>DC finally gives fans everything they want back >fans

Because they still aren't getting laid.

>>83019335

They need to stop liking Martian Manhunter first

>>83019148
Fans are excited as hell. Read threads. Just some of the same always mad people upset as usual.

>>83019541
Fans are excited about the books, but nobody seems happy about the Watchmen shit

>>83019619
>jealous MCUfags sick of living under Disney's thumb infiltrate every thread
Needed some more fixing.

>>83019621
Nah the Watchmen shit is the greatest shit ever. First thread of the news had people posting there copies saying how much they loved the idea.
Go read reviews too. Getting 10/10s and praise for the Watchmen shit outside /co/ also.

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>everything they want back
And even more!

is Cassandra Cain coming back?

Will she be naked again?

>>83019876
She's been back, but she'll probably be around more often than she has been. Doubt SJWs will let the nakedness slide though, those puritans.

>>83019876
shes been back. but shes just a tool to fawn over fan favorite harper row

>>83019621

I think it's another case of "people hate an idea from a story they haven't actually read"

I can't wait for the Watchmen to get blown the fuck out "What's So Funny..." style

>Barbera can still walk again

still mad

>>83019621
I'm happy about it.

>>83019447
Go home, Zack. Stop ruining DC movies.

fans are stupid and don't know what they want. you end up with shit every time you capitulate to them

>>83019619
This tbqh famm

>>83019621
I am. Watchmen sucks.

>>83020066
>Dr. Manhattan is a faggot with no taste who prefers Babs to Cass and Steph
wew

>>83019148
>any board on 4chan
>ever being content

>>83019148
/co/ - Complaining and Contrarianism

>>83019148
i never wanted watchmen.

>>83021388
>Dr Manhattan actually enjoys Lobdell Titans

I hope that blue faggot kills himself

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>>83019754
No they fucking weren't. I was there, people were salty as shit. You can even see it for yourself:

>>82967766

>>83019148
I love everything about Rebirth except Superman's new costume, and that's not even a huge deal.

>>83019876
Go fuck yourself cassfag, jump off a bridge, she's been back you non reading little shit

Something is telling me that new DC will be bleak as fuck, like Vertigo but with a lot more capeshit

>>83021883
This is one of the stupidest posts I've ever read, is it like satire or modern art or what?

>>83022103
It's called proto-anti-post-modernism.

>>83019148
>>83019621

I'm out of the loop, can somebody spoonfeed me? What's DC doing?

>>83022202
Making comic books.

>>83019148
/co/ is the one place on Earth that actually likes Damion Wayne and DCYou

>>83022366
Reddit likes them too. I spend a lot of time on r/dccomics and see lots of positive things.

Is DC doing another fucking reboot?

>>83022461
Not really, it's undoing the last reboot.

>>83019621
I'm okay with

Before Watchmen didn't destroy the original comic

this won't either

people just like complaining and freaking out or are just super bitter

>>83022461
DC hasn't rebooted in over 20 years.

>>83022461
Zero Hour 2.0

>>83022461
It's not a reboot, and it never was.

>>83021864

Your life must be pretty great.

>>83022799
Not him, but yeah my life is pretty great.

>>83019447
What exactly is wrong with martian manhunter?

>>83022979
Zac Snyder when asked if Martian Manhunter would be in the Justice League movie asked the crowd does anyone really care about him. The crowd cheered showing they liked him to which he responded with yeah but how many of you get laid.

>>83022540
>>83022681
How is New 52 not a reboot?

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>It's Watchmen's fault that comics are too gritty not the comic buyers'

>>83023216
You'd need to read Rebirth to understand.

>>83023147
You mean Goyer, but it's just a head on the same hydra.

>>83022266
Awful. I can see why people are angry.

>>83022979
he's a boring overpowered Superman clone who's even harder to relate to than Superman

>>83023232
Nu52 is a reboot.
Rebirth is not a reboot.
Rebirth is a deboot to unboot Nu52's reboot.
Noot noot.

>>83023216
You know Jojo and King Crimson? Imagine if someone did King Crimson's power for ten years worth of time.

Marvel and DC need to stop with the fucking big event bullshit

It is impossible to follow for anyone that is new to comics

>>83023425
fuck newfags

>>83023332
>Noot noot.

help

>>83023228
Easier to blame comic than people.

>>83023425
Big event bullshit is made FOR the new readers.

>>83019148
But I am happy.

>>83023636
SHILL
H
I
L
L

>>83023425
DC has had three months of events in the past two years.
>Forever Evil ended in May 2014
>Convergence was April and May 2015
>Rebirth is a oneshot in May 2016

>>83023594
Not when you need all the fucking tie ins

This is why only fat neckbeards read this shit while normies watch the movies and think that is the true interpretation

Can someone explain everything that's going with rebirth.

What's the deal with Dr Manhattan?

>>83023425
>Marvel and DC
>DC
DC barely has any events, I think you mean Marvel and just Marvel.

>>83023716
fuck what normies think
you defending normies son?

>>83023500
>Hoot hoot.
The Owls are coming for your ass. Call Nightwing.

>>83023722

He's behind the DCU going to shit the last few years but it won't be a slugfest to beat him
“I promise it’s not going to be Batman and company punching Dr. Manhattan a bunch of times. That’s not how you combat something like this,” Johns says, laughing.

>>83019148
Because Wally fans have always been whiny.

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Cyborg and Trinity are delayed.

>>83023836
Considering comics would die without new readers, yes

>>83023722
We don't really know, but basically Dr. Manhattan stole ten years of time from the Post-Crisis multiverse, causing the changes seen in the new 52.

He may be the threat Pandora was warning about, I don't know if he also caused Wildstorm to merge or not.

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DC Universe: Rebirth #1 Lettered Preview

>>83023425
You mean just marvel.

Five years since new 52 and all they've had is Forever Evil and Convergence, the latter being a two month filler for them moving across the country.
Meanwhile there was just a four month gap between Secret Wars and Civil War II.

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Teen Titans Rebirth Designs

Sauce: http://www.comicbookresources.com/article/first-look-at-dcs-teen-titans-rebirth-designs

When are we getting Barbara Gordon back as Oracle?

>>83024043
Look at the fucking edge on these designs.

>>83023971
All Star Batman?

>>83024043
>that Wally
>that Raven
>that Raven's hair
>that covered Starfire
Not my cup of tea.

>>83023265
kek

>>83024043
Why does Damien have a spray on tan?

>>83024090
Never, Cassfag.
>>83024123
Two-Face kidnaps Batman and they have adventures. Catwoman and some other villains confirmed to show up.

>>83024104
You call that edgy?

>>83024173
Showing us how proud he is for being Arab,

>>83024173
He's been ambiguously brown since Doyle made it so in his solo

>>83024176
I'd rather we didn't have a Batgirl at all. I just liked Barbara better as Oracle.

>>83023971
Would this be a good time for me to start getting into buying single issues?

I've never really seen the appeal in them until now seeing as I'm kinda excited for this rebirth. Usually I just buy trade collections or omnibus'

>>83019621
>Watchmen shit
I am behind. What shit happened??

>>83024226
it's not really ambiguous when we know his racial background

>>83024196
BB, Raven, and Robin are covered in spikes and edge.

So is DCU officially the Snyderverse?

>>83024241
In that case, sorry for calling you Cassfag.
>>83024253
Buy ones you really, really want to support. Tradewait big titles, like Batman and whatever.

>>83019148
Because being happy is shit.

>>83024298
You've never seen true edge, anon.

>>83024310
Spidey pls.

>>83024034
>>83023815

People who hate comics generally only use Marvel as their frame of reference, since Marvel is the most visibly shit. Most people who stop reading comics stopped reading after trying to get into Spiderman or Xmen.

I still don't get it. Are we still gonna be with the new 52 versions of most characters?

>>83024506
>since Marvel is mostly shit visibly
Fixed that for ya, ol' buddy ol' pal!

>>83024547
Why can't you read solicits and see that's the case? Goddamn, why are people like you so fucking retarded?

>>83024547
Yes

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>>83023971
Green circle will check out
Red x don't want
no mark no opinion

>>83019148
Because the very assertion that DC gave me everything I wanted is wrong.

>>83024253
Get singles for issues you think need the sales boost or risk cancellation.

>>83019621
I am ecstatic about it. Go big or go home.

>>83024128
>Implying Starfire using the Ms. Marvel look is a bad thing

wew lad.

>>83023709
Am I the only one who finds this impressive?
I mean they did say Rebirth is building up to an event over the next year or two but Forever Evil bring the longest event since Flashpoint is neat. It'll be interesting to see if they cave and try and have an event next summer to compete with marvel's inevitable event.

>>83024506
This was literally me. I went to a bookstore (a Borders, that's how long ago it was) and tried reading some of their Spider-Man and X-Men trades and found all of them to be trash and decided to give up on Marvel for the time being and try DC instead. I did eventually go back and read some Marvel books that I ended up liking after recommendations from /co/ a year or two later, but in between I was solely reading classic Vertigo stuff and recent DC trades.

>>83024739
Johns did say the plotlines in Rebirth would be felt throughout a number of books over the next couple years and culminate in another event eventually, so I guess we're looking at a 2018 showdown with Dr. Manhattan.

>>83024602
Because other confused people say misleading things, pretty simple concept huh

>>83019621
>nobody seems happy about the Watchmen shit
Speak for yourself.

>>83023991
So it wasn't because of Flashpoint?

>>83021388
Dr. Manhattan keeps Lobdell on the Red Hood book because you haven't suffered enough yet.

>>83023991
Wildstorm merged before Flashpoint's Pandora finale as seen by the Wildstorm characters that appeared in Flashpoint.

>>83024951
But I want Lobdell contained on it

>>83024987
>Dr. Manhattan knows the only way to free us from the beast that is Lobdell is to contain him on a character no one cares about
truly worthy of his PhD

>>83024128
>that covered Starfire
>the design is literally my fetish I use on a slutty OC of mine that fights tentacle monsters
Are you the same idiot that thought the new Star Sapphire costume was somehow "covering up" and didn't accentuate how naked looking she really was?

>>83019148
>DC gives everything back
>Supes still has no trunks

The wait continues

>>83019148

Comic fans are never happy OP but they still keep coming back for more. Their complaints aren't worth listening to for this reason

Explain what DC is doing with Dr Manhattan and the Watchmen franchise.

>>83025154
RAPES IT! Just how Moore loves it.

>>83022202
Caving in.

>>83025154
Try reading the thread.

>>83025190
I mean besides that.

>>83025154
Raping it softly.

>>83019621

I think it's great. It doesn't "Ruin" the original Watchmen story and it allows the possibility for great stories in the future for these characters

>>83025154
Making Watchmen fans cry

In DC's defense, those fans deserve it

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>>83025154
One disaffected autistic God just wasn't enough.

Now we can only wait for Watchmen 2.

>>83025215
Besides that, nothing. Remains to be seen did Manhattan create DC universe or not and that's it.

>>83025258
Agreed, anyone who's a fan of well written comics and still following DC deserves all the shit they can eat.

>>83023228
>>83023572

You are both idiots. Johns didn't blame Watchmen he blamed everybody trying to mimic it. Something /co/ has been complaining about for years

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>>83024012
>Rebirth is a relaunch
>Supposed to welcome new fans
>Show a bunch of characters, some from separate universes
>Doesn't explain shit
See you next relaunch.

>>83023425
>Marvel and DC need to stop with the fucking big event bullshit
> One 80 page book is an event now

Marvel needs to fucking stop though. It's the reason I'll never buy their books

>>83025367
The welcome to new fans is in each individual series's Rebirth special, not this event special.

Why did Manhattan cancel batwing? Is he racist?

>>83025265
Ah. Ok. He DID say he was going to create some life. So interesting take.

>>83025425
Yeah we'll see. #1s don't mean shit anymore.

>>83024739

What was impressive was that Forever Evil was actually good and the Tie ins were a bunch of minis that were made for it plus two JL books. The majority of the line was left alone. I looked at the Marvel solicits thread a few days ago and saw so many A CIVIL WAR II TIE IN part 1 of 4. How can people stand to have their stories interrupted for 4 months?

>>83024663
>Get singles for issues you think need the sales boost or risk cancellation
Welp no Static Shock so that rules out All my favorites that might get cancelled

>>83025476
We've seen previews of some of them already though. But go ahead and pout in your corner, baby.

>>83024253

Yeah it is a good time. DC should be applauded for lowering the price and going bi monthly on so many books. $3.99 for 22 pages a month is ridiculous in this day and age

>>83023293
Goyer pls go

>>83025532
Wait shit really? I'll check'em out then.

>>83025506
To be fair DC's Convergence did interrupt -literally- every DC book and that event was shitty enough to make up for how good Forever Evil was. Just getting that two month taste of having all of my books interrupted was miserable enough though, I agree.

>>83024547

Yeah everything in the New 52 still happened. It's a good way to get back all the good that was lost but continue on with what people enjoyed from the New 52

>>83025600

To be fair that was because DC was moving and it was either that or no comics at all

>>83025634
DC moved? What?

>>83025367
>>Show a bunch of characters, some from separate universes

Everybody shown is in the same universe

>>83025671
What about the concept of moving confuses you to the point of needing to ask what?

>>83025671

Their main offices are no longer in New York, they're now based out of Burbank.

>>83019621
>nobody seems happy about the Watchmen shit
Only Watchmenfags.

Johns is using his last hurrah (for a while at least) to shine a light on what Watchmen's popularity did to DC and comics in general. It's honestly fucking genius, I didn't think Johns had it in him.

>>83025671
It relocated to the West Coast.

>>83021491
And cocks.

>>83025693
Calm down, kid.

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>>83019148
Are they planning on fixing Captain Marvel?

>>83025742
What's wrong with current Billy?

>>83024301
Considering Rebirth is all about how the DCU's been made too bitter and needs to be fixed it's the exact opposite.

>>83025799
He's not in an /ss/ relationship with Harley

>>83025887
Injusticefags need to go

>>83023971
Right when I start to get into the new 52 to

Should I just stop now? I've only bought two trades.

Or is new 52 Action/Detective comics still worth reading?

>>83025958
At least read Morrison's run on Action and Multiversity, Dial H, and some of the DCYou stuff

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>>83025887
I prefer my Billy Batson to be in an /ss/ relationship with Diana, thank you very much.

>>83025799
And what's wrong is that current Shazam's costume is fucking gayer than aids, the shazam corps kids thing is just lame, and the whole cynical shit head billy pisses me off.
And his name is Captain Marvel.

>>83025742

Oh please tell me how Captain Marvel is "Edgy" now

>>83024298
This is significantly LESS edge than the designs these characters were wearing previously.

>>83026003
>and the whole cynical shit head billy pisses me off.
>I don't read comics

Yeah, fuck off cunt

>>83025958
Action is worth reading, Detective isn't. Where did you start with Action, with the first trade? The first three are great so read those for sure. The fourth is bad so you can skip it and deal with a gaping hole in your collection or you can power through it to get to the fifth trade and beyond which are great again (though a different kind of great from the first three).

>>83026014
Who are you quoting? I never called him "Edgy."
Seems like, you're a bit to quick to defend it there, friendo.

>>83025799
I have little beef, but people do want the classic Cap to be around too. It's kinda like night and day, the differences.

I'd say the difference between New 52 Cap and Classic Cap is quite substantial. Convergence and Multiversity showed that there's a demand for the latter, so fans are in the right to be asking for more.

Bringing back golden age Cap would be definitely in line with Rebirth.

>>83026045

Detective Comics is definitely worth reading, assuming you skip the first 12 issues. Everything after that is solid comics.

>>83026087

No I just know what your complaints will be and I know from actually reading Justice League that Captain Marvel is slightly naive but also heroic. You read two issues of a back up and have made up your mind. You're not worth convincing

>>83026168
I disagree, I've never heard any praise for it outside of your post other than when people were hyped for the ManaBooch combo to show up - though when they did that hype kinda died as it turned out to be a merely decent run carried on the strength of good art. If you're going to read a Batman book I'd still recommend Snyder's mediocrity over it.

>>83026107
>Bringing back golden age Cap would be definitely in line with Rebirth.

It actually wouldn't because it turns out that nobody coming back is anybody's multiversal double.

Nu52 Superman is going to be revealed as some kind of fake and Black Wally is actually from a different branch of the West family from White Wally, like he always existed we just never heard of him before.

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>>83025958
>>83025992
>Jeff Lemire's Animal Man
>J.H. Williams Batwoman
>Morrison Action Comics
>Geoff Johns Aquaman
>Geoff Johns Superman
>Superman Unchained
>Azzarello's Wonder Woman
>All-Star Western
>Dial H
>Scott Snyder's Batman
>Francis Manapul's Flash
While some of these, mainly Wonder Woman and the Superman stuff, are getting hit by heavy retcons they're still pretty good books and worth reading in their own right.

I know Snyder's run on Batman isn't very popular here but it's solid, even if the Joker arcs tend to be pretty crap. It's also going to come through Rebirth pretty much unscathed.

>>83026229
>Nu52 Superman is going to be revealed as some kind of fake

Yeah the Superman problem was the one thing I couldn't figure out in all this. I hope New 52 Supes isn't fake though. I liked him

>>83026184
>Read two issues
>they are absolute garbage that makes me want to vomit
>Stop reading
Sorry but I don't read shit comics just so I can keep up to date with all the shit

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>>83024043
Da fuq?

Beast boy is an anime character.
Kid Flash is a gangsta (racist moar dc?)
Raven is emo girl from South Park
Robin is anime guy
Starfire is anime mech suit pilot girl

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>>83026282

/co/ is the only place that hates Snyders Batman run. It's good

You also forgot the best title in the New 52

>>83026298
Well, depends on how we define "fake", he could just be another Superman or Superboy (Earth-2? Conner? Prime?) who Manhattan slotted into Clark's life while Real Clark was Convergencing it up...although if it's not Earth-2, it raises the question of where Nu52 Lois came from as well.

>>83026229
So it could turn out that drunken black wizard Shazam gave his power to the wrong Billy Batson.

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The idea that we can blame Doc Manhattan for shitty writing in comics is extremely funny to me.


So was The Comedian talking about the Nu52 the whole time?

>>83019148
Thanks for wasting my time making me thing I was reading Superman these last 5 years.

Fuck them, I am not buying a single more comic I will at best read some storytime here.

>>83026348
>/co/ is the only place that hates Snyders Batman run.
The only reason people have been praising it is because Snyder's Batman is all they've had

>>83025992
>>83026045
>>83026282
Actually the two I have read are manapuls flash trade #1 and Snyders batman trade #1 action and detective were going to be where I went next.

I've heard a lot of good things about Morrisons run on action is that the first three? And I was looking on finishing at least snyders batman run so I hope it comes out unscathed like you say

I'm pretty new to DC. Grew up with a dad who liked marvel a lot so I am trying to get some more exposure.

>>83026392
>Moore is also herald of Hypercrisis
lastlaugh.jpeg

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>>83026348
The edgy run where Joker cuts off his face, staples it back on, and they kept saying "some shit is gonna go down, someone is gonna die!" than nothing happened?

That run?

>>83026327
Was Michael Turner already dead when you started reading comics? Like, it wasn't even a decade ago that this style was a thing.

>all changes are undone!
>except the ones I made because I am Johns!

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>>83026425
Joker cut off his face in Detective Comics, not Snyder's run. And the entire point of Death of the Family was Joker playing on Bruce's paranoia and dismantling the family he'd established.
>>83026419
Yeah Morrison did about 18 issues I think, so the first three trades. Batman tends to be immune to these huge events lately, namely because Snyder's run was one of the most successful, fan-favorite books out of the entire New 52.

I really wasn't expecting to like Gordon Batman anywhere near as much as I did, but it was a fun ride dammit.

>>83026221

Layman's run was great (and had Fabok as the main artist before he left for JL)
Then Manapul and Buccaletto (which was okay, unfortunately Manapul only did art for a handful of the issues because he did some JL and American Alien)

Tomasi was the last writer and most of his run was dealing with Gordon as Batman and trying to make sense of Snyder's Batman continuity and its place with everything else happening in the DCU at the same time.

>>83026463
What changes did John make?

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>Inb4 they do this in the DCEU

>The main villain isn't Darkseid, but Dr. Manhattan and he's making the universe become edgy
>Justice League defeats him
>Suddenly the world fluctuates back to 52-style superheros
>Supes finally smiles
>It was all part of Johns and Snyders plan all along

Post yfw

>>83026567
You would know if you actually read comics Johnsfag instead of worshipping the CEREAL KING only because you follow tv shows

>>83026586
Kylefag pls.

>>83026582
if they wanted the villain to be what made the DCEU edgy then they're out of luck, Heath Ledger's already dead

>>83019148
>Marlel fans still find a reason to complain
FTFY

>>83026586
So you're just going to ignore that the reboot ruined his GL run, his plans for Flash, and erased the JSA

>>83026582
>and Snyders

Fuck you for still pretending he knows what he's doing. When the movies git gud, it'll be in spite of him

>>83026311

But you have no right to talk about "Fixing " a character when your complaints have no weight

>>83026644
>Snyder wanted to rape Batman
>Comedian rape scene from Watchmen
>Comedian
>Joker
>Joker raping Batman
That anon might be onto something

>>83026816
why? it worked for Superman fans complaining about nu52 superman

>>83026582
>>Supes finally smiles

He smiled plenty in MoS

>>83019148
so, if everything is "coming back", what was the point of even re-booting everything in the first place?

>>83026838

Those complaints were also stupid. New 52 Superman was in no way Edgy except for one JL arc

So I'm fairly new to comics and this looks interesting to me but I don't really want to buy single issues. How long before trades are gonna start coming out? Obviously in 3-7 months most series should have enough for a trade right but do they start selling them right away?

>>83026634
>and erased the JSA

thats probably a good thing since the JSA went pretty much to shit after he left the book.

fuck they put Guggenheim on it.

>>83024301
Scott Snyder is cancer.

>>83026879

Because the New 52 still happened. I don't know why everybody is having trouble understanding this

>>83026888
looks like editorial and BASED JOHNS disagree with you

>>83026903

How did one of the best editors in comics end up overseeing one of the worst runs of Marvel?

>>83026903

DC is where all the talent is right now

>>83026879
>>83026909

because "everything" isn't coming back.
they're opening it up that things can come back because they realized that they went into the new52 with good intentions but still messed some shit up.

>>83019148
>DC finally gives fans everything they want back
>>fans still find reason to complain
Scott Snyder's Batman He makes me a hater batman.

>>83026348
A lot of fans on r/comicbooks don't like his run.

>>83026903
Yes we get it you like superhero movies, go back to /tv/

>>83026906
Damifag pls.

>>83026895

Lately DC has been very good in getting trades out fast. I think the trades for DC You books came out just a month after the first 6 issues were done

>>83026934
>is where all the talent is right now
There only Tom King

>>83025605
How does this undo the reboot if New 52 is still supposed to have happened?

>>83019148
No Duke and Harper are not dead..

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>>83026348
>swamping
>the best
>where they introduced the shitty idea of the parliament being made up of former avatars
>where they show that the green is mentally retarded
>where they completely changed Anton Arcane into an "avatar of the rot"
>oh, and the Rot and the Red being created, all bullshit

I understand what they were trying to do, but it just felt really forced and silly.

>>83026973

Because the New 52 Universe was always the pre Flashpoint universe but it's been tampered with by Dr Manhattan. Rebirth is about the characters getting back to who they used to be but stories like Throne of Atlantis or Death of the Family still occurred

>>83025682
Yes I know, but that Superman and Lois are from post crisis.

>>83026964
Scott Snyder' pls. you sucks .

>>83027007
>where they introduced the shitty idea of the parliament being made up of former avatars

Moore introduced that with the Parliament, mate.

>>83027007
>>where they completely changed Anton Arcane into an "avatar of the rot"
I'm still mad

>>83027007
>where they introduced the shitty idea of the parliament being made up of former avatars
to clarify what my gripe is, it's the whole "the parliament isn't just made up of avatars of past that will "somewhat" help the current avatar, but that it's made up of former avatars who basically wants back in with favor from the green.

>>83027034

Everybody is from post crisis.

>>83027047
yeah I know, re-read it and I flunged it up. see
>>83027061
for slightly better clarification.

>>83027052
you and me both.

>>83026968
Tom King's The Omega Men collected edition will be out in three months.

>>83027005
What exactly is wrong with Harper as a character? I've only really read anything of her in Snyder's Batman and she came pretty inoffensive to me, so there must be something going on in some other book for her to justify the sheer hate she gets.

Snyder recently it seems like its 'cool' to hate him now.

>>83027098
Fans of Stephanie and Cassandra are butthurt OC is taking their spotlight.

>>83027087

That's pretty good for a title that sells so little

Anti Zack Snyder and Scott Snyder meme of .4chan.

>>83027098

nothing is wrong with the character.
But in the Gotham corner of the DCU, people get mad about the same things X-Men fans get mad about: they think a new character will push the spotlight away from their favorites.

So Duke and Harper are hated because they get to be Batman's new special friends instead of Tim and Damian and Steph and Cass and whoever they have a particular hard-on for.

>>83027098
She was pushed in favor of other Batfamily members to a ridiculous degree.
"FAN FAVORITE HARPER ROW"
Batman & Robin Eternal is just every member of the Batfamily talking about how great she is and how she would be Bruce's perfect partner

>>83022192
I thought it was neo-classical-absudist-shitposting

>>83027098
Batman dared praising her instead of Dick "I complain about Batman ruining my life at every instance" Grayson and Damian "I wish my dad was still dead and who cares he brought me back to life I hate him" Wayne

>The reason our comics suck is because of Watchmen! Not our shitty writers or editorial team

>>83027152

I think it's good. the protege should grow and move on from being Batmans sidekick. If people are mad at Harper and Duke just for that they should also be mad at everybody who isn't Dick

>>83027114

oh people have been shitting on Snyder's run since the end of the Court of Owls.

Death of the Family overall was weak, so having it follow a solid arc with a weak ending lead to a lot of people here upset with his run.

and Snyder gets blamed a lot for the Eternal books being pretty mediocre even though he didn't actually write any of them.

>>83027098
>Harper
I hate this character so much,, I dislike her for a number of reasons. ...t I think she's a really unnecessary like Cancer.

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>>83027152
Aren't most of those characters already off doing things in other Batfamily books anyway? That's dumb.

>>83027190
SHE IS A CUNT ;D

>>83024506

I've seen you post this claim, or similar ones in a bunch of different threads on /co/. I'd really like some figures to back up your bullshit, please.

>>83019148
>DC finally gives fans everything they want back

I still don't have a Cassandra Cain run that doesn't have Babs asBatgirl, and no Harper, so this is the exact opposite of what I want.

I fucking hate Barbara.

Go back to being Oracle and fuck off.

Take Harper with you.

>>83027152
>So Duke and Harper are hated because they get to be Batman's new special friends
This is a perfect explanation of my problem with her. That, plus her personality and story just annoys the shit out of me.

>>83027197
>I think it's good. the protege should grow and move on from being Batmans sidekick
This is true, the issue is that those sidekicks were erased and Harper was put in their place. So instead of Cass and Steph graduating from the role of Batgirl and passing it onto the next person, Cass loses her backstory, Steph was no longer Batgirl at all, and now both are Harper fangirls

>>83027197

oh they constantly do that.
Tim fans hate Damian because of the replacement.
Jason fans (didn't know those were real pre-Red Hood but w/e) hate Tim.
Dick fans don't care because hes better as Nightwing.

>>83027212

yes, but being in BATMAN as a supporting character is better than Tim being off in Teen Titans hell or Steph and Cass not existing for 4 years.

>Giant Status Quo shift
>AGAIN

Fucking hell, you people buy into it every fucking time, too. You people who keep buying comics from the people who have burnt you a hundred times are the reasons why cape comics are 99% suck.

>>83027275
>Dick fans don't care

Top fucking kek

>>83027022
Dafuq? If the Watchmen were part of the DC universe since the beginning, why haven't they made an appearance until recently?

>>83027260

Rebirth fixes all this

>>83027284
>>Giant Status Quo shift
>>AGAIN
But this isn't a shift, it's a return

>>83027260
Maybe she's meant to be hated? They want the reader to dislike her so they can do something else with her in long run.

>>83019148
So are the old 52 people gonna merge with their Nu52 selves or something? Or are we getting copies of heroes?

>>83027306

They have

The hand of creation is blue

>>83027326

The current Status Quo is being jettisoned for a new one. I call that a shift.

>>83027275
She the annoying girl at the end of the owls run?

>>83027341

The New 52 heroes are the Pre 52 heroes

>>83027341
Well the only duplicates running around right now are Pre-FP Supes/Lois and New 52 Supes/Lois, and there's a secret about New 52 Supes we don't know yet

>>83027244
I hate Harper so much.

>>83027326
>we are shifting back
>it's not a shift!
>it never was I swear!

Fuck off Johns

>>83027355

yes.

she pops up a couple more times in the main Batman book and then is a central character in both Eternal series.

>>83027369
Then how do you explain Bruce talking about superman's death in the preview?

>>83027152
Snyder shoving his "pet character" down our throats again... sorry, still a shit character. And such an original idea! Take an established character and change the gender or race! Bravo Snyder!...

>>83027396
If she it is back I'm cancelling all of my Bat-books. Hell, I might even cancel all of my DC books at that point.

>>83027406

because Superman still died in the new52.

it just happened in that weird 5 year gap between the end of the first JL arc and all the other #1s

>>83027445
Yep. Against Doomsday, even.

>>83019148
Did fans want to make everything into even bigger clusterfuck that it already is?

Anyone read this?

>Johns believes, correctly, that the core message of Watchmen was grossly misunderstood and manipulated in decades following its release. The comic, Johns believes, was a warning not to become disillusioned with the values that have defined DC from the beginning: justice, legacies, epic storytelling, love. Watchmen was not an instruction manual for writing contemporary hero comics

https://www.inverse.com/article/15992-dc-s-first-rebirth-comic-attacks-new-52-changes-regains-lost-heroes

>>83027433

she hasn't been referenced at all as far as I know in any of the pre-rebirth interviews/announcements.

She might pop-up in All-Star Batman or possibly Detective Comics (but that has such a big cast already that I don't see it happening)

>>83027478
>arguing with Damifag
Bored that much?

>>83027445
but we see Pre-FP Lois and Clark talking about N52 Superman's death

>>83027475
said by mister "let's turn silver age villains into edgy psycopaths with a twist"

>>83027133
Excuse me while I laugh until I throw up. Scott Snyder pls.

>>83027475

yea, Johns hates that everyone made comics dark and realistic after reading Watchmen because he realized that thats not what you were supposed to take away from that story.

>>83027497

I don't know man.
the Superman family editor is kinda shit. Don't know what to tell you except for what I've read in the books.

>>83027492
take your mouth from Snyders cock.

>>83027475

Johns is one of the worst fucking offenders when it comes to using the Watchmen style "Dark + Edgy" shtick as a crutch. I don't see that he has any write to criticise anyone else for doing it.

>>83027492

I didn't think we were arguing.
but yes I am very bored.

I don't really understand the hate for Harper. They're trying a little hard to push her (especially in the Eternal books) but I feel like thats because Snyder waited too long to try and do anything with her so nothing organic could be developed well.

Does anyone actually want Harper to have a bigger role than she already has? This smells like some executive or editor is forcing this unwanted character on us.

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>>83027445
He's talking about Final Days of Superman, which is ending with Nu52 Clark dying. But everything points to him coming back at some point because there's more to who he really is. I swear to god if they pull some shit with him having never been Superman I'll cut someone's hamstrings.

>>83027550
Johnsfag don't know that because they don't actually read comics.

>>83027559
!! NEVERRRRRRR!!!!"

>>83027553
Told above, she's TAKING SPOTLIGHT OF MY FAVORITE REEEEEEEEE. Plain and simple.
>>83027559
Yes. People are triggered with irrelevant Harper, imagine what would happen if she got solo book.

>>83027385
He never said it wasn't a shift.

He said it wasn't a "reboot".

Words have meanings. It would pay to learn them, y'know, for the purpose of communicating clearly with others?

>>83027629
>he never said it wasn't a shift
>"But this isn't a shift, it's a return"

>>83027629

Hey, buddy. You know that post you're replying to?

How about you look at the post that THAT one was replying to?

>>83027326

>>83027562

but Superman died again already in Hitch's JLA, so even Final Days of Superman is wrong.

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>>83027614
It's been five years and I'm still triggered that boring motherfucker Batwing got a book over any of the other Batman Inc. members.

My boy El Gaucho never gonna have his day in the sun.

>When all ya want is your favourite cape hero to get a good book but you're not allowed to have it.

>DC finally gives fans everything they want back

Trunks?

I'm done with DC comics until the next reboot.

>>83027683

Mexicans don't bring in the diversitydollars, m80

>>83027683

probably because DC was like "we need another black book"
and maybe because Winnick pitched a fucking Batwing book over anyone else.

I'm sure DC wasn't like "we're gonna make a Batman INC related book" and someone just went "BATWING"

I swear it seems like no one on /co/ understands how comics get made.

>>83027670
>Clark, stop dying!
>Clark, are you alive?
>Clark?
>>83027683
Same with me but with Knight and Squire. Well, Squire as Knight since Knight joined Dazzler's career.

>>83027700

Don't worry, it'll probably only take a couple of years. Sales will tank, like they always do.

>>83027723
I don't care about that. What matters is that Batwing is terrible and Judd Winnick has been getting away with his crimes for too long.

Snyder stories aren't that great and the endings are on the same level. (my opinion) He drags the stories to far and his endings are not anti-climatic but disappointing.

>>83027745

well he hasn't written a comic since he left Batwing if that makes you feel better?

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>>83027782
IT DOES I GUESS

>>83027562
Yeah, DC already spoiled there's another Clark Kent hopping around when Family Guy Clark takes over as the main hero, and it throws everyone for a loop since the secret identity is'nt quite back in the bottle yet.

>>83027780
I hate that people think he is the greatest thing since sliced bread, about the only good thing ever to come out of him was Court of Owls.

If you want good writers, here are the greatest Batman writers:

Denny O’Neil (Instrumental in bringing Batman back to his dark roots)

Steve Engleheart (His characterizations of most of the villains were perfect, Joker, Penguin, Deadshot, Hugo Strange, they were great)

Paul Dini (His characterization of the Joker alone is one of the best things to day and it’s the perfect representation along with Engleheart’s Batman)

Alan Grant (One of the greatest Batman runs ever with Norm Breyfogle)

Frank Miller (Year One is great, Dark Knight Returns and the sequel are…Mediocre in my opinion)

Bill Finger (Created the foundation for so many of the villains and Batman)

Doug Moench (Some of his stuff, not all)

Grant Morrison (Same with Doug Moench, but when Morrison makes a good story, it’s usually a must have)

Alan Moore (The Killing Joke and Batman Annual 11)

Those are the greatest Batman writers out there that trump Snyder any day. I don’t think Snyder is terrible, but this clinginess to his work is just appalling. Some of the stuff is good, but some of it’s awful.

>>83024173

Better question is why would he wear a hood? He needs situational awareness.

>>83027614
>Told above, she's TAKING SPOTLIGHT OF MY FAVORITE REEEEEEEEE. Plain and simple.
Harper is a literal Mary Sue

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>>83026282
>Superman Unchained
>Scott Snyder's Batman

>>83027848
>I hate that people think he is the greatest thing since sliced bread, about the only good thing ever to come out of him was Court of Owls.
>CoO
>Not Black Mirror

>>83027848
Dennis ONeill NuffSaid.

>>83027907
>BM
>good

Dickfags stop, it has been years. Enough with this meme

All you fuckers are ungrateful 2bh

Unless you're hype about Rebirth, then you're solid

>>83026404
You didn't buy DC, Disneyfriend

>>83027907

Thank you, anon. Pretty much all of Snyder's BruceMan has shit in comparison to his DickBats stuff pre-52. I was so excited to see him take over the main book in New 52. It's a shame how it turned out, really.

So what do you think the sophisticated approach will be to resolving the Rebirth crisis?

Geoff says it's not going to be Batman and co punching Manhattan in the face

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>>83027921
I'm as of yet not grateful nor ungrateful.

My grating depends entirely on what this does to Cassandra.

>>83027879
And other Robins and Batgirls aren't?
>>83027937
Two Batmen punching Manhattan in stomach.

>>83026903
Do you not read comics or something? Literally all the good writers at the big two are with DC.

>>83027937
they are going to get new costumes and use the something-force to stop Manhattan

>>83027950
>And other Robins and Batgirls aren't?
HAhahahahaahhahaahahahahahahaahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahhahaahahahahhahahahahaha oh my god absolutely not.

>>83027848
>hate that people think he is the greatest thing since sliced bread

literally who has ever said this?
who is this straw-man you have created to be mad at?

>>83027668
The problem is you attributing what that guy said to Geoff Johns.

Geoff Johns never used the word shift.

>>83027950
>And other Robins and Batgirls aren't?
>Dick
Womanizer, constantly lives in Bruce's shadow, cocky as hell
>Jason
Edgy, had issues with Bruce and his methods
>Tim
Too much like Bruce to the point that he alienated himself from his friends in his pursuit of justice
>Damian
Legit murdered people, constantly at odds with the rest of the family
>Babs
Didn't fully understand the risks of the Batlife, takes herself to seriously
>Cass
Literally couldn't speak because her fucked up childhood, had to earn an average life
>Steph
If it hadn't been for Tim she'd have died on the streets with her teen pregnancy baby

>>83026327
>Starfire is anime mech suit pilot girl
I don't see how that would be a problem.

>>83027937

They don't fight Manhattan at all but he sees how the hope and inspiration that the heroes have repels the gentry from the universe causing him to no longer meddle

>>83028147
DCare Bear Stare

>>83019148
Because they fucked it up

All they needed to do was fix it without adding any retardation on top

If this is an undoing of sorts and Nu52 characters are still canon, then how is pre-Flashpoint white Wally coming back while Nu52 black Wally is still around?

>>83028174
They'll merge, body of white Wally and dick of black Wally.

>>83025708
So he is blaming Watchmen for his own fuck ups
Did he take lessons at the idw pony writers school of criticism handling

>>83028174
nu52 Wally West is now White Wally West's cousin.

They're both named Wally West.

We just get all the heroes. I'm fine with that, give me fucking 20 of them. More superheroes is always good.

>>83028174
they all come from the same family, black wally is the cousin of white wally both named after their common grandparent

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>>83028213
>nu52 Wally West is now White Wally West's cousin.

>They're both named Wally West.

Wait how can the flashpoint universe be merged in doesent that no longer exist

>We're stripping everything back, to make it easier for new and lapsed readers
>Btw there's like 5 versions of Superman, 12 versions of Flash and 20 of the Joker, all in the same universe. Have fun!

>>83028237

It's not so odd if they're second cousins. I think they're both named after their grandfather. There's also a lot of racemixing in the country I live so a Black kid in a "white" family isn't odd to me

>>83028271
But they're not stripping everything back.

The whole point is they tried to do that with Nu 52 and it failed, so they're undoing it and embracing the convoluted nonsense that actually makes superhero comics entertaining.

>>83028250

The New 52 universe is the pre flashpoint universe. Think of it like somebody taking your favorite book, tearing out all the pages, gluing them back in in the wrong order while leaving a few pages on the floor but they have also written some fan fiction in the margins

>>83028193
It's hilarious really, especially considering they are the ones that turned everything super dark with stuff like Identity Crisis

This is like if Gundam had a show where they punch the EVA 01 unit for deconstructing the genre

>>83028305

I don't even think it's that convoluted and I started reading with the New 52. A rule from the New 52 was that everything Pre Flashpoint happened unless specifically stated not to

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>Real Wally is back
YES YES YES YES YES

>>83028193

He's not really blaming Watchmen. He's blaming everybody else for misinterpreting it. Would have been nice if he included himself though

>>83028381
>pandeering is fine when is a character I like! fuck Marvel when they do it by the way!

>>83028305
Convoluted nonsense is fun when it does not involve manipulating the nature of the multiverse.

>>83028381

And the JSA. I don't care about Manhattan. Nothing can kill my hype

>>83028403
>pandeering is fine when is a character I like
But that's always the case.

>>83028403
But Marvel doesn't undo their fuck-ups.
DC is at least admitting theirs, and actually making a meta storyline out of that admission.

>>83025367
>>Supposed to welcome new fans

Rebirth is specifically targeted to existing comic fans, not new readers. It is in direct response to New52 and DC You failing.

It's literally "shit, new readers didn't buy books, who can we get to still buy stuff?" and going back to old fans.

>>83028409
>muh JSA

why are redditors so obsessed with it?
they are to cool to like the JL?

>>83028431
No, wait, forget what I just said, considering in Marvel we have 2 Captain Americas, 2 Hawkeyes, 2 Hulks, some Wolverines, 2 Spidermen and a bunch of other things, just like this.

>>83028345
>This is like if Gundam had a show where they punch the EVA 01 unit for deconstructing the genre

If it was G Gundam I'd watch it.

>>83028405
you wont have to worry about it again till Action and Tec1000, the Watchmen aren't going to be this overarching thing in every book like the Monitor before COIE.

>>83028403

>Gotta drag in Marvel

At least people are talking about this. Nobody seems to care about Civil War II. It will appear to sell better though because of Variants causing shops to order more

>>83028459
>2 Spidermen
3, actually.

>>83028345
The difference is that Evangelion didn't actually change anything, whereas the influence of Watchmen in comics is horridly clear.

Mind you, Watchmen is a masterpiece on its own, but everything else doesn't have to be Watchmen.

>>83028431
>Marvel doesn't undo their fuck-ups.

Captain America has gone back to picking up the shield again 4 times now, one of those times involving him coming back from the dead*

*temporally displaced

Thor's also lost his hammer three times and died twice and come back and picked it up as well.

Shut the fuck up.

>>83028452

>Redditors

I love the Justice League and I've never been to reddit. If you wasn't to see why people love the Justice Society so much I suggest you read the convergence two parter

>>83028480
Fuck, I swore I typed 3.
And you know, there are more than 3.
Spiderverse, remember?

I don't recall any announcement that DC would bring back good writing.

>>83028471
>the Watchmen aren't going to be this overarching thing in every book like the Monitor before COIE.

This. Comics have always looked convoluted if you try and look at the big two as a whole