>>736587042 ALLLLLLRIGHT now heres whatcha gotta do. You listening? Now listen realllll close. All ya gotta do is an aportion at 105 months since conception. The religious right and the alt-right wont be mad cause you killed a faggot. The left can't be mad cause they support abortion. If the left tries and tell you that it wasn't a fetus just say that you identified him as a fetus and who are they to push their bigoted values onto you.
>>736587813 >If my son wanna be gay - fine by me. >Trans? fine by me. (as long as it's not because of a trend) >But I will never let a child, an 8yo child put up ridiculous make up like that. (Boy or a girl). I don't want him to be shamed, or to wake up one day feeling regret.
I'd agree. It's a bit young to encourage something so extreme perhaps. Check out the other comments though.
>>736587042 I'd think dressing up and even yes occasionally putting make-up on is a normal part of growing up. If he wanted to leave the house like that I'd have to make sure he knew the consequences ie that he would get fucking brutally picked on, if he still wants to do it it might have to be a lesson he learns first hand.
If it wasn't just dressing up and he wanted to transition... Jesus. I wouldn't let him wear make-up regularly, same as I wouldn't with a daughter. I disagree with people who let their kids take opposite hormones, it's so fucked up when they're young and could change their mind. But if he wanted to live as a girl why the fuck not? And when he's a bit older and puberty starts, if he was still sure, I'd let him take hormone blockers, because that doesn't cause irreversable changes. But I'd NEVER let him take the hormones themselves, not until he's 18. It's too risky if he changes his mind a few years in and suddenly he's a boy with C-cups at 16, fuck that.
>>736587042 >>736587280 How much you wanna bet that if someone painted their 8 yer old daughter like this, that the internet would blow up? People would call it disgusting, that you shouldn't make a girl that young look like a cheap hooker or that it's sending the wrong impression (like Barbie does because it sets an "unrealistic standard of beauty") But no this is ok becuase he's a boy
>>736589683 Without the sexual connotation you can't be a "transgender", dude, you're just playing dress up.
If you're using "transgender" as a way to describe someone, you're automatically making a statement about their sexuality.
If you can make a statement about someone's sexuality, how in the FUCK can ANYONE imply this person in question can't possibly understand sex?
You can't be a homosexual, transsexual, or whatever the fuck, if you're not sexually mature to understand sexual attraction, for fuck's sake. What the fuck is the problem with people these days? Holy shit.
>>736589917 Not who you replied to, but I've seen this argument in other threads about this too. For me it's the difference between being able to 'understand' what sexual attraction is but not being old enough to consent to sex. You say you can't be trans and not mentally able to consent to sex, and I think you're (sort-of) right. I don't think the kind of transition an adult would have (hormones and surgery) is EVER appropriate for a child, if my kid was trans I wouldn't let them do either until they were 18. But if they want to live as the other gender, dress and identify that way, I'm not going to stop them.
Keeping up with your analogy regarding sex, this is like how we usually don't chastise children for kissing each other or calling each other boyfriend/girlfriend, even if they're too young to have sex and we wouldn't let them have sex.
>>736587042 Tell that fucking faggot to match his color scheme, actually get a decent hairstyle, and get a new fucking shirt if he's gunna try to do his makeup and look super gay like that. My kid isn't gunna suck at being fabulous if he's trying that hard.
>>736590419 Lol, being transgender doesn't mean you have to "mutilate" your genitalia. You can identify as whatever you want with whatever genitals you have. It's 2017, no one gives a fuck what you do.
>>736590502 Oh good, no longer am I embarrassed to identify as a gay woman of color I'm so sick of people telling me I'm a straight white man, it's so oppressing When will people learn that my feelings disproves biology?
>http://www.transawareness.org/what-is-the-difference-between-transgender-and-transsexual.html What Is The Difference Between Transgender And Transsexual? Sometimes transsexual is used to imply that a person has or desires to have some sort of gender affirmative surgery, while transgender is sometimes used as an umbrella term in the same way that trans* is used on this website. (Cooper, 112) Like many other words, the specific meanings transgender and transsexual vary with time, location, and the individual. Before assuming that someone uses any word to identify their gender, it is respectful to ask them which words they use to identify their gender.
The argument has been made that the difference between transgender and transsexual lies in making a distinction between gender (culture/performance) and sex (bodies/biology).* On the contrary, Transgender rights activist and lawyer Dylan Vade claims there is no "meaningful difference" between sex and gender and any definition "that pit biology against psychology or the body against the mind...denigrates transgender peoples self-identified genders."
>>736590744 Now that's an interesting point; I'm pro-trans rights, and I read this controversial article about trans-racialism. It makes some good points. Basically I can't think of a single argument against it that doesn't also qualify to many trans people, so I think why the fuck not let people do it?
Here's the article if anyone's interested: http://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/10.1111/hypa.12327/full
>>736590903 Just because you keep changing the goalpost to make your argument sound better when someone starts poking inconsistencies in your claims it doesn't mean you're right, it means you're a dishonest cunt.
>>736590958 Well we have people not only being transgender, but transage as well? >http://www.dailymail.co.uk/femail/article-3356084/I-ve-gone-child-Husband-father-seven-52-leaves-wife-kids-live-transgender-SIX-YEAR-OLD-girl-named-Stefonknee.html How long until i can be transethnic? Or transspecies?
>>736591164 Kids can't change their sex, adults can't. Sex is biological, it's the chromosomes you're born with, even the biggest trans-activists in the world would admit you can't change sex.
I may be being pedantic here, you may have meant change gender. I sort of agree with you in my post. The point I make is that kids can't have sex or fully transition (hormones or therapies) until they're old enough. But we don't punish kids for kissing or calling each other boyfriend/girlfriend, we just (try) to stop them fucking. This is like how we can let kids dress and identify as the other gender, but we have to stop them making permanent changes like hormones or surgery.
>>736591287 kek trans-age would have to have it's limitations, I'd have felt 18 from the minute I started drinking at 13 if it would have gotten me beer. Trans-ethnic is similar to trans-racial, and happens to an extent now (people who had an ancestor 5 generations+ ago born in Ireland and they're 'Irish', people marrying Mexicans who speak Spanish at home and end up feeling Mexican).
Trans-species, if someone wanted to go full Kyle's dad from South Park and get doplhin surgery, why the fuck not as long as it's not at public expense. But I'm a libertarian and my main course of action in any situation is 'let people do what the fuck they want as long as they don't hurt others', so I'm not unbiased here.
>>736591482 >How can kids fuck if they don't understand sex? ... they can't. But most kids have a basic idea of what sex is (penis in vagina) from a surprisingly young age, and those basics of sex (and the ability to get erect, which I had from 10) are unfortunately all you need to know to fuck. I said kids SHOULDN'T have sex until they're old enough to fully know and appreciate the complexities and consequences of sex, but you can't watch young teenagers 24/7 and so all parents can do is TRY to stop them fucking.
>>736591382 >wanting to be the opposite gender despite not understanding what makes the opposite gender different In case you don't know what that is, the answer is: genitals, the organ that defines your sex and it's purpose is solely for procreation How can a boy want to be a girl without knowing that girls have vaginas and what a vagina does?
>>736591842 I wouldn't know the frequency it happens enough to say it's definitely happening right now, but it does happen. Youngest girl to have a documented pregnancy was 5, she was sexually abused by an older man rather than a kid her age of course, but 10 year olds fucking does unfortunately happen. >>736591838 >How can they understand sex but are still, somehow, unable to tell whether they WANT to have sex or not, then? I've tried comparing it to the trans issue as you and others have, but you're not understanding me so I'll switch tack:
Kids usually understand eating, and they often understand sex. They usually know when they WANT food, and by the time puberty kicks in they know when they WANT to have sex (constantly).
What they usually don't understand is the importance of a balanced diet, the fact you can die from eating too many bananas and how dangerous it is to be fat. Just like they often don't understand the true risks of pregnancy, or the true consequences of young parenthood (a fun drinking game is watching 16 and Pregnant/Teen Mom and drinking every time someone says 'I didn't know how hard this would be', you'll be wasted). They often don't understand that HIV is a lifelong illness which will cause huge complications for their entire life plans. So that's why responsible parents don't let their kids fuck or eat whatever they want when they're too young to know better, even if they do understand the basics.
>>736587042 You dont find your son like this. It's a long transition and if you ignore the signs and you rather sit in front of the tv with a beer than spend time and raise him properly then this shit happens
>>736591507 >Get him to Hitler Youth summer camp >Dont mix up with concentration camp >2 Weeks later, hes believing in National Socialism >Get him a Swastika Flag on his 9th birthday >Hes founding a party 9vyears later >He gets elected >He is führer >Im getting arrested next day >I had futa porn on my pc
>Mfw im getting gassed by my own son for being a fag
>>736592447 >So, as long as they understand the risks of unprotected sex they are free to fuck whoever they want, then? As long as they FULLY understand the risks... yes? But I don't mean just knowing 'I have to wear a condom because pregnancy/aids', I mean have a deeper understanding of what they'd do if there was a pregnancy, of the realities of having a kid, knowing it would fuck with their education and general life chances, that the other parent might not stick around no matter how much you say you 'love' each other. I'd argue kids' brains aren't really able to grasp these realities until they reach a certain age and maturity level.
But lets say my hypothetical 15/16 year old wanted to fuck their boy/girlfriend, and for some bizarre reason spoke to me about it first. I'd know my own kid, if me and hypothetical baby-mama thought the kid really did understand all that shit, I might be inclined to just buy them some protection and letting them go at it. But I don't know because it's all hypothetical.
I still think that if someone is below the age of consent (which should be 16 nation wide I think), and they want to have sex with someone over the age, and the age difference is more than 2-3 years, that needs to stay illegal. Kids experimenting with each other is natural, but when someone much older gets involved the kid could be exploited.
>>736592621 He was born female, transitioned to become male and only dates men. >>736592717 Well yes, he's a trans man and a faggot in my opinion. BUT if you call him a faggot for being a man (born female) who fucks men, you can't call trans women (born men) faggots if they want to fuck men. Only one can be gay if you apply any logic to it, so which'll it be?
>>736593118 If you were a man who was attracted to men before the sex change you're still a faggot even if you look like a woman If you're a woman who was attracted to men then had a sex change. you're still a faggot because now you're a man
>>736593152 HAHAA jesus you're amazing at misquoting, here's what I said later in the post: >>I'd argue kids' brains aren't really able to grasp these realities until they reach a certain age and maturity level. I'm not an expert on child development, but based on my memory of growing up even the most mature kid would be at LEAST 14/15 before they are able to fully grasp those things.
>So you're okay with your 6 year old having sex with an adult kek I noticed you also ignored me saying: >I still think that if someone is below the age of consent (which should be 16 nation wide I think), and they want to have sex with someone over the age, and the age difference is more than 2-3 years, that needs to stay illegal.
Like, I don't even know what you're arguing for anymore? I've said I mostly agree with your sex/transition analogy, sex being the equivalent of hormones/surgery (don't let kids do) and kissing/'dating' being the equivalent of dressing/identifying as the other gender (it's mostly harmless and often normal, so why not let them?)
>>736593246 Nah man he's had both breasts removed and takes testosterone (he has quite the beard), not what I'd call a normal girl. >>736593359 ... So, are you saying women CAN transition and become men, but men can't transition and become women?
>>736593511 I'm arguing for SOME consistency in ANY argument.
Anyone being honest and consistent, once in their fucking lives, would be great. Whether you're a pedophile or a gay activist, just be consistent in your position, and stop trying to get everything both ways.
>>736593967 Oh my god like five times I've explained my position on this, I don't know if you understand at this point. If you do get it and still think it's inconsistent tell me why. Here it is;
I AGREE WITH YOU THAT KIDS CAN'T HAVE SEX OR FULLY TRANSITION. In my mind, dressing as the other gender and using those pronouns is like innocent dating and kissing, a way to try to understand gender identity/relationships in a mostly harmless way. Taking hormones and having surgery is like sex, not appropriate for kids (I think letting kids take hormones/have surgery is child abuse).
If you actually understand what I'm saying here but disagree with the position make it clear when you reply.
>>736594461 Fine, we agree. So kids can't 'transition', i.e. take hormones or have surgery, and they can't have sex. But they can date and kiss people, or dress as and identify as the other gender if they want. Glad we could come to an agreement on this.
>>736594634 >identify as the other gender if they want What is this shit supposed to mean?
If you are a boy, you're a FUCKING boy, even if you want to call yourself a girl.
You can't encourage children to live this retarded fantasy just because it's "progressive". If a child "identify" as an 18 year old you are NOT going to allow them to join the military, so why the fuck can they "identify" as another sex and everyone must accept because it's their wish? This is absolutely bullshit.
>>736594799 >If a child "identify" as an 18 year old you are NOT going to allow them to join the military Because there's a risk they'd die in the army fucktard.
And it isn't about 'encouraging' kids to do shit, even accepting parents usually have a hard time coping with all the stigma their kids are likely to face in the future, they aren't going to talk their kid into getting bullied.
The point I'm making is a boy wearing dresses and calling him/herself by a female name and asking people to call him/her 'she' and 'her', if that's what they really want to do and they're prepared for the abuse they're likely to face at school, that's their decision to make ultimately. It doesn't hurt anyone else so let them figure shit out.
>>736595467 >using made up buzzwords Any term from anything in psychology is a buzzword. It's notes taken while listening to the ramblings of mad men. Also, let's take a step back here for a second and recognize that children have no real understanding of sexuality until much later in life. They have no idea what it means to be a man or a woman, so there's no solid foundation to base any claims of being something else.
You can't claim you feel like a woman because you have no idea what a woman feels like. You simply know that you don't feel right. Using children for your social experiments is shameful and this fad is going to leave a lot of really messed up kids in its wake. You should quite frankly be ashamed of supporting this psychotic behavior.
If they wanna be adults and go down the path of self mutilation through surgery, that's their deal. If they wanna walk that path to extremely high suicide rates, that's their deal. But stop abusing these damn kids and poisoning their mind.
>>736595630 You can either be male or female. The exceptions aren't normal, they're dysfunctions, they're NOT NORMAL.
Someone who is born with a deficiency doesn't belong to a "third sex" you fucking moron, since there's no such thing as a "third sex". Those individuals are abnormal, they're deficient, they weren't properly formed, they're NOT normal. STOP trying to imply they make a "third" sex, because no such thing exists in humans.
Kill it with fire, throw it into the swamp, build a castle on top, castle sinks into swamp, rebuild, its sinks, rebuild again, it catches on fire from the fire you started killing the thing, and it also sinks into a swamp, rebuild castle, have another son, betroth him to a chubby girl who's father is really rich, son grows up to be a flaming little songbird anyway, give up on children and castle building altogether and find the meaning of life.
>>736595888 Hahaa where did I say anything about a 'third gender'? Intersex is a medical term, it's not an identity any more than 'diabetic' is an identity. And 'intersex' people ARE technically 'abnormal', after all only around 1 in 2000 people are born with male and female parts, I was just pointing out the use of the word 'intersex' is medically valid here.
You're saying all this shit about 'they weren't properly formed, they're deficient'. I get the point you're making, but you don't actually have prejudice against people who were born with both parts or both chromosomes, do you?
>>736596232 Fuck me, your entire concept of gender is literally just genitals isn't it? Only when people change their genitals, that doesn't count, it's the genitals they're born with? Only if they're born with some of both, they can't consider themselves 'real' men or women, they're just freaks?
Love this quote by the way: >I don't give a fuck about your deficiency. because you seem to give a lot of fucks about how people live their lives and identify, even when it has no impact on your life whatsoever...
>>736596499 Yeah yeah, you think people can't transition and intersex people are just weird, I disagree, we get where we are with that. What I'm asking now is WHY do you give a fuck if some guy decides he wants to identify as female, or vice versa?
>>736587042 Beat his ass a little and tell him not to get involved in commitment requiring or subverting subculture movements. I'd tell him that it's important to be cool inorder get access to the good stuff in life, but it's also important not to be a loser when something new comes along.
You wouldn't tattoo "i'm stupid with ->" on your forhead. Just like you wouldn't go gay just because some manipulative whore tells you so.
The art of not being a retard is knowing how to participate in social movements without commitment or letting them get under your skin.
>>736587280 We don't have them flying cars and cure for cancer because people aren't that smart.
A major part of the population focuses their efforts in subverting others and doing exactly this kind of shit. It just isn't apparent to most people that they are idiots, and in cases where it is they turn it into a lifestyle.
>>736596670 >Boys only turn into faggets when they're mothers turn them that way Most statistics suggest having a deadbeat dad is usually a bigger factor. Don't abandon your son and he's more likely to be straight.
>>736596626 >What I'm asking now is WHY do you give a fuck if some guy decides he wants to identify as female, or vice versa? I don't.
I care when you try to force legislation criminalizing people for refusing to feed into this delusion that men can, somehow, turn into women if they want, because that's what they think they are.
I'm not against people choosing to be gay, I'm against people legally forcing others to take part in a fucking game of pretend just because some gay faggot chopped-off (or wants to chop-off) his penis.
>>736596392 Actually it's X-X and X-Y not your penis that makes you male. You could get disfigured and lose your penis and still be a male. Oh wait, that's kinda what a "sex change" seems to be. How comical.
>>736596818 >I'm not against people choosing to be gay, I'm against people legally forcing others to take part That's a fair point. I agree with you about some laws, I don't think cake-shops or any business should be forced to make a pro-LGBT cake or anything like that. And I don't think we should criminalize free speech or any of that shit, people should be able to say tranny and faggot if they want to. And they wouldn't pass a law saying you HAD to call people by their preferred pro-noun, that would be bullshit.
But core, essential services like seeing them at ER and letting them rent apartments or use the disabled toilet to avoid a kick-off, if a law protected those rights for trans people, you still wouldn't have to 'feed into' the delusion, you just couldn't deny them basic services.
>>736596893 Yeah not my argument that genitals are what determines gender, that guy was hung up on it. I agree that it's chromosomes that determine biological sex, but gender identity is sometimes more complicated.
Yeah. I'm sure the kid had NO influence from his parents. Father assumed dead. He just woke up one day and wanted to get made up. No "encouragement" from his likely fat ass lefty overbearing mother. Get him in a room with a caring counselor, and ask him if it was totally his choice that he wanted to do this. If not. Abuse.
>>736597275 >Who the fuck is stopping anyone from being attended at the ER? It was decades ago, but I'm thinking of Tyra Hunter specifically, a trans woman who died in a car crash because both EMS and ER staff refused to give her the treatment she needed. It's the rare, worst case scenario, but even one death is too fucking many.
>That's the owner's decision. He rents to whomever the fuck he wants to rent. Fucking bullshit. Housing is a basic necessity, meaning people need access to places to live on the private market. They can't all stay in the projects. Speaking of, if you think landlords should be able to turn away anyone they want, how do you feel about public housing? Because a lot more people will end up living there if they have no private options.
Glad you agree on the disabled toilets thing, most trans-activists tend to scream at me for that one but I think it's just the best way to avoid confrontation. And a law protecting civil rights isn't a lefty pipe-dream, can you imagine ANY Republican proposing we scrap the Civil Rights Act?
If liberals cared that young children are being prevented from becoming trans they would have started with shit like black kids being beaten for it and not trying to spoon-feed the narrative to the white middle class. You wouldn't bat an eyelash if a black boy was beaten for playing pokemon yet you feel the need to encourage my son to become something even you admit is a disadvantageous and dangerous identity?
>Son you can't be openly trans because someone might rape or kill you
See? I can even use your narratives and still be right. Hell I wouldn't care what my son wanted to be as long as he realizes he's white and what that means now. If he joins the liberal world he'll be at the bottom of every pecking order that's to be had. Seriously, why should anyone let anyone they love who is white be near you racists?
>>736597674 >landlords should be able to turn away anyone they want Yes.
>how do you feel about public housing? I don't think you should get something you can't afford. Charity is a good solution for the problems with housing, but forcing people to pay for other people to survive just doesn't ring as "compassionate" to me. I'm all for fostering independence and helping people to provide for themselves, but tax payer money shouldn't be wasted on able bodied people just because they want it.
>Because a lot more people will end up living there if they have no private options. If literally no one wants to rent you a place to live, then maybe you should consider changing a few things about yourself.
>>736598165 >tax payer money shouldn't be wasted on able bodied people just because they want it. kek I had a feeling you wouldn't be keen on public housing. Your idiotic idea that landlords should be able to turn away whomever they want, if enough landlords did that the government would have no choice but to house vast swathes of the population, many of whom can afford private rent and shouldn't be entitled to public housing. >If literally no one wants to rent you a place to live, then maybe you should consider changing a few things about yourself. If literally the only reason they're turning you away is because you're trans, then other people can fuck right off, why should people not dress and live the way they want out of fear of being homeless?
>>736587042 Tell him he's too young to wear make-up, the same way I'd tell my 8 year old daughter. If you can't be comfortable without painting yourself up like an adult prostitute, them you're just gonna have to wait until you're out of my house to feel comfortable.
>>736597275 >As long as grown men can't just enter the women's bathroom Anon, if someone is willing to commit rape, a little sign isn't going to stop them. What are you going to do, install a vagina scanner into every bathroom door? Or hire bouncers who could keep women from entering the women's bathroom, just because they look "too manly"?
>>736599109 It fucking does though you dumbcunt. Not the world, governments. Police, EMT's, fire service, education until 18, medical care if you're really poor, cheap housing if you're really poor. Libraries, infrastructure like roads, bridges and tunnels. There are so many things that the government provides for it's citizens, the right to a fucking roof over your head is a big one.
Obviously they kick people out of even public housing tenancies if they steal from others in the building, or deal from their apartments or shit like that. But if someone isn't breaking any laws or hurting anyone else they do have a fucking right to a place to live, the government owes them that if they can't afford private. And if they can afford private then the government owes them access to private apartments, enshrined in law if it needs to be.
>>736599977 How about food? You forgot to mention food. Does the government also owes its citizens food? How about clothing? Let's not forget transport, and entertainment. Those should be legit government obligations, don't you agree, comrade?
>>736600552 >Does the government also owes its citizens food? Well, yeah, food-stamps already exist if people are poor enough. >Let's not forget transport I did mention transport, who the fuck do you think maintains the roads? >entertainment Hell fucking NO. Entertainment is a medium people can use to criticize repressive governments, that belongs in the private sector. >How about clothing? You joke, but I have British family and poor people with kids in the UK do get a school uniform allowance, even the conservative government hasn't scrapped it. It's not a bad idea, I mean uniforms are stupid but a school clothing allowance would be helpful for poorer kids...
>>736587042 This is why I'm fine with getting older. If guys look like this for the next 10-30 years, young women are gonna be desperate for cock that doesn't come with a demi-queer otherkin nametag (AKA a male).
He's 8 so he confused so its not too late.. Let him play Dead or Alive games and stop covering his eyes and shit everytime he sees a naked girl or something instead of being a idiot putting him in a all boys school and shit
>>736596793 It's kinda what i meant when the fathers not around to teach his son how to be a proper man the mother imposes feminine traits to him. Molestation is definitely a factor not always but theres certainly data to show this.
>>736605160 Ah fair point pal. I don't think the mother always 'imposes' it on the lad, lots of mothers don't like the gays either. I think it's more about the kid only having female role models, or at least only living with women and no grown men, boy grows up not even knowing how men are.
I think you're spot on with the molestation thing though
>>736597018 I only argue its nurtured condition and I would be fine if children were left out of it. There are mothers basically indoctrinating boys as young as 2 yrs old as transgender because, he told me "mommy im a girl". You cant expect a child to develope normally when there basically groomed to be transgender.
>>736605459 I just call bullshit on a lot of that. I've never known a parent 'indoctrinate' or 'groom' their kids into being transgender, in fact a lot of parents who are accepting and don't give a fuck when it's someone else's kid, tend to freak out when it's their kid they're picturing getting bullied, left out and just generally treated like shit by a lot of people during their lives. I don't think any parent would really want that for their kid, let alone push it on them. I know there are narcissistic parents who make shit all about them, but I've never heard of a case of one of them pressuring a kid to be transgender.
>boys as young as 2 yrs old as transgender because, he told me "mommy im a girl" See, this just... I dunno, most parents of trans kids don't tell it like that, they tell horrible stories that I've heard from friends, about trying to cut their genitals off when they were young, crying every time they had to wear a dress, shit like that. I don't think any parents let their kids crossdress and identify as the opposite gender just because they expressed a little curiosity.
>>736587042 Yuk, poof kids are the worst. Atleast adult gays know they love cock, that little tossers balls ain't even dropped and the closest to an erect dick he's seen is his dads after he pulls it out of him mum.
Serious question here though. Would a hard, violent and truly unloving incestral ass fucking turn a 8 year old faggot wannbe girl thing back into a normal boy? Like overdosing him on the ugly side of being a queer so he snaps out of it.
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