Im new to comic books, how exactly is this supposed to work out?

>>85806103
>kino

Get out.

>>85806103
1. Get over yourself on this kino bullshit
2. Runs with specific characters are still totally worth reading, and it also gives you a better understanding of those "kino" titles. Reading Books drawn by Steve Ditko, for instance, will let you appreciate the watchmen characters based on his work, as well as the grid panel structure that was so consistent in Ditko's work. Or perhaps you would read the Lee/Kirby run of the fantastic four to see the best of what the silver age had to offer.
3. That being said, independent titles are probably your cup of tea, in which case it's up to you to find the stories you find appealing and the art you like.
4. As far as keeping up, yeah you can ignore most books that come out. Read the ones you like and you'll figure it out eventually

>>85806103
Wow, you have some shit taste anon, maybe comics aren't for you...but I think you'd like Questionable Content, I think it's your kind of Web comic.

>>85806103

>I'm not into cspehsit it isn't kino
>except these few capeshit stories I've been told are classics, they are kino

Top kekles me old chum

All you anons posting in a clear bait thread. At least learn to sage, guys.

>>85806103
>Im mainly interested in Kino
What the fuck is kino?

>>85806255
>>85806281
>>85806237
>>85806183
>>85806234
I always overestimate the age of these boards

I use the term "kino" ironically, but my point is that Im absolutely not interested in reading monday cartoon tier drivel "runs" that are only "worth" reading because X character is in it

the average cape story is absolute trash which is why singular stories like the killing joke are held in such high regard- I want to read good stories that dont take me hours of scourging through shitty money grabs that were made for neckbeards

>>85806388

Killing joke is literally an average Batman story though.

Not OP but I am interested in cape comics.

>>85806388
The Killing Joke is pretty shit as far as self-contained stories go though, there's so much better out there.

>>85806431
Astro City.

>>85806388
Read Azzerello's Wonder Woman.

plebeian taste, op

>>85806388
>Thinks he knows comic kino.
>Likes Killing Joke.
>No mention of indies or bandes dessinees.

>>85806388
You aren't interested in reading anything.

If you were interested then you wouldn't be ignoring the suggestions.

>>85806159
is there a part 2?

>watchmen
>TDKR
>Killing Joke

Lemme guess, your next purchases will be Kingdom Come, Batman Year One and Daredevil Born Again/Man Without Fear?

So fucking cliche. Your just skimming a "best comics ever" top 10.

Read some stuff and make your own mind up you fucking bandwagoner faggot.

>>85806491
Part 2 is where you learn to go out and look for things on your own.

what the fuck is kino

>>85806431
The easiest way to get into cape comics are to just think of a character you like from movies/tv/whatever the fuck you've seen them in, and then read either their current ongoing, or just look up recommended readings. In my experience, while DC currently has way better books, Marvel's the best way to get into comics, because Marvel Unlimited is really good.

>>85806375
A forced meme.

>>85806522
I'm asking because at least this guy is making this thread a little more interesting

>>85806521
>implying Watchmen isn't top tier

>>85806103
>not the usual capeshit where the only appeal is if youre fanboying the specific characters
That's actually usual only if you are casual who doesn't care about comics.

Best way to follow comics is by authors.

>>85806388
>singular stories like the killing joke
So, you're looking for stories that Alan Moore has disowned?

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>>85806431
http://www.mediafire.com/essentialcapeshit

>>85806564
Pic related.

>>85806521
>So fucking cliche
>Read some stuff and make your own mind up you fucking bandwagoner faggot.

so you cant like popular things? If you wouldnt be such an angry retard with teary eyes you would have noticed I was specifically asking for more to read since those are basically the only things ive read apart from a few random batman, spawn, spiderman and lobo comics

>>85806388
Neonomicon is a great book, anon. You should follow it up with Lost Girls. Both grade A Alan Moore at his best.

Miracleman by Alan Moore is top tier also

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>>85806103
>Kino

Using /tv/ memes outside of /tv/ should be bannable offense.

>>85806600
why would I care about what he thinks? Its painfully obvious he has "disowned" it because he thinks he is above superheroes now

>>85806640
>>85806666
premise?

>>85806686
>Its painfully obvious he has "disowned" it because he thinks he is above superheroes now
No, he just thinks it's a terrible story, and he's right. More or less all of his other superhero stuff he either likes or still sees the good points of, but he hates TKJ with a burning passion.

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You've already been getting suggestions and you're stil harping on about cape shit. If you keep focusing on what you want to avoid, you will orient yourself directly at it.

Stuff on my shelf right now that doesn't need the context of "cape shit"
- Strangers In Paradise by Terry Moore
- Concrete by Paul Chadwick
- Love and Rockets by Los Bros Hernandez
- A Contract With God by Wil Eisner
- How Loathsome by Ted Naifeh
- V For Vendetta by Alan Moore (don't watch the movie)
- Finder by Carla Speed Macneil

want good capeshit?
Miller's Daredevil
Doom Patrol (Drake/Premiani, Morrison)
Simonson's Thor
Ostrander's Suicide Squad
Kirby/Lee Fantastic Four
Thunderbolts
Azzarello's Wonder Woman
Superior Foes of Spider-Man
some good stuff I've read, hope there's enough variation

>>85806686
Miracleman it's how alan moore thinks it's a good captain marvel/shazam story, it has kind of the same elements like transforming with a word (kimota), but making it more like watchmen superheroes in the real world and all the classic alan moore stuff

>>85806608
M8, he's asking how to get into capeshit. You don't introduce someone to capeshit through shit like Invincible.

>l-looking for great stories like Killing Joke, Watchmen, TDKR
>implying TKJ is that good

It's pretty good, but there's better stories, much better. If you're not interested in stories where certain characters are in them and "shit made for neckbeards" then maybe you should fuck off. Characters are just as important as the story, because it represents the mood and emotion of the story, along with the art. It's what descripting writing is to a novel.

I know you're not interested in investing time to getting familiarized with certain characters and knowing their pasts and shit, but if you disregard that, their way of being, how one of them would react in a situation, then maybe comics just aren't for you.

That being said, if you still want to read some, just look up writers.

>>85806822
If he's interested in "kino" it's not capeshit.

>>85806686
>why would I care about what he thinks?
You trust him to write a story, but not his ability to evaluate the finished product?

>Its painfully obvious he has "disowned" it because he thinks he is above superheroes now
In the first place, he's disowned it because he thinks the story is too slight and poorly told story. It is both of these things. The Brian Bolland art is the only thing that makes it work.

In the second place, it's a /co/ meme that Moore hates comics, and superhero comics in particular. He doesn't. He just isn't interested in working for DC or Marvel.

>>85806822
I don't see Invincible in that recommendation. Why are you pulling Invincible out of your ass?

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>>85806760
Underrated Post, right there.

I'm still mad the SS movie butchered this scene so badly

>>85806159
I wouldn't recommend this pretentious shit to people looking to get into the hobby. This stuff is very limited in appeal in general.

>>85806910
He has disowned all of his corporate work, and he doesn't like it because it made innocent characters and he medium more rapey.

>>85806971
Could you explain to me why you think that those comics are "pretentious" and why you think that they're "shit"?

Instead of looking for limits in others, maybe you should reconsider how you're choosing to limit yourself.

>>85806978
However, he disowned for The Killing Joke for distinct reasons.

>>85806103
Read The Life and Times of Scrooge McDuck

>>85806971
>pretentious
>wahhhh why aren't the characters punching each other
>why is this making me think abloo bloo bloo

>>85806978
>He has disowned all of his corporate work
Post a source, please. What else has he clearly and explicitly disowned?

>>85806971
It might be a little pretentious to recommend them to someone just starting out, but come on dude some of those are the peak of the medium

>>85806608
This list is OK, there's no Invincible, I took Flex Mentallo thanks

>>85806843
This tb.h

Can't have a Batman story on Superman, etc.

>>85806608
>from A to Z
>Astro City
>Zot
I laughed more than I should have

>>85807072
Invincible is shit half the time

>>85806103
>Im new to comics
>Im mainly interested in kino

Nope, don't believe you.

>>85807060
He says that everytime he's asked. He doesn't want to do anything with his non creator owned work.

>>85807014
He only brought that u because he gets constantly bombarded about killing joke by journalists.

>>85806910
>You trust him to write a story, but not his ability to evaluate the finished product?
He's an artist, not a critic, and humans have always had a blind spot when it comes to self-evaluation.

Kurt Cobain thought Smells Like Teen Spirit was garbage. Anthony Burgess thinks Clockwork Orange is the worst thing he's ever written. Arthur Conan Doyle kept trying to kill Holmes off because he hated writing it so much. The list goes on and on

>>85806910
>You trust him to write a story, but not his ability to evaluate the finished product?
Retroactively 30 years later after he decided to go "hurr capes are shit automatically" why would i?

>>85806103
Well, since you like Alan Moore, let's go with that for now:

The Ballad of Halo Jones
Miracleman
V for Vendetta
The Saga of Swamp Thing
DC Universe: The Stories of Alan Moore
Promethea
From Hell
Providence

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>>85806103

>short legs, fat manshape female with colored hair and plastic operations..

well yap.. not even fapping.

>>85806103
Don't read comics, read manga

Japs do everything better

>>85807201
He doesn't think that, though.

>>85807201
Except he doesn't think that at all, he just doesn't like DC

Killing Joke is still mediocre

>>85807167
I asked for a source, why are you not posting a source? If he says it "everytime he's asked" then it should be easy for you to post a source.

What else has he clearly and explicitly disowned?

>He doesn't want to do anything with his non creator owned work.
What you need to understand is that he's fine with his old work, but he doesn't want anything to do with those publishers.

For example, he is still proud of Miracleman, but he asked Marvel to remove his name from it so that they wouldn't get free advertising from the market's "Alan Moore" brand recognition.

For example, he is still proud of Watchmen, but he wants nothing to do with what DC is trying to do to it.

>>85806932
It was just the first thing that popped in my head when I was thinking about indie capeshit.

>>85807171
>He's an artist, not a critic
If an artist isn't something of both, they'll be a lot of neither.

>Kurt Cobain thought Smells Like Teen Spirit was garbage.
It is.

>Anthony Burgess thinks Clockwork Orange is the worst thing he's ever written.
Harsh, but unsurprising coming from a man who wrote very little of note.

>Arthur Conan Doyle kept trying to kill Holmes off because he hated writing it so much.
Yes, and it shows in the work.

>>85807201
>30 years later after he decided to go "hurr capes are shit automatically"
You didn't read to the end of the post, then?

>>85807283
Broaden your horizons.

>>85807264
Lol no, maybe actually read some of his rants
He definitely hates DC but he hated them long before he began to hate capes

>>85807171
>Kurt Cobain thought Smells Like Teen Spirit was garbage
He was right.

>>85807167
That isn't a source

>>85807323
Post these rants, guy

>>85806388
>lol I used an autistic term ironically so everyone else is younger than me
What the fuck?

>>85807323
>Lol no, maybe actually read some of his rants
Give examples.

I think it's rather impressive that a thread like this is getting actual suggestions.

OP legitimately went "I only read kino like The Killing Joke" and people still proceed to suggest good comics for OP to read. A bait thread like this would have gone to shit on the very first post on pretty much any other board.

>>85807350
How new are you to require a source for that?

>>85806388
>I straight up admit to not reading comics but my opinion on these comics I haven't read is law
Kill yourself

>>85806388
>merely pretending

>>85807402
>I don't actually have a source so I'll call him a newfag instead!

wew lad

>>85806388
>I say retarded shit ironically, which makes me completely different from a retard

>>85807308
I read plenty independent comics, I just didn't think particularly hard about it.

>>85807402
Why are you still replying?

If you don't provide a source then the conversation is not going to continue in any meaningful or productive direction.

Since you lack the maturity to admit that you were wrong, and since you don't have a source, just stop replying and then we can all leave equally unsatisfied.

>>85807450
>>85807469
Stop samefaging. Read his interviews.

>>85807482
Which interviews? What do they say?

IPs who have posted on /tv/ should be permanently banned from /co/.

>>85806388
Kino is for movies
Murteeki is the term for comics and cartoons

>>85807482
>samefagging

lol?

what in the absolute fuck is kino and why do browsers of the worst boards on here keep coming up with meme words that immediately identify them as retards

>>85807171

>Kurt Cobain thought Smells Like Teen Spirit was garbage.

But it is garbage, same with everything else Nirvana put out.

>Killing Joke is identified as mediocre now
It becomes more and more /co/mblr every year.

>>85806971
> uses the word kino unironically
> not a pretentious shithead
pick one

>>85807568
It is mediocre, and it has nothing to do with Barbara Gordon. Stop being such a pleb.

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>>85806971
>I wouldn't recommend this pretentious shit to people looking to get into the hobby. This stuff is very limited in appeal in general.
Here you go.

>>85807528
Because epic cape movies are still not banned from this board.

>>85806388
>>85806103
I find it interesting that you use words like kino and drivel, but make persistent grammatical errors.
Me thinks the lady doth try too hard.

>>85807601
It's mediocre only if you read prose in a comic, thinking think Jim Lee or Frank cho are actually good or if you're a SJW. /co/ has plenty of both, so no wonder it's considered as mediocre.

>>85807517
Mods should wordfilter "kino" into "Gay porn".

>>85807649
*only read prose in a comic

>>85807637
It's "The lady doth protest too much, methinks"

>>85807649
A comic is both art and writing

A comic with bad writing, by definition, cannot be good

>>85807354
>>85807381
He straight up thinks they're cultural cancer
>>To my mind, this embracing of what were unambiguously children's characters at their mid-20th century inception seems to indicate a retreat from the admittedly overwhelming complexities of modern existence," he wrote to Ó Méalóid. "It looks to me very much like a significant section of the public, having given up on attempting to understand the reality they are actually living in, have instead reasoned that they might at least be able to comprehend the sprawling, meaningless, but at-least-still-finite 'universes' presented by DC or Marvel Comics. I would also observe that it is, potentially, culturally catastrophic to have the ephemera of a previous century squatting possessively on the cultural stage and refusing to allow this surely unprecedented era to develop a culture of its own, relevant and sufficient to its times.

>>85807649
What?

>>85806686
>Premise
Use google you fucking faggot

>>85807688
That's an indictment of people still obsessed with them, not superheroes as a concept

>>85807666
filter into "capeshit" on /co/ and "moeshit" on /a/ and "cunnyshit" on /tv/

>>85807686
>writing includes only prose

>>85807649
A: Opinions.
B: It does very little, to anything in any sense. Half of it's fame comes from shock value, and a large portion of it's content is Moore waxing poetic about a lot of nothing.
Personally I wouldn't call it mediocre, but i do consider it over-rated.

>>85807727
There is no prose in The Killing Joke, you fucking idiot.

>>85807712
>>I haven't read any superhero comics since I finished with Watchmen. I hate superheroes. I think they're abominations. They don't mean what they used to mean. They were originally in the hands of writers who would actively expand the imagination of their nine-to-13-year-old audience. That was completely what they were meant to do and they were doing it excellently. These days, superhero comics think the audience is certainly not nine to 13, it's nothing to do with them. It's an audience largely of 30-, 40-, 50-, 60-year old men, usually men.
Though I don't believe him, this is also a quote by him

>>85807749
It's overrated, but a very good single issue.

>>85807749
>I don't know what prose means

>>85807671
Paraphrasing is hardly worth a (You)

>>85807606
Can anyone explain why Usagi Yojimbo is held in such high regard? From what I've read it's not even as good as TMNT.

>>85807686
This. The art is important, but not as much as the writing. Even as an artist, a comic can still be good even if the art isn't. Of course, the art can't be complete garbage, and yes, I've seen bad art in comics, but it's still better actul garbage.

>>85807782
Cowabunga dude. Get a load of this totally radical pizza pie.

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>>85807637
English is my third language and I put zero effort into formatting my posts/ proper grammar on 4chan

>>85807782
You're right, it's better than TMNT.

>>85807782
Personal opinions about the story aside, Stan Sakai's work ethic maintaining a consistent massive piece of work single handedly for around 30 years now, deserves praise.

Since we're at it, does anyone have the mediafire for the Godzilla IDW comics?

>>85807606
>Locke and Key
It's not even a good entry-level horror comic. Something like Black Hole would be better,

>>85807956
Black hole is on the list

>>85806103
>Can I safely ignore 99% of them that exist?
If you wanna have no clue what's happening ever, sure. If you want to get into something that has history you're gonna have to bite the bullet and read some of that history eventually or you'll just lose interest because you don't have a clue who anyone is or why you should care about them.

Now that said, short stand-aloneish stories are great entry points.

>>85806971
What else am I going to do? Intentionally recommend crap comics for idiots? How does that help someone understand that comics aren't just IP farms and shitty toy ads?

>>85807956
Where does that list say that the comics on there are "good"?

>>85807965
SHEiT i feel blind.
Locke and Key is still Stephen King on a bad day-tier drivel.

>>85806971
>The Bus
>Concrete
>American Splendor
>Contract with God
>Pretentious
Ah yes the old, "I didn't read it, so it's pretentious" argument

>>85807992
The hardback collections sure are pretty though

>>85807999
How is Love and Rockets pretentious? I thought it was pretty straightforward.

>>85807688
Except that this is a comment on the readership, not the concept of superheroes.

>>85807758
He's clearly saying he hates what superheroes have become, not the concept of them, nor what they were or what they could potentially become.

>>85806103
>killing joke
>kino
Get the fuck out, casual /tv/ scum

>>85808039
Fuck off Moore defense force
He clearly has become a contrarian for shits and gigs/out of depression

>>85808037
I can see how someone could think "Muh queer snowflake mexicans" is pretentious, just like how Cerebus is not pretentious for 200 issues but you could call it pretentious once Sim goes mad
The 4 I listed there is no argument

>>85808071
He's become contrarian so people will stop asking about Watchmen

>>85808097
>The 4 I listed there is no argument
DUDE Mother Nature LMAO, humans are killing the Earth, we all just need to chillax and contemplate the cosmos for a bit, why can't you all be more perfect like my perfect hero?

>>85808114
Maybe that applies to /co/ too.

It's like this, OP. Are you the kind of reader who believes that reading should be a labour first and a pleasure second? If the answer is Yes, then the bulk of comics are not for you. Your best bet is to consult a literary website that i) acknowledges that comics can be literary, ii) refers to literary comics as "graphic novels", and iii) publishes lists of recommended "graphic novels".

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>>85806388

>>85808147
Considering I can't even tag those to the stories those are beyond memeshit replies

>>85806388
>the average cape story is absolute trash which is why singular stories like the killing joke are held in such high regard
The Killing Joke isn't even Moore's Top 10.

>>85807606
I disagree with All star superman on that list. While it does indeed show him as 'the best superman has ever been', and it's a blast to read, I've heard a lot of people who are new to superman or comics in general that there is too much new stuff here and they are not sure if this is supposed to be new and they just need to learn about it by reading, or if they simply don't have the background knowledge of superman. It would've benefited from being a longer series with more time to (re)introduce characters and settings. Right now it's a lovesong to superman, and a lot of people mention it as if it's a starting point to superman, but it's too dense for that.

>>85808215
I can't tell if that's supposed to be a pun or not.

>>85808215
Of course not, Top 10 is much different

>>85808071
>"See, Moore says he hates superheroes!"
>"That's not what he's actually saying, though, is it. If you look at the—"
>"Shut up!"

>>85808270
And much better.

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>>85808198

>>85808276
>literally says "I hate superheroes"
>N-no it's all s-subtext you see!

>>85808324
He then immediately explains that he hates what they've become.

>>85808147
I really hate this DUDE LMAO meme
It's just like >muh, you're not even fucking saying anything, there's nothing wrong with having the message of your book be that humans need to chill out

>>85808324
>Didn't read the rest of the paragraph.

>>85808425
>there's nothing wrong with having the message of your book be that humans need to chill out
Indeed, there's nothing wrong with it. And, in fact, I love that comic. Honestly, I do.

I just wouldn't put it on a list of non-pretentious comics.

There are a lot of standalone stories that are very dope but the best standalone cape stories, even the ones not tied to existing characters, cannot be fully enjoyed without some prior knowledge of more general cape comics
Nobody is asking you to read the really mediocre runs, but comics are actually much larger than you think
Just keep finding writers you like, and read everything you can find by them

>>85808468
Not that Anon, but I'm getting the impression that by "pretentious", you mean any comic with some kind of theme to it.

OP you want to read by writer/artist and not by character/company/genre etc
Creators are important because execution is the thing of paramount importance, and creators have proof of their skill in executing concepts.
Everything besides execution is shit.

>>85807606
I will always resent All Star Superman, Watchmen and TDKR being included as entry level books.
They are culminations and celebrations (well maybe not watchmen as a celebration) of the charcaters and genre, they are only legitimately understood after reading a ton of Superhero comics, not as first stories. The only reason they get recommended as firsts is because they're really fucking good.
Like how can you have TDKR on this list and not Year One? TDKR is literally Y1's pair book, with tons of parallels and matching imagery.

>>85808515
The theme is Chadwick pretending to be superior to the rest of us.

>>85808640
Watchmen could be considered a celebration of the medium if not the genre

>>85808590

Stop giving advice to that subhuman shitposting cuckold

>>85807606
> Watchmen entry-level
I can't agree. It's a desconstruction of the medium, which just slides off you if you aren't already immersed in the medium. and All-Star Superman is, like someone else said, a celebration of the mythology, so again it just flouders without its context.

>>85807606
I read All Star Superman as one of my first comics and didn't like it much. After revisiting it after reading it a lot more, I really loved it. I agree with the others, it is not entry level.

>>85806388
ironic shitposting is still shitposting

>>85806614

Did I say that?

But you are compiling a list of the most cookie cutter "best of" comics. And then going lol cape kino I have le superior taste"

>>85806388
You sound like a pretentious /tv/ faggot

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And there's a picture of my recent super crush, Harley Quinn. What a lovely coincidence to see my little nightshade pop up here.

>>85809041
>I can't agree. It's a desconstruction of the medium, which just slides off you if you aren't already immersed in the medium.

I don't agree at all. Watchmen is a deconstruction of many things, including comics, but there is nothing so unique to comic books as a medium, industry, or collection of tropes that isn't inferred in a very transparent way by Moore such that any layman could understand both the thing itself and Moore's corresponding antithesis. Are there obscure corner cases? Of course. Are there just as obscure cases involving pop-culture and 20th century history? Yup. Watchmen is a great starting place for anyone with the will to finish it and understand it, which is only as difficult as you let it be.

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>>85809520
that feel when I used to cosplay harley when I was 15

>>85809409
So you are retarded

Ive read/ watched things based on how they are received/ regarded

youre a painfully hipster retard

>>85809520
>>85810237
What the fuck is even happening in this thread

>>85810237
GOTHAM

>>85810281
/tv/ autists malfunction when there aren't enough movie threads up.

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>>85806388
I recommend the boys by Garth Ennis, specifically because it has a panel instructing what you should do.

>>85810401
Was expecting "don't be a cunt all yer life".

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>>85806388
>op's fw

Not even remotely surprised this thread has over 150+ posts. Fuck this cancerous board so hard.

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>>85810682
We thank you for your productive and creative contribution to the thread.

>>85810726
You have absolutely no right to bitch or complain or whine if someone from /pol/ or tumblr or /tv/ or whatever fake boogeyman comes to shit up the board. You invite them in.

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>>85806103
Stay away from 99.99% of capeshit

This is my comic to-read list that I've been making my way down for the past few months

>>85810768
Anon, I agree OP is a faggot, worse a pretentious faggot and most responses were bad.

That however, doesn't mean another bad response was needed.
>hurr fuck this board
isn't helping the situation.

>>85810900
When the entire board is falling for an extremely obvious troll, and not simply just reporting and hiding the thread, "fuck this board" is extremely appropriate.

>>85810940
Appropriate and useful are different things.

>>85807231
Plastic operations?

>>85810940
I've been here since 2005. /co/ has always been notoriously easy to troll.

Also, what >>85810978 said.

>>85810879

>No Judge Dredd