Lolita general - Midnight Feast edition

>>9536254
Who's going to the AP Tea Party in France next month? I'm a little bit nervous as it'll be my first tea party also my French is not so good...

>>9536384
Don't worry, the designers and half the models probably don't speak french, so everyone's lost in translation.

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If you had to describe lolita in a couple of sentences without talking about the clothes or the rules, what would you say?

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Didn't know whether to post this here or in comm thread, but here you go. Discuss.

http://www.houstonchronicle.com/life/article/Fantastical-Lolita-style-woven-into-Houston-11243139.php

>>9536254
Damn I'm loving that cat cape. This is just adding to my need to do an accessory order from Excentrique.

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>>9536414
>not all of them wear their coords every day to work; it's just the "lifestylers" who do that

>>9536391
Yeah, luckily I can speak Japanese.
I wonder if there'll be any special guest though as risa cancelled last minute

>>9536401
>Childish and playful, romantic and gothic, not only puff skirt with a maching bow. For me, lolita is a feeling and a statement.

>>9536414
I couldn't even read past a few lines, it read like a romance novel

>>9536414
>Each outfit has a theme, and some can take months to put together.
>"We got engaged in cosplay"
>"I'm going to wear this 'til the day I die."
>but only for meetups and stuff because you can't wear this daily unless you're a "lifestyler"
>t. conlitas

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>>9536414
>"I want the world to be like, 'Oh that Houston community, they're doing such great stuff.'"
Um, ok....

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>>9536426

>>9536415
I think they have something similar from last year on sale rn

>>9536414
>"We were doing a photo shoot, and all of a sudden he's like, 'Stevie, I've got something to tell you.'"
>He whipped out a custom-made heart-shaped pink sapphire ring - designed to match her favorite coords - and got down on one knee.
>"I was like, 'What are you doing? You're going to make me cry, and I'm going to ruin my makeup!'"
That's pretty cringy but also kind of cute, good for them. The article isn't bad either.

>>9536469
>The article isn't bad either
Are you a conlita too?

>>9536414
Well, that was about as painful as I expected. I had to take breaks in between paragraphs because I was cringing so hard. The interviewees just come off as squealing idiots.

>>9536442
Talking to reporters and making us all look like freaks to normies? Great first step. Thanks Houston.

>>9536469
This reads like a terrible self insert fanfic

One of the things I miss most about lj is lj notes so I can remember people like >>9536447. Is anyone using lacebook? What do you think of it? I tried to join when it was invite only and kind of a hassle and haven't tried since.

>>9536477
No I'm not but I think we need to stop with the conlita boogieman shit. If you're implying the article itself is bad than at least say why.

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How normal is it for brolitas to have "lolita names"?
Is that something I just haven't heard before or is it just related to other forms of guy dressing like a girl a.k.a: drag or sissy?
I ask because of a convo I had with a guy who's trying to get into the fashion and dropped his "lolita name" which threw me off.

>>9536502
I'd be wary around this guy if I were you, anon. "Lolita names" are not a thing legitimate lolitas use regardless of gender.

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I didn't know where else to put this. I recently saw Brazil for the first time and it was pointed out to me by a friend that this character wears what looks like lolita. She even has wrist cuffs.

This came out in 1985, but it didn't look like this then, right?

>>9536502
It really depends on how/why he's using it. I'm a brolita with a "lolita name" but it exists mostly so I can have a facebook account that's completely separate from my everyday life and I don't have to explain to all my redneck family why there are pictures of me in dresses on the internet.
If he's dropping his lolita name because he wants to friend you on his secret FB/IG/etc account, that sounds fine. But if he wants you to call him that all the time and it starts feeling like a role play, run the fuck away

>>9536502
Maybe it was an online username/alias?

>>9536496
Nayrt but the article itself is written oddly,
>With a sly half-smile, Collin Quinlan daintily picks up a pink frilly dress for his wife's approval.
This reads like some sissy fantasy drivel. On top of that there are claims in it that are just untrue unless you only wear lolita to meetups or cons like a costume, like "each outfit has a theme and some can take months to put together". That statement coupled with
>"calling a coord a "costume" will elicit gasps of horror from certain hardcore Lolita fashionistas"
is incredibly embarrassing and imo makes the interviewees sound delusional.

>>9536513
Those are gloves, not wrist cuffs, and that's definitely not what lolita looked like in the 80s. It's a girly style dress but it's not lolita.

>>9536515
>>9536519
It didn't seem to have a purpose. He just said; My lolia name is "______". After chatting for a while.

>>9536414
The writing early was godawful. Overall it wasn't the worst "culture" piece, the couple was a little too "squee" and pretty weeby, but no glaring inaccuracies like "Lolita's are always meanies" or "Lolita is cosplay" or something. I think it lumps us in with the public perception of anime dorks, weird but harmless. I'd just like to steer this away from the hot topic feeling though.

>>9536502
A lot of girls have slightly different FB names for lolita so work/wherever can't find the account, I'd say about a fifth of the girls in my comm. Some of these are nicknames they use IRL too, although maybe the nickname came before they got into lolita...

It can be a red flag but it also might be nothing to worry about.

>>9536502
I'm not a brolita, but I'm from europe and my name is pretty much unpronounceable. If I'm talking with my abroad friends I usually tell them to call me by my "facebook" name if they find it more comfortable. I know some people who do the same, but I never heard the term "lolita name".

>>9536520
Why the hell wasn't the writer flogged by the editor? There's a special place in hell for people who write like this.

>>9536502
I mean I'm a girl and I use a different name for Lolita (just a slight permutation of my real name). It's just to keep creeps off my back and it sounds a lot better than my current name, which I can't change easily because too many people are stuck on it.

I can see a guy using it because it might just be cuter? They're basically putting on this vastly different appearance than the norm, and a name would fit.

Obviously if they claim shit and play it off as a role play, run for the hills.

>>9536530
The editor probably didn't give a shit. It sounds weeb enough so let's publish.

Overall I think it's relatively harmless though.

What shipment methods can you use from Japan when you don't want your parcel to go by air? All I found was 'surface mail' which doesn't sound like a company's name.

>>9536496
>not all of them wear their coords every day to work; it's just the "lifestylers" who do that.
>requiring exquisitely matched petticoats, legwear, headwear and an elaborate "main piece," or dress
>Each outfit has a theme, and some can take months to put together.
>Between them they have more than 100 wigs.
>got into Lolita through a love of anime
>her younger sister Emma, now 17, followed in her footsteps toward anime and cosplay culture.
>Although it requires a similarly precise attention to detail, Lolita is not a type of cosplay - and calling a coord a "costume" will elicit gasps of horror from certain hardcore Lolita fashionistas.
>But for many in the local community, cosplay - like anime - is an overlapping interest.
>Of course, outside conventions and meet-ups, appearing publicly in Lolita fashion can be a fraught endeavor.

>>9536528
Worded it wrong. It's not that I never heard the term in general, but I never heard someone literally say: "My lolita name is ____".

>>9536536
So you mean seamail? That shit takes forever and a half, what are you trying to get?

>it also depends on your location too I guess

>>9536536
"exquisitely matched" doesn't even make sense as a phrase, someone needs to take away this writer's thesauraus

>>9536553
I'm going away for a month so if my SS ships my package now, I won't be able to receive it, but I don't want to bother her by making her keep it at her house. So I thought it would be good if I use something slow and I wanted to look up the price before I request it.

>>9536513
>confusing 50's/60's/70's fancy dresses with lolita

anon, not everything that fits a petticoat is called lolita. go lurk more or something

>>9536566
Mail hold? You can make your post office hold the package.

>>9536586
They only hold it for 2 weeks here and then destory it or send it back

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People who own pic related, how is the sleeves constructed up at the puffy part? Is it an "actual" puff sleeve or is it a "regular" sleeve underneath with the puffy fabric layered on top of it? English is not my native language, sorry for the wording.

>>9536447
This is so ridiculous, I am literally reading it in my head like substyles style of style style.

>>9536665
Kei doesn't even mean style in Japanese either. It means something like the word "type", but there isn't a good translation of it.

>>9536425
They announced Tina Tamashiro a couple weeks ago.
Most of the French community speaks English, don't worry!

>>9536671
The context gives the translation as style, that's what translation means. It's the transferal of meaning between one language and the other rather than just flipping of words.

>>9536599
Your post office destroys packages after 2 weeks? What the hell? Where do you live??

Do the Innocent World Millefeuille Boleros ever go on sale?

>>9536691
yes but they sell out with godspeed. if there is any stock left for sale of course.

>>9536691
I don't recall ever seeing it on sale but I could be wrong. They're very popular and get sold out (and rereleased) often, and if their full price is out of your budget you can find them secondhand sometimes if you're patient.

>>9536691
Theres two up for under 7k yen (red in L and brown in M) on Wunderwelt.

>>9536599
Assuming you live in the US, and you tell your post office to hold your mail, that's completely not true.
https://holdmail.usps.com/holdmail/

>>9536724
https://www.postnl.nl/klantenservice/vragen/post-ontvangen/wat-gebeurt-er-met-onbestelbare-post.html

>>9536739
That is fucked up, why don't they just send everything back?

Ask your SS to hold it, offer to pay her an extra fee. SAL shipping takes like a month, but it's also not tracked or insured, so you're really gambling with your package getting there sooner than a month and getting sent back/destroyed, your package getting potentially lost in the SAL void, or slightly inconveniencing your SS by asking her to wait on shipping.

>>9536755
I said destroy it or send it back. Insurance isn't important to me in the first place because I mark it down to 20 euro. She wouldn't accept a fee for holding it, I just bad because I know she lives in a tiny room. I don't have any experience with SAL so thanks for warning me.

>>9536762
Is it like 50/50 on packages getting sent back or destroyed? I'm still baffled at the reason they would do this.

>>9536706
Yeah im not fond of the lace of the brown one. And the red one is a gamble because I'm quite small

>>9536566
Can you set up a forwarding address or have them hold it and give them an authorized pick up person?

>>9536764
its when they dont have or cant read the return address or the person who they want to return it to doesn't accept it.

>>9536401
I live in a bougie area so I always just describe us as being "like art collecting, but for wearable art." There are artists/designers with more cachet/fame than others but lesser-known names that produce smaller works that speak to certain people more, and the community does a good job of cohering pricing for secondary-market purchasing and even paying attention to where specific (VERY coveted) pieces currently reside and whether the owner is considering selling them anytime soon.

To people who have any idea what art collecting is like, it makes total sense - we just wear our hauls instead of putting them on walls or in greatrooms.

>>9536414
>>9536435
This really does read like a romance novel. I didn't get the cringe until I read the first few sentences. Why can't journalism just be fucking normal? Why does it have to dress things up like we're either weirdos in a fairy tale or we're crazy living dolls?

>>9536795
Because "normal" (a.k.a the non-spiced up truth) doesn't sell. Journalism is all about the money nowadays. Hence the rise of clickbait, biased news, and other types of shitty reporting.

>>9536678
I disagree. Meaning can be lost in translation even when given context.

>>9536826
When Japanese people say fairy kei they mean a style. It has no relation to mori kei and visual kei.

>>9536423
>>9536436
Sounds like my comm.
>polite lady comes up to us to ask what we're dressed up for and if we often dress like this
>majority looks at her like she's crazy and say "of course not"
>tfw one of only 3 or so non-meetlitas in my comm

>>9536447
yikes

>>9536854
Your comm sounds awful, I'm so sorry, anon.

>>9536856
It kind of is. There are apparently a number of well-dressed girls in the area who wear lolita as a daily fashion but they stopped coming to meets before I really got involved in the comm. It's disappointing, but I don't really blame them.

>>9536837
Isn't mori "kei" a western invention too? The Japanese term never deviated from mori girl as far as I'm aware.

>>9536496
Conlita plz

>>9536496
Look, the main reason conlitas are disliked is because of situations like >>9536854

People who actually wear lolita outside of cons/meets, even if we don't wear it every single day always, don't like to feel weird. Especially not when we're meeting up with people who are supposed to make us feel less weird about our weird clothes.

>>9536837
Did you even read what I said before then? That's not was I was saying at all.

>>9536423
>>9536859
>tfw I live in Houston and wear lolita once a week or more

I also know the couple in the article, and I'm really confused as to why they'd say people didn't wear the fashion except for lifestylers. Not to be super emotional desu but it really bummed me out and hurt a little reading that

>>9536384
I wish I could go but it's like 3 hours away and I didnt got picked anyway.
I would have gladly helped you being a native french speaker.

>>9536254
is Excentique getting more popular or what? I keep on seeing pictures everywhere of them

>>9536496
If you want to cosplay, then go be a cosplayer. Lolita should be a fashion and definitely not worn at cons.

>>9536502
It's them disguising their fetish or pretending this is something like drag. Any real brolita will just use his actual name. It's seldom something like "Oh, I'm AliceBows online." It's usually like "My lolita name is Candy ;)" that is just red flags.

>>9536954
I was at the meet where the reporters were at. They didn't say it like that, they were trying to emphasize that everyone wears lolita differently but to not expect that everyone into lolita wears it every day. That couple wears lolita outside of cons and meets as well so don't get bummed it, it was just the writing.

Overall, the writing of the article was pretty hard to read through, but I don't think the content of the article was actually that bad. It did not present us as wannabe dolls or cosplayers at least, and showed off a cute side of the Houston community in the pics.

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>>9537084
>the pics
Yeah, especially pic related.

>>9537074
Are you really this retarded? Not everyone who wears lolita to cons ONLY wears lolita to cons, and even if they do, why give a fuck as long as they're well dressed?

>t. someone who wears lolita everywhere, including cons.

>>9536806
For as much as people say that, I think plain factual journalism actually would sell. It's kind of come full circle and people loathe things like clickbait and sensationalism and probably just want to know why we wear frilly dresses.

It's really being lazy on the shill "journalists" part. If they can make up some stupid story, they don't have to do hard research and tell the truth. The article wasn't the worst, but it was impossible to get tidbits about the fashion out of it.

>>9536536
do you have a close friend in the comm who can receive the package for you and hold on to it until you return?

>>9537085
Wasn't she explaining what was holding up our dresses and giving them shape in that picture?
The caption even says she "shows the petticoat underneath her Lolita dress on Sunday"

>>9537064
I think this release has renewed a lot of people's interest in the brand and there isn't anything else to get hype about atm.

>>9537074
if some people wear their normal clothes to cons, and i wear lolita daily... why shouldn't i wear it to cons too? your logic is flawed.

>>9537085
Ok but does anyone know where this petti is from?

>>9537193
Ronova I think? Bling Up sells them, if you go to Texas cons you can see them at their booth. Their petticoats are actually pretty cute.

>>9537074
This conlita thing is the dumbest thing to come out of cgl in ages, nobody outside of here gives a flying fuck about it. I bet non seagulls wouldnt even know what a conlita is

>>9536676
Oh thank you! I just needed to google her, cause I've never heard of her before. And now I'm kinda sad, I wish AP would bring an interesting model like misako with them. I bet my last 5ct that I'll pass this Tina girl multiple times without recognizing her.

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Can we talk about this though?
also the comments, man.

>>9537358
Can you post caps of the comments?

>>9537310
Never heard of her before but a friend told me she's "the Spoon model" so she should be easily recognizable haha.
And we also have Maki and Asuka.

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Ok on an entirely other tangent, did anyone else see this new indie brand's first OP and jsk? These are like 225 dollars. There's not even lace or detailing on the bodice. They say it's for "lazy" day lolita and mori but uh...there's something lazy here alright...can you even really call this lolita?

>>9536401

>It is a fantastic encounter between a sewing machine and an umbrella

.......This has to be one of the most interesting ways to describe it. OP source pls so I can quote it everywhere.

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>>9537368
>225 dollars

>>9537368
It looks like a potato sack. It could not be any more unflattering.

>>9537367
Maki and Asuka are sweethearts. I don't follow spoon, so probably that's why I never heard of her. By just googling for her name it appears she's a larme model?

>>9537362
tldr: >>9537362

>some idiot didn't get why people got upset about replicas
>indonesian comm member contacted the replica maker and tried to make her understand that what they do is art theft (didn't work)
>someone tried to butt in about Volks not releasing a doll that had a dress that looked like a Taobao release

>>9537385
The idiot not understanding people being upset about replicas made me laugh. Mentioning recast dolls? Mate. Maaaaate. If you think lolitas get angry about replicas, you ain't seen recast rage before. Holy shit.

>>9537387
I doubt this girl even wears lolita
Why is she even in that group

>>9537392
I doubt a lot of people in that group wear lolita. Some of the comments are so fucking dumb or off-topic that I never cease to be amazed.

I have a couple of pet faves that I keep an eye out for, because their comments are always hilariously off-base or ignorant.

>>9536762
SAL arrives pretty fast in the Netherlands atm, like within two weeks if you lower the value. And I don't know about the anon, but my SAL is always tracked and insured. (There are registered and unregistered sal, only unregistered isn't tracked and such. But, I must say my experience with that is that there is 50% chance it gets lost.)
Can't you ask a relative or friend to hold it for you? That you send it to them? Sea mail does take forever to arrive here, last time that took three months, but a lot of people don't ship with it anymore.

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>>9537362

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>>9537400

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>>9537401
thats all folks

Why do so many lolitas seem to have such awful teeth? I've always wondered this. It's like the fashion attracts girls with jacked up teeth.

>>9537405
Maybe you're just looking at the UK comm? A lot of lolitas have that Lor type nose too. Most people don't have model looks, not sure why it's expected to be different in lolita.

>>9537405
a lot of lolitas in general are just ugly/homely/plain because most people are ugly/homely/plain. that's just kind of how people work.

Does anyone remember when the most recent Holy Lantern MTO is supposed to be done by?
I want to say October but I'm not sure... thank you!

>>9537415
Wait, there's another one? Where was this announced?

>>9537415
You mean the Paris one earlier this year? Maybe they still have information up? Or ask them on facebook, they are really responsive.

>>9537405
Because how people look upon dental care/orthodontics differs from country to country and person to person.

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>>9537358
What is it with indonesian lolitas and fudging lolita? first dolldisgrace and now this mess.

Is there going to be a meet up at anime expo?

>>9536691
Rare to never. On recent sales there were leftovers of boleros in navy and they went off in minutes.
Sometimes Innocent World gives 15-20% discounts to all their stuff, not only older collections. Then you can have a bilero slightly cheaper.

>>9537436
isn't she Filipino though?

Anyone knows where can one buy or sell second hand high fashion goth stuff (e.g. Alice Uaa), besides closet child?
I like Alice Uaa, but I don't dare buying without knowing where to resell if I don't want it anymore

>>9537368
I really don't understand this, it's so insanely unflattering? And they want 225$?? And it somehow has 165 likes on Lolita Updates???
Look at the pulling and fit of that JSK bodice.

>>9537405
>>9537408
I'm genuinely curious, how much does dental care cost in the US? Is it cheaper than say the UK, or is it simply that dental care is more of a priority in the US? Sage for being off topic.

>>9537368
Babby's first handmade jsk and a not remotely lolita potato sack with the same print. $225? I wouldn't pay $100 for either of those. Maybe $50 if I was bored out of my mind and needed something I could take apart and improve on.

>>9537436
It's a 3rd world country.
But yeah, Dolldelight is from the Philippines.

>>9537506
Maiden Clothing, Alice Fururun and Tokyo Alice sell Alice Auaa, I believe other secondhand stores like that as well. They also buy your clothing, but that's a within Japan thing. I believe you can sell it on Lacemarket, they have other sections besides Lolita. I don't know if there are specific sales groups for it, but you can always do a quick search on FB and place it in a vkei or jfashoin sales group if there isn't.

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>>9537376
She's modeled for AP quite a bit, where have you been?

>>9537511
It used to be free with the insurance a lot of workplaces had. Now dental insurance is less popular so the dentists near me reduced prices for uninsured to like $100 a visit for cleaning and checkup

>>9537419
It was earlier in this year. I do think it's coming out in Oct.

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Speaking of replicas...

I really, really hate this blog. Between the god awful handmade piles of dogshit the owner tries to pass of handmade while telling their followers "quality doesn't matter! uwu" and now this, it's like an ita's wet dream.

And of course they haven't once mentioned the art theft side of the argument and keep pretending that there's literally no other option for poorfags and fatties other than buying replicas, even though I sent them an ask about it. And of course they're already getting asspats from genderspecial tumblrite fatties for this post.

It's amazing how tumblr will collectively shit itself when anyone steals from a tumblr artist, but as soon as it's an artist who happens to draw prints for a lolita brand it's suddenly okay.

>>9537625
*tries to pass off as lolita

sorry, it's early and my brain isn't fully functioning yet

>>9537511
Statistically people in the UK have better teeth than in the US on average because dental care is free until you're 18, so there aren't barriers to poor families getting braces or fillings. However, cosmetic dental procedures are not free, so stuff like teeth whitening or correcting minor wonkiness is much less popular than the US and less of a cultural expectation even among the rich (hence, UK celebrities have yellower teeth than US ones).

http://www.webmd.com/oral-health/news/20151216/are-british-teeth-really-worse-than-american-teeth

>>9537511
I had dental insurance under my parents and I'm tribal, so it was really inexpensive for my parents. Not sure about other people though.

>>9537064
I think it's because gulls have been wanting something more toned down and easy to wear and Excentrique is perfect. Tough their new print is busy, the cuts are comfy and they mainly release solids or beautiful patterns.

>>9537553
I've been with mana, misako and akira. Also, I'm not that type of person who's interested in models, but more into the dresses and stuff itself? Idc who presents the stuff as long as they look good. 10 extra points if they look outstucking in some way

>>9537637
Sorry anon, I should have clarified I'm from the UK. I was quoted £4,000 (privately) for braces, and decided it wasn't worthwhile in the end. I put the money towards a car instead.

>>9537300
I know a few lolitas tough who have left our lolita community because they found it to be too obsessed with coord pictures, nitpicks and not enough people who actually wear it without occasion, or treat it as a subculture besides going to meets/cons and arguing online. They had joined the community 8+ years ago and it has changed so much because of conlitas/cosplayers joining, at least in my comm. They only want perfect pics, like you have to buy an expensive camera or else don't bother posting your coords, and they are obsessed with the rules but when something is so OTT it's not recognizable as lolita anymore, it's ok because they didn't break a rule. Some of them act like if you're not a conlita or meetlita, you're automatically a lifestyler and trying to be a special snowflake.

>>9537370
Novala Takemoto - Japanese Goth

>>9537625
>Lolita brands are big and not hurt by replicas
Isn't an influx of cheap replicas what drove MM into the ground? My fave brand and they never have releases anymore, thanks replica-chans

>>9537594
>$100 a visit for cleaning and checkup
That's still a lot

>>9537625
Lolita brands are not big corporations, they can easily shut down. I hate her.

>>9537085
This is actually a really nice petticoat. Also like this is the least cheesy/fetishy picture with a petticoat possible. The writing sucked though

>>9537487
She is Filipino, yeah.

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>>9537370
>>9537677
I think I can find the entire essay online somewhere but the rest of the book is interesting too. Novala is actually quoting a French poet, exactly the kind of person lolitas would be into
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Comte_de_Lautréamont
>Ducasse wrote "only at night, sitting at his piano, declaiming wildly while striking the keys

>>9537637
Yeah, usually when people meme about Brits having bad teeth they're referring to the purely cosmetic side of things, not actual dental health.

>>9537074
>don't wear lolita to cons

Ok, so you want us to just show up in jeans to con teaparties?

>This rejection of societal norms by lolitas reflects the rise in Japanese society of young people, especially women, known as 'parasite singles'. Millions of young Japanese are choosing to stay living with their parents into their twenties and even thirties, working for a living but spending their income on material items and refusing to get married or have children.
I was reading old posts on lj and this reminded me of Misako lol

>>9537719
Nayrt but in a lot of countries cons don't have teaparties because it's an anime/manga event. Conlitas to us are the type of people who wear taobao (they probably bought for twice the price from a reseller) a few times a year or do a lazy cosplay of an anime girl who wears what they think is lolita.

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>>9537682
>Isn't an influx of cheap replicas what drove MM into the ground?
I haven't exactly been looking for them, but are MM replicas really that prevalent? I feel like I've only seen this one and 2-3 others across taobao reseller sites and milanope

>>9537665
I also don't care about the models, but she's been a model for so long you should have at least recognized her.

>>9537735
They were very prevalent years ago compared to replicas of other small brands

>>9537735
F+F used to do a lot of them, as did Taobao brands.

>>9537735
I don't know how many unique MM replicas there are per se, but I feel like when I type"Lolita dress" on AliExpress or whatever there's at least one on every page. I've never paid enough attention to them to know if it's a bunch of different ones or just the same 3-4 being sold by many different sellers, but I think it still hurts MM a lot either way.

Is JetJ dead? Their releases became so few over the past year or so. And they haven't released anything new since over a month. This trend of fewer and fewer releases of classic brands until they reach Mary Magdalene levels is really worrying imo.

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>>9537773
I'm worried about it to. I wonder if they lost a lot of loyal customers since they started focusing more on paintings and prints, but a while ago they did something old JetJ would have released and I don't think it did so well, pic related.

>>9537735
The people who were buying MM replicas were never going to give business to MM itself. Replicas are shit but in this case, they aren't the cause for the fading of the brand.

>>9536401
I'm really bad with words but otherworldly and beyond time comes to mind when I think of lolita aesthetic.

>>9537773
Their releases are so expensive that few people buy them, that might be part of it.

>>9537795
True for most replicas but not true in this case IMO. For certain design replicas, especially Fan+Friend the price of the replica was almost as much as an authentic second-hand piece. IDK what it was in dollars at the time but I know when I was new I wanted to buy an F+F MM replica which was well over £100, and would also have cost me £30 in shipping and potentially more in taxes. If I had known I could have got an original for not much more on the Japanese market I might have bought an original. F+F's stuff in general has always been really pricey, but they got a lot of free press from girls who couldn't fit into MM which advertised them to noobs who could actually have fit into MM.

Anyone else really enjoying the Every-Day Lolita Fashion FB group?

I know we've argued about how its basically the same thing as Closet of Frills, but I've been enjoying seeing clothes people are actually wearing on a daily basis instead of things they wear to meets or teas. There are definitely some hot messes, but I like it as a new place for casual inspiration.

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>>9537790
The princess sleeves on this dress are ridiculous and seem very impractical imo. Definitely nothing for daily wear even though the dress itself is very plain otherwise. I'd really love to see more plain non print dresses that are more wearable (like from their chiffon era 2006-2008).

The fewer releases might have to do something with their increased pricing desu. I would have bought pic related if it were 20000 yen cheaper (and that's still fucking expensive by the way) but they seem to be targeting the chinese market who loves exclusive OTT dresses and spending money. And that means that they can afford fewer releases if they just make them more expensive on average. Also the production gets slowed down a lot if they specialize in these complicated OTT designs. It seems only reasonable that they are going the route of Mary Magdalene with only a couple of releases a year. On the positive side, that might result in better quality control (wich had been horrible in recent years).

>>9537749
She looks very plain, girl next door like. Like every other Japanese girl. So maybe that's why I haven't? Though the 'latest' Keras and Bibles I own are from 2012/13 and I'm not into browsing new releases or so.

But lets see, maybe I'll recognized her and have a small talk with her. She might be nice

>>9537790
Oh wow how did I miss this? That op looks so soft and dreamy. Wish they made more like this, I'm really over the painting prints

>>9537085
This makes me deep dirty and I don't know why

>>9537828
I don't want this group to be mentioned on cgl because they will ruin it

>>9537838
*feel dirty, damn phone

>>9537844
It was all over cgl when it first launched, you missed the boat on that one.

>>9537824

>MM replicas

I think the other anon is referring to how MM dresses only came in one size. Not really a question of being skinny either, if you're too skinny the dress hangs off you since it doesn't have any lacing to tighten it either. With the size difference of international lolitas, it's a given that a lot of girls aren't going to fit into that specific size and won't be buying it.

>>9537880
Yeah but since then cgl has been pretty quiet about it, I think that's why some people have been more willing to post there.

>>9537405
isnt bad teeth cute in the oh so holy nippons?

>>9537735
They used to be extremely common and easier to get than MM... All the replica makers had St Clair and one other MM style

>>9537824
MM used to be very expensive and hard to find secondhand

>>9537686
Yeah it is, but if you go to some "community" dental offices you can get it for really cheap, like $25 for a cleaning/exam and like an extra $20 if you need your x-rays done. Full of trashy and/or ghetto patients? Yeah, but the dentists and dental assistants are fine and nice and all their equipment is clean and stuff.

For real though, US gulls, if you wanna save money on your teeth see if there's a county/community dental office in your area.

>>9537511
I pay roughly $200/year for my dental insurance. It includes free yearly check ups and most services are covered at 50 to 80 percent

>>9537968
Yeah st claire, petit fours and whetelyfe OP used to be plastered on every shady site known to man. I remember being like, 15 and looking through ebay and drooling over the stolen stock photos, jpg artefacts and all.
Thank god I never bought one, the shitty quality probably would have broken my heart, if it ever showed up.

>>9537553
On that note, what's the name of that jsk? I need it in my life

>>9538058
Tokimeki Girl https://lolibrary.org/items/ap-tokimeki-girl-jsk

>>9538070
Bless you anon

>>9537193
>Ronova
http://ronova.net/ you have to register for an account though, their other brand bb and b(?) does the same thing. not sure why but i assume it's for security?

>>9537833
Lolita models usually look plain. Pretty, but plain. The only one who has an "interesting" face is Rinrin and personally I only think that because it's homely. She is my least favorite model of all of the models AP uses.

>>9537824
But most of the people who were buying the MM replicas were newbies who probably had no idea what the brand was. Or newbies who were too afraid to order from them since they didn't have a cart system (as far as I remember).

>>9537790
It's a good thing to remember too that we're in the fashion off-season; wait until fall and I'm sure a lot will come out, but JetJ has been stagnating, IMO and needs to adjust their prices for the quality. They built up that whole cult of exclusivity and the people who worshipped them fell out of interest because of quality control.

>>9537511
dental for my family was covered under our insurance, but orthodontics was not because it was technically cosmetic. I had braces for 5 fucking years and it clocked in at around 5k USD to fix my terrible teeth

>>9537830
I bought two JetJ dresses last year. The quality was so dissapointing. It was the kind if quality I'd expect from <$100 dresses, not $400 ones. Blurry prints, bad fabric, absolutely no details, etc.

>>9538136
I don't get how Rinrin is a model at all, she looks unattractive to the point of being distracting, which is exactly what a model shouldn't be.

>>9537625
This girl is saying now that she's gonna make an tutorial now on how to steal prints.

>blog is 20dollarlolita incase you are wondering

>>9537719
Retard alert

>>9537833
In what world is she plain? Lol

>>9537625
>there are many aspects to why one should or should not purchase replicas

It blows my mind that technically (literally) committing a felony isn't good enough of a reason not to.

>>9537790
This didn't do well? I thought it did fine. A lot of people I saw really appreciated this anyway. I really love oldschool JetJ. It's just a special style with it's details that no other brand seems to put out.

>>9538360
C'mon, people to illegal things every day. Smoking marijuana, downloading music or movies or tv shows. Replicas are bad, but "its illegal!111!!" is weak.

>>9538371
Hey dude, I was charged with a felony and thankfully was found innocent. Believe me, that is one of the worst/most traumatic things that can happen to a person, if there's a way to avoid it, then they fucking should at all costs, but people are too damn ignorant and naive and think nothing will ever happen to them. Tossing out the "people smoke marijuana" thing is pretty dumb considering the insane amount of arrests are made for possession alone each year. It's not all that likely that someone will get caught, but with how salty the lolita community is if someone knows the right place to report and does it just because, they can and will go down for it.

>>9537824
Not defending replicas, but buying a piece secondhand doesn't give the brand money either. Instead of generating new business it's just shuffling old items around. But it's definitely better than replicas in that it's not generating an influx of new fakes and after a while the secondhand brand pieces will wear out and no longer be sellable.
I think MM is kind of a pain in the butt to buy from with almost everything on reserve. People can't make quick or impulsive purchases so they've kind of limited themselves to a small and loyal fanfase that keeps up with their releases.

>>9538389
obligatory "what the fuck did you do (or not do) to be charged with a felony"

>>9538360
>>9538371

I don't even care if people want to wear replicas, but why do the replica-fans have to be so fucking stupid. Most of the hate doesn't even come from someone else having a cheaper, lower quality version of an expensive AP dress, it comes from shit like this where someone shoops out the original brand name and slaps their own name on top like it's something to actually boast about. Jesus, you're basically boasting that (a)you have no manners, (b)you have no morals, (c) you're gonna drag anybody standing next to you into all that mud with your stupidity. How is his something you can even be proud of?

Tea parties with brand attendance, too. Girls will whine about "famous lolitas" wearing replica shoes and then demand they be allowed to wear print replicas. Jesus. The whole reason replica shoes go under the radar is because the girls wearing them are smart enough not to draw attention to them and the brands attending are usually too polite to point them out, and here you go wanting to rub it in the brand's faces by wearing replicas to their tea parties, thereby bringing the whole thing to their attention. What even goes through these girls' heads, like do they think if they show up with what is obvious an inferior copy of Sugary Iron Gate Jellyfish print someone will invite them up to the head table to sit with the designers instead of shuffling them out the door so the designers aren't offended by the replicas?

How are people this stupid?

>>9538547
>What even goes through these girls' heads, like do they think if they show up with what is obvious an inferior copy of Sugary Iron Gate Jellyfish print someone will invite them up to the head table to sit with the designers instead of shuffling them out the door so the designers aren't offended by the replicas?

They don't care about the designers. They don't care about anything but their own personal agenda, whatever that is. And if that agenda is rubbing it in the face of others that they can wear lolita for cheap, they're not going to care that it's illegal, immoral, unethical, or inferior quality--they paid less for you and they see it as the same fucking product.

I honestly assume that this is what happens when mainstream clothing outlets are flooded with lookalikes and knockoffs of bigger brands. It is so normal in magazines to have articles about how to "get the look" from a red carpet ensemble or celebrity outfit (which is all designer or all expensively tailored items), with a cheaper reproductions. I've come to assume that that just rubs off on these people when it comes to lolita as well.

>>9538392
I think lolitas who start buying secondhand are more likely to develop a loyalty to their favourite brand and buy new when they can, maybe later in life, or buy new accessories and stuff. The person they bought it from can also spend more money on brand. I only buy new lolita clothes with money I got from selling, not from my wages.
If MM didn't only sell on reserve, they would have to have stock. Meaning they would have to pay for a space to have stock and risk that not all of it will sell.

>>9538245
I think she's pretty. But I hear that she has a bad personality or something?

>>9538562
I've only bought brand second hand so far. But I have some major brand loyalty going on. If my favorite brand releases something new that I like when I have the funds for it, I will probably buy. It seems like it would be really special to buy brand new. I figure that a lot of people selling brand second hand actually use that money for new releases.

>>9538579
She's really sweet and fun to talk to irl

>>9538561
Yes, but the part where girls already tell you not to do a thing, you have to expect they’re not going to like it when you do it anyway. Wear it to a tea party to sock it to the designers if you want, but at that point you should already be counting how many enemies you’ll be making. You have no excuse to turn around and complain about people being rude to you when you’re rude to them first.

Besides, who even thinks wearing replicas to a tea party is socking it to the designer? On the contrary, this move just proves that their designs are so good, you covet them even though you’re poor, and proves that you’re rude, with poor social skills to boot. If you really want to sock it to the designer, all you need to do is wear the replica while carrying a genuine crocskin birkin, showing that you can afford it, but it’s not worth it.

“Steal this look” is yet another thing. So many years in so many magazines and no one notices they don’t use replicas either? It’s gotta be even easier for the magazine to grab a shady knockoff from some part of town and use that to get an even closer look. But they don’t, because the whole challenge in “Steal this look” isn’t to put together a fucking cosplay of a celebrity, it’s to copy the style while fitting it into your own lifestyle level.

It even goes the other way around, Balenciaga made a shiny blue bag that looks like the Ikea tote. And they know better than to copy it too closely, not because they can’t, but because the whole point of that trend is to look like you can afford to look poor while looking like you can afford to throw money away.

I mean c’mon, you’d think girls in a fashion hobby would pick up on these nuances. Just get into cosplay if you have no imagination and need to copy someone else that badly.

Sorry for the rant, it's just something that's been bothering me.

>>9538685
>tfw most active girls in your comm are also cosplayers and don't understand the aesthetic and feelings behind lolita at all
They do great photoshoots tough

>>9538627
Ok. I've just heard rumors. Nothing concrete. I'm willing to give most people the benefit of the doubt.

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>>9537511
Dental anon here, saging as well, but in CA, the UCR fees for an adult prophylaxis (cleaning) is $100, but a lot of places don't actually do a prophy, just teeth polishing (Think walk in dental clinics). Unfortunately, that's kinda like what >>9537994 was mentioning. They're not bad or anything, but these kind of places tend to either cut corners or don't offer or check for services that might be needed (like checking your gum health) and sometimes they commit fraud by billing your insurance for services that may not have happened, like additional x-rays or an oral examination from a dentist, when you may have only seen a hygienist.


Like what other anons say, most dental insurances cover preventative (cleaning, x-rays, exams) services at 100% and it's usually every 6 months/ 2 times a year. Work that needs to be done (basic like fillings, root canals, extractions) and major (crowns) have deductibles/ copays and become insanely expensive (and easily can go past the average annual max of ~$1500). A porcelain/tooth colored crown can be around $900 USD at a professional office. Also, with wisdom teeth extractions (something very common because impacted teeth cause major damage if untreated) is easily in the thousands at times without insurance. Dental care seems to be really focused on in the US compared to other countries- our televisions show/glamorize whitening, invisiline/straight teeth, etc. and have braces and bad teeth be a butt of the joke (although not as common anymore). Meanwhile in some countries, it's either not seen as important, or important for different reasons (iirc Japan has a thing for the snaggle tooth/fang tooth as a "it looks younger!" thing like what >>9537940 said)

On topic note- Wunderwelt summer coupon is up!

>>9538771
I am so glad I live in a country were dental care and orthodontics are fully covered by our health insurance. I would have cost my parents so much money, that I probably wouldn't have gottten what I have gotten now.
But anon, I must say being focussed on dental care and the glamourizing of bright white teeth aren't the same. Focussing on dental care would, in my eyes, mean that you are focussed on having a healthy and good teeth plus gums. This wouldn't just include people going to the dentist regularly, but also childeren getting taught how to brush at school and learning the importance in maintaining your teeth and gums. Glamourizing white teeth just means you are from a country that is very focussed on looks. It just says people want to look like a celebrity. (Teeth whitening isn't even healthy and a teeth in it's most healthy and clean form doesn't look bright white.)

When TNT express delivers a parcel but you aren't home to receive it, where does it go? To the local post office? I can't access their website or make an appointment for delivery because of a cyber attack. I'm in the UK btw.

>>9538358
Or maybe word your stupid comments better, dumbass.

>>9538732
cgl tends to make shit up on the fly. People I know who have met her have said she's a little shy, but that's it.

>>9538524
tdlr wrong place at the wrong time

I feel like there are two types of lolita.

One group that discovered lolita through anime and manga. They go to cons, meets and other events and they like cute stuff from Japan and geeky stuff. Probably also interested in other jfashions.

And one group who likes old european stuff that they romanticize and childish things like fairytales but listens to loud music (rock, visual kei, metal, punk). More likely to have a 'there are no lolita rules' or lolita at heart attitude.

Of course we're all individuals and maybe discovered lolita in different ways but I feel like I can place most lolitas I know in one of these two groups. Lifestyle lolita imo is pretty much dead as now it's mostly people who incorporate lolita aesthetic in their home and wear lolita very often that claim to be lifestyle lolitas and I think lifestyle lolita is something more extreme than that.

>>9538841
Nayrt but I feel like "pretty with a bad personality" is a standard rumor for any Lolita with little to no drama on cgl.

>please no bully
Any chance someone with a 98 cm bust, 68 waist would fit into the IW underbust cut jsks? Any advice on sizing would be appreciated, some of the jsk's come in L but I'm not sure if that would even fit depending on how they sit

>>9538685
I've only been following this discussion but I appreciate this comment.

>>9538371
Marijuana is legal in many places (has been for decades where I live) and most people I know just use iTunes and Netflix instead of illegally downloading anything. Stop saying "everyone does it" when that's not even true.

>>9538371
Not really, why would you want to profit off an artist's hard work? That's why it's illegal, people have rights to sufficiently creative works. If that isn't reason enough, you're a pretty shitty person

>>9538903
Underbust is a risky cut if you're busty (especially with IW whose cuts are generally not very forgiving for large cup sizes), you don't want to end up looking like a bar wench on accident. Anyway, I would advise you to look for a JSK that has adjustable straps just in case.

>>9538885
I've noticed a similar dichotomy in origins but at least in my comm, the itas and lolita-at-hearts are all from the anime camp whereas the people who found it through historical fashion were already into fashion before they got into lolita. They're generally better at putting interesting coords together whereas the anime group generally came from cosplay rather than fashion and mostly needs to buy full sets to look put together. They always look great when they manage to snag a full set but when they don't... they don't.
Personally I'm kind of in the middle; found it through anime like a decade ago, never got into cosplay and was inspired by lolita to learn more about historical fashion. I'm not the best dressed in my comm but I do manage to put together coords with items from different sources without looking like too much of a mess.

so, are we ever going to see lolibrary back to its full functioning or is it dead for good when it comes to adding new things?

>>9538805
I don't care much about whitening but my previous dentist would give me so much pressure to do it (that's a big moneymaker for them) I got really pissed off. One of my front teeth is a tiny bit yellower than the others, probably from bumping it on something in the past and even though I told him I don't give a shit he would badger me about it on every visit until I stopped going to him. Fuck that guy.

>>9538916
That's really interesting. In my comm the 'weeb group' can make really good coords, I think because they approach it in a way like ''it must look this way or its not lolita'' but that can also be a bad thing, some of them can't comprehend that dresses from Antique Beast and Atelier Boz can be shorter and they have difficulty with hybrid styles as well. Actually some of them have difficulty with anything that doesn't look similar to AP/taobao, like Excentrique.. On the plus side, cosplayers can usually take really good coord pictures. They also hate everything that looks childish which to me just shows that they don't really understand lolita beyond poofy clothes

>>9538831
>thinking that there must be only 1 person who recognizes that they're a retard

>retard with shit personality alert

>>9538921
I wish they would show more transparency with their donations. I'd donate a bunch of money if I knew they'll use it to finally finish the damn website.

>>9538906
Pretty much everyone I know pirates/streams TV and movies (less so for music), but I don't think it's morally equivalent to a replica because you're not paying for it (especially if you're using P2P downloading or adblock). It's the loss of a potential sale for the creators, but money isn't directly going to people making the fakes (like it would if you bought a bootleg video at the a market). Whereas with replicas you're paying a girl to continue ripping the product off and replica-makers then did things like hold reserves for replicas before the original had even sold out. Pirating movies is more akin to someone making a design replica for personal use than someone buying a print replica off OoJia.

sage because everyone's heard these arguments before and it's always stupid whenever this comes up because it's impossible to prove either way

>>9538885
I got into lolita through a combination of anime and visual kei when I was a young teen but I don't think I fit into the first category at all. I'm a weeb and go to cons but never in lolita, don't really care for meets and have zero interest in other jfashions, except for some non-lolita Japanese gothic brands. I'm also quite experimental with the fashion and don't really care about falling under the label 'lolita' or not with my outfits. #notallweebs

>>9538906
I assure you that everyone has atleast done one or two mildly illegal things in their lifetime. It's just a really weak excuse against replicas.

>>9538389
>but with how salty the lolita community is if someone knows the right place to report and does it just because, they can and will go down for it.

Hasn't it been established that getting in trouble for replicas is a legal grey area considering most are made in China? And many people on this board support aliexpress which is probably 80% replicas at this point, of western brands and others.

Lolita replicas aren't good, particularly print replicas, there is no need for them anymore because prints rarely sell out, and are often rereleased and there are numerous affordable options for those buying lolita on a budget. But the lengths cgl goes to be anti replica is ridiculous and hypocritical in some cases, no one freaks out in the aliexpress thread when someone purchases a UNIF or lazy oaf replica.

Replicas are wrong, because if you truly want to be a Lolita you should want to support the designers and brands, especially now when the fashion is in trouble and shops are starting to close up. The pearl clutching over the legality of replicas is a moot point, because someone considering buying a replica probably doesn't give a damn. We all buy circle lenses that probably aren't legal in our home countries.

>>9539010
I don't go in the aliexpress thread because the only jfashion I wear is lolita. From what I know she's not from China but from America so I hope americunts report her.

>>9538958
So edgy.

>>9539010
I kind of agree, the legality is not really the issue with replicas, the issue is whether they are good or bad for the fashion/ community... there are forums for things like designer purses where the members are very dedicated and treat it like a hobby, that's really the most analogous situation to our fashion hobby/ subculture/ whatever you want to call Lolita, and they simply would never accept knock off purses, so why should we? Everyone knows you can get a replica Chanel bag pretty easily but they would never expect a real designer purse fan to support that market over legitimate labels, even a less expensive similar bag would be preferable. Why is our fashion different?

>>9539085
I think because with bags the brand bag itself and the prestige that comes with it is the basis of the hobby, whereas lolita is a fashion style and look that can be imitated without prestige brand labels (handmade, indie, etc) and there's always been a heavy emphasis on DIY.
You can't be a designer handbag collector without owning designer handbags but you can be a lolita without wearing name brands.

>>9538269
She literally thinks you can use that iron on printer paper you use to make shitty t shirts to make a print replica.

>>9539097
After the cost of fabric, trims, all the transfer paper it would take to do that, printer ink and time, she could buy a secondhand brand print.

>>9539102
And it will all start flaking off and look disgusting

>>9539097
god i remember trying to use this shit in my cosplay days
terrible

>>9538771
I was mentioning a community clinic that does thorough adult prophylaxis. You always get the oral exam by the actual dentist. So yes, you're paying $25 for the full deal, not just a tooth polish. Nobody needs to be tricked into paying quadruple the price for the same thing in a fancy office.

>>9538937
I switched because mine tried to force me to get invisalign every time! Wtf, I have one back tooth that's barely out of line. American dentists are so pushy, no one needs blinding, oversize Chiclet teeth. One of my friends got veneers and they look so fake and huge. I'm glad Japan accepts crooked teeth, I wish it would catch on here

>>9539010
It's not a grey area at all! International copyright law is even stronger than US. It's just too expensive to sue replica makers abroad, especially in China. You have to get local counsel and the proceedings take a long time

>>9539161
Ha, yeah no. Japan used to think it's cute, but with the invasion of Western culture it's not really a thing anymore. Rich Japanese families go to America for work and have their kids get braces in America where there's less stigma when they are in school. Japanese kids are brutal to those with braces. Those families have perfect teeth for when they go back to Japan after their time is up.

Anyone have any lolita blogs they like reading? I'm looking for any that are active/semi-active (at least a post a month or so)

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Why the ricrac AP?

>>9539216
Nooo, the OP is adorable (and, thank god, not high-waisted or sack dress cut) but the fugly ricrac makes me not want it anymore.

What is with Americans not wanting to ship outside the US? I sent a polite message saying that I really wanted the dress and that I was willing to pay any amount of shipping but she still refused to sell to me because "the shipping is high and you might get hit by customs and I don't want to be responsible for that". Bitch I know customs exist, I'm not blaming you for it, just sell me the dress.

>>9539253
They're lazy cunts who don't want to fill in extra forms

>>9539253
They don't want to deal with buyers complaining or giving negative feedback if they have to pay more shipping or insurance when it arrives. Customs fees or getting lost, it's quite the worry. Where are you located? If Brazil, I completely understand not wanting to ship there. But generally if the buyer is nice and has good feedback and has accepted all risks, I'll still do it if messaged about it.

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Alright story time.

>preparing for a meeting
>decide to wear a jsk for the first time since i got it recently
then at the last fucking moment
>realize i don't have a matching bow or any matching headdress and all of them make the coord look meh and not like i want to
>fuck
>then remember pic related
>remember i have panties that would look absolutely perfect with this jsk
>really don't wanna change/make a whole new outfit in under ten minutes
>sweating intensifies
>i-if i do it right my coord will be on point and nobody will know, right????
>there's no time, do it right away and surprisingly manage to get it right
>fix it on my head with some bobbypins
>you couldn't tell it's a panty unless you look extremely close and even then it looks like some handmade headbow
>fast forward to the meeting
>sweating nervously, wonder if anyone knows
>some girl ask me what taobao brand is my headbow
>sweating intensifies
>"i-it's just some crappy handmade bow i did last night haha"
>she seems convinced and says it's nice
>nobody seems to notice
>it looks perfectly decent on pics
>still lowkey nervous but it went better than expected

Next time i'll buy a matching headdress right away.

>>9539096
That's very true and honestly I would love seeing more DIY, like handmade and indie brand are much more charming to me than a knockoff AP print.

>>9539268
When does that actually happen tough? I understand being annoyed with having to pay extra shipping because of mistake but I don't think that happens often

>>9539122
My mistake! I didn't mean to discredit your community clinic, but it sounds like a diamond in the rough compared to the area I'm in. It may just be that the dental clinics here are a lot less thorough and more shady. One of our patients had gone to an office like I described and they even argued with him saying he can't have his x-rays when he changed offices. Could be dependent on the city/county?

>>9538805
Ah, I meant more in a broad scope of "Perfect straight white teeth that are so healthy!!" is the marketed thing, even though whitening and healthy aren't the same- its that image of "Stained teeth are bad teeth!" A good dentist wont even do whitening if you have work like fillings that need to be done, and even then it's not a needed thing; purely aesthetic. And at home whitening is also dangerous because you can burn your gums (I learned that like an idiot when I first tried to use whitening gel trays) or really increase your sensitivity.

On a more lolita general note, how many gulls would wear a print themed around their field of work or if it had a subtle relation? The obvious ones of if you work in a baking/sweets field, do you gravitate towards sweet prints, or florals for florist anons, etc. I realize some career paths probably wouldn't work as prints but if they could, would you? I think I'd wear a dress with a creepy teeth or medical theme to it if it was good quality. I liked the concept of that one Violet Fane dress but I heard a lot of negatives regarding her construction.

>>9539233
It looks pretty high-waisted to me anon - it's not empire waist but it's not hitting at the natural waist either. Look at the proportions of bodice:skirt, it looks like it'd still hit on the average girl's ribcage.

>>9539271
Aren't most panties made out of stretch jersey material or satin, which is immediately visually obviously distinct from the cotton/chiffon lolita headbows are made of?

>>9539299
I mean that USPS will quote one price, send it, and on arrival they request more money to cover the shipping. My packages have gotten destroyed by their machines before so this is why I'm wary. Saying it doesn't happen just because it has never happened to you, doesn't make it true.

>>9539253
tbf I hate shipping internationally as an American because it's gonna be at least $60 if it complies with PayPal policies, and that always gets complaints.

>>9539268
I live in the Netherlands, we have awful customs fees but no issues with packages getting lost or anything like that. I specifically said I knew the shipping would be expensive and that it didn't matter to me. It's not like shipping is something that you find out after the fact, if she tells me it's 60 dollars and I agree to that then why would I complain afterwards? Eh, I'll find the dress elsewhere for cheaper probably, but I still think it's weird to decline when asked in private.

>>9539316
What the fuck? Why can't they just calculate their own shipping correctly? You can't say "it'll be x amount" and then change the amount after it's already done in any other business.

>>9539316
I mean I've never heard of someone giving negative feedback for those things

>>9539313
Mine were made out of cotton though? and the lace was cotton lace

>>9539326
Then you'd also have to agree that in the case that it's lost or damaged, you aren't going to try and start a claim on PayPal if you wanted the value of the package lowered. It's just a lot of trust you need to have in a stranger, I can understand why some people would refuse.

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>>9538269
did...did she just compare being told replicas are unethical to homophobia?

>>9539351
Jersey can be made from cotton... Are you okay?

>>9539253
Because we don't like to hear international buyers get upset about shipping fees (especially with tracking) and customs. Most of the time they ask us to write down a cheap amount for declaration as well.

Just because one buyer is perfect doesn't make up for everyone else being shitty so it's just easier to sell to people within our own country and occasionally to Canada.

>>9539351
Cotton underwear is cotton knit, it's not the same weave as the non-stretchy cotton lolita dresses are made out of.

>>9539368
I hope no one sells to the US so they feel the pain of this idiocy, sadly it won't happen but really. If the buyer says they are ok with it, go with it.

>>9539365
for some reason a lot of idiots in the lolita community think cotton=broadcloth, sateen, etc. if you don't know basic things like this why would you be into a fashion that's about fine detail and quality construction?

>>9539216
I hate the white waistband on the skirt, it looks so out of place.

>>9539368
Where are all those shitty buyers??

>>9539326
If they already clearly said in their terms of sale they won't ship to your country why would you get upset when you message them and they repeat what they already wrote? It seems pointless and you're just setting yourself up for disappointment.

>>9539407
If it's a dress I want I might as well try. I just don't get it. Shipping from Europe to the US is expensive as well, but if someone was willing to pay the cost I wouldn't care what country I was shipping my dress to. Guess next time I'll just get a US shopping service.

>>9539253
I can ship from my house to the us. It's a pain for some people to go to the post office while its open.

>>9539400
On Facebook. That's where I find most of mine.

>Your $3 item says shipping included, you'll ship it to Russia for free, won't you?
Sorry, no.. that's going to cost extra.
>BUT WHY

As someone who's had a EU buyer demand a refund because customs held their package and they 'couldn't' pay the fee then I completely understand why people would want to refuse a sale. Sure not all EU buyers are like this, but a one time bullshit case like this I get a little hesitate to ship to you guys.

>>9539394
Most sellers will though if you message and are polite about it. Calling them a bitch because they won't ship to you doesn't help your case (not you specifically, previous anon). It's just really risky and much more expensive shipping out of the US as opposed to into the US. Even Canada starts at $10 for an envelope.

>>9539419
People are going to say I'm lazy, but yeah, having to deal with the post office is a bitch. my two closest ones are in really inconvenient locations, and then if it's domestic I can just use the self service kiosk and be in and out. International takes waiting in line for 10-15 minutes, getting an estimate bc the online calculator sucks, going back again and having to do the paperwork, and the workers at USPS are cunts.

It wouldn't stop me from selling, but it's way more of a chore

>>9539365
>>9539395
>being this uppity just because i didn't catch what jersey was in my native language right away

>>9539467
I think we have every right to be uppity considering you wore fucking panties on your head to a meet, you dork.

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>>9539485
Well you got a point there.

>>9539419
This is the only answer that's made sense so far

>>9539443
Same tough. One American buyer fucked me over with paypal and I will never use paypal with American buyers again

>>9539497
Well that anon is wrong, you can also ship international from your house using PayPals shipping. You just need a scale which is a worthy investment when trying to sell your stuff (and it's like $10 on Amazon).

>>9539499
How?

>>9539216
>Le ricrac meme

It's cute when used right (like toy drops), fuck off. That print isn't cute though

>>9539516
It's not a meme if everyone acually hates it. You don't see ricrac on couture garments for a reason.

>>9539271
incredible

>>9539524
You don't see Alice bows in couture either, what's your point? Sweet lolita is cutesy and ricrac is a cutesey trim

>>9539499
Gotta say, from chatter I hear in the UK comm, American buyers are the worst and people complain the most about selling to them. America seems to have the most poor/newb lolitas who kick off about having to pay for shipping, or ask for ridiculous payment plans and holds and then back out.

>>9539558
After everything I have heard, I have no empathy left towards payment plans. I've only ever been a buyer, but all these nightmare stories are just unbelievable. Either you know exactly when you will have the money (based on paychecks) to the make the payments, or you literally don't have the money to buy.

"I thought I would have money by now" is a response I've heard even girls in my own comm say.

>>9539524
Yeah, because couture and lolita aren't the same. What a dumb comparison.

>>9539558
>America seems to have the most poor/newb lolitas
I think it's because of how lolita subculture is there, from what I've heard on cgl. There at a con you are likely to be able to buy cheap LQ lolita and they have teaparties at cons so more new people interested in Japan are exposed to lolita that way.

>>9539584
Was comparing quality, but sure anon. You can keep your ricrac.

>>9539608
There's a difference between quality and simply not liking a design element.

>>9539596
Could also just be that America has more lolitas in general, so it's easier for horror stories to come out of there. I have found the US buyers I've dealt with over Lacemarket pretty pleasant (I guess people who can be bothered setting up a LM account are more invested), but I'm really cautious about posting in the Facebook groups because most of the horror stories I hear come from there.

Also, LQ? What does that mean?

>>9539632
What makes you say America has more lolitas? Because there are more people?

>>9539634
It's obvious from online activity and con attendance/comm sizes, etc. that there are more US girls. It's a big country and it also manages to sustain three brand stores.

Like, as a % of population maybe the UK has more, IDK, but the US definitely has more lolitas overall.

>>9539632
>LQ
Most likely anon means "low quality"

>>9539010
>hasn't it been established that getting into trouble for replicas is a legal grey area

Not at all, it's actually a felony and people get caught all the time (for non-lolita stuff). I may out myself by explaining it, but it's literally my job to catch this stuff. Design replicas are gray area, but print replicas are majorly illegal. This issue is, they're incredibly hard to catch because when they're cleared through CBP no one recognizes them easily like they would Chanel or Luis Vuitton. If someone knows someone is importing replicas, all they'd have to do is find out which port they'd be cleared through and alert CBP with the information needed (photos, original listings, sometimes samples) and they'll be seized, destroyed, and the importer (and in many cases exporter, as well) receiving fines (oftentimes HUGE fines), potential prison sentences, and having the foreign company blacklisted for import, having whatever they're sending in the future through the ports turned away with additional fines/fees.

Sometimes design replicas can even be stopped, but it's much harder of a process to go through/prove and again, is much more difficult with lolita stuff than it is big brand stuff, but we've had such simple items get turned away for being counterfeit as Chinese knock-offs of kids' toys.

But other than that I agree with you whole-heartedly.

>>9539634
Girls are always complaining that there aren't enough lolitas in their whole country, while the US can support several comms in one state.

>>9538685
Rant away!

When I meant they don't care about the designers, I meant they really don't care, not that they were trying to stick it to the man or something. They don't know who the people who make these dresses are, and they don't care about impressing them. All they care about is cheap clothing. Cheap dresses! Cheapcheapcheap! Maybe 'agenda' was too strong a word in this case.

Some of them may want to sock it to the brands for being so expensive (since so many of them constantly bring up how expensive brand is compared to replicas), but I doubt most of them know even one lolita designer's name, nevermind the name of the person who designed the particular dress they've decided to buy a replica of.

>>9539362
That is a special kind of stupid...

People like her are the reason that conservatives equate marriage equality to OMFG! THEY'LL WANT TO MARRY DOGS NEXT!

>>9539552

Ailce Bow is the finished product, ric rac is raw material. We might not see designers make bloomers either, but at least we can see a lot of similar fabric, lace and other raw material being used (except ric rac).

I don't even hate ric rac.

>>9539216
The OP and skirt are cute af but
>ricrac
goddamn AP don't you want my money

>>9539516
Ricrac is shit, anon. Worse than that nasty stringy pompom trim even.

>>9539579
Same here. If you don't have the money ready then you shouldn't be spending it. Save up and hope that I still have the dress available in a few months. If not, tough shit, but you now have money ready for the next dress you'd like to buy!
>implying they won't spend it on useless crap in the meantime because they're dumbshits with no impulse control
welp, not my problem

>>9539814
Gucci has used ricrac, gulls are so fucking ignorant of fashion, it's laughable. That's just one I know of, I can research more if you retards care. There's a reason AP and Meta use it, western fashion thinks it's retro cute

>>9539913
Here's some Prada leather ricrac heels. Not sure why people hate it, there is different quality just like lace

>>9539913
Ricrac is cute as hell when used tastefully. I own so many AP pieces with it and it doesn't ruin any of them, just adds to their playful vibe.

However this new print is awful, ricrac or no ricrac.

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>>9539922
Is that even ricrac? Looks more like suede cut into wavy strips.

>>9539930
Yeah, "high fashion" anon is full of shit. Ricrac by definition is a flat woven trim. Those heels are definitely not made of ricrac. Perhaps they should research more about fabric and trims.

>>9539913
>>9539922
That's not even ricrac, that's a piece of suede cut into a wavy pattern. Ricrac is a braid woven into a zigzag. Also even if Prada or whichever designer brand uses it, it doesn't mean it's automatically a good idea for lolita. I don't even have a strong opinion on ricrac, your logic is just terrible.

>>9539216
I love the JSK, ric-rac and all.

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>>9539935
>>9539936
not the anon originally talking about ricrac being high fashion but here's a $525 Anna October skirt with actual ricrac

>>9539946
Yes, ricrac has been used in high fashion before, but anon was criticized for whining about how no one understands "fashion" and then posting a picture of heels made of wavy suede.

High fashion brands have made plenty of items with questionable materials inspired by questionable trends.

Nonetheless, while the skirt is $525 and someone is sure to buy it, the ricrac still cheapens the look.

Lolita fashion is by no means high fashion, but ricrac still looks questionable on a ton of the items they put it on. Surely someone likes it and someone will buy it, but that doesn't make it good.

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>>9539935
>so tacky

>>9539936
>it doesn't mean it's automatically a good idea for lolita
And "well a bunch of girls think it's ugly!" doesn't mean it's a bad idea for lolita either. People used to hate cork shoes and RHS too

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>>9539967
I'm sure ricrac Lolita is the way of the future.

>>9539980
>I think it's ugly so it's objectively ugly because my opinions = facts

>>9539967
So clearly your reading comprehension and ability to respond to arguments is terrible as well. Nobody you responded to said anything negative about ricrac, or commented on its suitability in lolita. We just said that the argument that "high fashion does it so lolita can too" is terrible.

>>9539985
>I think it's not ugly so it's objectively not ugly because my opinions = fact
Two can play this game.

>>9539991
I'm not even one of the previous anons, I just pointed out it *is* used in high fashion and that the "people don't like it!" argument is just as stupid as "well high fashion does it"

>>9539946
That looks like shit you'd find in a thrift store for $5.

>>9540001
It could be argued that the "people don't like it" argument has a little more weight.

If an item is unpopular, because "people don't like it", the brand makes less money and that could possibly hurt them. Consumers ultimately rule the market, so the brand has an option to pander towards them (and make money) or release unpopular styles (and suffer the consequences, like JetJ's not always popular mediocre prints/plain cuts trend).
If ricrac on a dress stops girls from buying it, it may've been a bad choice, not that it's going to pull AP sales under or anything.

>>9540001

Are Anna October and Zooey Deschenal really high fashion though?

For reference, I knew of a guy who set up a clothing shop selling $500 dresses. His stuff wasn't anything special, but he set up shop in a high-income area and was basically banking on people being willing to drop $500 on something "not special" because it's not a $2000 actual high fashion branded dress.

>>9540019
They are not.

>>9540018
I think it's safe to say that it's only the Western community (or maybe even /cgl/) who gets this autistic about a style of trim. The world exists outside of this hellsphere. Just because the popular opinion on this board is "wah wah ricrac is bad!" doesn't mean it'll actually carry any weight in regards to actual sales.

Imo gulls tend to latch onto one thing and hate the shit out of it, tempting other more impressionable people to hate the shit out of it because they want to fit in. Ricrac, gold shoes, highwaisted dresses.

>>9539769

Ah yes, this makes so much more sense now. Thanks, anon.

Although I guess it also highlights how much worse their personalities are. It sounds like they're very small-minded and self-centred people who only think of themselves and treats everything around them like garbage. Guess I'll just continue avoiding them.

>>9540031
I don't think anyone thinks /cgl/ is the real world. These boards tend to discuss the most inane details of a fashion/hobby we funnel large amounts of money into...and it can be fun, but obviously we're not here for deep, meaningful anonymous connections.

But yeah...if I can influence someone to hate ricrac with the burning undying passion as I do, I am all for it.

>>9540052
>highlights how much worse their personalities are

Yeah, it kind of falls under the attitude of "if I don't know someone who ____, then why do I care about that issue?" If they don't personally know someone affected, it's none of their business.

So if replicas are giving them something cheap to buy that looks 'the same' as the real thing, they can't connect to the fact that that is damaging to others. It doesn't affect anybody they know negatively, therefore it must not be negative at all. Right? Right??

... I dunno. People who hardcore defend replicas in general are hard for me to understand, but this is kind of what I've seen from reading arguments or hearing people in my comm defend it. In general, they're often very selfish, manage money poorly, and live in a very small world. The same kind of person who would post "my Beloved Pet Meowmoew McFlufferstein needs emergency surgery, please see this gofundmenow to help us afford it!" who then spends $100 on a replica dress a week later.

>>9540140
>I don't think anyone thinks /cgl/ is the real world

you'd be surprised

>>9540152
>In general, they're often very selfish, manage money poorly, and live in a very small world. The same kind of person who would post "my Beloved Pet Meowmoew McFlufferstein needs emergency surgery, please see this gofundmenow to help us afford it!" who then spends $100 on a replica dress a week later.

YES. This is the exact kind of stuff that makes me think they’re stupid. Like writing blogposts on how they’re “forced” to buy replicas because the original is too expensive, or how tea party tickets “discriminate against poor people”. It’s lolita, it’s not a public service. You’re supposed to spend money, it’s not some charity you get handouts from.

And the way some of them go on like lolita is some kind of life-essential support therapy, they cry about how receiving a new dress is their one method of coping with being depressingly poor. Like they do realise the new dress is the direct cause of their poverty, right? There’s gotta be some other method of coping that doesn’t involve actually digging your hole even bigger.

Honestly I think this is all bullshit, they do it just so they can continue to play the victim card while trying to guilt trip anyone that looks like they’re actually having fun in lolita. What a bunch of miserable jerks.

Secrets are late this week so you still have time to submit them.

>>9539640
>It's obvious from online activity
A lot of people prefer to communicate in their own language. I follow a few Spanish and French lolita blogs but I don't even know a good English one. There are also more than 3 brand stores in Europe but not in one country. I think it's just the bigger population.

>>9540262
Being poor automatically makes you more stupid because of stress you waste brain capacity and make dumb decisions you otherwise wouldn't

>>9539558
I personally hate French buyers more than US buyers.

>>9540031
>Just because the popular opinion on this board is "wah wah ricrac is bad!" doesn't mean it'll actually carry any weight in regards to actual sales.
All my comm members hate it too regardless of if they frequent cgl or not. It's like raschel lace, very few people in the Western online community like it.

>>9540296
Probably nobody will see this because the thread is saging, but I meant the membership numbers of the comms in the Google doc.

>>9539310
I collect prints related to the field I am doing my PhD research in, I even wear them to conferences, makes a great talking point!