Spend her entire life in constant life and death training and

Character Development

>>92285601
Just a cartoon bro

>>92285601
She redirected her hate towards Aku instead. She is still a vicious beast when she attacks her enemies.
>Example: Orc Army.

I wonder how mainstream outlets are receiving the Jack/Ashi stuff.

Though, what IS mainstream when it comes to a late night cartoon show on Saturdays?

>>92285628
Which is never shown. Wow such character development.
>>92285643
Fighting is another thing. Ashi should be like those people who have been locked up away since birth to adulthood. Those people come out like a 5 year old in a adult's body with major psychological issues. No concept of normal social interaction, what is a hug, love, what are friends, how do I talk to other people etc. And yet she is shown to be a completely normal person who has no trouble adjusting to the outside world.

>>92285601
Can't.

>>92285755
And yet people still lap this shit up because muh waifu. Fucking females and their SJWs pushing this shit into my SJ.

This honestly lost my desire to finish the show.

>>92285720
>Which is never shown. Wow such character development

You're a fucking idiot if you believe that.

>>92285601
people change.
just because you still act and dress like a 14-year old doesn't mean the rest of us are stuck like that.

>>92285601
>overnight
It didn't. Three episodes were more than a day, likely a week.

>>92285601
>Explain how 20 years of indoctrination and torture suddenly disappears overnight.
She met the Woolies and the cursed archers, went to the rave, met Da Samoorai, and found the samurai graveyard, all in one episode, and there's no telling who else she may have met that wasn't shown. Unless those places were somehow all in extremely close proximity to each other, that episode may have taken place over the course of weeks, maybe even month, so it wasn't exactly "overnight".

>>92286208
>you can change something someone has believed their entire life over the course of a couple days

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>>92285601
>faggots claiming one of the most basic storytelling tropes in human history is total bullshit because they're just THAT butthurt about there being a woman in samurai jack (or that samurai jack is in a women kekekekeke)

>>92286335
Don't you faggots have a better argument than "LOL U MAD"?

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Spend his entire life in constant isolation and indoctrinating his crazy dog with no social interaction with anyone else other then his dog and knowing next to nothing of the outside world except that he hates it. In a single minute, he suddenly tuns into a well functioning normie whose's only flaw is that he wants to cut the roast beast too badly. He should be a autistic mess with no clue how to interact with people and a psychological mess from having his entire worldview shattered and the memories of the past 20 years of pain and misery having been for nothing. Explain how 20 years of hatred and misery suddenly disappears over a few seconds. Explain this you fucking waifufags.

>>92286299
There is no fucking way to be more obvious that Aku is evil than what we were show.

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Spend her entire life in constant life and death training and being indoctrinated a crazy cult with no social interaction with anyone else other then her cultmates and knowing next to nothing of the outside world besides school. In a single ep, she suddenly tuns into a well functioning normie whose's only flaw is that she wants the Dragon D too badly. She should be a autistic mess with no clue how to interact with people and a psychological mess from having her entire worldview shattered and the memories of the past 20 years of pain and misery having been for nothing. Explain how 20 years of indoctrination and torture suddenly disappears overnight. Explain this you fucking waifufags.

>>92286369
>I ignored his whole point and called him faggot
Seriously, this writing is cliche' as fuck.
>Evil person meets good person
>Evil person was actually not that evil
>They are forced to work together
>They bond
>They fuck

>>92286431
Wasn't she taught all the sick shit Aku does is actually good though

>>92286502
Funny thing is that Jack and Ashi reminded me a little bit of Jake and Rose.

>>92286208
Person has PSTD, person has an anxiety disorder, person has been bought up in a death cult for her entire life with no social interaction. Over a single day, they're back to normal. Because.

FUCk you piece of shit. Child soliders don't magically become mentally sound just because they see the light. You get a nigger gangbanger who has spent his entire life gunning people down for some african nigger warlord since he was 4, give him a day of counselling and see how well they interact normal people. Would you invite that nigger to your house and let him play with your kids after 1 ep of "character development"

>>92285720
>>92285601
Are you that same autistic faggot from yesterday?

>>92286606
>>I ignored his whole point and called him faggot
I see the I irony is lost on you.

>>92285628
I guarantee the OP is unfamiliar with that concept because they only watch Steven Universe

>>92286660
No, she was taught that Aku made all the beautiful nature that she got a glimpse of, and that Jack wanted to destroy it all.

>>92285628
That is very rushed and not natural at all.
>Jack shows her some bad things
>She sees some good things
And that's about it.

>>92286750
She traveled pretty much the entire fucking world in the course of those two episodes.

>>92286428
i kecqued

>>92286686
>Over a single day, they're back to normal.
Well we don't know how long Ashi wandered looking for Jack but it was most likely more than one day, then however long it took them to get back to where he lost the sword, then however long it took them to get to the desert.

>>92285720
>Which is never shown. Wow such character development.
The change in Ashi's character is shown and it's shown how it happens with giving her inner conflict. What else do you need for character development?

>>92286606
>Seriously, this writing is cliche' as fuck.
Gee, and to think this is Samurai Jack, which has always been known for its original writing!

>>92286428
It was 53 years.

>>92286768
That's rushed, anon. Not to mention neither of those episodes were wholly dedicated to her.

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>>92285601
>>92286686
>>92286369
>Its another "IT WAS FORCED, IT CAME OUT OF NO WHERE" Episode with a /pol/ touch
>So mad didn't see this coming a mile away even with all the hints
>Thinks She suddenly turned good in the span of one episode
>Arguments be damn, OP rather screech like a retard
>when people call him out on his bullshit the only response is
> "WELL UH UR JUST A DUMB WAIFUFAG"

THIS IS INCREDIBLE!

>>92285601
>Its a "/co/ has an autistic meltdown" episode

>>92285601
> Explain how 20 years of indoctrination and torture suddenly disappears overnight.

She never gave in fully to the line her mother was selling and came to terms with the truth she'd already suspected over the course of weeks. I'm assuming you must not have watched episodes 5, 6, or 7.

>>92286775
Oh wow, twenty years of brainwashing, trauma and lack of any form of social interaction got wiped away in a week. Such an improvement. Actual RL child soliders/cult members spent years in therapy to be normal well adjusted humans again. And we are never shown this because? We never got scenes like Ashi sperging out because she has never any positive social interactions before and can't read people's body language.

>Someone trys to give her a hug. She attacks them because she doesn't know what a hug is.
>She doesn't know what a compliment is because she never gotten one.
>She doesn't know how to relax and have fun, again because she spent her entire life in a fucking deathcult.

>>92286428
SJ was supposed to be better then this...

>>92286902
>>So mad didn't see this coming a mile away even with all the hints
At least *I* saw it coming but still hoped it didn't happen because it's uninspired as fuck. Made worse by how chesy it was, they did it better with Ikra in less than one episode! It was predictable at it was terrible, that's why I don't like it.

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>>92285601
It didn't fucking disappear overnight and she was shown to have doubts in the brainwashing from the start. If you grew up in that environment with part of you always doubting what you are told and then the one person you've been trained to think of as evil and monstrous saves your life and does nothing but show you and everything around him kindness you would doubt your worldview too.

>>92287036
Again, it's not that she falls in love with Jack. It's that she spent her entire life in a cult that treated her like shit and she has no emotional or psychological issues from it. RL cult members from birth or child soliders tend to be PSTD wrecks who can't function in normal society. At the very least she would be behaving like some manbaby who has never left his house in 20 years.

Can you picture how someone would act when they don't know what a handshake, a hug, how to talk like a normal person, eye contact, personal space, you know the social skills we've picked up over our entire lifes.

>>92287117
I was about to say it's just a cartoon but considering one of the seasons biggest themes is Jack's PTSD you raise a good point.

>>92287117
It seems they don't want us too think too hard about it. Remember how she felt inadequate when truly naked for the first time despite having no reason to? Later she conveniently has no sense of modesty like she should not have had then. They don't give a shit.

>>92287300
And she somehow manages to fashion such a pretty dress out of leaves despite never having worn clothes or knowing anything about fashion.

>>92285601
Haircut = character development

>>92285601
is anyone fucking with the vision? recent ep had beautiful visuals and a lot of things conveyed without dialogue but then you have redundant lines like "watch out ashi"
>>92285601
a lot of time passed in that one ep.
> functioning normie
and you say this based on what?
>should be
not everyone is a faggot like you
>suddenly disappears overnight
or she is exploring another point of view without directly addressing her baggage

>>92287433
>"watch out ashi"
I think it's supposed to be intentionally awkward, like the feelings they had. It's still pretty lame.

>>92286963
>lack any form of social interaction
She was raised with 6 sisters and other cultists

>>92285601
I like how autists think these episodes are taking place within hours of eachother.

From Episode 1 to Episode 8 it's been at least a couple months

>>92287433
>and you say this based on what?
>Naked for most of her life. Suddenly able to fashion a such a good looking dress out of leaves when she shouldn't even know about the concept of nakedness.

>>92287117
given the setting, who knows those things? most of her interactions are with jack and she is not often called to do anything social. absence of those things could be very normal in that setting. one would assume that a substantial amount of time has passed given how much land they have crossed and that jack himself went from a lunatic talking to himself and eating rats to a chill guy making straw hats.

>>92287490
So what? Jack sat for weeks/months in that fucking graveyard before trying to kill himself?

>>92287473
it was ok in the bus but got stranger as time went by. I mean he knows she can fight and even then acrobatic reminded should be enough. Im mostly annoyed because I see the line "watch out" in a lot of shows and its always unnecessary (its not like she was being attacked from the back) no retard is not going to watch out when under attack, especially not a train assassin. it made me extra annoyed after that perfect moment when they jumped off the bus, looked happy and then realized they had stranded themselves in a desert

>>92287489
The 'always naked' thing has been Jossed by people associated with the show itself. Presumably the girls understood the concept of clothes, since her mother fuckin' wore them, and so did at least some of the other red-mask mooks. That's not even getting into the fact that they all prolly saw hundreds if not thousands of people tracking Jack, and Ashi saw even more looking to save him.

This is a nitpick on par with 'how does Jack keep getting a new gi.'

>>92287489
Im sure concept of nakedness is know to her. she was naked before the coal and one would assume she had to reapply it few times during her life. given that they use masks and even coal can be seen as a from of covering its unlikely she does not understand it even if her mom did not sit her down for a talk.
>Suddenly able to fashion a such a good looking dress
that is a story allowance. like jacks pimp outfit

>>92287520
Ashi was apparently pretty close on his trail.

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>>92287600
>that is a story allowance. like jacks pimp outfit

>Uh, right, that was good-looking too, Jack...

>>92285601
The character change itself is part of the themes of samurai Jack.

However, the fact Ashi was turned so quickly is lazy writing.

I'm guessing the speedy face turn was caused by limited episode count.

>>92287520
maybe. I mean when they went to see all the locations aku had fucked up(even infiltrated the city) Do you think all that was done in less than a week?

>>92287597
His gi comes from the spirit. its a gi stand.

>>92287626
oh come on, that was pure gold

>>92287638
Like I said, Ashi just causes bad writing. I'm going to sit in the graveyard for weeks and only try to kill myself seconds before MUH waifu steps in to save me. Also Omen just sitting there and staring at Jack for weeks?

>>92287558
Yes he knows she can fight, but he also knows she's unarmed and he doesn't realize his feelings for her are getting stronger and making him more worried for her

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>>92287679
Y-yeah, it looks...uh...unique. Like the back fur.

>>92287683
First off, Jack left to go head to the graveyard less than 5 minutes before ashi realized he was gone. however long it took ashi to find him(whether it was 5 days or five weeks), he did not have much of a head start.
Second off, he had to find a sword so that might have taken a bit of extra time for ashi to catch up.

>>92287683
>Also Omen just sitting there and staring at Jack for weeks?
yes? Im not even sure if he is real or dead, its not like he has anything better to do. He did stalk jack for years.
>I'm going to sit in the graveyard for weeks and only try to kill myself seconds before MUH waifu steps in to save me.
very common turn of events in a lot of productions.
>Ashi just causes bad writing.
how is your inability to accept a time laps without being explicitly told that there was a time laps, bad writing?

>>92287764
Don't be a retard. Jack headed directly for the graveyard. Ashi had to stumble around looking for his trail and wasting time on things like the rave, getting shown around the various villagers and towns that Jacked saved the bath and making new clothes etc.

>>92287764
or she got lost along the way thus making the head start bigger. It was more about thematics than actual time, to talk about the head start is the same as wondering how convenient it was that she found so many people jack had helped or defeated. she did not even know where he was going so it took her time

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Ashifags are getting pretty pathetic. Just letting bad writing wash over you for the sake of your super cute waifu who may or may not match your level of autism perfectly is just sad. Honestly this is kind of shit I would expect from /a/.

>>92285601
Because she never truly believed her mother.
It's been driven home that despite all the torture and training she was never broken, her mother even comments on it. She's trying to defeat the Samurai not because she's been programmed to kill her, but because she was told he was the one causing all the devastation.

In episode 4 she's trying to hold onto her delusion but by the end of the episode it's totally broken. Episode 5 has her come to terms with Aku being the one behind everything, so she shifts her hatred towards Hack towards the right enemy. In episode 6 she travels the fucking world, encountering many people who Jack has helped over his journey and going through a big change herself in response. Their relationship has been building for the past 5 episodes, which in-universe is probably weeks of time.

How does /co/ not have a grasp on Ashi's character when it's not subtle at all? She's a female Jack who was unfortunate enough to be raised by a cult of Aku rather than the forces of good and had to be set on the right path.

>>92287856
no fun fags are worse.

>>92287858
Because/co/ is autistic. That's all you need to understand anon.

>>92287858
some of us are the reason why Hollywood movies are dumbed down and preemptively give answers to irrelevant questions

>>92287779
>He did stalk jack for years
But only started really pressuring Jack just in time for Ashi to intervene and suck Jack's cock of hope back to full hardness? Come on.

>very common turn of events in a lot of productions.
>it happens a lot, so that makes it okay!

>how is your inability to accept a time laps without being explicitly told that there was a time laps, bad writing?
What? Anon is accepting the time lapse and calling bullshit on the writers for ignoring that time was still passing for Jack while Ashi was going on her cameo tour and getting a makeover.

>>92287819
>>92287845
You guys do realize that Ashi has been shown to be an excellent tracker right? you DID watch episode 3 right?
>inb4 "he waited a long ass time for them to find him"
he got swept up into a current and blockaded the sisters in a tomb with their dead comrade, that got him some extra time.

>>92287869
Ashi isn't fun. She's boring to everyone who doesn't want to vicariously fuck her.

>>92287858
>How does /co/ not have a grasp on Ashi's character when it's not subtle at all? She's a female Jack who was unfortunate enough to be raised by a cult of Aku rather than the forces of good and had to be set on the right path.
So while Jack has to deal with his PSTD and anger issues. Ashi is a complete well adjusted individual with no emotional or mental problems despite spending twenty years of her life in a religious cult with no normal social interaction.

>Ashi is good character guys I swear, not a shitty forced love interest.

>>92287858
>Because she never truly believed her mother.
Which is bullshit.

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>>92286963
>Actual RL child soliders

>>92287926
>But only started really pressuring Jack just in time for Ashi to intervene and suck Jack's cock of hope back to full hardness? Come on.
this has to be a bait. no one is this retarded

>>92287932
Also (and I fully admit this one is reaching) there is a chance that since the omen was taking jack to be executed, he may have allowed him to have a last meal/bedrest beforehand.

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>>92286428
>>92286502
>people still trying to argue after OP got BTFO twice
Do we need to make this a full-blown copypasta

>>92287963
why are you face palming? I mean suggesting we go for realism is stupid but those people do exist

>>92287952
>>Ashi is good character guys I swear, not a shitty forced love interest.
I don't even know how they can deny this when It's pretty fucking clear Genndy only put her in there to complete the actualization of his childhood fantasies where he fought alongside his crush.

>>92287858
>In episode 4 she's trying to hold onto her delusion

This never gets noted, but generally speaking, anyone who has to endlessly scream how much they believe in a given thing is talking more to themselves than to you.

>>92287965
How is it retarded, anon?

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>>92287994
>why are you facepalming
>suggesting we go for realism is stupid
You answered your own question.

Ashi is proof of SJWs forcing shitty female self inserts into media and /co/ is falling for it because of waifufags and because it makes tumblur angry.

You guys are the reason why trump won.

>>92286502
It took her almost two seasons.

>>92288046
>waifus are the reason Trump won

>>92288102
SJWs are the reason why trump won.

>>92288044
Right, so Ashi's character is unrealistic and unbelievable.

>>92288124
So is jack, so is aku, so is scotsman, so is every single fucking character in this goddamn show

>>92288027
he always pushes when jacks hope starts dropping. finding out that he did not kill those kids and being reminded of the good he has done has boosted his hope

>>92288156
I disagree with other anon, but reread his posts, you're misreading them.

>>92288147
nah, the story of a robot without a body boring a cruise ship is just like what happened to my cousin niko

>>92285601
A single episode... why insist to open these threads?

>>92285601
>Explain how 20 years of indoctrination and torture suddenly disappears overnight.

She is a young woman with serious mommy issues. Being a messed-up slut is natural from her.

>>92288184
What am I misreading? He is implying that its convenient that the spirit has not made him kill himself till now or that someone else helping out was wrong. in a way jack wanted it to be over, that is why he did not investigate when the kids "died" guy was depressed and needed outside help

>>92288006
She's there because Jack doesn't work as a solo protagonist at all. He's a Mad Max-esque character who's written to be a device for episodic stories about locals who need help, not carry his own narrative. He needs something to bounce off of.

Ashi fills that role while also doubling as a way to recap some story bits for new viewers. Her arc mostly exists to play into Jack's development as well, helping him find hope and his humanity again, but through a second person perspective since 7 episodes of him arguing with Mad Jack would get old instantly. I guess the Scotsman could have also done it but it'd be out of character for him to not just beat the shit out of Jack and yell at him to get over himself.

>>92285601
>it's another "DUDE RUSHING LMAO" episode
>it's another "DUDE I DIDN'T WATCH THE SHOW LMAO" episode
Ashi and Jack have been traveling together for an unknown period of weeks, and during that period Jack gave her exposure to the outside world. Hell, Ep 6 was LITERALLY about her venturing throughout the world on her own, and she did fine.

F U R T H E R M O R E

Out of the 20 years of her life Jack is literally the only person who has ever shown affection and mercy towards her. In addition to that, Jack is, physical attractiveness wise, a God. Biology takes over and feelings of attraction develop. This is 100% natural and to be expected.

>implying that 20 years of training on how to infiltrate the outside world to kill Jack wouldn't include basic training on how to not be a huge fucking autist in public so that you could sneak up on the Samurai in public without looking like a huge fucking autist

>>92288256
She didn't know what fucking deer were you fucking nigger. Or what the nose nuzzling was.

>>92286963
>HOW COME WE DIDN'T GET 10 EPISODES OF ASHI IN AKU-THERAPY DURING A 10 EPISODE SEASON REEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE

>>92288254
Bull. Shit. Jack carried his own narrative perfectly over the first three episodes, and Mad Jack was amazing.

>I guess the Scotsman could have also done it but it'd be out of character for him to not just beat the shit out of Jack and yell at him to get over himself.
That would have been better.

>>92288308
Not even a single scene just to highlight how bad her life was and how Jack is making her a better person. Really you fucking nigger. Also, just get more episodes if 10 isn't enough, which it clearly isn't.

The indoctrination and torture never broke Ashi like it did her sisters, though. That's why her mom always called her unfocused and lazy. She was never mindbroken and never stopped questioning.

>>92288250
>What am I misreading?
I specifically meant that the Omen waited to start pressuring Jack at the graveyard until Ashi arrived.

>>92288378
You don't need to break children. They're like clay, you can mold them however you want.

>>92288377
>Not even a single scene to show how bad her life was.
What are the entirety of the flashbacks in Episodes 1, 2, and 6? Why even bother posting in Jack threads if you never watched Jack?

>How Jack is making her a better person
What is literally the entire point of Episodes 4, 5, and 6? Why bother posting in Jack threads if you never watched Jack?

>>92288298
nor do a lot of people in our world and they function fine. again your requirements are very subjective

>>92288401
No, you still have to put in the work to suppress their natural urge to ask questions. They never killed this urge in Ashi, which is what led to her redemption arc.

>>92288403
>What are the entirety of the flashbacks in Episodes 1, 2, and 6? Why even bother posting in Jack threads if you never watched Jack?
And it doesn't matter because all that didn't affect her current self at all.

>>92288147
They have believable personalities, you twit. Ashi does not. You'd know that had you ever interacted with a female outside of your own mother.

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>>92285601
>>92286963
>>92287856
>>92288254
>>92288363
>>92287858
>>92288256
Everyone ITT is missing the point of Ashi's entire character. She is a symbol of what happens when someone escapes postmodernist collectivism and is able to become an individual once again. Everything in this entire show is basically Genndy's reaction to growing up in a commie shithole. The way Aku's government functions, all the mindless drones, hell even some of the environments look like places that the soviet Union destroyed, take for example the Aural Sea.

Ashi was literally thrown into a burning pit of tar, fire, and coal to burn her individualism away. Notice the themes with Jack and how her interactions with him center around the theme of water in episode four, and later in episode 6 when she washes the black suit off, and the subsequent outfit she puts on. She goes from being burnt and hardened to something more tender, sensitive and alive. Now think about the paralells there with what's going on in the world today, and the types of philosophies that Genndy Tartarovsky grew up with:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8qpgL6ndEQU [Embed]

She's a small plant, emerging from the ashes of a forest fire, both in a literal and philosophical sense. It's amazing.

>>92288377
>confirmed for being a dumb nigger who needs everything spoon fed to him

>>92288431
Children believe what you tell them.

>which is what led to her redemption arc
I wouldn't call thirty minutes an "arc".

>>92288479
>nigger

>>92288482
t. someone who has never seriously interacted with children for any length of time.

just stop posting, anon.

>>92288384
maybe he to got tired of waiting or maybe he said it few times before.

>>92288459
Yeah, that's nice.

Too bad she sucks.

>>92288459
People have their own idea of how they wanted the show to go, so they don't really want to think about the show as it is

>>92288459
I really liked this, thanks anon
>>92288526
Is unfortunately too accurate

>>92288482
>I wouldn't call thirty minutes an "arc".
Episodes 1-7 focus on Ashi just as much as they focus on Jack. Their arcs come to a close at the exact same time, as she kills her mother and he gets his sword back. Two of those episodes almost exclusively star her while Jack is off-screen doing other shit.

The claims of this season rushing everything are getting very exaggerated. Go marathon it all again from beginning to the most recent episode.

>>92288479
>Spoonfed = Not supporting a relationship between a PTSD victim who's lived 80+ years in frustration and a child soldier being whim-influenced puppy love that goes from a 2 to an 11 in a week like Romeo and Juliet.

>>92288495
I am literally raising a child. I remember trolling little kids in my neighborhood by making them believe stupid shit. I remember being shocked to learn that telephone poles aren't actually radioactive like my mom told me when I was little.

So no, I will not stop posting.

>>92288500
I have no clue what you're saying right now. Learn to articulate.

>>92288459
soviet union was an ok gov. Tartarovsky just mad he was not among the people getting the pie

>>92288559
>supporting != comprehending
just seconds ago you were confused about what is even going on. its like anakin and padme, it does not have to be star crossed destiny love for 2 people to hook up.

>>92287856
>I have no counter argument, what do I do?
>Maybe if I call them fags and don't reply to anyone nobody will notice

>>92288555
The bulk of her development happened in thirty minutes. I am not exaggerating. Jack showing her the horrors of the world and the cameo tour is 99% of her development.

>>92285601

>Explain this you fucking waifufags.
Why should "waifufags" explain anything? It's canon.

>>92288639
I've replied to all of the replies to my post, faggot.

>>92288575
>I am raising a kid who's too stupid to question the world around them
Sorry that your kid is going to be among the starving masses who are left behind by automation taking all the mcjobs away, anon. The shithead kids in my family will act and believe the literal exact opposite of everything you tell them.

>>92288559
You really shouldn't center your main argument around the amount of time passed, especially when you
>are simply wrong on Jacks time(8 years of happy childhood with parents>12 years of intense but culturally enriching and at times fun training>50 years of future)
>have no way of knowing exactly how long Ashi and Jack have been traveling together.

>>92288622
I'm not even the same person you yutz.
And that was already discussed with
>>92288403
>>92288438

>>92288644
Episode 4 has a lot more going on with Ashi than the ladybug scene at the end. The whole episode acts as a bridge between how she appears in episode 1 to the breaking down of her beliefs.

And it doesn't reach its resolution until episode 7's climax when she confronts her mother and reasserts her decisions by killing her.

Acting like all her development happened in thirty minutes is like claiming all of Jack's development happened during the tea scene because that was his turning point. Which is a load of bullshit.

>>92288438
Literally what is this even supposed to mean? Are you saying that flashbacks that explain Ashi's traumatic backstory aren't relevant to the current state of Ashi's character and motivations? I hope that you aren't saying that, because that would be fucking stupid.

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>>92288644
>>92287856
>>92288511
>>92288594
>the run of this entire new season
>it's just a big "/co/ is incapable of basic literary analysis" episode

read a fucking book

>>92288680
This just in, kids are stupid! Sports at 11!

>The shithead kids in my family will act and believe the literal exact opposite of everything you tell them.
So they're stupid.

>>92288439
>jack
>getting thrown thousands of years into the future
>not having future shock
>learning what bullets are and how to dodge them in the same encounter
>believable

>>92288725
Episode 4 was full of cringe and the fight with the High Priestess was hot garbage. Go smell your own farts somewhere else.

>>92288703
>50+ years is any better than 80 years.
Again, I'm not the same person.
>have no way of knowing exactly how long Ashi and Jack have been traveling together.
And that's a self defeating argument, it's the spectator's fault that Genndy didn't direct a sense of time?

>>92288825
>I didn't like it so it doesn't count as a part of the narrative.
What kind of logic is that?
It's a part of the season and important things happen in those episodes.

>>92288815
Those things aren't his personality.

>>92288776
I sincerely hope that you're just being ironic right now, anon.

The issue at hand is that Ashi's redemption comes about because the cultists never managed to destroy her natural curiosity, to not take things at face value. Her urge to keep asking "What is this? Why is this like this?" Was Jack's In to convince her of Aku's villainy, it was what stopped her from turning off Jack's message and doubling-down on Aku's indoctrination. The need to ask those questions was not present in Ashi's sisters, which is why the cultist mother described Ashi as "unfocused" and "distracted" relative to the others.

If you think that the urge to ask questions like this makes a child "stupid" I fear for your child's future.

>>92288853
>important things happen in those episodes.
Enlighten me. Episode four had no real significant development to my eyes and the High Priestess was out of nowhere and felt like they just wanted to tie up that loose end. They couldn't even hint at her stalking them?

>>92288863
>Ashi accepting Jacks truth after an unknown timeframe is a fault of her personality
>Jack accepting the future after what is shown to be no more than 5 minutes isn't a fault of his.

>>92288836
No, it's the spectators fault for ignoring that some important character interactions (jack learning ashi's name) happen off screen, and only taking into a count what happens onscreen, assuming that events are running in real time.

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>>92285628
>given intense training for her entire life ever since she was a toddler
>deeply brainwashed for years amongst her sisters to accept Aku as their father-god and focus on nothing but assassinating his biggest enemy
>all of them but her get killed by the samurai and spends an entire episode to kill him, despite being taken as his hostage
>does an 180 personality-wise within two days of meeting the samurai because he held a ladybug and helped people she never met
>able to job an entire army composed of thousands of men with brute strength alone, despite her training to be an agile ninja assassin and her petite physique
>suddenly wants him inside her within half an episode because he poked her with his sword
>"character development"

You sure you didn't hit your head hard as a child or are you really this stupid?

>>92288866
>If you think that the urge to ask questions like this makes a child "stupid" I fear for your child's future.
Way to misunderstand me. Are children naturally curious? Yes. So they ask questions. And then, because they're dumb little kids with no considerable critical thinking skills, they believe what they're told. Also ironic that you think Ashi not taking things at face value is believable when as an adult she takes Jack's explanation for things at face value (that Aku is responsible for all the bad things he showed her) even before she heard more stories from people Jack had saved.

Posts like OP really make me think how often people socialize.

>>92288989
Wew, it's almost like you can make any synopsis sound ridiculous when you put it that cherry picked and vague

>>92289004
>have plain scorched by the heat of evil darkness magic
>"Aku, the proud and boastful caster of evil darkness magic, cast this evil darkness magic."
>"Ah, I see"
It's not like Aku is shy about his villainy, holy fuck. He practically places his nametag on acts of evil and announces himself as THE SHOGUN OF SORROW. Literally all you have to do to show someone Aku is evil is actually just show the acts of evil that Aku freely admits to committing.

>>92288936
In case you haven't noticed, Jack in the original series was very stoic and driven. So yes, I do believe that he forced his way through his shock for the sake of his purpose.

As for Ashi, that's more of a fault with the writing in general not showing her acceptance, contributing to her being unbelievable. Despite what >>92288974 thinks, it is on the show to provide a decent sense of time.

>>92289014
does talking to a cashier, count?

>>92289056
Did Ashi see any real definitive proof that it was Aku though? Because for someone to let go of lifelong beliefs, they have to be shown something undeniable.

>>92288989
>shown from the first episode to have a passion for nature
>told as a child that Jack want's to destroy the nature that Aku brought
>Person who told her this squishes innocent animals
>see's jack being gentle/grateful/appreciative towards nature
>that challenges her preconceived worldview
I don't get why this surprises you
Also>>92289056
While she was raised to believe Aku was good, the cultists never saw Aku in any way and were worshipping their own interpretation of him.

>>92289029
He about covered it all though.

>>92289029
Stating that my comment is cherrypicked without saying why just proves you want to say I'm wrong because you don't agree with me, retarded waifufag.

It's not that deep

>>92286287
This. They only had ten episodes to work with. Assuming an episode takes place over the course of a day is stupid.

>>92289120
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qbnPx9yWDg0&ab_channel=MisterGum

>>92289120
It was Aku's magic that destroyed the trees, and she knows what Aku's magic looks like (it's the magic she was surrounded by her whole life).

>>92288459
Except Aku's world has far more in common with runaway capitalism than runaway communism.

>>92288924
Episode 4 is about dismantling her view of Aku's order.

She keeps screaming and claiming that he's responsible for all the beauty and wonders in the world and that the Samurai has destroyed it all. The episode takes place inside a monstrous beast released by Aku himself that is trying to kill them both. The things they both regard as wonderful are deemed not worthy of Aku's world and not a part of his order, which makes her question her own mission and her mothers' training. Jack and her keep arguing about Aku's true nature while Jack keeps saving her life time and time again. The very end of the episode brings all of this together in the escape sequence and the ladybug scene, which is the point where Ashi's worldview breaks down, she stops being denial and decides to see the truth with her own eyes. Aku's order no longer makes sense, the questions she had in the past have been reignited, and Jack isn't the person she was told he was.

Ashi's feelings don't come out of nowhere in episode 5. It's all established in episode 4.

>>92289211
how so?

>>92289249
Because he's a faggot who doesn't know the difference between capitalism and communism.

>>92285720
>>92286750
>>92288989
>that scene of Ashi as a child seeing the light outside
>Ashi seeing the deer
Unlike her sisters, Ashi always realized that good existed, but just kept that thought suppressed.
And what more character development could we get? I agree it's kinda rushed, but they only have 10 episodes to show the plot line that they want

>>92285601
Watch out, you'll be hit with a facts that never really happened in the show.

>>92289187
Nothing definitive. Aku didn't personally welcome them. For all she knows that could be happening without Aku's approval. So she just took their words and random scenes of destruction at face value.
If you think I'm being unreasonably obtuse, congratulations, that's how even normal people act in regards to their beliefs.

>>92289189
Lol nice headcanon. Where's the proof of that?

>>92289185

OP apparently thinks that the entire 5 seasons of Samurai Jack took place within a one mile square block, so it's reasonable to conclude all this shit happened over the course of a day.

>>92289296
How did she realize those things were good?

>>92289274
How is Aku a capitalist? He did not gain his power through economic means, but through hostile takeover of existing governments. Welcome to 1917 motherfucker.

>>92289142
Your post speaks for itself to anyone whose opinion isn't steeped in bias. That includes, of course, not you.

>Disagree with me? Must be a waifufag!

Fascinating thinking capacity.

>>92289056
This, if anyone's willing to admit Aku is evil, it's Aku himself. Even if Ashi didn't fully believe Jack up to this point, actually meeting him would let her decide quick.

>>92289316
>So she just took their words and random scenes of destruction at face value.

Because Jack was literally incapable of doing all the shit he showed her.

She didn't even have to take his word for anything in THE VERY NEXT EPISODE, because she was running around talking to everyone that Jack had helped over the years.

>>92289244
>The episode takes place inside a monstrous beast released by Aku himself that is trying to kill them both.
She doesn't know for sure that Aku released it.

>The things they both regard as wonderful are deemed not worthy of Aku's world and not a part of his order
How does she know that?

>Jack and her keep arguing about Aku's true nature while Jack keeps saving her life time and time again
For all she knew Jack had something worse than death in mind for her.

There's no solid foundation to my eyes.

>>92289316
>if you think that I'm being retarded on purpose, you're correct because I AM acting retarded, because this is how close-minded people act
>because this is meant to represent how Ashi would defend her beliefs, despite the fact that the show itself takes great pains to tell you over and over again that Ashi is a naturally curious person who doesn't act like a total faggot when it comes to having their beliefs challenged
Anon, I don't think that your "I'm retarded" act is just an act.

>>92289391
>Because Jack was literally incapable of doing all the shit he showed her.
She doesn't know that. She was raised to believe that the Samurai was a blight upon the world, not just some joe from the past with who had a magic sword.

>She didn't even have to take his word for anything in THE VERY NEXT EPISODE, because she was running around talking to everyone that Jack had helped over the years.
If you go alllll the way back to here >>92289004, you'll see I specifically took issue with her acceptance before she saw more perspectives.

>>92289397
Weird that her curiosity is sated by the words of the man she was raised to despise and murder and not the words of her mother and master.

>>92289451
>She was raised to believe that the Samurai was a blight upon the world, not just some joe from the past with who had a magic sword.

And I'm sure she also noticed that he didn't use any world-burning sorcery as they were actively trying to murder him.

>you'll see I specifically took issue with her acceptance before she saw more perspectives.

We don't know if she 100% believed him at this point.

She saw children were being enslaved, and worked with Jack to free them.

Are you just pretending to be a complete retard?

>>92289382
You didnt offer any sort of rebutal to that anons post.

So im incluned to believe him over you. Sad, you should defend the show you enjoy, you should be able to see things critically and if that anon was wrong you should be able to offer a counter argument easily.

>>92289395
>She doesn't know for sure that Aku released it.
She and Jack have an entire conversation about this in the middle of the episode.

>How does she know that?
Because she's literally told so via examples by her mother in the flashbacks.

>For all she knew Jack had something worse than death in mind for her.
There's a very clear dissonance between his actions and the stories that she has heard.

You might have a point if Ashi was a mindless brainwashed drone like her sisters, but she was not.

>>92289489
>words

No, actions.

She didn't believe a word he had to say until his actions contradicted what she was taught to believe.

>>92289451
Nigger if Jack could call down rains of unholy darkness to smite the daughters of Aku like he did those trees he could have just fucking done it instead of fucking about with his guns and not-sword. This should be obvious to everyone. Besides that, do you mean to imply that the Priestesses didn't give their assassins a rundown of Jack's powers/abilities before sending them out to kill him? I hope you aren't.

>>92285601
You mean spent 20 years without ever seeing a guy. After a long battle where both warriors are nearly nude and tired.
Almost dying a hell of a drug.

>>92289525
>And I'm sure she also noticed that he didn't use any world-burning sorcery as they were actively trying to murder him.
Doesn't mean he doesn't have any. It all could have been a ruse. He did still murder all her sisters in the end, didn't he?

>We don't know if she 100% believed him at this point.
She straight up said she did and then made the assumption that they were going to team up to save the world.

Don't call me retarded just because I didn't let Genndy pull the waifuwool over my eyes.

>>92289555
>No, actions.
Which also didn't provide anything definitive. He could have had any number of insidious motivations behind them, but she just took them at face value.

>>92288594
>soviet union was an ok gov.
The same government where the political elite pulled strings to get their kids to work at the first McDonald's in the country?

You sure about that?

>>92289556
>Besides that, do you mean to imply that the Priestesses didn't give their assassins a rundown of Jack's powers/abilities before sending them out to kill him?
I do mean to imply, and since we didn't see it happen and the cultists weren't shown to be super tactical analysts you can't argue against it.

And overt displays of powers aren't the only way to do shit. Ever hear of tricksters, anon?

>>92285720
>Which is never shown. Wow such character development

people over co freaking out about how much ashi got too much screen time and then this faggot comes and sprouts out the most stupid thing i've heard today
bravo anon bravo

>>92289588
>Doesn't mean he doesn't have any. It all could have been a ruse.
All you're proving at this point is that you have significantly less critical thinking skills than a brainwashed 20-something year old.

>She straight up said she did and then made the assumption that they were going to team up to save the world.

No, she straight up said, "What are we going to do (about the enslaved children)?

You anti-Jack fags are even worse than the fucking shippers on this board.

If you want to criticize the show, at least criticize it about things that actually happened.

>>92289655
>the Priestesses weren't tactical
Are you fucking stupid? The priestesses were operator as fuck, they trained the 8 daughters to be operator as fuck, and you see in their training montages that the obstacle courses and live-fire training missions were also operator as fuck. They were serious women conducting serious business in a serious manner, and their business was murder.

>Overt displays of power aren't the only way to do shit
Except burning down a forest of holy trees is definitely an overt display of power and not the work of a trickster, you stupid FUCKING retard.


This is your last (you), spend it wisely.

>>92289029
Name one thing that isn't fact.

>>92289612
>Which also didn't provide anything definitive. He could have had any number of insidious motivations behind them, but she just took them at face value.

According to your bizarre headcanon, there is absolutely nothing that would ever possibly prove to Ashi that Jack was not evil, by either word, action, or evidence.

There were obviously things that made Ashi question her beliefs through her interactions with Jack, that as a human being, were both believable and relatable.

If you want to write a one dimensional character, you can make your own show that nobody will ever watch because you don't understand basic human traits.

>>92289451
>find factory full of mindcontrolled tortured children
>get tortured by the owner of said factory
>he gloats about how incapable of hurting innocents jack is
>she sees jack on the verge of being murdered because he is holding back against children
>jack leaves to kill himself because he thinks the kids are dead(by someone elses doing)
you don't think this might be impactful on her?

>>92289672
>All you're proving at this point is that you have significantly less critical thinking skills than a brainwashed 20-something year old.
Or more, because I'm not just accepting things as they appear on the surface.

>No, she straight up said, "What are we going to do (about the enslaved children)?
See>>92289187
Skip to 1:30. She asks the question before they even learns that the children are enslaved.

>>92289788
You also forgot to mention the guy gloating about child soldiers.

>>92289749
you don't know what cherry picking means do you?
also your time frames are wrong

>>92289725
>>the Priestesses weren't tactical
Way to twist my words. I said they weren't shown to be super tactical analysts, which they weren't.

>implying tricksters can't do overt things as well tricks

>>92289788
All of that is arguably a different perspective from Jack's. Shifting goalposts a little here, but I'm still sticking to the spirit of my argument. And she still accepted Jack's view before it happened.

>>92289795
>Or more, because I'm not just accepting things as they appear on the surface.

No, that's called pseudoskepticism, a dismissal of evidence, without refuting the evidence, or offering an explanation with greater evidence.

Its a staple of creationists, global warming deniers, and apparently people who make nonsensical posts trying to shit on good cartoons.

>>92289782
What bizarre headcanon? That indoctrinated cultists shouldn't be so quick to shed beliefs they've held onto and built their identities around? I'm not the one lacking understanding in this exchange.

>>92289916
It's a staple for people who don't want to think in general anon.

>>92289952
Well it's not like she believed him all at once. It took him saving her life multiple times to even let her drop her guard to listen to him, and seeing countless atrocities before she started to realize some of what she saw was wrong.

The final transition was the next episode where she kept running into people affected by the Samurai.

>>92289916
It's just regular skepticism, anon. Sorry that I think Ashi was way too eager to accept a perspective that violently clashed with the one she was raised with after a little tour where nothing truly undeniable was shown to her. But you know there are only so many episodes so what can you do? Gotta get that contrived romance subplot up and running!

>>92289847
I'm not him, and cherrypicking still means you're telling facts. And it wasn't cherrypicking, all that he said was the full extent of what happened. I think it's you that doesn't know what cherypicking is.

>>92290011
>The final transition was the next episode where she kept running into people affected by the Samurai.
Right, and it would have been fine if she hadn't already accepted his version of things before that even happened. Everything that Jack did and showed her was enough to cast doubt, but not enough to believably convince her.

If it had been
>I need to find the Samurai! I need him to show me more because my beliefs are up in the air!
Instead of
>I need to find the Samurai! He could be in danger and I care very much about that even though I was raised not to really care about that!
And then on the way all the stories and different perspectives and happy people really hammered it home that her beliefs were wrong, then that would have been better. It was just a poor use of time. She already had the whole episode practically to herself.

>>92290044

By definition, it's pseudoskepticism.

We can also add projecting to that.

Your mistake is thinking that Ashi is you.

We've already explained multiple times how it wasn't a sudden change, how questioning beliefs works, and the things which caused her to question her beliefs, as evidenced by the actual show itself, and what happened in the show.

You can't accept that you're ridiculously wrong, so believe that Ashi shouldn't be able to accept she was ridiculously wrong.

But Ashi isn't you.

You're a faggot.

>There are people in this thread that genuinely believe a curious young woman would be as skeptical as a 4chan autist

>>92290249

>>92290228
>By definition, it's pseudoskepticism.
Or, you know, just not taking things at face value.

>Your mistake is thinking that Ashi is you.
What? I'm just saying that an indoctrinated cultist should be unreasonably attached to their beliefs and that Ashi's natural curiosity is paradoxical in the sense that she didn't believe her mom but believed Jack when he showed her a bunch of crap that did not definitively disprove her perspective and prove his.

Don't get assmad because I'm not taking the waifubait.

>>92290369
Now I know you're b8ing.

>>92290369
>don't believe something about the outside world told to you while living in a cave your whole live.
>believe something about the outside world that you see with your own eyes, hear with your own ears, touch with your own hands.
>somehow paradoxical

>>92290400
If that's what you want to believe, anon. Don't let me keep you from your vicarious self-insert romance.

>>92285601
>overnight

She's been travelling with jack for weeks, maybe even a month or two

>>92290441
Did she see Aku blasting people? Did she hear Aku laughing evilly about how wicked he is? Did she touch Aku's evil? No.

She saw some bad things that Jack said was the doing of Aku and then saw some guy saying that Aku definitely welcomes criminals. Not enough, in other words.

>>92290446
Where did you get that from?

>>92290541
Watching the show

>>92290541
fucking autist

>>92290520
>the most pointlessly elaborate ruse ever, nearly costing him his life multiple times, some on her behalf, for no reason whatsoever
Vs
>Maybe mom was wrong

Your inability to understand human beings is not a fault of the show, it's a fault of yours.

>>92290520
She went to the great city of Aku, which has his face plastered on billboards, his name on every street corner, and a wanted poster with jacks face on every building.
When they then go to the tower and see the banished criminals arrival, he asks the lobbyman very clearly "I hear Aku welcomes those like me"
and gets "most enthusiastically!" as a response before being sent to pillage and destroy a village filled with children.

>>92290706
How hard is it to understand that when it comes to personal beliefs, especially ones you were raised with, people are far from rational and accepting? It's not hard. It's also not hard to understand that Ashi's natural curiosity shouldn't have been satisfied from just how little Jack showed her, you autist. You're the one who doesn't understand human beings.

> All these years of hype climaxed in ten weeks of ship wars.

>>92290760
>which has his face plastered on billboards
She wasn't shown to have seen them or have been disturbed by them. In fact they weren't even shown to exist.
>his name on every street corner
See above.
>a wanted poster with jacks face on every building
See above.
>When they then go to the tower and see the banished criminals arrival, he asks the lobbyman very clearly "I hear Aku welcomes those like me"
and gets "most enthusiastically!" as a response before being sent to pillage and destroy a village filled with children.
Did he say he was a violent criminal? No. He could have just as easily been banished for political crimes. Maybe he has the mace and armor because space is dangerous. Did he say he was going to destroy and pillage that village? No. Maybe he goes to live there to protect it from any evil followers the Samurai might have.

Obviously to us, the viewer, it's clear what is being shown. But if you put yourself in Ashi's shoes, what does she see? Nothing definitive, unless she just takes it all at face value. Which is out of line with her ostensible curious nature.

>>92290936
The show should've been about suicide Jack!

Thread theme song https://youtu.be/NWEd8yDEURc

>>92290831
It's impossible to even remotely believe your autistic interpretation due to the extreme you take your pseudoskepticism.

The fact that every single human being on this board completely disagrees with your bizarre interpretation of how humans behave should tell you something.

Being raised to believe weird shit is a thinf, but so is cognitive dissonance, and adopting new beliefs from New evidence.

>people complain about Ashi getting too much screentime and attention
>same people complain about Ashi's character developing too quickly without enough intermediate steps
>better character development means more screentime


Damned if you do, damned if you don't.

>>92291003
>In fact they weren't even shown to exist.
Nice job outing yourself as having never seen the original show.

>>92291190
That's why people don't like Ashi, retard, she's a worthless addition that was poorly done because they only had 10 episodes to introduce her, develop her and have her with Jack YET they still went through with it.

Ashi shouldn't exist because she is a detriment to the quality of the show given the circumstances, and Genndy is a hack for not realizing the problem with her character. Ashi literally could've not being made well with 10 episodes, probably in 26, but having 10 just proves Genndy's lack of judgement.

>>92291181
Anon, I can't help that you can't acknowledge the inconsistency and poor construction of Ashi's character. She's curious enough to avoid indoctrination, but not curious enough to want some really solid evidence?

>>92291215
In the city that Ashi goes into, none of those things are shown to be present. She is not shown to see or react to them if they are there. Way to out yourself as not paying any attention.

>>92287117
tbf, they could have been taught social skills as part of their training (for tracking), and you pick them up naturally as a toddler/child just by virtue of communicating with and observing others, while others like eye contact are inherent. She had her sisters, mother, and the other cult members (who could probably pass on their own socialization from being born on the outside). Sociocultural norms are the things they'd have trouble picking up without any exposure to the outside world or explicit teaching, e.g. how to greet someone, table rules.

>>92285720
GUYS

HES JUST PRETENDING TO BE RETARDED REALLY!

>>92291433

Aside from the time he learned to jump good, Jack had absolutely no character development during the entire first four seasons after the premier.

He's absolutely no different from one episode compared to any other episode.

>>92291568
Alright first, he did learn, not necessarily character development but he did changed, let alone that he made relationships with the Scotsman.
Second, Jack did had a reason to change drastically in the first place, he had a mission, go back to the past, that's it, as the honorable Samurai archetype that he is it makes sense that he didn't lose his way.

And third, if you are bringing this up as a "defense" on why Ashi's development as a character is shit, then it's wrong. Ashi was an assassin and ended as Jack's romance interest, there has to be some fucking development inbetween, and it has to be good and well paced. It's not like Ashi was always a good person, she changed, it just so happens that her change was shit, in part because of the 10 episode limit.

>>92291494
Way to run around with those goalposts like a retard who gave his social worker the slip.

You already admitted nothing would ever change her mind, because nothing will ever change your mind.

>>92291568
Yeah but Jack never really had to change in an episodic series, did he? Things are different with this latest season anon. Ashi and Jack are both shown to be set up for development right from the start and plot points are set up to be resolved.

>>92291725
>You already admitted nothing would ever change her mind
Actually I did. I posted that what Jack showed her was enough to cast doubt, but not enough to disprove her perspective while proving his. If Ashi had instead entered a begrudging partnership with Jack in the pursuit of truth instead of just accepting what he says, that would have been good. Then once Jack runs off after the kids "die", Ashi could pursue him -still intent to learn the truth- and then the cameo tour could show her that holy shit, Aku really did mess up all these people and Jack saved them.

Then the Omen scene would have real weight as Ashi professed how she learned the truth and saw the hope that Jack had brought to the world. That would have been a satisfying conclusion to her face-heel-turn and a good catalyst for Jack to begin his redemption.

Fucking fight me.

>>92287944
Have you ever thought that some of us appreciate traditional narratives and just want to see Jack find happiness after decades of loneliness and misery? Or that people think she's a good complement to Jack? Most people watching the show aren't interested in banging drawings, anon, they're regular people who want to hear a story. And by far and large most people are happy with the story so far.

Anyone who think's that Ashi making a heel face turn within a couple days is realistic is a fucking moron.

Take Jonestown for example, people were so indoctrinated that they killed themselves because they were told to. And those people were not born into the cult, Ashi was, she would be in even deeper than they were.

>>92291888
>we don't care if something it's good or bad as long as it's cute and they look good together and awww i'm going to share this on facebook!

You are the cancer killing western animation

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>>92288046
This has to be bait.

- Ashi isn't a self-insert, nor is she a mary sue strong woman type character. She literally spent an entire episode tied up and carried around by a much stronger male character and has gotten her ass handed to her multiple times by men.
- Genndy wanted to introduce Ashi in the original run, well before the tumblr subculture emerged. She's HIS character, not a self-insert.
- Ashi and her story exists almost entirely to drive Jack's story.
- Ashi went from training in isolation from the world to falling in love with the first man who showed her kindness. There is a reason why tumblr is having a conniption over the relationship (just like you, faggot).

Just because a female character exists and isn't completely helpless doesn't make it 'SJW' pandering or whatever. Grow up and stop trying to find reasons to get offended. It's embarrassing. You're literally no better than tumblr.

>>92291886
>Actually I did.
Didn't, is what I meant to say.

>>92291886
>but not enough to disprove her perspective while proving his.

Yes, because like you, you believe nothing would ever disprove her perspective, because everything could be a trick.

We heard you be wrong the first time, there's no need to repeat yourself.

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>>92288439
>believable
>ultra-attractive serene, kind, self-sacrificing lone warrior with monkish levels of discipline and mastery of every fighting style and weapon known to man
>giant old-school walking stereotype whose traits interests never deviate from those of the caricature he's modeled off of
>believable

Do you live in a sitcom or something?

DOBT YOU GET IT YOU FUCKING MORONS? GENNDY WANTS YOU TO MEET A NICE GIRL, BE HAPPY, AND START A FAMILY.

>>92292251
>attractive
Where did you get this from, literally nobody in the original run ever lusts for jack, ever.
>mastery of every fighting style and weapon known to man
So martial arts and sword wielding means you know everything? When did Jack ever fired a gun but Season 5?
>monks/fighters with similar traits of those Jack had don't exist
I'm not going to say he's original, but he is believable, stop shitposting.

A big problem I notice with people saying things are rushed is this; one episode does not equal one day, and each episode doesn't take place directly the day after the last one. They could've been trapped in the Alaskan Bull Worm for days, and they probably spent days to a week traveling in episode 5. Ashi definitely spent weeks searching for jack in episode 6, and we don't know how long it took them to reach the place jack lost his sword. And an unclear length of time has passed between episode 7 and 8 because obviously it's gonna take some time for jack to readjust to his old self and for the two of them to get that close.

It's far more likely the season has covered months of in-universe time, it's obviously not a 10 episode season covering 10 days of time. Samurai jack is not fucking 24, Genndy loves to start episodes in media res and he's never showed the whole journey, even in the first 4 seasons.

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>>92292333
>Where did you get this from, literally nobody in the original run ever lusts for jack, ever.

Jack is so popular he has fangirls getting signed wanted posters.

>>92292379
just because you imply time "passed" it doesn't mean the development is vaild or good

you have to show, not tell.

>>92286606
Ashi was NEVER evil, seriously how do people not see this. Her view of what was good was just warped by the cult. They were trying to kill jack because they thought it was a good thing to do, not just to be evil dicks. The 7 daughters were never evil just misguided and lied to.

>>92292379
A thousand times this.
He learned her name offscreen, there's no telling what other topics were covered off screen

>>92292420
and we have been shown, sufficiently so. Why are you people so obsessed over this?

>>92285720
>Ashi should be like those people who have been locked up away since birth to adulthood. Those people come out like a 5 year old in a adult's body with major psychological issues.

You think those people stand a chance against Samurai fucking Jack? There were several other cultists besides her sisters. Also, the high priestess notes something that had been shown through pretty much every single one of her appearances: She was naturally curious and critical. Unlike her sisters.

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>>92292415
>hurr durr fujoshits lust over jack so he is ultra attractive in-universe

>>92292447
>I like your dress
>*gasp* or hands touched each other so awkward X3
>You are very troubled
>walking in a desert
>...

Not really

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>>92292466
>Jack is drawn as conventionally attractive and shown to have female admirers

>what do you mean he's supposed to be attractive?

>>92292523
>shown to have female admirers
[citation needed]

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Where my Jashibros at?

>>92292420
It's called inference, you autist.

They already show them traveling all the damn time, they don't need to take a few minutes out of every episode to show Jack shitting, when it's implied that he poops.

>>92292233
>ignoring my post except for the one line you can greentext to set up a witty comeback
Very transparent of you, anon.

Let me spell it out for you, you ridiculous retard.

>ashi is shown to be inquisitive and doubtful early on
>but she still accepts her mission to kill the samurai and treats her sisters' deaths flippantly, showing she received some degree of indoctrination
>samurai captures her
>she doesn't trust him
>his actions clash with her perspective
>but due to her inquisitiveness and distrust, she should still retain suspicion (and she does)
>samurai does the ladybug thing
>curiosity sparked
>demands the truth
>samurai shows her a bunch of things, the only really concerning one of which is the criminal refugee
>everything else can be reasonably denied, because there is no direct proof of aku's involvement shown
>just the samurai's words
>at this point ashi should NOT accept jack's version of things unreservedly (which she does, watch the fucking clip)
>but instead should be very doubtful of her beliefs and desire more answers, in keeping with her inquisitiveness and distrust of the samurai
>kid thing happens
>second piece of proof in jack's favor that does not come from jack himself
>kids are kill
>but not really
>jack runs
>ashi should follow, but the primary reason for this should be her quest for truth
>NOT concern for the samurai's well being
>along the way she sees more and more proof from more and more sources in favor of jack's perspective
>ashi's makeover has more weight this way, symbolizing her current metamorphosis instead of just being something that happens because she already accepted jack's version, remember?
>she arrives at the graveyard
>omen scene has more weight because it had more set-up
>ashi's face-heel-turn or whatever is now believable, having a proper build up

It's not fucking rocket science.

>>92292619
>why should we writte actual character and relationship development when we can just say they walked from point A to point B and people will eat it up?

>>92290831
Let me break it down for you-

* Ashi lived in a cave her own life being fed ideas but displayed natural skepticism and curiosity about the outside world
* This was done primarily through short scenes and symbols because most readers can pick up on what these scenes and symbols mean and it saves time
* Ashi's transformation took a matter of weeks or months but was illustrated with symbols and scenes. The ladybug didn't make her immediately change her mind, it was symbolic of the compassion Jack displayed towards herself and others compared to her callous mother and acted as a realization that sewed the seeds of doubt in her mind. She didn't make a 180 after seeing him with the kids, her change in tone resulted from the culmination of weeks of traveling with Jack and observing his character, but the scene served as an illustration as to why Ashi's opinion of Jack changed. It's impossible for any writer to show the audience a complete transformation of a character. That's why they rely on other techniques to show the reader that the character is developing. Failing to understand this is like failing to understand what a montage is for.

>>92290831
I've seen kids renounce Christianity real fucking easily, and that's a religion taught to you from birth without the abuse, something that could make you very easily resent someone for.

If I was in her position, I'd search for the quickest way out from the Cult myself

>>92288123
I thought hillary's corruption and the general public's dissapointment with the electoral choices is why trump won

>>92292664
Dude as well written and explanatory your observation is you know you are trying to educate a bunch brick walls known as fags rights?

>>92292672
Fucking this.

It's annoying to see someone say "OMG HOW COULD ASHI BETRAY HER FAMILY SO EASILY?!"

Because there's nothing fucking there for her, retards.

She was taught not to care about anyone or anything but the goal, and on top of that she was fucking abused.

If your father abused you from childhood, you wouldn't think "Wow, I sure love my dad! Can't wait to spend more time with him!"

You'd take the first chance out you'd get.

>>92291433
>That's why people don't like Ashi

Most people enjoy Ashi. It's just half of /co/ and tumblr that are complaining.

>she's a worthless addition

She's incredibly important for Jack's character development.

>they only had 10 episodes to introduce her, develop her and have her with Jack

The pacing was off in a few episodes, but otherwise they did a good job developing her and their relationship with the time they had. They placed numerous symbols and vignettes throughout the season to show her character development, but the autists at /co/ somehow managed to miss them.

>Ashi shouldn't exist because she is a detriment to the quality of the show

Speak for yourself; many Jackfags wanted Jack to have some happiness in his life, and Genndy wasn't allowed to put Ashi in the original seasons, so he's working with what he can.

>in 26

This is ridiculous. SJ isn't nearly complicated enough to need 26 episodes to develop and conclude the story.

>having 10 just proves Genndy's lack of judgement.

Not his fault.

>>92292651
Oh, great, it's another "Why didn't Gennedy write his show the way IIIIII wanted him to WAAAAAAAHHHHH" post.

Do us all a favor and kill yourself. You're even worse than a filthy shipper.

>>92292654
Because he did, and even the extent he did it has still made shitters scream "WHY IS THERE SO MUCH FOCUS ON HER!?"

>>92292025
>Muh grimdark! Cartoons can't be good unless the MC is a tortured lone ranger and the story concludes in misery! Fuck traditional narratives that have been staple since the dawn of humanity I want everything to be brooding and edgy!

Go back to watching capeshit. SJ has always been a traditional story, and you're a tard for expecting anything different than a satisfying traditional ending.

>>92285601
Another cuck who bitches about the show. This season is literally only 10 episodes. If it were longer, they would be able to add extra things about Ashi not being civilized.

>>92292842
What I suggested is a very minor change to execution to help the pacing. Believe it or not, season 5 of Samurai Jack has flaws and I'm allowed to criticize them and back up my criticisms. Sorry if you aren't getting the masturbatory echo chamber you wanted.

Maybe you could try an actual rebuttal instead of a whiny shitpost?

>>92289342

By not being autistic.

>>92292917
You're putting words in that anon's mouth. Where did he say any of that?

>>92292946
If you would like to talk about flaws, there are many subtle ones with the animation, such as there being too many sisters on-screen at once, or having them randomly change weapons in the middle of a fight.

Your autistic screeching isn't a flaw of the show.

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Spends his entire life in constant danger and riding on his motorcycle with no social interaction with anyone else other then his hallucination and knowing next to nothing of the future except that he hates it. In a single minute, he suddenly turns into a well functioning normie whose only flaw is that he got a little angry. He should be a autistic mess with no clue how to interact with people and a psychological mess from having his entire worldview shattered and the memories of the past 50 years of pain and misery having been for nothing. Explain how 50 years of hatred and misery suddenly disappears over a tea session. Explain this you fucking hacks.

>>92292993
>complaining about animation inconsistencies in Samurai Jack
So you never watched the original, huh?

I also fail to see how my post is autistic screeching.

>>92292333
>Where did you get this from, literally nobody in the original run ever lusts for jack, ever.

You have to be joking...

>So martial arts and sword wielding means you know everything? When did Jack ever fired a gun but Season 5?

Are you autistic? Jack was sent around the world to learn fighting techniques from every major culture. He's adept with every weapon he picks up.

>I'm not going to say he's original, but he is believable

I've never met a man who's humble, self-sacrificing, focused, wise, polite, stoic, strictly adhering to an honor code, good at every fighting technique he picks up, an expert military strategist even with technology he's never seen, extremely disciplined but kind to the point of being exploited, etc. Most men are mediocre and have at best maybe two or three of the more realistic of these qualities. You're confusing 'male hero fantasy' with 'believable'.

>>92292946
Can you believe that people are allowed to refute your criticisms? This is how we prevent echo chambers.

You fucking hypocrite.

>>92293110
>Explain this you fucking hacks.
It was rushed.

>>92292740
True. It's just so shocking that so many people ON A FORUM FOR DISCUSSING A NARRATIVE MEDIUM are seemingly incapable of understanding basic narrative techniques. So I keep taking the bait.

>>92293113
>Are you autistic?
I think it's been demonstrated beyond the shadow of a doubt that the anon you're responding to is a very low functioning autist.

>>92293121
I invited an actual rebuttal. Generalizing my post and then telling me to kill myself is not a rebuttal. It's a shitpost.

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Spends his entire life in constant isolation and masturbating to his waifus with no social interaction with anyone else other then his anons and knowing next to nothing of the big companies except that he hates them. In a single minute, he suddenly turns into a well functioning normie whose only flaw is that he started a shitty image board. He should be an autistic mess with no clue how to interact with people and a psychological mess from having his entire worldview shattered and the memories of the past 14 years of masturbation and waifuing having been for nothing. Explain how 14 years of hatred and misery suddenly disappears over a job offer. Explain this you fucking virgins.

>>92292543
You were literally just told he has them and signs autographs for them. Did you ever watch the original series?

>>92292572

S

>>92293110
This sounds less like the actual character and more like you projecting your headcanon.

>>92285720
you should watch the show some time

>>92291494
>want some really solid evidence
maybe she got tired of getting the shit beat out of her every time she asked a question. You remember how they showed that happening, right?

>>92292025
>my opinions dictate what's good
I remember being 14 too

>>92293335
That's the joke.

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>>92293113
>I've never met a man who's humble, self-sacrificing, focused, wise, polite, stoic, strictly adhering to an honor code
Because they are training? Not everyone lives the same live of a pleb you do, retard.
>He's adept with every weapon he picks up
What? Swords, spears, hammers sometimes, that's it. Everyone that trained his whole life should know how to use one, Jack not ONCE ever grabs a gun and starts using it like he knew what it even do.
>an expert military strategist even with technology he's never seen
When did Jack ever did this? and please use examples instead of muh "uh you have to be joking".

>>92293396
Facts dictate what's good, and the fact is that SJ S5 is no better than pretty much anything else airing right now besides art direction, if you can't see that It's not my fault you are a pleb.

>>92288123
>SJWs are the reason why trump won
I really want to hear your reasoning here, seeing as every sjw ever has been railing against him as a sexist since hillary started losing it on stage then had to get tossed into her van like a side of beef.

>>92293460
>When did Jack ever did this? and please use examples instead of muh "uh you have to be joking".

The second fucking episode, you stupid fucking normie.

Dude manages to make ersatz catapults out of excavators, weaponize mining products, and turn rocket ships into booby traps, while also planning and executing the entire battle with the help of one alien horse.

>>92293527
*third episode, actually.

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>>92293498
shoo shoo

Gotta smash

Smash dat ass

>>92293501
>every sjw ever has been railing against him as a sexist
That's why he won.
They were an endorsement for Trump in their sheer vitrolic retardation against him.
You can only hear "RACIST SEXIST NAZI", in that exact order, every time, until you start hoping he wins just so these people will cry.

>>92293501
People are sick of SJWs and since there's a natural reaction to say "fuck you and fuck your side" people voted against the candidate for SJWs

>>92293121
>people are allowed to refute your criticisms
>waaaaaaaaaah kill yourself
>refute

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>>92293527
>booby traps
>catapults
>spikes
>cliffs
>horse
>a bow

Holy shit the weapons in the future must be incredible how did Jack knew how to use such fucking advanced and unbelievable weaponry so quickly and efficiently? WOW

Maybe he should've punched the entire army to death, now THAT would've been well written.

>>92285601
instinct

>>92293460
>Facts dictate what's good
It's been made abundantly clear you people unironically regard your opinions as facts

>>92293640
Now name all the skills you would have had to developed to forge each of those things from scratch using material you've never worked with before, and employ them almost single-handedly against an army of killer robots.

And, oh yeah, win.

>>92293688
Are you saying the pacing and writing in Season 5 is good? Because that to me sounds like an opinion.

>>92293460
>Jack never uses a gun

Did you even see the previews of the new season?

>When was he a strategist?

In the earlier seasons, he would set traps for an impending army with advanced technology.

If you don't remember that, you're a total newfag.

>>92293708
Not being retarded?
>hmm these crystals look pretty sharp
>let's put a stick in it
>BOOM now it's a spear

>let's get a string
>let's get a curved piece of metal
>BOOM now it's bow

Holy shit how did he figure that out?

>>92293720
>new season
Yes, now 50 years later, now it makes sense.
>with advanced technology
[citation needed]

>>92293709
Pacing has issues. The writing is actual kino hampered by said paxcing issues. How's my opinion?

>Still being this salty 5 days later

>>92285601

The 'indoctrination' she went through was pretty fucking weak, I imagine if the other girls had survived longer even they probably would have changed their mindsets like Ashi eventually.

I mean, the mother said that Jack was manipulative, but what would she have done if, while looking for Jack, the girls had come across all the people he helped like Ashi had done? As well as all the people who expressly say Aku is at fault for the shitty world. I really just don't get what the mother was expecting sending them out into the world with that weak a reason.

>>92293830
Well opinions can't be wrong, but if I had to describe it I would say it's shitty.

>>92293844
YOUR SALTY XD OUR SHIP IS CANON LOL

>>92293787
That dude did a shit job expressing himself, but remember the original point was
>an expert military strategist even with technology he's never seen

>>92293460
>Because they are training? Not everyone lives the same live of a pleb you do, retard.

There are very few people on this earth who are both good and everything they pick up and have literally no negative traits. Not to mention that Ashi spent her life training. No less realistic than Jack.

>What? Swords, spears, hammers sometimes, that's it. Everyone that trained his whole life should know how to use one, Jack not ONCE ever grabs a gun and starts using it like he knew what it even do.

There are numerous episodes where Jack immediately becomes good at a weapon he picks up, along with technology such as the flying suit and the transportation fish.

>Jack not ONCE ever grabs a gun and starts using it like he knew what it even do.

Except that he did...

>When did Jack ever did this? and please use examples instead of muh "uh you have to be joking".

Confirmed for not watching the original seasons. He literally did that in the second episode.

>>92293887
The point here is that he doesn't use the technology, he uses the materials. At one point he literally rips apart pieces of metal from structures to make an armor out of them. Jack's knowledge of weaponry is primitive and it shows, but his strategy skills aren't.

>>92293787
Go make a functional hunting bow, them come back and tell me "durr easy".

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>>92285720
>Which is never shown. Wow such character development.

>>92293858
that's fair, but you failed to consider that my opinions > your opinions

>>92293865
well, aren't you?

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>>92293929
I didn't practice bowing with fucking robin hood, retard.

Jack SHOULD know how to use and make a bow. Did you even watch the original?

>>92293865
Well, that post doesn't make you sound salty at all.

>>92293920
>on the second episode
>>92293640

>>92293977
>>92294001
Go back to tumblr please.

>>92293606
>>92293598
oh ok that is fair I guess.

>>92293245
How did you get this picture of me?

>>92293865
Wow, thank you for proving me right.

>>92294041
>p-pls leave

>>92294060
So you admit you're from tumblr then? wew. i knew waifushits and shipfags were on a new whole level of retardation

>>92294019
He was shown to be an expert military strategist in the second chapter, adapting machines he couldn't have even dreamt about to work as weapons in a matter of hours. What's your point?

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>>92294041
Yep, not salty at all. Not a dingle grain of salt anywhere near this chum.

>>92285601
Hahaha you are an idiot

>>92294206
That edit is fucked up. Why are there two letters on that one cat's outfit? Whoever made this needs to be gassed.

>>92294155
He literally took the metal from the construction site and a couple of the crystals and made weapons out of them, nothing more.

>>92294253
Not enough cats I guess