So what the fuck's this about each reality having its own

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/co/ pls

>>88374558
What? Anon, you're misunderstanding. There is only one Living Tribunal, but he has M-Bodies in each of the universes. The "universal" Living Tribunal is just an aspect of the Multiversal one (which is why the Beyonders had to simultaneously attack every M-Body in every universe to defeat the Living Tribunal).

Adam Warlock is now the multiversal Living Tribunal because the last one was killed by the Beyonders and Reed wasn't powerful enough to create a new one himself. Hence The One Above All having to do it himself via promoting Adam Warlock.

There's some weirdness with how Starlin phrases some of the stuff, especially in Finale, but it doesn't contradict this.

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>>88376653
uh, about that anon...

>>88376964
Like I said, M-bodies. Living Tribunal has operated under this system for decades. Each universe has its own "living tribunal" but they're all just an aspect or part of the one true Living Tribunal. You can kill an M-body but you'd have to kill ALL the M-bodies to take down the Living Tribunal himself.

Now, this Adam Warlock's world was fused with 616 to a certain extent. The implication as I understood it is that the LT M-Body from that Adam Warlock's actuality basically got merged with Adam Warlock so it was never actually killed by the Beyonders, whereas 616's M-Body WAS killed by the Beyonders.

So the Beyonders killed every M-body but Adam Warlock's Universe's M-body, which was enough to kill the Living Tribunal, but an aspect of the original tribunal (via Adam Warlock's Actualities' LT M-Body) lived on inside Adam Warlock.

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>>88377496
They never really spell it out like that. The only mention LT even gets before that page is "Adam's potentially as powerful as the Living Tribunal!", implying it was the aggregate energy of a universe that made up an LT. And pages like this reinforce the implication.

>>88375737
So is anyone going to reference AU Warlock being the new Tribunal or is it going to stay in Starlinland?

Secret Wars III was a fucking mistake.

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>>88377781
>people referencing continuity

>>88377781
No cost was too high to purge Ultimate Marvel from every reality.

>>88377726
But see, that's how I'm reading that scene. He's saying that basically everything from his universe became part of him. This would include his universe's Living Tribunal M-Body. Since it was inside him, they Beyonders couldn't have destroyed it, meaning the piece of the Living Tribunal that's inside Adam Warlock in that scene is the only piece of the Living Tribunal left in existence.

Ironically, Adam Warlock being the sum totality of his original universe basically makes him pre-retcon Beyonder in that scene.

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>>88377781
Ewing did. Kinda. Which is why I read the damn things in the first place.
Relativity a shit
Seriously it's gotta be canon, right? Thanos vs Hulk is part of it and that was originally gonna be an arc in Hulk's ongoing. You could even bullshit that Thanos travelling back in time at the end of Finale has created two Thanoses, and the other one's the Secret Wars casualty.

>>88377781
Ewing did in an issue of Ultimates. Along with acknowledging that Starlin's Thanos did finally get with Death and is currently retired to her realm.

Basically, there's 2 Thanoses now. There's the one that died in Secret Wars (Earth 616-7 Thanos) and then the perfect copy created when God Reed remade the universe (Earth 616-8 Thanos).

616-8 Thanos (the perfect copy that never went to Battleworld) is Starlin's and the one that appears here and finally achieves his goal of becoming Death's mate in her realm, then 616-7 Thanos (the one that was killed by God Doom on Battleworld and survived the death of the multiverse) whose soul was excised from the multiverse but clawed his way back in and is now courting Oblivion instead of Death.

>>88377896
Cosmic Cubes are Beyonder eggs as of Hickman, it wasn't that much of a retcon desu.

>>88377974
Yeah, it's canon. It probably would have been entirely ignored if it wasn't for the fact that Ewing cares more about continuity than the entire Marvel editorial staff combined.

>>88377974
The secret war thanos is the one who was floating around outside the multiverse and then managed to sneak back in behind the ultimates

>>88378020
That reminds me to another Starlin gripe, since you're in the know:
How canon's Marvel: The End? I figured it never was but Jim KEEPS FUCKING BRINGING IT UP.

>>88377805
I get why DeFalco wrote it though. It makes sense to want to tie The Beyonder to The Beyonders, and it did a decent job wrapping it all up with the sentient cosmic cubes. It's too bad that it happened with one of my least favorite Fantastic Four rosters. Why does a team need two Things and two fire users?

Also most of the stuff that Secret Wars 3 established went pretty much unused until Hickman came along for the build up to Secret Wars 4, and even then, Hickman retconned/tidy up a number of things to make it work his narrative better.

>>88378069
That's the one I mean yeah. The one Doom killed. Secret Wars casualty.

>>88377805
You mean the FF arc right?

>>88378073
None of the "The End" books were canon is the official Marvel stance. Because Starlin kept referencing it in his canon 616 books, the way it basically fits is that "The End" itself isn't canon but most of the events of that book happened in 616 more or less the same. Pretty much just the ending's "death is fixed now!" being something that never happened or at least didn't work for 616.

Obviously. Since it's not like Marvel was going to just stop bringing characters back to life because it fit Starlin's narrative.

>>88378069
Yeah, which actually fixes a number of plotholes. First off, Reed remade the universe with everyone still in it. You could say he excluded Thanos, but then why would Reed draw the line there when there's even worse monsters? So then, it stands to reason that there would have been a Thanos in the new 616 so when Thanos that died on Battleworld clawed his way back in, that should have resulted in two Thanoses.

Then there's the fact that Ultimates establishes that Thanos didn't re-enter the universe until 8 months after Secret Wars, but Starlin's Finale only kinda makes sense if it happened during the 8 month timeskip after Secret Wars since the Living Tribunal is already dead by that point but definitely takes place before ANAD-era.

All that stuff is fixed once you consider what Ewing had Thanos say in Ultimates which implied there being two Thanoses, the one from Finale and the one from Secret Wars.

>>88378144
>Pretty much just the ending's "death is fixed now!" being something that never happened or at least didn't work for 616.
That was my big hang up yeah.
Thanos still referred back to the episode as him "fixing a celestial aberration" or whatever which piles on the confusion. You're here, verbally reminiscing, decidedly ALIVE: The fuck did you fix!

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An aside, since the topic's come up.
WHERE THE FUCK'S THE BEYONDER?

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>>88378433
WHERE
H
E
R
E

>>88378472
Figured he's show up in Time Runs Out or Secret Wars, but NOPE. Just the covers.

>>88378563
I'm partial to he went back in time and became Robert Reynolds

>>88378679
This desu senpai

Explains how he was able to beat Molecule Man and of course RR Lost Beyonder.

>>88378433
>>88378472
Maybe Ewing will remember him? Then again, it's clear that everyone at Marvel remembers him, what with Bendis' dumb Inhuman Mutant retcon, Secret Wars and all that, they just don't want to bring him back for some reason.

>>88378736
>for some reason
For plenty of reasons. Mostly though, there's no reason to bring him back unless you're building up to another Secret Wars.

>>88374558

Dude, forget it. Starlin has his own universe and everyone else lets him have it out of respect. It has no connection to or bearing on 616.

>>88377496
>Like I said, M-bodies. Living Tribunal has operated under this system for decades. Each universe has its own "living tribunal" but they're all just an aspect or part of the one true Living Tribunal. You can kill an M-body but you'd have to kill ALL the M-bodies to take down the Living Tribunal himself.

It literally states the Beyonders didn't kill the other guy. Bullshit, they killed the Living Tribunal by attacking him from all universes at once.

Starlin does his own thing, and they let him, because they want to have Thanos.

>>88378815
>It literally states the Beyonders didn't kill the other guy
Because they didn't. In here >>88377726 it's stated that the sum totality of this Adam Warlock's universe was absorbed into him. This includes his universe's Living tribunal m-body.

Since it was part of/inside Adam, the Beyonders wouldn't have been able to get to it. So in practice, the Living Tribunal m-body of Adam Warlock's universe is the only one that the beyonders weren't able to kill and thus the only "Living Tribunal" left.

>>88378433

He's currently flying the corpse of Exiitar the Exterminator to somewhere far away from Earth.

RR = LOST BEYONDER

>>88378679

Ding ding.

>>88378781
>Dude, forget it. Starlin has his own universe and everyone else lets him have it out of respect. It has no connection to or bearing on 616.
But Ewing.

>>88378736
>Bendis' dumb Inhuman Mutant retcon
Wasn't a retcon. He was fucking with them. OHTMU nigga.
Also Bendis was doing the same kind of thing with Bob at the time.

>>88378433
Whatever happened to that little pixie?

>>88374558
>Starlin's recent work has a lot of "wait what" moments but this takes the damn cake.
Starlin has been nothing but "wait what" moments for me since like 2005.

>>88378884
>Wasn't a retcon. He was fucking with them. OHTMU nigga.
Yeah, other writers retconed his retcon, but that doesn't mean that Bendis' intention wasn't to retcon the Beyonder's origin. Otherwise why bother with the story at all?

>>88378862

...The entities aren't MADE UP of their M-Bodies. M-Bodies are just how they manifest in our reality. They are just projections. There's even a cosmic entity in charge of that.

I understand you want to fold this Starlinverse into it, but just let it go. What Starlin does is basically a continuation of an older, a better age, but that age is over. It's not a part of modern Marvel.

They indulge him and the stories he tells because they need Thanos.

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>>88378945

Skreet. Nobody cares or refers to her. Good riddance. She was created for the most 90's series ever: Lunatik.

The last time we saw her she was with Cammi, but she's not with her anymore. In-context she probably struck out on her own again.

>>88378998
>other writers retconed his retcon
No, they didn't. After the book came out, Brevoort clarified that the Beyonder was just fucking with them and lamented that this was the one instance where "Brian was TOO subtle for once." Then the Official Handbook of the Marvel Universe, which is pretty much the arbiter of canon, clarified this fact explicitly.

It was pretty clear if you actually read the comic that the Beyonder was just fucking with them. Black Bolt couldn't remember him and Xavier basically said "it came to me in a dream." At no point did another writer come in and retcon his retcon because Bendis' retcon never really "happened."

>>88378998
The story itself ended on a smirk, it was one big nudge-nudge-wink-wink.
>Otherwise why bother with the story at all?
To play around with Beyonder's troll ass. Bendis wasn't always so hamfisted, but he was always a fanboy.

>>88379012
Yes, but I'm saying that this one projection of the Living Tribunal survived the Beyonders' attack. The Beyonders killed the living tribunal by destroying all of his m-bodies at once. All of them except the one that was projected into Adam Warlock's universe. So a single aspect of LT survived through AW.

>>88379108
I kinda hate the Primordials on principle desu

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>>88377994

>then 616-7 Thanos (the one that was killed by God Doom on Battleworld and survived the death of the multiverse) whose soul was excised from the multiverse but clawed his way back in and is now courting Oblivion instead of Death.

>tfw your sister's ex-boyfriend wants to get in your pants

Must be awkward.

...Or maybe not, who know. Oblivion doesn't seem to be right in the head, he actually chose a motherfucking GREAT LAKES AVENGER of all people to be his herald, for Christ's sake.

>>88379135

A projection isn't really a part of the Living Tribunal, and Starlin pretty clearly seems to think there is a Living Tribunal in each universe, rather than one for the entire Multiverse. Kirby knows where he got that idea.

The Proemial gods? It was a pretty goofy concept, but then again, there was some story potential there. Like the Elder Gods on a universal scale.

>>88379265

My headcanon vis-á-vis Oblivion is that he is a negative reflection of the multiverse - of all that exists, against the "Overvoid". So while he is nominally as powerful as the other half of everything, he can't actually act because that goes against his nature. Thoughts?

>>88379301

Makes sense, doesn't justify his weird ass choice of herald though. Look at the badasses that his siblings got as champions, even lil' Galactus

>>88379397

I don't think Oblivion has siblings. The universal trinity is Eternity / Death / Galactus.

>>88376964
It's unclear. Alt-Warlock's dimension doesn't seem to have been just a normal alternative universe, there's plenty of unique circumstances.

If it was a different Multiverse, a separate Tribunal would make sense.

>>88379453
Nope, it's Eternity/Infinity with their counterparts Death/Oblivion.
Galactus is a different thing entirely.

>>88379757

Isn't Eternity Evil Reed's bitch right now?

>>88379301
HE'S FUCKING OBLIVION
THERE SHOULDN'T BE ANYTHING
DAMMIT DEMATTIES YOU HAD ONE JOB

>>88379868
Eternity is in chains, he's somebody's bitch, but we don't know who's. Definetly not Evil Reed's though.

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>>88379743
If it was an entirely separate Multiverse it presumably wouldn't have been so goshdarned close to 616. NewUniversal was a separate Multuverse. The Killustrated Ideaverse is a separate Multiverse. DC's a separate Multiverse. "616 but Warlock doesn't change clothes" doesn't compare.
That said part of me wonders if the maelstrom in Infinity Abyss was meant to represent different Multiverses instead of different universes. The whole Atlez anchor thing seems like too important a mechanic to have never come up in Captain Britain or Man-Thing.

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>>88379757

Then our opinions differ.

>>88379941

He only "exists" because the multiverse exists. Kinda like Nekron, only somehow even bigger.

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>>88379868
Evil Reed's trying to save Eternity.

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>>88380140

And then again...

>>88379301
I also think that oblivion is part of a greater nothingness or overvoid. Like, basically oblivion is the perfect nothingness that was before the multiverse and will be after it, nothingness as a concept that exists within the cosmic hierachy of the marvel omniverse. you could even call it the "in-continuity" infinite void. On the other hand, the larger void is what exists beyond the concepts of beginning and end, beyond the omniverse, beyond the physical, the abstract or the conceptual. almost like a blank page in which someone came up with the lesser notion of "nothing" (Oblivion).

>>88379868
Evil Reed is making a plan to fight whoever has made eternity his bitch.

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>>88379453
>>88380140
Eternity & Death are the main ying-yang dichotomy. Galactus is a neutral third party representing equity between the two. Oblivion & Infinity were introduced later on as lesser-known opposites on Eternity/Death's level, forming a cosmic quartet.

>>88379868
Evil Reed is Sunspot bitch

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Starlin's take on the Big Four really confuses me desu.
I was under the assumption that Eternity & Death represented time whilst Oblivion & Infinity represented space. Yet his comics state Infinity is time, and never so much as reference Oblivion unless it's as a synonym for Death.
He also only ever brings in Infinity to job her out like any old abstracts. I thought her & Oblivion were extradimensional constants, like lower-tier Tribunals or Beyonders. I mean, they literally fill everything/nothing.

>>88376964

Did we ever find out what the fuck the Beyonders were?

The Builders helped to create the universe...right?

And where does God fit into all this?

>>88381754
>Did we ever find out what the fuck the Beyonders were?
Beings from beyond the multiverse that liked fucking around with the Marvel multiverse.

>The Builders helped to create the universe...right?
Nah, they were just among the first races and helped seed a bunch of planets with life before becoming multiversal nomads.

>And where does God fit into all this?
God is The One Above All. He doesn't really interfere and just let's things run their course. Him turning Adam Warlock into the new Living Tribunal was one of the only times he directly intervened because he's the only being powerful enough to create a new LT.

>>88381754
The beyonder from the original secret wars was a pocket universe baby, a spawn of the real things.

The larger beyonders were an embodiment of what lied beyond real space. They were both creators and destroyers of the multiverse.

The builders didn't exactly create the universe. They were sheperds. They destroyed what had to be destroyed, evolved what had to be evolved, created cosmic ecosystems, etc. Like second hand celestials

God is Jack Kirby

>>88380644
Eternity has typically Representative EVERYTHING. When Infinity was created, Eternity representative Space, and Infinity was Time. Death and Oblivion are basically the opposite balance of Eternity and Infinity respectively.

He probably has Infinity to job because, while she is equal to Eternity, Eternity is a fucking Ditko creation, Infinity... isn't.

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>>88382526
>When Infinity was created, Eternity representative Space, and Infinity was Time
bruh

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When tae fuk did kiddie-Thanos meet the OG Beyonder I don't remember this.

>>88379109
>." Then the Official Handbook of the Marvel Universe, which is pretty much the arbiter of canon, clarified this fact explicitly.

I cannot accept it because it's just fanfiction printed by Marvel. I mean sure, isn't every comic etc etc, but the OHOTMU are literally just pages of fan speculation printed as """""CANON""""""

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>>88383172
>I cannot accept it because it's just fanfiction printed by Marvel
>printed by Marvel
>fanfiction

bruh

>>88383220

The Appendix to the Handbook of the Marvel Universe is not a site sanctioned or created by Marvel.

>>88383274
...Bro I think you're getting your resources mixed up.

>>88378294
But which Thanos will be the Thanos they fight when Avengers 3 or 4 come out because you know damn well they're going to do another Thanos event.

>>88380187
>the war that' coming
Dear God, what now?

>>88374558
Starlin has always been a hack

>>88383966
The evil murderous one obviously.
>>88384075
Eternity War nig. See the post above you. Need dem sweet synergy bux.

>>88383966
Earth 616-7 Thanos. Earth 616-8 Thanos is pretty much permanently retired unless Starlin decides to make a new comic.

>>88384075
Eternity War. Eternity vs. Oblivion/The Empty Hand

DeFalco wrote a Secret Wars 3? What book was this in? How have I never heard of it? Worth checking out for a cosmic weirdness fan?

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>>88387297
It was an arc of DeFalco's Fantastic Four and got us this gem.

>>88387297
>>88387390
>>88378093

Holy shit, it was Englehart.
>/co/
>reading comics

>any good?
It's not primo Stainless at all, and it's essentially just a huge metaphor for how shitty Shooter was as a boss, but it's well in line with the trippy, highly allegorical Marvel of yore (even if it's not always for the right reasons).

>>88377994
>is now courting Oblivion instead of Death.

literally gay

>>88377994
Why Thanos is obsessed with sticking his dicks in abstracts? When will he clone himself to gangbang LT?

>>88378005
Yeah it was already implied pre-hickman that the beyonders probably give civilizations THE idea of cosmic cube when they are ready. So once its ready the cube learns everything it needs to know about its civilization before achieving sentience as a new being, like kubik and kobik and whoever the girl-beyonder was.

>>88387572
>>88387390

It was Englehart and it basically was the first big Beyonder retcon. Englehart really wanted to shit in Shooter's sandwich after he left. of course barely anyone read it so it ended up ignored a lot.

>>88386108
If Ewing doesn't do Thanos vs Thanos I'mma be a little upset.

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>>88387833
>personifications of the cosmically abstract
>conforming to binary gender norms
Eye of the beholder.

>>88389853
>Thanos & Warlock finally fuck

>>88391394

>Neil Gaiman death

I wonder if he threw a shitfit like he did when she showed up in Peter David's Hulk

>>88391405
I a'm infinigendered abstractosexual now. Prefered pronoun is titan.

>>88381820
TOAA also intervened to make Spidey feel better and stop him from giving his marriage to the devil but we know how that turned out kek

>>88391405
that sexual tension has lasted for decades

it might break the universe

Am I the only one who finds the Marvel cosmics/abstracts/concepts way more interesting than the DC cosmics?

Only the Endless come close.

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>>88391411
>when she showed up in Peter David's Hulk
Ooooo, do tell/post pls.

>>88391546
I still find that real fuckin' weird.
Where was it confirmed to be TOAA and not just Yahweh or some shit?

>>88391576
What's DC got?
That should say it all really but nah I'm genuinely looking for a refresher course. They have their own FemEternity right?

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>>88391623
I think everyone just kinda knows its TOAA.

In a meta-perspective, it makes sense for him to show up and try to steer the most important Marvel character from a catastrophic mistake. Too bad Quesadilla was even more powerful.

>>88391657
So Iggy Pop is God? Huh.

>>88391633

They basically don't have abstracts. Not in the sense that Marvel does. They have some super-powerful beings but they tend to be a lot more traditional, and then there's the Endless.

>>88391687
They have the new gods, but they don't play around with them as abstracts as much as marvel does.

It's usually just throwing Darkseid at Superman or the Justice League to get beat up.

They might as well all be Heralds of Galactus tier.

>>88391657
Ozzy Osbourne?

>>88391657
Who IS he meant to look like? Kirby on a rough day?

>>88391546
I think assuming he was TOAA may be a bit of a stretch. I always assumed he was supposed to be the Abrahamic God.

>>88377994
>the perfect copy created when God Reed remade the universe (Earth 616-8 Thanos).

Starlin!Thanos did skip Secret Wars thanks to Tribunal Warlock jumping in the future.
You will note the events before(and during most) Finale portrayed a 616-7 universe, while the events at the end of Finale did portray 616-8.

Oblivion!Thanos was probably created by Tribunal Warlock to play his part, but we don't actually know

>>88379269
Living Tribunal is exactly like Eternity: there is one Eternity for each Universe and there is the Multiversal Eternity which is made of all the Eternities.

>>88391679
that's how Peter visualizes God.

Peter's God is Iggy Pop.

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>>88378866
COME ON DUDE NO

>>88382573

A clue is the names. Eternity is a time measurement. Infinity is a space measurement.

But in all fairness we had Eternity as the cosmic embodiment of the universe for decades before Infinity was introduced, Eternity used to come across as more the embodiment of all existence with at least some focus on 3D space, or at least the combination spacetime. Infinity came along and she became space, Eternity got a bit of a downgrade to "only" time.

And of course some writers forget/dont know about Infinity, so Eternity ends up being the universe's embodiment, both space and time.

Getting too worked up about continuity in a serialized storytelling medium written by hundreds of writers over decades is a sure path to insanity.

>>88378862
Your logic makes sense but I can't help but wonder why Starlin didn't say so in the text itself to clarify matters. It would've taken, like, one extra word balloon.

>>88379012
>What Starlin does is basically a continuation of an older, a better age
>>88379269
>Starlin pretty clearly seems to think there is a Living Tribunal in each universe, rather than one for the entire Multiverse
Contradiction thy name is anon.
TLT being multiversal isn't a new thing, it's from that older better age.

>>88384075
I'm pumped as hell, Ewing is writing and Ultimates is almost definetly the best book marvel has rn

>>88391576
Nah, that's precisely why I prefer Marvel's Cosmic and, by extension, their overall universe/setting. DC of course has phenomenal stories but their greater universe never really came together and clicked for me like Marvel's.

Multiversity was fucking great though.

>>88376653
yeah there was an old what if where the cosmic entities were shut out of the universe because their m-bodies were destroyed and the mutated human race ended the universe shortly after.

what if the avengers lost the evolutionary war or something i think

>>88398716
forgot to add in the only cosmic entity who doesnt exist in multiple universes is the one above all the living tribunals master

Bump for cosmic discussion

>>88398628
Honestly I prefer them in different ways. Marvel has a more organized pantheon with hierachies, more cosmic entities with specific purposes, and so on. They have a generally more diverse multiverse and haven't backed down from having an infinite multiverse for the sake of continuity. DC's is more organic and chaotic, it doesn't have as many entities because the universe itself is an entity. Plus they generally do more weird/experimental stuff with their multiverse and explore the relationship between the stories and us.

>>88377974
So is there any rule 34 of sexy Marvel Death and Thanos yet?

>>88401009
>and haven't backed down from having an infinite multiverse for the sake of continuity
didn't they just do that with the latest secret wars and hackman's run

>>88402068
It's back up to infinite again. Reed's been busy.

>>88396833
When has Starlin ever been a bastion of clarity?

>>88398716
>>what if the avengers lost the evolutionary war
Funfact: the Evolutionary War happened because the High Evolutionary wanted to prove that he could make turn humanity into the equal of the Beyonders. This was before the Beyonder/Beyonders retcon happened in SW3, too.

>>88374558
bump

>>88377974
Wasn't the whole point of the Thanos/Death dichotomy to show that Thanos would never, ever get with her because he's a complete piece of shit and she's not into him?

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>>88377882
>implying it's gone

>>88404321
He's nicer now so he deserves his happy ending

>>88404397
It's not the ultimate universe as in the 1610 universe, it's more like >>88380187

Thanos - The Infinity Relativity (2015) (digital OGN) (Minutemen-Entombed)
http://www19.zippyshare.com/v/zcmawZTk/file.html

Thanos - The Final Threat (2012) (digital GN) (Minutemen-InnerDemons)
http://www12.zippyshare.com/v/MgbfEH8V/file.html

Thanos - The Infinity Finale (2016) (digital OGN) (Minutemen-Entombed)
http://www8.zippyshare.com/v/SFjsc5ZO/file.html

>>88404161

>>88404161
why bump this

>>88408694
Hot abstract sex

>>88391358
In a later, even less-remembered story, the post-Beyonder Molecule Man, who restored his "original" power, forced the Beyonder to exist again, then beat the crap out of him, thus completing the full shitting upon the Beyonder concept. Unfortunately.

>>88409447
I think Hickman made him go back to his "omnipotent guy who exists outside of everything" roots.

Also I'm still mad that the beyonders were so badly misused in the final issues of TRO and secret wars

>>88409471
Hickman didn't clearly explain what the Beyonders where, except for them existing outside of the rest of Creation. Also it was suspicious how techno-organic the ones that appeared seemed, especially since they were making use of robots in the forms of the Mapmakers and the Sidera Maris the whole time. So they may not have been the true Beyonders?

>>88409505
Ewing did, as a totality they were a embodiment of what existed beyond the multiverse. Also they took different, techno-organic shapes because they have no real appearance (they are essentially beings of nothingness) and Deodato is a hack.

>>88409505
IIRC one description had them as being too big to make themselves small enough, so to speak, to fit into things like space and time. It was literally impossible for them to do so, so they worked through advanced alien races and things like Cosmic Cubes.

>>88408837

so much THIS

>>88409727
>ywn pound Infinity into oblivion with your eternal deathcock

>>88409544
>>88409505
It is worth noting that the original Beyonder had a fascination with technology. In SWII, he'd often use machines to do things he could just easily do himself. Rather than just use his powers to do something, he'd use his power to create a machine to do the thing. Knowing that he's a "child Beyonder" thanks to later retcons, you can use this to assume that The Beyonders are naturally fans of machinery hence using robotic bodies when entering the multiverse.