Why do people complain about modern cartoons using pop culture

Who wins in a straight fight, Bogart or Buggs?

>>85404432
Not gonna lie, those Bugs Bunny cartoons were my first exposure to the likes of Humphrey Bogart, Edward G. Robinson and the Marx brothers. I might never have been interested in old films otherwise.

>>85404490
Bogart

>>85404432
>when cartoons have always done that
The problem people complain about is when those pop culture references make up a significant amount of the humor. If there's a 5 minute joke, or even an entire episode about Brittany Spears, it's not going to be funny 20 years later when she's a literal who or she relaunched and redeemed herself. Nobody complains about like, a show taking a single quote from like, the Big Lebowski or something.

And I don't really see much complaint about contemporary technology. Most popular modern cartoons take place in fantasy settings where that doesn't even apply.

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It's a matter of proportions.

Old cartoons had pop culture references. The ones that relied on them exclusively (Mickey's Polo Team, Autograph Hound, Mother Goose Goes Hollywood, Mickey's Gala Premier) are mostly forgotten. The ones that are sparse on pop culture references are the ones that stood the test of time.

>>85404432
Well, most of those WB shorts with the famous actor caricatures were designed for full families visiting the theater, so there was some attention paid to adult interests. Also, this was before television really mattered in the way that it does now, so people really knew their film stars.

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>>85404432
Dated jokes thread?

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>>85404625
>Family Guy will someday be mostly forgotten

i know its unlikely but a man can dream

>>85404625
Book Revue holds up pretty well, but that might be because of my charisma, intelligence, and wicked sense of humor.

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>>85404432
can you help out a fellow American who's down on his luck?

>>85404940
CUCARAAAAAAAAAACHAA

>>85404676
I only remember it whenever someone mentions it or I accidentally watch television.

I guess Baby will just have to have steak instead...

I remember Scooby-Doo having all these celebrity cameos in the 70s (I remember Adam West's Batman and the Globetrotters).

>>85404432
You want a real answer? This is the best I've got.

Back then, you could do things like that as long as they weren't the selling point of it, and dictated the plot as it all revolved around the refferences.

Take the new Teen Titans Go! for example: I can't like it because the whole thing IS a pop culture reference.

Think about it-- the show has a tendency to use eight-bit graphics and shit when it can because the 80's nostalgia wave is happening (now moving to the 90's), the other jokes of comprised of unoriginal humor such as "waffles", the unnecessary inclusion of other DC properties in the background, and the show focuses more on LOLSORANDUMB things typically found on Youtube instead.

When their own original humor is not enough to support a show, they'll rely on other things people find funny in pop-culture because it's famous and promotes circulation for their product.

It's one thing to have Humphrey Bogart in a Bugs Bunny episode for a good laugh, but if Bugs just shouted about popular things in his time alongside Bogart because his own material wasn't funny enough, then it's just boring. I think a more recent example of how to use pop-culture references alongside original jokes would be Animaniacs, but even that went a bit to deep with it at times.

Does anyone get what I'm saying? I've tried to explain this to my friends multiple times, but they don't seem to understand.

I'm kind of bored, so I'd love to hear someone's else's point of view, particularly OP's.

>>85405659

"Sonny and Cher?!?"
"Shaggy and Scooby?!?"

>>85404586
A good reference joke works as both a joke on it's own with extra flavour if you get the reference.

A bad reference joke is dependent fully on the reference.

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>>85406005
Boco, please. My fagmeter is off charts.

Based on this thread folks must hate South Park with it taking the topic of the week. I personally love it though

>>85406100

How about Tim Conway? He was a riot.

>>85406150
The topical jokes in South Park do not require the audience to be familiar with the topic. (Bruce Jenner, scientology, Tom Cruise, etc etc etc) This means that anyone can watch it and enjoy it without having to catch any references.

Contrast with shows where the jokes are "hey, I recognize that."

>>85404432

You know how you hear a song from a few years back and think that it's overplayed and old by that point? Think of how it will be seen in 20-30 years. You have stations that play just the 70s, 80s, or 90s. Then you move back further and you have songs considered classics. Move back even further and you have what is considered the pinnacle of all music, stuff that is played in packed theaters by a person on a piano.

tl;dr the older something is, the less it matters that it's dating itself

Because today's pop culture sucks. Dismiss it as nostalgia but you know full well that pop culture 40 years ago used to be something we were proud to be defined by.

>>85405011
Hit the road!

>>85406089
Yeah, a lot of those old Looney Tunes shorts still work because even if you don't get the reference (whether it's an actual one or a character that acts as a parody of a celebrity from the time) the writing/humor is still done in a way that you can watch it and laugh.

Compare that to, say, the """""joke""""" from a Family Guy episode that's just "JARED LETO IS A TOOL" before Stewie kills him. There's nothing there and if you don't know who Jared Leto is then it completely fails as a joke.

This is 4chan. Without the complaining we would have to have actual discussions about things.

Terrifying.

>>85405997
So, the TLDR equivalent >>85406089? I can understand what you mean.

>>85405997
Well you're not wrong that is primarily the issue. Shit gets weird though. Peter Lorre was parodied to such an absurd extreme that he no longer really resembled himself or his roles in those toons. But who cares? Most of the people from that period knew it was absurdist humor and accepted it as such. But you're left with this odd little cultural artifact, a caricature that doesn't resemble the character it's based on all that much. And he's hardly the only one.

>>85406150
South Park is good at humour because Trey and Matt never focus on the caricatures of the joke, they keep the humour regarding them relatively naunced and keep the topic itself relevant to the plot.

I.e., Mel Gibson and the Passion of the Jew, he didn't take away the scene or stole the show, they made fun of him occassionally and were still able to deliver the punchline by the end of the episode.

I dont know, to be honest. I guess its one of those CEO things that triggers them.

Firstly classic stars have very cartoony charm with simple, defined traits.
Secondly classic cartoons didn't just focus on the fact they are famous but what they are famous for and (thirdly) used it as means of humor. To simply put they treated stars as cartoon characters.

Fourthly situational references worked as indepented jokes and fitted the mood.
Fifthly and lastly there wasn't too much focus on technology unless it was imaginary technology.

>>85410376
I can't even think of a cartoon or popular animator currently that could do (Or that I wouldn't be surprised as fuck if they could) an accurate identifiable caricature in their show.

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DON'T YOU BELIEVE IT

I guess for really old cartoons, your mind as a kid just chalks that up as the cartoon being weird for the sake of weird.

Though I also suppose it's because Looney Tunes references pop culture that established itself years ago (Peter Lorre, minstrel shows, etc.), while cartoons like the new PPG reference pop culture that failed to establish itself as firmly into common knowledge (No me gusta).

>>85410676
>Really haven't seen an old Tom and Jerry Cartoon in years.
>Didn't even pay attention to the picture.

Read it in that low echo voice without any hesitation.

>>85405165
Ooooh, so close...it was "a ham sandwich. "

>>85410676
i never got this reference.

>>85404432
The main difference is that Bugs Bunny had great humour and the cameos were just a bonus. Crap nowadays instead relies on pop culture references to be funny, and have fuck all humour without them.

>>85411766
It's a reference to an old radio trivia show

>>85404432
Because many pop culture references of today are dated from the get-go. Looney Tunes at least TRIED to be current in its day

One of Family Guy's major gag characters is Adam West, whose entire comedic hook is that he's an elderly man who used to play Batman before most of the viewers were born

Hell, they referenced Peanut Butter Jelly Time like 2 or 3 years too late

>>85411970

>whose entire comedic hook is that he's an elderly man who used to play Batman before most of the viewers were born

no, the point is that he's clearly mentally touched but everybody puts up with his retard antics because of his beloved celebrity status, why do you think he's the major of quahog

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>>85404432
>>85405011
I watched those cartoons when I was a kid. This is the first time I notice he was a reference. I noticed Grouxo, Laurel and Hardy because I had seen them on TV, but none of them added anything to the story. They were just human characters.

>>85405011
It took me until this year to realize that was Bogart.

>>85411457

Dammit!

But yeah, its a shame they don't make cartoons that riff on modern celebrities anymore. 'Hollywood Steps Out' was brilliant.

>>85404668
That's still funny though.

>>85408659
>pop culture 40 years ago
Ooh yeah, cheesy cop shows and The Dukes of Hazzard. Truly the 70s was a hotbed for high art...

It's Frankie!

>>85415814
It had to be yooooooooouuuuuuuuuuuu

>>85405997
But that s nonsense. TTgp humor trends towards surrealism and assholery, very much like the Adult Swim superhero spoofs it takes cues from. Think Sealab and Birdman. While they do do pop culture references it's usually in an episode themed after them specifically (80s flicks, genres of animation,video games, synthcore) or a one time gag (the ducktales recreation, The sailor moon transformations)

I mean whether it's good or not is subjective but it's clear you haven't watched many episodes. Pop culture isn't really the ttgo main style.

>>85404432
Maybe they were just lucky, maybe they were smarter or maybe they had higher standards, but the references they used are from classic media and featuring celebrities and pop culture people would recognize and appreciate to this day.

Nowadays it's references to shitty flash in the pan fads and "celebrities" that no one will remember about in a year and literally NO ONE will get in a decade, and if they will, it'll get an eye roll or a groan instead of a chuckle.

>>85414582
no it's not

>>85412099
I'd also say it's less a reference and more because Macfarlane loves Adam West. Remember that he and Hartman wrote the Johnny Bravo episode with Adam West and then both used him as a regular character in roughly the same role (which was roughly similar to his Johnny Bravo role) on their shows.

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Guess who?

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>>85418212

Yehudi!

>>85416162
EEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEK!!!
*faints*

>>85404432
>joke that gets better if you know the context
>joke that relies solely on the context
I wonder why

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Do think people should excuse problems just because they were present even before our time, OP?

Referential humor is weak and easy, no matter what you're referencing.

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>>85416579
>the references they used are from classic media and featuring celebrities and pop culture people would recognize and appreciate to this day.

Well, except for whoever that actress was that Betty Boop was caricaturing. Nobody knows who she is now after Betty became more popular than her.

>>85418313
All humor is referential. Show/tell me even ONE joke where I don't have to understand a reference to something in it and will still laugh.

>>85418474

A man walks into a bar. He says "Ow".

>>85408953
Who the fuck is Jared Leto?

>>85418566
people with Hereditary Sensory Autonomic Neuropathycant feel pain. next?

>>85418874

Uhhhh...a horse walks into a bar, and the bartender says "Why the long face?"

>>85418566
you have to know what a bar is before there's a chance you'd find that funny plus in addition to that the humor comes from the expectation that, like most bar jokes, the man is going to go inside the bar and say something to the bartender but, instead you get a man who walks into a bar as in running into the outside wall of it. it's a referential joke.

>>85418949
>What is a person born blind.
Next?

>>85404432
Because people are whiny assholes.

>>85418990

ARRRRGH...

Why is 6 afraid of 7? Because 7 8 9.

>>85418975
wow..party's don't start till this guy shows up.

>>85419165
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dyscalculia

>>85404432

Remenber when Brain made a parody of Orson Welles "Frozen Peas recording event", and the joke is that Brain sounds like Orson Welles, and kids and adults who never heard of it where supposed to get it?

https://youtu.be/7uWW--w4SRs

https://youtu.be/V14PfDDwxlE

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>>85419165
>what is people born in a third world country with no schooling.
Next?

>>85419286

They called that the "5,000$ inside joke" or something.

>>85419331
But the creators had SOOOOOOOOO MUCH FUN making it

>>85418874
>>85418975
wow i guess memes in cartoons are okay after all

>>85419204
I was being an asshole sorry. I was just trying to (autistically, perhaps) drive home the point that jokes require you to have knowledge that you weren't born with and had to learn and ergo all jokes are referential jokes.

>>85419286
This was made to fill time and IIRC is actually hacked together from the VA warming up while the mic was on. Yes, his warm up for the Orson Welles voice was him being a drunken dick in the booth.

>>85419359

I bet. Its hilarious.

>>85419394
Yeah I dont really care and I understand what that anon was saying. I had recently read about that disease so I decided to roll with it.

>>85418874
>>85418990
>>85419322

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>>85419425
I smell what you are stepping in brah.

>>85416591
Yes, it is. It's a visual gag.

Because back then celebrities could still laugh at each other and were, more or less, still human.

Could you imagine today's actors not getting completely assblasted by how something portrays them? There's a reason Don Rickles was almost blacklisted from modern hollywood after he roasted Scorsese and Julia Roberts.

>>85419277
I have dyscalculia and I get the joke

it isnt always numerical dyslexia. sometimes it's just a complete inability to math

>>85420145
"Bing Crosby's horse still hasn't come in!"
True, people take themselves so seriously today that it probably wouldn't work.

>>85420489
Imagine someone like Rickles roasting someone with their head up their own ass like George Clooney or Matt Damon. Imagine that apocalypse.

>>85420145
I thought it was because he said something less than perfect about the new King Obama.

“I shouldn’t make fun of the blacks,” Rickles said, and then proceeded to do just that: “President Obama is a personal friend of mine. He was over to the house yesterday, but the mop broke.”

>>85420895
Obama just isn't that funny though. He's bad, don't get me wrong, but he's not the eccentric/weird kind of bad like bush jr. Combine that with the fact that you'll be accused of being racist if you criticize him or sexist if criticizing his wife and you just lost every possible joke.

>>85420737
Maybe Matt Damon once had his head up his ass but, he's gotten it out of there since then. Have you even since the Jimmy Kimmel segments with him? And in at least one interviews he said he found the portrayal of himself in Team America to be funny.

And.. you just made me defend Matt Damon, you bastard.

>>85404432
>Why do people complain about modern cartoons using pop culture references and contemporary technology "dating" the show when cartoons have always done that?
because they like to think they're above everyone else and flaunt how cultured unique and individual they are by claiming not to take part in what everyone else enjoys. It's something retards do usually when they're in their teens.

I would know, I used to do this shit all the time and as a result I ended up alienating myself. So yeah if you're reading this, complaining about everything will send signals to other people that you're fucking annoying. Don't do it.

>>85404432
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_VrRlMt8SF4
Because Bogart is not the whole joke, just an element of it. Replace him with a generic menacing character and the joke is still there.