> "dumb liberals getting useless degrees and into debt

>>730167895

Bump so anons don't fall for the meme.

>>730167895
nah, you're just a fucking loser if you got a chem E degree and can't get a job. you probably have a shit personality. people don't want a fucking jackass working for them.

>>730168121
you can't bump your own thread until someone else does, retard. so I'm going to sage so it still doesn't bump.

engineer the future of the white breed

ensure our dominance and our survival

if you can master chemical engineering it should be cake. godspeed

I feel the same way. Going to school for illustration and have to deal with the 'lol, starving artist' shit. Average starting salary for a concept illustrator is around $60k, and most comic artists charge about $900 per-page for basic inks... not to mention covers and color work.

>>730168317

You're right anon, we should encourage more people to go into art school/film school type stuff because engineering doesn't pay.

Higher education is great if you just get out of highschool then commit and finish with anything.

I dicked around trying to find what was logical. No matter what I suggested I try learning others would suggest it was a bad idea, but in the end I didnt finish with a BA and ended up in labor work force.

>>730168317
post work so we can tell you if you have a future or are wasting your time.

> most comic artists charge about $900 per-page for basic inks

cmon man. making it as a comic artist is hard as fuck. Same with illustration. small market, insane competition.

I can't tell are you saying the comic artists have it easy?

Source. I actually hire illustrators as an art director.

>>730167895
Im a manger at a gas station ill hire you op

>>730168234
Chemical engineer = DOW chemical employee.

Understand what you signed up for, you'll be in a factory for the rest of your life.

>>730167895
calling bullshit on this whole thing, everyone I know with an arts degree is FUBAR.

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>>730168416
Fukkin kek

>>730167895
>> kids who majored in gender role psychology and race-mixing studies are now earning 90k as social media "engineers" or some shit

you don't understand how this works, and I bet you can't point to 2 people you know who do this for a living. I'm guessing maybe 1 person told you about it?

>>730168453
bad ideas = anything without a specific place of employment or job lined up.

If you say, hey I want to go be a mechanic, I'm going to go work in one of the thousand garages around and make a reasonable living.... Most won't say anything.

>>730168453
you can go back later if you need it. how old are you?

>dual undergraduate degree
>masters degree
>graduated at top of my class
>multiple internships
>went on to own and manage my own company
>eventually sold company
>thought it would be easy to get a new job

One year later and I'm still unemployed while I see absolutely unqualified morons around me landing 6 figure jobs. This job market is fucked.

>>730168416
Not saying that it's for everyone. Faaaar too many people go to art school and end up jobless and in debt - you need to be top of your fucking game to make it in this industry. Still, there's a stigma that there are no jobs out there - which, if you've ever played a videogame, read a magazine, or owned a product with a logo, you'll know is untrue. Engineering is vital, though - would never say that it isn't.

>>730168751
I dont really agree. I wish I got a degree in anything cause I could fall back on labor like I did anyway. Having a degree shows you are reliable and can commit to learning new things.

Also I dont know how people go into debt. I didnt pay a dime for school and didnt take a single loan out. I just used grants which covered the entire cost. Even when I finally flunked out of school I was able to prove I at least attended class and kept my grants.

>>730168936
employers aren't going to hire you if they think you're going to bail on them.

Being overqualified is a thing

>>730169063
Minority detected

>>730167895

if you're studying anything other than for reasons of genuine passion or interest you're a fucking loser, empty shell of a human.

>i want to make lots of money working a Job i hate for the rest of my life

>>730169152

Who says I hate my major?

>>730169152
I allready do that and I graduated from highschool. Sometimes a passion is better left as a hobby.

>>730167895
>get degree in chemical engineering
thats bs. most pharmaceutical and extract industry is in need of people. you are shit in your field if you cant find a job.

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>>730168454
Age 18. No formal art training cause shitty underfunded public highschool. I know I'm shit rn, but after 4 years at one of the top art schools out there, hoping to be not-shit enough to get a job.

>>730169063
>Having a degree shows you are reliable and can commit to learning new things.

So does having a solid work history. Hiring some punk straight out of college who has no work history is a gamble

>>730168936
start a new company? what are your degrees in? where do you live?

>>730169150
I'm so fair skinned I will probably get skin cancer.

>>730168825
26 and I graduated with an AA in liberal arts at a community college at 20. I tried uni last fall and I am out of practice with school and community college is ridiculously easy compared to real university. I should have just gone to university right away. Fuck the meme of community college is cheaper. Get financial aid, get grants and you go and do well straight out of high school when you still remember how to succeed at school.

>>730169340
art director guy here. I would never hire someone first 2-3 years out of college - unless they had some prior work experience... basically proving they can

>show the fuck up
>get along with management
>not be primadonna art prick

>>730169480
what does the BA get you that the AA didn't?

adapting back to school is hard - but I used to teach older students and they tended to do better than the younger ones. less brilliant / A's, but far less Ds and Fs. The older ones only did poorly if they had serious life shit going on ( divorce, medical problem, etc )

I think that there are a lot of good art degrees. Glass-blowing, for example, is an ultra-specialized skill that is really only taught at art school. Labs need custom glassware all the time....... not to mention the demand for bongs, pipes, etc. Know a guy who makes 85k a year by doing that.

>>730169713
I did liberal arts because people encouraged me to get core courses out of the way then specialize. When it came time to transfer schools and pick a major the only way I'd graduate on time in 2 years is if I picked an art or science. I couldnt do engineering with out at least an extra year or more and was getting exhausted of school. Once I started working I really wanted to focus on that instead.

liberal arts is basically a highschool degree. Its nothing. If you are only going to get an associates specialize in anything.

I dont know any trades other than driving and manual labor, but I'd rather pick up a trade like plumbing than go back to school at this point.

>>730170132
i know some pretty wealthy plumbers lol. what about something like construction management? basically get into the trades, but at a higher level.

There are also a lot of bad art degrees. Fine-arts stuff like painting is a huge gamble unless you are really, really good at it. Commercial art is where it's at. I personally chose illustration over animation because I simply like it a bit better, but both are good so long as you have talent, a solid portfolio, a good attitude, and drive. Also, avoid private American art unis. RISD is something like $250,000 for all 4 years - artists make money, but not that kind of money. Go to a state uni or Canada.

>>730168555
literally no. people need to stop talking out their asses here.

plenty of available opportunities for chem engineers, my sister has a desk job currently as one.

>>730170622
Pretty much. My cousin is an architect who just graduated a few years ago. Works at firm designing layouts for office buildings. Other grads get to build parks and bridges. Lots of variety. A lot of it comes down to luck, I think

>>730169359

Management and Marketing. Not STEM, but still not basket weaving or something like that.

>>730167895
>kids who majored in gender role psychology and race-mixing studies are now earning 90k as social media "engineers" or some shit
If that's true, it wont last. We're living through one of the most distasteful trends in history.

Everything always snaps back to the middle and then the complete other direction. I just hope that other direction doesn't include sharia law.

>>730170344
I make out ok making 30k a year and could learn to drive freight to make 6 figures, but I am not that committed.

>>730171224
I listened to nutjobs tell me that Obama was going to enact Sharia Law for 8 years, and so far I've yet to see it happen. I know that for some people the very sight of people practicing their constitutional right to have a religion within the US is proof that total Sharia Law is right around the corner, but for me, it's no more convincing than the idea that there is an oncoming inquisition against godless heretics such as myself because I saw a church congregation hosting a bake sale in the park.

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>>730167895
>graduated w/ BS in Info. Systems
>3.35 overall GPA, like 3.75 for major-related classes
>spent 8 months unemployed and getting nagged constantly because I just wasn't "trying hard enough"
>finally get a job this January

>22,800/yr full time salary
pic related

>actually is EVEN LESS because "I didn't start at the beginning of the work year"

Thats the story of how 4 years and ~$100k got me the dream job of taking home $1200/month.

>>730172026

You could literally make more as a Wendy's chef, sans-meme.

>>730171178
Marketing can be rough, just because of all the competition. Although having the success of a sold company under your belt, I'd think that would go a long way.

ChemE degree here, literally graduated with a 2.8 GPA. I have a 6 figure job with a major chemical company. I love being in a plant.

If you don't like major manufacturing, then stick with chemE into your masters, and do research.

Fucking idiot. If you don't have a job then it's your personality's fault. I'm a dumbass with a good personality.

>>730172026
Its only been a few months. If your employer recognizes potential you can go places.

>>730172429

Which company?

>>730172489
Dow

>>730172323
I could probably make even more by just reverting to my true autist form and claiming disability NEETbux. It sounds a little less reprehensible each week.

>>730172444
>If your employer recognizes potential you can go places.
its a school district, its about as deadend as it could get. Everyone above me has been there for a while and definitely won't be going anywhere.

>>730172556
Then stay there while applying for other jobs. My friend got into accounting and was disappoitned he was making 30k a year. After a year he got hired somewhere else. Another friend in accounting started out doing shit work then he was promoted with in months and though he works long hours I can tell you he makes a very decent living. Haven't bothered to ask his salary cause i know it will put me to shame.

>>730172026
first jobs are always rough. I worked as a secretary with my degree at first. took a year or two to get into an actual design studio. just keep looking for work, finding out what you need to do to get hired.

first jobs are important = they show the next employer you can follow rules, show up on time, etc.

>>730169328
Mate that looks fucking amazing

I would love a job shitposting

>>730173143
then get better at it

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>>730172848
>Then stay there while applying for other jobs
already on it, only offers have been for a soul sucking position and one doing completely unrelated work (decal creation since I did that once).

Is it an exercise in futility to apply to positions you don't check all boxes for?
IE: 2+ years experience with Cisco hardware, things of that nature.

>>730172866
Its true that they are important, its just crushing to go from final round interviewing for Amazon AWS support to a "highschool diploma required" tier job.

>>730172366

Yeah, I've focused on the management part, which is what my MBA is in. The company I owned manufactured, warehoused, transported and sold animal feed ingredients.

>be me
>get degree in Pre-Law
>find out law labor market is terrible, figure I'll save myself the debt-suicide and just get a job instead of law school or masters, parents made it clear they'd give no assistance
>try to get into State Department
>pass the test no problem first try
>get to personal narrative and all the want is experience working overseas
>well fuck me
>work at local school district in the mean time, still sending out applications
>$15 an hour because my bachelors gets me 2 whole extra dollars, no benefits
>still obviously applying everywhere but no interviews (near NYC, very competitive)
>3 years later
>same shit job, about to lose parent's health insurance and lost dental long ago
>gave up on State department because they just want Rich, Male, and Yale. And I am not rich, or Ivy.
>reliable so I get the worst assignments in the school, kids who hurt other kids and even hit teachers (and they've hit me with zero repercussions)
>look into graduate school
>do fucking amazing on GRE
>no schools want to talk to me because I'm too long out for recommendations and they have no time for people with gaps unless they want a MBA

I've been lucky enough to live at home, but my parents have threatened to kick me out since day 1. I'm always on edge and never go more than a month without checking new apartment listings in several different places in case I have to leave and make it on my savings.

My brother graduated college last year and was talking about going into the army to pay for law school, my parents started freaking out about how they could make it work and pay full ride for him.

Oddly enough, I actually no longer want to kill myself. I want to die, sure. But every day is basically spent making a dozen different survival plans so it's sort of a preoccupation

>>730172026

>dosent post major

>>730173454
Hrm - what city/state are you in? Are you able to look for jobs in other cities?

Just seems like you have a great skill set. Maybe be focusing on business development vs marketing?

>>730172508
Do you like working for Dow? I work for DuPont and I'm not looking forward to the merger because of what I've heard about Dow

>>730173874
>>get to personal narrative and all the want is experience working overseas

I think my friend got into the state dept without that. maybe you should ask them
>

>>730173438
Still apply. Applying doesnt hurt even if there isnt an open position. If theres a way to show you are available for hire do it.

On resumes you can try white font to add keywords that arent relevant to you,b ut are relevant for the job because typically software is going to filter through online applications. This way people will actually look at it.
I have 2 friends who went into networking and they are doing great. Took longer for them to move up though, like 3 years for 1 friend til he was promoted.

>>730169328
Post more. And post often

>>730174432
no, it's bureaucracy, no getting around it.

It's a recent addition, maybe last 5 years? You have to send that in after passing the test. If accepted, you get to move on to actual interviews (for about 5 more months).

Sucks, but I'm done with it. They want wealthy/ middle aged they can get them. You have to wait a full year to try again every time you get dropped, it's irresponsible to postpone my life any longer

>>730174167
>graduated w/ BS in Info. Systems
>BS in Info. Systems
>Info. Systems
nigger learn to read

>>730174604
I'll keep on applying then, the keyword addition is something I didn't think about so I'll do that also.
I feel like I should do well in networking, so hopefully it pans out and I can stop being an adult that still lives with mommy.

>>730169328
>>730169328
where you at school? do yourself a favor - start thinking about your job now. what does that mean? networking online on forums, information interviews, focusing on a portfolio.

I used to teach at the Art Institute - which frankly is a shit school. But I saw 3 students I helped teach do fucking awesome after they graduated. 1 works for blizzard as an illustrator. 1 works for a major game publisher ( and no shit is trying to get into NASA ). 1 works for a major game dev.

these fuckers worked every day. were active on forums and in community, and frankly had pretty solid cool personalities. they had job experience at shit jobs ( which shows you can show up on time ) , and had a good internship.

>>730174803
go work in mexico or canada for a year dude. that can't be that hard.

just saying - if you want to be in state dept - do it.

>>730175014
Living with mom isnt a big deal just save money so when you do get married have a house and kids you will have money put away.

>>730175064
True. When it comes to art there is nothing that art school will allow you to do that you couldn't do before.

>>730175344
I'm not going to say that 100%.. I mean there is real value from skilled teachers, and being in an academic community. I'm just saying that is only part of the equation.

>>730175344
>Living with mom isnt a big deal
it isn't but unnecessarily complicates dating. I consider it akin to a kick in the shin.

>>730175560
Yeah its not 100%. To me art school should be for fun though. Its not to get a profession or become famous since those are things you should be pursuing if you are really devoted to your craft.
Best thing is probably criticism in a formal education environment, but if you are making art your life you will be constantly learning even beyond school.


>>730175743
So save and if you see a girl for a month you can rent an apartment.

>>730175343
dude, I'm having a hard enough time getting interviews in America. Why would another country want me?

almost got lucky with an interview with a think tank a few months ago but they blew me off a few minutes before the meeting... and sadly that's one of the more positive experiences

Anthropology postgraduate degree. Six figures.

Master race software engineer reporting in. Got my first job straight out of college and now that I've been here for two years I'm making past six figures.

>>730167895
You fucked up somewhere along the line. Don't blame others for your shortcomings.

>>730167895
You don't get a degree for money. As an example just picture a student getting a degree in medicine just for the sake of getting a good salary, its office would be a slaughterhouse.

>>730175064
Senior year of highschool. Trying to really get better. I'm a scalie fuck who draws dragon porn, but it does help a lot, in that I get to know artists who are waaaay better than I am, a lot of whom are working at going pro themselves. Also gives me experience with commissions. I'm trying to get as good as I fucking can so I don't have to draw furry porn for the rest of my life - but admittedly, I make more off of it than I did working after school as a busboy.

>>730176716
I fucking think porn artists are hilarious
Good on you making money drawing dicks and that sort of stuff. I'd do it if I could.

>>730176716
hey that is cool if you are getting commissions :)

something to focus on - hang out with the people you want to be. There will be creative / marketing networking meetings - you'll be the youngers person there, but you'll meet other professional creatives - the people who actually hire illustrators.

find 5 people whose jobs you want. look up their resumes / linked in / ask them if you can do an information interview. find out what gaps there are in your skill set and experience - it will give you some concrete targets to aim for.

>>730167895
literally any oil company dude

who in the fuck do you know making 90K to run someones twitter? i can't think of any company that would pay that

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>>730176975
Wow! Thanks for the advice, anon!

>>730177101
>>730177101
If you work for a large agency, you can make that money. eg: Living in NYC / SF, working for a big ad agency. But you have to be really fucking good, able to manage multiple projects, etc. And it isn't a job you get right out of school.

>>730173874
lol, I know a bunch of people working for State and none of them are rich or went to an ivy. Were you trying for for Foreign Service?

>>730174349
>Maybe be focusing on business development vs marketing?

I haven't really done any marketing. My focus is more on business/operations management.

>>730177325
sure man, hope it is helpful. being a creative sucks in a lot of ways - life expects you to do shit you didn't really sign up for.

>network
>business development
>managing budgets / debt

One trap is to treat your "peers" as the only people you hang out with. It is fun and all, but in a creative industry - you want to be hanging out with the people who hire - not just the people you compete with.

>>730177544
oh ok. well, I'm sure it will come together. just havent had the right opportunity yet. have you looked at people with competing resumes? are you missing anything significant? its dumb, but for me I found that shit like being on local boards, having xyz hiring experience - and specifically calling it out, made a difference.

As someone who wears a lot of hats ( run my own small business ) sometimes I forget just how much shit I do - converting it to a resume is always a challenge.

good luck you'll get it eventually.

>>730177406
yup, is that particularly bad?

Had a professor who had suggested CIA, having previously interviewed with them (and got rejected because he wouldn't say he'd die for Bush). I applied but obviously some BA holder isn't going to get in without some spectacular shit to their name

>>730177809
>having previously interviewed with them (and got rejected because he wouldn't say he'd die for Bush).

he was rejected because he failed the background check kek. that is just the story he told you.

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>>730177572
Yeah, absolutely. One of my favorite comic artists once said that the best way to get into the industry is to start chatting with an editor/publishing exec at a con, take them out to dinner, buy them a beer, etc. Basically like taking the person on a date, but with the end goal of getting a job, rather than some ass. By the time I graduate in about 4 years, I hope to be drawing at a level similar to this, which I think would help my work stand out from the crowd.

>>730173438

Honestly, I went to a trade school for machining and now I'm a dispatcher.

I basically mentioned tolerances, cutting metal and shaping. I let it slip in that those concepts also apply to people and I started at 30k/yr last April. May 1st my salary is 45k/yr.

If you start at the bottom and just prove that you can work and enjoy it, the only way you can move is up and maybe to the side if they don't want you in that certain position anymore but doing something else related.

>>730178138
yeah that is solid work - good goal. something else to keep in mind a portfolio needs ideally to show different styles and subject matter.

personal style is great, but the bulk of the illustration jobs involve doing multiple styles. showing your flexibility is a sign of a professional illustrator.

Friend of mine got into game development back in the day. loved war games and shit. got hired by Mattel or someshit - spent his first two years working on some Barbie Nail Painter game lol. Getting those first jobs can be a real bitch - and if you want to freelance the more different looks you have mean the more potential clients you can have.

This is a problem I have with designers - lots of OK ones can really only do one look or style.

oh shit something else very different about professional environment - time limits. new designers are used to having as long as they want on a project... once you are working hourly you get like 6 hours on something for a first round. that is very hard for young designers to adjust to.

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>>730178553
Yeah, I'm really trying to get become more flexible with styles. I want to be able to digitally paint like a game concept artist, whilst still being able to do traditional inks. My dream is to one day work in indie comics - Image or IDW-type stuff.

Time limits are something I really have to work at. Right now with school and all, it's difficult to finish stuff in a timely manner - plus I often take longer on shit I'm not all that invested in, which I really have to get over if I'm going to make it professionally. When I'm focused, though, I like to think that I work at a decent pace for an untrained artist. This took me maybe 4 hrs, and was done from direct observation

>>730179449
that is awesome - sound like you have a really solid foundation.

>>730179851
Eh, I'm trying! Got into RISD and Parsons, but I'm a poor kid from the northeast, and they didn't give me enough aid/scholarships for it to be worth it. Thinking about doing a year in the states, then transferring to a school up in Canada, where it'll be cheaper.

>>730168234
sage only works if you dont quote someone you fucking newfag cucklord