In the DCAU, why was Batman mad about Superman sending Doomsday

batman cant rape people in the phantom zone

>>89171074
He can't rape Doomsday's butthole, PERIOD, though.

He was mad because Superman took the action before consulting the rest of them. The whole Justice Lords thing left him scared of either of them going that route, so Superman doing that without their consultation scared him.

>>89171019
I think it was cause they decided to send him by themselves instead of letting the proper authorities to deal with, which likely would have come to the same conclusion
Then again its fucking Batman, hes pretty awful at dealing with caught crminals.

>>89171097
He didn't even offer an alternative.
WAS there an alternative?

>>89171019
Batman was always afraid of the League becoming the Justice Lords. The options on what to do with Doomsday was limited, but he wasnt a fan of Superman having the idea to dumb people into the Phantom Zone so causally. In short, his paranoia

>>89171235
Was he not aware of, you know, all of the events that transpired the entire time Doomsday was on the warpath?

>>89171097
the whole message of this show is apparently "never get scared. it will make you do things that hurt yourself and others. no fears are ever justified, or if they are, nobody will ever react the correct amount to those fears."

>>89171450
Well, that's dumb.

>>89171019
Obviously Batman wanted Superman to do the same thing he does: give the criminal to the police, and wait for him to break out so they can do it all over again.

Superman and Batman relationship is entirely based on trust and comradeship. That's why Superman gave Batman kryptonites willingly. They trust each other. Without that deep level of trust they wouldn't be friends.

So ever since the Justice Lord debacle Batman had been fearing that they could still potentially follow that path. When Superman decided to play Judge, Jury and Executor with Doomsday without consulting anyone, Batman got scared that maybe... just maybe Superman might be following that path. It was a breach of trust and uncharacteristic behavior for Superman..

>>89171988
Except he didn't execute Doomsday. He stuck him in the Phantom Zone.

Because DCAU Batman always has to get the last word for no fucking reason.

>>89172031

That's still an extreme and uncharacteristic behavior for Superman, specially when he did it without consulting the others.

Sure, Superman had his reasons, but Batman's fear of their bad future still made him fear for Superman and get butthurt.

Because Batman is a hypocritical asshole. Only he's allowed to make decisions.

>>89172062

He had good reasons.

>>89172091
This shit is why everyone abandoned him in the end

>>89172031
You know what he meant anon. Its not about if his choice was right, its about how Clark made the decision so easily without council, which scared the hell out of Bruce. Kind of like how Injustice Superman operates. And arguably being sentenced to the Phantom Zone is worse than death.

>>89172106

That's the price he had to pay.

>>89172091
The road to being a total Sue is paved with good intentions.

>>89172106
I forget, why did everyone on the League cut ties with Bruce? I can sort of understand the bat-family given what happened with Tim and how everyone sort of just outgrew his shadow, but you would think Clark and Diana would stop by more often.

>>89171988
>When Superman decided to play Judge, Jury and Executor with Doomsday without consulting anyone
Wasn't everyone aside from Bats in the room when Superman did that? I'm pretty sure the original League members where there with him.

Yeah just looked it up, the others were with him so they had to have at least consented that there were no other means to contain Doomsday and allowed him to be Phantom Zoned.

>>89172067
So, no one remembers when Superman sent Jax-Ur and Mala to the Phantom Zon, is what you're telling me?

>>89172155
Diana died though

>>89172155
I feel like Epilogue may have flat out said he drove everyone away, but it's been a while since I watched it.

Superman was Starro'd though, there was a BB episode about it.

>>89172210
Natural causes?

>>89172139

He couldn't be a sue since he had so many flaws in the show. Him always trying to control the situation and being judgmental is just part of his character and the fact he's an ass.

>>89172155

The implication isn't that they cut ties with him, it was that he cut ties with them. He pushed the Bat-Family away in fear that they'd get hurt like Tim and he cut ties with the Justice League because he blamed the fact that he was always away on JL missions for what happened with Tim. He thought he had neglected Gotham. Had gotten his priorities twisted. Pushed everyone that could be hurt or distract him away.

Basically, he acted like an ass.

>>89172155
He's kind of an asshole. And not the "Oh he's tough but he's really a softy" No he's just an unpleasant person that brings down everyone around him.

>>89172210
I thought she went to the Justice Lords Earth and lived happily ever after with that Bruce?

>>89172228
>some shitty city > the wellbeing of the entire universe
This is what Batman actually believes

>>89172266

The Beyond digital comics are fucking awful and weren't written by the DCAU's staff.

>>89171019
sent him to arkham to work through his agression

>>89172210
Really? How?
>>89172221
Forgot about the Starro thing
>>89172228
>>89172245
I guess the mission just consumed him even further. It was never going to be over for him, and I guess he just decided to do all he could in Gotham and let the League handle the rest.

>>89172284
It's more closure for the league than we ever got elsewhere

>>89172320

Terrible closure that got tons of facts wrong about the cartoons, especially characterizations, and even including things from the main canon like Hush and Batman Inc.

Nah, they suck and should be ignored.

>>89171019
Because he has flaws, Batman isn't always right. Others should have talked him down.

And everyone remember that Superman attempted to lobotomize Doomsday the same way Justice Lords Superman did, it just didn't work. If forget if this was before or after Clark's distrust of Lex lead to the fight with Captain Marvel, but there was a steady build up of strain on Superman.

>>89172319

It wasn't so much about the mission, but rather his guilt about failing Tim Drake.

Tim was kidnapped when he was away and he failed to find Tim on time. Tim was broken and became a killer because of it. So he blamed himself from being away with the Justice League, cutting ties with the JL, and he pushed the Bat-Family in fear that the worst could happen with them as well. This left him utterly alone in Gotham fighting a never-ending war where he kept blaming himself for everything bad that happened.

>>89172202

Not everyone and Batman was hurt, not being able to be on the vote. Batman felt that Superman knew this would affect the outcome and took advantage. It wasn't also just about Superman becoming erratic, but all of them.

>>89171019

Put him in Arkham where he will never be a threat to anyone ever again

>>89172416
To be fair, he was in the middle of a brawl with Doomsday, in a erupting volcano, and punching wasn't doing anything. It wasn't like he was lobotomizing him as he was innocently buying groceries, it was as Doomsday was trying to kill him.

File: image.jpg (47KB, 500x308px) Image search: [Google]

47KB, 500x308px

Why are these never available as alternate costumes in any video game? Not even the Arkham games, and they had every costume I can think of.

>>89171097
>He was mad because Superman took the action before consulting the rest of them

The rest of the league was with Superman when he did it. Batman only had a shit fit because Superman didn't ask his permission.

I personally think Beyond is the best Batman ending for the character. Hes refuses to stop, hes pushed everyone away, and he hands the mantle to someone who isnt a carbon copy of him

>>89172459
Batman conveniently neglected to mention what he would have decided.

>>89172488
I really hope Injustice 2 gives us Crime Syndicate gear options, that was really missing from the first game. But knowing our luck, we're probably getting DCEU costume/gear to help advertise

>>89172067
>That's still an extreme and uncharacteristic behavior for Superman

No it isn't. He forces criminals back into the Phantom Zone all the time. It's fucking Doomsday. Bruce should just be happy Superman didn't rip him in half

>>89172507
>and he hands the mantle to someone who isnt a carbon copy of him

Yeah, about that...

>>89172110
Well Doomsday can't die. So it's the only option than let Doomsday rampage.

File: 18-2_zpsdbc82bd6.jpg (96KB, 640x480px) Image search: [Google]

96KB, 640x480px

Maybe it's that Batman holds Superman to an exacting standard, and Superman didn't exactly live up to it.

I mean, one of the big themes of the DCAU is that Superman isn't as perfect as everyone THINKS he is. The first appearance of the Justice Lords plays into this, with him talking about how he flunked out of the Boy Scouts.

He's not perfect, but he's still good.

>>89172600
Yes we know about the DNA shit, doesnt matter. See Waller made every effort to duplicate the right conditions that created Batman because she feared a world without one. Yet despite all her efforts, Terry became his own man, his own Batman, with his ways of dealing with things. This is apparent in Return of the Joker, and in the epilogue it shows that Terry doesnt have to make the same mistakes Bruce did.

>>89171117
>Then again its fucking Batman, hes pretty awful at dealing with caught crminals.

You mean the cops he hands them off to are awful at dealing with caught criminals. Or the jails they get sent to are awful at dealing with them. As far as he goes he's got a good track record of catching the bad guy to send to the cops.

>>89172635
Again, no one is saying the decision was wrong. The point was about how it was made

>>89172206
I don't recall either of those happening in the Justice League cartoon, which is it's own contained universe separate from the comic books.

>>89172681
He can afford the Batcomputer.
That alone proves that Bruce Wayne can't be bothered to invest in more secure holding facilities for his psychotic villains.

>>89172600
Terry wasn't a copy, just a biological son. Nanobots overwrote the sperm not the entire embryo.

>>89172737
Comics, you say/
Try Superman: The Animated Series.
Which, by the way, is canon.

>>89172737
>openly admitting you didn't watch STAS, the best DCAU cartoon

embarrassing

>>89172750
>>89172660
>>89172600

I always thought that was the dumbest shit.
Not out of sentimentality, but because that might actually be the dumbest shit.

>>89172777
Yeah the biological son asspull was unnecessary, though in fairness it does say a lot more about Terry

>>89172814
I'm all for Terry being his own man and being different from Bruce Wayne-
But that clone son shit was the worst. Who wanted that, anyway?
Was it Dini? I bet it was Dini-

>>89172777
They just got caught up their own ass with it. Like the point was that the genes didn't determine his path but Batman Beyond itself already proved that you didn't need to be Bruce Wayne to be Batman. Of course in attempting to canonize this illustration they also diminished the idea.

>>89172777
I actually like that the unexplainable fact that BOTH of their sons look nothing like Terry's father, quite probably lead to his parents' getting divorced. Think about it, Terry's dad was probably convinced he was cucked, but his wife was actually faithful the whole time. Shit's fucked up.

>>89172759
It's hard to tie either STAS or BTAS to JL and JLU (other than their being created by Timm/Dini) due to their significantly anachronistic environs. Like how Gotham takes a ridiculous leap in technology between Dick Grayson and Tim Drake's tenure as Robin.

>>89172890
Apparently they were always going to go the son route but I think it was said that Catwoman would have overrided the mom's genes? Something like that.

>>89172912
Don't be a baby.

>>89171019
Is Batman Beyond in the same universe as Justice League? Because I dont like how it all turned out for Bruce and I dont really like the direction they went for.

>>89172912
Nah, BTAS is definitely not needed outside of entertainment but JL/U pretty much don't make sense without STAS. None of the Hamilton stuff has proper context to establish that their concerns are legitimate unless you've seen Superman being mindfucked.

>>89172964

The time travel episode kinda gave the audience an out that the future could change.

If I could add one thing to Beyond, it would be Catwoman moved in with Bruce and settled down with him. Granted it sort of takes away from the misery Bruce created for himself, but I like the idea of Selina replacing Alfred as the person to ground him and Terry to a normal life, reminding them of other responsibilities they have. Not to mention it would be kind of funny to see the grumpy old man/nice grandma dynamic between the two.

>>89172964
According to Epilogue, yes.

>>89173050
They seemed to hate Selina given how they treated her after her introduction. Shit episode after shit episode.

>"You can't just make decisions without the rest of the team, you tyrant!"
>"MY CONTINGENCY PLANS ARE JUSTIFIED ONE OF YOU MIGHT GO ROGUE!"

Batman is a mentally ill, hypocritical cunt, what else is new?

I think we can all agree that the Cadmus arc was pure perfection. It's one of the best arcs in any piece of media in my opinion.

>>89173050

But Catwoman in DCAU was amoral and selfish to the core. It's what drove them apart.

Terry also doesn't need a grandma who's not related to him in anyway to ground him, since he already has a normal mother, a normal brother and a normal girlfriend. He's grounded enough as it is. Also, it's Terry role to ground Bruce and bring back his humanity.

I understand that you like your shipping, but she wouldn't make any sense being there and her role would be superfluous.

>>89173155

You're mixing continuities there, pal.

>>89173199
It was good but don't get too hyperbolic. Not even the one of the best superhero arcs across all media, or at least I can't rank it up there with truly beautiful things like Superman Beyond 3D.

>>89173199
Pretty much. Not only was it good on its own, the call backs to earlier stuff was smart and helped a lot of seemingly unrelated things make sense in the grand scheme of the universe. Things like Volcana and the Royal Flush Gang all being part of early Cadmus stuff, to finally resolving some of the effects from the last episodes of StAS, it was great at making stuff work together organically. Even the finale with Luthor was something that was built off of early Superman episodes, not to mention call backs to how the Justice Lords had a major effect on how the Justice League thinks about their actions. Even though the next season was also great, if everything ended RIGHT THERE it would have been satisfying.

It also did a thing that a lot of stories struggle with: two sides that have legitimately RIGHT reasons for what they're doing, that oppose eachother. Cadmus had every reason to be afraid, and some people in the organization where shitbags while others believed they were working for the greater good. And the people who believed it was a just cause tolerated the shitbags because they NEEDED every possible advantage they could get against a vastly superior (perceived) enemy. The "heroes on both sides" concept is rarely done this well.

>>89173050
>>89173121
>>89173295

Didn't this happen in the Beyond comics, but with Wonder Woman instead? She came back from the Justice Lord's universe and her followers there didn't wanted her back there with them, so she remained in the normal universe and without a home moved to Wayne's Manor with old Bruce to live with him and reconstruct her life.

>>89173050
If I could change stuff about Beyond, it would be to make Melanie the new Robin. Shit would be cash.

File: alright.jpg (14KB, 335x385px) Image search: [Google]

14KB, 335x385px

>>89171450
>no fear
NO PAIN
Sorry, I've been rewatching Kuuga lately

>>89173467
>shit would be schway
FTFY

File: james-gordon-jr.jpg (59KB, 600x639px) Image search: [Google]

59KB, 600x639px

>>89173050
>>89173467
If I could change stuff about Beyond, I'd give Terry a legit archenemy.
James Gordon, Jr?

>>89173394
Who can say, the Justice League Beyond comic ending with no conclusion to any of their plot lines.

>>89173607

And they were terrible.

>>89173568
Blight was a great archenemy, shame they "killed" him off so early.

>>89173619
Sadly. I really wanted them to be good.

>>89173628
That's partially what I meant by 'legit'.

>>89173568
I hate the "fated archenemy" shtick, honestly.

>>89173628
Yeah, Blight was handled for shit. I expected things to have a lot of back and forth between them, maybe build up to a big showdown like in Bubblegum Crisis or something. But no, he gets a few cool moments, then dies. Then his son is around and also worthless, because they just didn't want to do the corporate badguy thing all that much. I remember MANY discussions of how to fix Blight, and they all involve giving him more episodes, making him a mastermind behind more villains, and keeping him in a seat of power until his final showdown.

>>89171183
Turn him over to the Green Lantern core?
They have prisons for powerful alien beings. Not sure if it would hold Doomsday though.

>>89173682
Agree to disagree, then.

>>89171019
Because doing morally ambiguous stuff is only ok when Bruce does it.

>>89172062
>Implying it's just DCAU Batman

>>89173722
It's barely even morally ambiguous

>>89173722

Bruce isn't the goddamn Superman. Superman's much more important for the world.

>>89173754
Not in the eyes of DC or WB.

>>89173754
So you agree?

Also I'd fucking prefer Clark just fucking killed Doomsday and Darkseid rather than pussy out and endanger the world because Bruce's feefees were hurt. Locking people up doesn't fucking work when they are capable of destroying a planet.

>>89173805

Superman shouldn't do any of that. People need to look up to him.
Batman's Superman biggest fan. He places Superman and his existence on a pedestal.

So Superman going all ballistic scares the shit out of Batman.

>>89173842
>sending an unkillable murder-monster to a prison dimension
>going ballistic

>>89173879
I like how Clark has no compunction whatsoever about the scores of people, some who have served their time and are just floating helplessly, that Doomsday will kill once he's free in the Phantom Zone. Out of sight, out of mind.

>>89173789

Anyone can put on a cowl and say "I'm the gosh darn Batgod."

The fact that WB put out five films with three different Bruce's show how little they actually care about that.

However, only a Kryptonian could be Superman and there's only one Kryptonian around, baby.

>>89171019

Because the Justice Lords future was so easy to get to. It took Flash's death to send them there. So anything even remotely hinting at it happening is what upsets Batman.

But the turning point was the finale with Brainthor. Notice that it almost seemed like Superman was going to kill Luthor. But who stopped WW from jumping in? Batman. It was an act of trust and proved that the Lords future wouldn't happen.

POTTERY

>>89172600
But Terry still had to train

>>89175471
But Superman chose not to kill luthor on his own

>>89172272
>his shitty city that he left in the hands of kids > the wellbeing of the entire universe guarded by all the other supers

>>89172600
>Not MUH canon

File: doomsday_phantomzoned.png (593KB, 1101x693px) Image search: [Google]

593KB, 1101x693px

>>89172067
>specially when he did it without consulting the others.

Except he did consult the others. They were literally in the room with him. Why do so many people misremember this scene?

>>89172964

Look on the bright side; the comics that explained what happened with Diana and so on are of questionable canon to the DCAU. Since it just happened in ROTDK3, it's completely reasonable to assume that Supes is going to dip elderly and dying Bruce into a Lazerous Pit (as many times as he said was needed in that one episode) and boom. The Batman is back, Wonder Woman can return from her Island, and the League is practically back together. There is even a new Bat family by this point.

That's my headcanon.

>>89173394

Best end, especially when this happens... >>89176565

>>89171019
Didn't Superman try to lobotomise Doomsday with his heat vision just like Justice Lords Superman did and that's what got Batman worried about Supes turning bad?

Or am I remembering it wrong?

>>89173754
>Superman's much more important for the world
Which is why Waller decided the world would always need a man who dressed like a bat and failed to save his city

>>89171988
Oh but what about fucking Tower of Babel? Batman is a cunt, a hypocrite one.

>>89172266
Yes

>>89176017

>they have a dark chamber with thrones where they pass down judgment on the villains they catch

They were already heading down the Justice Lords path there.

>>89174668

I'm pretty sure this varies from one version to another, but I think the Phantom Zone was created so that the criminals trapped there can't hurt anyone, not even other criminals trapped inside with them. They become some kind of ethereal form inside the dimension.

>>89173514

>another Kuuga fan

My brother of AfroAmerican descent!!

>>89174668
Phantom Zone prisoners are incapable of interacting with ANYTHING. They're basically ghosts. That's why the Kryptonians were able to survive decades without food and water with no physical repercussions.
So Doomsday is kinda floating around helpless, as well.

>>89176806
Nope. It was sending Doomsday to the Phantom Zone that made him autistically mad.

>>89176961
Well, they wanted Terry to be Bruce's biological son SOMEHOW.

>>89172155
probably after Ras'al'ghul killed half the league

>>89176565

If we take the terrible Beyond 2.0 comics into consideration and follow what you're saying i can see the episode Epilogue happening, but with the difference that battle-hardened Wonder Woman still lives in the Wayne's Manor and takes care of dying old Bruce.

So like you said i can see her not wanting to accept that dying old Bruce is actually dying of old age and without his knowledge or consent takes him to a Lazarus' pit to dump him there. Bruce will get young and angry that WW did this to him, but eventually they patch things up. Like... in 2 to 4 seasons after many "will they, won't they" bullshit between the episodes.

>>89178276

I can see it.

File: 1483476977802.jpg (2MB, 2168x3464px) Image search: [Google]

2MB, 2168x3464px

>>89176565
>>89178276
>>89178390

This, but with Diana?

>>89171091
he can, but only once.

>>89178432

Basically, yeah. She simple won't accept that he's going to die after all they went through and being rewarded so little time to spend together in these last few years, and despite knowing that he'll certainly hate her afterwards she goes and dips him. This after Epilogue, of course.

By the way, i wonder how Miller's DKR series will be now with a young Bruce. I just hope he won't start fucking Carrie Kelley. That would be weird.

>>89178492
>By the way, i wonder how Miller's DKR series will be now with a young Bruce

It's won me over to actually starting reading it, and collecting the trades. For me the series was always a curio that I would refer to, and remember enjoying, but pretty low on my collect list. This twist kinda has me interested where it will go.

>>89178559

Things felt underwhelming after DKRII, specially in regards to the characterization of the other JL characters, but i've enjoying the new books somewhat. It's a pretty crazy universe.

>>89171019

Bruce is an asshole?