The fuck's happening with Bitcoin!! I'm losing all

Fuck off /biz/

Seems cleptocurrency is collapsing

>>745136700
the banks would never allow it

>>745136835
shut up you fag. It's freedom

It was clear it was gonna happen. You guys are idiots

>>745137135
>implying Bitcoin hurts banks in any way

You got ripped off man hahaha>>745136700

>>745137816
Banks create new money due to fractional reserve system.

You deposit $1,000
---- bank saves 50 (5%) and lends 950
-------- those 950 arrive to other bank, wich saves 45 (5%) and lends 905
-------------and so on

Ideally, if Bitcoin became more and more used banks would have a big problem. Because creating money is their main source of income.

>>745138020
Hint: Bitcoin does not stop a fractional reserve system

>>745138094
You need to have financial intermediaries who take deposits in order for a fractional reserve system to be possible.

They are scared

>>745136700

OP,

1. What price did you buy at?
2. Why did you put all your savings in a volatile currency?
3. Have you heard of 'buy and hold'? You've gotta keep holding through the drop.

Investing is a psychological game, and you're currently losing

>>745138363
Which Bitcoin does not prevent.

You deposit your 10 BTC at the bank.
The bank lends out 9 BTC to some other guy.

To think that people would not want loans or insured deposits in a world with Bitcoin is naive as hell.

>>745138597
I agree it does not prevent it theoretically.

>>745138545
1. bought at $4300
2. thought it was only going up and I was stupid, friends were winning money.
3. I know "buy and hold" but I don't know whether it is cracking or nor. If it cracks I'll be screwed.

>>745138728
I don't think it would prevent it in actuality either. Maturity transformation is a vital function that banks provide, and consumers would be incentivized to continue to use banks.

>>745138843
I think it will recover, but it is a long term high risk investment.
I didn't buy in 2016 because i am a moron. Will wait for it to drop more and buy some. I think it will beat 10k in 2 years.

No mention of Jews or Chase bank yet? I am disappoint.

>>745139018
You guys can thank that faggot from Chase for this. Talking out of his ass.

>>745139018
The thing is... It really is the fucking jews fault!!

>The bought a shitload of bitcoins earlier this year
>Because of limited supply prices sore
>Gain 400% profit
>Start selling to morons like OP that think prices will keep rising
>Prices drop because of increased supply
>Jews get to spend profits on passover crackers

>>745139132
He probably has his bets there. He just wants the price to go down so he can buy cheap

>>745138993
I am not sure, everybody is saying the opposite. I resist to believe. I think they have their interests, but countries like China are forbidding Bitcoin.

>>745136700
about a year and a half ago 1 buttcoin was worth 300$, take a guess where this is going. ;)

Bitcoin is a scam and it's going to be forbidden illegalized soon. You better get your hands away of that crap-

>>745139559
isn't that what it's called A BUBBLE?

>>745138843

You bought high. First mistake. Fomo buying.

You could have sold at 5K and made a healthy profit but you didn't.

Selling now would be your third mistake. If you know anything about Bitcoin and its history, it spikes & drops, then when it recovers after the drop, goes to a NEW HIGH. So HODL (hold on for dear life) and all will be well.

Experts are predicting 10K in 3months to 3 years. 50 to 100K in 5 years, and possibly a mil per bitcoin within 10. So stay in the game if you want to win. You only lose money if you sell.

If you wanted safe, you should have gone for an index fund or gold. If you want to get rich fast, you should trade ICOs with a smaller amount of money & leverage up.

At this point, stay in the game until at least $4300. But I think you'd hate yourself if it goes to 10 or 20K and you sold it cause you didn't have the balls to hold

Besides, are you an oldfag? Could you save or earn like that again?

>>745139745
Thanks anon. I'm a midfag late 30s. My life won't change but it hurts haha

Calm down. Look at a graph of Bitcoin prices over the course of a year.


It is because of rumours of China regulations. They are fucking it up. If you think worse down spike couldn't happen then you are wrong. It will recover eventually though.

>>745140169
No probs, anon. Wishing you all the best. And I'd recommended doing some research so you don't freak out. Stay calm and rational.

>>745139745
100k? what? lol. basically 'hey everyone lets run the price up so we all get rich. and then sell and leave a lot of people holding bags". if bitcoin price goes down when someone uses it (or does it?) thats gonna happen. otherwise what causes price to go down on BTC?

>>745136700
https://cointelegraph.com/news/media-spread-wrong-china-bans-bitcoin-narrative-causing-bitcoin-price-slump

>>745140432
All the things "good" for the Bitcoin you read them in pro-bitcoin pages. I suggest looking at neutral ones with no interests

>>745140412

That's right, 100K or more. If you think about it, with 7 billion people on the planet, and only 21 million BTC to ever exist (less in actuality because some have been lost), it starts to make sense.

If BTC becomes more widely used and popular as a digital currency, 2 things will happen:
1. The price will go much higher per BTC
2. It will stabilize in its volatility

Which will lead to eve more people adopting it. Especially as the petrodollar tanks. 100K is possible by actual growth, not just pump & dump

>>745141367
Bitcoin is a threat to "the state". It is used mainly to commit ilicit trade and to evade paying taxes.

Therefore should it become more widely used, it would be banned by the state. Because the state cannot allow a black market money to grow over certain limits.

Wasn't it at $4300 2 days ago?

As an outsider, is Bitcoin this volatile or is now the time to buy?

>>745141653
I get your point, but I think that line is going to a hard sell to the public as clearly there are more and more normies buying it who aren't illicitly trading on the deep web.

You're right that it's a threat to fiat currency and government. And of course they're making moves to squash it. That's exactly what this China thing is. But it ain't gonna work. The Genie has been let out of the bottle already

>>745142001
it's always this volatile, now at 3.530, but now going down at an astonishing speed.

Never catch a knife when it's falling, you can get hurt. Wait till it stops and consolidates a bottom.

>>745142001
Only buy with money you can lose.

I bought my first at 1600 it immediately dropped to 300. bought 3 more, and mined 1.

Sold one a couple of days ago at $4400ish.

These things fluctuate. China is fucking with the price but it will settle down eventually.

>>745136700
money out of thin air?

sounds like a jew's plan

go here

https://petitions.whitehouse.gov/petition/do-not-pass-hr672s198-combating-european-anti-semitism-act-2017

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>>745139559
>take a guess where this is going
$0

>>745138020
Implying that jews are not behind BTC too.

>>745142139
Yep, I've heard that, but still very few people have Bitcoins and non that I know uses them for other different than to speculate.

The state has two means of income: taxes and creating money. Both extremely important. If at some point the government sells to the common public that Bitcoin is threatening the public services of the country... moreover, if the Government claims (reasonably) that the Bitcoin is used massively to evade taxes... It will have all support to ban cryptocurrencies.

Main problem for the government of cryptocurrencies is that it can't trace winnings of money, nor operations done in Bitcoins.

Not sure in the US, where there is some anti-state sentiment and praise of freedom... but in Europe, where I live, the moment where the Bitcoin poses a threat to social-state, it will be over.

>>745142470
Uhhh no.

It has more inherent value than the US dollar.

What's the dollar backed by? 'Faith'
There will never be more than 21 million bitcoin.

>>745142543
This is only true if you are only using a wallet.

If you use a service like coinbase the feds certainly can track you. They are suing coinbase now for user lists.

>>745142620
The dollar is backed by all the gold of US, industry, infrastructures, your fucking house and your car,... and everything that fisically exists in the US.

>>745142771
so many niggers tho!

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>>745142620
>It has more inherent value than the US dollar
Kek'd

>What's the dollar backed by? 'Faith'
No, it's backed by the government and economy of the United States.

>There will never be more than 21 million bitcoin
Oh wow, a limit on the number of units in circulation suddenly makes it intrinsically valuable?

>>745142771
LOL... Dollar backed by gold.... are you from the 1890's?

>>745142828

>Oh wow, a limit on the number of units in circulation suddenly makes it intrinsically valuable?

As opposed to the dollar with unending dilution?

>>745142842
I studied economics and work in finance... yeah, dollar like any other fiat money in the world is backed by the precious metal reserves in their Central Bank.
It is not convertible, but that doesn't mean it's not backed.

>>745142543

The real threat to government is that it can be replaced entirely or minimized with the block chain. We could have visible, transparent elections and direct allocation of tax to the places we want those funds to go. Which effectively makes government obsolete. But consider that Bitcoin is already an independent global currency that is it tied to any single countries economy or currency. It's hard to control or to devalue. Its actually free market at work

>>745142926
>As opposed to the dollar with unending dilution?
If that were the case, hyper-inflation would occur. You're sounding like a delusional bitcuck.

>>745142926
the fed has been printing like there's no tomorrow for a while m8.

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>>745136700
Make sure you pick up Bitcoin Cash as well. Did you buy before or after the fork?

>>745142981
I understand that an anti-statist person defends that... but common public wants public services payed by taxes worldwide. The case of the US where people not rich don't want a big state is unique.

>>745137135
>>745137816
Banks are starting to buy bitcoin in huge amounts.

Scource: Banker

>>745143029
and yet the dollar hasn't had a significant change in value.

Invested in BTC when each BTC was $200. I invested $100k. Now, I'm a millionaire! Still haven't cashed out yet!

>>745143148
Yes. The only possible future in which Bitcoin succeeds is in an scenario where traditional banks take control of it.

>>745143004
The only thing propping up the dollar is that it's the world's reserve currency.

China and Russia are actively trying to change that. If it happens; the dollar is fooked.

>>745142961

Ho lawsuit. Get a load of this guy.

There hasn't been actual physical gold backing the dollar for decades

>>745141653
>Bitcoin is a threat to "the state". It is used mainly to commit ilicit trade and to evade paying taxes.
It ain't that hard to track Bitcoin (e.g. when Silk Road was busted).
>it will be banned by the state
No, it will be regulated like any other commodity. You don't eliminate a black market by making it blacker. You legitimize it and make it a part of the system (like state funded gambling).

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>>745143148
>Scource: Banker
Wow, impressive spelling skills Mr. Banker

>>745143131

I would suggest that this is an area where the state will have to negotiate with the people eventually. It will probably start in the less socialized economies like the US, and as it gains traction, Europe will adopt

Bitcoin is one of the biggest enablers of fraud / TAX evasion. It's going to keep dropping as more countries follow China's lead. Prepare to lose all your shit

>>745143240

Explain your logic please

>>745143301
You don't understand it. The dollar as the money in the US is backed by the reserves of the US, which some of them are gold.

Fiat currencies are backed by the reserves of their central banks as well as by the economy in which they are used. That's the reason why countries like China or Turkey have being stacking tons of gold.

>>745143484
This. Not to mention that in the grand scheme of things, very few retailers accept Bitcoin. Bitcoin only exists as a speculation/criminal tool.

Relax...we had a similar situation in july...it recovered just fine.

>>745141367

Here's the problem with that logic. Cryptos have no intrinsic value whatsoever and they don't generate income so they aren't an investment in any sense of the word and they're not a currency because no one accepts them for goods or services. You can exchange for fiat currency to spend on goods and services and some platforms have streamlined this process, but it still means that no one wants these coins as a currency.

Bitcoin is a speculative risk asset and a highly volatile one at that. It's been pumped uo into a HUGE bubble and as soon as conditions are right for a rally in some other commodity, big money will take its profits in bitcoin and dumb money will follow. All the pigs who hang onto theirs are going to get slaughtered.

>>745143503
LMAO since when is the US Dollar backed by gold/silver again? Your either stupid or a paid shill

>>745143490
Banks and funds are the biggest players out there, should Bitcoin be as good as it praisers claim, they will eventually take control of it and its markets.

It's somehow curious that common people think that they are more intelligent than professionals in finance and more than rich people and their advisors. Make no mistake. If Bitcoin succeeds the current commanding-heights of the world will take control of it.

>>745139317
>Spend profits on Passover Crackers
Fucking lost, well played.

>>745143177
Are you serious? In relation to what? What do you think these economy bubbles are about? Do you know how much more buying power the dollar had 50 years ago vs. today? In 1965, a minimum wage job would get you the equivalent of a $90K/ year income in today's money. And the amount people were paid was roughly the same amount as t is now. The difference is inflation and our reducted buying power because the dolllar had been devalued massively.

>>745143301
Different Anon here. You stopped reading after "gold", He wrote "industry, infrastructures, your fucking house and your car,... and everything that fisically exists in the US."

And, actually, that's how economy and money works. Current economic model is based under "future winnings". The promise of the gob to created more stuffs, sell them, buying them and make everyone happy, in simple words. That created "Inflation". The money is not physically
backed up, but a solid promise of, in some timein the future, would be. Then, it's real value is "inflated" by a promise. Good inflation is good, because shows the country is growing, but Hyper Inflation is cancerous. In that scenario, money lose it's value because there is less and less physical things that
backed it up, and more and more, and later, impossible promises. That's the case of Venezuela. They have a shit ton of oil, but the government fucked everything

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>>745143503
Oh really? Where does it say that? My money says 'backed by the full faith and credit' nothing about actual resources.

Money USED to be backed by hard assets Like the related pic a silver certificate. Read the bottom. Payable on demand

>>745143584
Correct. Bitcoin is only speculative. The only people that actually trade with it are criminals.

>>745143605
This

>>745143851
While your reply is saturated with sarcasm, traders are effectively criminals. They are complicit in a massive pyramid scheme.

>>745143671
perfect explanation. Bitcoin is not even a currency since it can't be used to trade. It's an intangible volatile asset.

>>745143846
You need to understand that "backed" doesn't mean "interchangeable".

>>745143789
BS

How is the dollar backed by industry? Because of potential economic output? Or are you saying the US could confiscate private business and sell it if they feel like it?

>>745143671

1. Bitcoin does have objective value: its security, transparency, and underlying technology. This is where trad economists always miss the mark. Investing in Cryptos is investing in technology and the likelihood they will become used en masse and widely valuable in the world in the same way google and Amazon are.

2. People and businesses DO in fact already use bitcoin for goods and services, without conversion, and will continue to do so. Uber is rumored to begin taking bitcoin payments soon, for example

>>745143972
I actually thought of my response in both ways. And with both I do agree.

>>745144107
Our money used to be backed by gold and silver. That changed with Nixon aka the Nixon Shock, back in 1971. This enabled the fed to print money, and lend it with interest to smaller banks. Thus stimulating "growth," and making money for the Federal Reserve (remember, the Federal Reserve is a private, for profit bank, and is NOT part of our government. They just control our money in secrecy).

>>745143789
If the dollar is covered by my car, wouldn't that mean the state could repossess it, in order to pay debts to another state?
That would mean anything I buy, i merely lend from the stock of goods, that is our economy.

>>745144129
Other anon here:
The price of moneys is in terms of other moneys. Example $/€. When your economy goes well dollar tends to appreciate, when Europe goes better dollar tends to depreciate. (very simplistic and not analyzing central bank policies)

The reason because of which the dollar is highly valued worldwide is because of the economy that lies underneath it. That's why when you travel to some Southamerican or African countries you can eat for $1 a whole meal... their economy is shit, thus their money is too. And that favors you exchanging.

>>745143789

No. The dollar is backed by its status as the currency which Oil is traded in. The petrodollar. That's what we switched to when we stopped backing it with gold in the 70's. If the petrodollar collapses, or if the dollar becomes disconnected from big oil, it's backed by nothing. What do you think all these wars were about?

>>745144506
philosophically, yes. If hypothetically the US went on default it would reposes some of the private wealth somehow.

>>745144177

What security? There is no security. A fiat currency backed by the economy of a nation state is bound to remain as stable as that nation state's economy. That's security. When some other speculative commodity looks right to the big boys on Wall Street, they'll collectively liquidate billions of dollars of bitcoin sending it plunging to a fraction of its current value. That's the risk involved when you hold an asset that's solely supported by its market cap. That doesn't sound very secure to me. If you honestly believe that btc has intrinsic value show me how it's contributing to its share price. You absolutely can't, because the market cap is the sole pillar holding the cryptos up.

Awesome anons. I think this is the best discussion I've ever seen in /b/.

It's the chinks that fucked everything up. Fucking chinks banning exchanges and shit. We need to stop them from having so much damn control.

>>745144177
Nothing that changes +-10% daily can be used as money. Period.

Companies that accept Bitcoins sell them immediately in the market. They do not stock Bitcoins. The volatility Bitcoin has is unbearable for any legal business.

>>745144658
Is that enshrined in the law? I'm actually not a US citizen, so I'm not that well informed. Or is that the shift from gold backed, to the current system, everybody is talking about?
Seems weird I mean, guns are a commodity bought and sold, they could hence legally repossess guns in a time of economical crises, without changing the law.

>>745144679

The secure transaction of the block chain. It's unhackable, unfalsifiable. So it's impossible to lie or cheat the system. Which means it's secure as a form of data transfer, and since most everything in our world is data driven, it creates security for all data. And data security in an electronic age is a highly valuable and practical thing

>>745144853

For now. It's a matter of scale. Like any economy, the more people adopt and use it, the more stable it becomes. That's exactly why it's great for speculation now, but will not be in the future

>>745144913
I'm not US citizen either. I was talking in a phylosophical way as I said. Any country that goes bankrupt takes wealth from individuals.

It's breaking $3500 downwards. So happy to see those cryptofags faces :)

>>745144658

You realize that each US citizen has a STRAWMAN private corporation made in their name to attach physical value to and trade that value on? Each person born InThe US is actually the property of the US and whoever the US owes money to. Our debt can be paid in blood or slavery if need be

>>745145180
All you have to do is hold. Shit like this happens every year when china decides to "ban" markets. All they are doing is playing the market and will buy when it's low, to again sell when it's high. This is how things work, kid.

I told you it is going to go down. I think it stops between 1000 and 2000. When it is low, buy more.

>>745144129
The current economic model works as a whole. Example, your body. Your central point is your brain, but you needs lungs, liver, heart and other stuffs to work. The government always keep and eye in the industry, because a healthy industry creates money, and money created taxes, and taxes helps the country to grow, a growing country creates the conditions to buy, sell and investment, investment created more jobs, jobs created paychecks and paychecks buy stuffs, buying stuffs rocket the industry and industry pay taxes, rinse and repeat.

Then, the money, who currently is not backed up for a precious metal as gold, silver or diamonds or whatever, is backed up for a concept: A growing country, or a healthy body.

Because of this, current money is, indeed, a promise, then it's real value is inflated, and as I said before, that's a good thing, cuz it show to others than the country's economy is growing and healthy

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>>745136700
>The fuck's happening with Bitcoin!! I'm losing all my savings? Where it's gonna a stop!!
welcome to bitcoin
>i bought at $1000/coin
>i'm still at 300% ROI
volatile markets are volatile?
>who woulda guessed.

Key point is why would someone use Bitcoin instead of gold derivatives if it's not for speculative purposes... gold futures can be exchanged instantly.

>>745145412

Kek

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>>745145180
>It's breaking $3500 downwards.
it may drop back down and hover around $2400 like before the big surge.
>i would guess on $3000 (at worst) though based on a lot of people not wanting to sell at that price.

you faggots should invest in iota to become richfaggs

>>745145402
Perfect answer

>>745145581
IOTA is useless shitcoin that won't survive in the long run.

>>745145452

You're mixing present and future. Presently, it is used for speculation because its volatile. Same is true in emerging industries (tech) and economies (dinar). Volatility is good for speculation. As things stabilize in the future for BTC it will be used more as a medium of exchange and less as a medium for speculation

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>>745145402
>backed up for a precious metal as gold, silver or diamonds
those objects value is the same as crypto
>people think their valuable
if you have a bar of gold, but nobody there to verify the serial number, then you may as well have worthless tungsten.

>>745144914

Okay, yeah I understand that's it's complex. I would protest that you should never say never when it comes to the hackability of any tech, but let's assume its perfectly secure from theft, duplication, etc... What does any of that matter when its value can be zero? It's not secure in the sense that there is no finite number of coins that can be produced and almost no barrier to entry. It takes energy to produce a coin sure, but at the end of the day, what has that energy produced? Unlike gold, or silver, or oil, or soybeans, you haven't produced something that has any value on its own.
It relies on other people owning it for its value and as such it will always be highly susceptible to manipulation. That's the antithesis of security.

Going back to your last, I've gotta weigh in on your Google/Amazon comparison. Google and Amazon have business plans to deliver value to their shareholders by creating a profit and grabbing market share respectively. This plays a huge part in their valuations and that intrinsic value is why they are considered investments, not speculative risk assets like Bitcoin.

It is not going to stop..
Bitcoin have always been a currency based upon demand and not by fysical value.

Yes bitcoin techonology have a future, but the coin it self do not.

Reason is VERY simple.
Do you think that all the huge banks and financial system and National states having an interest in a system they cannot control.. NO

So it is pretty obvious that the above have an interst in creating their own, and preventing bitcoin from becomming a success.
They will make their own system, and is currently developing it..

Bit coin is at the moment a bad investment, since it is very volatile and you dont know if it goes up/down since there are no value, but just a fictive virutal coin...

Just saying it maybe go up for a while, but in the end bitcoin will die.
Maybe you get lucky you win your money back, maybe you dont.

>>745145452
From my point of view, Bit Coin is the new black of gold. A rare commodity with limited real application. Yes, there's some places here and there, and businesses using it, but still very limited.

The problem is, if people continued acting in the same way as the previous gold fever, sooner or later BC could devaluated or the government can put laws to regulated it.

>>745145715
haha the long run is what it makes... look which big companie are behind iota faggot

>>745145715

What makes you say this? Seems that something blockchain based will be used in the IOT. If not iota, then something else. So why do you think it's a dud?

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>>745145903
>look which big companie are behind iota faggot
just like HD-DVD?

>>745145963
in this case btc is the hd-dvd...

>>745144914
And if the market decides each bitcoin is worth $0.001, at least you'll have an unhackable, unfalsifiable $0.001.

>>745145741
It may never be used as a medium of payment. Should it exist in the future it will be a very specialized peer-to-peer interchangeable asset.

>>745145963
apart from this iota is a parallel currency, which is intended for machines

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>>745146023
>in this case btc is the hd-dvd..
look at the market value... then tell me that
>Bitcoin's market capital is why it won't disappear overnight.

>>745145813
>Yes bitcoin techonology have a future, but the coin it self do not.
Exactly

Two words. Tulip fever

>>745138597
You're assuming banks will allow BTC deposits which they won't while it remains such a volatile currency

donate plz
18ZresD1QX4WDxrjsW
C7Yb5u7AzeHQjkZL

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it already stabilized. TO THE 10.000 MARK FAGGOTS

>>745146129
remember my words when it's time, but do not start crying

>>745145843
also gold has practical applications, like microchips or satellite solar panels. The only reason gold is not used in more things is its price, but gold is an element with fantastic properties.

Thus, gold has intrinsic value appart of being a medium of payment and wealth storage.

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>>745136700
Don't sell. Honestly its just China being stupid. Been hearing bitcoin will die and crash for years now.

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>>745146026

>>745145903
kek fagget. Maybe they have big companies but the coin has no secure consensus model like bitcoin. it is literally useless shit. no advantage above fiat money.

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>>745146258
>remember my words when it's time, but do not start crying
remember my words when the USD collapses, and Crypto booms like dynamite

>>745145743
>those objects value is the same as crypto
>Taking piece of a whole sentence to have a point, missing the whole concept

kek

>if you have a bar of gold, but nobody there to verify the serial number, then you may as well have worthless tungsten.
Gold without a serial number is still gold, and if you don't know how valuable tungsten is, you're very ignorant. Double kek.

Thanks for the laughter, Anon.

If you can't stomach the drops your in the wrong game. I'm down 33k since last week and i'm not sweating it.

>>745146333
remember my words when it's time, but do not start crying

>>745146129
Bitcoin market cap is ridiculous, don't be so naive, some billion dollars worldwide is nothing

>>745146349
>Gold without a serial number is still gold,
it's not worth the same you paid for it if it needs to be melted down, and nobody will accept it as payment unless it has been verified as gold by a third party.
>it's like you giving a USD to someone after the United States no longer uses them.

>>745146282
I tip my hat to you, bro

>>745146431
>some billion dollars worldwide is nothing
for now. it will grow. it used to be nothing.

>>745146282
>gold has intrinsic value appart of being a medium of payment and wealth storage.
yes, but without the certfication process for gold bars/coins they aren't worth nearly as much due to nobody trusting that it's actual pure gold

>>745136700
David Seaman BTFO

>>745146026

Kek.. and you know if it did dip that low and the reward for solving a block shot up to 300 coins, there would still be jackasses pouring energy into the so-called mining with delusional hopes of it rising to thousands per coin again.

>>745146455
there's a little mark-up for bars and coins, but not higher than 2-5%... not that much of an issue when talking about wealth keeping.

>>745146558
... what I am saying is
>why would I take your gold bar unless someone can verify that it's pure gold?
>i have no real use for your gold
>i would rather have ammo/food/fuel

>>745146376
>I have no clue how crypto currencies work or why they have become a thing

IOTA is just marketing no technology.

>>745136700
So you invested in a meme currency that only has value because a bunch of virgins on the internet believed it did?

>>745146535
anyone can test the purity of your gold in 10 sec. I assure you if you get there with a kilo you'll get 95-97% of its market value.
If it's just an ounce probably just 85-90%

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>>745146675
>IOTA is just marketing no technology.
i don't care 1 IOTA

>>745146711
>anyone can test the purity of your gold in 10 sec.
anyone
>anyone
so in a SHTF situation who is going to check it?

>>745146701
t. goldman sachs shill
theyre on /biz/ working overhours, not surprised that theyre on here too

>>745146711
>I assure you if you get there with a kilo you'll get 95-97% of its market value.
>market value
which is completely dependent on 3rd party certification of gold

>>745146665
OK, now I see, you say in person-to-person transactions... well Probably nobody would trade in gold unless they have with them the chemical kit to try it which is 10-20$
Gold wouldn't be used for small transactions. For big ones maybe.

>>745146675
believe what you want

>>745146804
this>>745146856

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>>745146856
yes. I am talking about crypto vs gold.
>if the dollar shits so does the infrastructure
if you are trying to survive a service-less situation nobody would care if you have gold.
>they will care if you have useful goods to trade.

>>745136700
>savings
Top kek, bitcoin is not savings. It's called investments, and in this case, extremely speculative bubble investments. You deserve to lose everything.

>>745145914
IOTA does not use a blockchain.

When you want to make distributed money, all participants in the system must agree on who has how much money.

IOTA does not provide a secure mechanism for distributed consensus. This makes it useless.

>>745146961
in that mad-max scenario I doubt anyone would rely in crypto either.

Nobody is talking about the fact that without supervision Bitcoin markets are heavily manipulated by big players.

>>745147102
>rely in crypto either.
exactly. so the only real argument for gold is an investement/store of value. same as crypto just less volatile.
>mad max eh? life can come at you fast.
https://www.thesurvivalistblog.net/bosnia-war-survivor-warns-collapse-america/

>>745147382
no, gold has intrinsic value, crypto has not

>>745146783
How much did you lose, anon? When do you think it will bottom and bounce back?

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>>745147446
>gold has intrinsic
can you eat it? build shelter from it? cure disease with it? no, it has value to those who think it has value.

>>745147554
as I said earlier you use it to build microchips, satellite solar panels,... 1/3 of the world's gold is used in industy. it has obvious value.

>>745147458
I already sold. Lost +$50,000

>>745136700
Where is a good online place to buy bitcoin ? I want to get into the exchange practice but never really knew how to just get into it

>>745147780
Got your cardboard box ready?

>>745147742
But its intrinsic value is like 1$ per kilo gram if at all. Most of its value is just speculation and faith.

Money does not need to have intrinsic value.

>>745136700
Hope all etherium fags suffer the same fate so we gamers can finally own a graphic card

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>>745136700

IT'S NOT GOING TO STOP!!!

>>745147554
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gold

Check the section "Other applications" for enlightenment, and make yourself a favor and go back to school, you're not ready yet for the real world

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>>745147742
>as I said earlier you use it to build microchips, satellite solar panels
... normal stuff that would be relevant after a societal collapse?
>otherwise the value is simply pegged at market value
>i.e. whatever someone is willing to trade for it

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>>745148374
y did you buy during a surge?

>>745148287
Are you sugesting that gold would be less valuable not than paladium, platinum, etc... but even to iron or aluminum if it wasn't for speculation?!?!?! 0_o

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>>745136700

Many groups of people here.

1. Idiots who don't understand Blockchain/non-theoretical economics.

2. Idiots who invested in Bitcoin and are confused by the drop.

3. Idiots with a little clue, dramatically parodying #2 (pretty sure this is OP).

4. People trying to argue with all of the above.

5. Folks who think Bitcoin is on sale.

>>745148504
after a societal collapse nothing electronic would be reliable. Gold... perhaps.

>>745148368
They will. People are pouring in because they think it'll be a bitcoin#2. It's just a "me too" speculation. If a cryptocurrency can be worth something then there can be only one. Otherwise there can be 10, 100, 1000 currencies, each created by "mining" and with a maximum number

i bought 33 bitcoin at 89$ and sold all at 770$. imagne how i felt when it went to 4k+ , then bought 15 more at ~500ish and my best friend from high school (works at department of defense in network security in Maryland hes the guy that got me interested in bitcoin at the time) he asked me to send him all my bitcoin because he had a new trading bot that would trade alt coins he said he would send them back in a month with an additional 10% bitcoin. well i sent him all my bitcoin and he never spoke to me again.

I'm considering monopoly mone as an alternative.

>>745148813
I'd rather have a watch than a bar of gold.

>>745148708
yeah probably. We have tons of gold but only need very little for our technology.

Iron and aluminum on the other hand we need for nearly every modern thing we build.

>>745148868
If investing in Bitcoin is stupid... investing in other cryptocurrencies is other level.

At least Bitcoin people talk about a future in which it becomes dominant worldwide, unprobable, but OK... but WTF, if there are endless cryptocurrencies none can ever reach that state!

>>745148975
I would gladly trade my watch for your bar of gold when the time comes.

>>745136700
I called this a year or so ago,

The min they allowed evictions to become fractional devalued the money.

It went from being worth something based off demand, to having infinite currency.

Infinite currency is worthless.

>>745148993
We don't have tons of gold. All the gold extracted EVER fits in a 20 meter square cube!

It has been rehused and rehused for all humanity.

>>745148504
After societal collapse bitcoins will don't have any value too. We will return to exchange valuable and physical objects for others. Virtual ones don't have any kind of place in that kind of world.

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>>745149327
>After societal collapse bitcoins will don't have any value too.
that's my point. gold isn't worth what u paid for it if shit hits the fan
so, gold is only really valuable because our society values it. however it's not a great investment since it's just a store of value; a hedge against inflation.
>So saying crypto is le dumb but gold is the answer is naive

>>745149327
+1

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>>745149176
Err... a 20 meter cube would be about 170,000 tones. That cube would also be the size of a 6 story office block.

>>745136700
and by "your savings" you mean "all the money I had less than 2 months ago and decided to buy bitcoin with"

>>745149463
gold has been used over and over as a currency or means of payment by people from different cultures without contact.

Of course you cold trade in any other physical thing, but gold is scarce, in doesn't deteriorate, it can be divided and rejoined without a loss. It has great properties.
And also it is easily transformable.

>>745148993
I would speculate that if society did collapse and we are down to bartering essentials, if I had bullets and wheat to spare and wanted some oil, but you had cloth but no oil and wanted bullets, it wouldn't take long before a non-forgable neutral trading medium would appear - a bit like gold.

It wouldn't be leaves; pace the Golgafrinchams

>>745149647
too bad I cant send it over the internet huh?

>>745149176
kek. 20m3 of gold are literally hundreds of thousands of tons of gold.

>>745149647
It's utility goes down with inflation, you can't practically divide a bar into billions of pieces.

>>745149615
There have been estracted approximately 12,780 tonnes of gold in human history.
Gold is a very dense material, it's not water.

The usual ingots you see in the government's vaults are between 30-40 kg

>>745149733
BBC: How much gold is there in the world?
http://www.bbc.com/news/magazine-21969100

>>745149327
Salt.

>>745149710
I don't think the internet will be top of your worry list if the shit does hit the fan, unless you think googling "how can I make fire with two sticks" is a viable survival tactic

>>745149934
For some time in the US tobacco was used as currency after independence from UK, but it had a problem: it deteriorates. Moreover, there are different qualities.

>>745149964
im not investing my money into anything for "when shit hits the fan" because when it does, I die
bitcoin best use case it to buy stuff on the internet. if they get transaction fee under control, it fulfills that task. You can make the same argument about Paypal having no value, but it does.

>>745149832
It's 19.3g/cm^3.

The basic attributes of chemical elements are well known. You probably had to do calculations with them in school to pass Chemistry.

>>745148883
lol

>>745149463
You missed all the points where someone told you gold have other applications. Bit coins only have one: Currency, not more, not less.

Then, you not only don't even understand how the current economic model works and pick up isolated sentences to look smart, even when everyone noticed how you missed all the points

Next, you used a lot of post apocalyptic scenarios were, actually, gold will have more value that crypto currency. Gold is still a physical object, a precious metal and have lots of more applications than "currency"

And, at last, you put a random unfunny pics that make you look even more retarded.

You don't have, I dunno, a color book to end or something? Summer is ending and you need to go back to school

>>745149914
Did I say something else?

170 000 tons are hundreds of thousand of tons aren't they?

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>>745148883
kek

>>745150353

Actually that's just one hundred thousand, plus seventy thousand. That is a single "hundred thousand", for the plural "hundreds of thousands" you would need at least two hundred thousand. Obviously.

>>745150199
You're an idiot if you think bicoin and PayPal are comparable. One is a wanabee currency, the other is just a form of escrow using established currencies

>>745149934
Or water. Kevin Costner showed us how valuable the water will become in the future

>>745150540
Scale - established
Pedantry - established

>>745150563
> not comparable
He compared their value.
Everything has a value attribute.

>>745150540
Well it is 1.7 hundreds of thousands.

When I did the calculation I came up with 1.5 million tons. I messed up counting the digits obviously, sue me.

>>745138843
never invest more than you are willing to lose.

>>745149647
>Of course you cold trade in any other physical thing, but gold is scarce, in doesn't deteriorate, it can be divided and rejoined without a loss. It has great properties.
>And also it is easily transformable.
i agree. but it won't be worth what you paid for it. if a gold coin would buy u a sack of corn now it might buy you an ear of corn once the markets that sell gold are dead.

>>745148883
yeah i had to buy the 15 at 500~ish over 3 days because coinbase changed and you could only buy a maximum of like 5 bitcoin a day (up to 3000$) but it averaged out to like 550 per coin

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Mfw net worth 200k less than yesterday

>>745150774
what if he's a jew who can't let go even a single shekel?

>>745150720
Apart from its market capitalisation, PayPal is worth nothing.

Actually, that is the same as bitcoin. Not the same as the currencies that are used on PayPal, though

>>745150933
not sure. Nowadays almost nobody has gold, and in that scenario they may need it. IF it became the money it would need to represent the actual wealth in that moment (whatever it would be)

It could be lower or higher, it depends on the wealth it would represent.

>>745136700
just a dip bro, just a dip. or maybe the end of this ponzi shit finally

>>745150933
Depends how much corn there is about

>>745150774
> never gamble more than you are willing to lose.

FTFY. Some investments have a very high likelihood of providing a return on investment over time, such as index funds.

>>745151162
>ponzi

I hope that's bait.

>>745138843
buy high, sell low. always works. how much did you spend?

>>745150758
Final notice before commencing legal action.

Our credit terms stipulate full payment of 170,000 tons of gold within 14 days and this account is now 1 day overdue.

If the full amount of the sum outstanding, as set out above, is not paid within 7 days of the date of this letter, we will begin legal action, without warning, for a court order requiring payment.

We may also commence insolvency proceedings. Legal proceedings may affect any credit rating. The costs of the legal proceedings and any other amounts which the court orders, must also be paid, in addition to the debt.

This letter is being sent to you in accordance with the Practice Direction on Pre-Action Conduct (the PDPAC) contained in the Civil Procedure Rules which stipulates that you should acknowledge receipt of this notice within 14 days. The court has the power to sanction your continuing failure to respond.

The amount outstanding can be paid as follows: Bitcoin / Gold Ounces

We await your immediate payment of the outstanding amount.

Yours sincerely,

Anon

>>745142771
It's really just backed by a promise. People trust the dollar because they feel the US is less likely to default than say Greece or Spain.

>>745151281
$350,000

>>745148797
just a dip bro, just a dip

>>745151269
>I hope that's bait.
Of course, bitcoin will have value as long as heroin dealers and North Korea need to launder money. That's not scammy.

>>745151154
I think you'll find most diversified portfolios have some gold. And money floods into it at times of instability

>>745151363
prove it

>>745142961
"I work in finance"

>cashier at Walmart

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>>745148883
>i sent him all my bitcoin and he never spoke to me again.
i had to wrestle with a mostly defunct trading platform for over a month just to transfer my BTC out.
>at least I got mine back

>>745151381
I cashed out and was waiting for the dip. I don't watch it too closely though.

>>745151392
>That's not scammy.

Well, at least it's not ponzi

>>745151319
>The amount outstanding can be paid as follows: Bitcoin / Gold Ounces

Address?

>>745151392
pretty much! question is, what is the right value for it if you are right, and you are... Dark market has use for it only, nobody else really... it was a scam from the beginning.

>>745151471
top kek

and also seems to be very true.

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>>745151191
>Depends how much corn there is about
then gold would be even less valuable if there is a food shortage

>>745151154
>It could be lower or higher, it depends on the wealth it would represent.
exactly its a store of wealth against currency, but as currency itself it won't be worth what it is as a commodity in a market economy.

>>745151796

It is not and never was a scam.

Someone just thougt "this different kind of money could be useful to some" and it has proven to be.

The high price we see at the moment is a result of speculation of course and does not reflect the current use of Bitcoin.

But it is not a fraud or a scam or a ponzi scheme. It is an actually useful thing that is being hyped ad nauseam at the moment.

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>>745151796
>>745151392
Sorry guys but Monero has that covered now. Who in their right mind is going to conduct criminal operations on a public blockchain? Bitcoin is destined to die.

>>745151796
You can send money to someone else in your own country (bank account to bank account) with a few taps wherever you are, it's fast and easy.

Sending money around the world is costly and slow though. That's how remittance companies exist.

>>745152362

>what is a mix network.

But I agree that monero is one of the most promising coins at the moment.

Nontheless: destined to die is an exaggeration.