Alright /b/ I'll debate anyone: Gender doesn't exist.

>>728641626
>Gender doesn't exist
Why's that?

>>728641626
why do people get all bent out of shape over it if it doesn't exist?

>>728641626
If not gender, then what?

>>728641626
there are only 2 genders

>>728641713
I'm a man of science, and the science is that you're either born with a penis or born with a vagina. Nothing after that has any basis in science, only tradition.

>>728641626
>implying words even mean things

>>728641721
Go ask a priest.

>>728641819
Not him, but everything has a basis in science, even if that basis is unclear or unknown currently. Humans having a concept of gender falls into that category.

>>728641721
I personally just believe that hormone therapy and sexual reassignment surgery are and create abominations. "Transgender" people are merely biological men or biological women who feel that they would be much happier doing things that are traditionally associated with the opposite "gender". Eliminate gender and eliminate all the bullshit debate surrounding trans rights

>>728641951
religion has a basis in science then?

>>728641819
except that men and women have numerous anatomical and physiological differences. as far as I know anatomy and physiology are sciences. try harder, faggot

My two cents:
>I don't think genitals are inherently masculine or feminine, only secondary sex characteristics
>I think if everyone was just labelled as "has penis/vagina" instead of "is man/woman", we'd eliminate gender, which'd get rid of transgender, which'd then get rid of dysphoria that transgender people feel. Win/win yeah?

>>728642113
>anatomy: having a penis or
>physiology: functions of the body related to having a penis or not

you try harder faggot

>>728641713
Because gender is a theory made up by liberals to distract people from their biological sex

>>728641981
but thats supporting a delusion

not that i care if someon wants to be the opposite sex, but what gets me is the people that flip flop every hour, then get offended that some random ass stranger says 'sir' or 'ma'am'. as if anyone else knows or even cares that you feel like a woman but dress/appear like a man at that moment in time

>>728642281
>distract people from their biological sex
sorry I'm furthering the liberal agenda by not constantly thinking about my penis.
what is this even supposed to mean?

>>728642023
Yes. There is a science behind what gave rise to religion. Probably an evolutionary coping mechanism which adapted to deal with fear of death or yearning to have control over the uncontrollable.

File: xpblSAr.png (40KB, 625x626px) Image search: [Google]

40KB, 625x626px

>>728641626
Gender exists because humans are not all born the same way. You either get the plumbing on the outside or the inside. Sometimes both, and it's gross. People also aften get gender and sexual orientatiom mixed up. There are only 4 sexual orientations, all others are just unnecessary and reserved for faggot attention whores. The 4 are:
Hetero
Homo
Bi
Asexual
These encompass the entire spectrum of sexual preference. All of these made-up things like demigender and shit should be classified as 1 of the 4

>>728642234
exactly, having it counts as a difference. there are functions that aren't related to having a penis or a vagina you know. there's a thing called hormones. we have different muscle structure, different metabolysm.

File: 168094358.jpg (102KB, 558x640px) Image search: [Google]

102KB, 558x640px

>>728641626
Now you're getting it. It follows that if "transgender" and other silly categories don't exist, there is no basis for discrimination whatsoever. Everyone is just a person with different sexualities.

>>728642290
OP here yeah I don't give a fuck about your pronouns or your bathroom preference. Go to the bathroom based on what is between your legs. Eliminate gendered pronouns, call people whatever pronoun you feel like at the moment idc.

Getting offended is for pussies.

>>728642369
>not constantly thinking about my penis.

but thats the problem they are always thinking about having one or not. nobody cares

>>728641805
>there are only 2 genders
Gender and sex are not synonyms.

Sex is not a binary, it is more of a bimodal distribution, since there are plenty of factors that influence it. Genetics, hormones, environmental factors etc.

Gender is all over the place.

>>728642469
exactly. i couldnt give a fuck about which bathroom someone uses, but dont act like they killed your mother when they use the wrong pronoun or some shit.

those kinds of people are seriously mentally ill

>>728641819
Same with language then. I can call you a fucking retard but you can decide "retard" actually means genius. We assign people words to details about them. Your definition of gender might be off, but it doesnt change that the sentiment of having a penis = x and having a vagina = y. Youre probably an atheist too because youre too smart for your own good.

>>728642450
wow you're really enlightening me anon. i had no idea any of what you're saying existed.

trying to nitpick your way into proving me "wrong" just shows the weakness of your argument.

>>728642601
how is that nitpicking? those are facts. i've provided factual arguments as to why men and women are different. where is your argument faggot?

>>728641626
>Gender doesn't exist.
So... non-existant studies?
Soulds about right.

>>728642601
Hes trying to be edgy by breaking down the social barrier of definitions. Just because we call men "men" and females "females" means that they dont exist because WE decide to call them that. If he believes in biology then he wouldnt have to make that claim, because regardless of what we "call" them, men differenciate from females regardless of language.

HeshetheyitOP is delusional

>>728642697
Are you going to reply to my comment about language? No? didnt think so.
>>728642574 ▶
>>728641819

>>728642519
you're a colossal faggot
penis=male
vagina=female
both/none=genetical defect

>>728642742
see, I don't care what people call themselves, or what they identify as. I think it's stupid, yes, but it is their right. but you can't deny that there are core differences between being a "man" and a "woman" (again call it what you will)

>>728642819
Hence where the word OP comes from --- genetic defect

>>728642601
This not how you argue correctly. You are full of shit. Fuck off.

>>728642850
umm yea.. there are core differences.. but youre saying theres no such thing as gender.. How can that be if there are core differences between the two genders, creating different genders by nature?

>>728642697
>>728642742
Clearly none of you idiots understand what the word "gender" means. Prove to me that biology, anatomy, physiology, should with any basis in logic or reason determine the style of clothing we wear, the toys we play with, the length of our hair the shit we cake on our faces, etc. etc. etc.

>>728642940
I'm saying the opposite. learn to read.

>>728642970
They don't need to understand words or science. They just assert their white privilege and then tell everyone else how they should live. Don't you know how this works?

>>728642970
Just as i said before.. youre sying that youre a man of science and everything after that is cultural. YES YOURE RIGHT But even without culture, even without "girl toys" and "boy toys" there still exists gender. If we didnt have toys, didnt have clothes, are you still saying there wouldnt be gender? Do dogs not have gender even though they dont have culture with toys and clothes? I thought you were a man of science.. but all your arguments lead me to believe youre a man of sociology.

>>728642804
I love the smugness of this post.

Your point isn't nearly as clever as you think, doesn't even warrant a serious reply

>>728641626
Gotta love me some Manny Mua.

>>728642819
Well that's a killer argument. "I don't agree with you, so you're a faggot".

You can call them defects, but they're not, they're just a collection of traits that come together to form something we recognise as male or female, and sometimes it doesn't hit exactly on target.

>>728642970
Who is saying that gender defines the way you dress or what toys you play with? How retarded are you?

>>728643125
Learn the difference between sex and gender, then come back and apologize for being an idiot.

>>728643137
Youre arguments contradict yourself
>im a man of science
>all arguments saying gender isnt real are based on culture
>doesnt acknowledge gender exists naturally within science

>>728643125
>Do dogs not have a gender
No you idiot that's exactly the point I'm making.

Dogs have separate sexes. Gender does not exist.

OP here, just to clarify for all the idiots in this thread...

There are two sexes.

Gender does not exist.

>>728643217
You're a fucking idiot

For centuries gender and sex have been used interchangeably and suddenly because some stupid sociologists decide to change the definition you suddenly think gender doesn't exist anymore?

>>728643323
I think you meant, "For centuries uneducated fucks used gender and sex interchangeably"

>>728643191
This is such a stupid argument. Gender is something given to people per your defnition, sure. But its completely subjective IF youre going to play it like that because then you just choose not to accept the objective opinion on gender. Most people in America do believe there are 2 genders whih is how genders exist in the first place. The lgbt community is creating a culture where they decide not to accept the definition of gender, thereby creating theirown culture which doesnt exist. The whole movement is based on destroying that definition. Gender only doesnt exist if everyone decides that girls and guys act the same, which they dont.

>>728643154
/thread

Well said, sir.

>>728643323
hahaha i know this guy probably goes to some liberal ass state college who took a lesbian dance theory and sociology course and now things hes a brilliant snob

>>728643292
Gender isn't real, it's a social construct. There's nothing in your genes that say "skirts are for women, games consoles are for men".

However there are not two sexes. There is a bimodal distribution of sexes, and a scattering of differences around those two peaks.

For example, we all know that males begin fully female, but then change and become male. That process is not exact, sometimes it occurs to greater extents than others (that's why some people are more masculine than others). Sometimes it happens a bit in women (mega clits that are like little penises). We group these as one sex, but how far from "exactly female" do you have to go before it's weird?

>>728643480
>The whole movement is based on destroying that definition.

Yeah, just like modern astronomy was based on destroying the moronic idea that the Earth is the center of the universe. Your worldview is anti-scientific religious authoritarianism meant to make the world a safe space for privileged white retards.

>>728643545
youre wrong. There is something in a mans genes which tell them to hunt, tells them to get their hands dirty, tells them to be promiscuous. There is something in a womens genes that tell them to be well mannered, decent, and a companion. These traits helped over the years what would be a guys toy and girls toy (bob the builder, barbie, etc)

>>728641626
Imma Attack Helicopter

>>728643480
Both "most people in America" and the lgbt community are wrong though.

Both are subscribing to the fact that gender exists. One group simply believe you CAN'T change it. The other believe that by calling yourself different pronouns or surgically removing your penis you CAN change it.

If gender simply doesn't exist, neither side has issues to debate

>>728643620
Why dont you just fight webster to take gender out of the dictionary for good? Im genuinely asking that. Is it something youd want? Cause thats the only way your opinion will be met with satisfaction

>>728643740
Hilariously, you still don't know the difference between sex and gender. Didn't I tell you to educate yourself already?

https://www.apa.org/pi/lgbt/resources/sexuality-definitions.pdf

>n-n-n-no
>science is only right when it AGREES WITH ME

What a joke you are. Total embarrassment.

>>728643675
This is exactly the kind of argument that makes me passionate about this issue in particular. Your retarded-ass Middle Ages opinion on gender roles is holding back our entire species as a whole. Conditioning females to believe they are naturally pre-disposed to be housewife and be less intelligent than men is asking for half of our scientific breakthroughs and technological advances to remain undiscovered forever. And the opposite is true as well. To beat the emotion, creativity, and freedom of expression out of men we are stifling cultural and artistic progress to a degree we can't even fathom.

>>728643985
Im 21 years old and if you cant acknowledge the biological difference that hormones have on males and females than you are very far detached. Guys and girls have different nature, naturally.

>>728643528
I go to a pretty liberal school in California yeah but I hate most of my closed-minded snowflake peers and identify as conservative in all issues except social. Voted for Trump in the last election.

>>728644088
>I'm 21 years old and

stopped reading there

Not OP but 100% agree, it's also why I despise the term genderfluid. There are only physiological differences. We do not engender other animals because it does not exist in their societies. Hell gender was a purely grammatical term for male/female words until the 50s and it wasnt unti the 70s that people began considering it as we do now - a stand in for a bunch of societal norms for a given sex.

>>728644145
>too old, irrelevant opinion
>too young, irrelevant opinion
>be anon, relevant opinion, because its herhisitthey's opinion

>>728644220
not the age, but the need to preface his post with an age description that invalidates whatever point he was trying to make

File: 1245071298430867375.jpg (71KB, 800x668px) Image search: [Google]

71KB, 800x668px

>>728641626
x and y chromosome do though..

>>728644272
What? Someone told me i was middle-aged so my opinion was wrong (for that reason) i replied saying i was not in fact middle aged, but 21

File: 2jdfhp0.jpg (18KB, 647x363px) Image search: [Google]

18KB, 647x363px

>>728641626
OP obviously didn't pay attention in Biology 101. There is no debate when you will obviously ignore basic facts

File: Screen Shot 2017-04-10 at 2.11.11 AM.png (79KB, 1210x290px) Image search: [Google]

79KB, 1210x290px

>>728644348
kek

>>728644366

>>728643191

>>728644286
It's the SRY gene that determines maleness, not the Y chromosome per se. They're not always present on Y chromosomes, they're sometimes present on X chromosomes.

>>728644431
haha wow okay i misread that

>>728644286

>>728643191

>>728643675
Actual horseshit. All studies show minimal variation between men and women and that psychological differences are only due to deviations in development rates (girls 'grow up' quicker than boys)

>>728644506
Yeah in abnormalities, in canon is should always be present in the Y.

>>728644912
Should, but isn't.

>>728644806
Not only on developmental rates, now you're the one spewing horse shit. Sociocultural factors play a big part, probably even the biggest part. Also, we can't forget that some biological factors, like let's say muscle mass, which is much easier to attain for males, makes them preferable hunters over females.

There are a FUCKLOAD of factors contributing to the various differences and when we get right now to in, aggressiveness and physical dominance brought about the world we live in today.

>>728643620
No matter how many times you keep saying those buzzwords no girl is going to want to fuck you.

File: 1487282923274.jpg (52KB, 593x294px) Image search: [Google]

52KB, 593x294px

>>728644102
>calls people snowflakes
>is a snowflake
>pot
>kettle
>black

:^)

>>728645870
Wikipedia as im too lazy to research myself
n 2005, Janet Shibley Hyde from the University of Wisconsin-Madison introduced the gender similarities hypothesis, which suggests that males and females are similar on most, but not all, psychological variables. The research focused on cognitive variables (for example, reading comprehension, mathematics), communication (for example, talkativeness, facial expressions), social and personality (for example, aggression, sexuality), psychological well-being, and motor behaviors. Using results from a review of 46 meta-analyses, she found that 78% of gender differences were small or close to zero. A few exceptions were some motor behaviors (such as throwing distance) and some aspects of sexuality (such as attitudes about casual sex), which show the largest gender differences.

>>728644503

>>728643191

>>728645870
Also

In 2012 Irina Trofimova [22] reported “middle age – middle sex” phenomenon and suggested that the significant female advantage in verbal fluency and male advantage in physical power fade after age 25 in an asymmetric manner. She pointed out to several other studies on humans and other primates showing a levelling of sex differences in sociability and physical strength. Males and females might indeed have different timings of maturation of physical and verbal systems: according to McGuinness and Pribram (1978) during the first two years of life talking and walking rarely occur simultaneously, which suggests that these two abilities compete for the same set of neural connections, or that one type of neural organization inhibits the other. This coincides with the higher mobility of boys, accompanied by their lower rates of speech development in childhood, in comparison to girls. These different timings in maturation appear as sex differences in early age, and likely level off in later adulthood (Barbu, Cabanes, & Le Maner-Idrissi, 2011). This middle age – middle sex phenomenon might explain why meta-analytic reports and several experimental studies of verbal abilities and dominance using adult participants reported no sex differences.

>>728646382
The snowflake reference was so obviously a joke but sure, get your keks in dude, you're real clever

>>728643154
>You can call them defects, but they're not

yep faggot confirmed

>>728646301
Oh, please. The so-called "alt right" is entirely made up of confirmed incels

>>728641721
>god

>>728641819
Facts /thread

>>728643154
Funny how that only becomes relevant when any leech on society can get a voice from the bleeding hearts of the left. I'm not saying there's no truth in it, just that the act of wanting to mutilate oneself to satisfy an idea is, by and large considered a mental illness. The fact that there are a wide margin of people who support this behavior is more troubling than the condition itself...

File: 1.jpg (377KB, 1280x1799px) Image search: [Google]

377KB, 1280x1799px

>>728641626
I want post to your thread but at the same time 99.99% troll 00.00999- % you even find truth it what your saying OP YOUR A FAGGOT TAKE A DICK...

>>728645870
But your missing my entire point which is that sociocultural factors are constructed, place people in a different cultural environment and they will be brought up differently. Gender is an amalgamation of a lot of these - it is artificial

>>728646512
That is so fucking lame.

Gender does exist, but being transgender is literally pretending to be the opposite.

>>728646606
Seems like a pretty accurate level of intellect for this thread

>>728646523
Who mentioned the "alt-right"?

If, for the sake of argument, that the body is normal and healthy but your emotions and feelings tell you to cut your dick off; you might be bat shit fucking crazy. It's a mental illness, cope and get help.

>>728646619
It's been taught for ages that gender and sex are one and the same. Liberals are the only ones who think otherwise, they make a compelling argument because they play on people's emotions, which have no place in an objective setting. Fuck off.

>>728646619
No it isn't, if you let kids be raised by monkeys, they will naturally assume the roles of females and males according to their gender/sex.
By the simple fact that males produce a lot more testosterone than females and act on it, the same way females produce more estrogen and act on it, naturally, without "societal" roles being enforced.

This is the average, if you want to point out exceptions, they are exactly that, exceptions, not the rule.

>>728646495
>be retarded
>"nay, i jest"
>still be retarded

The only thing that was so obviously a joke is you. :^)

>>728646463
So even The Department of Gender and Women's Studies in the University of Wisconsin-Madison agree that 22% of gender differences are inherent.

>>728646908
False. Gender only came about as a term referring to people in the 50s.

>It's been taught for ages
Solid logical argument

>>728646921
They also might get killed or eaten at birth since most animals cannibalize defective young.

>>728646964
>The Department of Gender and Women's Studies

That sounds something similar to the KKK's Center for Racial Studies.

File: 1491366226431.png (284KB, 1176x603px) Image search: [Google]

284KB, 1176x603px

>>728646673

>>728647041
Maybe the word as it's spoken today but yes, ages. Don't just spew wikishit factoids.

>>728646908
>It's been taught for ages
>objective

Wow, you're really stupid.

>>728641626
If you're born with testicles, you are a male. If you are born with ovaries, you are female.

Everything else falls into what's called, lifestyle. But many people have grown too stupid to understand that anymore.

>>728647211
>Says it hasn't been taught for ages
>Doesn't dawn on him that bible study has been mainstream for more than a thousand years

>>728647239
tbf, if I was around you every day I'd have definitely grown too stupid

>>728647306
>bible study
>mainstream
>more than a thousand years

so, uh, was your great great gran pappy studying the bible in great great aunt june's basement with all his fellow church goers over 400 years before the printing press was invented?

>>728647202
Just because something is engrained into society doesnt make it real, For years people believed in geocentrism but that didnt make it true

>>728647646
It's basic biology, really basic.

>>728646621
because you're a faggot!

>>728647716
Yes, I agree, there is a bimodal distribution of sexes.

>>728641626
Gender doesn't need to exist. It's just a way to tell dick from pussy. And even if it doesn't "exist" it's still going to be a popular topic. So this whole thread is useless.

>>728647577
I know this is a troll but parchment was also a thing centuries before that, ya faggot.

>>728647716
Right. Except Im perfectly fine saying theres sexual dimorphism. The issue is saying shit like it's encoded into being a man to get yor hands dirty whilst girls are well mannered. The psychologcal studies have shown that there is minimal to no idfference between men and women directly related to genetics.

The gender roles we have are much more built up form the fact that men are/were more disposable than women as they dont bare children. This mattered in the past when survival was an issue but doesnt so miuch now.

If you look at different cultures though you can see that women dont always take such a passive role e.g. Scythians

Theres some valid point to saying things like women can be more emotional due to greater changes in their hormone levels, etc. but these apply more to populations than individuals & dont validate the whole load of extra baggage brought on with gender roles.

>>728648787
Not OP but there wasnt really general literacy before the printing press

>>728649579
So group study wasn't a thing? What I'm getting at is that these liberal tard children are just trying to upset thousands of years in the trial and error of mankind because they don't have any solid science to sate their feelings. I'm becoming a potato just trying to hold a conversation, holy shit.

>>728641805
There is only one gender, women are objects.

>>728642469
So you think Buck Angel should use the ladies room?

>>728642469
>Getting offended is for pussies.

Real easy to say when you havent spent your entire life being made fun of or hated because of a core part of your identity.

>>728650353
Well, this is...true, according to the bible they're just ribs from men. Fuck I'm hungry now.

>>728650699
Cry harder and checkum, pussy. People get made fun of all the time, regardless of sexual preference so fuck yer

>>728649530
>minimal to no idfference between men and women directly related to genetics

Complete bullshit, hormonal differences are evident

>>728641626
Finally someone with logic on this site. Thank you op and have a blessed life, I believe a person with views like yours will be able to succeed in their future

>>728643499
How's that (You) treating ya today?

New anon here, but if I may...

Biological sex is binary with few modifiers. That is, in the presence of a Y chromosome, you are biologically a male, else a female. In the presence of extra sex chromosomes, look for the presence of a Y chromosome and realise that its a genetically mutated male or female.
Its also not a good thing to have extra chromosomes. While sex chromosomes have less of an impact on your intelligence, and other faculties, there is a strong correlation between the extra chromosomes and learning/mental disorders.

Having said that, I will respect a person as a person; should they identify as the opposite sex, whatever, y'know? However, made up genders can go fuck themselves.

One more thought: people reportedly feel that their body and mind don't match up, hence wanting to change their body. Hormone therapy means changing your chemistry in such a way that there will be evident personality changes. That's just part of being hormonal. While people try to say they are just being themselves, now, I can't shake that they have actually let go of the Self they used to truely be.

>>728650999
Except that's what recent studies show/.

>>728650202
no, not really.
a full and complete bible was rare because they had to be hand written and anytime the writer or editor saw a mistake they had to throw the whole parchment away because erasers weren't a thing back then. it takes days to copy a bible and it takes money to hire people to copy a bible, but it's not like anybody but the priest could read anyway so it didn't matter. Long story short, not every town had a bible before printing presses, and even if they did, there'd only be maybe one and a half literate people per town who could read it anyways. Basically, lay people actually reading the bible would be an extremely modern development, but let's be honest, even if you read, neither of us have read the whole bible.

>>728651140
* Also intersex & possibly asexual are biological classifications - not sure about the last one im a physicist not a biologist

>>728651216
>I see what you did there
You're right, I myself don't realistically believe it's complete and I don't actually believe in a lot of it's context but I have read the KJV cover to cover.

>>728651285
Intersex exists, but from what I understand that is on the external level, where no testes nor ovaries as present, or both a penis and vagina appear. I haven't seen the lack of sex chromosomes to this point.... I definitely will not deny the intersex exists externally, but on the chemical level, its still a boolean based on the Y chromosome.

>>728650202
Moreover than what >>728651216 said the bible was in latin - only the ecclesiastical members of a community received any education to be able to read the bible to begin with. That was generally one priest across afew villages

>>728650859
>according to the bible
I'm a right winger but I still find it hard to believe that people only think that the Earth is 6000 years old and shit

>>728651451
Afaik intersex is hermaphroditic and asex- is a lack of genitalia. So it's not quite as binary as that as inter depends on the amount of protein etc expression performed by the Y / SRY gene as to how male a person is

>>728651451
Equally though i believe XYY & XXY people are classed as male so you may be right

>>728651601

But male and female is about function, and not merely appearance. We assign at birth based on appearance because it is accurate the vast majority of the time.

>>728651451
>boolean based on the y chromosome

>>728651832
Pretty much with you 100% just wanted to point out that gene exprssion muddies the waters in the case of defects as XXY are male and sterile by and large and hermaphrodites it depends entriely on how developed either/both sets of sex organs a developed. Prob just spliting hairs tbh

>>728651399
"read the KJV cover to cover"
how far did you have to get into it before you realized you have shit taste and why did you read a book about dumb shit like god written maybe 1700 years before any kind of public education?

>>728652224

....are you saying that's stupid, or its accurate. Single line green text has become ambiguous over the years :(

>>728652355
I'll admit that its muddied, especially if I live by the sword of functional sex organs. But, then I think about a hand without any tendons. Doesn't work, but its still a hand.
I would be forced to think a bit harder if I saw a person who produced sperm and had ovulation...

>>728641626
who gives a shit, you niggers need to get jobs.

>>728653014
normally i'd just call you a newfag and leave but if there's green text, he's calling you retarded. it's even less ambiguous than actually saying they're retarded because text can have sarcasm but green text is always insulting

>>728642436
According to your post pedophilia and ebephilia are natural you fucking queer

>>728654055
they are tho

>>728652224
>>728653435

But how isn't it a Y Chromosome boolean?

>>728641626
But there is gender.

There are 3 categories.

1. Male
2. Female
3. Abnormalities

1 and 2 are simple, 3 covers Hermaphrodites and those are are Intersex.

There is an X and a Y Chromosome. Females are XX and are known as the homogametic sex, Males are XY and known as the heterogametic sex.

Abnormalities are somewhat more complicated. Hermaphrodites have ovarian and testicular tissue combined in an Ovotestis. Those with an Ovotestis have sex chromosomes showing male-female mosaicism, meaning one individual possesses both the male XY and female XX chromosome pairs.

Intersex can be a combination of Male, Female and Hermaphrodite traits. To be clear though these are not defined as a different gender, this is only defined as a COMBINATION of statistically normal genders.

tl;dr there are only 3 possible genders.

>>728641819
>tradition and convention don't exist
Congratulations. You've contradicted yourself in your first two posts. Kindly get the fuck out.

>>728641626
Get the fuck out of 4chan reddit

>>728656165
That's sex. Gender is the interpretation of those by society.
Different societies have treated the sexes differently throughout time. Different expectations, different treatments, etc.
Genders are based on biology, but with more basis in convention than physiology nowadays.

File: 4L_imIGiByG.jpg (85KB, 640x640px) Image search: [Google]

85KB, 640x640px

>>728642436
>asexual
Humans cannot into zygote by themselves.

>>728641626

There are males and there are females.

Within those two genders are heteros and homos.

Within those orientations are attention whores and non-attention whores.

That's it.

>>728657340
>heteros and homos
>bisexuals don't exist
Ok, pal.

File: female_male_chrom_fig2.jpg (27KB, 618x241px) Image search: [Google]

27KB, 618x241px

>>728641626
How so?

>>728641626

FUCK OFF AND DIE FAGGOT

>>728641626
Nothing exists as human languages describes anything and everything. Even math may ultimately not reflect reality at all--but sorry, numbers aren't actually real, physical things either, not even so-called 'real numbers.'

On the other hand the very idea of nothingness is quite absurd from the standpoint of modern physics. I guess what I'm getting at here is that everything humans have ever said or done, and perhaps even thought may be, and probably is complete and utter bullshit. Not that humanity in general gives a fuck about any of this shit though.

Which is another point I guess. You're just philosophizing here. That's cool I guess, but philosophers are some of the most useless humans who've ever lived.

>>728656979
Fuck your social constructs I am giving physical facts. The question was about gender, gender is what sex you are. Sexuality on the otherhand CAN be interpreted based on social and personal preference. You cannot interpret a physical fact differently from what it is.

There are only 3 genders, deal with it.

>>728641626
https://youtu.be/c6rP-YP4c5I

>>728650999
Sex hormones doesn't set in until puberty, and they can easily be swapped out..

>>728656979
Here is an example in a video, they use MALE organs to pee yet are dressed as females and are apparently trans, no. Trans is not a gender, They are Male.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=APeAXKmkVcI

Did logic scare reddit away?

>>728658386
They are fucking trannies you fucking retard.

>>728659587
Trannie > Transexual.

Which is not a fucking gender, they have a dick meaning they are male is the point I am making. I am not questioning the fact they WANT to be female, the fact is they are not female AND transgender is NOT a gender.

>>728659877
Transgender women do not WANT to be female, they ARE it. Their brains are female. There are some scientific evidence of that.
Trannies are just men who like to dress like women and it's a fetish for some.

>>728642194
Nope. Since transgendered people also want the opposite sexs genitalia they'd still be around. Remember these people are mentally unwell, you can't reason them out of existance

>>728660401
Can mentally unwell people work and contribute to society, you fuckwit?

>>728660105
Give me actual sources for that being the case. Does this "Female" in the your theory have XX chromosomes or XY? I am happy to call a male who has had their penis turned inside out a female but till that point they are not, hormones or otherwise.

They do WANT to be female due to gender dysphoria. We live in a society where people like this are encouraged to take irreversible change before persuing other possibilitys, this is wrong. A male brain is not female, I would place that element down to sexuality, A male who wanted to feel what its like to be a woman and gets fixated upon this.

>>728643620
Good God what has b become?

>>728660785
https://www.scientificamerican.com/article/is-there-something-unique-about-the-transgender-brain/
https://www.newscientist.com/article/dn20032-transsexual-differences-caught-on-brain-scan/
Look nobody is denying the chromosomes. Sex is physical and gender is in the brain. And besides there are more than just XX and XY. And what do you call the intersex people? Are you aware that doctors and parents used to decide the sex of intersex babies and some of them feel they are of the wrong sex later in life?

>>728660537
Depends on how mentally unwell they are. There are plenty of crazies locked away or confined to their houses because of their mental illness

>>728661354
see >>728656165 this is my post.

You can feel what you want, that does not change physical facts.

As to Intersex, here is some statistics on how common the various types are in North America
http://www.isna.org/faq/frequency

>also thank you for actually giving sources unlike the others above.

>>728661520
I've known and met transgender people who function well in society. Some are fucking rich. So are they "mentally unwell"?

>>728661730
Yes

>>728661730
Just like there are plenty of successful autistic people or those suffering from depression. They are all mental ilnesses

>>728661354
>Sex is physical and gender is in the brain
bullshit.
gender is a synonym for sex. Only SJWs try to change it's meaning.

>And besides there are more than just XX and XY.
that's true, but still anything but XX/XY *is* abnormal, which means it's now how it's supposed to be. It's an error.

For example XXX, trisomy X.

>>728661878
Well then all the /b/astards are extremely mentally unwell.

>>728661730
>So are they "mentally unwell"?
in some aspects, obviously yes.

Also what are you even saying? That rich people can not be mentally disabled?

>>728661993
That's true. I cite Trump as an example. I'll concede.

>>728641626
A man can't get an operation to become a woman and give birth. A woman can't get an operation to become a man and get a woman pregnant. It really is that simple and anything else isn't natural by definition.

If there is a creator/observer somewhere, I'm sure they are sitting there going "What the absolute fuck? Well, let's see where this goes."

>>728662112
Real edgy my dude

>>728662135
And if we develop a Star Trek technology that makes that possible?
Also consider this: Commander Riker and Troi teleport to a planet and the teleporter malfunctions and their bodies switch. And they're stuck on that planet. Are they actually "mentally unwell" as claimed by the inhabitants?

>>728657884
>Fuck your social constructs I am giving physical facts.

You don't think that gender roles reflect the individual societies that they come from? Not at all? Because these roles very obviously change over time. The idealized idea of men and women today aren't exactly the same as they were in the 50s. And before you go blaming feminism and shit (not saying that you'd be incorrect mind you) they weren't exactly the same in the 50s as they were in the 30s either. My grandma grew up on a farm in the 30s. The idea of the Nuclear family would have been incomprehensible to them. Men and women both worked their asses off in the fields. So did children who were old enough to be useful and do as they were told. The post-war period is what gave us the Nuclear family and housewives, who did all the domestic chores and raised the kids. When. My grandma was growing up everyone did domestic shit, and the kids were raised by the extended family units (communally, or 'it takes a village to raise a child' if you'll pardon the proverb), although generally it was slightly older children who watched the younger ones through the day, because the adults didn't have time.

So what changed? The very fucking structure of society. In a very revolutionary way. Before the war, most Americans lived in rural communities and we're likely farmers, or at least did something that supported farming. During the war there was a major industrial and technological boom, out of necessity, and it only increased after the war. People left the farms for the cities in droves, and their old lifestyles and family structure was no longer ideal. Plus they actually had money in their pockets for a change too.

>gender is what sex you are.

Normally. Gender and sexuality are not the exact same things however. Gender is a mental perception, and it is based on how society defines it. Sex is physiological. Normally they do coincide, but not always. Biology is very sloppy in case you've never noticed.

>>728662345
>Biology is very sloppy in case you've never noticed
I see what you did there.

>>728661354
Let's say gender is in the brain. How come people don't have gender reassignment instead of sex reassignment to make their brains congruent with their bodies?

>>728662345
>The post-war period is what gave us the Nuclear family and housewives

no, you fucking cuck.
Not having a large war gave you that. That's how it normally works. Typically womyn only work when they have to or as some kind of hobby. and imo that's really smart.

>>728662345
Gender roles are irelevant to what OP started this thread as, and what I have been trying to explain. Gender roles are very different no in societies, however in a stone age scenario there would be a very definite roll for female and male. If people want gender equality in the world people should look into Spartan history.

Gender roles however does not mean there are more than 3 genders still. Society does not trump physical fact, however much society and peoples feelings want it to.

>Gender and sexuality are not the exact same thing
I did not say they were, gender is a synonym of sex. Sexuality is your preference. And yes biology is very messy, that said I would encourage you to look at the below link on how common the varients of the third gender type are, it illustrates the disparity between the amount of trans people and the amount that have actual physiological gender difference.

http://www.isna.org/faq/frequency

>>728662745
because that would imply that it's a mental condition / a mental disease. And that hurts their fee-feels, so it can't be that. So let's fuck up their bodies instead.

I think this shit is actually a disease in the brain caused by modern food "ingredients" or some shite.

Gender is a social construct based on stereotypes and assumptions and bc people have been taught that their whole lives they feel the need to pull dumb shit like being "genderneutral" or "trans" to break that construct... when in reality it reinforces that men act a certain way and women act a certain way

>>728641626
Gender is based on sex. There's only 2 sexes. Therefore there's only 2 genders. Hermaphrodites are a genetic mutations and therefore do not apply.

>>728663098
>Gender is a social construct
No, you fucking moron.
There a 2 genders and that's it. You stupid stupid stupid person.

>>728662745
If that is possible and if that's what they want.
>But that's like trying to change the brains of homosexuals.

>>728654055
thats a fetish

>>728663389
But how about therapy and encouragement to conform to normal gender roles? Or is that too unnatural and insensitive as opposed to chopping someone's dick off?

>>728663389
It's not like you can fully change their bodies

>>728663601
Dude that's like encouraging homosexuals to take conversion therapy.

>>728663729
With advancements in medical and science that can be possible.

>>728663601
That is how people try and deal with it now

>>728663750
No, it's not. There is no real problem with gays being gay, it doesn't hurt them, but gender dysphoria from all accounts sucks

>>728641626
xy yy

This isn't hard

>>728663843
No we seem to be going in the direction of changing their bodies and anything else being backward

>>728663883
How does that hurt them? Other than the obvious "ït's the society".

>>728663955
Why the fuck do people state the obvious?
OF COURSE FUCKING RETARD WE KNOW ABOUT THE XX AND XY.
That isn't the point.

>>728663979
What gender dysphoria? If it doesn't hurt them they wouldn't want the surgery and hormones

>>728664088
Ugliness don't hurt ugly people. So if it doesn't hurt them they wouldn't want the plastic surgery.

>>728664170
They should just learn to deal with their ugliness. Is this the point you're making?

>>728664360
No. The point is that it doesn't hurt them and yet they want the surgery anyway to make themselves feel better and more in tune to their inner beings.

>>728664469
>more in tune to their inner beings
>by mutilating themselves

>>728664806
So? Some ugly people mutilate themselves with plastic surgery and yet I don't see you complaining about that.

>>728663969
No, the initial treatment for body/gender dysphoria is counselling. AFTER that is found to be ineffective they look to treating people surgically.
It is easier to change a persons appendages than an imbalance in the brain as we dont know how the brain works properly yet.

>>728664971
Like i said ugly people should deal with their ugliness. But it's hardly in the same league as chopping your dick off

I don't knwo about the rest of all this, but there are 3 genders; male, female, intersex.

Am I the only one who genuinely doesn't care? Let people be whoever they want to be, who am I to judge anyway.

>>728665096
You have your opinion and I have mine but really why the fuck should we care if they want to chop their dicks off? I don't give a flying fuck what people do to their bodies.

>>728641819
>Thinking science supports your ridiculous and stupid notion that the only difference between the two sexes are genitalia, and everything else is 100% equal

I've got news for you kiddo, science is not on your side here.

>>728657638
You are quite literally retarded.

>>728644088
Are you fucking retarded?

Hormones have the SAME effect on males and females. However males have more of certain hormones, women have more of certain hormones. Everyone has a bit of all of them.

A person with more testosterone is more "manly" whether they're a male or female.

Example: there's lots of lesbos who are obviously more manly than you, you 21yo inbred fedora-tipping cuck.

>>728665307
Why should we care? Because young children are being taught this shit, being sent to the Tavistock institute and encouraged to start hormones. I'm just not sure it's right

>>728644912
There's no "should" in science. It's a positivist field. Just because something happens more likely or is seen as beneficial from a human perspective doesn't mean it "should" happen in a scientific sense.

I think having more than 3 genders is unnecessary and unimportant, but hey, people do what they want to do. If they choose to get castrated, then they get castrated. If they choose to get a dick sewn on to them, then they might as well just do it. If they decide to have pronouns different than what they had when they were born, then hell yes, do it. I don't fucking care.

Gender is not a social or political issue. It is just a thing we do. Today I am going to play with my willy!

>>728665568
Saved. This picture sums up everything i ment in my posts.
>>728656165
>>728657884
>>728658386
>>728659877
>>728660785
>>728661697
>>728662893

>>728665668
Are you actually telling me that they are teaching children to be transgenders? Serious? I hope you are kidding.

G*d only made two kinds, male and not male. Why are mental deficient people say otherwise?

Shit doesn't have effect on my life, shouldn't have any on yours either

>>728666079
What about your taxes paying for their welfare?

>>728641626
You are incorrect. There is MALE and FEMALE. That is the end of it. There is no argument, that is just simply fact. If you believe otherwise, seek mental help immediately because you delusional.

>>728661920
If you can't tell the difference between a thing and societies' interpretation of that thing then you're a retard.

>>728666214
So any and all societal interpretations on facts are valid?

>whos retarded here?

>>728666337
What do you call women that act like men? And what do you call them if they are lesbian?

>>728666337
>Implying I said that

File: 0bb.jpg (107KB, 1695x1077px) Image search: [Google]

107KB, 1695x1077px

>>728641626
did you just assume I would like to debate on this topic ?

File: Buck Angel.jpg (28KB, 321x450px) Image search: [Google]

28KB, 321x450px

Would you fuck this?

Did I miss the debate?

Trannies are mentally ill and it's careless to let our culture just accept it as a common thing when it's an aberration that should be medicated and therapized. The moment the US starts legislating anything related to trannies, it's a big problem.

>>728666730
its exactly what brought Babylon to a close

>>728666423
Both are still women, what they do is irrelevant to their gender.
>>728666467
No you did not, but >>728661920 im fairly sure was trying to point out that you cannot interpret a sex or gender as anything other than what it is. Society and its opinion on these facts does not matter in regard to what gender somebody is when it does not change the biology.

>>728666730
There is a difference between transvestism and transgenderism.
There that'll save you from further embarrassment. Research more if needed.

>>728666974
Again what do people generally call them?

>>728667093
Confused or mentally unwell.

>>728667187
I think you are avoiding my question because you would be forced to concede my point.

>>728667242
Put your point clearly then instead of asking questions where you expect me to miraculously get to your conclusion.

>>728667357
What do people generally fucking call the women who act like men? It's a really simple question. Farmer girls get called that word a lot.

>>728667497
Tomboys?

>>728667592
There you go. :)
Now that refers to gender.
Now you see the difference between sex and gender.
Gender is a social construct and what is in the brain.

I don't understand why OP used an image of an openly gay man who does make-up tutorials to start this thread off. Manny Mua isn't transgendered, just gay, and if I could do make-up like that motherfucker I would be getting a job that pays bank.

TL;DR: This picture doesn't prove your point

>>728667731
But gender IS a synonym of sex, what you are refering to is what is known as gender identity. All of this stuff is social sciences which have no leg to stand on against actual biological science.

>>728641626

THIS THREAD SUCKS ASS.

GO HERE >>728667444

SAGE

>>728667891
>no leg to stand
>>728661354

>>728668038
That was replied to me. And thats not social science, thats actual science in those links. So my point stands

>social science has no leg to stand on.

>>728668158
You mean you think social science is just a bunch of opinions?
Well I know what John Nash would say to that.

>>728668349
And what would a mathmatical genius have to say about that then?

>By the way you think you know what he would say, your opinions and interpretations are irrelevant in regard to what he WOULD say.

>>728668523
His theories helped advance social science.
So I'm pretty sure that whatever he said about it would be relevant.

There's two genders with some amount of fluctuation on how people see their gender, but you don't stop being male or female if you decide to cut your junk off or get a penis implant.

>>728668749
Science and Maths are retroactive, previous knowledge is always used in some way or another to disprove and old way or help a new theory. Was this his intention to advance social science with his game theories? I think not. Game theories which have failed in many scenarios just for your information.

>>728669063
They certainly have helped economics and political science.

>>728669387
Economics certainly and sure it has with social science too. I guess my main issue is that social science depends too much on society and is therefore forever changing, which in my opinion is not very scientific when you have such a messed up confused society, making new genders and new sexualitys just because they want to not because there is an actual physical presense which is proveable

Society is not a science. Simple. Society is simply the majority agreed opinions of a particular location, where minority fight to be accepted by the majority using non-scientific means of proving it. Feelings are not proof of anything, the sooner the world gets that the better.

No hate at you anon, I am simply sick of minoritys insisting the majority should change for them.

>>728641626
you are retarded.
gender is everything you are.
denying it is retarded.
you must have been sexually abused or brainwashed by shitty liberal people.

>>728670410
I am aware of many pseudo genders that they keep coming up with but I think that transgenderism is legitimate and it doesn't make them mentally ill. Granted there is not enough scientific evidence for it but it's a growing science with more and more evidence coming in. I am sure there are mentally ill people who think they're something else they are not, especially with people who think they are dogs and cats.