Being a nerdy fag that I am I got an urge to start a coding thread

>>726289320
JS for everything web based (nodejs)
C# for games (Unity)
Python when need to crunch some data.

C++ or python

C#, simple and powerful. With WinForms you can whip up a program with UI in like 5 minutes to do a simple task. Though different languages can better suit different tasks.

>>726290124
Oh and React Native (JS) for mobile apps

>>726290124
>>726290136
I heard python is only used when you need to write something that's not important, how true is that?

C# is good for anything so many professional libraries it is a very powerful language that large businesses prefer

ruby bois

>>726290293
Its interpretive, which means it is much slower. C, C++ and the like are for systems level development. Python is very much not.

>>726290615
C ?
C was my first language to learn, but really, i never go back to C after learning C++

do you happen to know if C is used for anything these days?

Java

assembly for hardware, C++ or C# for software.

python doesnt really do it for you so much as to you.... disorganized memory allocation, and the things that make it simple are the same hat make it a pain in the butt, also the data types are silly.

I have to study java for my college course. but my first language was actually batch

>>726290944
I think some operating systems still use it. Some people say C is still a better language than C++ for various reasons.

>>726291350
I am just wondering since I don't see even one advantage C has over C++

Can you name few?

>>726291350
Many many reasons.
First thing to note is the definition for "Standard".
Alao, C is still being used for building portable libraries take zlib for example
C will never dieded.

Ruby/Rails

>>726291705
Isn't memory handling another reason? I remember reading that someone didn't like the new operator for some reason, can't remember why though.

>>726289320
go to bed matt

>>726289320
Favorite languages are probably C++ C# and Python for various different tasks. Web development with js + node is also pretty nice. Java can suck my dick

>>726292283
Why hate on java when you already use c#?

>>726292283
> Java can suck my dick
why

>>726291660
C is faster than c++ (nano seconds)
C has a fucking standard (you can trust the compiler)
C can implement c++( except containers.. ugly hacks)

Templates are cool but faggots are all over them it is getting gay.

If you want absolute power use asm, else use C
For fast and fancy development use c++ compile with g++ (I almost always O3)

>>726290944
C is still really common for microprocessors.

C++. Type safe, fairly mature now days, and can use it to write solid production quality code.

>>726292639
You know a lot.
Thanks :)

C# FOR LIFE

+ Object oriented
+ Elegant as fuck
+ Easy to write it
+ Easy to read
+ Incredibly powerful
+ Awesome as tits

>>726292450
>>726292491

The problems I have with Java aren't about the fact that it has memory management or anything (just like C#). I really dislike Java's philosophy of refusing to add new and useful language features because of their commitment to backwards compatibility. I understand to some extent why they want portability considering how widespread the language is but there are tons of issues that arise from it. Incredibly simple things to implement like operator overloading or property getters and setters aren't implemented, Generics suffer from type erasure because of the limitations of Java bytecode, anonymous functions are only implemented in the relatively recent Java 8, their standard packages are way less extensive than in .net and things like that. In addition C# has some really nice features like async await, and linq which just do not have equivalents in Java.

tl;dr Java refuses to add even the simplest of new features due to maintaining portability.

>>726292639
>C can implement c++

C++ can implement C++. Google "Self hosting". Basically a language is considered serious when it can be self hosted.

>>726292450
>>726292491
not the other anon.
I don't like java because it is c++ with less control plus new shitty "technology" called GC.

The main reason I don't use Java is because of the shitty GUI and .jar extension.
You can also extract source code from .jar file.

Well if you want a high paying industry job, it's a no brainer...everyone want's kick ass C++ programmers.

>>726293186
I hate windows, so all of that makes java pretty good imo.

>>726292639
I think it is misleading to say that C is faster than C++. The reason this might be true in some cases is not because of any limitations of the language, but because the coders might sacrifice some speed to use the builtin container types and such in the standard template library which may not be well suited to the programs specific case. You can do everything in C with C++, and in fact C++ compilers these days are very often faster than C compilers because the C++ language is undergoing additional development unlike C.

I can code HTML
get on my level

>>726289320
>Being a nerdy fag that I am I got an urge to start a coding thread

>implying programming is in some way nerdy and not something that literally any indian idiot can do

>>726293179
I use c# for personal stuff.. scrappers and whatnot.
You have to mention the high memory usage and 100% cpu usage for math tasks...

I'd love to have the beauty of .NET GUI with C & c++ power (please don't mention interoperability or c++.net)

>>726293754
So what, I can type a word document.

>>726293602
Well as I said, I understand the argument for portability, but when the language was made long enough ago that they didn't consider adding many very useful features it makes it much worse to code in.

ITT people who don't even know what PLT is shill whatever language somebody else told them was great when they started, or a close relative thereof

>>726293952
I can write on a piece of paper with a crayon

>>726294135
>not coding everything in PL1

>>726294259
Oh yeah, well I can use BASIC.

>>726292283
Agreed Java sucks a fat one.

real programmers code in assembler

Yeah, The old c64 basic and Assembler

>>726294386
I can shout mock-Lua to people

>>726294600
real programmers design and produce ASICs for every script they need

>>726294688
I can scribble pseudocode on a sticky note

>>726289320
C# for big projects, Python for quick and dirty.

>>726295052
I can email binary to friends over hotmail

>>726292657
this.

>>726289320
FORTH fag reporting

>>726293712
>
It is not misleading.>>726292639 (You) #
I think it is misleading to say that C is faster than C++. The reason this might be true in some cases is not because of any limitations of the language, but because the coders might sacrifice some speed to use the builtin container types and such in the standard template library which may not be well suited to the programs specific case.


Who uses the fucking standard anyways in production code? Most use boost.
Boost IS the standard.

You can do everything using both c++ or C.
For a dinosaur such as myself, I don't care about language features.

Oh and please do explain the (s) after c++ compiler.
I have only used gcc and at some point intel to build c++ applications.
Most c++ compilers don't implement all c++ features.
I am STILL getting warnings for using C++0x syntax! ( even with correct flags. the program compiles though).

C doesn't need much development. It is.. C!
We don't want your fucking exceptions and whatnot templates.

Also, smaller .o and trust worthy compiler.

>>726289320
Not using Assembler
faggot

>>726294613
The 6502 instruction set is truly beautiful.

>>726290944
C is great for low-level things like kernels.

>>726295800
Intel or AT&T syntax?

>>726295606
Aand. I fucked it up.
ignore until the empty line.
The first part was supposed to be greentext and the answer should have been " it is not misleading"

>>726292450
because Oracle blows donkey cock

Perl if you want to write a program quickly.
C++ if you want to write a program that runs quickly.

fuck javascript

java is god

Scala because I need the jvm but don't like java

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>>726289320

Not one mention of Haskell in this thread. Y'all a bunch of faggots.

>>726295959
VAX bi@cthes

>>726289320
C for everything -> Gtk for GUi, openGL for graphics and so on and so on.
Lisp for AI and showing my superior god like logic.

>>726296200
99% of people who ever type "Haskell" when talking about programming don't know how to program. They just read web comics that reference programming.

>>726296200
Haskell is for fags.
Your mother sucks my list while tail recursing on my cock.

js is the only real web based language to learn. Everything else is fucking trash for mexicans and niggers.

>>726296408
> 99% of people who ever type "Haskell" when talking about programming don't know how to program

Honestly true. Doesn't mean the language itself is bad though.

>>726289320
fuck c#, fuck java, fuck js

c/c++, python and gameboy assembly e'ery day

>>726296695
Until you need to write a real and scalable app

>>726296122
>>726296200
I can do functional programming in Scala and use the Java stack, haskell is just impractical for my uses

>>726289320
Python for easy shit, large arrays, csv shit
node.js for web development
Been writing SQL scripts for years as a process engineer for Intel. But fuck them now. I'm looking for a new job.

>>726295606
My whole point was that any speed difference between the two is due to coding practices, not language level issues. I don't disagree that there are tons of issues with standardization in C++, thats what happens when you create a language by basically patching features onto an existing language, I've used VC++, GCC, Intel, and clang at various times, and honestly I've only rarely seen complete failure to adhere to standards, usually its something small like an extremely misleading warning, but still with a cause.

Oh and templates are fucking awesome.

>>726296792
Not true, built a lot on js backbones. jQuery node and angular are heavy duty.

>>726290944
C is used for things where speed is absolutely necessary. Like game engines and shit.

>>726296389
>Lisp for AI and showing my superior god like logic.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HM1Zb3xmvMc

>>726296885
Python is like porn. You feel like using it and it's great instant gratification then you finish and you see how ugly it is.

>>726297086
>jQuery node and angular are heavy duty.
You have to be kidding

>>726296408
>>726296721
Pretty much. That entire community is like experimental/avant garde music. It's really great for making and spreading new ideas, but hardly anybody actually listens to that shit (except for edgy faggots).

>>726297239
But there are no ;'s and the readability is just great.

>>726297707
>That entire community is like experimental/avant garde music
That has to be the worst analogy I've ever heard

You guys seem pretty knowledgeable. I only know Angular JS (I'm more of a code artisan than a programmer), but I want to get involved in the Linux kernel. Do any of you know if I could contribute without learning something low level like Python?

>>726297836
It's perfect¡¡¡¡

We need twenty more in different colors.

>>726297739
I'm with the other guy; there's just something "dirty" about using indentation instead curly brackets to define code blocks.

>>726297836
I meant the entire PLT or experimental community of languages, not the people themselves.

>>726297972
>artisan
Go suck off a Thai ladyboy while a Nigerian prince fucks your ass as a prerequisite to giving you a million dollars you'll never receive.

This is like asking which is a better tool, a screw driver or a hammer?

>>726298009
well that's your opinion. I prefer the readability of python. But yeah its slow. I used Python to build a scraping app for personal info on craigslist and backpage personals and linking phone #s to facebook accounts.

>>726297972
nice bait

>>726289320
Learning JS in college, but I heard from someone I should start teaching myself python

>>726296200
haskell is bae <3

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>>726297972
>without learning something low level like Python?

>>726298361
screw driver. cause if it's big enough i can use it as a hammer

>>726296927
You can write bad code with any programming language.

no disagreement.

Yes, templates are awesome.

I think we both can agree that C must be used when you have to know everything that is happening atm. with no abstraction what-so-ever. (no compiler confusion).

>>726298929
>templates are awesome
wh.. what?

What's the deal with C#? I'm assuming it's object oriented and has a bunch of neato convenience like C++, but what's the difference in philosophy?

Hey guys, I'm going to be starting a web development course in two weeks. In preparation for the course I started learning some coding.

So far I've learned the basics of HTML/CSS, SQL, and JavaScript.

I have a question though, my biggest problem so far is being able to code off the top of my head. Like when codeacademy tells me to do something without at least setting me up, I become completely lost and frequently have to resort to using the hint. Is it just that I need more practice or what?

Coding is literally like the last thing I have left for me in terms of career path so I can not fuck this up. However I'm starting to lose faith given that I need to look up shit every new lesson. That being said, I can read the code and interpret what it will do, it's just the writing that I'm having difficulty with.

FORTRAN. Greatest language ever, and still used extensively behind the scenes in a lot of things dealing with numbers.

Anyone for Lua?

>>726299268
That's a weird way to spell COBOL.

>>726299143
honestly you just need practice
being a good programmer is not really about knowing this language or that language, it is a way of thinking. The ability to break down a problem into its atomic components is not one you get without just a bunch of practice. As time goes on you will also get better at determining what are good and bad abstractions.

>>726298929
Yeah I definitely agree with that. I admit that on more than one occasion I have dug into an issue for hours only to discover some obscure undocumented behavior of my C++ compiler ;)

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What sort of math do I need to program ai in vidya gayums? I regression analysis and probability models, and did well in both, but thatwas many years ago.

Python. I can generate working code nearly as fast as I can think of it, and if I need to handle hardware I can make wrappers for existing C code.

>>726299719
depends too much on what exactly you are talking about when you say AI to give a good answer imo

Could range anywhere from a very simple state machine to a fully trained neural network

>>726299719
At least algebra is essential for being decent at any programming, and that covers most of what you need in most games. Whether you need more depends upon what you're doing, since every game mechanic can require different things. Most math is probably going to be in physics, graphics, (I suddenly mentally lost it), AI, or in rare cases, performance analysis (really it can show up anywhere, as I said). For 3d, you need precalc at least. More math is always better, though. Might as well learn calc and get it out of the way, which also develops the mathematical reasoning relevant to programming.

>>726299143
Start small. Making a static web page with only html and css is one thing. Javascript, even with JQuery isn't the most beginner friendly way to start. Add backend development and its a mess for a beginner. I'd start with Python / Java / C# and work your way out from there.

>>726298984
*for c++ only.
Although I don't care about language features..
I still think it is NEAT not having to copy and paste containers for different types.

I don't want them anywhere near C though. (Because C is C)
If I WANT abstraction and indirect-ness, I'd go for c++.

>>726299719


>>726299995
this. Also:
Fundamentally an AI is always supposed to be able to beat you (i.e. chess).
Whether you are in a fps or rts the AI is dumbed down so you stand a chance at victory.

Shooter example: Make an AI. Have it automatically aim at the player. Add randomizer that makes them miss in accordance to difficulty. Imagine letting your little brother win when you play against them in vidya. The player is the little brother.

>>726289320
Game Developer here.

I want to learn C++ for coding in game engines and such. Where's a good place to start/good online resource to teach myself.

I can draw/model/animate but also want to learn to code and become self sufficient so I don't have to rely on a coder all the time.

>>726293597
What industry are hiring C++ programmers?
In the US what is the pay range?

>>726300413
>abstraction and indirectness
>c++

>>726300635
Sorry I mean C#

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I use Java because that's what my school taught me and for no other reason.

>>726300872
im so sorry

>>726289320
C.
fuck OOP. the only good thing in OOP are exceptions.
and overloading.

I use PHP because it the easiest to use and it is what apple uses for the iPhone iOS

>>726290194
Can confirm. A good, balanced answer. Also AngularJS, so good on the client side. For a simple, file-based database, use LiteDB

>>726289320
I enjoy python, although it's not what I use most of the time. Definitely my favorite though, object-oriented programming is just so clean.

>>726292450
Among many, C# is considered "Java done right". No need to load 9 conflicting libraries when the core framework already has the functionality built in. :)

>>726293179
>C# FOR LIFE
>+ Object oriented
>+ Elegant as fuck
>+ Easy to write it
>+ Easy to read
>+ Incredibly powerful
>+ Awesome as tits
REPRESENT!

>>726300635
>i can draw/model/animate

You're pretty much there, man. Programmings all memorization, and it doesn't take years to get good at it like it does with drawing and animating.

https://learnpythonthehardway.org/book/ex0.html

However, I'd recommend you start with this before jumping into C. Learning any easy language like python makes C a lot less daunting when you get there. Get to around ex45 and you should be good to get going with C++.

You have no excuse to not be making games within the next 6 months, anon. Fucking do it, and make us proud.

>>726302035
>tethered to microshit

>>726301931
>done right
see above

BASIC nigger, if you can't do it in BASIC it don't need done

>>726302166
>Fellow master-race detected

Do you use EMACS or VI?

>>726302331
Vi.

>>726302414
>not having a web browser in your text editor

Why live?

>>726302517
I have a web browser as a separate application though.

>>726289320
C++ is my favourite language, since I like to undertake some cryptographic implementations for fun in my spare time (and I'm not familiar with more mathematically-efficient languages like C)

A number of my games can be modded with Python, so I write some of that, too.

At work, all of our executables are strictly controlled by IT, so pretty much the only languages I can write in are WScript and VBA, which both have surprisingly robust functionality if your code isn't particularly processor-heavy.

How many of you faggots can host web pages with node.js that query and append MySQL databases?

>>726302166
>You)
Lol. Microsoft does kind of suck. Its products are just tools, so if you have the basics, you can use anything.

>>726302166
>2017
>hating on Microsoft
C# and .NET have been open source since 2014 nigger.

>>726302517
Convert to the church, you VI heathen.

>>726302146
>>726302146
>Programmings all memorization, and it doesn't take years to get good at it like it does with drawing and animating.
Horseshit. Programming is just as much an art as any other. You can solve simple problems by memorization, or even complex ones by throwing shit together, but it becomes unmanagable, buggy, impossible to extend, and the end product ends up shit.
>However, I'd recommend you start with [Python] before jumping into C.
Why jump to C at all? I'm not a Python shill, I won't get into what I'd recommend right now, but there's no reason to move to something less managable until you actually exceed the boundaries of you rcurrent tool.
>You have no excuse to not be making games within the next 6 months, anon. Fucking do it, and make us proud.
I can agree with this. The games will be shitty and small, but I bet, if you put yourself to it, you could get decent sales within a few years!

>>726302703
Yeah, python's really useful as an offhand language. It plays nice with most of what's used today, and is great for games.

>>726302740
Never tried node.js - but hosting web pages with a RDBMS isn't hard. These days people turn white at the prospect of not using tumblr

>>726302856
Hopefully that Indian fellow will take them to better places than BALL(GAG)MER

>>726302146
Dope, thanks man. And yea im actually working on game rn, though im not programming im the artist!

>>726302916
Well, the thread was asking what resource he should use for C++, so I didn't want to tell him not to learn that. I did want to at least suggest learning python first, because it's a fucking great language and is great for first-timers.

Not really horseshit, by the way. The only thing that stops people from programming (unless they're fucking stupid) is whether or not they want to. If you try to learn, you will.

>>726301810
>python object-oriented
This is true
>python clean
This is debatable
>object-oriented clean
This is also debatable

I've actually learned to like Python whitespace requirements over brackets, but I hate the dynamic typing. It makes code so ugly. You can just shove shit anywhere, and it works, until it doesn't.

>>726302946
never tried RDBMS. Lots of reasons to not host your own website, like fucking around with port forwarding and shit, but I have my own live website that runs on a raspberry pi for minor entertainment and for the lulz.

>>726302035
>>726301931
I've really come to like C# more and more over the years, particularly after working in Java for a long time, you work in C# for a bit, and it's like... Coding in a version of Java from 50 years in the future, where all this garbage has been fixed.

Java because it is the only one Ive spent a decent amount of time using.

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>>726303242
Yeah, but that's true of anything. Anybody can draw stick figures and symbol-draw. Anybody can invest a ton of time into something without much practice and come out with something rather detailed, even, but I doubt it'd even come close to pic related, and I bet they had been learning for months.

The best language is the one you use the most.

>>726303653
I feel it's more true for programming, especially since your form of input (keyboard) is a skill that almost everyone has these days. It takes years to be able to draw a realistic person with a pencil and some dabbing paper, but you only have to spend a few months with a decent language to be able to code a solid game engine.

>>726303073
They are on a good track right now.
>sizeable and continuing contributions to open source
>new browser abiding by modern standards
>consumer products beating out Apple for design recognition
Windows 10 is actually a pretty ballin' OS, if it wasn't for the advertisements (which you can disable). I wish my Linux distro at work was half as smooth as Win10. (Or I wish Win10 was built on a *nix file structure and terminal, though at least they kinda have native Bash now.)

>>726289320
Question for you all. Old dude so started with Fortran and Pascal. Taught myself C no problem. Tried to learn C+ on my own and just couldn't do it. Just can't seem to wrap my mind around object code. Something about going from distinct blocks of memory to things apparently just floating about in space.

Anyways, any other people with problems with jump between object code and older types of code? Is transition harder in one direction rather than the other?.

Another fag hoping to jump into coding from scratch.

Lots of good info but, learn python, java, or C# first?

>>726289320
C++ is shit tier.

Java all day every day.

The power of muh multi threading is Godly.

>>726304119
If you're having trouble with objects, try python. Some anon linked a good resource above for it.

>>726304119
I'd say the transition is harder going from garbage-collected systems to manual memory management, for sure.
Going from Java to C, if I forget to properly handle memory, I've got leaks or corruption or segfaults.
Going from C to Java, sure, I might feel confused or uncomfortable, but I can't really fuck it up.

At work we are building libraries for self-driving cars using C and Assembly.

>>726304166
Java

Its pretty easy to learn and pick up on, and its "c like" so when you transition to C or C++ it'll be easier.

It also helps you pick up JavaScript quickly, because the syntax is fairly similar.

>>726304288
Dude wut?

>>726304502
The last good thing that came out of C and Assembly was Roller Coaster Tycoon.

You've got some big shoes to fill.

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>>726304515
Thanks for the input!

>>726304693
If you knew what we were doing you'd understand why. Other parts use different languages like cameras and collision software.

NOBODY HAS SAID THIS YET, BUT FOR THE LOVE OF GOD OP, USE A GOOD TEXT EDITOR.
Atom is fine if you don't want to use a terminal-based editor, but do NOT just use notepad or mousepad or some bullshit like that. Please, for the love of GOD. A good editor which uses syntax highlighting is essential.

Going to bed so I won't be following up, but it seems like a lot of the people on this thread would benefit from picking up Golang and Rust. Golang solves a lot of that "mystic behavior" and sloppy OOP that C++ has with a refreshed and concise standard thats pretty clear.

The other's a functional language that works wonders for concurrency. No, but like actually functional, not that bull shit function soup MFers make these days.

Eh. At work we use Ruby for devops and it's terrible. That said, as a utility language (quick tools, number crunching, wrappers, plugins) its amazing as long as the scope is left small.

PS: I use Vim without any plugins and do pretty fine. I code on Linux, OSx, and Windows. They're all fine and bear their own limitations; no use being a tard simply cause the others aren't what you're good with.

(CentOS and OSx makes me kinda frustrated sometimes though, but not for any good reasons)

>>726304011
The analogy was more directed at the art anon than you. I really doubt anybody could make a "solid" engine only two years in, either (at least not one of any real complexity). I got about halfway through defending my point, but I realized I don't really have time to continue this, since I should have gone to bed an hour ago. That said, goodnight.

rust seems cool.

>>726289320
C++ is a horrible nightmare you autistic faggot.
Nothing reaches the beauty of pure C.

>>726289320
whitespace to save printer ink

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>>726305062
Real niggas use emacs.

The UI is so ass it helps me code faster.

>>726305382
Here we see a mono-language autist attempting to defend his lack of brain cells.

>>726305382
It's pretty amazing that C++ and most languages in the C family are so awful that they make C look beautiful.

C is ugly and impure. Not too bad, but beautiful is not a word I'd think to describe it with.

>>726305467
MY NIGGA RIGHT HERE

JOIN THE CHURCH MU'FUCKAS

>>726305382
Then tell me why I have to make three methods just to fucking manipulate strings.

Malloc, MALLOC!

>>726305062
I used Jet Brains for Python and Visual Studio for everything else. I really like Business Essentials for making SSRS websites.

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>>726289320
python
science package
nigga

>>726305467
> DOS line terminators
> fucked up indentation
> emacs GUI mode
kys noob

>>726305467
I looked at your image before your post and almost yelled at you for not configuring the UI at all. Then I saw that it was intentional.

>>726306065
I miss ctrl+shift+f in Eclipse.

>>726306200
fuck reroll

>>726305467
not formatted
still uses strtok()
i hope char *fields[] has enough space for all the fucking tokens there

malloc()s strlen(s1) + strlen(s2) + space for nullterminated, then just copies s2 and returns it...

im off to sleep. it's nightmares tonight.

>>726290944
programming MCUs nigga
as an engineering student I use C quite a bit and we aren't even required to learn it

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>>726306102
Theres enough cucks out there with a black background and pink text. If I wanted to be a fag I'd use vim.

>>726289320
Real men use assembly
Higher level languages are for faggots

>>726306592
I program in 0s and 1s cuck

>>726306509
eeeeh if you know the lengths (and you do since you strlen()'d both) why the fuck dont you just memcpy() that.
strcat() has to find the end first, so basically an extra call to strlen().
mmmmeh.

>>726306672
also that else is just basically return(strdup(s2));

what if you get ENOMEM?

>>726299268
>not using ruby
>not using Haskell

C++ if you're a cuck, C if you're not

>>726306672
>>726306813
ALSO WHAT THE FUCKING HELL, YOU MALLOC RESULT THEN MALLOC IT AGAIN?
nigga you fucking leak memory

>>726306984
lmao

I wrote that concatenate function a year and a half ago, I was just learning C. I go back to the file whenever I need it.

I just know the shit works.

10/10

>>726289320
C++ is good.

I'm conflicted between C++ and C89. C89 is cleaner but it's a little TOO clean, sometimes I just want to make a thing that works without having to make everything that goes inside it too. But then I use C++ and I remember, oh, that's right, my program's going to be bigger and slower because it's going to be full of stuff I imported but didn't use because I only wanted to use other stuff that was in the same compilation unit. I guess that's an inevitable problem with using other people's stuff to make your stuff instead of just making your own stuff, no matter what language you're working with.

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>>726304119
Finally, you become familiar with topoi, and study the internal logic of categories
then familiarize yourself with (general) type theory, and its applications to programming. I also recommend studying how to reformulate mathematics in terms of globular categories for use in automatic theorem proving, because there is an inherent programming-like 'feel' to it.

>>726304166
First you brush up on your basic math:
Arithmetic, a little geometry, elementary algebra, and some basic trig.

Next get a standard calculus text and dive in. You should also get a linear algebra and discrete math books as well; make sure the discrete text is proof based (I recommend Mathematics: a Discrete Introduction by Scheinerman or A Transition to Advanced Mathematics by Smith, both of which can be accessed by simply googling the name, author and PDF; in fact you can get free pdf copies of textbooks for every subject this way).
Once you're a couple chapters in to your discrete book (you will want to have covered basic proposition and higher order logic, and basic proofs), you may begin learning programming and computer architecture. As a litmus test, if you don't know what this statement is

∀P((0∈P∧∀i(i∈P-->i+1∈P))-->∀n(n∈P))

you aren't ready to take the reins of a computer.

Now, forget what you do know about computer programming:

First, you learn boolean logic operations
then, you learn transistor logic
then, you learn how to build functional units from logic gates
then, you learn CPU design
then, and only then, you learn assembly language
then, after you have mastered assembly language (not dabbled, but mastered it), you learn C
then, after you have mastered C, you may learn the higher-level languages of your choice, but you will always use C and assembly as your primary languages because everything else is unnecessary bloat.

By this time you should be finished with your calculus (up to advanced integration techniques and vector basics), discrete, and linear algebra, and are ready for the next wave of math: abstract algebra, analysis, multivariate and vector calculus, and, after you have progressed a way in those, topology.

>>726307342
9gag = fag

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>>726307342

>>726307267
and leaks memory.
FIX IT NAO FOR FUCKING FUCKS SAKE.
noticed another one.
"only s1 can be NULL" well good luck trying strlen(NULL) then.

>>726307688
If it aint broke, dont fix it.

i like dick. fuck this thread. i just like dick. fucking a man.

>>726289320
C# for Unity

Where can I find good tutorials to learn C++ from scratch, up to a really advanced level ?

brainfuck is the true programmer's language.

$$ > $

thats the only language that is important

even if you have to murder babies as long as you get money

What language is best for browser interaction?

>>726309238
Ruby

>>726307488
>∀P((0∈P∧∀i(i∈P-->i+1∈P))-->∀n(n∈P))
First of all, this statement is malformed. You can't use the universal quantifier without a set operand. For all P in *what*? There is no universal set of all mathematical objects, nor can there be one.
I'll try to ignore this glaring error and continue evaluating.
>For all P (if (0 is in P and for all i (if i is in P then i + 1 is in P)) then for all n (n is in P))
Let's break this up into chunks.
>0 is in P and for all i (if i is in P then i + 1 is in P)
So this portion of the statement seems to be replaceable with "P is a superset of the nonnegative integers."
>For all P (if P is a superset of the nonnegative integers then for all n (n is in P))
Breaking it down some more.
>for all n (n is in P)
This clearly proclaims P to be a superset of the implied universal set. (*ahem* Which doesn't exist.)
>For all P (if P is a superset of the nonnegative integers then P is a superset of the universal set)
This claim is then expressible as
>all supersets of the nonnegative integers are supersets of the universal set
==>
>the nonnegative integers are a superset of the universal set
==>
>all mathematical objects are nonnegative integers


... this statement is stupid

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>>726309287
Ruby is server-side; JavaScript is the language for browser interaction.

>>726309238
Give malbolge a shot

>>726309330
It's the principle of mathematical induction expressed in second order logic

>>726309603
That doesn't particularly matter if you know how to use AJAX. Just send Ruby the browser state via AJAX and have it send back the modified browser state, and voila, you're interacting with the browser through Ruby.

>>726289320
C# Master-race. Game dev in Unity, God-like web design with ASP.NET MVC.

Javascript for front-end shit. Specifically AngularJS or Knockout if I'm strapped for time

>>726309922
I refuse to use a language that has "unsafe" sections. C# is for cucks.

>>726310060
unsafe sections?

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>>726309330

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>>726310148
Used when dealing with pointers.

>>726310485
Why?

>>726310963
Because its a language made by cucks for cucks. They're scared of pointers.

>>726309814
No, it's not. It's nothing expressed in anything, because any statement of the form ∀P(p(P)), where p is a predicate, is malformed. You need ∀P∈Q(p(P)), where p is a predicate and Q is a set. As it is now, it's a definition of an unspecified set in terms of other unspecified sets.

Here's a correct version:
∀P∈P(N)((0∈P∧∀i∈N(i∈P-->i+1∈P))-->∀n∈N(n∈P))

This reads:
"For all P in the power set of the set of all natural numbers, if 0 is in P and it is the case for all i in the set of all natural numbers that if i is in P then i + 1 is in P, then for all n in the set of all natural numbers, n is in P."
In other words, "For all subsets P of the natural numbers, if 0 is in P and everything in P also has its successor in P, then P is a superset of the natural numbers (i.e., is exactly the natural numbers, because it's already been established P is also a subset)."
In other words, I've turned your definition of an unspecified set in terms of other unspecified sets into a recursive definition of the natural numbers--surely what you intended.

>>726290124
I have no reason to post, because you took the words out of my mouth.

>>726311093
They should be. These days there's rarely if ever a good reason to manually manage memory. Everything should be done through reseatable garbage-collected references.

>>726290124
>JS for everything web based (nodejs)
>web based
>(nodejs)
Pick one. NodeJS is SPECIFICALLY the distribution of JavaScript intended to NOT NECESSARILY be used for web content. Brainlet.

itt: college students who've completed intro to cs

>>726311322
>Everything should be done through reseatable garbage-collected references.
That would drain performance intensive programs.

Theres no reason to hide from the tools of base memory.

Good books / links to learn C# and C++ ?

(Same question for Unity / Unreal Engine)

>>726311549
>That would drain performance intensive programs.
"Would", yes, but not "does". Get with the times, grandpa.
>Theres no reason to hide from the tools of base memory.
Reason #1: They suck.
Reason #2: They're 100% obsolete

Fun fact. Pointers and references are only different in the abstract sense. They compile to identical machine code with GCC and MSVC compiler when used for identical purposes.

>>726311433
He just knows the buzzwords, pal.

>>726311783
Where can you even learn this kind of information, and can it have any use ?

>>726311783
Fun fact #1: That abstract sense in which they're different is important in and of itself.
Fun fact #2: Reseatable garbage-collected references are very significantly and profoundly different from ordinary pointers. If references are pointers with clothes on, reseatable garbage-collected references are pointers with Goku clothes on and bellies full of steroids.

Currently in the software engineering carrer. We mostly use Java, C#, PHP and Fortran.

>>726311095
Okay I concede it was malformed, but that original post was intended to troll the guy asking for help anyway

>>726311723
If you understand memory, you can program a lot better especially when using bit shifting and masks. As well as for using certain algorithms, such as Radix sort on integers.

Pointers as well. You can't even do network programming without pointers you cuck; especially true in C.

>>726311469
Shhh adults are talking right now. Most of us are in our 30s and 40s have been here since around the time your mom sold her pussy on the night your mistake ridden ass ruined her figure and tits.

>>726297086
>heavy duty
js runs on a single fucking thread. Heavy duty my ass. Then again, you probably don't know what a thread is.

>>726312265
Do you want to take this outside you pompous little faggot? Talk shit get hit, bitch

>>726312207
Except me
>23
>beginner programmer
Pray that by grace of Tzeench my path is made to reach success!
Or call me a faggot.
Both are valid forms of positive reinforcement.

>>726289320

I make a lot of enterprise scaled apps with a heavy user base of 40k-50k users and multiple DB clusters in MSSQL, MYSQL, and MongoDB. I'v recently made the switch from java to C#/.net and its much better to maintain, support, and patch. Java was a nightmare to troubleshoot across a scaled business, especially with tiered app security. With C# its nice to be able to use windows event logging and write your own exceptions using windows libraries. It was easier to just write it, create documentation in a KB form, then pass it off to service desk or tier 1 support. This way i don't have to fucking hire idiot java developers just to figure out dumb shit java tends to do and get called in the middle of the night because SLAs. Also its nice to have powershell do monitoring for my app, so i can get live heuristics and IO on a dashboard so I can get heath reports on the fly on both app, os, and hardware. Having Visual Studio assist with SAML based auth on my app for integration end points is also really nice since it uses some prebuilt .net frameworks. With C# i can rapid deploy solutions, something i couldn't so easily accomplish with java.

>>726312084
>If you understand memory, you can program a lot better especially when using bit shifting and masks. As well as for using certain algorithms, such as Radix sort on integers.
Yeah, but programming "better" is a dead art. The hardware is so good we don't need good software anymore. All we have to do is write shit that works and doesn't break. Performance doesn't matter. Like, at all.

>Pointers as well. You can't even do network programming without pointers you cuck; especially true in C.
You can hardly do any kind of programming at all without pointers. Even assembly uses pointers; in fact, it uses them more than C does, because it doesn't take care of transferring data between memory and registers automatically for you like C does. Also, almost all if not all high level languages use pointers, you just can't see them.

As for doing network programming without EXPOSED pointers:
>PHP
>Java
>Ruby
>Almost anything else that's streamed to the processor during execution instead of existing in a complete compiled form on-disk

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>>726312265
>Then again, you probably don't know what a thread is.

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>>726305665
> methods
I think you mean functions. And what the fuck are you doing nigger?
Strings are easy as fuck to manipulate, you just need to know memory
management. Free after you allocate, don't rely on the OS to do it for you.

awk for scripting
c is for serious
lisp when I'm lazy

>>726311996
I agree. There are demonstrably beneficial scenarios and idioms in which you definitely want one over the other.

For example, since c++11, you can return a reference to a static locally scoped variable. This is fantastic for singletons. And things like:

// Inside any function
static std::mutex mu;
std::lock_guard<std::mutex> lock(mu);
// Immediately thread safe function omg

These would not work in quite the same way with pointer semantics.

Similarly, theres a reason PIMPL is not called RIMPL.

My point is that I was only describing something that I learned recently. More often than not, you're not going to get any noticeable difference using pointers/references.

>>726313069
Or just use Java, which is superior in every way that matters and inferior only in ways that don't.

BTW, ways that don't:
>time complexity of algorithms
>space complexity of algorithms
>space complexity of data structures

>>726311924
Stack overflow. People from various programming forums and IRCs/Discords.

>>726312871
It does make a difference. Running A* in C properly and A* in Java has a noticable time difference.

The same goes for bidirectional search. Just like big O, it doesn't seem like it matters until you load the system more and more.

O(n^2) doesn't seem that bad compared to O(n) until you start using it heavily with larger constructs.

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any love for HDLs?

>>726313359
>you can return a reference to a static locally scoped variable
Wait you couldn't do this from the beginning?
...wait
Couldn't you just store the static locally scoped variable in a static function that returns a pointer to it, and then export a function that returns the reference that results from dereferencing that pointer? Wouldn't this accomplish exactly the same thing?

And if there IS this alternative way of doing exactly the same thing, why the hell has the simpler way of doing it not been available all along? Just because no one thought of it?

Favorite language is C++ followed by Python (and especially if I'm allowed both) followed by C followed distantly and reluctantly by Java.

I'm terrible at maths... should I give up my dreams of becoming a coder?

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Smalltalk was generations ahead of it time. Modern languages like C# and Swift follow a lot of the original Smalltalk paradigms. We now have computers that can build Smalltalk written programs now.

>>726289320
straight up assembly all compiler fags out!!!

>>726313623
Moore's law. We're fast approaching the singularity. The hardware is getting faster faster than the software can get slower; by the time you even HAVE that large of a load to process, improvements to the fundamental computational model have been made that make it doable with even the shittiest program.

Accumulating data to process takes time. As it happens, technology is now growing so fast, that technological growth takes LESS time.

>>726314047
No, just get better at math. You're only bad at it because you don't actually do us enough. It's just like learning literally anything else. It's just repeated assosciation between two things. Learn to assosciation with numbers (better get, concepts).

>>726314047
When you start coding, you won't be terrible at math anymore. Coding is like math except:
1) Not all variables are numbers, some are sentences instead.
2) You make the laws. You don't have to memorize so-and-so's law of numbers or whatever. You invent them. All of them. And more of them than you can count. Instead of solving the math problems, you're now writing the math problems, having an electronic servant solve them, and enjoying watching the desirable behavior that results.

>>726314047
Learning code in college is a mistake because you get a fuckton of math that isn't useful to the field you're going into.
If you want the piece of paper that says CS Degree on it, you'll have to tough it out.
Otherwise, just learn your shit and learn it well and you'll be more valuable than any CS grad fresh out of college.

>>726314150
>Moore's law. We're fast approaching the singularity.
Singularity is the atheist / agnostics version of The Rapture.

Always coming soon but never happens.

how do i go about learning c++ and java before my courses start? about to switch to computer science in college, i know basic c++ and no java at all. Basic c++ as in functions and if statements and all that beginner shit.

>>726313418
C:
> Doesn't need a runtime
> lightweight as fuck
> not oop.
> doesn't need a VM.
> simple and relatively small.
> used forever and has a billion libraries for everything.
Java is shit for kiddies who want to make their very first gaemes or by business owners who can't afford to rewrite their software.

>>726314349
This. I'm currently in college and have been working for 2 years as a network engineer. When I'm 22 and have 4 years of experience, I'd be more valuable than most grad students. However, I'm also getting my degree while working. It's not a fun life most of the time, but I hope it will be worth it in the end.

>>726314150
There are limits to technology. The only reason hardware is improving and not plateauing is because of parallel processes; you can only fit a finite amount of paths on a chip, so you need to utilize all available space.

This is why functional programming is becoming increasingly important, because it disallows info bleeding on parallel constructs.

No matter how advanced technology becomes, there will still be faster and better ways to structure a program to have the most optimized result.

>>726314484
Good, good, keep believing we're not already there.
That's what they need you to think.

*puts on sunglasses and spontaneously disappears*

>>726314285
>>726314344
>>726314349
You guys actually boosted my motivation a shitload, I find it hard to really get stuck into coding because I'm just expecting failure, the whole learning process frustrates me a lot sometimes

>>726314538
>C:
>> Doesn't need a runtime
>> lightweight as fuck
>> not oop.
>> doesn't need a VM.
>> simple and relatively small.
>> used forever and has a billion libraries for everything.
C is one step form assembly. Write a server app in C, it will outperform anything written in Java or Rails by 10x to 100x in performance. Many companies have cashed in well by writing server apps in C and keeping server resource fees low.

>>726314766
>Good, good, keep believing we're not already there.
>That's what they need you to think.
>*puts on sunglasses and spontaneously disappears*
The singularity is a myth.

>>726314047
Nope, you simply go back to the basics and get caught up. That's what I did, and I'm about to graduate with a double major in math and cs with a stats minor. Seriously, when I first got back into it, I didn't even know the ins and outs of doing fractions.

>>726314903
My man.

>>726289320
>>726290124
>>726290194
>>726291277

i use c# for pretty much everything
c++ for commandline stuff sometimes
i like perl for pulling web stuff
propietary language based on java 1.0 for work

>>726314903
>am starting to be persuaded to try C

>>726314538
>Doesn't need a runtime
Yes it does. It's called a binary.
>lightweight as fuck
Doesn't matter, the hardware has outgrown such concerns.
>not oop
This is a disadvantage.
>doesn't need a VM
This is also a disadvantage. You shouldn't have to recompile code for every platform you want to use it on. That's absurd.
>simple and relatively small
Again, hardware has outgrown these concerns.
>used forever and has a billion libraries for everything
Ever heard of a package? There are, like, a lot of them.

>>726289320
C MOTHERFUCKER!

>>726315169
You're going to get a lot of shit flung at you for this

>>726315169
>>726315294
RIP anon

c is the only best language
doing java right now

C++ is great and fun until you get a " sorry, not implemented" compiler message

>>726315009
>>726315156
Learn Berkeley sockets or raw socket programming, you'll make the Internet your bitch.

The Java VM is written in C!

>>726315156
It may be confusing at first but when you understand it, it feels so good.
Pointers are the only semi confusing part. It makes sense if you just remember
"Its not a variable, array, or anything like that, its just the location of it."

Somebody tell me where I can learn C++ on my own. All I know is the basics, pls

What is the best language for pentesters/malware coders? I'm really interested in trying to follow a career path of 'ethical hacking'

>>726315451
Pointer arithmetic and manipulation, when mastered, is actually amazingly useful

>>726315449
>The Java VM is written in C!
The Java VM wouldn't have been written at all if C was good enough.
If anything, the fact that Java relies on C should be evidence in favor of Java

>>726315580
bash

>>726290944
>do you happen to know if C is used for anything these days?
Only things that are important and you don't want to fail:

Operating systems, planes, spacecraft, medical devices, or anything which could kill a man.

It's dominant in "embedded development".


>>726291660
You know what the fuck it's doing and there aren't 15 billion layers of abstraction and misdirection between you and the hardware.

It is THEE most portable language out there. Seriously, C is where compilers start. They might take your language to something other than x86 intel some day, but C is already there.

It's not controlled by Microsoft, Oracle, or Google.

>>726290124
>Python when need to crunch some data
R is better shithead

>>726315580
Scratch

>>726315791
KEK

>>726315780
I was thinking this too, I was just too timid to speak out

>>726315727
Amen, man. Fortran and slide rules took mankind to the moon. Now we have fucking facebook and oop.

>>726315605
Anything you can think of that pointer arithmetic is good for, data structures are better for it.

Bigger, clunkier, but better.

>>726315780
octave/matlab is actually pretty amazing, too.

>>726315977
Don't they cost $$$ though?

>>726315791
Its so hardcore it was developed by MIT

>>726315580
you're probably going to want to study web languages for pentesters (html, javascript, etc) and for malware? probably assembly if you wanted to create it, but i guess since you want to do the opposite, know enough of java/c# to read deobfuscated code?

>>726316034
Not octave.

>>726315948
That's probably true. It depends on how much abstraction you prefer, really, unless the specific project calls for certain requirements.

>>726307488

that's only if you're a minor in math. my CS bachelor's is like:

127A/127B learn java to a basic level
245 intro to discrete math
252 learn binary/octal/hex, 32bit assembly, and then CPU design (it's last and pointless to know ahead of assembly
352 systems programming and UNIX where you learn C
335 advanced java object-oriented
345 more discrete math
??? compilers (make a compiler in C)
??? operating systems (make an OS in C)
445 algorithms

and maybe some electives. there's nothing else core i can think of. i'm also going to take the C graphics course but um, you don't need more than calc II. i got to the T, K, N, whatever 3D shit in calc III and realized it fucking sucked and i didn't even need it for the major.

most CS people HATE math. you're a left brain psycho.

>>726315977
I remember using Matlab to help write chords from any song. It worked for basic chords but getting into the nitty gritty made it pretty impractical

>>726315727
>Only things that are important and you don't want to fail:
>Operating systems, planes, spacecraft, medical devices, or anything which could kill a man.
>It's dominant in "embedded development".
This.

C was designed for processors that had storage in kilobytes and not megabytes.

The first machine to run programs written in C ran on the VAX PDP-8 at Bell Labs. This ran the switching of the Bell System in the 70s as automated mechanical switching was phased out.

That performance level is now in micro-controllers where C programming thrives replacing hand assembly.

>>726289320
I have to decide between Java and C++ next semester. What are the pros and cons of each? Or just blast me with bias and I'll try to weigh both opinions.

>>726315451
I've dabbled with C++ and understand what pointers are but efficient use of them hasn't clicked for me yet. I know there's some clever uses for them but I haven't worked with C++ enough to find any.

>>726315449
I don't really have any ideas for projects where writing socket stuff myself would be useful but the raw-ness of C makes me want to feel cool using it for other stuff lol

>>726298929
>Yes, templates are awesome.

wtf is a MilStd1553MsgMap?

Oh, obviously: typedef std::map<int, Tdk::Shared_ptr<Tdk::MsgQ<std::pair<int, Tdk::Shared_ptr<MilStd1553RtMessage> > > > > MilStd1553MsgMap;

... you motherfuckers.

>>726316069
MIT is the clickbait of universities. Sometimes their stuff is good, but don't take everything they do as gospel.

>>726307488
im a career programmer and i have absolutely no idea what that gobbledygook means. our field needs to seriously amend how we teach if people think that shit's necessary to code.

>>726316148
Java is a clunkier, more verbose and in a way restricted language that, despite the previously listed flaws runs on any platform that has a JVM, and android. It's speed approaches c++ in some cases, and it has a garbage collector.

C++ is sometimes faster, has manual memory management, much nicer genetics via templates (imo), and can be used for programming anything for which there is a compiler, without needing a JVM. Despite having loads of nice features, it's been getting progressively more bloated and complex, making it really hard to learn the entire language.

>>726316159
technically every time you use an array you're using a pointer. the array name is the pointer to the 0th index.

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>>726316082

to add to this, i missed a section. i still think i really want to take both compilers AND operating systems because i'm interested but i'll figure that out later.

MEXICANS DO ANYTHING FOR FREE IF IT EXCUSES THEIR HOMOSEXUAL PEDO DESIRE

>>726290293
Python is good for making improvements that fit your needs on programs like autocad etc... pretty useful for engineering

>>726316082
>>726316415
So you both know how to mop up spilled caffeinated drinks and pizza crusts. Cool story kiddo.

>>726316159
>I don't really have any ideas for projects where writing socket stuff myself would be useful but the raw-ness of C makes me want to feel cool using it for other stuff lol
There are a lot of low power WiFi chips coming out where ports of some of the original TCP/IP stacks are running. Also, you can do TCP/IP sockets over BLE. Even better, UDP sockets on BLE is screaming for mass implementation.

>>726316505
Yes, but unlike pointers arrays can not alias, making them more efficient for numerical computations because the compiler can generate better code.

>>726316415
>im a career programmer and i have absolutely no idea what that gobbledygook means. our field needs to seriously amend how we teach if people think that shit's necessary to code.
You need to be a high end mathematician to understand that Wizard script.

>>726315169
JAVA
Compile once, debug EVERYWHERE.

>>726307488
i meant the logic statement only.

the other stuff is probably things you need to glean to be a good programmer. if you're wanting to be a hobbyist, ignore this guy completely and just try to make something. you'll stumble around a bunch, but just have fun with it and watch the progress of your creation.

>>726316745
>didn't take the opportunity to use mathmagician

and then there was 404