frozen -- elsa was supposed to be the villain at some point.

Well it's based on the story of the Ice Queen, so it's got some basis.

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>>89332331
Disney was trying to adapt "The Snow Queen" since the time Walt Disney was alive, so it's been in pre-production and production for literally decades. During that time, the project was handed to various teams, each of who tried to spin the story around into something that would work and feel like the Disney movie they wanted to make. So there's been shitloads of various story iterations, tons of concept art of what the characters could be, and the Snow Queen character was indeed villainous in many of them.


However, the version that was finally, eventually greenlighted into production proper was the one where they gave up on trying to make an adaptation of the Snow Queen fairytale, and instead just wrote a new story "inspired by" it. But quite late, Elsa was still somewhat villainous, so much that a clip of her casting snow spells on a mountaintop, still villainous, even made it to some trailer version iirc. She was finally rewritten to be just misunderstood tragic and frightened instead of bitter and vengeful after Let It Go was written.

In general the whole project was a huge clusterfuck till the end. They were still rewriting shit literally 5 months before premiere - for example the song "For the First Time in Forever" got WRITTEN AND COMPOSED in June 2013, when the movie came out in November. It's absolutely insane, and that's why the animation is so shit in places and the plot isn't as polished as it could be, because they kept changing it until it sort of "felt right". But some stuff with bitchy villainous Elsa even made it to the merch, the rewrite came so late.

>>89332331
https://a.tumblr.com/tumblr_n1jnjkxvJ01qdny4ho1.mp3#_=_
Evil Elsa is pretty hot

>>89333388
>But some stuff with bitchy villainous Elsa even made it to the merch,

Pics plz

>>89333417
>https://a.tumblr.com/tumblr_n1jnjkxvJ01qdny4ho1.mp3#_=_
She sounds and talks like a villain from a Spider-Man show.

>>89333417

>Dat voice

Muh dick

For some point, i want in frozen 2, Elsa is brainwashed so she became evil.

https://youtu.be/_ah3zQOVims

>>89333388
>Disney was trying to adapt "The Snow Queen" since the time Walt Disney was alive, so it's been in pre-production and production for literally decades.

oh wow. i had no idea. great post, anon.

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>>89332331

Long story short:

disney wanted to adapt Snow Queen, modern Disney decided to twist it a bit, making Gerda and Ice Queen sisters, renamed them Anna and Elsa, they did research on the sister relationships, they wanted to make a deeper movie, unfortunately it all went to shit when exec heard the Let It Go song and thought this movie would be succesful if Elsa wasn't a villain.

unfortunately, he was right, and as a result we got Frozen, complete bastardization of the original tale, which practically became the "Lion King" of our times.


as a result they made

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>>89333388

>>89334119

little girls wont care, Elsa is a strong independent woman!

>>89334119
Yeah, and the shadows are also completely fucked in a lot of scenes. It was a rush job and it shows

>>89334221

Little girls don't care that Elsa is a strong independent woman. They like her because she's pretty.

Most Disney Animation gets extensive rewrites.

Tangled was originally going to be a Shrek style post modern comedy (Rapunzel Unbraided), then they redid it to give the film a painted look (there's a few seconds of footage, it looked great), then after Chicken Little flopped hard, they decided that they should go back to doing more traditional fairy tales and it became Tangled.

Zootopia was going to have predators wearing shock collars (there's a storyboard floating around and it was surprisingly dark).

Moana, based on the unused songs on the OST was originally going to have Maui worshipped rather than seen as the person who doomed the world, Moana was going to be trained as a hero under him, the "we were explorers" stuff was explained by Moana's father rather than kept secret and the lava god originally looked like an old crone.

>>89334092
>unfortunately it all went to shit when exec heard the Let It Go song and thought this movie would be succesful if Elsa wasn't a villain.
in the end that song was one of the few good things about the movie. god that woman can sing.

>>89334317

SHE GOT SUPERPOWERS

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>>89333447
I'm not sure if there's more of it, but the colouring book picture that anon posted is based on this deleted song
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2Sgr9Ro3Oxc

In the lyrics of the song, the sisters mention a prophecy. The story used to involve a prophecy about Arendelle getting a ruler with a frozen heart who will cover the land under eternal winter unless a sword sacrifice happens. People in Arendelle were openly worried about Elsa because of that; they thought she would some day turn evil.

I'm guessing this version would still have Elsa redeemed at the end. It probably had Elsa built up as the red herring villain, but then there would've been the twist of Hans being the one with a (metaphorical) frozen heart, and the sword sacrifice was about Anna preventing the prophecy by saving her sister.

"Let it go" it was once supposed to be the villain song where Elsa embraces her role as the bad guy. If you listen to the lyrics, it could still work nicely for a villain, like for example in this fan-made clip that has a slightly more aggressive tone:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1xGmx4K81Hc

However, Disney liked Idina Menzel's rendition of the song too much. She made the character feel so vulnerable and tragic that they decided to drop Elsa's bitchy/villainous qualities. For comparison, notice how unperturbed and callous Elsa appears in "Life's too short" when Anna tells her about the fjord being frozen over. But in the final movie, her character is depicted a lot more empathetic and fragile; learning about the situation gives her a mental breakdown.

>>89334468
This is true, but Frozen had major rewrites ridiculously late in the game. Even Zootopia's re-writes were considered "last-minute" and that was more than twice as long before release as Frozen's.

>Moana, based on the unused songs on the OST was originally going to have Maui worshipped rather than seen as the person who doomed the world, Moana was going to be trained as a hero under him, the "we were explorers" stuff was explained by Moana's father rather than kept secret and the lava god originally looked like an old crone.
Maui was originally going to be the protagonist. Then Musker and Clements did more research and got ideas for an original story with an OC.

>>89334468
>Zootopia was going to have predators wearing shock collars (there's a storyboard floating around and it was surprisingly dark).

you forgot about reels, concept art, documentary similar to "sweatbox", even abandoned toy models.

shit was insane how dep the rabbit hole go.
it's disturbing.

>>89334549
>Maui was originally going to be the protagonist.
The movie would have been better for it.

>>89334707

they didn't have time. also there was a version where moana had like 7 brothers.

they cut corners, in the land of monsters and they reused Flash from Zootopia(they put mask on him) and Snowball monster from Frozen.

>>89334707

Disney thought they would be able to make a princess film appealing to both girls and boys if they made a male sidekick with no romance.

>>89334762
The male/female duo has been their winning formula for about a decade now.

>>89334774

The male/female duo is almost always romantic and female-oriented. Do you think Flynn appeals to little boys?

Maui's design and personality was clearly intended to get the male audience interested. Note how they released action figures and boy merchandise for him.

>>89334837
>Do you think Flynn appeals to little boys?
Yes. That's a huge part of why the movie sold well - It wasn't sold as a "princess" movie, but a movie equally about both characters.

>>89334931

this movie borrowed heavily from dreamworks:

horse and thief from el dorado, the bandits from shrek etc.

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>>89335034
Less so than it was originally going to. It was re-written to be much more sincere.

>>89335064
What was Jack Black's role in the movie?

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>>89333451
>She sounds and talks like a villain from a Spider-Man show.
that explains muh dick

>>89335105
Protagonist. A pizza delivery guy from the modern day transported into fairy tale land.

>>89335156

reversed Enchanted

>>89334512
>If you listen to the lyrics, it could still work nicely for a villain

Seems like a bit of an understatement. The second verse does pretty much state "Fuck your petty morals, might makes right"

>>89334707

The film could have done with spending less time on the island and more Maui and Moana fighting mythological monsters.

One more monster that also serves as a replacement for the comically short montage where Maui relearns the hook (making that character arc pointless) and Moana becomes a skilled sailor and navigator in a couple of hours.

>>89335870

at this point they dont care, these sweet marvel/starwars/frozen money made them lazy fucks.

>>89334468

you mean this scene?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tqlaPttudUc

It's hilarious how preachy this movie was going to be.

>>89333488

I'd actually like Frozen 2 to do a kinda reverse of Frozen 1. Shady evil looking guy who turns out to be ok but Elsa can't trust him. Love ensues.

That said Disney will probably keep Elsa a spinster. Don't want to piss off the "zomg she gay!" stuff but also don't want to risk backlash from their cashcow having an explicitly gay princess.

>>89336023

Was too on the nose and probably made the audience too unsympathetic to the herbivores.

One of the clever things about Zootopia's writing is that they deliberately left all the parallels vague so you could take whatever message you like out of it. Is it anti-feminism? Pro-feminism? Racist? homophobic?

Something they also did with Let it Go. There lyrics are generic as fuck about a secret that you've kept hidden but feel you shouldn't have to. It could be about being gay/trans, alternatively it could be about having IBS. They all fit.

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Right in the middle of production, the leading crew members were literally waifuing Elsa, which led to late rewrites and re-edits since they didn't want their precious 2D woman to be seen in a severe negative light.

>>89333388
>She was finally rewritten to be just misunderstood tragic and frightened instead of bitter and vengeful after Let It Go was written.

This disgusts me. It sounds like they said fuck it with trying to convery a good plot because their song'd give them millions of dollars.

>>89336252
I agree to an extent. The final product is still super preachya nd on the nsoe sometimes, at least to me. But the original diea feels like it'd have been even more so i'm ok with it.

>>89336386
They could've left it to, since literally everybody loves a good villain song.

>>89336423

i bet you mean things like "dont call bunnies cute, that's "our" word"

>>89336252

IIRC creators were obsessed with making the city unsympathetic for some reason. did they wanted to make another black cauldron?

>>89336513

but it would make little girls be bad, and that's a bad influence.

>>89335064
>>89335156
>>89335200
>reversed Enchanted
>in delicious 2d animated world instead of disgusting real world
fuck this would have been so much better

>>89336637

The jilted fiance in Enchanted got to fuck the animated prince.

>>89336773

owww, papercut!

>>89336773

She's pretty cute in 2D, were the designs done by the Little Mermaid guy?

Also never realised it was Idina Menzel who played her.

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>>89336856

forgot the pic

>>89336289
>the leading crew members were literally waifuing Elsa

So? Everybody else in the world did, too.

>>89336252

nearly every storyboard or deleted scene portrays predators as niggers/gays/jews etc. I'm glad Pixar told them to knock it off, unfortunately they still haven't learned much, they're currently butthurt about the well needed political change.Some people.

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>>89336964
>Implying preds weren't stand-ins for men

>>89339210

oppressed by who? feminists?

>>89332331
Well...technically she WAS the villain. The few people you see at the end? Those were the town's SURVIVORS. Loooootta frozen corpses in Arendale...

>>89339412
That image does seem an awful lot like a little girl crying rape as a black man is surrounded by a lynch mob.

>>89339965

dont forget he's defenseless.

>"Let it Go" gets written
>Story writers go "oh shit we have to rewrite everything now"

>>89334092

If your looking for faithfully adapted stories Disney is the last place to look, Walt forbid the guys working on the jungle book from actually reading the source material, it was all about ignoring the source, taking the premise, and making a good film about it. In reality film was much young then and animated film was in its infancy a lot of the missteps of older film attempts were faithful adaptions of plays, they didn't work as films, he was probably trying to avoid the same mistake

>>89339965

>Disney pulling another kingdom of the sun/emperors new groove in the name of some hateful ideologies

Wtf I hate this company now

>>89340250
>making a good film about it.

Frozen is not a good movie though.

>>89340286
>another kingdom of the sun/emperors new groove

What are you referring to?

>>89340325

ENG was supposed to be KOTS a musical,(with music composed by Sting), similar to pocahontas in some manners, unfortunately it was bloated with ideas director couldnt figure out on time, also exec told him to make the movie more funny, it was like 20% complete. 6 months before the deadline it was rewritten and changed into a buddy comedy.
disney is quite ashamed of that story. plus that movie marked the end of the "disney renaissance". i feel sorry for Sting the most.

>>89340469
Oh! I heard of that. Except the way I heard it, David Spade and co came in and ad libbed so well and so much, they shifted the movie over to be a comedy.

ENG was awesome, and Sting's music was bland. I can only imagine how boring the movie would have been if it hadn't been changed.

>>89340506

yup, it was a good change, where we would be without pacha memes?

>>89340506
I honestly stop caring about ENG the moment Yzma and Kronk aren't on screen. The movie's strongest asset is its chemistry and comedic timing but the main plot focused on the two characters who had the least of either, IMO.

I wouldn't want KOTS either. But I feel like ENG is about 1/3 of an actual good movie. I could've really gone for a villain-driven movie with Warburton and Kitt as the stars.

>>89340325
>>89340506
Look up a documentary called "The Sweatbox", the movie had a rather troubled production. In the end it worked out well IMO, the final movie turned out very different from typical Disney films and it was fun to watch. However, that documentary is still worth seeing. It shows the pain of creators pouring their souls into something, only to see all their hard work getting scrapped in the end.

>>89332331
Up until that fucking song was written and then they decided to completely rewrite the movie.

>>89340078
I always felt Let it Go was the only thing that kept the movie together.

Now I know that was for reals. All the changes of the original diea happened because of Let it Go.

>>89336252
They pushed the suffering invoked by the collars so that they could play up the predators as the noble savage, enslaved by the small-minded prey majority.

Once the Pixar folks smacked them back to sensibility ("No one wants to watch a depressing slavery movie about cute cartoon animals"), they were able to change focus to the misguided prey realizing her mistakes. This allowed the predator to be a toned-down rendition of the noble savage and forgive her, which was a far easier sell to the audience.

I do suspect that a lot of the people pushing the first form of the movie still think to this day it was a cop-out.

>>89340506
Well originally KOTS has Yzma be a necromancer who wanted to kill the sun and unleash demons into the world

The only thing standing in her way was Kuzco's retarded ass

https://youtube.com/watch?v=374xW4zZbZA

>>89339412
Preds weren't "oppressed" prior to Judy's screw-up. But they had negative stereotypes associated with them, and there were sore feelings because they oppressed pret in the past.

>>89340506
>>89340469

I hate how The Sweatbox glorifies the original concept making ENG look like the villanous sad ending to a story filled with problems.

Yes, there are many cases were a good diea gets put through the executive grinding and ends up sucking. But for the bits and pieces we have seen and heard from KOTS (besides the amazing Villain Song that managed to get to the ENG OST) it looked evry udnerwhelming.

Just "The Prince and the Pauper in Peru". Sometimes there's a reason why it didn't go well with test audiences. Yes, some test audiences can be shit, but this time they never specified if it was because kids didn't like it or adults...so maybe the movie just wan't entretaining.

>>89342368
Well it is doc made by Sting's wife and himself. For better or worse, ENG is the antagonistic force in their narrative. The doc never promises impartiality or an objective view of the facts. It only ever provides us with the emotional rollercoaster Sting gets on once he's involved.

That's also why we never have a clear view of what KOTS is or was ever supposed to be. We only hear about it in relation to whatever Sting's doing. There's only ever a more cohesive focus on what everyone else is doing once a more direct emotional parallel can be drawn between them and Sting.

It would be really great to get a more objective doc about Disney's process though. Waking Sleeping Beauty often feels just as slanted as the Sweatbox but its wider focus kinda distracts from that.

>>89342368
Please link to some of those bits and pieces!

Is this >>89341263 one of them?

>>89334512
>It probably had Elsa built up as the red herring villain, but then there would've been the twist of Hans being the one with a (metaphorical) frozen heart, and the sword sacrifice was about Anna preventing the prophecy by saving her sister.
That definitely sounds better than what we got.

>>89334747
>there was a version where moana had like 7 brothers.
If Moana was going to spend the entire movie out in the ocean, then there would be no reason for her to have that many brothers. They wouldn't have added anything to the story. Removing them was a good call.

>>89335870
>Maui relearns the hook (making that character arc pointless)
That made no fucking sense.
>My magical hook isn't working properly
>Well I was actually born a human and was abandoned by my parents. I guess that's somehow the reason why the hook suddenly doesn't work
>Oh wait. I guess I just needed to get used to it again. Nevermind

>>89334468
>they redid it to give the film a painted look (there's a few seconds of footage, it looked great),
anyone have a link to this footage?

I think it was that Elsa was the villain, but then Let It Go struck a chord with the writers so they changed it.