With all the talk of craft beers lately, do you ever find yourself

the only good beer is miller lite u little fagboy

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>>8728507
Belgium beer best beer.

>>8728511
>not drinking high life
Sad!

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>>8728507
Everybody in this area is moving to IPAs just because it has more pure alcohol without considering actual flavor. All the new kids out there are drinking just to get drunk instead of drinking for the actual drink, and then in turn get drunk from gluttony. They only see Denogginizer or Iguana and only ever ask us "is there one with a higher alcoholic content?" when going though checkout. I mean this is fucking Bev-Mo, at least let your taste buds explore a little before killing off your liver permanently. Kids don't even want to try the Japanese stuff anymore.

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>>8728566
In fairness, Japanese beer, like Chinese beer, is kind of shit.

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>>8728573
I beg to differ. There are some great Japanese microbrews

>German beer
>good

>>8728566
Yeah can you believe those millennials? Wanted the biggest bang for their buck while still buying something decent. I can't believe they don't want to spend their mediocre paycheck on overpriced imported beer!

Nah. Maybe on my next trip to Germany, but there's too many good American craft beers to explore as it is.

German beer is kind of old news and unsophisticated compared to what's happening these days in America. Much more complexity and flavorful beer.

Not often, its mid tier in quality between American macros and american craft, but costs just as much or more than legit great beer

>>8728566
Where the fuck do you live?
>>8728616
There is a limited amount of pretty good Japanese beer, but the price point is so much higher than American or even Euro beer of the same tier

>>8728866
>Where the fuck do you live?
Probably the east coast US. IPAs are insanely popular here and I hate it.

I just want a nice german sour beer, like a berliner weisse. I don't want one of these meme beers with pictures of grim reapers on them and the name HOPSECUTIONER bragging about their 10% abv

>>8729199
There is such an insane variety of beer styles really available in America. I haven't been to the east coast in a while, but I assume its not that far behind the midwest. Berliner Weisse is pretty common even, especially in the summer, sour beer in general has been trending for years now

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Are lambics a meme?
Just hade pic related. It was certainly better than most mass produced lagers. But it was still not my thing.
What beers are meme beers?

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>>8729314
You chose the wrong lambic.
Also stop saying meme so much, you sound like an idiot.

>>8729314
anything is a meme, you have to be more specific with your question

I tried Mikkeler's Coffee Raspberry sour beer the other day though and it was really interesting

>>8729326
Boon made the best European made sour beer I have ever had, they are great

>>8729342
You should try the Marriage Parfait by Boon.
It's amazing.

>>8729249
You'd be surprised. I used to live on the west coast, and thought the beer was pretty good there! I liked the variety too. My friend from the east coast visited once and complained about how "craft beer is ruining beer in America" because of how hoppy everything is and all there are are IPAs. I thought he was just being a whiny bitch... and now I live in NYC where every bar and ever local brewery has IPAs, double IPAs, strong IPAs, hoppy ales, you name it. It's all one-note, like taking a loaf of sourdough and adding vinegar and pure acetic acid to make it the "TONGUE EXECUTIONER OF SOURNESS".

I'm glad to see the midwest is still standing strong. There are non-IPAs you can find here, to be sure, but they're overwhelmingly outnumbered by really strong one-note hoppy beers.

>>8729449

West Coast makes a huge variety of beers, they're just known for making the best IPA's.

>>8729482
>, they're just known for making the best IPA's.
No, they are known for starting the IPA craze, Midwestern and New England IPA is much better

>>8729497

Kek.

>>8728507

i go to the liquor store every friday and get something i haven't tried before. been trying beers for months.

the expensive, 'hip' beers don't taste better than guinnes or pabst or budweiser. it's just different. it's as likely to be worse than labatt or molson as it is to be equal or better.

it's all just swill.

>>8729508
I'll take a delicious Zombie Dust or any Toppling Goliath MWIPA or a juicy, hazy NEIPA over a bitter west coast IPA any day. Not that West Coast IPA is bad or anything, just that we have formulated much better stuff now, kind of the plight of the early adopter situation going on in the west, so many of their IPA brands were established before modern techniques developed better stuff

>>8729530

>bitter west coast ipa
>the west coast stopped adopting modern brewing techniques in the 90's

>>8729559
There is some great IPA on the west coast, its just a smaller share of the total IPA market than it is in the Midwest and Northeast because a lot of mediocre, older brands are popular. Meanwhile even the older brands in the midwest are typically better. Two Hearted for instance is way better than its contemporary IPAs on the west coast. The NE caught on even more recently and is making some great IPA now. The west coast really isn't great for top beer. They have a high percentage of good beer compared to shitty macros, but the good beer just isn't ass good as it is in the north

can you anons help me out, i really want to like beer but i fucking hate it.

its like this, i like the smell of it, i like how fucking good it looks and the taste is often not too terrible but the bitter aftertaste makes me want to throw up, are there any beers that arent like that?

>>8729593
Brown ales

>>8729592

>Two Hearted for instance is way better than its contemporary IPAs on the west coast

This is what flyovers actually believe.

>>8729609
I'm not a huge fan of Bells otherwise, but Two Hearted is a great old school IPA, about as good as the pre-Citra era single IPAs get

>>8729620

I'm not saying it's bad, but saying it's better than any West Coast IPA is like a West Coaster saying that Sierra Nevada Pale Ale is better than anything made in the Midwest.

>>8729627
Note, I am saying it is better than any traditional West Coast Style IPA, not any IPA currently made on the west coast. I am comparing it to the likes of Stone IPA, Sculpin, Lagunitas IPA etc

>>8729632

It's obviously a matter of taste, but I'd take an AleSmith IPA any day over a Two Hearted.

>>8729609
It absolutely is. Not the same poster

>>8729609
Flyovers are better at beer than coasties

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>>8728566

>IPAs taste disgusting
>but people buy it because it masks alcohol best

>>8728866
>There is a limited amount of pretty good Japanese beer, but the price point is so much higher than American or even Euro beer of the same tier
This is entirely true if only because of the import costs associated with them. The bevmo guy does raise a good point though. Younger generations have always been drinking alcohol not because of the taste but because they want to look "cool" and "mature", and IPAs are the current trend with them because they also have the higher abv associated with them. When I was a kid it was just whatever beer we could sneak out of dad's cooler, next generation it was all about jaegerbombs and four loko (before they cut it down), and now this newer one is going for IPAs. Same shit, just with a different drink.

>>8729935
>Younger generations have always been drinking alcohol not because of the taste but because they want to look "cool" and "mature"
Young people drink alcohol because it is fun, not because they want to be mature.

I don't really think college kids these days are buying kegs of IPA for their basement parties, they are still drinking shitty macro beer because it is cheap

>>8729961
what does any of this rant have to do with my post?

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>>8729961
What

>>8729974
Obviously the image people desire to portray affects their purchasing decisions, thats why wine is still a thing. But to suggest that this is driving America's youth to only buy high ABV double IPA without regard to taste is rather silly.

and I don't have any clue why you are bringing up scotch. Young people don't drink fucking scotch with any regularity, its way too expensive, you can't afford that shit while in school. What do you even mean by youngster? People under 45? Your whole argument is a real mess

>>8730016
I'm not even talking about my own habits. When I hear of youngsters I am thinking of people younger than me.
Also I like how people who do things you like are not doing it for the image, but people who like things you do not are.
and scotch is inherently expensive. it just costs a lot to make and is not in the budget of the vast majority of college kids
Personally I like double IPAs fine, especially the more aromatic, less bitter west coasty ones, but I drink beer of pretty much any style, a disproportionate portion of my fridge is stouts right now being the end of winter, but I bought a 6 pack of APA, and 2 bombers of a barrel aged Scotch Ale today. As more spring and summer beers start hitting the shelves I am sure a lot more hefewiezen and IPA will enter the picture. Also planning on drinking a nice Gueuze later on tonight. But none of this discussion was previously about what I or even people in my demographic like

>>8730070
>That's nice, so, 20 year olds? 21 year olds?
I think we were pretty unambiguously talking of college aged kids
>The kinds of beer that /ck/ autistically rages over aren't really appreciably more costly than your average Constellation or Diageo branded liquor from Scotland.
A lot of great beer is considerably cheaper than even low tier scotch, and thats entirely beside the point as we were talking about what the kids drink, not what the average /ck/ person in beer threads drinks
Seems like you are trying to take this whole thing to all sorts of entirely unrelated tangents and not even address the topic that you originally started your rant in response to. I originally just commented to point out that your dichotomy between drinking for taste vs drinking for image was silly and that kids are mostly just drinking to get drunk cheaply and that these are certainly not the same people as those who are buying DIPA

Maybe you should just start a new thread for all this random ass other shit you want to rant about

>>8730129
There is a huge difference in the drinking habits of a 19 year old college kid and a 25 year old college grad in America

>>8730129
Dude, what are you even talking about? Are you like 60?
So basically your entire argument is that people who like things that you do not like are too young to have real opinions about what they are tasting and are only doing it for the image?
Surely the reason young people drink so much more good beer than your advanced generation is because they grew up with such good beer so readily available unlike you, not just because everyone younger than you is dumb and cannot formulate opinions. Your generation is no less affected by marketing images than any other generation

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Getting back on track with a special release my gf bought for me. Insight puts out really great stuff, so I'm pretty stoked to try this soon. Also found out a local store carries Hammerheart releases.
Any mnfags should really try their shit out if you haven't. Tons of smoked, oaked, aged, etc. shit. Just snagged their smoked doppelbock. Going to buy their islay scotch barrel aged extra strong bitter next. Sounds super different so why not.

>>8730129
>
...Anonymous
03/25/17(Sat)21:48:37 No.8730129
>>8730098 #
/ck/'s age demographic leans young, aka kids.
You have no way of knowing that.
Shut the fuck up, retard.

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Yeah it's called Stella u poof

>>8730164
The whole thing is dumb though? You think guys are buying something they don't like for years just because "image"? Most craft brewers barely even advertise.If anything your generation is much worse when it comes to this. They still buy Budweiser and bad overpriced wine

>>8730180
So what you are saying is that these young people are far too young to know what they think tastes good and as a result they primarily buy bad things because of vague image concerns given to them by "Big Craft Beer", but at the same time you drink these bad things and they actually aren't bad, its just that you are drinking them for the right reasons unlike those dumb millennials?

>>8730206
Did you not go to college? There are plenty of opportunities to try varied beverages. Usually not the top shelf stuff but a huge variety of beverage types
. and at that point their preferences are largely based on a fairly immature (I don't mean this as an insult, just a factual state of affairs) understanding of what the different drinks are like and how people might judge them.
No, actually they have a much better understanding than your generation by their mid to late 20s because the beverage industry is in such a better place than it was when you grew up. No matter what type of beverage you are into, good stuff is more common than ever

>>8730234
The first wave of craft beer in the 90s was a huge improvement but not anything like it is today. People in the 35-20 range, millenials, just grew up with the stuff always there, it wasn't some novelty like it was for you, and this goes well beyond beer. Across the board, the quality and breadth of alcoholic beverages is better than ever before for millenials. This is why your generations still mostly drinks macro beer and thinks shit like Heineken is fancy and buys mostly diageo tier spirits and mediocre wine. You still haven't been able to adjust to the availability of good shit, and the younger generation's adoption of better stuff must just scare you or something

>>8729620
I literally grew up drinking at Founders but I still prefer their rival Two Hearted.

>>8730307
>when it is your age group that fears branching out beyond "the new craft beer"
What are you even basing this on though?
>At any rate this feeble attempt at turning this into a generation warfare discussion is just deflection.
You've spent this entire time talking about how awful young people's habits are
>The more time you have with disposable income and the legal right to purchase alcohol, the more you can figure out what you like
I don't really think this is how it works. A couple years is a long fucking time to buy the same thing that doesn't taste good repeatedly because you think it is cool, at a certain point people just develop habits that they don't like to break, this is why millennials are so much more adventurous when it comes to both drinking and food than previous generations. They are just used to having so much available and haven't gotten into the ruts of your people. So much of the attitude of millenial craft beer drinkers is the desire to try and experience new things, not because they don't know what they are doing and just think DIPA is cool
>you are buying beer because it has epic dragons and swear words on the bottle
I have bought beer with all sorts of labeling schemes, some cool, some simplistic, some classic, some cringy, I just want to try good things regardless of how good they brewer is at marketing labels (since most of these breweries don't even have a full time marketing person, at best they higher a third party to design for them)

>>8730167
Whoa why did I think this was a beer general

>>8728804
Enjoy your nightly cube of nasty @$$ retard

>>8730367
>The less experience you have, the fewer experiential data points you have to draw on
but your desire to generate data is that much stronger

>>8730367
So do you honestly believe the 25-35 year olds currently buying DIPA will no longer like IPA in 10 years, and are only buying it because of "image" without regard to actually not liking it? It can't be because well made DIPA is delicious, right?

>>8730367
>It's just that, after a while, you look for a little variety.
There is an insane variety available with the current leg of the craft beer boom, primarily being consumed by millenials though. This idea that we only drink super hoppy high ABV beer is ridiculous, hell, DIPA only makes up a fraction of the Pale Ale market and for some reason everyone wants to make a mediocre session IPA instead

High ABV beer is inherently more flavorful than low ABV beer, thats the main thing behind the ABV trend you speak of

>>8730386
The DIPA will live independently of the of the IPA movement as a whole. I hate IPAs but have been known to get the DIPA if that is the strongest on the "menu" of choices offered.

The DIPA can end sooner or later, but I would consider it on its own timeline compared to its more mainstream cousin.

>>8730394
>high scores, statistically, is the winning formula.
Oh, making beer that people perceive as good makes people more likely to buy it?

This high ABV stuff doesn't even make up a large chunk of what millenials are buying, so its hard to see why you are so focused on it. The vast majority of it is in the 5.5-9% ABV range. Its not like millenials are drinking 120 minute IPA everyday
>But as a general rule, people your age go for dragons and fear things that seem "cucked" or "feminazi"
Alright dude, you've been on 4chan too much

>and people my age, with some boozing under their belt, have a much larger mental database to draw from, and might drink just about anything.
Surely young people drink a wider variety of beverages than the older generations

Well, it looks like at least one person I was arguing with was a mod, how about that :^)

Banned for wrong opinions, thanks hiromoot

>>8730428
MODS are pathetic beta nu-male cuckolds across this entire site. I bet 90% of them came directly from Reddit or some other echo chamber blog.
They get triggered so easily, it's kind of funny and then throw a shitfit ban tantrum like a little kid.
They obviously never learned to argue and accept other people's opinions and that's why they are such colossal losers irl and ended up as mods on 4chink.
I pity those sad clowns because they will never amount to anything in life.
But hey, at least one of them is a craft beer connoiseur and expert.

>>8728507
Yes. American attempts at German styles are pathetic. Bland hopbombs with thin malt presence. They go back easy, but have no depth of flavor. I'm more interested in seeking out Baltic and central European beers than anything here, and I'm surrounded by new breweries (SF Bay Area).

>>8730515
>Yes. American attempts at German styles are pathetic. Bland hopbombs with thin malt presence
Speak for yourself California

>>8730529
Well yes, I only try what I can get here, i.e. west coast stuff. Does your state/region make a good doppelbock or dunkel? Alt?

>>8730536
While not nearly as common as Pale Ales/IPAs or Porter/Stouts, german styles are still pretty available up here and often quite good. Was just drinking a good dunkelweizen from a new brewery the other day

>>8728507
I lived in München with an older woman for a few months and this, along with Augustiner, was all I drank. Best time of my fucking life.

I used to, but no longer. Local market is flooded with so many different sorts of beers that I almost always find something that makes me happy.

>>8728507
It's what I use to bottle my homebrews.

This round, I'm going to be putting something similar back in - maybe a bit lighter in colour.

>>8730536
My friend - who now works in collaborations and consultations with a handful of breweries in Toronto, and I think just took over as co-head for one - made the only close-to-the-original Altbier and Festbier I've ever had that were made with Canadian-grown/sourced ingredients. At some point, the hops, yeast, and grain strains were German, but they've been naturalised here - it alters the recipe more than I would have thought.

>>8731084
I love the story of how what is now sold in America as Oktoberfest, pretty ubiquitous in fall, is not what is sold at oktoberfest in Munich, but this is because the big Munich brewers decided to make a cheaper lighter beer for the fest a couple decades ago, and they have a cartel so no on else can sell there. So now you cannot even get traditional Oktoberfestbier in Germany legally but its super common in America

>>8731107
Everybody (well not everybody, but you know what I mean) makes a Marzen. The magical beer fairy makes a pretty close match to Paulaner's 2013... not my favourite beer in the world, but that he pulled it off with local ingredients was pretty astonishing - water especially.

>>8729314
That one is quite sour. I suggest you try a more balanced one like Drie Fointeinen Geuze or Boon Oude Geuze. When lambics are good they are REALLY good.

>>8731107
Isn't ayinger still quite traditional? It's not a pale lager like most big brands.

https://www.ratebeer.com/beer/ayinger-kirtabier-autumn-beer/2718/

I still remember the one I tried first as the best one but I remember that one was quite light though:

https://www.ratebeer.com/beer/hofbrau-munchen-oktoberfestbier/8823/

>>8728507
yeah, Einbecker and Weihenstephaner

>>8729449
A decent, balanced IPA is a thing of joy.

When pulled off correctly it's not just 'lol, mouthfuls of hopps' like that Dogfish Head 90 minute swill.

I blame the frat scene for the whole 'RRRGH! BITTER IS MANLY!' trend.

Heffenwizen pretty good

Franziskaner is my preferred beer, but only 3 places in my shitty town actually carry it.

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This beer recipe included red cedar chips and fir tips

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This stuff is fantastic, an Italian collaboration with Dogfish.

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>>8728573

I'm not sure I agree as far as Japan goes.

>>8731347
I'd second your blame for the frat scene, just like they ruined hot sauce.
>"What? Hot sauce should have flavor? NO ITS ONLY FLAVOR IS PAIN"

Anyway this thread inspired me to go down to my liquor store that stocks a lot of beer.. I spent half an hour scouring e v e r y case, 6-pack, build-your-own, and individual bottles they had, and I'd reckon at least 2/3 of them were IPAs and double IPAs.

I ended up coming away with the ONE sour they had, Ommegang Hennepin, a saison. It had pretty good ratings on BeerAdvocate, and the notes I read about sounded good to me. It didn't taste sour like I expected, more bitter, but after I ate some blackberries, it tasted pretty good.

Still, a 4-pack was $13 which was pretty steep.

>>8728507
Franziskaner and Weinstephaner for Alcoholic beer.
Oettinger for Malt Beer. Just because it isn't as sweet as Karamalz or Vitamalz.

>>8731347
Lol, I don't think frats are buying kegs of 120 min IPA

for me its the liquified mcchicken

best fastfood drink

>>8731894
Where do you live?
IPA is about 30-35% of craft beer sales as of last year nationally

>>8731894
Is saison considered a sour? I have never heard that before.

Gose and Berlinner Weisse are sours. They're a huge trend right now. I personally can't stand most of them because they taste like a wine cooler to me. Probably why they're getting so popular.

One that I do like I Hoof Hearted Chuck Biscuit, but it's dry hopped and not fruity.

If the only "sour" your store had was a saison, find a different store.

>>8732710
Some Saisons are sour, most are not

Yeah, sounds like that guy just went to a super shitty place, sour beer is everywhere

>>8728616
>microbrew
>being imported
If it was actually good they'd be selling out before it could even leave the country. If you can find an imported beer there's either high production (not a microbrewery) or it's shit and praying on weeb trash like you

>>8729199
Sour beers are common as shit on the east coast. Unlike the west cost and mid west there's actually a decent balance of IPAs, sours, and stouts out here

>>8732737
Or - third option - someone found out about it and ordered some.

I can't always get beer from Schloss Eggenberg, but I can always get on the wait list.

>>8732748
The midwest certainly has the best balance, but the northeast is catching up

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>>8730617
augustiner is easily the best of the munich breweries

>>8728507
I have tried time and time again but I just can't find a German / Belgian beer that I like, I find it all has a weird taste to it that I can't really describe. English / Scottish ale is my go to.

>>8732645
NYC

>>8732710
I don't especially consider it a sour, but it's technically fermented, so it's considered a sour. I was hoping to find a Berliner Weisser, but no dice. The problem with 'finding a different store' is that, having no car, I'm kind of confined to whatever's in walking distance, or taking the subway or uber for 30-40 minutes each way just for a 6-pack.

>>8733420
I think New York is a pretty bad place for beer relative to New England and the Midwest
>I don't especially consider it a sour, but it's technically fermented, so it's considered a sour.
All beer is fermented. Sour beers are fermented with the addition of bacteria that form acid during fermentation as supposed to the ethanol fermentation yeast do. Also beer fermented with wild yeast such as Brettanomyces are grouped in though that does not technically make it sour, most sour beer is a combination of wild yeast and lactofermenting bacteria.
Most modern saisons are not soured, though its well within the styles bounds to be sour and traditionally they were (as was almost all beer if you go back far enough)

>>8733444
>All beer is fermented. Sour beers are fermented with the addition of bacteria that form acid during fermentation
I actually didn't know that was considered fermenting if it's just yeasts working in the beer... that's interesting. I do know more-or-less the differences between soured and non-soured bears, having worked with lactic acid bacteria in sauerkraut, kimchi, and sourdough. I thought the lactobacilli were the main component in the actual fermentation. I also didn't know that wild yeast-fermented beers are considered soured.

>Most modern saisons are not soured, though its well within the styles bounds to be sour and traditionally they were
That would explain why the Ommegang I tried last night really wasn't sour. It wasn't bad, but not what I was craving.

>I think New York is a pretty bad place for beer relative to New England and the Midwest.
Ah, that could be. I haven't been around New England, or the Midwest, but New York is pretty atrocious. I miss the beer on the west coast.

>>8733469
There are many different types of fermentation, its is just a metabolic pathway for cells to generate chemical energy from stuff they 'eat' without the benefit of oxygen (using oxygen is respiration, and is much more efficient energetically). Even human cells can go into fermentation when not enough oxygen is available as happens with strenuous exercise, though humans cannot sustain this for long. There are many different types of fermentation

In sour beers it is still primarily the yeast doing the fermentation, if you just have lactic acid fermentation with no alcohol fermentation in your beverage, thats kombucha I guess

>>8733517
>Even human cells can go into fermentation when not enough oxygen is available as happens with strenuous exercise.
True! That actually is lactic acid fermentation too, though, which is partially what helped spin that incorrect understanding in my head.

But yeah, good point, I always figured the sour beers were still mostly yeast-dominated.

My understanding of sour beers is that they utilize lactobacilli the same way other lactic acid fermented foods to: the lactic acid makes the environment too acidic for other bacteria to colonise, and the particular strains of yeast that survive are suited to that acidic environment, giving them allowing them to thrive. It creates a symbiotic relationship, which is why lactic acid fermented foods (including sour beers, which like you said, almost all beers were if you go back far enough) are some of the oldest.

>>8733557
Yeah, if you go back even a couple hundred years people didn't know about bacteria or yeast or sanitization, so it was literally impossible to make beer as we know it today with only brewers yeast. Thats actually why hops originally started being used in beer as people noticed that it allowed beer to keep longer without going sour, which is why IPA originated with beer designed to be stored for months over the trip to India so they considered it worthwhile to take the extra expense of using a lot of hops

>>8733687
That's fascinating. I'm assuming the hops acidify the beer in the same way lactobacilli do, so it was probably just a way to control the acidity and the environment of the beer better.

>>8733768
Its actually a chemical in hops that has antibacterial properties