Is this the only thing that could have saved Frozen that

>>88284497

>tfw Helsa will NEVER EVER be canon

fire-powered Anna is stupid though

>>88284569
Remember when fire-powered Hans was a thing? And when it appeared it was almost always a tack-on to Helsa.

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>>88284620
>Remember when fire-powered Hans was a thing?
That was a thing?
>>88284569
Yeah but I would enjoy some good fire animation

The only thing that can save frozen is a really great power origin story
Also more world building


In one of the versions of Snow queen
She did have a sister that can control spring and was planing to trap the girl protagonist.

>>88284620
I prefer Hans as a sort of deconstruction of the handsome prince hero come to vanquish the evil ice witch. The idea of it at least, if not the execution. The execution was sort of shit.

He should form an RPG party with Gaston, Clayton, and.. I don't kinow, who else would fit? Humans that could just as easily have been heroes in another context. Maybe Frollo as healer?

>>88284497
Elsanna
Lots and lots of Elsanna

>>88285036
This
>>88285170
Off with you scrapper

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>>88284569
Fire Anna is dumb, but Helsa is far closer to canon than Elsanna will ever be.

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>>88284497

Fuck off frzfag.

Your fanbase is dead long time ago.

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>>88285236
I wasn't around for those, I hated Frozen. The writing fell flat on it's feet and the direction the story took was awful. I didn't dig the false feminism either.

>>88285036
>Bard: Gaston
>Sorceror: Malificient/Dr Facilier
>Ranger: Clayton

I just realized none of the disney villians are knights or straight fighter types

>>88285231
>dumbass didnt pull a von Habsburg and usurp the throne by having his sons inherit the throne through paternal right

nigga didnt deserve the throne if he cant even legacy

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i honestly cant hate hans.

because of the sudden change of heart, it seriously seemed like the good prince was suddenly kidnapped by aliens and replaced by someone else in the middle of the film.

when elsa went missing, he took charge. he got the townsfolk to assemble for a search party and he had the presense of mind to think of helping the other civilians when the winterfall was hitting hard.

if he was that good of a leader, there is quite literally no reason for him killing ana nor elsa. EVEN IF HE WAS EVIL.

hed have a loyal bitch. whether or not he kills elsa, ana will still become queen because the eldest had fled the kingdom and therefore abdicated. hed be competent enough as a king and a leader that no one would complain about him.

hans was that guy in every film whose plans were all going to keikaku to the point that the main characters cannot even possibly stop them, but the writers/director are too creatively bankrupt that they just force him to be retarded in the final act so the heroes can get their moment.

this pisses me off so much

and besides, if he really was smart enough, he wouldve just gone and seduced elsa in the first place. him by her side wouldve made her more confident and even control her powers

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>>88285289
Hans, as a prince and a swordsman, works well enough for fighter. A paladin doesn't have to wear armor. Hans could find an analogue in Philip here. If only Hans were Philip's equal with a sword, he might have been able to put up some fight against the ice witch. Alas.

Fighter: Hans
Priest: Frollo
Archer: Gaston
Mage: Grimhilde

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>>88285264
>mfw someone posts a Helsa image I don't have yet

>>88285416
Heard a theory that the Trolls fucked up his mind to try to get him out of the way so Anna would fall for Kristoff. Knowing Fae folk, this seems plausible.

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>>88285591
>Knowing Fae folk, this seems plausible.
Absolutely. Even good fairies like the Blue Fairy or Glenda are kind of assholes when you think about it.

>>88285591
believable if it was in a darker non-disney story

here in my country, our versions of tree spirits and elves are absolute cunts they will literally create a lose-lose situation where either decision you make would anger them and result in some potentially life-ruining cruses

Fairies are assholes. For better or worse, they love to screw with mortals. They fuck about and help just barely enough to keep things going the way they want. They get off on that shit.

>>88285416
When Anna asked Hans to kiss him, what should he have done? He knew he didn't love her and the kiss wouldn't work. He also knew she was impulsive, and they weren't married yet. If she got magical proof that their relationship wasn't true love, would Anna still want to marry him and get him closer to the throne?
It looks like he thought Anna was dead meat either way, and he got sick of pretending for her sake.
Still, the one really stupid thing he did was leaving her alone instead of staying and waiting for her death.

Also, he did have the intention to seduce Elsa. But he figured she was unapproachable and it would be an easier task to try to reach the throne via Anna.

>>88285591
I believe they were intended to be just normal good guys, but some scenes kinda make them look questionable. One of the trolls declares her intention to adopt Kristoff even though there's at the time no indication he's an orphan, and during their song, they discuss getting Anna's fiance out of the way. Much earlier they modify Anna's memories too. A power like that could easily be used to mess with people without them being aware of it. Like for example, I've seen people speculate that maybe Kristoff isn't an orphan; he just thinks he is. Child-snatching is something that's associated with magical creatures anyway.

>this miedocre movie will be milked for the next 20 years.

What a time to be akive

Has anyone else heard the theory that the weird rock dudes mind raped Hans (With their mind rape powers) and made him blindly hate both of the sisters at the last minute?
But hey, that's just a theory...

Why this thread havent deleted yet ?

Mods i need you to do your job please, Frozen is not allowed on /co/

>>88287111
Oh? What's the story behind that one?

I hope Elsa marries a black chick with lightning powers

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>>88287136
>I hope Elsa marries a black chick with lightning powers
Yeah, Storm is my favorite X-Man as well.

>>88287133
600+ consecutive general threads that were basically just namefags and bloggers jerking each other off about how great their fanfics are

wish they did the same with RWBY

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>>88287133
>>88289860
also, context in this thread
>>88287856

the /frz/ generals started out ok if you just want to browse for new art and stuff, but as time went on, the "regulars" started using it as a daily blog. they just use the excuse of talking about frozen every now and again, then they just started shilling their DA pages and fanfic pages. then of course, the roleplayers.

i dont want to return to that bitter and cold time

>>88284497
They're saving that for Frozen 2: The Meltdown

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Lack of scans of this comic is proven that /frz/ is dead

>>88286081
>When Anna asked Hans to kiss him, what should he have done?
Not gloat about how evil he is right to her face?
>would Anna still want to marry him and get him closer to the throne?
Well she's gonna be dead soon and besides he pretty much already had the throne on lock at this point in the movie.
>be an easier task to try to reach the throne via Anna.
It would be harder to reach the throne via anna

>>88285591
Reminds me of the "God hardened Farao's heart"-thing in Prince of Egypt.

>>88285236
What do you gain from posting in a thread on a topic you dislike?

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>>88285489
Enjoy

>>88284497
I could sit through a couple of hours of lesbian incest.

>>88284955
Is Hans about to slap Elsa's ass with that sword? Because that's what their expressions are telling me.

>>88284569
>fire-powered Anna is stupid though

My idea was for Tangled/Frozen crossover movie, direct to video. In it, some blah blah blah would threaten the Kingdom and Elsa would decide that only her powers could stop it. But through some blah blah blah magic, the droplet of sun that once gave Rapunzel her hair and healing is fanned to life again and gives her fire powers.

>>88292656
While I would love it if the Disney Princess movies eventually turned into X-Men with 19th Century royalty, I think that the connections between movies should be left inferred.

https://youtu.be/I4HmlBRWRjQ

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>tfw no one else ships Hanna
But I like it in a wacky cartoon-y way, in which Hans keeps trying to murder Anna after they get married, and she just keeps managing to get out of every trap, completely oblivious

>>88285747
I was always told that forest fairies will fuck you up too. I think they're only nice in Disney's world

>>88284497
no, not even Ruan Jia can save frozen.

>>88292804
And even then, they're always a bit manipulative.

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Once the movie got going I was hoping that Hans would end up getting to know Elsa in prison and helping her out, turning into a romance thing which would make way for Anna and kristof to have relationship, fixing every problem. I knew Disney would let me down and I could see that shitty twist coming.

>>88294396
Well the writers did say they wanted to give Hans a redemption arc if they got a sequel, so I guess there's hope for you yet.

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>>88284497
Nah, Anna or anyone else having fire powers would have been too easy and cliche'd. I really hope they won't march out other magic users in the sequel, or at least not very many.

>>88285231
hear, hear.

>>88285416
>there is quite literally no reason for him killing ana nor elsa
He didn't kill Anna, he risked his life to save her and would have done it again. Anna showed up practically already dead from Elsa's curse, her skin was ice, hair white, too weak to walk and condition worsening. The only way to save her would have been the true love's kiss, as Anna told him, but he knew he didn't love Anna at all, in fact he disliked her, so there was nothing to be done.

I think that if he could have, he'd have kept Anna alive, married her, produced legit offspring and then become an aloof husband with mistresses on the side. But seeing how Anna was, as far as he knew, already as good as dead he just decided to stop wasting time and get on with killing Elsa before citizens would start to drop dead from the worsening cold.

When he says "if only there was someone who loved you" he believes it to be true.

Elsa on the other hand had to be killed because she couldn't control the winter, and so killing her was the best way to make the curse end before people would start to drop off from the cold. Also Anna told Hans that Elsa had cursed her to death with her powers, completely leaving out the accident part, so he believed her to be a murderess who'd killed her own sister to boot.

>>88294437
I would like that for a sequel but that's messed up that considering what he did. I'd rather the plot holes fixed and background basis, as much as I like Helsa.

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>>88285591
I don't think so. Hans seems to have have a steadily incresing dislike for Anna. He was attracted to her at first when they met, on the boat, but the longer he spends with her the more forced his smiles become and the more disdainful looks he starts throwing at Anna when she's not looking.

He really doesn't like crazy. At all.

>>88287111
Frozen discussion is naturally allowed, /frz/ as in frozen generals are not. this clearly isn't a general, so it's okay.

>>88291319
What do you gain from posting another unfunny, forced maymay thread?

>>88294841
I don't blame him. Wish he'd won and finished off their entire cursed line, to be honest. If only he were as strong as an actual hero, and not just a conniving wimp.

We needed Wesley and we got Humperdink

>>88294437
Citation Needed

(That would be pretty cool though actually because I don't think that Disney has ever Redeemed a Villain before so that would be an interesting route for them to go on)

>>88291896
Sadly, with current Disney this is exactly what an animated series would look like if they made one.

>>88295120
The Tangled Series and The Big Hero 6 Series don't look nearly as bad

>>88285591
Trolls aren't quite the Fae.

>>88295200
...Yrs they are

They are basically the shitty ones that do most of the kidnapping, food stealing, and cursing of people and homes. There are even certain days where one cannot go outside because it's the Troll's Night and they will curse the shit out of you.

They are just as bad about bargaining with humans for things that only really get them into much more shit down the road.

People that consort with trolls are supposed to be incredibly evil assholes too that plagues villages and eat people.

>>88295307
Slow lumbering big guys that use rock clubs and punch trees?

No anon, you seem to have no fucking clue what a fae is or how they work if you think for a second the dumb brute types of fantasy are anything related to them in the slightest.

>>88291896

Muh Dick

>>88284497
How about this, which getting stuck into Sunday's broadcast of the movie?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=X2jXpbS3TJo

>>88295542
Are you going by the RPG tier trolls or actual folklore?

>>88285591
watched Film theory too, it's more belieavable than him suddenly turning evil.

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Is /co/ gonna watch the Lego special tonite?

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>>88296175

>Toy Elsa

nope, not fappable unlike this

I really thought that all things Frozen were going to be the Disney holiday mascots. Every Christmas there would be Elsa and Christmas trees everywhere.

Kind of surprising that did not happen.

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>>88295116
Different anon, but Santino Fontana, his voice actor, mentioned in an interview for broadway.com already before Frozen 2 was confirmed that he'd been assuming that even if there was a sequel he wouldn't be in it, but they told him that actually they want to bring Hans back and redeem him.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zRApwIY98F4

Also just the fact that he's an interesting character whose backstory could be even more interesting and they bothered to put a worldbuilding map in Frozen Fever showing that
a) the Southern Isles are right next to Arendelle
b) Hans is alive and doing manual labour as a punishment a year after the events of the first movie
sort of hints that they might consider bringing him back. Writing redeeming character arcs would be easier if he'd have had to do hard labour for 2 years or so and would have had time to think about his actions.

And exactly like you say, it'd be cool and fresh to redeem a villain. It could be used to teach kids the lesson that even if YOU think you're right and your actions are justified and you're the hero of your own story, you can still end up doing really bad shit if you get blinded by your own righteousness, so it's important to evaluate your actions critically. People who do bad shit don't necessarily recognise it or think of themselves as villains, so it's dangerous to fall for the "I believe myself to be in the right, therefore I must be" mentality.

>>88296782
If Disney is going to redeem Hans, he can't just show back up claiming to be a different person. He has to be put through the grinder, be reshapened, essentially killed.

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ZZZZzzZZZZZZzzzzzZZzZZZzZZzZ...........

>>88290065
I have all three of these comics.

>>88297870
We're fucking discussing the movie, not pimping out shit fics or droning on about drilling Elsanna.

>>88297870
Go back to /a/ with that obnoxious shit. Report and fuck off.

>>88297888

Then scan it ?

Win o thread failed me hard.

>>88286081
>When Anna asked Hans to kiss him, what should he have done?
Play dumb and say he doesn't know why it isn't working

>>88297995
i'll do it tomorrow. I got work soon.

>>88298066

Thx anon.

also i been lied to in win o thread many times, i hope you not one of them

>>88298031
>Any Discussion about Frozen Movie is prohibited
But that's totally wrong, you idiot. Only the generals are prohibited.

>>88297812
Yeah, I'm fairly sure he's gonna pull a Disney Death in Frozen 2, like Anna, Flynn, Ralph etc did. He'll get "fatally injured" protecting Elsa or some shit like that to prove that he's really changed and is selflessly thinking of her best interest now, but will get healed and not die because magic.

But I'm fairly sure the writers at Disney aren't as dumb as to have Hans show up and just go "Oh I think differently now" and never have him prove it through his actions, because that'd be hack as fuck writing

>>88298127
no worries. i'll make a thread on it.

>>88298250
>hurrrr durrrr every thread where Frozen is discussed is a "stealth general"
You're a retard, anon. Frozen remains a very popular animated Disney movie that influenced the field a lot (despite being mediocre) and so it will get discussed. That's not the same as a general.

Stop your moronic shitposting. I get that you dislike Frozen but discussing Disney movies is allowed on /co/, all Disney movies. It's not a general. You're starting to border on spamming. Leave the thread and go spend time on something you enjoy, it'll be more productive.

>>88298294

Once again, thx.

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>>88298301

But theres nothing to discuss anymore frzfag, you only have one movie & a short that came out like, 3 years ago. thats it.

Hell, even Zootopia fanbase are more alive than you frzfag.

>>88298375
I just saw the movie yesterday. Just because I didn't see it at the same time as you doesn't mean I'm not allowed to discuss it. Just quit it with the wannabe board police shit. Just report and hide. Damn.

>>88298803
>just saw the movie yesterday
What did you think?

>>88298917
It was okay. As usual, toward the end I found myself rooting for the bad guy. I thought Anna was kind of retarded. I didn't really enjoy the big musical number. Didn't hate it, but compared to other Disney musical numbers I do like, it was middling at best.

I'd say I'm just getting too old for this, but looking back I think kid me would feel the same.

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>>88299012

Anna is a fucking slut

In fact, shes the most dumb slut disney princess in history

>>88299012
So you're basically me, then, apart from the doubt over getting too old for this. I really disliked the Broadway sound of a lot of the songs, I wish there'd have been more of a nordic sound to them

>>88284497
>Fire-themed Anna
>named Helsa
>not Sauna

Forgive Hans.

>>88299287
Helsa is the name of the pairing of Hans and Elsa. Although HELLsa is a pretty funny pun on its own. Sadly, it has nothing to do with fire Anna, At least not directly.

>>88299287
No no, they say "that isn't Helsa".
Helsa is the ship name for Hans x Elsa. Anna ships are Hanna (Hans x Anna), Kristanna (Kristoff x Anna) and Elsanna (you know who).

Anna with fire powers was speculated on a lot, but I really hope she won't turn out to ever have any magic powers of her own.

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>>88299193
>I wish there'd have been more of a nordic sound to them
This. I fucking love Norway and this movie was a huge Norgeboo let down.

>>88299622
I know. The first two songs with their distinctive nordicness really made me hype, then FTIF was kinda meh but still pretty okay, but the rest of the songs just drifted further and further away from the theme and the world. In Summer and Fixer Upper were the last and also the worst ones, so it definitely left a bad taste in my mouth. Why.

>>88296175
I'll watch. Looks pretty funny.

>>88296175
When and where?

>>88300326
On Disney channel in 50 minutes.

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>>88300453
Yay!

>>88300453
Well I'm hype

>>88300453
Let me know how it was t. foreignfag

That was amazing. Hans redeemed at last.

>>88301887
This
>>88302022
Don't tease me like that man

>>88302022
that's cruel famalama

LEGO Frozen sucked. It proved Anna isn't funny & she has no personality other than reckless optimism. At least they acknowledged that nobody likes the trolls.

>>88285202

That is not Scrapper but I do agree that Elsanna is the purest form of love and you cannot have enough of that.

>>88304142
So you must be Scrapper then

>>88304177

I'm not Scrapper but he does have fine tastes in pairings especially the intoxicating Elsanna.

>>88285416
>if he really was smart
villains are stupid tho

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>>88304501
That's enough from you

>>88304761

Every time I see this movie I think how much of a bastard do you have to be to want to bring harm on two beautiful ladies.

>>88304501
>I'm not Scrapper
Scrapper's motto.
You aren't fooling anyone.

>>88304828
That's easy. You just have to be dedicated to a goal. There's nothing more beautiful than success. If his goal were the women, that's fine, but he was looking further beyond that, you see? Ends, means, etc.

>>88304828
Why kill when you could eternally rape in your dungeon?

>>88305000

What a piece of shit.

>>88305015

Only sick fucks would ever even think about raping Elsanna.

>>88284569

kinda. I had a small fan theory that suggest she always bad heat or fire capabilities but her personality never really allowed for it to furnish. If elsa's powers were controlled via Love then it maybe that anas abilities where opposite requiring absolute hatred and fury. I think shes just never been so upset as to absolutely cause hell fire to rain from the skies.. other wise her passive heat has always just kept Elsas freeze in check until Elsa completely lost it and overpowered anas dormant sort of passive low simmer heat.

Ana will never realize her power because her personality is just too positive and upbeat to truly harness complete anger and hatred.

>>88305169
im dumb and cant type today (or proofread before submitting)

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>>88305058
Enough scrapper

>>88305285

I'm not Scrapper but I agree elsa is a goddess and needs to be protected.

I miss shitposting in /frz/

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>>88305555
It was never shitposting to me.

>>88285416
Source?

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>>88284497
No. Helsa is the only thing that can redeem Frozen.

>>88285591
my dumb yandere loving ass has been searching for a way to connect Kristoff with this track, and I'll just go ahead and take that.

(Singer is his VA)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fdxLohjwhoQ

>>88305928
It's Incase.

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>>88305058
How chivalrous. Watch out ladies, this one has a heart of gold.

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>>88307184
This is the answer I wanted

>>88304828
He's was doing it for the people of arendelle, they deserve royalty who would actually lead and not just go on dates with their sisters.

>>88285457
>Frollo
>not a LE Paladin

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>>88307184
So which type of Helsa is better
>redemption Helsa
Or
>ruthless power couple Helsa

>>88307334
Hans never killed Anna; that was all Elsa's doing. Hans attempted to kill Elsa, but he & everyone else concluded that since Elsa cannot stop the winter herself, taking her out would.

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>>88307423

>>88307423
Hans was never evil and went after Elsa instead of Anna is my ideal Helsa

>>88307624
Hans isn't evil. Evil people set puppies on fire or abuse people for keks.

>>88307729
I've never seen a truer post on 4chan. Like, your post actually made me think. I'm not even high.

>>88307729
>leaving a qt like Anna to freeze to death
>not evil

>>88307831
What else could he do?

>>88307825
Thanks, man! That helps my self-confidence.

>>88307831
It would be better for Arendelle & by extension the world if Anna died. What does she objectively provide to anyone?

>>88307865
He could have at least fucked her good first.

>>88307884
She offered many "goods" and "services" to the people of Arendelle, if you know what I mean.

>>88308036
Hans knows to not stick his dick in crazy.

Arendelle wouldn't whore out Anna though. She can fuck things up; hire an escort.

>>88307729
>>88307426

You are an evil person and i hope you die

>>88308286
How? How are either of those two comments evil?

>>88307423
Obviously the latter, but we have to be reasonable and understand that we're never getting that.

>>88308466

You cannot get past your personal bias for Hans and think he is some sort of hero when he has tried to kill both sisters. You need to have your head examined.

>>88308731
How did Hans attempt to kill Anna?

>>88308698
We can get a few doses of that. I'd imagine they'd be a more cynical couple.

>>88308805

He left her in a room to freeze to death.

>>88308824
They'll be the uptight straight men to Kristanna's crazy goof-off couple.

>>88308829
And how is her freezing his fault? He couldn't provide her with a cure.

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>>88284497
What could have saved frozen

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>>88308962
also this

>>88285416
Funny thing about Hans: when I watched Frozen (not knowing anything about the story beforehand) and Hans casualy told Anna he is the last in the (long) line for the throne I instantly thought something is up. Anyone beyond the second (maybe third) male child in a royal bloodline was entitled to absolutely fucking nothing back then. He was barely more than a peasant with his title.

>>88308905

He could have helped her but he didn't because he's a psychopath. Fuck him for trying to kill Elsanna.

File: All Hail her Grace, Elsa of the House Arendelle, the First of Her Name, Queen of the Ice and Snow, the Trolls and the First Snowmen, Lady Regnant of the Northern Kingdoms, Protector of the Realm and Khaleesi of the Great Frozen Sea.png (1MB, 1300x1844px) Image search: [Google]

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>>88284497
After a rough and painful travel Elsa freezes her own hearth to not feel anything anymore. Then takes over the neighboor kingdoms and rules with an iron fist. Only thing she ever show some affection is her mindbroken sister she takes as a concubine.

>>88309106

I can get behind this.

>>88309048
Oh you're one of those delusional lesbincest fags...

Like how could Hans have helped Anna?

>>88309249

By keeping her warm.

>>88285416
>InCase
I can recognize that artstyle anywhere.

>>88309269
But she was still going to die.

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>>88307423
I'm a fluffhead. I want cuddly redemption Helsa.

>>88309369

And he was bringing her close to death.

>>88309462
How can we know that? Anna was going to turn into ice, but who knows if anything could have been done to speed up or slow down the process.

>>88308268
Anna isn't crazy, she's just a dumb slut.

>>88309408
Nothing wrong with that as long as they don't act out-of-character.

>>88309617
Most sluts are crazy, anon.

>>88307624
But He still has to be a manipulative bastard.

>>88309626
Aww, so know cringey ATLA-comic-sweety moments? Phooey!

>>88309650
Crazy about Dick.

>>88309613

Well he obviously did it on purpose.

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So, uh, how about that Matpat video?

I think he was right, Hans showed no signs of betrayal and I found it narratively disingenuous to the point it soured the whole movie.

>>88300477

Already watched it.

Im too old to enjoy it btw, it was clearly made for kids.

>>88309462
>>88309269
Anna was already pretty damn close to death. She was so cold several people remarked on it in shock when they touched her - even through her winter clothing; Hans described her as being so cold to have "a skin of ice". Her hair had gone white. She was too weak to walk in on her own and even collapsed to the floor, too weak to stand.

"Keeping her warm" would have done absolutely nothing at that point. The curse kept advancing no matter if Anna stood in the hot springs steam or whatever - it's a curse, a magical curse, and you can't stop it through external means ffs

>>88309016
Same here. I've been watching so much period drama the "12 older brothers" thing was an instant red flag that he's absolutely damn desperate to marry into money. It's always the younger son characters like that who turn out to tragically have to abandon the girl they really love for a marriage of convenience to some rich heiress who they don't like but who's loaded. Seeing how Anna was a rich, loaded heiress, it just seemed highly suspect

>>88309766
Did what on purpose?

>>88309048
>He could have helped her
There was absolutely nothing he could have done. Pabbie said it clearly; only an act of true love can save her, and Hans didn't love her at all, so there was absolutely no way for him to help her.

You'd do well to remember the reason Anna was dying was Elsa's curse.

It's Elsa who killed Anna, not Hans.

(Yes, killed - she did actually turn into solid non-living ice before it was magically reversed)
Hans didn't effect Anna's death much at all; he didn't plan for it, didn't cause it in any way, couldn't have done anything to stop it, and only tried to speed up the inevitable a bit by putting out a fire in a fireplace, but that's all. Sure he's still a douche and he intended it to speed up Anna's death, but he's nowhere near the main culprit.

>>88308036
>He could have at least fucked her good first.

Literally like fucking a snowman with a slushie pussy tho. He'd have gotten severe frostbite injuries on his dick, not worth it imo

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>>88307423
Both, anon, both.

redemption at first so that it can happen, and then fluffy cuddles, tenderness and passion in private and ruthless power couple manoeuvering in the political arena.

>>88284497

>LET IT BURN, LET IT BURN

FILM THEORY

Are Anna and Elsa from Frozen lesbians as well as sisters????

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>>88313223
Obviously not

Anna daydreams of and lusts after men in a shockingly blatant way for most of the movie and canonically ends up in a het romance with Kristoff.
Elsa, on the other hand, didn't express interest in anyone because she spent most of the movie paralyzed with fear of herself and convinced that she'd kill anyone who got too close. Presumably in Frozen 2 she'll have gotten over her fears a bit and her character arc in the sequel will include daring to open herself up to love and finding a partner.

However, by the time Frozen 2 rolls around Elsa has been marketed worldwide for at least half a decade as a "normal" (=not gay) Disney heroine, and she's gained incredible cash cow popularity and profitability assumed straight. Disney has never ever had the guts to have a single canon gay human character (who's not a villainous sidekick) in their animated movies. They sure as fuck won't risk that gigantic leap with Elsa, who's pretty much the most profitable character they have right now, and possibly anger all the millions of parents who've been buying Elsa merch for their daughters. She'll never be a lesbian.

So, they'll both end up with male husbands. Possibly both won't marry by the end of Frozen 2, but eventually I'll bet you money they'll both be married off, even if just to sell some wedding dress special edition dollsets.

>>88295200
>>88295542
Troll are fae. Read old lore, put the comics down and go to your local library anon.

>>88298224
I'm expecting something similar, and if they convincingly show that Hans has changed and is now willing to help others for it's own sake then I have no doubt that Helsa will happen because it would be too good a full-circle ending for his character arc to not do it. In the end Hans gets what he wanted at the very beginning of his story (remember how he said that his original plan was to try to seduce Elsa?) not through plotting and scheming but by becoming a genuinely good person.

>>88284497

I always kind of assumed it was a seasonal thing, not an elemental thing.

Like, Elsa's power was winter magic, rather than ice magic, since she controls the weather and can grant life to snow.

I always assumed someone with powers like Elsa's would be seasonally themed, like someone who has autumnal or spring-based magic.

It'd actually be pretty cool if someone with Elsa-like powers but attuned to spring was also royalty. A small kingdom somewhere where has been and always will be a perfect, bountiful spring for as long as the ruler or their oldest child is never unhappy or scared.

>>88285416

Jesus, you're stupid. The POINT was that he was cementing his position as their hero.

>>88313972
Durrr but I tot fairy were lil winged girls??? Trolls n elfs n goblins is diffrant stuff. I never heard of no Seelie Court.

>>88311164
We'll I fucking hate the trolls so I'd be happy if matpat's theory was actually right for once

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>>88313189
I just want them cuddly.

>>88292741
Like in chitty chitty bang bang?

>>88292741
That would be wacky fun.

>>88321430
The Lego Special highlighted that people hated the trolls.

>>88284497
keeping the songs from the demo could have helped. anna being anti snow powers and wanting status quo could have helped

>>88322469
exactly like Chitty Chitty Bang Bang

>>88323828
But Anna didn't want the status quo. She wanted all the doors open & to marry Hans.

>>88323799
So are they going to rerun that or do I have to watch I'm online somewhere?

>>88324330
That would be the status quo.
this https://youtu.be/hUMiU2wp7ZQ

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Only thing that could've fixed frozen t b h
>>88324455
>the thumbnail sketch version
One thousand times better then what we got

>>88324343
You can watch it via Comcast OnDemand or it'll be on television sporadically throughout the winter.

>>88325025
Ok cool (no pun intended) thanks

>>88323828
Keeping the songs from the demo would have led to a completely different storyline, and I'm not sure it would have made for a better movie - at least based on "life's too short" both of the sisters seem a bit more selfish and obnoxious than they do in the final movie.

>>88325988
But at least they had friction in their relationship (albeit it still hinges on Elsa having powers)...

>>88326027
They still have some friction in their relationship, the situation in the movie was just so dire they didn't have time to address it. But in Frozen Fever, for example, it's pretty clear Elsa's still very traumatised about it all and is mainly trying to keep Anna happy out of her own guilt and self-loathing, which isn't very healthy, and which creates a thing for the sequel to solve.

But in the "prophecy" situation "Life's too short" is talking about would have made for a competely different movie, and again both sisters kinda come across as selfish bitches in the song. I agree that having more friction would have been nice but I still think they made the right choice in scrapping LTS, it wasn't the way to go, not the right way to build conflict.

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I really didn't like the Broadway Sound. I mean, I love theater, but even I hate Broadway.

>>88326564
It's true, it didn't fit at all.

>>88326168
Elsa may have some lingering anxiety, but that's not actual friction (yet). There's no conflict between the two. We really need to see the sisters have a dispute that isn't rooted in Elsa's magic, such as Anna's frivolous spending or Elsa's restraint on generosity.

>>88284497
those arms...

>>88313059

Putting out the fire.

>>88313090

Stop looking at Hans through rose colored lens. He was a ruthless bastard who wanted power.

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>>88327553
Disney has a very distinct sound and the broadway sound completely destroyed that part of Disney magic in the film. Brother Bear is more memorable than Frozen.
>>88328724
Why do you keep pushing this? He wasn't in the wrong.

>>88284497
Save it from what? Making insane amounts of money?

>>88329087
Save it from being a bad story. Making money doesn't make a story inherently good.

>>88329305
You should contact Disney with your ideas, I'm sure they'd love the opportunity to get out of the vicious circle of making mad dough that they're trapped in.

>>88328569
Looks like Anna is more closely related to Quasimodo than Tarzan. Maybe she has scoliosis.

>>88328724
Yes, but why does it matter if Hans put out the fire? Anna was going to die & Arendelle needed to conserve firewood.

Did Hans really want power? On the outside, yes. But frankly he has gone his whole life associating power with respect. In the Southern Isles, the closer to the crown you were, the more power you wielded, & by that the more attention & respect you garnered. Arendelle only further supported this idea as Anna, a retarded whore was respected solely because she was a princess. When Hans became associated with Anna, he became a respected figure of authority. Unlike Anna, he was honored & grateful to be in his political position.

>>88328960

Yes he was you delusional little shit

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>>88329411
>tfw this close to becoming CalArts student
>>88329957
Killing Elsa would have saved everyone in the kingdoms from freezing to death. Anna would have died regardless of the kiss or not.
Hans 2, (you) 0

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I would be okay with Elsa getting a Girlfriend if that girlfriend was Hansa.

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>>88330205
I wouldn't dislike that idea BUT

>>88330320
This is actually kinda scary. Like he takes her in and starts teaching her how to use her powers offensively and honing her into a WMD.

>>88329938

I don't give a shit why he did what he did, the fact of the matter is he did horrible things to the sisters and you cannot spin that any way.

>>88330108

Except there was another way that didn't involve killing anyone you psychopath.

>>88330510
He was cruel to Anna after she made him feel like a complete ass & was going to kill Elsa to save Arendelle. Being verbally cruel isn't a crime, & one sacrifice is worth to save masses of others.

What would be the other way? We gotta rule out the Elsa has an unrelated epiphany & lifts the winter deus ex machina.

>>88329938
>>88329938

Are we still talking about Hans or what you headcanon Hans to be?

>needed to conserve firewood
Oh man, you're really reaching now.

I just wish Hansfags would admit that the only reason they justify him and want him redeemed is because they think he's hot. You rarely ever see someone ask for a redemption without also asking he hook up with Elsa.
It's the reason Hans is always the good guy but never the old and ugly Duke.

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>>88330510
Sure whatever but killing her is simple and involves the least variables. People are so defensive over one damned Ice Witch. Shit, these days a hero can't even vanquish someone like Maleficent without inciting a picket line.

>>88330510
>Except there was another way that didn't involve killing anyone you psychopath.
Which one would that be?

>>88330624
>Anna after she made him feel like a complete ass
lol wut? You're going to need to explain that one. Hans had Anna wrapped around his finger the whole time.

>kill Elsa to save Arendelle
He was going to kill Elsa before he even knew about her magic, before Arendelle was ever in danger. He literally says this himself, he wanted power and she was in the way. Saving Arendelle was just a convenient excuse.

>>88330801
Yeah, it's a pretty neat bonus though. If only Hans weren't so weak. But I guess the plot required it. Pity.

>>88328724
>He was a ruthless bastard who wanted power.
Sure, but at the same time Elsa was the one responsible for Anna's death, not Hans. He's a dick but he didn't cause Anna's death nor did he plan or particularly wish for it; he just disliked her and chose to be a dick to her face and stop wasting time instead of pretending to be nice till the end.

You can dislike him all you want, but trying to spin his actions into worse than what they were doesn't make you seem like the objective one, you know.

>>88330692
This has ruined nu-Disney for me. You can argue they've had villains, but they don't feel like real antagonists I want to hate. Now it's either I WAS THE VILLAIN THE WHOLE TIIIIIME or villain redemption. Moana could've had the crab be a great antagonist, but he's incredibly wasted. Why can't there be another Maleficent tier villain again? Not the shitty new version, the "I'll spend the next two minutes saying how you'll never see your loved one ever again" version.

>>88330630
Not the guy you've been arguing with but my beef with Hans is the piss poor way that they handled him in Frozen. He went all Snidely Whiplash because they wanted a villain twist. It would have been just as easy to make him a genuinely decent guy who was just going about fixing the problem the wrong way. Disney majorly dropped the ball with Hans by not giving him depth or humanity. They did the same thing with Mother Gothel. She could easily have had a softer side, maybe have her own moral struggle with keeping Rapunzel imprisoned.

I'd love to have seen Hans kiss Anna, which doesn't save her. That spurs him into a sort of desperate need to do something to save Anna and Arendelle. He believes he has to kill Elsa to do both, even though he doesn't WANT to, but he's the Hero and a hero must act, etc. He's wrong, but he's not evil, and certainly not the cartoony evil we got at the end of Frozen.

My desire for a redemption for him is based on that more than anything else.

>>88330510
>the fact of the matter is he did horrible things to the sisters
Such as? Be a gold digger and pretend to be in love when he wasn't? Oh wow what a shocker an unmarried princess first in line to the throne has some men courting her who are actually after the money and power and not her as a person, who could have known? Wow it's def not like the princess should have thought it might be the case and been a bit more wary.

Or are you talking about how he kept the citizens of Arendelle alive? Or managed to keep Elsa from becoming a murderer and also saved her life by preventing her getting an arrow to the back? Or the way he pleaded with her respectfully to stop the winter, even though she'd sent her snow monster to attack him and her own men and who'd almost killed Hans? Or how he risked his life on the search & rescue mission for Anna and was willing to do it again?

Hans isn't a hero, but his main flaw is just that he's ruthless and was willing to enter into a loveless marriage for the sake of money and power, even if it took some lying. That sort of gold digging isn't that uncommon though. He was also possibly prepared to kill someone if that's what it took to reach the throne, but that's only on the level of speech and never materialised into action.

He's pretty well written in his ambiguousness.

>>88330801
Yeah Anna put Hans through shit during their courtship. Sliding down the hall in your stockings, hiding from the guards because lol, playing hide-&-seek in the stables? That's not what dignified royals do.

Saying you were going to kill someone & actually killing someone are two different things. Hans committed to the latter when it was the best option for everyone. If he wanted Elsa dead, then why did he interfere at the summit siege?

>>88330838
What?

>>88330987
Disney did not give Hans depth, but there's plenty of room to accommodate it.

While your motivation for Hans's redemption is based upon how the story should have been handled, I've attributed my desire to an inner goodness in the character. He's courteous, generous, understanding to animals, & incredibly brave. Bad guys aren't nice to animals; Hans was the fuckin' horse whisperer.

>>88330624

Except you can't because that's what happened.

>>88330692

Because these "witches" matter.

>>88331138
And does Hans truly want power? Or some goddamn respect?

Hans can begin a redemption once he learns that power does not equal respect.

>>88331746
But you have to ignore having Elsa lift the snow as an option if she stated she was unable to. It was scratched as a possibility in Hans's mind because of that.

>>88331746
How does Elsa matter? Sure, she's queen, & yes, none of the snow or ice or suffering was intended, but there's still hundreds of just as innocent lives at stake regardless. What is one life sacrifice compared to the detriment of hundreds? It's not fair, but that was what the situation was.

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>>88330510
t. tumblr

>>88332824
Fuck that's dark. It's one thing to slap it in the face of Anna who just bounced around wherever she wanted, but a mother to her child?

I sympathize for Hans, but no way was his life that bad. He was still a prince.

>>88331746
WLM

>>88333235

Actually, I do seem to recall the creators saying that Hans is the way he is in part because he grew up unloved. 13th in line can't even see spare to the throne with a fuckin' telescope, the guy probably had zero prospects for his future except as one of his brothers' clerks if he didn't bang a princess.

Hans having fire powers

>>88333235
>I sympathize for Hans, but no way was his life that bad. He was still a prince.
Why do you think that being a prince - a 13th one - would automatically mean having good, caring and loving parents who are there for you?
Do you think that royalty or rich people are by default amazing, great people who are emotionally present and wonderful at parenting? Or do you think that having money equals balanced and close family relations?

Jennifer Lee, the writer-director, stated in a Reddit AMA that in her view "Hans is a tragic character, a product of growing up without love". His life canonically sucked.

Also an official tie-in book, though not really canon, presented his home situation prior to the events of the movie as downright abusive, both physically and mentally. So while the book again isn't proper canon (it actually contradicted some onscreen events from the movie itself, got Hans' age wrong etc. etc.) it seems that Hans' life was pretty damn bad which explains why he was desperate to marry Anna if he couldn't get Elsa.

He was willing to pull almost anything to get the fuck away from home.

>>88309408
you might get y(our) wish
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rc6NgT_6jGE

>>88339856
If Hans hated his situation so much, he could have dropped his titles & left the kingdom. I guess he wasn't as vapid as Jasmine, though.

>>88284497

>>88342954
Was there more?

>>88340082
The flip side though.... I hope they don't just have the trolls make him forget being bad or some dumb shit.

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>>88339513
I actually thought this was going to happen when Hans put out the fire in Anna's room

>>88344482
Wouldn't be the first copout...

>>88325988
>different storyline
and it would have been better
>obnoxious
I don't know where you are getting that from. is it the voice or do you just think anyone who is not willing to dump their own interests and happiness to accommodate others is obnoxious

>>88326168
>selfish bitches
harsh, seriously were are you getting this?
>not the right way to build conflict.
why? one wants to be free of all the guilt and self-loathing and another wants things to be comfy and her sister not to be the prophesied ice queen. its there moment of truth and outburst, its not like they would be like that the whole movie. having characters grow is more interesting than the plot being about moving from point a to point b for a conversation that could/should have been had ages ago. to me they seem a lot less bitchy(or whatever) than merida from brave and people loved that crap + here it would make more sense than in brave

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>Dat Elsa & Anna horny face

Muh Dick