His entire scheme made zero sense. He gave experimental and therefore

>>81216804
Goddamn man I want to read your post but your lack of sentential breaks makes you sound like a bigger sperg than Lex in the movie

>>81216909
Sorry. Did that intentionally to drive home the incoherence of Lex's scheming. If you get overwhelmed, lost or annoyed while reading my post then I've accurately conveyed the experience of sitting through BVS.

>>81216804
BECAUSE HE GETS OFF ON HAVING POWER OVER OTHER PEOPLE AND HATES FEELING POWERLESS.

>>81216804
What I don't get is why the mercs needed experimental weaponry in the first place if they were just killing random Africans.

>>81217092
Okay. That's an acceptable, if lazy, motivation. Now explain his fucking evil scheme.

>>81217122
Or why the United States gave a fucking that some uncivilized desert apes were killed in the first place.

>>81216804
Why did they think stammering Zuckerberg was a good direction to take Lex?

>>81216804

You know how previous movie Luthors were all real estate businessmen?

This Lex is an arms dealer.

>so the American government would blame Superman from gun-related deaths in a war zone in another country

They don't blame him for SHOOTING the people, they claim that his presence escalated the conflict and caused the massacre, when in reality it was Lex's sponsored mercs who open fired before he even got onto the scene

> and ask him to come to a hearing to explain himself so Lex could have a former Wayne employee who irrationally hated Superman ride a jihadi wheelchair bomb into a hearing and kill a bunch of politicians so Superman would be blamed for even more deaths via conventional weaponry

Again, not for the explosion itself, but they blamed him for not catching the bomb and stopping it.

>so he could gain their power and turn it against Superman because....?

Because he's an egotistical maniac who is terrified that Superman is either just as crazily sociopathic as he is, or is being treated as a false god that prevents him from operating freely to manipulate people and do as he wishes.

>>81216804
It makes sense if you assume he knew who ever one was from the beginning and has been planning for two years like the late movie says he was
>experimental weaponry
Lois assumed it was experimental but it just wasn't commercial or military
>random african rebels
They weren't random they were the United States terrorists of the time but him getting the team installed is kinda bullshit
Jimmy had nothing to do with anything
>American government would blame Superman from gun-related deaths
Those bullets earlier probably made the gun deaths look a little odd for gun deaths until lois recovered the bullets
Military knew what was going on anyway but it was classified which is crazy that they'd just let supes take the fall for it
>ask him to come to a hearing
The people want supes to be apart of the democracy
That means coming to hearings
>Lex could have a former Wayne employee who irrationally hated Superman
Lex manipulated this man into hating superman for this long plan
> ride a jihadi wheelchair bomb into a hearing and kill a bunch of politicians so Superman would be blamed for even more deaths via conventional weaponry
Superman is failing to stop the destruction this makes batman mad
>government would be so antiSuperman that the'd freely give Lex access to a ruinedspace ship and an alien corpse so he could gain their power and turn it against Superman because
Government would have did it anyway
His plan rests on him knowing who everyone was and having great foresight

I till dont get how you can tie GUN DEATHS to Superman

>>81216804
literally /r9k/ the character

>>81217317
Government cover up
Swanwick told lois they knew but it was classified

>>81217397

But why cover it up? Unless they are already on board with Lex anti immigration policy but that was only introduced during the meeting with the senator which is after the hearings.

>>81217129
He hates Superman because the existence of aliens have put him at the bottom of a whole new totem pole. Cue plan to fuck with Superman.

Trap in the desert to discredit Superman and get him the political leverage he needs to do the thing. The bullets were him signing his work and shoving his dick in everyone's face telling them they won't say a god damn word, because he has the power to do that (and he gets off on that).

The bomb was there to kill the Senator lady. Why? Because she told him no, and took power away from him. Jar of piss levels of petty. The guy in the wheelchair was him building an asset in case he needed it. The Senator woman was his political roadblock, the other interested parties were on board.

The ship had knowledge, which was power, which he had to use to get HIS power back. Use kryptonite to stop Superman, so Lex can fuck around in the ship. Kryptonite got stolen, plan b to make Superman fight Batman, kill at least one of them.

Fuck around in ship, learn about shit, adds his DNA to the corpse monster so its HIS. Because it has to be his or it doesn't count. Kill Superman, get to the top of the totem pole.

>>81217484
Probably would have covered the whole thing if superman didn't pop up
Everyone knows superman was there because he's loud with his sonic boom and visible
And Lois can only account for superman
So maybe thats why the blame for an otherwise covered up event was placed on superman

>>81217496
>He hates Superman because the existence of aliens have put him at the bottom of a whole new totem pole
When is that ever said or shown in the movie? We're only supposed to assume that motivation because Lex is such a well known character. I would let that go if the Lex we got wasn't so inanely, radically different from the source material.

>>81217317
apparently the directors cut features lex's henchmen ripping up the bodies - hence the r-rating

>>81217773
It was in his monologues. Specifically his speech during the party and his conversation with the Senator.

>>81217773
it's implied I guess.

>>81216804
Why did he hate superman to begin with? Where's the beef? I can understand batman but that's only after he stole his shit

>>81217773
>ever said or shown in the movie
>the red capes are coming
He's Lex Luthor. The most powerful man in Metropolis. Now a WAS the most _

The emergence of the Kryptonians and destroying part of his city and him not being able to do anything about it is the heart of his hatred. So, he rebuilds and shows people that his money still hold sway BUT powerful? Now that a caped alien goes around the world saving people, Lex is no longer front-page material -- unless he does something about it. Make the front-page article a discrediting piece by making it look like Superman is responsible for new horrible stuff.

I understand blocking the checks so that the wheel chair guy would become like a mad and shit but why write on them? was that supposed to make Bruce mad? It does but that should had made him mad at Lex not superman

>random wheelchair dude was made at Bruce Wayne for shit Superman did or wondering why this one lone CEO isn't waging a war against a god
literally wtf

>>81216804
The Bigger question is why he thought creating a large brown dude to go on a rampage was a good idea.

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CLARK JOE
Also he was working for darkseid

>>81216804
They give him access to the body and ship way before the bombing of the Capitol.

>>81217961
>speech during the party
If you managed to actually follow that nonsense, cheers to ya m8. YouTubers are more coherent than that travesty of a scene.

>>81218248
He's not mad at Bruce. Lex was the one intercepting the checks and writing shit on it.

>>81218194
>Supes rips apart the batmobile
>You're a vigilante and a dick
>I'm Superman and I'm a god so stop it
>[that's it! i'm fucking killing this high-and-mighty alien]

Bruce hates both Lex and Supes (just at different levels). The alien actually confronted him.

>>81218009
>Why did he hate superman to begin with?

Cause he hated the idea of someone that powerful being let to do whatever he wanted

>>81218263
It's his creation. He thinks he can control it. He was talking to it and giving it orders and almost got Doom-smacked if not for Supes.

>>81217122

They weren't some random mercs, they were people working directly to Lex. Better weaponry = bigger and bloodier bodycount, which is exactly what they wanted.

>>81218009
have you never Lex Luthored before?

>>81218263
he's just evil Bruce Banner and Doomsday was his Hulk.

>>81218399
Have you ever realized this is a new continuity that doesn't appear to give a shit about being faithful to established characterization and therefore is obligated to explicitly justify itself?

>>81217773
>so radically different than Lex

read some silver-age and re-watch the hackman movies

>>81218446
The characterization is different; BUT the motivation is the same (I'm number one).

It doesn't matter if he was Gangster, Evil Scientist, Real Estate Mogul, or Super Genius Arms Dealer.

So, his question >>81218399 IS valid!!

To me, this lex wasn't smart enough to figure out supes identity on his own

That's why I say we should consider the Kimmel sketch as an actual part if the movie

>>81217317
He IS a gun

>>81218446
What are you talking abiut. Lex is a petty ego mad autist,same as always.

>>81218516
>and re-watch the hackman movies
Oh shut the fuck up already, hackman was awful.

>>81218446
I've always found it strange how we're expected to have an encyclopedic knowledge of all iterations of the source material in order to appreciate the brilliance of Snyder's vision, but if we notice that he's shitting all over it or characters are in name only, suddenly it's a new and different adaptation that need not follow anything pre-established.

Snyder loves relying on expectations and going "What why are you angry this is different I'm doing my version!" . He just uses the source material as a dodge, He'll find one panel in a 75 year history and use that to justify five hours of poorly scripted poorly characterized tripe.

In other words he'd fit right in here.

>>81218574
Hackman was great, especially as a silver-age luthor

>>81218527
That's still expecting the audience to just assume that. Given the nature of the film, that's a little much to ask.

>>81218516
Yes, because this grimdark gritfest was obviously pulling inspiration from the Silver Age.

>>81217317
>be superman
>faster than a speeding bullet
> poke people to death

>>81216804
"Goldfinger isn't a good book because what the fuck is that master plan it would take years to do all of that shit neh neh neh" or BRING LOGIC TO MY COMIC MOVIE. Everyone go see this grandiose work of art. OP, go away.

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>people already rushing to defend this fucking incoherent pile of shit

>>81218574

Hackman in the original was fucking great, I don't know where people get this idea that he was a joke for the entire series.

>>81218624

>implying Goldfinger's plot isn't clearly explained in the narrative

It's not realistic but you understand it.

>>81218608
>audience to just assume that
Just you. You don't seem to get the term megalomaniacal -- which has always been used to describe Lex.

>>81217092
This movie has the same problems as MoS. The characters are underwritten and usually only make sense if you supplement the characters on screen with the material from the comics. Goyer and Snyder's characters can't stand on their own in just the movie.

>>81218684
>always been used to describe Lex
but it's not lex...?

it's his son

>>81218608
>That's still expecting the audience to just assume that
It's a Lex Luthor with a different job. That's difficult for you? Really?

>>81218527
He gave a 2 minute speech to superman about God didn't stop his mean dad from touching his peepee and I'm suppose to assume that's been his motivation for the past 2 hours? I know who lex is and what he does but this movie gave little to no root at all as to why this lex hated him. It's a whole new universe devoid of some of the comics canon and what it set up for movie canon was in poor taste. 2 fucking hours and we get his talk with that bitch who drinks tea without ever really focusing on the man himself

>>81218684
>always been used to desribe Lex
Yeah, and fucking peaceful, lovable, admirable and friendly have been used to describe Superman, while things like shrewd, brilliant, beholden to a code...all for Batman. Oh, and Wonder Woman is usually described as not being a fucking twig.

This movie is not faithful to any easily recognizable spirit of these characters. Stop trying to defend this mess by referencing the core DC canon.

>>81218756
Too deep for you, huh?

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>>81218665

>smug anime girl

>>81218759
also Lex would never bow down to Darkseid considering Lex's will was so absolute he once ruled Apokolips himself

>45 seconds that explain why Lex goes nuts at the end
>cut
>2 minutes of the senator stuttering over a jar of piss
>untouched

???

>>81218773
Too shallow anon. It lacked everything a c rated movie would have had. Marvel does characters better

>>81218684
He lacks the cunning, the savvy, the foresight, and the intelligence of Lex. A Lex Luthor that gets caught and sent to prison. A Lex Luthor that wasn't powerful enough to buy his way out, and wasn't smart enough to cover his track in the first place. A Lex Luthor that had to rely on alien technology instead of his own resources. If all you retain of him is "megalomaniacal", you might as well replace him with a thousand other villains.

But whatever. Based Snyder can do no wrong, I guess.

>>81218759
>Yeah, and fucking peaceful, lovable, admirable and friendly have been used to describe What is project Cadmus
Sorry you don't read comic books too well

>Superman, while things like shrewd, brilliant, beholden to a code
You mean like he's starting to do now after learning from rookie mistakes

>Wonder Woman is usually described as not being a fucking twig.
I swear man, Alex Ross is now considered *usually*. Fucker ruined WW forever.

>>81218808
>Marvel does characters better
>Loki and Ultron are quipsters

>>81218796
You have to look past the writing anon and just take everyone else's head canon. It's not what they said but everything they left out because poor writing.

For a fagget that " hates gods" why did he ring the bell to summon more of them?

More shit writing, that's why

>>81218847
>rookie mistakes
>rookie
???????

>>81217122
Lex wanted Lois to investigate the bullet and confront him so he could push her off a building

If anyone's got that shot of WW

You know the one

>>81218880
yeah you're right, the kidnapping had nothing to do with it

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>>81218808
>Marvel does characters better

>>81218847
>you
>in charge of reading comprehension
Shrewd, brilliant, beholden to a code refers to Batman. This Batman is far from a fucking rookie and yet he still goes on a pathos-fueled terror and murders what, dozens of people?

>>81218796
jars of piss will be a long standing and recurring plot point in all the DCEU films.

Justice League, will have Darkseid sitting down on his throne to find a jar of piss labelled "anti-life equation"

Aquaman, a small undersea mountain of empty jars of "warm memories"

Wonder Woman, Ares gets a big ol' jar of "Peace on Earth"

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Can someone try to defend this scene please?

Like what the fuck was Clark thinking?
>A vigilante is taking the law into his own hands, much like I'm doing... but he's a bit violent
>Instead of trying to communicate reason with him, I'm going to stand in the way of his car, rip off the roof, then threaten him. That ought to inspire him!
>Like a true Superman!

>>81218777
>also Lex would never bow down to Darkseid considering Lex's will was so absolute he once ruled Apokolips himself
Not to mention this:
https://youtu.be/0qXyRETjy-Q?t=448
There's just no way to make Eisenberg into something half as good as this Lex. Not even if they had five more movies to build it up.

>>81217496

>He hates Superman because the existence of aliens have put him at the bottom of a whole new totem pole. Cue plan to fuck with Superman.

This isn't why he hated Superman. He hated Superman because Superman was a symbol of ultimate power being ultimately good. Superman was the closest thing to a god that spent his spare time going from place to place helping people who needed it.

This rubbed Lex the wrong way because when he was a child he was beaten by his father and he prayed for anything or anyone to intervene but they never did. Hence his whole "If God is all powerful he is not all good, and if he is all good then he can't be all powerful". And that's what he wants to prove to the world. He wants Superman to either kill the Batman or fail to save his own mother. He wants to be able to hold him up for the world to see and say "See everyone? Superman can't save everyone" or what he was more likely hoping for "See everyone? Superman might be powerful enough to save the world but he kills people who try to save it too"

>>81218928
Not only that why didn't he just fucking TAKE HIM AND THEN HAND HIM TO THE POLICE???

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>>81218847
>Alex Ross is the only artist to ever draw a muscular, statuesque or buxom Wondy
How many images will I need to post before you feel sufficiently stupid?

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>>81218896

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>>81218920

>>81218851
Marvel has all its characters go through the gauntlet of the big screen while DC hopes they can just have 4 of them ride batman and superman's coattails.

Even Deadpool only reverted to using some no lister heroes as tag alongs yet their hit to miss ratio still edges out better

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>>81218551
>Superman
>gun

Pick one.

>>81218843
>He lacks the cunning, the savvy, the foresight, and the intelligence of Lex.
>lacks
You mean different.

>gets caught and sent to prison.
This has never happened EVER.

>powerful enough to buy his way out, and wasn't smart enough to cover his track in the first place.
This has ALWAYS happened in comics and cartoons and TV serial and 70s movie.

>rely on alien technology instead of his own resources.
This has never happened EVER especially in comics and cartoons when making Metallo.

>>81218847
>>Yeah, and fucking peaceful, lovable, admirable and friendly have been used to describe What is project Cadmus
What kind of run on sentence bullshit is this. Are you that edgelord that thinks that modern comics are all Injustice Superman?

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>>81218901
>Iron Man in the comic is a smarmy fuckface who think he's hot shit and is a great engineer
>Iron Man in the movie is a smarmy fuckface who think he's hot shit and is a great engineer

>Superman in the comics is a paragon of virtue and justice, helping people with a smile on his face because he truly enjoys the act of doing the right thing
>Superman in the movie is a dour, brooding murderer who seems to hate helping people and threatens to smash Lex to bloody pieces with a snarling grimace

>>81218961
also the fact that the anon thinks Loki isn't a quipster in the comics

he's a fucking quipster in mythology

>>81218851
>>81218901
>Wonder Woman has 8 minutes of screen time and ten lines
>Superman is an emotional and downcast fascist
>Batman is good, aside from him recklessly killing a bunch of goons

You would have to try really, really hard to do worse than this.

And while I didn't like Ultron quipping, it suits Loki quite well.

>>81217298
>but it was classified which is crazy that they'd just let supes take the fall for it

The US government distrust Superman enough to have Senate hearings about him, why on Earth would they exonerate him when it would mean admitting that classified weapons tech developed in secret for their use pops in the middle of a warzone? It'd be incredibly embarrassing and cause a ton of political shitstorm to them. Letting Superman be scapegoated also plays well into their agenda to somehow get a hold on Superman, who so far has refused to submit to their authority.

>>81218955
B-but that crops out the good bits

>>81218928
He just really didn't want to write about football. Every story Perry gives him, football. He's from a small mid-western town, Clark has to love football is what everyone thinks. Clark does not care for it at all.

>>81219000
The only time I liked Ultron was when he switched to Vibranium body. That's when his character changed a whole lot for some reason.

>>81218980
>Superman in the movie is a dour, brooding murderer who seems to hate helping people and threatens to smash Lex to bloody pieces with a snarling grimace
>Implying Supes has NEVER done that in the comics

Bad comics maybe, but your argument is still bad.

>>81218980

>Iron Man in the comics is a smarmy fuckface who think he's hot shit and is a great engineer
>Iron Man in the movies created Ultron for no reason other than "It's easier then protecting the world myself"

>>81218966

>>gets caught and sent to prison.
>This has never happened EVER.

Are you implying Lex has never been to Prison? Because the Superman New 52 run started with him in a fucking prison he invented to imprison himself so he couldn't escape for some fucking reason.

>>81218777
Right, because Luthor never work with people he's planning to betray later on.

>>81219000
For the first half of the movie the occasional Alfred and Perry White scenes would come along and keep me from just giving up.

I thought they were done EXTREMELY WELL. It's just unfortunate that almost anyone that was a main character they just seemed to have no concept of.

>>81219044
I fail to see how that second point doesn't factor into the first.

>>81218980

>who seems to hate helping people

Yes that's why we got a montage of him helping people and refusing to stop.

>>81219082
>thinking Eisenberg Lex is going to be the big bad of Justice League Part 2
>especially after these reviews
lmao ok

>>81218912
>Shrewd, brilliant, beholden to a code refers to Batman.
You do know that the original Batman used guns and landed on people's necks, right? Even the current comicbook Batman is a product of comicbook evolution.

>far from a fucking rookie and yet he still goes on a pathos-fueled terror and murders
Comes back from retirement, and **brands** the first two criminals he went after (pedo in jail and white slaver).
Alfred looking at the newspaper headline and photo: That's how it starts. The fever, the rage, the feeling of powerlessness that turns good men... cruel.
(he came back worse).

can't sit long enough to pay attention, huh?

>>81219044
Isn't that why anyone creates anything? To make things easier. Even they fleshed out how worried he was about not being able to handle world invasions that up till a few years ago were undreamt of

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>>81218966
>This has never happened EVER.

>>81219110
remember when he helped jimmy from getting killed despite the fact that he saved lois just a bit later?

hm

>>81219094
>I thought they were done EXTREMELY WELL. It's just unfortunate that almost anyone that was a main character they just seemed to have no concept of.
Wait so the supporting characters are great and make you want to stick around, but the main characters are poorly written and make you want to quit, and the pacing is an absolute nightmare?
Oh my god. Is BvS the cape version of Naruto

>>81219081
He was being sarcastic.

>>81219103

Why would someone who is as self righteous as Iron Man, an egotistical prodigy of an engineer, who spent his first three movies holding his Iron Man plans close to his cold, lifeless chest like a child with a bottle turn around and decide "Hey I shouldn't be doing this myself, I'll build a sentient AI that will take all the glory!"

>>81219037
>seriously implying that since he acts like that in an extreme minority of the comics that somehow disregards the argument

Come on, you're not stupid enough to make a statement like that. Furthermore, you seem to be under the mistaken assumption that this movie is somehow about adapting the comics. This movie isn't about that and was never about that, its about translating the popular image of Superman to film using SOME small amount of extremely broad comic book material. When the general public think about Superman, they generally don't think about a guy who snaps people's necks.

>>81218851
>Ultron is a dark reflection of Tony, who never shuts the fuck up
>Loki is the God of Quips

jesus anon can you be any dumber

>>81219081
It's called sarcasm, anon.
(His argument back at his face.)

>>81219127
>this batman is actually a retired batman!
wow more fan theories, what is it like 17 now just for BvS?

Lex was right.

>>81219144

Right. He wasn't there to help Jimmy in time so he must hate helping people.

Everyone who wasn't there for the Paris bombings must be funding ISIS

>>81219110
Dude he looks like he fucking hates doing it. He doesn't even smile, it's like a tired obligation that he doesn't want to do anymore. People are feverishly thanking him and he's like "whatever, you people are fucking ants to me, I don't care."

>>81219142
sarcasm.

see >>81219154 and >>81219164

It's better that doing realestate scams for 10 or so movies. Then waiting for Superman to overcome green rocks.

>>81219189
>despite the fact that he saves lois just a bit later
but I mean i'm fine with this really

if you want Snyder for 3 or 4 more movies for the DCEU, my pleasure

xDDD

>>81219198

>"Thank you for saving that girl in the burning building Superman!"
>"Fuck off. I'm missing a dope party with Bruce Fucking Wayne to be here. Can't you morons build fire escapes or some shit?"

>>81219198
>People are feverishly thanking him
More like worshiping him like some angel from the heavens.

I think it's more the execution of these saving scenes that made them the way they are.

>>81219167
>fan theories
The news anchor actually says "... after all these years ... the Bat is back" in the movie, anon.

>>81219170
And yet he still used the ship to summon darkseid because why not. What does he gain from the unknown?

>>81219198
>People are feverishly thanking him and he's like "whatever, you people are fucking ants to me, I don't care."

No, he's feeling uncomfortable because people are literally piling up to worship him.

>>81219156
In the end he's still responsible for it, and he gets the acknowledgement and satisfaction knowing that he's the one who protects the world. Tony's a playboy, and undoubtedly gets a huge kick out of the spotlight, but I never really pictured him as a glory hound. He just gets off on knowing he's the smartest person in the room.

>>81219210
The only reason he didn't is because Zod was the real estate scam this time around.

>>81219241
so which is it, a retired batman or rookie mistakes?

>>81219248

He birthed him, didn't summon him.

And I think at that point with Superman not killing Batman or vice versa Lex was out of options and when the space ships computer told him this genetic thingy was dangerous to Kryptonians it was his ace up his sleave

>>81219250
>No, he's feeling uncomfortable because people are literally piling up to worship him.
I'm almost positive that there's been at least three different comics where he tells people not to worship him rather than just standing there and cringing.

>>81219248
>And yet he still used the ship to summon darkseid because why not.

He doesn't ring the bell. He learns the bell has already been rung by the Kryptonian Archives.

As a Marvel fan, I'm really loving all these Snyder defenders

>>81219282
>rookie mistakes
is Supes see >>81218847

(like what you just did)

>>81218665
>Stop having discussion, different opinions not welcome!

>>81219265

But he wouldn't get the glory. Ultron would.

Whenever Jarvis tells him something or informs him of something does he turn around and say "Thanks me! Man I'm so smart"?

The Iron Legion seems like something Tony would do. An army of Iron Men in his image that act as drones.

A fully functioning AI that will act of its own accords? That doesn't sound like something Tony would do.

>>81219324
>rookie mistakes referring to Supes
??????

>>81219291
>He birthed him, didn't summon him.
Darkseid, not Doomsday.

>>81219335
Whatever makes him sleep better at night.

>>81219354

Oh man.

I will leave now.

I'm sorry.

>>81219291
That's doomsday anon. End of the movie speech is what we are referring to.

>>81219310
No anon, watch the movie again. He said nothing about the Kryptonians who planned to invade earth to make their own world anew summoning darkseid to come and conquer them

>>81219362

It doesn't.

Unlike you I want all characters to be portrayed well. Both companies are doing a terrible job with majority of their characters and it hurts that Marvel are the only ones getting away with it because since Iron Man was such a huge hit everyone has become walking Joke books for children

>>81219335
>Whenever Jarvis tells him something or informs him of something does he turn around and say "Thanks me! Man I'm so smart"?

In all honesty I bet he literally does in his head.

>A fully functioning AI that will act of its own accords.
While it's been a while since I saw Weekend at Ulron's, I'm pretty sure that making a fully sentient AI wasn't in Tony's original plan and it was going to be something more like JARVIS.

>>81216804
If he'd be the Joker, the character would have fit better

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>>81219402
>everyone has become walking Joke books for children
Cap hasn't. Cap is so Cap that he's started to become Superman.

>>81219402

>Marvel movies movies for children

>DC makes movies for nobody

>>81219311
I defended AoU as well, especially
-- Fury's role ... which some folks think is just comes out of nowhere
-- Veronica ... where has this been all along (like for Harlem)
-- The Roma twins hatred for Stark

I like expositions. It's like a What If? issue or Elseworlds comics. :)

>>81219390

The bell being rung is Cyborg fusing with the Mother Box.

>>81219402
If I remember, Iron Man in the first film wasn't like 616 Iron Man before the movies.

>>81219402
>Both companies are doing a terrible job with majority of their characters

Like who? And how? What makes Tony's characterization so different? That makes the characterizations wrong for the "majority of their characters"?

>>81219341
I'm sorry you don't have memory of the incidents when he first put on the uniform and had to fight trained Kryptonian warriors.

>>81219498
Follow-up ... I'm also this guy >>81219462

>>81219436
He was a supremely undignified and a joke of a character with nonsensical motivations.

But damned if he wasn't entertaining.

>>81217376
>rich
>successful
>probably has had sex with men or women before

Nope.

>>81219436
>incredibly famed billionaire who was a centerpiece in a famous tragedy 35 years ago and has been extremely active in the spotlight ever since
>MEETS
>fucking literally who redneck that has a whopping year and a half of journalism under his belt
Why was this a big deal?

>>81219479

Tony was never the wacky joke man in the comics before RDJ. He was arrogant but never really one for firing off hot zingers, he was more sober and reserved due to how fucked up and broken he actually was.

Then again Civil War broke the character on such a fundamental level that I was actually happy when he got turned into RDJ 2.0 in the comics because at least he wasn't Double Hitler anymore.

>>81219464
I know of the motherbox but the word mother and box were never used in the same sentence the entire movie.That prison cell speech was poorly written as was Waynes sudden future visions which I'm sure they will tie in later. As well as superman's delusional visions of his dad. Both those guys need some help

>>81218796
>Over 5 minute long dream sequence
>Showing the flashback of Bruce's parents dying twice
>Funeral scene lasting just long enough to be pointless and excessive
>All the buildup on that final shot for the stupid inception ending that doesn't make sense

I'm not even trying to be nitpicky, but how can a movie have both too much and not enough?

>>81219462
>-- Veronica ... where has this been all along (like for Harlem)
This was a thing? They say in movie that Banner helped Stark design it. So it could only exist post Avengers 1.

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>>81216804
My father, was a drinker, and a fiend. And one night, he goes off crazier than usual. Mommy gets the kitchen knife to defend herself. He doesn't like that. Not. One. Bit. So, me watching, he takes the knife to her, laughing while he does it. He turns to me and says, "Why so serious?" Comes at me with the knife. "WHY SO SERIOUS?" He sticks the blade in my mouth... "Let's put a smile on that face." And... Why so serious?

>>81219436
>>81219537
Did Luthor really have to point that out? Is subtlety not a thing in Zack Snyder's movies?

>>81219529
I genuinely like Eisenberg as an actor, he clearly had fun with the role - even if the script was total garbage

>>81219537
I'm more annoyed about Clark somehow not knowing who Bruce Wayne was outside of Lex's house. Like holy shit, how can you be a journalist and not know one of the biggest celebrities on the planet

>>81219617
>Is subtlety not a thing in Zack Snyder's movies?

Are you joking? Are you high?

>>81219576
There was one butthurt guy from TV sperging about RDJ showing up in Incredible Hulk ... BUT why didn't he just bring the Hulkbuster suit then.

We knew he sperging when he mention San Francico (from the first Hulk) ... which is not an MCU film.

>>81219537
Cause journalists are the real heroes or something like that I don't know

>>81219638
Okay, there may be subtlety in his other movies but BvS was deprived of it.

>>81219641
>TV
sorry ... meant /tv/

>>81219641
Probably because he hadn't finished it yet I imagine.

>>81219617
clark kent is kinda a big deal in the news paper world

>>81219617
Zack Snyder makes a series of scenes that would look good in a trailer, then strings them together to make a movie.

>>81219617
>Zack Snyder
>subtlety
This is the man who made 300 and Sucker Punch. I don't think he's capable of subtlety

>>81219662
...No, there is next to no subtlety in any of his movies. I'm going all the way back to Dawn of the Dead here too.

>>81219665
Or only an untested prototype. So YES, that's basically 1 of the /co/ theories.

>>81219670
>I used to fall for stupid trailers


....

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=sDX1m0Y2Vkg

>>81219670
I almost want to believe that

>>81219665
>>81219710
Or like I, and more importantly the movie itself said, he made it in conjunction with Banner. I mean shit even the code name of the suit requires knowledge about Banner's personal life that Tony probably wouldn't get otherwise.

>>81219667
How? His own coworkers don't seem to give a shit about him, he's stuck writing pointless sports pieces and, again, he's been a journalist for a maximum of eighteen fucking months.

>>81219766
That's right!
Bruce has a Betty, so they Hulk a Veronica!

Cool Archie reference.

(I haven't watched TMNT, though. So, I haven;t defended that from an IDW standpoint. Still doesn't lessen my /co/ geekiness)

>>81219837
they **made Hulk a ...

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>>81219837
>Everything you just said

>>81217317
I don't think he was blamed directly, the way I see it he was criticized for not preventing the conflict from spiraling and reaching nearby villages. Since the only person he saves there is Lois, an outsider. And some accused him of being the catalyst seeing things only went south immediately after he gets there.

It's similar to the bomb situation were he is blamed of neglect. Most didn't implicate him in the actual acts, they were just lashing out because "god" wasn't there to save them.

>>81217317
This is bait right?

Just in case. No one is saying Superman killed those guys with guns (or at all) but they're saying his interference caused the shooting.

>>81217092
Then why did he imply at the end that he broadcast a signal to space inviting other ultrapowerful space gods to fuck up earth?

>>81219537
>>81219617
You people do fucking realize that he knows that they're Superman and Batman already at this point right? He's deliberately saying it amuse himself and feel superior.

>>81219953
He didn't imply that.
Just that he knew.

>>81216804
Because he's just sooo wacky.

>>81218725
That... is a valid criticism.

>>81219971
HOW?

>>81220019
He's Lex Luthor lol idunno

>>81216804

https://www.fanfiction.net/s/10360716/1/The-Metropolitan-Man
>The existence of Clark Kent cost four people their lives in the average day. A human life was worth less to Superman than the ability to sit at a desk for an hour. And that was just actual death. If you included rape, assault, property damage, and theft, it became even more atrocious. Lex immediately revised his estimate of the existential risk posed by Superman upwards by a substantial amount.

>Lex had investigated the Clark Kent issue as much as he could from as remote a distance as possible. There were a number of troubling aspects to it, aside from what it implied about Superman's psychology and the value that Superman placed on human life.

>Clark Kent's first byline for The Daily Planet had preceded Superman's arrival by three months. Superman had claimed to study the world for two weeks before intervening in human affairs, but that was clearly a lie. And where had Clark Kent come from? You couldn't just get hired without paperwork and references. It was admittedly possible that a number of people were in on the deception, but Lex thought it unlikely. He'd spoken to Lois Lane in person on a number of occasions, and she hadn't let even the smallest false note slip. Even if she were a masterful liar, now that Lex knew the truth he should have been able to spot something in retrospect. He would speak to her again to make sure, but if Superman's interviewer weren't in on the secret, Lex couldn't imagine anyone else would be either.

>No, the signs pointed to Clark Kent existing in some respect prior to his arrival in Metropolis, and this buried past was where Lex needed to be looking. He hired out a private investigator to strike up a conversation with a photographer at The Daily Planet named Jimmy Olsen, and when the topic of a recent article came up, Jimmy was all too ready to spill the beans on Clark Kent. He'd been obliging enough to provide a location: Smallville, Kansas.

What if Lois hadn't reported on that shit in Africa?

What if there was never a shootout?

What if there was, and Superman never arrived and then Lex was the one blamed for all this shit?

Why did Lex make the bomb in the capitol building traceable to the dude's chair? Seems like that just makes the dude look like the bad guy, not Superman.

What if Batman had killed Superman?

What if Superman had successfully warned Batman and they both flew over and saved his mom?

Also, how did Luthor manipulate the dude's checks before ever even meeting the dude? Or was he just bullshitting Bruce?

Lex's plan was not well thought out.

>>81220093
>In his home, Lex Luthor had built a keyboard which connected to the phone lines. Many nights he could be seen pressing the keys while staring at his coded notebook, with no apparent output. When he hammered down the keys to, they didn't produce the normal solid clack of metal levers pressing up against a ribbon of ink. Though it looked much like a typewriter, the keys were attached to an electrical mechanism which translated each press of a key into a tone, which was in turn sent down the phone lines.

>Someone watching Lex Luthor's hands from above might try to observe what he was typing, but that would be a useless exercise since Lex Luthor was typing in a crude code on keys that were completely unmarked. Someone with absurdly superior hearing might find the terminus to the phone connection at an office building in downtown Metropolis, where the tones were magnetically recorded on a steel wire and later translated into a still-encrypted paper copy by a somewhat bewildered secretary. The paper copies were filed away, and from time to time Lex Luthor could be seen stopping by to leaf through them, seemingly able to decode them without need for a cipher.

>>81220107
>Seems like that just makes the dude look like the bad guy, not Superman.
duh

>>81220121
>The line was split of course, and the terminus in LexCorp offices was a decoy. The coded messages that filled the cabinets were nonsense, the letters randomized past the point of recovery, not that Superman had shown himself to be much of a code-breaker. The real coded message was received by a small office out in Star City, California, where it was decoded into a set of instructions, with a header in English and the rest in some other language. The people who worked at the office knew little about who they worked for or what purpose their work served. The English portion of the message was for them, and told them who to send mail to, or occasionally who to call, while the second part was for their recipient, and invariably in a language that the people at this small office didn't speak - an additional protection against Superman, though it was really more of a minor inconvenience than good security. The people at the office assumed that their secret master was the United States government.

>This circuitous route was a bit paranoid, even given Superman's demonstrated surveillance capabilities. Superman had repeatedly been shown to need to focus on stimulus, and it was Lex's working theory that Superman's brain filtered out the vast majority of the input that it received from his ears and eyes. Superman could prime himself to listen for a gunshot, or the sounds of shouting, but he didn't have total information processing. For this very reason, most murders in Metropolis were now surprise attacks using melee weapons that would eliminate the victim's ability to produce sound. A gunshot was distinctive, while the sound of a knife slicing flesh was not. In a way, Superman's arrival had made the underworld a more brutal place.

>>81220107
My entire point in creating this thread. This whole fucking thing was a mercilessly cynical and dark comedy of errors. The entire plot hinged on unlikely happenstance and misunderstanding.

>>81220129
How does that benefit Luthor in any way? If anything it paints Superman's idealogical opponents as crazy, pseudo-Jihadists and garners sympathy for Superman.

>>81220133
>It was likely that Lex could have skated by on lesser security precautions than he took, but he'd woken up to nightmares of having his skull crushed between Superman's hands too many times. In the dream he was just one in a long line of people that stretched out on either side of him, an endless number of people waiting to be killed by Superman. The alien did the work calmly and cleanly, and Lex was the only one who was trying to fight back. Precautions were the order of the day.

>>81220154
"I trust Superman," said Lex, "But do you believe that Superman is perfectly good?"

"Perfectly?" asked Lois. "That's a high standard. But he's as damned close as we're going to get. He's been here four months now, and he's saved hundreds if not thousands of lives. He doesn't act as a law unto himself, he just flies through the air and helps people like it was the most natural thing in the world. He hasn't killed anyone, and despite what people might allege, I don't believe that he's ever seriously injured anyone either."

"All true," said Lex with a smile. "But given that he isn't perfect, do you think that it's unreasonable to take precautions against the possibility that he one day acts in some unconscionable way?"

"Is it really worth however many hundreds or thousands of dollars this renovation is costing you?" she asked.

"There are a number of factors that go into determining that," said Lex. "I have enough money that the expense is somewhat trivial to me, and I have enough intellectual property that having it stolen would be quite damaging to me - patents, ideas, formulas, processes, and half a hundred other things. Beyond that, there is a value to me in not being watched, even when I'm not doing anything of note. It brings me peace of mind, which is worth something even when the actual risk is low. I suspect much of the sales of this shielding will go to husbands who want to know that their wives aren't being spied on in the bath."

"'Humans have an intrinsic right to privacy'," said Lois. "Navis told me that, and I suspect that he heard it from you."

>>81220185
"I believe I said something like that, yes," said Lex. "It's one of the great flaws of our Constitution that a right to privacy is not among those enumerated. It's funny, isn't it? No one would begrudge you from having frosted windows in the bathroom or drawing your curtains when company is over, but as soon as Superman enters the picture many people think that such measures are somehow indicative of criminality, or morally wrong in and of themselves."

"I didn't bring up crime," said Lois.

"But you will, in the article?" asked Lex.

"Of course," Lois nodded.

"Then I have a further argument for you," said Lex. "Perhaps you perfectly trust Superman not to look at you while you change, or perhaps you have no secrets you'd rather he not be privy to, but do you believe that Superman will always be the only one with his abilities? We can infer that there are other aliens out there, and here on Earth there are plenty of scientists - myself included - who are working to reverse-engineer the things they see him do. If tomorrow my rivals in business can see through my walls, they'll find my defenses already in place, which is only prudent."

"I suppose," said Lois. She looked down at her notebook. "I think I have everything I need. More than I need, actually. The article isn't going to be particularly long."

"You can admit that you enjoy talking to me," said Lex.

"It's stimulating, I'll give it that," said Lois. "But I also came here to thank you. The ERA passed the Senate and moved onto the House, and even if it fails there I'll consider you to have held up your end of the bargain."

"I'm a man of my word Miss Lane," said Lex. "Though I have to warn you that prospects are bleak. The Eighteenth Amendment has made people shy of modifying our founding document."

"All the same," said Lois.

What I didn't understand was Lex's grand plan with the spaceship. He kidnaps Martha to get Superman to fight Batman, presumably to distract him while Doomsday finishes cooking.

Thankfully it took exactly the same amount of time he needed (I guess Lex is THAT much of a genius that he predicted exactly how long Batman could hold him off for), but barring the best possible scenario, what would've happened if:

A) Superman flew over to Gotham, killed Batman in 1 second, and flew back?
B) Batman managed to kill Superman, which he almost did until the coincidence of the century happened.

Either Doomsday is killed before anything even happens, or Doomsday is born and doesn't even have Superman to fight.

>>81220203
There was a moment where perhaps Lex could have asked her to dinner, but he let it pass by. Lois was tenacious and decisive, intelligent and principled, and in another time he might have tried to see whether she could sustain his interest in the long-term. Now was a time of action, and the threat of Superman was too great to permit for such idle distractions. Later perhaps, when Superman lay dead in the street, Lex would go on the pursuit.

After they'd said their goodbyes, Lex sat in his smoking room and thought about explosives. The actual designs would have to wait until his study had been coated in lead, but until that time he could refine his plans within his head. He would need to find someone to carry out his will, someone without a strong moral compass, but he thought that he had just the right person in mind.

>>81220232
>Timer has 10 minutes on it when Superman is almost finished by Batman
>Batman is able to change costumes, get into a fucking helicopter, and fly over to Metropolis, beat up the bad guys, and there is still time to spare
That's what pissed me off the most about that part.

>>81220232
It's almost as if this movie was poorly written and poorly directed...

>>81218577
>In other words he'd fit right in here.
This statement stands for itself. You yourself are exceptional.

>Lex is smart enough to figure out Superman and Batman's identities
>can't figure out how to not get caught

>>81220232
Why would he even need a distraction, though? Superman is too busy fucking Lois Lane in the bathtub to care about what Lex is doing. All he does is call attention to himself.

>>81220263
>helicopter
Batplane
>fly over to Metropolis
Alfred said he tracked the Russian's cell to the port was in the port (ironically where they were all along)

>>81220263
Changing costumes is fine, because when he gets into the plane/drone thing, he uses the same insta-change technology used in the sliding bat pole or whatever.

My issue is, even though the fight scene was good, and Snyder does Batman combat way better than Superman combat, that while BM was playing grabass with the jobbers and revealing himself to be in the next room over, Martha had enough time to be breaded, roasted by the flame thrower, and eaten by the time he got in there. Maybe it was because the badguys were expecting SUPERMAN, not Batman, and that if they killed her SM would've ripped their heads off their spinal columns.

Some henchmen.

>>81220340
Plane, copter, he still had to go and get that shit, turn it on, etc. Shit takes time.

Also, the port was in Metropolis. The movie has Gotham being directly across the harbor from Metropolis.

>>81217317
Because is convenient to the US. They are scared of Superman and they want the public to be too. They claim his presence was a catalyzer. Which is not hard to convince. You have people in the real world thinking Obama is a satanic Muslim and lizard people are controlling the government so Superman making a delicate political situation worst is not hard to convince people of

Am I the only one who wanted at least a black Lex Luthor with a purple and green super metal suit that shoots Kryptonite lasers?

>>81220438
That would have been too silly for this super-serious superhero flick with ham-fisted Christ references, jars of piss, and CGI destruction

>>81220107
>What if Lois hadn't reported on that shit in Africa?
>What if there was never a shootout?

Then Lex would have engineered something else to make Superman look bad.

>What if there was, and Superman never arrived and then Lex was the one blamed for all this shit?

Lex wouldn't be blamed because then the news would only be that Lois Lane died in a warzone. The bullets would still not go anywhere because the US government would keep it hushed up, due to the fact that a dead CIA agent was found there with classified experimental bullets anywhere would embarass them.

>Why did Lex make the bomb in the capitol building traceable to the dude's chair? Seems like that just makes the dude look like the bad guy, not Superman.

The bombing is just to make people fear and hate Superman even more. Even though the investigation will clear Superman, people will still harbor the initial reaction of "omg did Superman just fucking blow up the goddamn capital building?!" and Superman failing to stop the bomb just will enforce the anti-Superman sentiment against him. It's a win-win for Lex.

>What if Batman had killed Superman?

Lex would have been content and resumed his weird ass doomsday science project.

>What if Superman had successfully warned Batman and they both flew over and saved his mom?

That's what happens in the movie, and Doomsday was that back up plan.

>Also, how did Luthor manipulate the dude's checks before ever even meeting the dude? Or was he just bullshitting Bruce?

Because he has been planning this for a long time and manipulating an ex-Wayne employee to be an unwitting suicide bomber is just what he needed to piss Bruce off to throw him off the ledge.

>Lex's plan was not well thought out.

No, people are just idiots and try to nitpick everything to death.

>>81220513
>Lex would have been content and resumed his weird ass doomsday science project.

Which would have immediately killed him as soon as it woke up, since it immediately tried to kill him as soon as it woke up and Lex only survived because Superman showed up

Indeed, it was not very well thought out

>>81220513
>they both flew over and saved his mom
>That's what happens in the movie
Did you even see the movie?

>>81220549
>Indeed, it was not very well thought out

Lex being a victim of his own hubris when he fails to control a monster he's created? Yeah, that would never happen. Oh wait, Lex's creations just about always turn against him.

>>81220513
>Lex wouldn't be blamed because then the news would only be that Lois Lane died in a warzone.
You don't think the government would check into the unique, one of a kind LexCorp bullets involved in the death of a CIA operative and immediately question Lex?

>>81218928
this is honestly the worst scene in the entire movie, and that's saying something, because boy does it have some competition

>"The bat is dead. Bury it. Consider this mercy."

Never have I seen Superman handled so horribly in my life, and I never thought I'd be saying that about anything else after MoS.

>>81220573

Yeah, I misread that but it doesn't change the fact that it's what basically happens in the movie, apart from them fighting a little first and Superman then flying back to Lex.

>>81220583
But there wasn't even an attempt to control Doomsday, he literally had no plan.

>>81218808
>Marvel does characters better

With the exception of Spider man (Toby Mcguire movies) all other Marvel characters in the movies version suck, essentially are adults with infantile mentality that never take responsibility for their actions before society and create more problems than they solve (or are responsible for creating them)

>>81220583
You are only proving me right in showing that it was a stupid-ass plan.

>>81220622
Sounds like comic book characters to me.

>>81220602
>The bullets were stolen, here, have a report that we filed to you about it two weeks ago? Must have been a clerical error that you never got it. And besides, why would I, a multi billionaire, sell classified bullets to some random third country warlord? For some nickels and change? I make more money just by taking a nap.

And that would be the end of it.

>>81220388
>port was in Metropolis
The Russian has been operating in the abandoned Gotham port. Yellow Sodium lamps of Gotham. Not the blue hue nightlights/street lamps of Metropolis. Watch it (again) carefully and listen.

>>81220620
Wasn't him slicing his hand and bleeding over Zod like...some sort of genetic control? I mean, yeah DD went straight for Lex with the punch so it didn't work...what WAS the point of bleeding on Zod? I thought he was trying to make Connor at first, and then Bizarro popped out, and then he turned into Doomsday.

>>81220604
This is my favorite scene, because it highlights Superman's disgust with Batman for stopping sex offenders and pedophiles.

File: ObiWanHS-SWE.jpg (57KB, 500x667px) Image search: [Google]

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>>81216804
BUT WAS HE A GOOD FRIEND?

>>81218944

>MoS Superman
>symbol of ultimate power being ultimately good

Oh wow.

>>81220660
You seem to think the CIA is a lot more gullible than they actually are.

>>81220623

Which is entirely in character for Lex, so not really a big issue.

>I-i-it's okay to have bad writing, it's totally in-character you guys!

>>81219158
You're talking about comics vs movies.
You were cherry picking.
Yes, the comics where Supes does that are not considered good, but it means that it isn't unfaithful to some depictions in the comics.
If we had an angry snarling Superman in the early 90s or something, he would probably be accepted as relevant and faithful to recent depictions.

The argument should be that it's a bad and cheap way to characterize him, not comparing it to the comics.

>>81220673
Why would he even think that would work?

For that matter, why would he even think to try it in the first place?

What the fuck is wrong with this retarded script?

>>81220706

They can suspect all they want to, but they can't prove anything so it's not a problem for Lex.

>>81216804
>The mercs were already merc'ing, he just sent some guys 9ver after he heard about the story because he wanted to make Superman look bad by having him swoop in to save Lois but not staying around to handle the after effects
He assumed it would be enough to get him access to the space tech, but when it wasn't he found the Wayne Tech guy because he saw it on the news and talked him into speaking at the U.N. to sway the public against Superman. As a show of good faith he gave him a brand new wheelchair (which was secretly a bomb)
It made people turn against him because a bunch if people died because he wasn't expecting it to happen, making him look fallible and Furthering complaints that he needed to stop doing what he did free range because obviously he wasn't smart enough to handle everything on his own
After he got the space tech he wanted Batman to either put him down, or if that failed he was going to use Doomsday as a last resort to off him

>>81220754
I think that it's okay to have bad writing when it comes to this version of Lex because he's a horrible characterization that lacks any shred of likeability. Everything he does is retarded because he IS retarded.

He is literally the Jar Jar Binks of this movie.

>>81219454
>>Marvel movies movies for children


That explains why the characters act and behave like children who have in their hands a loaded gun

>>81220713
How is it in character for Lex Luthor to have zero precautionary measures in place before creating a godlike monster man?

Fuck, Superman 4 had a smarter Lex than this.

>>81216804
How do you deal with mitigating the risks of superpowered beings roaming the Earth and threatening to spill out from the sky?

>>81220785
It's never okay to have bad writing in a movie. If a character like Lex Luthor is being compared to Jar Jar Binks there might be a problem with your movie.

>>81220801
Leó Szilárd patented the nuclear chain reaction in 1934. He then asked the British War Office to hold the patent in secret, to prevent the Germans from creating nuclear weapons. After the discovery of fission in 1938, Szilárd tried to convince other physicists to keep their discoveries secret, with limited success. In 1939, he wrote a letter to Franklin D. Roosevelt with Albert Einstein warning of the possibility of nuclear weapons and recommending action.

The reason US nuclear weapons development had been surprisingly fast was the massive scale of investment. Around $1.9 billion nominal US dollars were spent on the Manhattan project, which was roughly 0.8 percent of annual US GDP at the time. That's be $27,638,705,521.47 USD in 2016.

"'If each necessary step requires ten months of deliberation,' Leó Szilárd had complained to Alexander Sachs in 1940, 'then obviously it will not be possible to carry out this development efficiently.' The American program was moving faster now than that, but not by much." (Rhodes 1971, 369–70)

You need 1. An Arms Race, 2. Scientific Secrecy, and 3. a Presidential Alert.

>>81220809
Yeah, I'm not saying the movie is good. I'm saying it sucks and Lex sucks. But complaining about Lex's completely stupid plan is like complaining about a dirty floor in a house hit by a tornado.

>>81220801
Make an invincible, genocidal troll monster, clearly.

>>81218880

No he didn't you ucking retard, he had just sold the weapons to them.

She got her hands in the ordeal, started snooping around, and so he decided to keep an eye on her. Found out she was dating Clark, pushed her off a building.

>>81220861
That's an oddly specific way to say, 'an engineered organism for the purpose of eradicating an existential threat'.

>>81220622
Which leads up to the plot for civil war. It all comes together. Gotta look at the bigger picture

One of the really noticeable flaws of the film was how unnatural almost all of the dialogue was. It all had this stilted, pseudo-intellectual filter over it, as though they were hoping they were writing lines that would get quoted on some kid's fanart wallpaper.

>>81220895
But unless the mother of all coincidences happens and both die simultaneously for the purposes of narrative closure and Christ symbolism (and really, what's the chance of THAT happening), you're gonna end up with one really pissed off godlike abomination gunning to murder everything you've ever loved. That seems like a pretty bad plan. Unless Lex was planning on making even BIGGER invincible genocidal troll monsters in perpetuity and making money off collecting the insurance from all the destroyed buildings.

>>81220706
Not gullible but if one of their agents gets killed in foreign land, doing something he probably shouldn't do on a place he shouldn't be. They just cover it up. They can't investigate much. They can't send CSI on somewhere elses land. And check the what kind of bullets, why even care. Also they probably can't do shit to someone as rich as luthor who probably makes more of the equipment of war for the US government

>>81218312
It really wasn't that hard to follow

>>81218851
Ultron may be a quipster but he had a clear character and motivation. His rambings were actually coherent in comparison to Lex Zuckerberg.

>>81219044
>Tony creates armor because its easier than just punching things with his hands

Lol what a fag

>the when Batman once again killed the KGBeast.
How does he keep getting away with it?

>>81220773

I don't believe it was to give Lex control over him. Though I'm sure he would have hoped it would have.

I see two more likely reasons:
A) The ship was very against creating DD, so Lex put his blood on it as way of overriding the kryptonian law
B) The ship required living cells to jump start the process to bring DD to life.

>>81221196
Which would have made it more human than anything and yet it had to strange build up and release ability. I mean for every few punches it took the thing leveled 3 blocks

>>81217298
>Superman is failing to stop the destruction this makes batman mad
>>81217239
>but they blamed him for not catching the bomb and stopping it.

These sounds stupid when you add "...so batman goes on a training montage and crafts a kryptonite spear to kill superman" at the end of it

oh hey, those cops failed to capture joker. Better kill them

Not that I'm trying to hate on batman but his motives for wanting to kill superman was so unclear

>>81221286
Wait so if mixing Kryptonian and human DNA creates Doomsday, what would happen if Clark and Lois had a kid??

>>81221391
Superman Returns

>>81221506
That movie looks a heck of a lot better these days...

>>81221391

The whole "Doomsday/Bertram's Curse" thing is only for Kryptonians who were birthed via the Codex or whatever. Clark was a natural born Kryptonian and didn't have that failsafe in him.

>>81221373
>Not that I'm trying to hate on batman but his motives for wanting to kill superman was so unclear
There are a lot of different reasons that are hinted at in the movie. Bruce wants revenge. Bruce is pissed off that Superman didn't have to earn his station as a hero through pain and suffering. Bruce feels guilty that he wasn't able to save everyone. Bruce is paranoid and sees evil everywhere he looks.

Take your pick, any and all are valid given different moments throughout BvS.

>>81216804
OP, I love the movie to death but it's just bad. Plain and simple. I don't know why you're saying it like some people don't realize it's bad.

They should have handed out phamplets explaining this stupid shit at the theathres like they do with classic Opera.

>>81221751
>Pamphlet reads "Warning: Zack Snyder is a fucking hack"

>>81221751
>>81221802

>Trigger Warning: Piss Jars

>>81221802
Imagine a Zach Snyder film starring Rob Snyder.

>>81221868
>Rob Snyder
The CEO of Stream Energy?

>>81221868
Schneider v Snyder: Dawn of Hackness

>>81221922
>Rob Schneider dressed as Batman yelling "YOU CAN DO EEHT"

>>81221682
I was just blown away at how bad it was. I was expecting some kind of shitty guilty pleasure, like X-Men 3 or Ghost Rider. I didn't anticipate something even worse than The Spirit. I have never seen such an irredeemably, fundamentally terrible comic book movie. It's every bit as technically inept as its bad comic movie predecessors but without the ridiculous camp that makes awful shit like Catwoman strangely enjoyable. This was two and a half hours of misery.

>>81220996
>one really pissed off godlike abomination gunning to murder everything you've ever loved.
The creature was created solely to kill Superman. It only attacked any aggressors—and bystanders—that were perceived to be in the way of that goal. It didn't have the best programming, but as far as general-intelligence goes, it would have got the job done. One might presumed that it might shutdown or detonate upon task completion. (Hopefully!)

>>81220996
>Unless Lex was planning on making even BIGGER invincible genocidal troll monsters in perpetuity and making money off of collecting the insurance from all the destroyed buildings.
With ludicrous, comic levels of foresight, he probably owned and/or bought out a lot of the office buildings and warehouses in the surrounding area for good measure.

>>81221011
Agreed.

>>81221373
>Not that I'm trying to hate on batman but his motives for wanting to kill superman was so unclear.
Did you not watch the opening?

>>81220785
>Not liking Grandma's Peach Tea
The passive-aggressive posturing and verbal jousting with the senator were fun. You are the anthemia to fun. The hand waving, odd gesturing and facial tics were fun. I mean, it'd be great if it was for a different character, granted. It'd be great if this wasn't the DC cinematic universe we ended up with. But a cup of grandma's peach tea will make all the difference to you. Because at some moments in the film, you really get what they were trying to do with it, and you can accept it. Accept it. The sooner you accept it, the sooner it feels better. So drink up, Sonny!

It's not every day that you get to see a villain in the heart of a crashed alien spacecraft, treading knee— and then waist deep in the amniotic fluid of an alien spawning pool, receiving untold knowledge from the recesses of countless long since dead civilisations, so that he may endeavour to re-enact The Modern Prometheus.

>>81220796
>How is it in character for Lex Luthor to have zero precautionary measures in place before creating a godlike monster man?
I would have said sanity slippage. But the more pertinent question would be: What sanity? I mean, on all other projects, he clearly has his shit together. Top-notch, state of the art equipment, and all the paper work is in order. He even went out of his way for an import licence instead of just sneaking the thing in because he was working legit on that particular project with the kryptonite.

As for the seeming lack of precautionary measures with creating a horror with godlike powers of devastation? All that tutelage via machine prompt had given him all he needed to know to operate the xenotech. Presumably he knew enough to get by on principle. Probably dug up the records concerning the previous "Ancient Kryptonian Deformity" and the case files against making them.

>>81222014
>The passive-aggressive posturing and verbal jousting

Is that what you call scenery chewing and facial tics?

>>81222029
>Is that what you call scenery chewing and facial tics?
In my defence, yes; that is exactly what I call it. But we both know my argument won't hold up in court.

>>81221977

>calling it worse then Catwoman

That's a tall fucking accusation to make man. You're breaking the big seals right there.

Is there anything as incredible as the basketball scene, at least?

>>81222095
That basketball scene is like they forgot they were filming an actual movie and not a hip and sensual music video.

>"Ever tried facing your victims in court?"

I'm just saying, the wheelchair explosive plot was a good plan. It's based on emotional manipulation: It depended on Superman being too ashamed to even look at the guy. Because he avoided even glancing at him, never mind that he wouldn't even think to use his "X-Ray" vision, he would never see the bomb coming. And because the bomb incident could have been entirely avoided -- had he only looked! -- it would only make Superman feel all the worse for it!

>>81222120

It gets better every time I rewatch it.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rNlmRId2FVQ

Everything about it is a perfect storm of utter garbage.

>>81222167
I think you're giving Snyder too much credit here.

>>81218980
tbf Iron Man wasn't really that until AFTER the movie characterisation.
He was a bit of an autist beforehand.

>>81222095
>>81222181
>>81222120
See, this is what I mean. It's so bizarrely terrible that it's very entertaining. You can't help but like it on some weird level because it's so bad.
BVS is not like that. It's a oppressively grim, cynical movie with absolutely none of the depth required to justify its tone.

>>81216804
He's crazy and wants to feel powerful and safe so the painful childhood memories and his horrible social skills stop hurting. Literally a 4chan user irl.

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>>81221196
C) The ship needed the blood of a MONSTER to make a MONSTER.
Deep mang.

>>81221977
>The Spirit
>not a shitty guilty pleasure
OCTOPUS

>>81222182
I feel like maybe I walked into the theatre in a really uplifted and good mood, and was over-thinking things, throwing everything in a positive light in that wishy-washy way. I had a four day, energised euphoric streak from some new pills, so I'm going to say that might very well likely be the case.

In all honesty, how was everyone else feeling while watching? I usually find myself real dour, and that really makes it hard to enjoy things. (No, I'm not memeing.) Blogging aside, how was your viewing mood at the time?

>The Lex issue.
Conflicted. I had fun with this, but it seemed a lot of people got rubbed the wrong way. And now I'm doubting my own sanity because everyone is articulating very well in exacting terms what was wrong with this depiction and even the performance of the character.

>>81217216
Because it was different
Literally. That's the justification.
They were going to go with Cranston.

>>81222302
Dude, like what you like. Don't let other people ruin your fun.

>>81222240
>to justify its tone.

Why does it have to justify its tone? They went for the dark, grim style because it deals with dark subject matters and inherent human cynicism. It wouldn't work at all if it was all colorful and smiley.

>>81216804
How do you frame Superman by using bullets?

>>81222411
They're special neck-snapping bullets

>>81222240
>absolutely none of the depth required to justify its tone.
They are stuck with grimdark because they want to stick with a contemporary setting that is, while we're on the subject, stuck in a post 9/11 world, so it forcibly has to acknowledge the political tensions and instability that grips the world at large. This milieu has to be felt throughout everything, such as having the Daily Planet acknowledge the death of the American dream, no one batting an eye at Gotham's high crime rate, etc.

>>81222334
Thank you.

>>81222329
Thank you for letting me have my fun.

>>81221577
>Bertram's Curse
?
Refresh my memory pls

Lex's rants sounded a helluva lot like the narrator in The Beast of Yucca Flats.

they also sounded like the kind of thing a thirteen year old scribbles on the cover of his textbook.

>>81222334
Not that anon, but it would be fine being all dark and grim... IF it worked. But it doesn't work. The movie takes itself so seriously that its nihilistic view of heroism becomes ridiculous. Not ridiculous in a fun way, more of a the-message-becomes-impotent kind of way.

>>81222014
>The hand waving, odd gesturing and facial tics were fun.
And you are the poster child for bad taste.

>>81222499
D:
>It hurts, but only because what you say is true.

>>81222441
>Thank you for letting me have my fun.
If you want to continue having fun, you should probably run as far away from these BvS threads as possible. Psychologically, the more someone's exposed to criticism of something, the less inclined that person is to like it. (Unless they have a cult-like mentality toward the subject, but that's a whole other conversation.)

I read a lot of reviews that bitched about opening the movie with Bruce's parents getting offed again, but honestly, it was good. It removes all question and lets you know right away that the guy in charge has no clue what he's doing.

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Why the fuck was Jimmy Olsen CIA?

>>81222528

Killing Bruce's parents is an artform at this point, everyone has to do their own take on it.

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>>81222537
Because FUN. You like FUN don't you? Why does everyone hate FUN?

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>>81222528
>honestly, it was good. It removes all question and lets you know right away that the guy in charge has no clue what he's doing

>>81222476

I don't know, I found it refreshing that superheroes aren't just automatically worshiped just because the genre calls for it, and instead tries to show that real heroes are those who will still help people despite the world being against them. Because it's a calling.

Also, whoever said Wonder Woman was the high of the movie was himself high. Alfred was the high. Wonder Woman was as dull and perfunctory as the rest of the "cameos". But kudos to the casting director, they managed to get someone even skinnier than Gal Gadot on board (that being the what's-her-name that played Mercy Graves).

>>81222528
But not having the oh-so crucial bat dream sequence necessitates watching Batman Forever, to get the answer to, "But why bats?"

>>81222521
>the more someone's exposed to criticism of something, the less inclined that person is to like it.
Good. People need to be DeZuckered. It's the only way to live healthy. I want better taste.

>>81222441
>>81222334
Because it was a serious tone. A relentlessly somber film that takes itself seriously needs to have some sort of legitimate depth to keep it from being a sullen chore. Imagine if say, Schindler's List was about a bunch of ninja clowns but was still as straight-faced.

>>81222652
this is exactly it

>>81222612
You're giving the movie a bit too much credit in terms of supporting heroes. It often feels more like it's saying heroism is ultimately pointless. Superman rescues Lois and a village suffers for it. Batman rescues a guy and he ends up miserable and getting blown up. Pa Kent talks about horses drowning while he ate his hero cake. You rescue one person, someone else suffers. That's why I called it a nihilistic view of heroes.

>>81222652
Even Schindler's List had moments of levity to break up the drama and keep it from being a relentless, unwatchable misery.

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Step back and second and consider the following:
It's a film about middle age men in costumes who take themselves incredibly seriously based on comics for children.

You should expect stupid schlock and incoherent bullshit plots because that's what the source material is.
Wanting or even expecting that high art be made from a turd is sheer lunacy. You got your big dumb action movie, just enjoy it for what it is.

>>81222745
Schindler's List: More Lighthearted than a Superhero Movie

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>>81216804
His plan was to feed that one guy jolly ranchers, everything else was just icing on the cake.

>Select all images with candy

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WHY
WAS LEX
NOT BALD

>>81222753
And if Zack Snyder had gone in saying that, he wouldn't be getting this kind of backlash.

Then again, if he had gone in saying that, he wouldn't have turned out something this bad. It would have been at least cheesy enough to enjoy on that level.

This isn't a frog that dreamed it could be a prince. This is Zack Snyder giving us piss and telling us it's Granny's peach tea.

>>81222828
>"We touch on some subjects which I believe might be a bit too challenging for the audience"
Z. Snyder

>>81219000
A part of me actually liked the fact that Batman killed with no qualms in that movie. The point is that he's jaded after all those years of crime fighting and making so little of a difference that he just doesn't care anymore. It's heavily implied that Joker isn't around because Snyder Batman had enough balls to put that animal down

>>81222870
I'm not sure if I should be offended he thinks people are too stupid to get his movie or if I should be offended he thinks he can trick people into liking his movie by saying only idiots don't get it.

Either way, he's a condescending asshole.

>>81218312
Hey, just an idea, maybe you weren't paying much attention

>>81222721

Both instances are due to the villain doing villainous things to fuck with the heroes.

>>81222968
Okay, part of Lex's character is that he's not good at public speaking, as evidenced by his pauses, stammering, back-tracking, and general incoherence. It's dickish to fault someone for getting lost in the crazy bullshit that is his speech, especially since anon clearly isn't the only person who couldn't follow that frayed, tangled thread.

>>81222311
I suppose Cranston not getting the part was a blessing in disguise, since it wouldn't have changed the director

>>81221977
>Catwoman strangely enjoyable
I-I feel you anon. It's like Batman & Robin enjoyable. though you're fucking wrong as shit saying BvS is anywhere near that level of bad

>>81222745

BvS had moments of levity too, or did you forgot about them entirely?

http://strawpoll.me/7217086

>>81223036
Is she with you and it's the cape got laughs in my screening.

>>81223052

None for Alfred's many catty remarks when he's talking to himself?

>>81217122
Have you never Heard of field testing?

>>81223066
oh yeah the quip about never getting any heirs got a chuckle.

>>81222995
I got the impression the village getting attacked by its own government had nothing to do with Lex and was more a result of the tension in the geographical area, but I could be wrong.

Pa Kent saves his own farm but drowns the neighbor's horses. Bruce rescues the little girl and asks where her mom is, and she points to the destroyed building. Yay! we saved the little girl, but shit is still determined to be depressing.

Let's not forget that fighting crime has turned Bruce into an angry, paranoid man who sees evil in everyone and is less and less concerned with killing criminals. And Superman's response to Lois when she talks about the consequences of his rescue is "I don't care."

>>81223036
I didn't forget about them. But not a single joke landed in my theater.

Packed screening, and none of the jokes elicited so much as a chuckle. Other than some awkward laughter during Lex's "dingdingdingdingding," the audience was completely silent.

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>>81222820

Origin Story

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=S176AKQhcCk

>>81216804
To me, the worst part of Luthor's plan is that he made no effort whatsoever in covering his tracks or avoiding prison.
It was ridiculously easy to link him to all the bad shit that happened, even in his best case scenario where Superman died he ended up in prison.
Comics Luthor would have at least TRIED to maintain some sort of plausible deniability or covered his tracks somehow. He wouldn't have done such a stupid Kill-Superman plan.
Comic Luthor's goal is to kill Superman, then rule the world.
Eisenberg Luthor had no plan after killing Superman.

>>81223215
>I got the impression the village getting attacked by its own government had nothing to do with Lex and was more a result of the tension in the geographical area, but I could be wrong.
It was a direct result of Lex murdering the warlord's entire posse, creating a power vacuum when nobody was left to assume control after the warlord was deposed.
>Pa Kent saves his own farm but drowns the neighbor's horses.
Lesson about how heroism is hard and part of it is to accept that you will never be able to save everyone, nor fully be aware of the concequences of the good deeds you do, down the road. It is a burden you must carry as a hero.
>Bruce rescues the little girl and asks where her mom is, and she points to the destroyed building. Yay! we saved the little girl, but shit is still determined to be depressing.
Because it's juvenile to think that saving one life doesn't mean somebody else didn't die during your heroic rescue during a giant cataclysm. There are limits to what you can do, even as a hero.
>Let's not forget that fighting crime has turned Bruce into an angry, paranoid man who sees evil in everyone and is less and less concerned with killing criminals.
That is due to his Metropolis incident PTSD, that makes him feel powerless and he tries to compensate by becoming overly cruel and brutal. Which is fixed when he gets over his hateboner for Superman and says he will not fail Clark in death like he did in life.

>>81223277

But what if getting caught was part of his plan?

say doomsday killed superman the way he planned, how was he going to deal with doomsday?

>>81223265
God....those fucking glorious drums. You could feel them reverberating through you in the theater, goosebumps. Even when it was just Bruce seeing her photo I was on the edge of my seat cos of this song.

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>>81223277
This, comics Luthor's has an understandable reason and goal for killing Superman: he's an obstacle to his plans for power. Even when he gets caught, he still knows how to weasel his way out.
Eisenberg Luthor lacks this drive and lust for power. You don't really get the impression that Superman inconveniences him in any way, you get no indication that he wants to rule the world or gain more power, he just hates him because MUH DEMONS.

>>81216804
backwards, he already knew where lois lane was going and took advantage

the superman hearing is more complicated than that >>> the testimony of the lady explains a lot while also expanding on the effects superman's intervention had

wayne employee is explained in lex's conversation with superman

government was never anti superman either, lex got access to those things before any of that happened

>>81223297
Trick him into drinking piss

>>81223313

Lex is young, give him some time.

>>81218665
>people are reacting to complete misinformation about the movie

>>81223277
>Eisenberg Luthor had no plan after killing Superman.

Eisbenberg's Luthor cares about power. Once you have killed God, you're the most powerful being on Earth, speak nothing of what he can then properly loot from the Kryptonian ship now that he has free access to it.

>>81223360
But you can't do any of that if you're sitting in a prison cell.

>>81220673
>Wasn't him slicing his hand and bleeding over Zod like...some sort of genetic control? I mean, yeah DD went straight for Lex with the punch so it didn't work...what WAS the point of bleeding on Zod? I thought he was trying to make Connor at first, and then Bizarro popped out, and then he turned into Doomsday.


this scene and most of lex's scenes are going over everyone's heads, i'm wondering if people even watched the movie. i'm on board with talking about the editing choices but everything the characters do is consistent

>>81223332
>Lex is young
He's in his 30s, that's how old Lex usually is in the comics.

>>81223358
B-but I didn't understand something....that makes it bad right? It's also not like muh comics so that makes it the worst cape movie ever right?

Anyone surprised that Lex went to jail?

I'm used to Lex getting out of that sort of shit via legal fuckery in most other interpretations, especially when just starting his conflict with Superman.

>supes got stabbed in the heart and killed
>like jesus
>arose from his grave three days later
>like jesus
HE'S DONE IT AGAIN, THE ABSOLUTE MADMAN

>>81223392

Eh Jesse is in his 30s, but we don't know how old Lex actually is.

Bruce we know is 45 in the movie, and Clark is 33.