dull and appealing.
Nice logic there bro.

>>93847910
I meant the designs, not the art.
Jeez, indiefags are incorrigible.

>>93848026
I mean
There are entire indie miniseries with superhero universes that feel less empty than Valiant's

>>93848080
>Jeez, indiefags are incorrigible.
I literally only read superhero books

>>93848105
>There are entire indie miniseries with superhero universes that feel less empty than Valiant's
I disagree. And you're not doing a good job of arguing your point, you just keep stating the same thing over and over again. What exactly do other universes have that Valiant doesn't? Because right now, honestly, Valiant's universe than Marvel's, in every way.

>>93848174
"Valiant's universe *is more interesting* than Marvel's..."

My bad.

>>93847910
This is so immense autism.
The settings are dull and soulless.
OP didn't say shit about Marvel or DC, you stupid cock sucker.

>>93848026
That's not even remotely what was implied, and you know it, you dickless cockroach.

>>93846329
Probably because they're disjointed as hell and the heroes all know each other in a really forced and awkward way, and there's no headline team or sense of unity.

TMNT has better lore.

>>93848080
>>93847548
There are a lot of plainclothes/uniform tactical characters, but there are certainly some standout designs.

The thing is, a lot of Valiant characters aren't Cape but genre fiction in a shared universe. My prime example for that is Gilad, the Eternal Warrior. He's a sword and sorcery Conan-type in a cape-esque shared world.

But as for strong designs in general, i'd say Quantum, Bloodshot, Rai, Ninjak, Divinity, X-O Manowar and Shadowman are all nice, interesting designs.

Armstrong, Archer, Gilad, Ivar, and the Harbinger crew designs are less visually distinct and notable but i feel fit the characters well.

>>93848174
Valiant's universe is terrible. And if you think that unironically, you're a hipster indiefag of the utmost contrarian nature.
SJW garbage Marvel still has a better atmosphere than the soulless shell that is Valiant.

>>93848249
>The settings are dull and soulless.
OP didn't say that, now did he? I still disagree with that, but I wouldn't go about it the same way.

>That's not even remotely what was implied, and you know it, you dickless cockroach.
Then please, educate me on what OP meant, because what I took, from his words, was that Valiant characters and designs needed work.

>OP didn't say shit about Marvel or DC
>way emptier than other comic book superhero universes
>other comic book superhero universe
>superhero universes

>>93848200
OP here.

Gotcha.

Well, anyway

Like, don't get me wrong.
Ninjak looks great. Shadowman looks great. Bloodshot looks great. X-O looks great.

It's just-

The universe just feels empty.
Sure, there are some clear shared factors (like Harbingers and stuff) but it feels like there are too few prominent superpeople, and that all of them have almost nothing to do with each other. And besides the characters I just mentioned (and Quantum), many of the rest of the BIG characters just look visually one-note: Harbinger kids all wear street clothes and/or blue/black, Toyo's guys all have dull red uniforms, Livewire's outfit is just kinda visually boring-

You know how a lot of the time, X-Men seems like a separate universe from the rest of Marvel?
Nearly everyone in Valiant feels like that, except more visually bare and with less going on. There's barely any real long-lasting bad guys besides Rising Spirit and Harada (and even PRS is biting the dust in favor of "Omen").

Maybe those aren't turn-offs for others, but for me, they are. That's all.

>>93848387
Superhero universes include not only DC and Marvel but also Milestone, some Image stuff, etc

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>>93848387
>Image doesn't exist
>Dynamite doesn't exist
>IDW doesn't exist
>Darkhorse doesn't exist

>>93848356
Literally every Valiant book coming out now ranges from 'pretty good' to 'great." Marvel outputs 20 garbage books every single week, with maybe 3 stand-outs every month.

>>93848424
Of fucking course, but can you name another superhero universe that's coming out right now, that's actually good, and has more than 3 series?

>>93848319
OP here.
Thank you for being honest and respectful.
You're the salt of the earth, anon.

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>>93848461

>Having standards this bad
>Shit talking SJW marvel as if you didn't just pour a spaghetti tsunami out

Deadshot is their only title that isn't disjointed tone deaf garbage that's overly up it's own ass.

>>93848437
Literally none of these are superhero universes. I swear to god, I'm arguing with children. The Hasbro universe counts I guess.

>>93848519
>DEADSHOT
Kill me boys, I done shot myself.
Put me down, quick.

As someone who has never read Valiant. What would be the first few books I should read to get introduced to that universe?

>>93848504
Image sometimes.

>>93848541
Any of their #1s, I'd say

>>93848529
I'm sorry, we weren't aware there was an actual retard in our midst.

>Dynamite isn't a superhero universe
>The reboot Youngblood and Invincible and Savage Dragon aren't superhero universes
neck yourself, m8

>>93848541
Well, the best thing about Valiant isn't the universe but the books, you feel me? There are a lot of good books but they're more just good books than good introductions to the universe.

I'd recommend Fred Van Lente's Archer & Armstrong, Vendetti's Eternal Warrior, Lemire's Bloodshot, Kindt's Ninjak, Dysart's Harbinger Saga (Harbinger to Imperium), Milligan's Britannia, Kindt's Rai, and Kindt's new X-O Manowar has been really good so far.

>>93848396
Well I suppose these are fair points. I apologize for getting... heated. I just like Valiant a lot.

The universe has definitely felt a little disjointed the last couple years, and I wish it was more interconnected as well. It looks like they're doing just that with the recent Harbinger arc and Harbinger Wars 2 though.

>too few prominent superpeople
X-O Manowar, Bloodshot, Ninjak, Eternal Warrior, the Harbinger Renegades, Faith, Rai. I guess I would agree that they aren't all as prominent as they could be, but they only make 6-9 books a month.

I think the "basic" designs were kind of on purpose. No one's really trying to be a superhero, besides Faith and sort of Unity. They're just people with superpowers.
I also think that they have a couple stellar designs. X-O and Bloodshot are fantastic and fairly recognizable.

They do have a bit of a problem with bad guys for sure. They could use a little more work in that department, but they do have a few good ones: The Vine, The Sect,Edison's Radical Acquisitions, Father, Future Neela, Myshka, Harada and his cohorts. I could go on, but I do agree that they could use some work.

>>93848541
Do you want to jump in on the current stuff, start at the beginning, or just pick out the best bits?

>>93848587
How the fuck can you think these are even in the same category as Valiant? All of these have maybe one or two books a month.

Valiant is so fucking dull, almost every character is the same snarky edgy 90s mercenary. They have like 4 good books (Imperium, Rai and the new Eternal Warrior).
That Rai event was great, but the rest feels like they are wasting potential on movie-bait.

At least they are better than Marvelshit.

>>93848755
>almost every character is the same snarky edgy 90s mercenary.
Please elaborate.

>>93848703
Thanks for being civil, at least in the end.
I'm all for third-party superhero universes (I'm helping develop one, myself, so it'd be pretty heinous of me not to be supportive), I guess Valiant just isn't always my cup of tea.
Maybe me ams just cultureless pleb?? Who knows-

>>93848753

Are you an actual helmet wearing retard.
In all my days on this Goddamn website, I've seen stupidity of this intensity maybe one other time.
How is the Green Hornet, The Spider, The Shadow, The Phantom, Flash Gordon, The Green Lama, the Owl and many many more superheroes, in the same universe, not a superhero universe....?

Your comment was "Literally none of these are superhero universesl!!!!" not "hurrr not valiant publishing rate, durr" you utter simpleton.

>>93848861
Well for me, the most appealing thing about Valiant is the consistency. The ratio of good-to-bad books is just crazy. I'm also just a sucker for smaller superhero universe, and they tend to do everything right.
>Events occur sparingly
>line-wide events happen once every 3 years
>literally one instance of SJW politics
>Characters that feel consistent across multiple books
>They don't flood the shelves
>They have a variety of genres. No two books are the same
>Infrequent relaunches
>They cultivate talent well.
I could go on, but I see your points. What have you read from them so far?

>>93848880
>Interconnected Dynamite series in July 2017.
>literally none
http://www.firstcomicsnews.com/dynamite-entertainment-july-2017-solicitations/

>>93849026
Do you have Asperger's
King's Watch is literally running, right now.

>>93848982
Of the relaunched stuff, I've read Bloodshot, maybe half of Bloodshot Reborn (stopped around the Bad Future story arc), some Archer and Armstrong (which I enjoyed until Archer went full atheist), and The Valiant (which I enjoyed a lot, even if the IE btfo'd all those heroes a bit too easily).
Of old Valiant, I've read a lot of X-O, some Ninjak, some Harbinger. And the first two issues of Secret Weapons (which were GREAT), but dropped it at the third issue (jarring and surprising drop in quality).
I've been meaning to read the relaunched X-O, Ninjak, and Harbinger sometime, but I haven't gotten around to it yet.

That wasn't the topic being discussed, why are you still talking about it.
No one said anything about publishing rates.

>>93848396
>Sure, there are some clear shared factors (like Harbingers and stuff) but it feels like there are too few prominent superpeople

Have you considered that there are just less characters? Because that's the actual case here. Valiant isn't terminally overcrowded with one-note superheroes like Marvel and DC are.

>You know how a lot of the time, X-Men seems like a separate universe from the rest of Marvel?
>Nearly everyone in Valiant feels like that, except more visually bare and with less going on. There's barely any real long-lasting bad guys besides Rising Spirit and Harada (and even PRS is biting the dust in favor of "Omen").

Personally I feel the completely opposite way.

The connections between characters in Valiant feel natural, and as an emergent part of an ongoing story where everything is ultimately sharing the same space. I'd say it's far superior to the big two, where characters mostly just know each other for vague reasons that aren't established, because a big super event happened out of nowhere, or because they were put on the same superteam by the Avengers/Justice League.

Seeing Harbinger and Generation Zero and Bloodshot all bounce off each other is great.

>>93849057
>1 series
Oh, you got me.

>>93849133

You didn't even mention the villains despite greentexting me mentioning the villains, you cAD

>>93849057
It's not?
That other guy still has no point, no one brought up Valiant or anyone else's output.

>>93849133
What Title's do you recommend?

>>93849160
>Arguing a point no one made

Even if you were right, you're a moron, anon.

>>93849229
My point was that no other superhero universe is comparable, in size, to Valiant in 2017.

>>93849188
That's really covered by the point above.

There are less characters overall. The universe does not NEED a zillion big recurring villains. It has around four huge ones that pop up in everyone's shit and that's fine.

>>93849294
That.....has nothing to do with anything, you retard.
No one brought that up, that isn't a factor, not for anyone else, you made that a factor.

>>93849188
Maybe because that's a good thing?

It's good when stories end. It's good when characters finish their arcs and conclude their adventures.

Marvel and DC's inability to do this is part of what makes them insufferable.

>>93849372
It's not that the villains die.
It's that the villains who die are typically one-note weirdos that no one cares about.
Even fuckin ANIME is capable of getting this right.

Dude, in this post (>>93848387) I explained that the OP implied that Valiant's universe is more boring than Marvel and DC's.

In this post (>>93848437), this anon tried to say that these other publishers has comparable universes to Valiant.

And now I'm just explaining how there's no other universe that holds a candle to Valiant (and the big 2) in 2017. Seems like a pretty clear through-line.

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>>93846329
>Valiant Comics

>>93849294
The Valiant universe has continuity but it doesn't matter because 90% of the characters are boring as fuck.

Valiant is all just knock off superheroes
its for fags who thought they were too cool for 90s Image heroes
I don't understand why anyone would want to read it at all
if you want to read superheroes, just read the good ones
if you want indie books, read some Fantagraphics or something actually worthwhile

>>93848753
I don't know man. I just want to read something new cause current Marvel sucks.

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>>93851697
Alright, in that case, I recommend X-O Manowar Vol. 1 by Matt Kindt. It's only $10 and it's really good. The art is incredible.

Also Secret Weapons #1 just came out, by the writer of Arrival.

>>93851947
Secret Weapons? I've been a bit out of the loop

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>>93855120
Mini-series starring the psiots that Harada refused to take in after their activation. So basically they're all the psiots with shit powers. Livewire is a main character as well.

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>>93855853

>>93855853
Wasnt livewire like his right hand gal? And wasnt gen zero the same thing but with prs? Anyways sounds cool i always like characters with 1 power or a limited use or something.

>>93855968
Yea, Livewire was Harada's right hand woman until she found out that he's crazy evil. Even when she knew that he was a little.. morally ambiguous, she stayed beside him, but after she broke into every single one of his files, she found out that he wasn't the nicest guy in the world.

Gen. Zero is about teenage war criminals. They're complete badasses. PRS didn't abandon them, Gen. Zero escape imprisonment and then PRS (and now Omen) did everything in their power to apprehend/kill the problem they created. Harass abandoned the Secret Weapons kids because he felt like they were worthless to his cause.

>>93848461
>Literally every Valiant book coming out now ranges from 'pretty good' to 'great."
What is "Faith"

>>93847910
Half those artists are awful

Just finished the first 3 ivar timewalker books.
Is there a continuation of this or is this his whole story?