It is just me or was Cottonmouth a really incompetent villain?

>>86689955

Well Fisk is alive and coming back to power and Kilgrave ruined Jessicas life and was a lasting threat through the entire season. So no, it's not just you, it's the intent of the story

He wasn't cut out for it but had it thrust upon him, whereas his cousin was the opposite.

EVRYBODY WANTOBE DA KING

>>86689955
Kilgrave was a fucking moron and was only alive because Jessica was also

>>86689955

He was a mid level guy, really. He wanted to be feared, but he didn't really have *it*. That's why he kept laughing all the time. He felt uncomfortable in the role he was playing, but he didn't know anything else to do.

Which makes him an interesting parallel to Diamondback, who was certainly unhinged and made for that life. Diamondback is who Cottonmouth wanted to be, but didn't have the personality or damage for it.

Honestly, I didn't know what to expect. I didn't know it was all going to be like this. I let my kids see some of it because they loved the Marvel stuff. I thought it was going to be like those Avengers and Captain America movies. But when the hip-hop music started playing, I had to ask my son to leave the room

>>86690322
You mean your wifes son.

>>86689955
>Cottonmouth
>villian

>Be raised by shitty mother who forces you to do terrible things you don't want to do
>All you want to do is play music and be a musician. You're even talented.
>Your bitchy sister gets to go to college while you're forced to run a criminal empire and kill the one person who believed in you
>Always kind of resent your mother and sister, but still love them because family
>Regret when Pop dies because you looked up to him
>Kill the real niggers who are just shitty people
>Insult your sister when you're both having a bad day and she gets swept up in emotion and kills you, completely ignoring the "family first" moto you were raised on
Cottonmouth may not have been a great villain, but I found myself sympathizing with him. And i'm not even black.

So was Shades white or a pale mulatto?

>>86690442
hispanic/white

dudes last name is alvarez

>>86690442
He was latino

>>86690442

Mexican

>>86690442
Puerto rican, like the actor.

>>86690490
>>86690493
>>86690507
>>86690521
Huh. I considered that but dismissed it as unlikely since he was from Georgia instead of New York.

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>>86690593
>since he was from Georgia instead of New York.

They have latinos there too man

>>86690593
He is from New York. He was just jailed in Georgia. He even talked about how when he was growing up he had respect for Mama Mable

>>86689955
Hes not a supervillain, just some guy making money on the streets

Keep watching, youll see

>>86690322
>I didn't know a show about crime in Harlem focused on black people was going to have hip-hop
You're the dumbest mother fucker ever

Cottonmouth was a broken hearted man.
So much talent quelled early, so Ma Mabel could have dumb muscle to do her bidding.
But he wanted to have his place be vibrant and alive with contemporary music, and he almost succeeds - if not for that tosser Dante and his two string-alongs.
He could have been something else, and he knows it. He does his level best though, and is intimidating and oddly graceful despite his advanced sociopathy.
A complex villain, I like him.

Mariah though, she's effin' dangerous.

>>86689955
that was the point

>>86689955
I think that was part of the point, he thought he was hot shit and then got easily overwhelmed. People constantly told him shit like "don't put all those funds in one place" and he was so sure of himself that he didn't listen. The others also had precautions like how Fisk had his illegal dealings behind layers and layers of corruption while Cottonmouth was pretty much known by everyone to be a crime boss but he ruled out of fear with only a few people there for evidence cover up purposes. He is essentially the guy a real boss gets to run an area or two, so a middle management guy thinks he can run a franchise but can't handle more than a disgruntled customer.

>>86690593
Are you a retarded yuropoor?

>>86689955
Cottonmouth simply bit off more than he could chew. Hes not cut out to be Kingpin, but thats nothing against him by any means.

>>86690977
This. He could've been something good, but his mother and sister ruined his life. I won't pretend he's innocent. But he's definitely not evil, or at least, not as evil as the ones who made him that way.

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>>86690442
Whatever Mister Worldwide is

>>86691069
>mother and sister
Aunt and cousin. His actual mom abandoned him and left him at her doorstep.

>>86691120
Shades is Puerto rican, Bulldog is Cuban

>>86691153
Ah, yes. My mistake. Still my point stands. His family was fucked up from the start. If his parents would've been there for him he might've become something good. The story of most black criminals.

Ali did such a great job playing him, it was a shame he was killed so early on. I wish we had more scenes of him using shit like bazookas . He was a hell of a lot more interesting than Diamondback at least.

Also, someone needs to make a compilation of his laugh scenes.

>>86690421
>mother
>sister
Did you autists even watch the show?

>>86691223
Diamondback felt like he came out of no where
He had buildup for sure but then they just plopped him out

>>86691259
Wow. I missed one detail that was mentioned but a few times in the show for some brief seconds and apparently that means I didn't watch the show. I guess you'll just forget everything else I mentioned too because then it would mean you're wrong.

>>86690219
MY NAME AINT COTTONMOUTH

>>86689955
He wasn't as good as Fisk, nor should he be. Kingpin is supposed to be the rising star of organized crime, these other criminals are just blips on the radar

>>86691358
in his backstory which consisted of two episodes he said aunt and uncle and cousin multiply times

>>86691202
Except for Willis Stryker who's just batshit crazy.

>>86691358
They called each other cousins multiple times. Mariah constantly mentioned how she practically raised Cottonmouth after he was abandoned by his mother. Hell, they didn't even have the same last name.

Sorry, mate, but I think you might be retarded.

>>86691358
he called her cuz alot

>>86691259
You don't understand autism then - if we were autists we'd remember every detail, including what brand shirt everybody wore and how many times Shades removed his ... uh.. shades.

>>86691446
Even him, Only reason he went batshit was because he was abandoned and left to rot by his brother and father

>>86691422
>>86691466
Sorry, I only remember things releated to the plot. How was the fact he was a cousin important? He literally could've been Mama Mabel's son and there would've been no difference whatsoever. Mariah still kill him because her mammaries went out of control.

I liked Diamondback, he was Loki but not written/casted to be charming and as redeeming.

>>86691558
So you're just doubling down on stupid then?

What I fount weird was how Shades made it seemed like Diamondback was tired or had some growing animosity about Cottonmouth and then when we meet him, and Willis considered him his best friend.

>>86691597
Seems like he is

>>86691558
No-one said it was insanely significant, just that you're retarded. No need to move goalposts and justify your stupidity, it's fine, we get it.

>>86691558
>>86691597
Has anyone on /co/ ever just been corrected and reacted with a "oh, that's right, my fault."?

>>86691549
True enough, Lucas Sr. was a bastard who didn't care for his kids.
But Willis went over the top though.
Cottonmouth kept himself calm through most of it.

>>86691606
You just don't get him, he's so wacky!

>>86691635
I have, or either just dropped it and moved on.

>>86691635
Well, I actually did. see >>86691202
I was ready to admit to making a mistake. I just got upset that these guys started insulting me for something like this. I admit it. I was mad. Not for being called out on the mistake, but for assholes getting all smug because I messed up a detail.

>>86689955
I like how he seemed pretty immediately incompetent. From that first exchange with Shades you get the feeling that he's a small fish in a bigger pond.

>>86691655
Shades was lying. He was trying to gain more power over Cottonmouth and using Diamondbacks name to do it. That's why he discouraged Cottonmouth just calling him to fix shit.

>>86691711
Why is /co/ full of so many thin-skinned faggots? Is /co/mblr real?

>>86691894
It's been real for the past 5 years at the very least, but it isn't because of him.

>>86691894
>gets triggered that other people get triggered.
triggerception?

Thread theme.
https://youtu.be/bk67TqxQzGo

>>86691981
>interpreting my post as being "triggered" because I said /co/mblr
Sorry, are you triggered?

>>86692001
This dude and his song were fucking retarded.

Point is from his backstory is that he barely wanted to be a mobster, but was sorta forced into the life.

>>86691606
That's what I thought at first but after how everything played out I'm pretty sure >>86691760
was right. Shades was just being Starscream.

Jessica Jones theme > Luke Cage Theme > DD theme

Sorry

>>86692075
>NO U
great comeback *obvious sarcasm*

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>>86692222
Your post was literally "NO U" in the first place, you inbred mongoloid.

>>86692001
Loved that scene and the use of music with the club. I think there's some weird missteps with the show but there's some really unique, fantastic things they do.

>>86689955
>Especially compared to Fisk and Kilgrave.
>Kilgrave

Compared to Kilgrave a retarded squirrel is competent.

I liked that he was incompetent because they played out his incompetence. It wasn't like he was incompetent and everyone respected him still. Shades was constantly on his ass for fucking up, Mariah too.

>>86691760
I was sure that they would reveal that there was Diamondback and Shades was pulling a Mandarin all along.

>major tonal shift in the middle of the season because mariah killed cottonmouth
>killed him because not muh permission/no means no/I wasn't asking for it
>stupid feminist bullshit
when will Marvel be stopped?

>>86692393
She literally got so triggered that she kill him, becoming a worse person than he ever was. If anything, this should make all the feminists butt mad that this paints them in a negative like. At least cottonmouth looked after his family. Mariah betrayed the one single good thing her family stood for.

I really liked the guy. I thought it was a pretty interesting take on a villain: a guy acting like hot shit, but turns out he's not all that he claims to be.

Especially when you find out that he didn't even want this life. I also really liked how you later find out why that club meant so much to him and why he enjoyed listening to artists performing on stage. The guy really loved music with a passion. That was the life he wanted, but couldn't have. He was easily one of the better parts of the series.

>>86692474
Cotton was innocent. His aunt and cousin were the real evil.

>>86692550
>cousin
Mariah was raised by the same person

>>86692566
So..? It doesn't stop them being cousins and referring to each other as such.

>>86689955
I'm not through yet, but he seems to be lucking and murdering his way out of everything. Definetly not a very smart guy. But then I interrupted my Narcos binge for this so he's a fucking master criminal compared to good old Escobar.

Still, I'm at episode 7 now and I literally thought to myself "oh no, not again".
Right now I'm done with cottonmouth. I wish they would just switch to diamondback instead of just dragging cottonmouth out to fill 12 episodes. It's the exact same shit that utterly broke Jessica Jones for me. Don't just do two fucking story loops with the same villain if he gets utterly fucking shut down by episode 6.

>>86692666
Close the thread and keep watching, my man.

>>86692592
obviously I wasn't questoning the fact that she was his cousin

just that she has every reason for being innocent that cottonmouth had

>>86692666
Keep watching.

>>86692710
Ah right, my mistake. Still, it was explained away by Mariah being sheltered and protected her entire life thanks to her academic skills and flirting with the uncle.

>>86692666
That's some weak bait, Satan.

>>86692269
No u

Should I watch Jessica Jones before Luke Cage? I heard it was absolute shit though.

Watched all of DD though.

>>86689955

That was the point -- he wasn't cut out for being a mob boss and he never really wanted to be, he was just forced into it by his family and tradition.

>>86692710
The thing with Cottonmouth was that he wasn't cut out to be a gangster but was forced to be one, while Mariah was cut out to be one, but was pushed into becoming legitimate. Cottonmouth isn't really innocent, but underneath he was a better person than Mariah, though if you go by what Mariah says later on, he was trying to make her a criminal too because he knew she would be good at it.

>>86692815
It's not absolute shit. It's a drag at times and it's poorly written in some parts because of the whole "oh no! the villain has gotten away!!!" but it's an enjoyable watch. It takes place before Luke Cage too so yeah, it's best to watch it first. Would've benefitted from being cut by about 5-6 episodes.

The politician was the real villain

They reveal pretty early that he wasn't a good gangster, needing the politician's money for his club.

>>86692305
Yeah, Kilgrave wouldn't be able to survive without his powers. When you can mind control everyone around you, you have no reason to become a functional human being and Kilgrave is the perfect example of that.

>>86692666
>Escobar
What did he do?

>>86694107
But he was good at acting!
Remember the Chamber?

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>>86690322
your wife's son is going to grow up to despise you

>>86692815

Cage is built up in JJ and theres a few plot threads from JJ that show up here too. Why not just watch it and make your own opinion?

>>86692815
>picking and choosing what to watch in the MCU and asking about continuity

>>86689955
He was never meant to be a villain. The narrative gives you so many contrasts between him and the true villain Diamondback. His backstory all but beats you over the head that he is living the wrong life. Shooting his uncle was the worst mistake of his life.

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>>86690322
>your head

>>86691331
The part that pisses me off was the "I am your brother" reveal. There was just no lead-up to that, and I didn't care. It didn't really add anything, even with all the family-comes-first stuff. And then they couldn't even let him be permanently removed from the equation at the end. He'll be back in S2, expecting me to care.

>>86690273
>Diamondback is who Cottonmouth wanted to be, but didn't have the personality or damage for it.
He wanted to become a woman in order to escape from the crimes and murders that he committed like Bruce Jenner?

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At first I hated Cottonmouth, but I've come around to him. The 1 hero vs. 1 nemesis per season idea was going to get stale on Netflix soon, so I'm glad they tried to do something different with the guy. A lot of his plans turned to shit, but that's also true to gang life as well. There are always factors you don't account for, or stuff you underestimate.

Cottonmouth and his cousin kept saying how they are Harlem, but Harlem had a grip on them and their identities the whole time. They were both talented people, but their family and their environment kept shaping them whether they liked it or not. Mariah is an interesting parallel, because Harlem and her family kept shaping her into being something she always had a knack for.

>>86695727
I'm not going to fight you on how dumb Diamondback's first appearances were, but it was also pitch-perfect on what Luke Cage's early comics were like. He was always going up against these huge bragadocious weirdos.

I think the series was just trying to juggle a lot of moods and themes and sometimes the whole thing just came off as schizophrenic. I still find it to be an entertaining show, though.

>>86695823
watch the show you fucking casual

>>86695823
The other Diamondback you stupid casual. The Luke Cage character.

>>86689955
The real antagonist in the show wasn't any particular person, but the black person's struggle against a world that they feel that is against them.

>>86692393
I don't like Mariah, dude, but it's not weird she freaked when accused of enjoying uncle molesting her

>>86691164
Bulldog?
I like that.
You funny

>>86689955

So what? Not everyone has the same power level.

Plus, I liked him and his story. Way better than Kilgrave.

>>86695727
There was some lead up. The flashback had Carl choose the name "Luke" because his father was a preacher, and Willis mentions his father being a preacher shortly after showing up and starting to quote the bible.

>>86691069

His backstory worked for the same reason Fisk's did - It wasn't anything too left-of-field or shocking, no single event that changed him, rather a series of events you look at and go "yeah, that's exactly what a person who had an upbringing like that would probably turn out like".

>>86690242
>>86692305
This.
>>86696981
>Way better than Kilgrave.
I liked Cottonmouth too, but being better than Kilgrave is not really an accomplishment.

>>86689955
>Get me Kingpin!
>He's unavailable.
>Then get me his nonunion black equivalent!

>Stokes
On one hand it makes me wish Cottonmouth's surname was "King" to fit his kings motive, on the other hand it's too on the nose.

Did anyone else see eminem every time shades was on screen? I couldn't get it out of my head.

>>86695727
>No lead up
>First scene has him imitating nearly word for word the 'my father was a preacher' lines luke did in the previous episode
>no lead up
>not incredibly obvious

I didn't know /co/ still had people with sub-80 IQs

>>86690322
You're a bad person.

>>86692393
Sounds like someone has never been violently raped.
>>86692815
JJ is fine. There is a callback but it's not needed.
>>86692874
I think all of the Marvel shows on Netflix would benefit from being cut down by a few episodes.
Luke Cage feels the least padded out though- there is actually enough plot for the whole season.

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Shades was fucking based.

>>86699119
Yea that's what I kept thinking too. Fucking Slime Shad(e)y

>>86692815
Nah. It is shit though, you're correct there.